Home LED lighting is just around the corner!

[WhiteTara]

I am so excited I have to share. I received word this morning that 1000 and 1200 warm white LED bulbs are ready for the production line! This is so incredible 10 watt LED bulbs will produce 1000 lumens (75watt bulb) without mercury or lead poisonings. These bulbs only offer 5000 hours rather than the low lumen LED of 50,000 hours. But still, these are par with CFLs without the toxic effects. I hope to have these on the market in the big box stores by September and rolling out into independents by spring. Watch for them, and plan your replacement program!

If anyone can help me coax the PUC to force electric companies to offer rebates in the same manner they do for CFLs, please let me know!

Also, I would love to work with John Edwards and Al Gore in lighting their homes with LEDs. Again, if you can help with the contact, I would be sooooooo grateful.

Thanks for reading. Hope you are as excited as I!
:bounce: :bounce::bounce::bounce:

[Matsubara]

1. I'm excited but a link to the story would be nice...

NT

[WhiteTara]

4. the link to this story

is me. I have formed a company to sell LED lighting and I got my call this morning!

[Matsubara]

6. I congratulate you then...

...and at the risk of being presumptious, would suggest press releases and other PR...

[WhiteTara]

8. yep, that too!

It is almost overwhelming to think of the whole picture of bringing this to fruition, but piece by piece, step by step and poco e poco.

[liberaldemocrat7]

49. Hmm let's create a bulb that only needs 1/10th the electricity and sell it for 10X the price LOL

and have it last 1/10th the time of the regular incandescent bulb. No economic improvement here. Business just doesn't want to give the regular consumer a break and pass along the huge savings.

This reminds me of the hybrid auto market. Sure we'll sell you a hybrid car but we'll jack up the price so the savings you get gets eaten by the increase. Oh and we'll sell you ice in the wintertime. Who will buy some hundred pound bags.



SHOP AT ZAZZLE.COM FOR MUGS, STAMPS, BUMPER STICKERS AND MORE.

[Occulus]

15. Okay, here's a technical question, then

I just bought a Samsung 50" DLP television. It's really, really nice- I won't have to buy a new TV for at least ten years- but the lamp is only rated for 6000 hours (although I know someone whose lamp has lasted for eight or nine thousand hours without replacement).

The lamps are expensive! They include a housing that comes with the lamp and slots into the side of the TV, but I was wondering: could an LED lamp be used instead of the hot halogen monster in there right now?

You could bottom out lamp prices for these if you did it right, I think. You don't have to buy a new housing, just a new lamp.

Or are the power requirements so very divergent that this is not feasible? I don't want to pay $200+ every time the lamp goes out (may this be seldom)...

[WhiteTara]

18. actually, I know nothing

about that application of LEDs. In fact, my learning curve is straight up as it is. But what you ask sounds so logical and I would imagine that it would be so. The difference between the LED and halogen is the heat! LEDs produce almost no heat by comparison. Good luck with it.

[localroger]

40. Unfortunately, no

Projector lamps have to not only emit a lot of light, they have to do it from the smallest possible area. LED's aren't nearly as bright as a lamp filament, and getting a lot of light out of them basically involves incorporating a lot of elements over a wide area. You can do this to light your house, but not to project images on a screen.

[Matariki]

52. Hey congratulations!

I've been waiting for LEDs. They seem like a *much* better alternative to CFLs.

[eridani]

55. Your company needs a web page, ASAP n/t

[WhiteTara]

69. are you offering?

[eridani]

79. I haven't been able to get my own web page up yet

There are plenty of web savvy folks here though--do a shout-out.

[blondeatlast]

83. Try Matcom (since eridani doesn't do them, as s/he says). nt

[mcg]

85. I do web pages.

I have professional experience with intranet web sites and have helped a friend with an internet site. I could help you some. You can send me a message if you would like to discuss this.

[tavalon]

80. That is fabulous!

Good on ya!

[melm00se]

does this mean that

LEDs themselves will finally drop?

The reason I ask is that I am aiming to put LEDs on my motorcycle and the damn finished boards cost a fortune.

[proud patriot]

2. great news

:)

[WhiteTara]

5. Thanks

:party:

[originalpckelly]

3. Oh that's absolutely wonderful, as someone who gets what you're saying...

because they're also trying to get those in laptop screens, I'm quite happy with that! Woohoo!!!!!!

:bounce:

Thanks for the good news!

[WhiteTara]

7. yes, there is going to be a whole LED

world that will change everything. What is so wonderful is that gallium (the base metal) is plentiful and does not come from just one place in the world, so no wars, no raping the earth and no toxic leftovers!
:woohoo:

[originalpckelly]

13. The wonders of technology are quite exciting!

[gollygee]

9. So long as they aren't flashy

The new CFLs don't bother me but I'm worried about LEDs.

We will certainly jump on that bandwagon if they don't give me headaches.

[WhiteTara]

19. LEDs have constant light

and turn on instantly. They are the future and are coming soon.

One of the incredible details of LED lighting is that they incorporate the full spectrum color. There are reostats (for want of the real word) that change the color. So, if you want to sleep, turn the color to blue, etc. This is such an exciting technological advance.

[conscious evolution]

78. Way cool!!

Changing colors would rock.

[blondeatlast]

84. I have one for my pool light--spectacular or soothing, depending on how it's programmed. nt

[skids]

81. Technically, some of them do pulsate.

If the LED bulb is using a pulse driver, which some do because you can get more efficiency out of some LEDs by driving them in short pulses rather than always-on. And that's how the rheostats work -- they change from using shorter, stronger pulses to longer less powerful pulses which alters the tint of the output. Typically the pulse rate is around 1KHZ though so nothing like the 60HZ flicker of an old flourescent. Some LEDs may not use pulse driving techniques at all, but the ones with adjustable tint definitely do.

The newer CFLs actually work at a faster rate than that (several tens of KHz), but probably those who are still sensitive to them are sensitive not to the higher frequency rate, but to a 120Hz oscillation that is picked up from the land line in poorly designed AC/AC converters (they may have better luck with a different brand.) As long as the LED drivers don't have a similar problem they should not generate problems for people that are sensitive to that.

[liberal N proud]

10. I wonder if my idea would fly...

lighting the whole house with one light bulb?

One light source for all your lighting need throughout the house or office.

[Occulus]

16. Please explain

I think I might know how to pull that off... how would you do it?

[liberal N proud]

23. Fiber optics

One bulb, fiber cable to each area you want to light.
You just need a shutter at each source to turn off the source in that room if you desired.
There wouldn't be any more yelling at the kids because they left the light on in their room. It wouldn't matter.

Now if someone develops that Idea, I will know where they got it.

[phusion]

74. This is already done I believe...

With natural light, at least. Fiber optic skylight channels...

Cool idea, for sure!

[AndyTiedye]

11. LEDs Rock

We're running LED bulbs in several lamps, and have some LED track lighting going in this weekend.

Most of the current stuff is cool white. The arrival of warm white will be quite welcome.

More on LED home lighting here:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?p=1796498

[WhiteTara]

20. Thanks for the website

registrations are down right now, but I bookmarked it and will go back later.

[slackmaster]

12. SUBSCRIBE

:kick:

[glowing]

14. Now these I will buy.. I don't dare buy the others witha toddler in the

house.. do you know how dangerous that is?

[WhiteTara]

24. Yes, and think of the millions that are in use

right now.

[glowing]

29. I know, most people won't dispose of them properly and will end

up in the landfill.

[WhiteTara]

31. unfortunately and illegally so n/t

[localroger]

41. Glowing, CFL's aren't dangerous

They are much safer than old style long flourescent bulbs, and the new ones of those are much safer than the ones they made in say the 1970's. The amount of mercury in a CFL is really tiny, and has been really overblown.

My problem with LED's is I'd like to know the manufacturing pollution costs; all forms of electronic fabbing are extremely toxic and messy. CFL's need a circuit board to generate the right starting and running voltages so maybe that's a wash, but I'd like to see an honest comparison before going too rah-rah.

[KurtNYC]

64. LED is directional light and at 70 lumens per watt you are getting

better task lighting (more light where you want it) than CFL which is about 90-95 lumen per watt but is measured 360-degrees.

LED quality is all over the range though and the claims of 100,000 hour life for white LEDs is unfounded. However LED is now reaching the threshold price and quality wise to be on par with fluorescent so we are going to hear a lot about general use LED in the next 12 months.

[SammyWinstonJack]

17. Why can't you contact Al Gore and Edwards your own self, since you seem to be the "stroke of genius"

behind this? :eyes:

[WhiteTara]

22. Okay, I will. n/t

[SmokingJacket]

21. Dang, so I have to change my bulbs AGAIN??

Haha, just kidding. I only changed a few to start with -- knew this was coming and was never fond of those fluorescents anyway.

[InvisibleTouch]

25. Sounds great!

I'll keep watch for them at the stores, and hope you will keep us updated here.

Will these be useable in regular light sockets, the way CFL's are?

[WhiteTara]

28. Absolutely, in the regular base

candle base, and MR16. Most will look just like your bulbs now, but some are so cool, you can leave off the shade!

[StarryNite]

26. Wow! LEDs, the wave of the future.

There are numerous uses for LEDs from lighting to health applications. Thanks a bunch for posting this. I'm so excited that I'm having trouble typing!

:bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

27. Big question:

The price I saw on LED fixtures was huge. Do they expect economies of scale to kick in early and often?

[WhiteTara]

30. Price is huge. I am working on this

Just before I read your post, I thought...here is the perfect place to market test price! You are so right on.

I am working for a rebate program from the electric companies, just like they are doing for CFLs presently. I am working through my state leg and have prelims set up with federal legislators to work on this. But until today, I have only had theory, no product. Now, I have something real to discuss.

So, how much would you pay for a lightbulb that lasted 5000 hours used 1/10 of the current amount of electricity you currently use for lighting your home and to reduce the amount of airconditioning you must use to cool the house from the heat of the incandescent. As an added bonus, you can toss this bulb into the landfill without danger and would only do so every 4 or 5 years. One study suggests that each bulb will save $67.00 in electricy costs over its life.

Okay. I look forward to your answer. Thanks

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

32. I look at it from a marketing position.

First, above a certain price point, there will be great resistance. People are NOT going to pay for one of these at the prices I saw. They just won't. Second, the poor and those on fixed incomes, who could benefit greatly from the reduction in electrical bills, will never be able to afford to make the switch at those prices. Period.

Finally, there has been some very well-informed speculation that some of the cause of the recent rise in electrical rates was fueled by the cut in usage by so many people switching to CFLs. That has to be addressed in the strongest possible terms.

Quite frankly, fuck the investors in energy generation and distribution companies. There is something more important afoot, here.

[WhiteTara]

33. yes, but what would you pay?

"There is something more important afoot, here." what does that mean?

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

42. At present prices, I wouldn't.

I can't. I'm poor. Really poor. And there's the rub.

What is more important is saving energy and cutting the burning of fuels or fission of materials.

[BlackVelvet04]

34. What kind of price are you talking about? n/t

[Pawel K]

44. It will be large

LEDs are still fairly expensive. They required a PCB with a resitor to operate and in many cases you need a AC to DC converter mounted along side of the led. If this really is just 1 10 watt led it will be extremely expensive. The largest LEDs I've had a chance to play with were 3 watters and those were fairly expensive.

Color Kinetics has done some interesting things with their products. I got a chance to attend a demo where they had a new MR16 bulb out which gave out very good light out put running at only 3 watts. But as you said the cost will be big, to give you an idea this perticular mr16 bulb was gonna sell to distributors for $40 ea.

LEDs will be great in the future, but I just don't see them taking the market by storm for another decade or so. Sandia national labs did a great study on this a few years back, I'll see if I can find the white paper on it.

[BlackVelvet04]

61. Thank you for the info. n/t

[KurtNYC]

65. I have seen lots of the new LED stuff in the last 4 months - it wont be 10 yrs

LED is coming on application by application. Right now it is replacing neon and backlighting letters. GE sold 7-million feet of Tetra for that. Already took traffic lights and dont walk signs and brake lights on cars. Many companies are trying to do general illumination now and I have seen some decent results. LED PAR lights are fairly decent now.

Did you get a chance to see how hot the 3-watt LED MR16 was?

[Pawel K]

86. But these changes took about a decade to get here

It wont happen overnight but we are getting closer. Yes, LEDS are the perfect replacement for neons and for sign lighting at this point, but because of the way a LED works it will take a while longer to replace home lighting. LEDs give light where you point them at which makes them ideal for those sign applications, but people wont be too happy about that when trying to light an entire room.

The 3-watt mr16 was actually cool to the touch but it only ran for about 15 minutes. This is still extremely impressive so it looks like color kinetics might have finally fixed the heat issues.

[KurtNYC]

90. My desk lamp, bathroom lighting and under counter lighting is all LED

some of it has an incandescent look and some is daylight. I'm about 1/2 LED right now.

Here is an apartment that is all LED:
http://www.vossolutions.com/projects/london_apartment/london_apartment.htm

Warm white (incandescent look) LED was all over the Lightfair International trade show last month. There has been a huge increase in quality and output over the last 18 months. The purity of the chemicals going into LEDs is much better and they are running cooler. The price of the LEDs themselves has gone down by more than half in the last 12 months but most manufacturers have not passed that along. Home Depot is now selling a lights for patios that have a solar panel on top, a battery that gets recharged and then LEDs pointing down for $9 each(!) GE sells a small puck light there too and Ikea stocks a couple LED lights so the retail beachhead is already forming. But the better stuff isn't at Home Depot yet. I have seen LED track lighting and I use LED replacement for fluorescent -- long tubes with hundred of smaller LEDs in them to throw light everywhere. LED is ready now but getting more retail shelf space is going to take time because buying a halogen bulb every 800 hours brings customers into the store.

[Pawel K]

91. What kind of savings have you seen with your LED replacement for fluorescents...

...and how much did they cost? Also were they all direct replacements?

That all LED apartment looks awesome, my company is actually doing a similar job in Florida but only for one large room. However, that kind of installation with all those color kinetics fixtures would cost you hundreds of thousands of dollars.

[WhiteTara]

70. do they think they will have a market?

$40. to a distrib would then have to sell for $80. retail...is that possible?

[Pawel K]

87. They already have a big market in the commercial world

but the home market wont be out there for a while longer until these things can get a lot cheaper.

Knowing color kinetics they will sue the next person to develop the next led mr16 that doesn't get hot.

[orleans]

35. k&r n/t

[SixString]

36. They're here now

http://superbrightleds.com/MR16_specs.htm

A little pricey though.

[IndyOp]

39. Welcome to DU SixString! :-)

None of the bulbs on the page you linked to are for "normal household lighting" -- they are all really low wattage - around 20~25 watt incandescent.

Maybe I am missing something?

:shrug:

:hi:

[No DUplicitous DUpe]

50. Welcome to DU, SixString..I just ordered over $100.00 worth for my colorful taxi...

http://www.ultimatetaxi.com

Thanks for the link!

Jon

[SixString]

51. Nice!!

[No DUplicitous DUpe]

53. Thanks, I guess I'm not anonymous around here, anymore

[here_is_to_hope]

54. My daughter just said...

For me! For me!
Really cool thing you are doing.:toast:

[No DUplicitous DUpe]

62. Tell your daughter I'm just a big kid...

I am a hit with kids birthday parties...Although my ride is for kids of all ages!

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

37. Keep Us Posted. I Look Forward To Them. Any Idea On Cost Comparison?

And I should be able to use these with dimmers too, right?

[tkmorris]

46. I have no idea what new design the OP is referring to but....

The currently available LED products for home use will not work well with dimmer switches, no.

[WhiteTara]

71. I'm not sure about dimmers

there have been articles both ways

[IndyOp]

38. My electrician talked me into installing recessed lighting -

My living/office space has 8 75W/130V FLOOD Sylvania Capsylite Par30 bulbs that operate on dimmers.

The lamps & bulbs were installed 2 years ago and only one has gone out -- are there CFLs or will there be LEDs that will operate similar to the bulbs I already have?

I live in Indiana - I mention this only because I hear that Canada has lots more CFL options than the U.S. and that might influence your response.

Thanks!

:hi:

[Pawel K]

45. There are LED par30 replacements out there now

but as I said in another post in this discussion I think they are total crap:

http://www.ablamp.com/LED_PAR30-full.html

The technology simply isn't there yet to replace conventional lighting but it for sure will be in a few more years. In the last 6 years I have been in the led business the market has exploded. They are getting more efficient and less expensive almost daily, but they still have a while to do.

[IndyOp]

48. Your link to ABLamp doesn't include info about cost or where to buy...

How do I know how much light they put out? They don't show # of watts...

Also - the fact that they are non-dimmable - can they go in dimmer fixtures and does that mean I just get on/off - no more dimming?

:shrug:

[Pawel K]

89. You would have to contact them about cost and all the other information

From my experiments in the office you can usually still dimm them as all you are doing is lowering the voltage to the lamp so naturally the LED will get dimmer. But sometimes the side effect of that with LEDs is that you will get flicker as the wave form of the current actually changes when you do that.

[Pawel K]

43. I'm skeptical of LEDs to replace conventional lighting

the technology doesn't seem to be there yet. My company was one of the first to jump on to the growing LED market about 6 years ago. And as awesome as these lights are for decorative lighting all the light bulb replacements I've seen got way too hot to use in regular home lighting. So yes, on one hand you might save power at the bulb it self but the heat energy produced will limit the efficiency. In a few more years this will probably change and solid state lighting really has a chance to take over the market. Color kinetics has released a new cool mr16 bulb that is comparable in light output to conventional mr16s but the big draw back there is the cost, about $40 a bulb, and it really isn't a direct retrofit as LEDs require electronic circuits to function.

However, I have not seen this perticular product so I can't really comment. Do you have any links to this?

[garybeck]

73. wa?

if there is heat, that is electricity being wasted. incandescent lights get hot because over 90% of the electricity is given off as heat, not light. LEDs do not get hot, not nearly as hot as incandescents. my understanding is they are roughly the same efficiency as CFLs. So they should get roughly the same temperature, which is not very hot. To say they get "way too hot to use in regular home lighting" doesn't make sense. the only drawback of LEDs that I'm aware of is cost. if this person can produce them at a reasonable cost, then say hello to LEDs for home lighting.

[Pawel K]

88. In theory LEDs don't get hot, you are aboslutely rigth about that. But...

when you actually apply that to your circuit you will always find that in fact they do get hot. It still isn't as hot as incandescent lights but I had a mr16 in the office a few months back that was at around 300F when installed in a fixture, we had to pull it out to avoid a fire danger.

The other big problem with those LEDs is that they shine light were you point them. This is why they will take over MR16s in probably the next couple of years but to replace incandescent lights it will still take some time.

[Jokinomx]

47. Congratulations on your new endevour!

I was listening to (I hate to admit it here, but)Glenn Beck ONE day this week. That is all I can stomach from him. Anyway, he was ranting about light bulbs and the push to force Americans to use florescent. I think it was California that has passed or is considering passing legislation to ban incandescent bulbs for the toxic florescent.

I really think you should research who is pushing for this change and see if you can get them on board with your safe LEDs.

Good luck...

and I know my household would make the switch....

Peace....

[WhiteTara]

72. AB722 passed in California to ban

incandescent, but they did not put the language of favoring any technology. So that was good, and yes, I'm working for inroads into the leg.

[David Zephyr]

56. LED's began replacing traditional lights all railroad crossings years ago.

Brighter and they last forever.

[KamaAina]

57. About time. Fluorescents suck!

The ones in my boss's office are making her sick. Literally. She had to put a couple of incandescent desk lamps in there. It's like she's working in a cave, like Cheney. :evilgrin:

Worse still, fluorescents generate a 60Hz flicker. Most people can't see it, but some can, particularly people with autism. It is like going to school or your cubicle or whatever with a strobe light on. Not fun!

I wonder if "typical" people might perceive the flicker subliminally, and if that might not be why everyone is so tired even after a day of not much actibvity in a fluorescent-lit office.

Go LEDs!

[uppityperson]

58. How much will they cost? I read $30-40 a bulb.

Of course, you don't ever have to replace them, but still, a bit steep. I also read an article recently that said the main people expected to be able to afford them are big companies that then don't have to pay janitors to replace them (mega malls, etc.)

[WhiteTara]

67. I think we will be able to come in under

that price by a lot. But they still aren't $1.00.

[uppityperson]

76. This all sound really good. Congratulations and hoping it goes well.

[unkachuck]

59. excellent....this great news....n/t

[blogslut]

60. cool

I dig LEDs.

[Briarius]

63. So are you just doing distribution?

I'm actually in the development phase of a warm white bulb... guess I better hurry up :P

[WhiteTara]

66. Indeed, but there will be room

for lots of lights, we need to change the world...one light bulb at a time!

[Greyskye]

68. Good luck!

I hope you're able to keep the price point low. I doubt you'll find much of a market - even with the specs you've quoted upthread - unless you can offer them for under $10.

I've really been looking forward to LED home lighting - thanks for being on the bleeding edge! :toast:

[redacted]

75. GREAT! Thanks to IKEA we're an all-CFL house

with NO conventional light bulbs, except in the oven & refrigerator!

[conscious evolution]

77. Can you make a GU-10 base?

Do these work with standard dimmers?
What is the cost?

[Lurking Dem]

82. A personal note of thanks -

For people like me, who cannot be exposed to UV and, hence, CFLs, this breakthrough of yours may mean the difference between being housebound and living a considerably less restricted life. At least, not having to dress in what amounts to a burka every time I go somewhere.

The public push for fluorescent lighting has been scaring me to death. I cannot tell you how much this might mean to me.