Zero Tolerance Keeping Us Safe From 6 Year Olds

[unapatriciated]

Run time: 01:56 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfK4u3Hg2H4   Posted on YouTube: October 13, 2009 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: October 13, 2009 By DU Member: unapatriciated Views on DU: 2803

 

[MineralMan]

1. The thing has a sharp knife blade. It is a knife.

It's being cast as some fork and spoon thing, and it has those tools, but it also has a typical pocket knife blade.

I carried a pocket knife all through grammar school, and still carry one, but this poutrage thing is way overblown. The kid had a knife at school. That's against the rules. Mom and sorta Dad sent him to school with it.

I suspect a publicity stunt.

It's like this:

[unapatriciated]

2. this sounds like a stunt to hijack this thread...

because no one on here could seriously suggest throwing this kid in reform school

[MineralMan]

4. No, I wouldn't send him to reform school, either.

I'm just pointing out that it's not just a fork and spoon set. It's also a knife. Personally, I think kids should be allowed to carry pocket knives, just like I did. They aren't, though.

This is not a zero tolerance thing. Zero tolerance is when a kid is in trouble for a dull plastic table knife used to spread peanut butter or cut an apple. Zero tolerance is a kid getting in trouble for a picture of a gun, or a transparent plastic squirt gun.

This is not zero tolerance. This is a knife with a sharp cutting blade. That's against the rules at that school.

What should happen? Couple of days suspension or after-school detention and a strong warning that includes the parents.

[tomm2thumbs]

9. it's also to protect other kids who's parents have not given their kids knives or taught them

knives are passed around at school 'come on... lemme see it!!!!' and it's really not just about the kid having it, but what other kids can do with it as well. I think the parents are trying to play 'poor me' when they are the ones responsible - unfortunately, the kid is getting the punishment. Reform school - sounds a bit much to me as well, but I can tell you these rules aren't there for the purpose of harming kids but to protect them. I think the parents dropped the ball completely not making it clear as a bell that it wasn't for school.

[MineralMan]

11. Yeah, this mostly falls on the parents.

In the first place, most 6 year olds shouldn't be using any pocket knife with a sharp blade unsupervised, and as you say, kids pass this stuff around. We did, I know.

Also, I suspect that one or more of the adults is a winger of some sort, and may well have done this to provoke an incident. It happens. Pretty much everyone knows that sharp knives are not allowed in school.

In any case, they've said now that they're going to home school the kid. I still think it's likely to have been a publicity stunt.

Even so, reform school, or an alternative school, which is what where the kid is going is, is pretty harsh. A two day suspension makes more sense to me, and maybe a spanking for the adults who are obvious morons.

[unapatriciated]

14. I'm not saying the issue should not be addressed.

What I disagree with is your thinking the parents allowed him to take it to school.
I raised three boys and yes they did many things that got me a call from the school.
It was handled between myself and the school never with a threat of reform school. (they went to some pretty tough inner city schools)
They did have a responsibility to point out all uses of the tool and where and when was proper to use it. That is were they failed.
Sorry, I don't think this is something that calls for detention because the intent was not there. What is does call for is education on why it is not allowed at school.
but I would have never given one of my boys a pocket knife, or a bb gun at that age. They are really too young to understand and respect the danger of those items.
You can not watch them 24/7.

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MineralMan]

18. Well, I guess you told me...

:shrug:

[tomm2thumbs]

26. and I guess someone told them!

there's no place for that kind of response - if someone can' disagree without that kind of rhetoric, it isn't worth getting into the conversation in the first place

[MrModerate]

28. That's not how I define zero tolerance. I define zero tolerance as something . . .

That means adults have to portray themselves to children as dumber than rocks, because they don't have the discretion of a six-year-old.

One can argue whether pocket knives should be banned from school or not, but for school officials to tie their own hands and suspend the process of rational judgment teaches all the wrong things. Zero tolerance is for cowardly autocrats of the George Bush school of governance.

Not exactly a pedogogical high water mark.

[sasquuatch55]

21. He's six for christ sake!

nt

[Piewhacket]

23. sure, but this six year old is still WAYYYYY smarter than a school board.

its like this,
'zero tolerance' is not legal, because it refuses to recognize
either mitigation or a legal defense. which is why its used for
political rhetoric, but only a fool would actually put it into
action. here, the entire school board should be replaced.
Oh brave new world that has such people in't. (The Tempest)


as for the boy,
this six year old is smart enough to know he must stand up
straight and present his defense, even when it is scary.
my heart soars like a hawk to know of such a hero.

[sasquuatch55]

29. I concur.

nt

[MineralMan]

3. It's called a hobo knife, and there are dozens of varieties.

They all have a sharp knife blade, though. You can see the blade in the video.

Yes, it's a tool for eating, but has a sharp knife blade, just like any other pocket knife. If knives are not allowed in school, this one fits the category.

[tomm2thumbs]

5. he could have brought cutlery guns, like these

[tomm2thumbs]

6. just as long as he didn't bring his own chair to school

[MineralMan]

7. Those are probably a bit costly for a 6 year old boy, I'd think.

I'm betting they're museum pieces. Pretty cool, too.

[MineralMan]

8. One other note:

While I carried a pocket knife to school, it wasn't until fourth grade, if I remember correctly. At age 6, I wasn't considered old enough to use knives unsupervised by my parents. I got my first pocket knife and permission to carry it at age 8 or 9. I don't remember exactly. Got my first BB gun at age 10.

Sharp knife blades and 6 year olds are not a great combination. Heck, I probably closed the blade of mine on my finger half a dozen time even at age 8 or 9. I did finally learn not to do that, at the cost of a few bandaids.

[NavyDavy]

10. the 6 yo should be suspended and the parents should get some

type of punishment for allowing their 6 yo to take it to school....rules are rules.

[Piewhacket]

24. no, the the knife should be returned, the principle sacked, the school board replaced.

oh, and NayDavy needs to be banned for posting
such a ridiculous troll.

[depakid]

27. Wow- even on an ostensibly progressive board the rule of reason gets tossed out

[The Wizard]

12. If the principle had a lick of sense

he/she would have taken it away and sent a note to the parents to come in and pick it up along with a list if items forbidden in school.
Imposing unmitigated authority without forethought is right out of the Bush playbook.

[goddess40]

25. You are right with such a sensible solution

I hate zero tolerance rules they're for lazy adults.

[20score]

13. WTF! Anyone twisted and moronic (and scared) enough to write and enforce, or even endorse these

rules, is an embarrassment to the whole human race.

[Hulk]

16. It is a knife as well...

...and it really had no place at school. The parents didn't seem that dumb...but wtf, maybe?

As for a punishment...certainly "zero tolerance" is a joke. But this does need attention, and parents and students do need to know that sharp knives at school are a no no. I don't care if they have a Barbie doll attached to the handle. I have a little faith that the system isn't going to be this rigid and f*cked up. Let's give them time to work it out.

Nice publicity stunt.

[The Animator]

17. The video isn't playing so I haven't been able to gague the subject.

Sending the kid to reform school, is waaay over the line, but I will say a knife is a knife, and a six year old is a six year old. I honestly don't believe a kid one grade above kindergarten is mature enough to handle the responsibility of carrying a knife. Does he know that when you hand an open knife to someone else to hold it by the blade with the handle toward the other person? Does he know that your always supposed to cut "away" as opposed to "towards"? Does he know it's not to be used as a prop while he play cops and robbers? Does he know that if he's going to try knife throwing, that it could just as easily bounce off the tree he was aiming for and hit someone standing nearby? Kids are kids, and kids play... give them something shiny, and they will toy around with it.

Let's not even get into the possibility that he could be a bully...


I remember when that kid got, what, suspended? expelled? Over a picture he drew of a gun... Now THAT was excessive. First thing I thought of was an image I saw in a humanities class. The caption reads: This is Not a Pipe.



Sure, your reaction may very well be "Of course it's a pipe. I know very well what a pipe looks like. I mean, what else could it possibly be?"

Duh, how about a PICTURE of a pipe... that's what it really is... you could no more take the picture off the wall and smoke it than that kid could have drawn a picture, and then shot someone with it... Real life does not work like a Warner Bros. cartoon.

[Quantess]

19. I watched it by clicking on the youtube link on the right side of the blank screen.

[katty]

20. geezus, we are a nation of asshole, dictatorial ninnies, reform school?!

[The Animator]

22. Yeash, having now seen the video.. I draw two conlcusions.

1). Yeah, I think the school seriously over reacted. I mean, a Swiss army knife is every little boys idea of a James Bond Gadget. It's a knife, but it's also a screwdriver set, a fork, a spoon, a corkscrew, a pair of scissors, a can opener, a wrench, a ruler, and a saw. It can do everything. Now the Bow Scout knife in question does not have all those other cool extra's but for a little boy it's way awesome. I can't think of any kid who, upon receive one, wouldn't want to use it every time they ate. Breakfast, dinner, desert... using it to spear Cheetos in a bowl while they play video games on the weekends, and yes... when they eat lunch at school, especially if they think it will impress their friends. Kids these days are just as susceptible to wanting to be the first kid on the block to have "insert whatever is popular here", as we once were.

2.) Yeah, I think that kid was coached a little before the camera started rolling.