In the next 5 years, things in America will get: 1: Better. 2: Worse.

[Philosoraptor]

Poll question: In the next 5 years, things in America will get: 1: Better. 2: Worse.

Grab your keyboards you optimists, check in all you pessimists, rave on optipessimists.

Give me your prognosis for the next 5 years in America.

[meegbear]

1. How about "flatline"?

[Philosoraptor]

3. You flatliners, I swear.

Yes, the patient is terminal.

[MUAD_DIB]

17. Sadly I believe that too much damage has been done to the US

by the right wing and the inaction of Americans to kick the right wings ass.

We get what we deserve. :(

[wildhorses]

2. i am not sure even gore can save this mess

:scared:

[INdemo]

8. It will take a generation to clean up this mess.

[trotsky]

4. No signs of getting our budget or trade deficits under control.

And when oil becomes more commonly traded in Euros rather than dollars, it's going to get ugly.

We're phucked.

[bryant69]

5. The future is a good thing.

Certainly beats the alternative.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[Coyote_Bandit]

6. Personally

the nest five years will get better. Hard not to at this point. Society in general will stay about the same. The economy? Better in some sectors and worse in others. Jobs? I expect to start seeing a resurgence in trade and craftsmen and other small business.

[BreweryYardRat]

7. It's gonna get better.

If it gets worse, we're all fucking doomed, so I'm going to be optimistic.

[Beausoleil]

9. Similar to the Great Depression

It will take much more than 5 years to recover. And we haven't gone through the worst yet.

[Tesha]

10. We're past the age of cheap energy; things will get drastically worse.

Neraly everything that seemed wonderful about the recent past
was lubricated by cheap oil and cheap energy. Our entire
standard of living, from food to clothing to housing to
transportation was only made possible by cheap energy and
petroleum and natural gas feedstocks for petrochemicals.

We're now past the age of cheap fossil-fuel energy and things
will get drastically worse for at least a while.

*IF WE'RE LUCKY*, fusion power will come online somewhere
between 2040 and 2060. At that point, once again, encore
les bon temps roulee.

The question is how we will bridge between now and then.
Fission power is the likely conclusion of the powers
that be, but it carries with it the twin demons of
long-lasting nuclear waste and the very likely proliferation
of nuclear weapons; one or both of those demons may well
prove fatal to us.

And if we chose a path that isn't bridged by nuclear
fission, our choices are stark:

o We either voluntarily *VASTLY CUT DOWN ON ENERGY
CONSUMPTION* (and thus, our current standard of
living), or

o We experience "Mad Max" style global wars over energy
resources with the concommittant destruction of society.
The end point, of course, will be an involuntary vast
reduction in energy consumption and a likely failure to
have enough society left to make the leap to fusion power.

Personally, based on everything I know about human
nature, we will *NEVER*, as a society, voluntarily do
*ANYTHING* that is good for us but causes us short-
term pain. So we'll either travel down the fission road
(and hope like hell that the twin demons of proliferation
and pollution don't escape) or humanity sinks into Hell
on Earth.

I'd give us about 1:10 odds of coming out the other side
with a workable society.

Tesha

[H2O Man]

11. Other.

Things will get better and worse.


Getting Better
(Lennon/McCartney)

It's getting better all the time
I used to get mad at my school
The teachers who taught me weren't cool
You're holding me down, turning me round
Filling me up with your rules.
I've got to admit it's getting better
A little better all the time
I have to admit it's getting better
It's getting better since you've been mine.
Me used to be a angry young man
Me hiding me head in the sand
You gave me the word
I finally heard
I'm doing the best that I can.
I've got to admit it's getting better
I used to be cruel to my woman
I beat her and kept her apart from the things that she loved
Man I was mean but I'm changing my scene
And I'm doing the best that I can.
I admit it's getting better
A little better all the time
Yes I admit it's getting better
It's getting better since you've been mine

[riona]

12. That depends

Hopefully, THIS time, the electorate will elect an intelligent, honest, qualified leader who in turn will surround himself with people who are dedicated to strengthening America and upholding its Constitution. Wouldn't it be nice if voters and the media would pay attention to what really matters rather than hair styling, moles, crew-neck sweaters, and weight gain?

[Demeter]

13. Call Me a Cock-eyed Optimist

But I don't think things can get much worse--Michigan is in a Depression already for 6 years now.

[Tesha]

30. Okay -- "You're a Cock-eyed Optimist!"

Feel better now? ;)

Tesha

[The2ndWheel]

14. Entropy

If we can keep pushing problems off into the future(making them bigger and more complex when we have to deal with them), then we'll be ok(until we have to deal with the problems). If we can no longer win our war on entropy, and have to deal with the problems, then we won't be so well off.

Energy(from whatever source) better be cheap and plentiful in the years to come, and it better be able to keep up with demand that continues to rise. Also, our habitat has to be able to remain habitable, because we will use every inch of it to save ourselves from it if we have to.

[Labors of Hercules]

15. Depends on whether * says something stupid to cause WWIII before he leaves office. nt

[dysfunctional press]

16. "gradually better" or "drastically worse" are the only two options...?

that sure leaves a lot of uncovered ground.

i'm hoping for drastically better, but i'm counting on gradually worse.

[Annces]

18. My mother who has a much better understanding of these matters

says that Bush has caused a lot of damage and we will take a long long time to recover. I think things will be maintained in a mediocre way by DLC. Who knows when we will go green.

[Jed Dilligan]

19. There are so many different things to measure

I think things could get worse while the people get better, if you know what I mean.

We might be looking at five dollar gas followed by a financial crisis and homelessness on a Depression-era scale, but at this point I wonder if all that is what we need to grow up as a people.

Another artificial boom (a la Clinton) could just increase our arrogance and isolation from each other.

I don't want to go hungry, but if the price is the nation's soul, so be it.

[Make7]

20. Better for some people, worse for others.

The answer largely depends on one's perspective.

- Make7

[Yavin4]

21. It Will Be Better and Worse

The future will be better for the following people:

1. The extremely wealthy

2. People who have skills that can be exported around the world, technology, health care, finance, languages, etc.

3. The college educated

4. People who live in major metropolitan areas



The future will be worse for the following people:

1. Low skilled laborers

2. American mfg. laborers

3. Homeowners, unless in high priced markets

[dkofos]

22. As long as the corporotists are in charge, this country is in DEEP SHIT.

[StudentsMustUniteNow]

33. You said it n/t

[CrispyQ]

23. "Things are going to get a lot worse before they get worse."

I don't know who said that, but it sums up my feelings. My husband & I both feel that we have lived during the best years of the USA. Our remaining years will see it continue to decline - at what rate, I can only guess.

I can't recall if it was TDS or Colbert, but one of them had a guest, who said that the baby boomers were the first generation to not have to worry where the next meal was coming from. He mentioned how much that has shaped us as a generation & how it greatly affects the following generations, who also have not had to worry.

For the most part, we have not had to apply ourselves much over the past 60 or so years & I think it has made us fat, lazy & complacent. We have squandered that opportunity into a shallow quest for stuff, satisfying every desire of the individual. We have ignored our here-an-now communities. By here-and-now, I mean the communities we conduct our daily lives in & especially, the ones that you don't know or associate with or the ones you disagree with. The stingy attitude about paying taxes that support our communities is shameful.

I hope that whatever happens, our society will again value ideals like community, common good, & commonwealth.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

24. The collapse of empires is a messy business. The American version is not immune.

IMO, we are in the last stages. Deeply in debt. Relying on brute force, mercenaries, and client states to "protect our vital interests", being challenged around the world. See Rome and Britain for precedents.

The question is how long will it take and how bloody it will be?

[Tyler Durden]

25. Any history student can read the writing on the wall.

Frankly, Bush has done to us what we did to the USSR in the 70's and 80's: he's SPENT us to death. There's nobody out there who'll cover our debts. If we STARTED recovering right now, we would be treading water for the next 10 years plus, and you aren't deluding yourself that the European Union will be sitting on their hands waiting for us to catch up, are you?

The primacy of the US is over. We are running on inertia right now. I just hope things wind down with a modicum of PEACE and we don't end up with some sort of Civil War.

[rucky]

29. The world will be better off without US in the lead.

so your vote for worse is my vote for better.

[rockymountaindem]

34. The USSR didn't spend itself to death and we had nothing to do with it

Don't fall for the Reaganite line.

[Tyler Durden]

35. Having been there, I watched it happen.

I don't credit Reagan for anything. It was wrong what we did, as shown in what stink is left in Russia now.

[Art_from_Ark]

37. The USSR's economy was always a basket case

There was far too much emphasis on the production of industrial goods, which were basically made to supply other factories. For example, Factory A would make parts for Factory B, which made parts for Factory C, which made parts for Factory A, and the cycle would be repeated. The consumer was all but ignored, to the point where even daily necessities like bread and toilet paper were in such short supply that people often had to line up and wait for hours for their chance to buy them in the state stores. Such an economy would have collapsed upon itself eventually, with or without outside assistance.

[Javaman]

26. What needs to be defined is the term "better"...

Better because moron* will no longer be in office? you bet it will be.

OR better because we will be on the down side of oil and there will be less cars on the road? damn straight we will be better.

Or will it be worse because moron* has totally fucked us way beyond the capasity to recover?

Or will it be worse because there won't be enough oil, food will become harder for most people to either afford or get?

Every coin has two sides.

[TlalocW]

27. I think it will get better

I really believe we're going to take the White House, and whoever it is will be a whole lot better than Bush. If it's Hillary, it will probably happen faster since she and Bill have had experience cleaning up after the Bushes already.

TlalocW

[warren pease]

28. Better here politically because it doesn't get any worse than BushCo (except maybe CheneyCo)

But worse world-wide as climate change and population explosion set in with a vengeance and ecosystems start to collapse, leading to the generalized collapse of economic systems, leading in turn to localized, state-wide and eventually international mass murder, violence and genocide, and a permanent state of world war.

The cushy little lives we've been leading all these years will rapidly turn to pure shit as leisure, entertainment, dining out, books, drinking in fern bars, driving to the beach, driving anywhere at all, the arts, academics, theater, movies, the BBC, and several hundred other things that make life worth living are replaced by the daily and increasingly desperate search for food and shelter, safe surroundings, a little money competing with Mexican landscapers for the jobs "Americans won't do."

Yup. A real blast, brought to you by the American Dream, and accelerated by GOP administrations, beginning in earnest with Reagan/Bush I and reaching a fever pitch of environmental hostility in this maladministration of greedy, bloody-minded, insatiable corporate rapists and murderers.

And somebody turn the light out when it's all over.


wp

[Tesha]

31. It could get a lot worse than Bush.

> Better here politically because it doesn't get any
> worse than BushCo (except maybe CheneyCo)

It could get a *LOT* worse than Bush. The 20th Century
provided many real-world examples ranging from Adolf
Hitler through to Pol Pot and Nicolae Ceauşescu. And
if you want to turn to literature and fiction instead,
then you might want to consider 1984, V for
Vendetta, or Children of Men.

In the grand scheme of truly evil governments, the
Bush regime are lightweights.

Tesha

[warren pease]

36. Well, yeah... conceded...

I guess we're extremely lucky that these jerkoffs are so bad at their jobs. Now Pol Pot, Ceausescu... those guys knew how to run a proper genocidal dictatorship. BushCo on the other hand are, as you say, truly lightweights among the true mass-murdering giants of history.

Only thing that bothers me, though, is the amazing weaponry they have at their disposal. Turns out you do get something for your annual $400B - $600B arms budget after all. You get killing machines so deadly and efficient that BushCo's military, armed with maybe a tenth of what they took with them to Iraq, would have produced overwhelming victory for the Nazis. Which kicks their ability to create true chaos and misery up several notches.

And re 1984: my all-time favorite scene goes like this: O'Brien challenges Winston to isolate the underlying motive for the indiscriminate exercise of continuous, overt and largely random state brutality.

Since Winston is unable to conceive of limitless power, or how a state might exploit it to do limitless evil, O'Brien supplies the perfect image: "If you want a picture of the future,” he says, “imagine a boot stamping on a human face – forever.”

And then Smith's off for his date in Room 101.

Btw, what's V for Vendetta?


wp

[Tesha]

39. "V for Vendetta"

> Btw, what's V for Vendetta?

V for Vendetta is a comic book (excuse me, graphic
novel ;) ) made into a movie that was very popular
around here last year. It describes a near-future England
in a world that has fallen into chaos. Like the 1984
England, it is an oligarchy, but run mostly by one man, the
Warden of England.

The movie describes the struggle of another man, aided
by one woman, against this power, using the theme of Guy
Fawkes Day to rouse the people.

It's well worth seeing.

* http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V_for_Vendetta (the comic book)
* http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V_for_Vendetta_%28film%29 (the movie)

Tesha

[StudentsMustUniteNow]

32. What's the difference between Clobama and Bush?

Oh wait, the former is pro-choice.

If we don't pull to the left, we'll be pushed to the dirt.

[murielm99]

41. Clobama?

What the fuck are you talking about?

[porphyrian]

38. Both, likely. Possibly all three, but I can't say. - n/t

[Raksha]

40. I notice you didn't have an option for "things will stay the same."

Very wise, because that isn't an option. If things DON'T get better as we recover from the Bush years, it's for damn sure they will get worse--a LOT worse.

For the record, I picked the optimist's choice but with inner reservations. Any progressive Democrat capable of presiding over a gradual recovery from the Bush years will have the unenviable task of prying entrenched power from the corporatists' cold, dead fingers. That won't be easy or pleasant, and could very well be dangerous.