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Senator Joseph Biden on 10-22-01:

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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 05:42 PM
Original message
Senator Joseph Biden on 10-22-01:
On 10-22-01, Joseph Biden, the chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, said the following:

"The President has not been as blunt as I'm going to be. Pakistan may very well, and Musharraf may, in fact, collapse. .... If that were the case, we would find ourselves with a whole hell of a lot more forces in the region than we have now ....

"how much longer does the bombing (in Afghanistan) continue? Because we're going to pay as escalating price in the Muslim world. We're going to pay an escalating price in the region. And that in fact is going to make the aftermath of our 'victory' more difficult ....

" I hope to God it ends sooner rather than later. .... We have to make clear to the Pakastanis that, notwithstanding the fact that we need you very much right now .... if you are going to continue to foment the terror that does exist in Kashmir, then you are operating against your own near-term interests, because that very viper can turn on you."

I think that a wide range of Americans will recognize, when they hear Senator Biden speak on this topic, that he is an intelligent, insightful person who can provide leadership in the US's positions in the Middle East. Senator Biden has made it clear that it is important for us to consider how our policies in countries such as Afghanistan and Iraq influences events in countries such as Pakistan. It is a valid topic for our democratic candidates to discuss at this time.

We should ignore those who claim that it is wrong to examine how US policy in Afghanistan and Iraq has helped to create the violent climate in Pakistan. They are as dull-witted as that pathetic blob of ignorance formerly known as Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert, who called Senator Biden "completely irresponsible" for questioning the administration's policy, and accused him of "bring(ing) comfort to our enemies."

We need to examine every candidate's position on Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, and Pakistan.
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troubleinwinter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 05:58 PM
Response to Original message
1. A recommend, and a kick too.
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brer cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:14 PM
Response to Original message
2. Excellent post.
It remains to be seen whether our candidates will discuss their position. There is no question that US has created much of the violent situation in Pakistan.
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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
3. A lot of them probably don't really have one.
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ThomWV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:20 PM
Response to Original message
4. This is just one more example of why Biden is really our best choice.
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monmouth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:20 PM
Response to Original message
5. What a wonderfully insightful post...n/t
Edited on Thu Dec-27-07 06:21 PM by monmouth
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globalvillage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:30 PM
Response to Original message
6. Kerry/Biden resolution on Pakistan from 11/8/07
Specifically called for protection for Bhutto after the first attempt, among other warnings about the 'powderkeg' in Pakistan.

(5) to call upon the Government of Pakistan to conduct a full investigation into the attempted assassination of former Prime Minister of Pakistan Benazir Bhutto and provide her and other political leaders with all necessary security to ensure their personal safety.

http://kerry.senate.gov/cfm/record.cfm?id=287064

I'm still undecided, but Biden is looking better every day.

co-sponsors:
Sen Biden, Joseph R., Jr. - 11/8/2007
Sen Casey, Robert P., Jr. - 11/8/2007
Sen Clinton, Hillary Rodham - 11/13/2007
Sen Durbin, Richard - 11/8/2007
Sen Harkin, Tom - 11/13/2007
Sen Obama, Barack - 11/8/2007

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jillan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #6
17. Hey GV!
You should take a closer look at Biden. Alot of the reasons why I support him are the same reasons why I supported Kerry.
I trust them to do the right thing, make the right decision, especially on days like today.

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globalvillage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 07:35 PM
Response to Reply #17
31. Biden is my first choice right now.
He's no JK, but I like him better than the others for several reasons, mostly because I think if he got the nomination, he could beat any of the Republicans. I'm not as confident about the rest.

:hi:
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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:32 PM
Response to Original message
7. Kick. nt
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KT2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:44 PM
Response to Original message
8. Biden has the big picture
our country needs that now more than ever.
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Me. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:54 PM
Original message
Just Saw Biden On HB
Very substantial on this. I also think it important to listen to what he said about her not being well protected despite his urging Musharrif who is now blaming Al Queda. The very Al Queda he has let roam the hills of Pakistan freely. Treacherous.
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:59 PM
Response to Original message
11. I saw that too. He looked concerned, and he repeated,
several times, that the vast majority of Pakistanis are secular, and moderate... not the Islamist fundies that much of the media is doing the "booga-booga" dance about right now.

I have a tremendous amount of respect for Biden's experience and I hope people are listening.
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youthere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:54 PM
Response to Original message
9. Kicking for Biden...because he gets it.
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Klukie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 06:56 PM
Response to Original message
10. I really think Biden will get the nomination..
and I am okay with that. Thanks for the post.
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ms liberty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 08:10 PM
Response to Original message
12. K&R. I like Biden...
Since Al Gore doesn't seem to be getting in, Biden is one of my Personal Top Tier candidates. Biden has a lot of the experience we need, and I agree with him more than I disagree with him. He speaks with an air of honesty and bluntness that is very engaging. He doesn't talk down to his audience, he's not scripted, and he is authoritative on the issues. He is very much an authority on foreign policy. And he can back it up with a decent record that is center-leaning-left. We could do worse.

I liked what he had to say tonight in interviews regarding the tragic assasination of Mrs. Bhutto. I also noted the statements of other candidates of both parties. All of the GOP candidates, and surprisingly more than one of the Democratic candidates used the opportunity to remind Americans that the world is a dangerous place, where we can be blown up by terrorists at any time. It's always so nice to know they care, don't you think?
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riverdeep Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. Seeing the pub candidates was frightening.
They don't get it. Everything for them is an opportunity to go 'terra'. Wasn't 'Full of Mitt' Romney lambasting Huckabee for daring to suggest that Bush's foreign policy might have been overreaching and born of arrogance? Hey, guess what? While we've been focusing on Iraq needlessly, creating more terrorists than Osama could have hoped for, the original breeding ground was growing all along.

Six years from 9/11, and all we've got is billions down the drain, hundreds of thousands of lives lost, many more shattered, and the world more dangerous than it was before.
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Mnemosyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 11:03 PM
Response to Original message
13. Needs a
:kick:
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pacalo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 11:04 PM
Response to Original message
14. How wonderful to know that you're looking at Biden, too.
Your opinion holds a lot of weight with me, H2O.
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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-27-07 11:05 PM
Response to Original message
15. Biden can speak well enough, sometimes in his own words. His votes, however...
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jillan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 12:57 AM
Response to Original message
18. Check this out from Brent Budowsky -
Edited on Fri Dec-28-07 12:58 AM by pirhana
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Sam Ervin jret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
19. Once again , I ask, since when has intelligence, integrity and experience mattered to the voters?
???

Not in this century. It wasn't what got Bill the Job even though he happened to be quite bright. George the I, experience, yes but integrity? Reagan? Don't get me started. I guess it was Jimmy. And we all know well how America treated him and understood the global politics of that time.

After all it took big tough Ronny to "scare those Iranian's into giving us back our hostages."

Please! We can hope for a country wide awakening and education. Stranger things have happened. We know that. We've live through the Gorge the II years!!
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nyc 4 Biden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
20. Kick for Joe!
:kick:
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harmonicon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 03:25 PM
Response to Original message
21. but if we examine our candidates' positions, the republicans win!
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
22. Thanks for the post
More and more I'm noticing that Biden has always had the bigger picture on world events, in sharp contrast to Bush's narrow vision.

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rockybelt Donating Member (938 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. Bush has a vision? nt
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. For a couple feet and with blinders on
That's how he stays "focused"!
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. I've long thought
that Senator Biden has stood out as among the most capable members of congress of this generation. Of course, there are areas where I disagree with him. But I think that being a good Senator is more important an accomplishment, and a greater contribution to society, than being an "average" president. Thus, I was happy when John Kerry decided to stay in the Senate, rather than running for the presidency again -- I think he has more to offer as a senator

However, in Senator Biden's case, I think he has talents that would fit well in the executive branch.
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 07:33 PM
Response to Reply #26
30. Yes, I agree with you
He isn't the best of the candidates, he is the best person for the office. At a different time, I might have a different opinion, but now is Biden's time.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. That is such an
important point: we all want to reverse the severe damage that this administration has done to our country, to our standing in the world, and to other nations. But it is going to be hard, even under the best of circumstances. One democratic administration alone can only stop the worst Bush policies, and begin to repair the damage. It will require someone with an understanding of global politics, and with the ability to work with congress. It will be up to the next democrat to do the most difficult work to rebuild our foundation. It's not incorrect to think of it much like building a foundation for a building -- it's tough, dirty work. But it is needed in order to build an attractive building on top.

I like things about all of our democratic candidates. But as someone who did foundations to pay my way through college many years ago, I like what I hear from Senator Biden.
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 10:33 PM
Response to Reply #32
34. I like your analogy
I'm afraid that once the next president takes office, he/she may find that the damage is far greater than it appears. Being this administration is so secretive, there is no telling what all they've done behind close doors.

I do not envy the person who takes on this task, but I do think Biden is the one who can start the repair work quickly and decisively.
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Think82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 10:41 PM
Response to Reply #26
35. Agreed!
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
25. K&R -- Thanks!! nt
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puebloknot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 05:21 PM
Response to Original message
27. K&R Well said! There are no questions which should not be asked...
...with regard to our foreign policy, and especially in the Middle East.
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Steely_Dan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 06:02 PM
Response to Original message
28. Thanks for Your Post, H2O
Coming from you, it means a great deal to me.

I like the idea that people understand that Joe Biden is not perfect. Of course, none of the candidates are. I didn't agree with all of his votes either. However, I have never been more sure about a candidate in my life. This is not a time for on the job training, especially in the area of foreign affairs. The pendulum swings slowly. Indeed, I wish it would swing back to the left in an instant. If I thought that were possible, maybe Kucinich would be my idealistic choice. But that is not the way the world works. We must put into place an intelligent, insightful and creative leader to help guide the pendulum back to the left. Mr. Biden is that leader.

-P
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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 06:37 PM
Response to Original message
29. Biden 4 Prez! nt
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DemReadingDU Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 07:46 PM
Response to Original message
33. It would be nice to see Biden move up in Iowa & N.H.
I would hope that the people who caucus in the early states are re-thinking the candidates foreign experience because of what happened to Bhutto, Pakistan, the the entire Middle East.
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 10:46 PM
Response to Original message
36. I really DON"T understand why Biden isn't doing better in the polls?
what is it? money?
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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-28-07 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #36
37. 1st - MSM doesn't talk about him much
I think it isn't as "exciting" has having a former 1st lady, former vp candidate and a black candidate duking it out. Don't get me wrong, there are legitimate reasons to like HRC, Edwards and Clinton, but I think MSM gives them extra attention because of the reasons I list. Despite being a senator for decades, Biden isn't an "insider" either. He doesn't have the machine and connections of Clinton. He has the 2nd lowest net worth in the senate, so he can't buy his attention the way other candidates can.

If he doesn't break into the top tier in IA, it will truly be a shame. He has the most experience of the bunch, respect from foreign leaders, and he is as good of a speaker as any of the candidates too.

Maybe we will be pleasantly surprised by IA.
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