Pizza driver who fatally shot robber violated Domino's gun policy

[shain from kane]

The Associated Press
http://www.bnd.com/breaking_news/story/217890.html

UNIVERSITY CITY, Mo. --A pizza delivery man who fatally shot a robber last week was not permitted to carry a weapon and could have faced discipline for doing so, a Domino's spokesman said.

The employee, who has not been named, has resigned since the incident.

Employees sign an agreement in which they agree not to carry a weapon, said Domino's corporate spokesman Tim McIntyre. It is a policy designed to protect both the public and employees.

Domino's trains employees to try and reduce their risk, both before and during a robbery, McIntyre said. Drivers are told to carry a cell phone and avoid wearing jewelry or carrying valuables or more than a small amount of cash, typically $20.

They're also taught to keep driving if they have doubts about an address and to call to verify it, he said. If robbers approach, drivers are told to "turn over the pizza and empty your pockets."

--------------------------

I believe Missouri is a concealed-carry state.

[TahitiNut]

1. "Domino's gun policy"??? How HORRIBLE!!

Nevermind that a human being is dead. Nevermind any laws he may have broken. The Dastardly Dude broke a CORPORATE RULE!!!!! Throw him in jail and throw away the key!!!

[Gato Moteado]

5. i don't know the details of the robbery but.....

...had the pizza guy been unarmed and killed by the robber, would this story have even made the news? probably not. you wouldn't have even known about it happening, so i wouldn't be able to know if your outrage would have been aimed at the robber.

i don't like handguns and i think they should be outlawed. unfortunately there's a lot of them on the street in the wrong hands already. if this pizza driver delivered to some bad ass neighborhoods and maybe had a few run ins with some gang bangers or robbers in the past, you can kind of understand why he might want to arm himself. and if concealed weapons are allowed in his state (as someone mentioned in this thread), then how would you justify throwing him in jail and throwing away the key if he didn't break any laws in defending himself?

[TahitiNut]

10. Here ... insert this where it does the most good:

:sarcasm:

[Ineedchange]

80. How did the NRA let that pass?

You can always count on big business to think about their risk versus your life. Pizza delivery, gas station attendants and convenient store workers are always at risk from thugs. Thugs would think twice if they thought there was a possibility they could get shot.

[opiate69]

104. Hmm...

Thugs would think twice if they thought there was a possibility they could get shot.

So, let's examine this train of thought.. typically, whenever I encounter a gun debate like this, I maintain that the victim of the crime is more likely to get shot if he or she pulls a gun on his/her attacker.. this is usualy met with links to stories from all over in which the victim was successful in turning the tables and shootng the perpetrator.. so, it stands to reason that the "thugs" must surely already be aware that there is a possibility they'll be shot, and yet, there seems to be no shortage of violent crime.. I guess bumper-sticker sloganeering as public policy doesn't work then, no?

[SteveM]

2. Domino's founder big anti-abortion bankroller. I guess life ends at birth.

[shain from kane]

6. Tom Monaghan, with his new goal of building the perfect town. (No gunfire allowed.)

In February 2006, ground was broken for the new Catholic university and town, Ave Maria, Florida. Monaghan controls all commercial real estate in the town, and plans to build 11,000 homes, an oratory, and several businesses. Pulte Homes has been signed up to build most of the private homes. Monaghan said in 2005 that any town retailers would not be allowed to sell contraceptives or pornography, a statement which drew fire from the ACLU. Threatened with lawsuits, Monaghan has since modified his stance on how tightly commerce will be controlled in the town. Defenders of Wildlife has also challenged the development, stating it is destroying habitat of the endangered Florida Panther.

[Captain Hilts]

38. He sold Domino's several years back, so the boycott's over. nt

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

118. I don't go there any way...flavored carboard..:yuk:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

3. Fine with me.

Usually when these guys who play hero get fired, there's a big outcry for the guy. Me, I side with the company.

[Gato Moteado]

11. play hero? he defended himself from an armed criminal....how is that playing hero?

from the story you would have seen this had you read it:

Smith's alleged accomplice, Rodney Reese, 18, fled with the pizzas, soda and the driver's wallet, police said. Reese was later charged with first-degree robbery, two counts of armed criminal action and second-degree murder because he was allegedly involved in a fatal crime.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

13. Because he should have given the guy the pizzas and the money.

They're charging the other guy with murder? Boy, that's rich.

[Gato Moteado]

19. armed robbers have rights in your world view and victims have none

boy, that's rich

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

22. Actually, they both had rights.

But what "rights" have anything to do with this, I haven't the foggiest idea.

[Gato Moteado]

37. that's alright....nobody ever has the foggiest idea about what you're talking about....

...it's probably why you're on so many ignore lists

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

39. Mmm, no.

I think it's because I win arguments with immature people who can't take it.

That's what I think.

[Gato Moteado]

45. well, keep on thinking that...we won't burst your bubble

george bush really thinks he's in charge of things.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

46. I think I won this argument.

Feel free to prove me wrong.

[slackmaster]

21. The other guy (who is being charged with murder) GOT the pizzas and the money

And some sodas.

Are you happy now?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

25. I couldn't care less.

But charging him with murder is still pretty stupid, any way you look at it.

[slackmaster]

26. I think the felony murder rule is a good thing

It takes criminals off the streets.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

32. Justice be damned, eh?

How authoritarian.

[slackmaster]

54. It's definitely justice

It's the law, and everybody including wannabe accomplices to violent crimes knows it.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

56. How?

How on earth is that second degree murder? I can see an argument for involuntary manslaughter, but second degree murder?

That's just stupid.

[slackmaster]

59. Murder is whatever it is defined to be

If you don't like it, then don't hang around with people who rob other people.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

61. It doesn't look like murder to me.

Looks like self-defense.

:shrug:

[slackmaster]

62. Are we reading the same thread?

The accomplice of the robber who was shot is being charged with murder of the robber who got shot.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

65. Yeah.

And if you think that's murder then I'm the Queen of Uranus.

[slackmaster]

70. Pleased to meet your Royal Highness!

I understand your Uranus is in Pisces.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

71. I'm not really the Queen of Uranus.

That may have gone over your head.

[DCKit]

82. He was involved in an armed robbery that resulted in a death.

It doesn't matter whose death, he was armed and somebody died while he was committing a crime. End of story. He will now spend much of the rest of his life behind bars, where he belongs. Maybe he'll get to meet the tiger brothers while he's in there.

The Domino's policy is stupid and wrong. By not allowing their drivers to carry, Domino's is putting them in danger. Criminals know the drivers aren't supposed to carry and target them all the more. A stack of pizzas, a case of sodas and enough money for your next rock is more than enough motive for a tweaker.

Thankfully, somebody who thinks logically about these issues will hire the driver. Obviously, you are not that person. And what is the point of your endless, pointless arguments with people?

[karlrschneider]

35. Absolutely!

...

[RamboLiberal]

124. Self-Proclaimed victory means squat

Enjoy it. It won't even get you a pizza!

[RamboLiberal]

29. And in your rose-colored world the robbers never shoot

delivery person after getting the money and the pizza? Wrong. Many times these cretins then take out the driver as well.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

34. In my rose colored world...

armed robbery victims are less likely to get shot if they give the robber what he wants.

If the guy who's playing hero get's shot, I couldn't care less.

If I got shot because my coworker decided to play hero, well than that's another story. And I'd want my employers to protect me from jerks like that.

[RamboLiberal]

49. Riddle me this Batman - read my post listing a number of

delivery persons killed or wounded recently delivering food. Did they not cooperate with the thieves? Can you tell me why they are dead or wounded?

A lot of these thugs want to eliminate the witness or just want the thrill of shooting someone. They don't give a damn that you give them the money and the food!

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

53. Read this, Boy Wonder.

http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-bin/abstract/88012970/ABSTRACT?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0

[RamboLiberal]

57. You link goes to a cookie error

Your point?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

60. People are far more likely to get hurt when they resist an armed robbery.

And it's well known too.

That's why corporations have such policies in the first place.

[RamboLiberal]

67. Yeah so let's just let the robbers rule

And be the sheep. And possibly die. Or be wounded. Or be abducted. Never fight back.

IMHO you go with what you feel at the moment the crime happens. If you think youre life is in danger and you have the means to defend yourself - take it. Neither of us were in that delivery guy's shoes at the moment so who are we to judge him?

As I've shown you in another post there are plenty of dead and wounded delivery victims who probably complied with the robbers - your statistics sure did them a lot of good!

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

69. No, you give them the money...

than you call the police and let them take care of it.

"your statistics sure did them a lot of good!"

The statistics show there are a lot more dead and wounded people who resisted. And because of the statistics, employers train employees not to resist thereby saving many lives.

This isn't TV, kid.

[RamboLiberal]

81. Yep just like airlines trained employees not to resist

hijackers. I still say the victims should go with their gut at the time and employers be damned when the victim is successful. After all the CEO is nice and safe in his plush office, gated communities and country clubs.

Gee my gut tells me this cretin is going to murder me but the employer told me that statistically he won't.

Statistics ain't the real world kiddo.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

101. "Statistics ain't the real world kiddo."

I'm afraid they are.

[mvccd1000]

125. Like this lady in today's paper did?

http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/105899

“He just said, ‘Where’s the money,’ and I told him there’s no money until the boss gets here,” Hernandez said.

That’s when Hernandez said things turned violent. She said the man pulled out a pair of sewing scissors and stabbed her in the stomach and ran away.

Hernandez said if she had the money, she would have given it up — something Mesa Police said to do. But what worries her is the next time other customers knock on her door for help.

----------------------------

She's lucky he ONLY stabbed her once. Had he chosen, he could have kept going until she was dead. I guess his right to commit a crime trumps her right to defend herself?

[Edweird]

83. No, corporations have that policy so criminals can't sue.

They don't give a damn about their employees life or health.

[slackmaster]

93. I think Edweird hit the nail on the head

With a hammer.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

102. Actually, no.

It's to prevent families of dead employees from suing them over inadequately training employees in what to do during a robbery.

[Edweird]

107. What other employees were at risk when the pizza guy defended himself?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

109. In this particular situation, none.

But they've got to stick to the policy. If some guy had robbed the store back when he was picking up more pizzas, then he'd have put all the employees and other customers at risk.

[Edweird]

112. He wasn't at the store. He was out on a delivery.

The policy is in place to keep employees from defending themselves. Not for the protection of other employees, but to keep the criminal from sitting on the stand and SWEARING that "Your Honor I was just minding my own business on my way from bible study to go volunteer at the homeless shelter when X, an employee of Y walked up and started shooting me for no reason. I want 100 million dollars for pain and mental anguish. And free pizza. For life."

When the fact of the matter is, he was going to kill you for the heck of it.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

114. The policy is there to keep employees safe.

Just because this is a rare exception to the rule, it doesn't make the policy bad.

Sorry.

[Edweird]

117. I disagree. the policy is to protect the corporation.

apology accepted.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

119. It's to protect the corporation...

from wrongful death suits from employees families.

Loony conspiracy theories about lawsuits from injured robbers... sorry, that's just stupid.

[JVS]

97. People are least likely to be killed in a robbery after they've gunned the robber down.

Giving pizza and money might appease the robber. But a dead guy can't shoot or otherwise harm you

[razors edge]

52. I got shot for not

having anything to give the robber to begin with, how does that square in your theory?

If a guy defending his children from a threat gets turned into red mist in front of them you could care less? How heart warming.

I prefer my coworkers armed, they tend to draw bead on the ones I don't see first, if it comes to that.

[JVS]

75. He should have given him money, pizza, and a lead salad in that order!

[Edweird]

78. Giving up the pizza and money is no guarantee you won't be killed anyway.

Sometimes they kill no matter what you do.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

103. No.

It's just much, much safer.

[Edweird]

108. No, it's not.

I used to manage taco bell's then later papa john's pizza. At the end of my training I went to a store to replace a manager that took a delivery and was beaten so severely that he needed reconstructive surgery to repair his face. For 29 dollars, a pager, and a pizza. They didn't demand it. There was no confrontation. One man distracted him while another attacked from behind. This "just give them what they want" attitude is nothing but cowardice.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

110. That's wonderful anecdotal evidence.

Unfortunately, resisting is still far more risky despite your anecdotal evidence.

Just like there's still global warming even though it's cold outside.

Standing up to an armed robber is nothing but faux machismo. It's like putting plastic nuts on the back of your truck.

[Edweird]

116. if it doesn't work, then why do cops carry guns?

[Edweird]

120. Standing up to an armed robber is SELF DEFENSE.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

122. It's also stupid and dangerous.

[Edweird]

126. Enabling and encouraging violent criminals is stupid and dangerous

Giving them that false sense of power and authority as well as rewarding their actions is a deal with the devil and only makes it worse for everyone over the long run.
If you are mentally or physically ill-equipped to handle a confrontation of this nature, then don't.
But others that choose to defend the most basic of human rights are not stupid.
Life is dangerous. Life is 100% fatal. You may choose to curl up in a ball and hope for the best; that is your choice to rationalize however you want, but I choose defense.

Maybe you want to explain how fighting back is "stupid and dangerous" here.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2594149

Edited for spelling.

[RamboLiberal]

111. I had a distant teenage female cousin who was murdered

outside a MacDonald's at closing by a thug. She didn't resist. She didn't even have the money. The robber shot her for no good reason.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

113. OK.

There are a lot more people than you with dead cousins who did resist. Or cousins who had coworkers that did.

[RamboLiberal]

123. I can't ever remember reading that the person shot

in a robbery had a CCW and his gun on him. It might happen but IMHO it's far less than the unarmed person who didn't resist that got shot. There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics. I think your statistics are a fraud!

This dates from 91 but I'd expect it's still true - and I bet most of these people didn't have a gun and didn't resist:

When it comes to violent crime, Mr. Reeder's line of work (convenience store clerk) is the second most dangerous there is, after driving a cab, according to a new study by the National Institute for Occupational Health and Safety, a Federal research agency in Atlanta.

Although the Government does not keep statistics on convenience store killings, state and local police departments say they have become more and more common, especially in the faster-growing states, where convenience stores have joined the gasoline stations, fast-food chains and discount stores that form the infrastructure of suburban sprawl.

Here in Florida about 10 percent of the 316 inmates on death row were convicted of killing people in convenience stores. From August 1989 to August 1990, 13 people were killed in convenience stores: eight clerks, three customers, a passer-by and a holdup man.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0CE2DC113CF934A35757C0A967958260

[benEzra]

121. You and a friend pull a gun on an innocent person...

and tell him you'll kill him if he doesn't do what you want (and may kill him anyway), and he shoots one of you, yes, the other one will be charged with felony murder. You sign up for it if you choose to participate in an armed robbery...

[RamboLiberal]

23. I side with the delivery guy

There's a lot of delivery people being wounded or killed delivering. They should have a right to protect themselves. To hell with Dominos, or any business that puts a person in a dangerous position then when they defend themselves boo hoos it's against their policy. Bet Dominos won't stop deliveries!

Google News:

The family of a pizza delivery man gunned down early Saturday morning says this wasn't the first time he's been shot at work. Fifty-three year old Paul Schumann was killed after getting robbed near Hopkins and Locust.

http://www.todaystmj4.com/news/local/12277886.html

Another driver, Robert "Tony" Swick, was killed during a July 10 robbery on Jefferson Street. Matthew Quintana, 16, and his 17-year-old girlfriend, Kali Armstrong, have been charged with murder for the incident. Quintana also is a suspect in a second robbery of a deliveryman earlier that day.

http://www.newarkadvocate.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071222/NEWS01/712220307/1002

Standing in his Edgewood pizza shop yesterday, Ahmed Fereydouni held up his bandaged finger, a souvenir from the armed bandit who tried to shoot him in the head Thursday night during a delivery in Swissvale.

He managed to duck just as the gunman squeezed the trigger. The bullet grazed his finger.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07356/843733-56.stm

A pizza delivery man shot and killed during the weekend had been shot twice previously, his employer said.

Zayna’s Pizza owner Younis Abdel-Hami would not have been surprised if Paul Schumann, 53, stood up to his attackers when he was slain Saturday about 3 a.m.

http://www.postcrescent.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071210/APC0101/71210059/1979

A deliveryman for a diner was shot in the face and killed as he brought an $18 order of food to a Yonkers apartment, police said Tuesday.

The order was apparently a setup for a robbery, said police Capt. Michael Murphy.

Martin Antonio Perez, 25, of Yonkers, was found dead Monday night in a 12th-floor stairwell at 50 Hawthorne Ave. He had left the Emerald Diner two hours earlier with an order for an 18th-floor apartment, and when he did not return the diner owner went looking for him. When he found the delivery car outside the building, he called police.

http://www.1010wins.com/pages/1354029.php?

The murder of a pizza delivery driver named Wilson James over the weekend demonstrates how an unassuming job can actually be very dangerous.

http://www.live5news.com/home/7860682.html

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

28. Then by all means, they don't have to take the job.

:shrug:

[RamboLiberal]

33. Are you rich?

There's a lot of people out there trying to earn a living any damn way they can! For some this is a 2nd job they desparately need.

Man you live in a rose-colored glasses world!

And there are small-business owners just trying to make a living by providing evening delivery service in their neigborhood pizza, chinese take-outs, etc.

Maybe we should stop deliveries!

Or not deliver to certain neigborhoods - but then there are howls of discrimination.

It's the good people trying to make a living or just wanting a delivery of food that are being hurt by these scumbag robbers.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

36. No.

But I'm sure this guy can get another job, what with his heroic can-do attitude and all.

[RamboLiberal]

41. You are incredibly naive

The driver had every right to defend his life.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

44. Absolutely.

And Domino's has the right, ney the responsibility, to fire his ass for breaking their policy.

[Gato Moteado]

47. yes, domino's has the right to terminate his employment.....

...but that's not the issue here that you're arguing. you're saying that a person that defends themselves from an armed attacker is really a cowardly murderer.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

48. No, that's exactly not what I'm saying.

A person has a right to defend themself.

Duh.

[RamboLiberal]

50. Dominos should be protecting his ass by stopping deliveries

Oh but then they wouldn't be as profitable!

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

51. Well then he'd be out of a job, wouldn't he?

:shrug:

[RamboLiberal]

55. Oh yeah but that would be better than being dead in your

world where he should just comply with the robbers and hope he's lucky that they don't shoot or beat him.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

58. Mmm, yes.

Being out of a job would be better than being dead.

:shrug:

[slackmaster]

64. Think of the poor robber who got shot

He's both dead AND out of a job. That sucks as badly as getting eaten by a lion.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

66. Indeed.

Probably just needed a few bucks to satisfy a drug habit, or something.

[DCKit]

87. Undoubtedly his family will now be suing for loss of future income.

It's been done before.

[comradebillyboy]

4. a gun in your hand is better than a cop on the phone

how dare this fellow defend himself! How much better it would have been to allow himself to be robbed and assaulted or maybe murdered and then let the police take a report and maybe catch the bad guys. If you think the police are there to protect you and your rights you are kidding yourself. Everyone has the right to protect themselves.

being fired by domino's is a lot better than being dead.

[Gato Moteado]

7. i agree with you there

nt

[karlrschneider]

8. Well, keep in mind a lot of DUers don't think self-defense is permissible

in their rose-colored world. :eyes:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

9. Oh we think it's fine.

We're just not OK with cowardly murder.

Well, most of us anyway.

[Gato Moteado]

14. how is using force to defend yourself from an armed assaulter a "cowardly murder"

do you really believe half the stupid shit you post or are you just into starting arguments?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

15. Karl's talking about somebody else.

A month or two ago some white guy murdered a couple of black guys, shot them in the back in cold blood. He claimed "self defense" when it was obvious it wasn't self defense. Karl supported the murderer, and he got burned for it.

And now he's bitter. Which is ironic, because he claims to be the kind of guy who supports giving people what they deserve.

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

20. Am I going to have to post my poem again?

[Gato Moteado]

27. you're obviously on karl's ignore list....

....so stop wasting your time replying to him with your nonsense as he doesn't see any of it.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

30. Obviously.

But lots of other people know just what sort of person Karl is, and I think I can safely assume at least some of them are amused.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Captain Hilts]

40. If your person is being threatened, hell yeah. If your property is being threatened, hell no. nt

[karlrschneider]

42. I operate on the assumption that anyone willing to use overt force to take my stuff is a threat

to my person. So I'll stick with my support of anybody who blows away scum. Don't you think there's too much scum in the world anyway?...I sure as hell do.

[JVS]

76. Yup. If dominos thinks that their shitty jobs are worth giving that up, they're fools

[karlrschneider]

12. Good for the driver...one less scum robber to prey on people.

!

[Wcross]

94. Probably wasn't the first time he did it.

He probably would have continued doing it. Hate to say it but being a criminal has certain risks, death being one of them.

[slackmaster]

16. DISCIPLINE? From a PIZZA JOINT!!! OMG!!!

[karlrschneider]

18. I think it involves KY jelly and wine bottles

:evilgrin:

[Dr. Strange]

31. And if it's not over in 30 minutes, then it's free.

Or so I've heard...

[Indy Lurker]

43. Pizza Delivery is extreamly dangerous work

The data is a little old:

2005

http://money.cnn.com/2006/08/16/pf/2005_most_dangerous_jobs/index.htm

Deaths per 100,000 workers

1 Fishers and fishing workers 118.4
2 Logging workers 92.9
3 Aircraft pilots 66.9
4 Structural iron and steel workers 55.6
5 Refuse collectors 43.8
6 Farmers and ranchers 41.1
7 Power line installers/repairers 32.7
8 Driver/sales (Pizza delivery) 29.1
9 Agricultural workers 23.2
10 Construction laborers 22.7

I believe Police are around 18

[Quixote1818]

85. Holy Shit!

I delivered Pizza when I was between HS and Collage. Thats amazing! Thanks for posting.

By the way, I got held up once and my pizza and money stolen.

[ileus]

63. What are they going to do fire him??? F Domino's.

[NeedleCast]

68. Ironically, being robbed as a pizza driver got me into handguns

I've been target shooting pretty much ever since I got robbed for the first time when I was working part time as a pie driver when I was 21.

Kinda funny story actually. I'm driving a pie to some random apartment. Dude answers the door in his tighty-whities, a pair of tube socks and nothing else...holding a gun. Demands the pizza and my money, which I gave him. Then he shut the door. I was sort of shocked but drove back to the restaraunt and told the owner what happened. We called the cops and the local sheriff's dept. came out. They thought at first that the guy had robbed me at the apartment complex and then run away. I said nope, he robbed me from his own apartment. I drove over there with them, they knocked and he answered the door. Cops asked me if that was the guy, I said yes and they cuffed him and took him off. It was all very calm.

It wasn't until later that it sunk in that I had been robbed at gunpoint.

[slackmaster]

72. The fucker didn't even tip you?

What an asshole.

[NeedleCast]

73. Criminals just have no shame these days

However, considering he wasn't wearing pants when this happened, I'm not sure I would have accepted the tip for fear of where he'd been storing it.

[Wcross]

79. You're shittin us NeedleCast, right? No, really, you HAVE to be.

I love it. A real criminal mastermind at work. How did the sheriff's deputies cuff the guy while rolling on the floor laughing their asses off?

[NeedleCast]

89. Not a Bit

True story. On the drive back to the shop I was worried the owner would think I was trying to pull a fast one on him but luckily I had known him a long time and we were on good terms. Even the cops had to hear the story several times. I got "so, you pulled up and the guy was outside and robbed you?" No.

"So the guy was outside the address you were delivering to and robbed you as you walked up??

No.

THey asked if I thought it was a fake gun and I said no, I was pretty sure it was real. They asked if the guy had acted in an aggressive manner and I said that no, he had casually opened the door in his undies and socks, robbed me in a boring fashion. They asked what he said and I told them he had gestured in my generel direction with the gun, told me to give him the pizza (large supreme...I'll never forget) and all the money I had, which I had done. Then he sort of nodded his head and shut the door.

The cops didn't even pull their guns when he opened the door (he had hidden his gun under a couch seat...apparently the one he was sitting on). They had me standing down at the base of the stairs on the first floor, asked me to confirm that it was the guy who had robbed me. I said yes, they cuffed hiim without a struggle and that was that. I had to testify against him. Took about 20 minutes. He got a few months of county lock up and several years probation.

[Wcross]

92. Damn.

So what is your favorite style handgun? I carry a Kimber pro-carry 1911 style in .45 Acp. I like it because of the dual safety's. (back strap & regular safety)

[NeedleCast]

96. Grandfather's WW-2 Service Revolver

More of a sentimental thing. Gramps is alive and well but going blind and gave me his service revolver a few years back (I'm also Ex-army) since he didn't think he could hit anything with it anymore. Said "grandson, I see two or three of whatever I see these days, and that ain't much, so you better keep this safe for me." Brought a tear to my eye.

I owned a Star BM 9mm for a long time. It was very average but cheap, and at the time I bought it (from an uncle, legally) I was on a pizza delivery guy budget. Until a few years ago I didn't care that much. I still have it actually, but haven't done anything other than basic care and maintiance on it in a long time. I now have a Sig P-220 as well and like it a lot. I don't think I've been using handguns long enough to decide if I have a favorite. It's a decent size for CC and has good stopping power. For some reason, I really like the sights on it although they're nothing special really. Target shooting I consistantly hit better with the Sig even though I use to shot both it and the Star and had owned the Star a lot longer. Sights on the Sig just work well for me.

[RamboLiberal]

115. Sigs are just damn accurate firearms - one of the best out of the box

My first handgun was a Sig - and except for that first DA shot which I could never quite master in competition, that gun was a tack driver for me in single action. It made me look like a better shooter than I was at the time.

Sig 220 is a great choice.

[JVS]

74. Fuck Dominos.

[hughee99]

77. "Could have faced discipline"???

No offense, but he's a pizza delivery guy. What's the worst Domino's can do, let him keep his job?

[mdmc]

84. I boycott this place for a reason

but this ain't it.
I hope the shooter/delivery guy gets a better job.:kick:

[Wcross]

88. I boycott ALL pizza chains because they suck. They suck HARD.

If there isn't a good Mom & Pop pizza parlor close by then there is no pizza on my menu. I want to eat where there IS no corporate policy on anything. Just a good pie made by a guy or gal who is working there because they own the business.

[slackmaster]

91. Same here - I usually make my own including the dough

It's not really very hard to do.

[Wcross]

86. What do those people make? Just curious & nothing to do with this thread.

I always wondered what pizza delivery people make. Is it a base & tips or something else? Does the pizza company pay for the gas or the driver?

[NeedleCast]

90. Dint know now...in the mid-90s we made

minimum wage plus 75 cents per delivery plus tips. When I was doing straight delivery and not managing the restaurant I would make on average about 10 bucks an hour between hourly and tips. A Friday closing shift (usually about 5:00 PM to close at midnight) could net 75 to 100 dollars cash plus hourly. It was a nice job and I did it off and on for several years in high school college. Always had cash in my pocket. Always forgot how much I had made in tips during tax season. If I wasn't traveling so much for work most of the year I'd consider going back to doing it part time 2-3 days a week.

Edit: Pie jockey for Papa Johns told me last week that it's currently $1.00 per delivery on top of tip. Basically covers the cost of gas for the ass-clowns out there that don't tip. You non-tippers know who you are, and I'll be waiting for you in the afterlife.

[mdmc]

95. in newburgh ny i made between 6 and 25 per hour

delivering pies for a local shop:kick:

[Fleshdancer]

98. On the flipside....

I can see why Domino's would have the policy.

Let's say you hire an employee to drive to the home of your customer to deliver your product. If your employee has a gun and decides to harm your customer, it's a HUGE liability.

[karlrschneider]

99. Yeah, that's been a huge problem for years...

:eyes:

[Fleshdancer]

106. I'm not saying it's a huge problem...or a small problem

I'm just saying that allowing your delivery personnel to be armed is not the smartest move. I would bet cold hard cash that every company that delivers a product - from pizzas to refrigerators - has this policy in their handbook.

[NeedleCast]

100. It's all about liability

but not in the way you think.

It's more like Domino's desire not to be sued by some two-bit robber who gets shot by an employee.

[Fleshdancer]

105. well, there is that oddly enough

My husband started the business where we both work so it's hard for me to not think of the liability issue as an employer.

Fortunately we don't have a business that requires employees to face dangerous situations. If we did, I believe it would be unethical for us to pay less than a livable wage and not invest a certain percentage of our profits in technology (or whatever) that would decrease the amount of life threatening encounters for our employees. Part of the reason would be because I wouldn't want my employees meeting customers armed.

BUT, it's all very hypothetical in my case. The worst thing that can happen to our employees is probably eye strain and carpal tunnel syndrome.