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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-21-06 09:07 PM
Original message
US economy could withstand sharp dlr drop -Bernanke
http://today.reuters.com/investing/financeArticle.aspx?type=governmentFilingsNews&storyID=2006-03-22T000415Z_01_N21342616_RTRIDST_0_ECONOMY-BERNANKE-UPDATE-2.XML

WASHINGTON, March 21 (Reuters) - The chronic U.S. trade gap need not fuel a "precipitous" decline in the dollar, but the economy may be able to shrug it off if it did, Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke said on Tuesday.

"Although U.S. trade deficits cannot continue to widen forever, these deficits need not engender a precipitous decline in the dollar, nor should such a decline, were it to occur, necessarily disrupt financial markets, production or employment," Bernanke said in a letter to Rep. Brad Sherman, a California Democrat.

The shortfall in the U.S. current account, the broadest measure of the nation's overseas trade, widened to a record $804.9 billion last year, or 6.4 percent of U.S. gross domestic product. Some analysts have said the widening of the trade gap could lead to a potentially damaging dollar drop.

While Bernanke downplayed those concerns, he said "the possibility of a future disruptive correction of the U.S. trade deficit cannot be ruled out."

"The best way to protect the U.S. economy from such an event is to continue policies designed to maintain the stability of the financial system and the flexibility and resilience of the economy," he added.


The article says more... but is anyone else not reassurred?

What are the policies designed to mainitain the stability? It's not offshoring. That's WORSENING the trade gap.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-21-06 09:17 PM
Response to Original message
1. Whistling past the graveyard.
I'm no economist but even I can see that the trade deficit is leading to bankruptcy and it's irreversible. The economy can't survive without imports and outsourcing and it can't survive with it.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 06:26 PM
Response to Reply #1
19. Read the forums of many people who support offshoring...
They think it's great because of lower upfront costs. (What idiots; they should figure out what ROI, TCI, and product quality mean! Businesses need quality to keep profits high as well; reduced support costs. :dunce: :dunce: :dunce: :dunce: :dunce: :dunce: :dunce: :dunce: :dunce: :dunce: :dunce: )
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-21-06 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
2. as i said in the other thread
this is not new policy, * and snow announced early on that they were following a "soft dollar" policy

don't kid yourself, the dollar has already declined precipitously since 2000, the fact that you don't seem to have noticed prob. says it all for how this policy affects your quality of life

however, for me, it is quite upsetting, because the american dollar is now "toilet paper," in one european's delightful phrase to me and hardly buys anything overseas

even canada's silly dollar has strengthened considerably since *co took the wheel

never mind the pound and the euro which stomp the dollar into the dirt
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converted_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-21-06 10:59 PM
Response to Original message
3. We're fucked folks.. He went out of his way to bring this up.. He never
would've brought this up unless he knows something is coming down the pike.. I guess he can say he warned about it down the line.. Oil is going to cost an arm and a leg, and everything will go up with it.. Mark my words, this isn't going to be pretty..
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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 12:21 AM
Response to Reply #3
9. Exactly...He's explaining what IS going to happen.
Edited on Wed Mar-22-06 12:22 AM by Dover
There WILL be a 'precipitous drop' very soon, and he's trying to reassure us that the dollar will rebound. By 'very soon', I mean within the next month.

What we are REALLY about to witness is a drop that is the harbinger of things to come. There will be a serious drop, then it will appear to recover (just as he said). But it won't 'really' recover...
The really BIG crash will follow sometime shortly thereafter.

Hold onto your hats. We may even see a run on the banks during this 'first phase' of the fall.
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converted_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #9
15. It will make the Depression look like a county fair..
I'm not trying to be over the top here, but I bet there are large segments of the elderly and disabled dying in the streets, and I bet that crime rates go through the roof.. There isn't nearly enough food produced in America to feed America, and importing and transporting it will be just too expensive to consider.. A year to two years out from now this country will be unrecognizable..
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niallmac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #15
24. ...appropriate avatar.
Just imagine. The party that at least stood for responsible financial stewardship even if it meant
slashing all social services...is the party that puts us in the economic dumpster!
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #9
22. A run on the banks -- meaning people trying to draw out all of their
money. The banks don't let them have access to it and it is still there? Or does it disappear?

What does one do? Take out money in advance?

:shrug: :scared:
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converted_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-23-06 08:48 AM
Response to Reply #22
29. That's basically what a run is.. People get start to catch wind of what
the true picture is, and they go to the banks to withdraw their money.. Then banks end up without enough money to give to everyone that wants to take theirs out.. That's the simple version, but that's what happens..
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Pharaoh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 07:29 PM
Response to Reply #3
21. as long as the price of pot
stays the same, we may be able to weather the storm.....:party:
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Inland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-23-06 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #3
30. Yep. nt
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Ksec Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-21-06 11:05 PM
Response to Original message
4. I thought we lost that kinda spew when Mr BigWords stepped down?
Tell me how an American economy financed by foreign countries is a strong economy? Maybe they feel spending billions a week to pay for those loans is a good thing? If I have my entire household financed with credit cards . are my finances in good shape?

I guess I dont get it . Maybe if I expanded my vocabulary ,I'd understand but I doubt it.
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converted_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-21-06 11:20 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. They're doing it on purpose.. If we get to the point where they want it
to our "creditors" will step in and make us gut all of our social programs including SS.. This has been their plan all along..
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Ksec Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-21-06 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. starve the beast
Yea, you are correct. Do you think if the people knew this they could ever win an election again?
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upi402 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 12:32 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. i dunno, seems that the people are amazingly easy to fool
:patriot: :puke:
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converted_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 07:31 AM
Response to Reply #8
14. I don't think it will ultimately matter.. People are going to know what's
Edited on Wed Mar-22-06 07:32 AM by converted_democrat
up, but it's going to be too late to do anything meaningful about it.. We might win, but it's going amount to "winning" the chance to clean up a train wreck without any shovels.. This is going to be a disaster..
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savemefromdumbya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-21-06 11:08 PM
Response to Original message
5. Didn't Greenspan warn him?
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Neil Lisst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-21-06 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
6. translated: "I sure hope we don't have to raise interest rates again"
Edited on Tue Mar-21-06 11:19 PM by Neil Lisst
Because he's Bush's boy, he's going to say whatever best helps Bush.
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upi402 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 12:30 AM
Response to Original message
10. house of cards meet hurricane season
i still consider selling my home and buying gold. i get flamed like a 90's gold bug when i talk about it. maybe it is an over-reaction.
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AlienGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 02:08 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. Buying gold can't ever hurt
You can buy it in small quantities...every time you get a spare $75 or so, pick up a tenth-ounce bullion coin; if you get spare five-hundred-some dollars buy one-ounce coins. If you do this repeatedly, you'll soon have a nice little savings built up that is unlikely ever to drop in value.

Silver's good too; one-ounce silver rounds purchased two years ago for $7.50 each are now worth about $10. Silver is even easier to buy than gold, because it's cheaper.

Tucker
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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 01:28 AM
Response to Original message
12. My interpretation of this alarming article >
Edited on Wed Mar-22-06 01:28 AM by Dover
This is my interpretation of the article: I think we are about to experience a very serious drop (crash) within the next month. And this article is trying to interpret it for us ahead of time so that we don't panic, and instead believe that things are simply following this script. In other words, Bernanke is telling us what WILL happen. There WILL be a 'precipitous drop' in the dollar, and sometime afterwards things WILL recover. Or at least they will appear to recover. But I believe this drop will be an eye opening glimpse of a much worse and long-lived drop in the not-too-distant future. In actuality the dollar has been losing value for some time, but this sounds like a less than gradual drop.
He's also addressing the banking infrastructure, as weakened or failing state chartered banks become vulnerable to commercial buyers (especially during a big economic shock like a crash) which could ultimately change the whole power structure of our financial institutions and FDIC protections.

I'm no economist, obviously, but have been following this subject and am trying to read between the lines. I may be wrong. But I'll bet we begin to see things we haven't seen in our relatively short lifetimes that will reveal our true financial/economic situation, and which may finally provide undeniable evidence that even those with the rosiest of rose colored glasses will grok. I'm wondering if we may even see bank runs. Of course they rarely discuss the Iranian oil bourse and the switch of the petro-dollar to the Euro that occurs this month, but if other countries follow Iran's lead and also make the switch as most would like to (and the U.S. doesn't attack Iran), then this big piece in the global economic /currency equation may finally make it's way into our mainstream press.

By the way, Bernanke is a specialist on The Great Depression, which I believe may be one of the reasons why he was chosen to replace Greenspan.
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #12
26. Here are some good articles and threads to read, too >>>>>>>
Edited on Wed Mar-22-06 10:13 PM by Roland99
The End of Dollar Hegemony
http://www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congrec2006/cr021506.htm


The Mess That Greenspan Made
How 18 Years of Easy Money Have Changed the World
http://themessthatgreenspanmade.blogspot.com/2005/11/m3-moneyness-and-conspiracy-theories.html


A Disaster In The Making
http://www.conjur.com/blog/2006/03/07/a-disaster-in-the-making/
Yeah, tooting my own horn :)


Money Supply
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_supply

Because(in principle) money is anything that can be used in settlement of a debt, there are varying measures of money supply. The narrowest (i.e., most restrictive) measures count only those forms of money available for immediate transactions, while broader measures include money held as a store of value. The most common measures are named M0 (narrowest), M1, M2, and M3. In the United States they are defined by the Federal Reserve as follows:

* M0: The total of all physical currency, plus accounts at the central bank which can be exchanged for physical currency.
* M1: M0 + the amount in demand accounts ("checking" or "current" accounts).
* M2: M1 + most savings accounts, money market accounts, and certificate of deposit accounts (CDs) of under $100,000.
* M3: M2 + all other CDs, deposits of eurodollars and repurchase agreements.

As of March 23, 2006, information regarding M3 will no longer be published by the Federal Reserve. The other three money supply measures will continue to be provided in detail. On March 7th, 2005, Congressman Ron Paul introduced H.R. 4892 in an effort to reverse this change <1>.



Repurchase agreement
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repurchase_agreement

Federal Reserve use of repos

Repurchase agreements when transacted by the Federal Open Market Committee of the Federal Reserve in open market operations initially add reserves to the banking system and then withdraw them; reverse repos initially drain reserves and later add them back.

Under a repurchase agreement ("RP" or "repo"), the Federal Reserve (Fed) buys US Treasury securities, U.S. agency securities, or mortgage backed securities from a primary dealer who agrees to buy them back, typically within one to seven days; a reverse repo is the opposite. Thus the Fed describes these transactions from the counterparty's viewpoint rather than from their own viewpoint.

If the Fed is one of the transacting parties, the RP is called a "system repo," but if they are trading on behalf of a customer (e.g. a foreign central bank) it is called a "customer repo." Until 2003 the Fed did not use the term "reverse repo" - which it believed implied that it was borrowing money (counter to its charter) - but used the term "matched sale" instead.



Iran poses threat to dominance of the US dollar
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x728674

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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-23-06 06:58 AM
Response to Reply #26
28. thanks!
more good news.....
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lectrobyte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
16. Let's see, we're importing half of our energy needs now, so what
would heating your house during a harsh winter cost? This year was bad enough with one of the mildest winters on record. Not to mention the cost of everything else...
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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 05:46 PM
Response to Original message
17. Some 'less than rosy' economic scenarios
Widening Global Imbalances

Rodrigo de Rato, Managing Director of the International Monetary Fund at a recent speech at the University of California at Berkeley, stated that "while global current account imbalances have been widening, the fact that they have been financed easily thus far seems to be inducing a sense of complacency among policy makers. I think they should be more concerned. This is not to say that the risk of a disorderly adjustment is imminent, but the problem is growing, and if a disorderly adjustment does take place, it will be very costly and disruptive to the world economy.

The most visible aspect of the global imbalances problem is a very large deficit in the current account of the balance of payments of the United States - amounting to about 6.25% of GDP. The main problem is that in the United States savings are too low. These global imbalances could unwind quickly, and in a very disruptive way, with either an abrupt fall in the rate of consumption growth (i.e. increased savings) in the United States which is holding up the world economy or by investors abroad becoming unwilling to hold increasing amounts of U.S. financial asset, and demand higher interest rates and a depreciation of the U.S. dollar, which in turn forces U.S. domestic demand to contract."

Economic Pain

Timothy Adams, Undersecretary of Treasury for International Affairs, stated recently that "the world economy is dangerously imbalanced and the U.S. current account deficit is now at levels that many experts fear could trigger a run on the dollar, soaring interest rates, and global economic pain."

Severe Consequences

Robert E. Rubin, director of Citigroup Inc. and former Secretary of the Treasury; Peter Orszag, Senior Fellow at Brookings Institution; and Allen Sinai, Chief Global Economist at Decision Economics Inc., made a presentation to a joint session of the American Economic Foundation and the North American Economics and Finance Association recently. They stated that "the scale of the nation's projected budgetary imbalances is now so large that the risk of severe consequences must be taken very seriously. Continued substantial deficits could cause a fundamental shift in market expectations and a related loss of confidence both at home and abroad. This, in turn, could cause investors and creditors to reallocate funds away from dollar-based investments, causing a depreciation of the exchange rate, and to demand sharply higher interest rates on U.S. government debt. The increase of interest rates, depreciation of the exchange rate, and the decline in confidence could reduce stock prices and household wealth, raise the cost of financing to business, and reduce private-sector domestic spending."

Wild Ride

Paul Kasriel, Director of Economic Research at Northern Trust and co-author of the book 'Seven Indicators That Move markets', has stated that "If foreign creditors should question our ability and willingness to repay them without resorting to the currency printing press, there could be a run on the dollar, which would lead to sharply higher U.S. interest rates, which would do great harm to household finances and the housing market, which would put a crimp in consumer spending, which would increase unemployment, which would result in a spike in mortgage defaults, which would likely cripple the banking system given that a record 61% of total bank credit is mortgage related, which would, in turn, render future Fed interest rate cuts -expected on or about September 20th, 2006 - less potent in reviving the economy.

We have the most highly leveraged economy in the postwar period and the Fed is still raising rates and in the past 30 years or so, whenever the Fed has raised interest rates, we have usually had financial accidents. Our federal government is spending like a drunken sailor so my advice is to put on your safety harness as it is going to be a wild ride. My bet is that we are going to end up on the rocks."

Category 6 Fiscal Storm

Isabel V. Sawhill, Vice President and Director and Alice M. Rivlin, Senior Fellow of Economic Studies at the Brookings Institution have said that "the federal budget deficits pose grave risks - a category 6 fiscal storm - to the U.S. economy. The current course is simply not sustainable. Promises to the elderly, especially about medical care, cannot be kept unless taxes are raised to levels that are unprecedented or other activities of the government are slashed. Postponing such action would be reckless and short-sighted. Massive amounts of capital have flowed in from around the world, financing much of America's federal deficit, as well as its international (or current account) deficit. While this inflow of foreign capital has kept investment in the American economy strong it means that Americans are accumulating obligations to service these debts and repay foreigners out of their future income. As a result, the future income available to Americans will be lower than it would have been without the government deficits. Foreign borrowing also makes the United States vulnerable to the changing whims of foreign investors. There is a risk that Asian central banks, or other large purchasers of dollar securities, will lose confidence in the ability of the United States to manage its fiscal affairs prudently and shift their purchases to euros or other currencies. Such a shift could precipitate a sharp fall in the value of the dollar, which could cause a spike in interest rates, a plunge in the stock and bond markets, and possibly a severe recession. The risk of such a meltdown is unknown, but it seems foolish to run the risk in order to perpetuate large fiscal deficits, which will ultimately reduce Americans' standard of living."

Drastic Fall

Sebastian Edwards, the Henry Ford ll Professor of International Business Economics at UCLA's Anderson School of Management and a research associate of the National Bureau of Economic Research and has been a consultant to the Inter-American Development Bank, the World Bank, the OECD and a number of national and international corporations, has stated that "The future of the U.S. current account - and thus of the dollar - depend on whether foreign investors will continue to add U.S. assets to their investment dollars. Any major reduction in the USA's ability to obtain sufficient foreign financing would cause the dollar to fall by 21% to 28% during the first three years of any adjustment period, cause a deep GDP growth reduction, and push the USA into recession."

Substantial Macroeconomic Consequences

Ian Morris, Chief US Economist at HSBC, has said that "about half the US housing market may be overvalued by as much as 35-40%. When these housing bubbles begin to deflate, it is likely to have a substantial macroeconomic consequence."

Serious Collapse

Ian Shepherdson, Chief US Economist for High Frequency Economics, has warned that "house price increases are going to slow much further dragging down expectations for future price gains and therefore raising real mortgage rates. This, in turn, will be the trigger for a serious collapse in home sales. The housing market is a bubble, and it will burst."

Economic Earthquake

Robert R. Prechter, President of Elliott Wave International and author of 'At the Crest of the Tidal Wave' and 'Conquer the Crash,' calls for "a slow motion economic earthquake that will register 11 on the financial Richter scale.

The Great Asset Mania of recent years is in its final euphoric months and the next event will be a sharp decline of historic proportion in stock prices - the Dow should fall to below the starting point of its mania which was 777 in August 1982 and probably below 400 by no later than 2008 - resulting in a deep economic depression lasting until about 2011. If an across-the-board deflation occurs, which has a substantial probability, then real estate, commodities and all bonds issued by other than those rated AAA will fall in value as well. That we are in the midst, and apparently near the end, of the greatest debt build-up in world history suggests that the resulting deflation and depression will be the biggest deflation in history by a huge margin. A corollary of deflation will be a soaring value for the U.S. dollar, contrary to virtually all current expectations. Credit expansion is a major reason why stocks have kept rising and the dollar has kept falling but when the bubble begins to deflate, the investment markets will go down and the dollar will start up. The period after the market crash will be the most vulnerable in terms of the potential for hyperinflation. The ultimate result will be the destruction of any value remaining in bonds and the wipe-out of all dollar-denominated paper assets."

Giant Speculative Bubble

Ravi Batra, Professor of Economics at Southern Methodist University, in his book 'The Crash of the Millennium' foresees not a deflationary depression but an inflationary one. He sees "the giant speculative bubble that we are currently in bursting, the stock market crashing and then the U.S. dollar collapsing almost immediately followed by a rise in interest rates and plunging bond prices culminating in a depression made doubly damaging by rising inflation through the early part of this decade. In spite of the inflationary nature of the coming depression, property values will tumble in most parts of the United States. In the long run, home prices will probably continue to climb but in the short run, however, they could sink and sink hard."

Systemic Banking Crisis

Richard Duncan, a former consultant for the International Monetary Fund, current Financial Sector Specialist (Asia) at the World Bank and author of the book, 'The Dollar Crisis', writes that "the United States' net indebtedness to the rest of the world, already at record highs, will continue to increase every year into the future until a sharp fall in the value of the dollar against the currencies of all its major trading partners puts an end to the gapping US current account deficit or until the United States is so heavily indebted to the rest of the world that it become incapable of servicing the interest on its multi-trillion dollar debt. In the meantime, as long as the US current account deficit continues to flood the world with US dollar liquidity, new asset price bubbles are likely to inflate and implode; more systemic banking crises can be expected to occur; and intensifying deflationary pressure can be anticipated as low interest rates and easy credit result in excess industrial capacity and falling prices (i.e. deflation)."

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FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #17
23. Egads!
Alright Dover, can you cheer me up now?
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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-23-06 06:54 AM
Original message
Ohhhhhhhhhhhh....
:o

The sun'll come out
Tomorrow
Bet your bottom dollar
That tomorrow
There'll be sun!


ahem.....did I say 'bottom dollar'?

sorry.:think:
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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-23-06 06:54 AM
Response to Reply #23
27. ....
Edited on Thu Mar-23-06 06:55 AM by Dover
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 05:55 PM
Response to Original message
18. It damn sure has me worried!
:scared: :hide:
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corkhead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 06:41 PM
Response to Original message
20. I seriously think it's the holy Chimperor trying to precipitate armageddon
I think we are headed back to an agricultural economy. The modern world economy, built by a soon to be non existent middle class, is headed for collapse.
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niallmac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-22-06 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. Makes me think of a Mad Max movie.
But even then Bushie will be screwed. He has no skills of worth
on a subsistence market.
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-23-06 09:21 AM
Response to Original message
31. Wealthy could withstand drop in US economy---
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-23-06 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
32. Kick!
:kick::bounce:
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-23-06 08:45 PM
Response to Original message
33. "I am the Lizard King! I can do anything!"
Mr. Bullshit Risin'.
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