If they lie to you, they can be prosecuted for false representation, or entrapment. This is a tactic that they have been using forever. They get their people into the movement, and they provoke people to get violent, then it gives the movement a black eye. This is what happened to us when we tried to shut down Shoreham, back in the 70s. The police were unsuccessful in their attempts to turn us into a violent mob though, because we knew who they were. Now that we have the Internet, it's a lot easier to check someone's identity.
Never has been true & never will be true. Cops can & do lie about everything especially their ID. I use to see it a lot when working for criminal defense attorneys...Defendants would become friends with these undercover cops & on many occasions had asked them & the cops lied only to be busted later on. Defendants would bring pictures of them partying with the under cover cops to our office & there is nothing that can be done...They are allowed to say & do anything they choose while under cover including getting high!
It is one big urban myth that cops have to tell you they are cops when you confront them.
was to ask directly, "are you a cop?". Of course they will lie, and you then ask to see ID. Now this will make them real nervous and they will refuse - they may have their badge and cop ID with them. If they start to throw something, start getting in the riot cops' faces, or start talking about violence, get as many people as possible to surround and isolate the agent and "walk" him away for the scene. Take pictures, as many pic takers as possible at the same time, and have somebody take pictures of the person taking pictures. Watch them carefully and note if they are making eye contact with the riot cops, and what the response is. Also,look for color codes or odd clothing, used a a codefor other cops to pick out the infiltrators
48. That's exactly what we did when they tried to deny it
back in the 70s. Not sure about the color code thing, but when they start to stall about their identity, you know that something's up. At the point when they stuttered, I would say, "If you have to think about if you're a cop or not, than I guess that you are." Once they were confronted like this, they always admitted that they were, in fact, police. At that point they were expelled from the group. If something started to get the slightest bit violent during a demonstration, we would use the circle and isolate technique, without even asking the person's identity. There weren't as many cameras around back then, so we didn't take pictures, but the few of us who kind of coordinated things remembered these people. It's easier now, but you still need a core group of people who you can really trust.
the Stanford Prison Experiment in 1971. Zimbardo recruited college students for a sociology experiment wherein twelve students 'became' prisoners and twelve students 'became' guards. The experiment was terminated after less than a week because the 'guards' became controlling and abusive, and the 'prisoners' became passive and tolerant of abuse.
Despite the criticisms leveled at Zimbardo and this experiment, we might consider the fact that twelve ordinary students chosen randomly from the Stanford student body to act as 'prison guards' became controlling authoritarians, and that some were abusive--even sadistic.
I am not surprised when I see this type of behavior among the police who are charged with 'handling' the Occupy protesters. I am quite impressed that the protesters remain committed to non-violence and Satyagraha. Perhaps the Satyagraha will help some of the police officers to throw off the shackles of THEIR oppression.
42. Thich Naht Hanh told a story of something that happened during the Vietnam war...
Americans and Vietnamese were shooting at each other from each side of a foot bridge over some water. Four monks needed to cross, so they did, slowly. Shooting slowed down as they did, and eventually ceased all together.
45. Even MORE frightening, the Milgram Experiment, 1963
"The Milgram experiment on obedience to authority figures was a series of notable experiments in social psychology experiments conducted by Yale University psychologist Stanley Milgram, which measured the willingness of study participants to obey an authority figure who instructed them to perform acts that conflicted with their personal conscience. Milgram first described his research in 1963 in an article published in the Journal of Abnormal and Social Psychology,<1> and later discussed his findings in greater depth in his 1974 book, Obedience to Authority: An Experimental View.<2>
The subjects believed that for each wrong answer, the learner was receiving actual shocks. In reality, there were no shocks. After the confederate was separated from the subject, the confederate set up a tape recorder integrated with the electro-shock generator, which played pre-recorded sounds for each shock level. After a number of voltage level increases, the actor started to bang on the wall that separated him from the subject. After several times banging on the wall and complaining about his heart condition, all responses by the learner would cease.<1>
At this point, many people indicated their desire to stop the experiment and check on the learner. Some test subjects paused at 135 volts and began to question the purpose of the experiment. Most continued after being assured that they would not be held responsible. A few subjects began to laugh nervously or exhibit other signs of extreme stress once they heard the screams of pain coming from the learner.<1>"
but every cop knows a bad cop. The kind of cop who enjoys his job a little too much, that sees him or herself as the last check on criminals or has simply been at it to long and has burnt out. Cops are people with power, and we all know that power tends to corrupt.
It seems to me that a careful activist could use the same technology as the cops have, it simply takes some effort.
At the G20 in Toronto, and everywhere else. They know they get away with it because its one of those "if the lie is big enough". Many people just do not believe it happens. And the lazy MSM just hooks onto the story of "violent protesters" instead of actually investigating first.
65. Yesterday rabble-rousers broke windows and spray-painted businesses in Oakland
Edited on Thu Nov-03-11 04:25 PM by Fire Walk With Me
during the marches. They were quickly shunned and protesters immediately went to work attempting to repair damages.
Considering what is seen and heard in this video, and that this is the THIRD time Quan has unleashed the dogs of war, how great of a leap is it to believe that POLICE are the ones doing damage and trying to create an excuse to tear the whole thing down?
Bloomberg has had police sending drunks and homeless and rabble-rousers to Liberty Plaza ("Take it to Zuccotti"). "Authorities" and police have been engaging in disgusting tactics against this peaceful, truly meaningful protest and would not suprise me if they they got even worse.
Of course, it will backfire upon them. Fascists all. To any police reading this: If you are taking orders from a corporate-controlled government, your actions are fascist. You are doing the bidding of Goldman Sachs and the corporations the Supreme Court allowed to fully engage in politics. Please consider this before accepting orders to cause harm or to even intimidate those of us who seek to reinstate the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. Thank you very much.
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