is the justification "for officer safety" inimical to our civil rights?

[datasuspect]

Poll question: is the justification "for officer safety" inimical to our civil rights?

officer safety is the rationale used for pat down searches.

it's why the fourth amendment doesn't extend to your car.

it can be construed as a basis for suspicion or probable cause.

[Evergreen Emerald]

1. of course it should

The officer is assigned a duty--by the citizens of the state. And that duty puts him at risk. Of course the officer should be able to minimize that risk.

[Evergreen Emerald]

2. And the reason the fourth amendment does not extend to certain places in vehicles

is not because of officer safety but because we have less of an expectation of privacy in vehicles.

[datasuspect]

3. no but it applies to the individual person in the vehicle.

being in a motor vehicle makes you de facto suspect and the officer can search you incident to an investigation based on suspicion of a crime being committed or with probable cause.

if you fit certain profiles, officers rarely use discretion and a traffic stop is escalated from routine almost automatically; i.e., you are immediately assumed a suspect by virtue of fitting a profile and held to higher scrutiny.

[Evergreen Emerald]

4. we have tougher privacy laws in WA than you must.

No search without a warrant is the standard. Then we look to exceptions. We cannot be stopped without reason (ie traffic violation), which can lead to something more if PC exists (ie they see an open beer can in the car, or smell alcohol). But there have been cases thrown out of court because an officer used a pretext to stop someone.

I do, believe that an officer should have the right to search someone if they fear safety.

[treestar]

5. There has to be a balance

Naturally under current conditions it's one more thing they'll use as an excuse to give the government more power, so whatever the proposal is, we need to really think it over for necessity.

[bob4460]

6. Here's the problem

IF it were only "TERRY" pats it would be ok but often this is what happens. L.E.O. stops you for jaywalking or pulls you over for routine stop,then pats you down for weapons,but in doing so ask if they can pull everything out of your pocket or ask if they can pull the pack of cigarettes out of your pocket.If you say no that is probable cause (to THEM) witch is illegal under TERRY but who knows the law any more???

[datasuspect]

7. prosecutorial discretion is also helpful

but it depends on venue. in some jurisdictions, nuisance cases like first time offenses for small quantities of marijuana are low grade misdemeanors.

although you go through the hassle of the arrest, and are usually released in a short period of time, prosecutors will sometimes drop charges or withhold charges pending a court date that never comes. the permissible time in which to pick up charges or reinstate the initial charges usually expires and you can expunge the arrest record after a certain amount of time.