Do you think there is any risk of an assassination attempt if...

[Locut0s]

either Hillary or Obama were to win the democratic primary? I don't mean this to be a flame bait thread but a serious question. Do you think this is a serious concern? We all know there are lots of right wing racist and misogynistic nut cases out there with guns, question is Do you think it's a serious security risk?

[Basileus Basileon]

1. Yes, as with any Presidential candidate That is why they have security precautions.

I don't think HRC or BO have any greater of a risk of assassination than JE does, if that's what you're asking.

[Locut0s]

3. Certainly that's the case. However I did think that they might face more of a risk because...

the types of nut cases out there who would contemplate assassinations are often also the types who would most dislike the thought of an African American or Female president.

[Horse with no Name]

2. Not as long as they continued on a corporatist path

Clinton didn't have any assassination attempts, did he?
The ones who have the most to worry are the ones who would not adhere to status quo.
I don't think Clinton or Obama have anything to worry about.

[Basileus Basileon]

4. Clinton didn't. Reagan did. Not every assassination is part of the Evil Corporatist Conspiracy.

[Horse with no Name]

7. You do know that Neil Bush had dinner the night before the Reagan

assassination attempt with Hinkley's brother, don't you?
And...who stood to gain if Reagan was assassinated?
Who was the VP?

Sometimes IT really is part of what you mock.

[Basileus Basileon]

8. So Bush tried to kill Reagan?

Please tell me, yes or no, if that is what you're saying.

[Horse with no Name]

9. Make up your own mind. n/t

[Basileus Basileon]

10. I'm not asking what I should think. I'm asking what you're saying. Yes or no.

Do you believe that George Bush attempted to kill Ronald Reagan, or not?

[Horse with no Name]

11. I don't HAVE to answer anything to you

That is the information.
Make up your own mind.

[Basileus Basileon]

12. I already have. I'm asking what you believe. Did George Bush try to kill Ronald Reagan?

[Horse with no Name]

13. And...I am refusing to answer you.

What I believe is of no concern to you. I disagree with you on about 99.999% of everything so I have no desire to enter into any type of discourse with you about what I do or don't believe.

[Basileus Basileon]

16. I doubt you could find three issues we disagree on.

I mean substantive policy issues, not conspiracy theories.

I'll give you the first: I don't believe an impeachment trial would be successful, and as such, I would rather we not. Next two are on you.

Edit: I guess maybe K-L, but you're against that because you're against an Iran war at all costs and see it as a slippery slope, and I was reluctantly in favor of it because I'm against an Iran war at all costs, and I think a toothless show of "strong diplomacy" will convince enough of the fence-sitters in State and the Pentagon that war is not necessary to be "tough on Iran." I wouldn't really accept that one, though, because the core issue is: "Do you believe in any sort of military action in Iran for any reason," and we agree completely that the answer is no.

Second edit, to preempt: I am in favor of single-payer universal healthcare, an immediate withdrawal from Iraq, a raised minimum wage, tax increases, drastically lowering military spending, increasing medical and scientific research, and complete amnesty for undocumented workers. Please don't try any of those.

[MonkeyFunk]

20. I'm curious, too

do you think George H. W. Bush was involved in the assassination attempt on Reagan?

[Basileus Basileon]

39. As with most conspiracy theorists,

happy to dance around accusations, ask leading questions, and imply wrongdoing, but refuses to actually pin down their beliefs.

[Horse with no Name]

54. Not at all.

I just prefer having discussions with those of the same political persuasion as me--which is why I come HERE.
However, there are some here that are polar opposite of everything I stand for--and you happen to be one of those. I prefer not to discuss ANY beliefs with those folks. I KNOW that you and I cannot have a civil discourse--so I refuse to let you engage me.
Plain and simple. No dancing here.

[Basileus Basileon]

56. And yet you are unable to find a scrap of evidence that our political persuasions are different.

Seriously, just search for my posts and poke around. Calling me a troll when I say things you disagree with will indeed irritate me, but you'll find if you actually engage me in conversation I'm quite pleasant.

[Horse with no Name]

59. Unwilling and unable are two different things.

I never called you a troll. I just disagree with you on 99.999% of things.

[Horse with no Name]

14. edit. dupe.

[Igel]

46. Close.

Reports say the dinner was scheduled, but cancelled.

[conspirator]

26. Bill Clinton tried to fight lobbies, but in the end surrendered to corporations

Nevertheless he was impeached, because probably he wouldn't support ground invasion of Iraq.

[Locut0s]

6. I was thinking more of the risk from radical racist / religious groups.

[MonkeyFunk]

15. Some guy

tried to fly a small plane into the White House during Clinton's term. And another guy jumped the fence with a gun.

Another guy with a semi-automtic rifle fired 29 shots at the residence while Clinton was home.

[mvccd1000]

17. Clinton didn't venture onto too many military bases. :)

He likely would not have found a receptive audience if he had. I know a lot of people would have just LOVED to have him make a stop on the ships I was on.

[MonkeyFunk]

18. Clinton did just fine with the military

are you suggesting your shipmates would've tried to harm him? Did you report them?

[sasquatch]

21. I guess some of them equate "over-spending" with "stromg defense"

[mvccd1000]

22. I'm not suggesting that...

... just saying that I don't know anyone (including me) who would have rushed to throw him a life preserver if he fell overboard.

He gutted the military, and the quality of life and morale went downhill during his terms in office. He's one of the main reasons I got out.

As for your statement, "Clinton did just fine with the military," whose military are you talking about? Not the one I was in...

[MonkeyFunk]

25. Your facts just seem to be wrong

Clinton didn't gut the military, no matter what Limbaugh said at the time.

[mvccd1000]

37. Only speaking from experience.

I don't know what Limbaugh said; I was out to sea too much to get a chance to listen to him. :)

I spent six years in the Navy - two Bush years and four Clinton years. Night and day difference in pride and morale between the two times.

I'm not regurgitating someone's talking points, I'm telling you what I experienced during my time in the service. Clinton was not popular with the military.

(Edit: "sea", not "see".) :)

[RainDog]

55. A question of origin

Cheney, under Bush I, cut the military budget and paid Halliburton millions of dollars to study how to privatize parts of the military. Surprisingly :eyes: Halliburton was then awarded huge contracts to take military jobs into private ownership. btw, b/c of his wise investments, Cheney's assets have risen some 3000% over the last few years...

This policy that Cheney put in place might be some of the attitude you're referring to. However, while you were on that ship (and thank you for your service), I was raising my children and oftentimes watching American news programs in the evening in which commentators noted the military held Clinton in scorn because he didn't serve in Vietnam. this was one reason among others, also the cuts in military spending, the lack of respect for the powers of the military-powers-that-be (I guess Kennedy was his idol not because of the women he bedded but because he sought a less confrontational foreign policy... in Clinton's case, only his character was assassinated... I'd like to see any of those republican tit-titters -Burton, Barr, Hyde, all with long or short -term mistresses, with pix of frolics at strip clubs, with illegitimate children --not to mention Wide-stance Craig or Mark (Glorious!) Foley, those newer icons of republican hypocrisy talk about their own affairs as part of public policy debate, but anyway...

...We also know now that the U.S. Airforce had and has a large bloc of fundie christian fascists who hate anything "democrat." (I guess it's too embarrassing for them to admit they don't like things that are DEMOCRATIC, because that would be a little too spot on... anyway, I wonder what the effect of their holy war was on Clinton's perception among the troops?

I mean, do the commanding officiers now look as though they are barely repressing scorn when Bush speaks knowing not only that he did not serve in Vietnam, he got his daddy to place him (just like demo Bentsen's son) in the Nat'l Guard, where he apparently mastered the craft of sniffing illegal substances? Do they look at him in scorn because he failed to insure EVEN AFTER THIS WAS WIDELY AND PUBLICALLY KNOWN that soldiers had the protective armor they needed, while Halliburton was performing substandard work and getting paid billions even when they couldn't even get painting schoolrooms right??? Or how about Bush making fun of the No WMDs, knowing our fellow citizens have died because of his lack of any scruples? How about blaming those torture orders on the soldiers? Do others in the military think that makes Bush a great CiC, esp. compared to that blow-jobbing prez... cause of course no self-respecting soldier would ever want to get a blow job from some woman who acted like she adored him...

I guess I kinda wonder who is creating the narrative for the soldiers in the military... do you hear the same sort of trash against Bush that you heard against Clinton? If not, why not?

[Selatius]

33. Gut the military? The Cold War ended. No reason to keep spending 400+ billion/year on defense anymor

Even Dick Cheney was talking about a peace dividend that would be freed up once military spending was cut and the military demobilized for peacetime after the Soviet Union dissolved. If you thought Clinton was bad, you missed out all the fun under George W. Bush and the damage he's done to all the front-line units he threw into the meat grinder in Iraq.

[mvccd1000]

36. Yep, gut the military.

I was in the Navy during the (1st) Bush years and during the Clinton years. Morale was in the toilet during the Clinton years. Whatever else he may have accomplished, he did not have many fans in our military.

I've now been in Iraq for almost three and a half years. I'm not missing out on much fun at all, unless you count black Friday shopping specials at home. :)

[Selatius]

38. What else could have Clinton done? Continue to run gigantic deficits on military spending?

The Reagan military build-up came at a price. The debt accumulated during his years has never really been paid off. Now this president in the White House has doubled its size to 9 trillion dollars. Today, we can spend 500+ billion on national defense, but that means we sacrifice spending that much on the military in the future because not only do we have to pay off the debt, we now have to pay off the billions upon billions of interest upon that.

At that rate, you would be forced to cut back spending on everything like health care, public education, infrastructure, even the military in order to service the national debt. The Republicans like to claim they're fiscally conservative and sound. Conservative, my ass. All they've done is bury their kids and grandkids in debt by borrowing against their future.

If it were a contest, I'd say the morale of the US Army is lower now with Iraq grinding away than it was under Clinton. At least under Clinton tens of thousands weren't coming home injured, paralyzed, or without limbs with several thousand coming home dead.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

52. You say you got out under Clinton. Now you're back in. CIC more of your liking? -nt

[Perry Logan]

23. That's sad. Clinton increased the military budget by 14 percent, reversing the trend under Bush I.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

51. What, exactly, would they have done? Please share. -nt

[MadBadger]

42. Are you kidding me?

What does Clinton have to do with this?

The oP is talking about crazy racists who cant handle a black man as president, or ones that cant handle a woman being president. Last I checked, Bill Clinton was a Southern White man.

[silverojo]

5. Does a bear shit in the woods? n/t

[RushIsRot]

19. I think the more progressive an elected official might be, the more

likely the wingnuts are to try to get rid of him/her. CAN'T HAVE THAT!

[Perry Logan]

24. Most wingnuts are too cowardly to try anything. They're basically chickenshits.

[shadowknows69]

27. I think any Democratic President will be in danger

This country is so polarized right now the nuts will come out of the woodwork.

[blondeatlast]

29. I was pretty much going to say the same thing. When I think of 3/10ths of

the people I know who can still support GWB, I get kind of frightened. They are ignorant and cultish in their devotion--and irrational in theri thought processes. :scared:

[rucky]

28. Yes, but I'm more worried about the internal threats to any Dem.

[Bitwit1234]

30. I am changing the subject a bit and asking this question

when you talk of a VP going after a president, are any of you old timers, thinking that Johnson and Connelly had something to do with the assassination of President Kennedy. From the bottom of my heart I always believed that Connelly and Johnson had a part it in. I suppose that is why I never liked Johnson as a president, Viet Nam besides.

It never got much news but right after that Connelly's wife Martha was gathered up by Secret Service men and locked up in a motel for about a week. Then in about six months she was dead. They said cancer. But we never heard anything about it til about a month before she died. I think they did something to her in that motel. She had a big mouth and was always hinting at state secrets. And right after she passed away didn't Connelly change from democrat to republican.

[MadBadger]

44. I believe that Johnson killed Kennedy

Thats why i cant stand him.

[TheCentepedeShoes]

45. Maybe you're thinking

of Spiro Agnew. His wife was named Martha IIRC and was kinda flakey.
John Connelly's wife was Nellie and I think is still living.

[TheCentepedeShoes]

49. Oppsie!

I meant to say Nixon's attny general John Mitchell's wife, Martha.
I knew somehow that "Martha Agnew" didn't sound right.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

50. Youve goofily combined Martha Mitchell and Marina Oswald.

:eyes:

[Crabby Appleton]

57. You certainly have your facts mixed up. Nelly Connally, John's wife

died about a year ago in Sept 2006. As pointed out above, it sounds like you created a composite character from Marina Oswald and Martha Mitchell.

[Vinca]

31. Absolutely and it worries me very much.

Listen to some of the wingnuts on the Washington Journal and you'll realize it's not a stretch to imagine. Fortunately, both have Secret Service protection right now.

[shadowknows69]

32. All you need is a couple agents loyal to the neocon cause.

To not see the gun man in time. Hinckley got Reagan.

[VP505]

34. I wouldn't speculate

about assassination attempts, but I would bet that should HRC get nominated and win election within the first two years she will face impeachment. The RePukes are always whining about how the left "hates Bu$h". I don't think the justified dislike for someone who has damaged this country as much as Bu$h has will come close to what we will see thrown at HRC, should she be elected. IMO, she will likely experience a level of criticism, pure evil hatred and push back the likes of which no President has ever experienced. I only hope I am completely wrong about that and that we pick up enough Dem House and Senate seats to be able to neutralize most of their dirty tricks.

[lonestarnot]

35. bushitler or dickwad haven't been whacked yet and they openly kill their kids, so no, not worried.

[leftofthedial]

40. neither is a true progressive

there is always danger of some wacko going nuts

but little danger of the ruling cabal offing them ala JFK or MLK

[Cheap_Trick]

41. of course there would be

If Hillary was president, there's all the women fearing tightie righties, and with Obama it'd be the racist pricks...also tightie righties.

[L. Coyote]

43. When I left the RFK campaign office we knew we were going to the White House

because the California primary was the last high hurdle. We talked to the national office, and they told us just that, that winning the California primary was the bridge crossed, that we were working for the future President now. I left as the speech ended, to get some needed rest.

I awoke to the radio alarm loudly proclaiming on the hour, "Senator Kennedy is dead."

If it had been H. H. Humphrey winning, I doubt the same scenario would have happened. Need I say more?

[LWolf]

47. Not so much for those 2.

Perhaps for other possible nominees that represent change in the status quo.

[MadBadger]

48. So you dont think that their are white supremacists that cant handle a black President?

Nope, you dont see it. All you see is your false view that Obama and Clinton are the same as George Bush and the republicans.

[LWolf]

58. I don't doubt that there are white supremacists who wouldn't

want a black president. I don't think that was the question, though. The question was about assassination risk.

I don't think that white supremacists or sexists constitute a larger assassination threat than other groups.

I think that the largest assassination risk comes from those currently holding the power, and I think the targets are those most likely to threaten the current power structure. Thus I don't think Clinton or Obama are at the greatest risk of assassination. They don't threaten the power structure.

[DS1]

53. I know a guy who runs a computer tracing bix, and there's already been one

attempt on Hillary's life that's been stopped.