WIRE COAT HANGERS needed in SOUTH DAKOTA.

[LynnTheDem]

South Dakota Senate passes abortion ban
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11510472/?GT1=7756

As South Dakota moves rapidly back to the dark ages, women requiring abortions will once again have to resort to back alley butchers with coat hangers.

WAY TO GO, South Dakota!

As for you, Julie (D) you MFing stupid cow, NO, the blood of the women AND foetuses that will die in future because of this will NOT wash off your hands.

[Che_Nuevara]

1. Expect abortion rates in N. Dakota to go up.

They can't make a law making it illegal to cross state lines and have it done :)

[atreides1]

6. Yes they can make a law making it illegal to cross state lines

And apply it to minors only, without the consent of their parents.

At least with this law we now know definitely that Republicans have little to no problems with rape or incest, and that those in the state legislature who voted for this abomination don't really belong in the modern world, and have no regard for the rights of women.

What will they do next, make Christianity(the Whack Job brand)the official state religion?

[Tesha]

67. Most of them believe Christianity *ALREADY IS* the state religion. (NT)

[Greylyn58]

80. I think if this is allowed to stand

the next thing these whack-job freakazoids will do is go after all the safe birth control methods women currently have.

They have in effect already started that fight with these so-called Christian Pharmacists and their refusals to fill Doctor prescriptions.

[arealliberal]

87. The can, but the will not.

[havocmom]

10. Look at a map. Long way to anywhere from S.D. and damn few doctors

who provide basic care let alone abortions. I'm in a neighboring state and a lot of people HERE have to go to other states just for many routine treatments!

Docs in small population centers are mindful of the fact that there is not much they do which is really kept private between patient and physician. Some just don't offer all the care one would want for fear of community relations problems.

Hell, I have seen doctors in big cities forgo the procedure due to protests and threats against them and their families.

[uppityperson]

11. I know doctors who have stopped, nurses too.

in small towns and big towns/small cities. I know doctors and nurses who fear for themselves due to having provided abortions in the past. But still we speak out past the fear.

[Nikki Stone1]

17. Threats on the life of doctors and their families have stopped

a lot of access.

[liberalhistorian]

23. The only place in SD

offering abortions right now is the main branch of the state's Planned Parenthood office, in Sioux Falls. They set aside six days a month for abortions, and several out-of-state doctors come in each month for that. Many women in the state actually prefer it that way, because they don't want anyone else to know and it's kinda hard to keep something like that under wraps in most communities in the state.

I just moved to Rapid City, SD, from OH this past summer, and I was really surprised to discover that many residents are far more liberal than I would have thought. You should see some of the angry letters in the Rapid City Journal, and some other newspapers in the state, including in Pierre (the capital) and Sioux Falls. I've been very pleased to see that. Even people who are generally for the ban are angry because there's no exception for rape or incest.

The RC Journal came out against it for several reasons, the main one being the expense of defending the clearly unconstitutional law all the way to the SUPCO. That brought out the usual bullshit from the usual suspects, with the RW wacko legislators asking what kind of price should be put on the lives of the 800 "precious babies" aborted in SD each year, that each of those lives is priceless.

Oh, really? Then why are you the same fuckers who cut funding for child care, nutrition, and other social programs benefitting children and families? Why are you the same ones balking at additional state funding for education, despite the dismal state of many school districts in the state? Why are you the same ones attempting to cut Medicaid funding for women (yes, even including pregnant women who are carrying those "precious babies"), children and families? And etc., ad naueseaum. Typical fucking RW hypocritical idiots.

And you better believe that they pushed this through now because of the two new additions to the SUPCO, whom they are hoping will side with them when the ban goes before the court, which it assuredly will. I have news for them. Women ain't gonna go back, no fucking way. And there are a lot of angry people in SD over this, and they ain't all dirty hippy libs, either.

I was watching an old "Unsolved Mysteries" on Lifetime yesterday afternoon while home with bronchitis, and they had a segment that's haunted me ever since, and that underscores just how important this fight really is.

An unmarried woman in her late 20's disappeared in September of 1965, after allegedly undergoing an illegal abortion at the hands of an unlicensed, non-medical practictioner, who had a "practice" in Cape Coral, FL. Apparently, she'd had a pregnancy test under an assumed name earlier in the week; she then withdrew $300 from her bank account shortly afterwards. She scheduled an appointment with the "practictioner", who was a Hungarian immigrant with no medical degree or real knowledge; then just disappeared. 25 years later, after the airing of the program, the Cape Coral police received a letter explaining what had happened to the woman. She'd apparently died of complications from the illegal abortion, and the "practictioner" had had her body buried in the Biscayne Bay to cover it up. The police were able to determine that the letter was authentic and the mystery was finally solved. The picture they showed of her was heartbreaking. A smiling young woman full of life, loved by family and friends and important to so many people, whose young, promising life ended simply because she'd gotten pregnant at a time when there was terrible stigma against such a thing, and she'd wanted an abortion to avoid being fired, (which was a very real possibility at that time), ostracized, etc., etc. Her sister was just furious that that was the case, even those many years later.

Yes, abortion is sad, but the loss of a woman's life out of desperation, and because a clump of cells is considered more important than her life, is even more tragic. My mother and paternal grandmother could tell some real horror stories about what women endured pre-Roe, and they did. And whenever I attended marches, there would be women there who either suffered horribly from an illegal abortion or who lost friends or family members because of it. I remember one woman had a large white sign with red, scraggly letters that said "My mom had an illegal abortion. I don't miss the baby. I miss my mom." The woman said that she was a young girl when it happened; her mother just could not face having yet another child and her father wasn't too crazy about it, either.

What really angered her was people's attitudes, because her mother was a really wonderful person, she said, who didn't deserve all that was said about her. And what especially angered her was the common attitude she got that turned the baby into a saint and totally ignored her mother. She was always being asked if she missed the sibling she could have had, with no mention of her mother. That just infuriated her, understandably so. And even then, when she told RW wackos that, they said, "well, at least someone asked about the baby", again totally disregarding her mother. I've never forgotten that. And neither should anyone else.

[Joe Fields]

48. Oh, Canada!

[dflprincess]

71. Sioux Falls is the only place in South Dakota where abortions

are performed. And that's only at one clinic with doctors flown in from Minneapolis and St. Paul. I seem to recall reading the doctors are only at the clinic a couple of days a week.

[Warpy]

25. they will certainly try

and that can possibly lead to conflict escalating into the next US Civil War. They'll try to own "their" women exactly the way the slave states tried to own "their" blacks.

This whole stinking, filthy mess is CONTROL, folks, and has absolutely nothing to do with bay-beees. If it did, they'd take a hell of a lot better care of the bay-beees already out there, fully formed, and cutely gurgling in their cribs.

Control is going to try to prevent any woman from crossing state lines unless she's accompanied by a husband, father or brother. That's next.

[donkeyotay]

61. Definitely about control. This won't stop here folks

After you've banned the abortion you do have to exert further controls to enforce the law, including keeping the wombs from crossing state lines. Now a brother or burka might help, but I say let's go for GPS chip implants. I think we also need a DNA database so that the impregnators can made to marry 'em and raise up the lucky lads real good. And another thing I think SD needs is a way to keep track of doctors who offer morning after pills and birth control - oops, never mind. God's army of pharmacists can take care of that one. Then build a fence between SD and ND and make everyone carry ID... the main thing is that we continue to do God's work of sticking our nose into as much of other people's business as we can.

[azmesa207]

28. S D ban all abortions

Look for North Dakota to follow they are like two peas in a pod

[AndyA]

2. Cheaper to tie a hungry rat to a string...

:(

Society seems to be moving in reverse. WTF?

[Kierkegaard]

9. Wait till they get around to reinstating witch burning.

Welcome to puritanical Amerika!

:shrug:

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

3. Here's the best post I've seen yet on this issue...

PuraVidaDreamin (1000+ posts) Thu Feb-23-06 12:22 PM
Response to Original message


Get the woman bikers to boycott Sturgis this year in Badlands
and get their partners to boycott as well!

[neverevergivein]

4. Brace yourself

In two years, at least a dozen states will have similar laws.

[cali]

15. A dozen states already have similar

laws on the books from pre Roe days. My own state of Vermont has, and its current abortion laws are as liberal as any in the country. Anyway, SD's new law won't be implemented. I doubt the SC will grant cert. Of a far greater concern is the upcoming SC case re the fed law banning so called PBAs. If it becomes the law of the land, it'll open Roe up to attack in a way that we haven't seen since Casey in 1992. It changed the 'fundamental right' standard to the undue burden threshold, allowing states to place restrictions on abortions of the pre viable fetus. The fed PBA ban has no exception for health.
The upcoming SC case is far more important than what happened in SD last week. Should the SC allow it to stand, it will have an immediate impact on women's lives.

[thinkingwoman]

5. coat hangers are so 1970s

RU486 will be the solution of choice.

[havocmom]

12. Not if ALL pharmacies are not forced to carry it.

And doesn't it have to be taken so early after conception that one wouldn't know if one were pregnant? Being a bit old for the issue, I am not up on all the details, but isn't that one used within 72 hours after unprotected sex or in post rape situation and such?

If someone were using birth control and there was a failure, it wouldn't help as the user would not know there was a failure of her method until she became aware she was pregnant.

Would guess women in S.D. would have trouble getting access to it too. Things are different in rural America for many. There are not a lot of places to shop and if you local pharmacists won't carry it, or decides there is not enough market to carry it well, it could also involve a long trip to get somewhere it is available. NOT an option for many.

[thinkingwoman]

32. who said anything about pharmacies?

RU486 will be the new back alley abortion...smuggled and traded just like drugs.

[havocmom]

37. That will still leave out a lot of women in rural areas, like most of S.D.

Life is different for many. Not everybody has access to a dealer.

[thinkingwoman]

40. do you seriously believe

that there are no dealers in rural areas?


:rofl:

[havocmom]

41. Didn't say that

Said not everyone has access. That I know for a fact. Meth is easy to come by. Hell, folks cook it up. More involved things with small market... dealers don't bring everything into areas where it is not cost effective.

:rofl:

[thinkingwoman]

59. cost effective...exactly

If Roe v. Wade goes down, bet your bottom dollar RU486 will be more cost effective than meth. Demand will be through the roof.

[hobbit709]

13. Except they want to ban that too

[thinkingwoman]

30. sure they do, but...

it could be smuggled black market farily easily.

[Nutmegger]

7. This is what the RW "base" wants

They want this because lives are being taken away. :sarcasm:

Um, if they are so concerned with life, why don't they work to get the troops out of Iraq or end capital punishment? Oh, I forgot, we're in a war based on a feeling "terra". Silly me, I just plain forgot!

[transeo]

8. We should send wire hangers to the state capitol

Start a movement to collect and ship a ton of wire hangers to the capitol building. Could be interesting. :hi:

[havocmom]

16. I'm in favor of implanting fetuses on the spleen or liver of men voting

for this! Been done with apes, should work fine for humans They can decide between Cesarean or natural delivery themselves when the time comes ;)

[liberalhistorian]

24. Hey, I'm in Rapid City, SD,

I'd be glad to help out however I could!

[High Plains]

56. Hey, Liberal Historian, check out the South Dakota forum.

I'm trying to flog it back to life and could use your help.

[liberalhistorian]

66. Will do!

We had a Rapid City DU meetup last July, so I know there are some good people right here.

[InsultComicDog]

29. I must have a couple hundred of 'em

From every time I send the clothes out

[Captain Hilts]

33. Mail them to #24 in Rapid City. nt

[Pachamama]

83. Didn't Greenpeace recently dump a 15 ton Whale in front of the Japanese

Embassy in Berlin? How about a bunch of Dump Trucks full of wire coat hangers? Right on the steps of the legislature? How about coinciding with Sturgis, there be a march (or biker rally?) with every woman marching to the steps of the SD Capitol steps and dumping wire coat hangers in protest? :hi:

[Captain Hilts]

14. Should we mail some to the state legislature? nt

[cap]

18. maybe we need to start the underground railroad

have a chain to help women get abortion no matter where they live...

Have women open their homes in friendly states and help out with transportation... ride boards etc.

[Scout]

22. "Hi, this is Jane."

the network shall live again...

we also have "menstrual extraction" which some women are trained to do...

and the midwives and wise women can help us find the naturally growing abortifacients...

[robertpaulsen]

52. OVERground railroad. Let's get in the wingnuts' face about this!

We need to resort to more CONFRONTATIONAL tactics, including civil disobedience if necessary, in order to publicize the injustice of the violation of women's civil rights in the name of "state's rights". Until we have a Constitutional Amendment protecting women's rights, we must be prepared to keep fighting against this attempt to take America back to the back alleys.

[Jean Louise Finch]

69. Some of these now exist

State "Fund for Choice" organizations do great work trying to get anyone who needs an abortion the technical and financial assistance they need to go for it. I know in big cities, there are organizations that help find hosts for women coming in from out of state or out of town to get the medical treatment they need.

Please consider getting involved!

[cap]

85. it's the local areas that need help...

The anti-abortionists are doing a Maoist technique of surrounding the cities and choking them off.

[Captain Hilts]

27. Here's the link for SD senators!!! Mail them a hanger!

http://legis.state.sd.us/sessions/2006/mem.htm

Mail 'em a hanger!

[ugarte]

19. Chastity belts, veils, corsets, foot-binding, genital mutilation

As Bush likes to say, all options are on the table.

[MountainLaurel]

20. As an FYI

A standard wire coathanger can be folded up into a regular business envelope, including those postage-paid fundraising envelopes from the DLC or the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee. Not that I've ever done that, of course.

:evilgrin:

[DemonGoddess]

21. k&r

:kick:

I like what the one poster said about MAILING these SOB's wire hangers

Seriously though, what the hell are they THINKING??? This is unjustifiable. :mad:

[Iris]

38. They're thinking life begins at conception.

And are obviously willing to force that idea on every one in their state.

On NPR, they said there was some debate about rape - including the scenario of a woman with 2 children who becomes pregnant by rape. They decided if it was about "protecting unborn life" than even that's not a good enough reason. Who cares what hell that would play on a family in that situation - husband watching wife carry another man's child for 10 months, 2 children wondering what their mother did with the child she was carrying (assuming she gives it up for adoption).

[Vektor]

26. My mom was an OB nurse pre-Roe V Wade...

And she knows firsthand what the ramifications of criminalizing abortions are.

Dead babies, full term, found in dumpsters and landfills, commonly.

Dead babies, full term, found in plastic bags in abandoned buildings and fields, commonly.

Dead babies, full term, found drowned in public toilets, commonly.

Women fatally injuring themselves, and also killing the fetus in the process of trying to self-abort.

Suicide.

And "best" of all - mutilated babies, delivered full term, with arms, legs, portions of the skull, or the chest wall scraped off after a botched abortion where only parts of the fetus were extracted, born alive, only to die shortly thereafter.

All, also, not uncommon.

Graphic? Sorry - it's the reality. My mom often had to wrap the corpses of these mutilated infants for the funeral home. Had to look at the exposed organs. You see, when you have a back alley butcher removing the products of conception from your womb with kitchen utensils, chances are, he won't do it right. But in many cases, the protected environment of the womb allows the remainder of the fetal material to continue to grow inside the uterus until full term.

Often the attempted abortion was so horrible, due to the un-sterile conditions, lack of pain medicine, lack of proper instruments, injury from improper technique, and humiliation and horror of maybe being raped by the abortion provider (also VERY COMMON) that the woman does not return to finish the job, and carries to term, often thinking the infant is intact. When she finally delivers, the grossly compromised and malformed infant dies as soon as it's exposed to the elements.

With safe, legal abortion this does not happen.

I hope the fundies in North Dakota are ready to reap what they have sown. We legalized abortion in this country for a damn good reason.

And if any of these wackos dare argue, I defy them to witness what my mother did for ONE DAY in her line of work and say they think that's a better option for society.

God help the women of South Dakota. And with this country in the stranglehold of blind fundamentalism and fanaticism, God help us all.

[area51]

35. Excellent post. (n/t)

[Vektor]

36. Thanks. What sucks is...

that any part of America is ever going to have to suffer that again.

[Ilsa]

73. I think that is the suffering that will have to happen for these

idiots to wake up. THey will have to know someone personally who nearly died from an infection, or cannot have any more babies, or see the twisted grotesque result of a mutilated pregnancy gone to full term or a back alley abortion. They have no memory of this, so they have to face it before their minds are changed.

[EFerrari]

43. I had an abortion before Roe. I was only 14 and the details

are too ugly to post.

But, I had to find a doctor that would certify the fact that I would lose my mind if forced to carry the pregnancy full term. It took months.

Fourteen.

We're NOT going back.

:kick:

[Vektor]

45. I'm so sorry.

:hug:

[EFerrari]

47. It was terrible. But it taught me something I will never forget.

Women, not governments, need to be in charge of womens' bodies.

Thank you, Vektor. Let's bust these fascists -- for the girls. For ALL of them.

:hi:

[July]

50. I'm sorry, sfexpat2000. Hope you are healed in mind and body.

That must have been very difficult.

[EFerrari]

53. Awful for the teenager, instructive for the woman.

Never give up, never give an inch.

:hi:

[July]

54. I'm with you. nt

[leftchick]

75. you are such a great role model!

I will have my older son read this post tomorrow. He is 11 and was asking me about abortion two days ago. Your posts are very instructive. Thank you for sharing. :hug:

[EFerrari]

78. Our kids, girls, boys, our lovely hopes

should never have to go to that place.

Cheers, leftchick, for trying to give them better options.

:toast:

[shireen]

31. what about legislation for FREE reproductive health care?

I'm pro-choice .. but folks, we're going about this the wrong way.

Money talks.

If they're going to legislate to make abortion illegal, it MUST be tied to legislation to make reproductive health care FREE TO ALL WOMEN AND MEN, including teenagers! It's only fair, don't you think? If they don't want aborted pregnancies, they should make it easier to avoid pregnancies.

So let's start demanding free reproductive health care with all anti-abortion legislation -- frame the debate that way to bring out the money, and watch the anti-abortion freaks being ignored by lawmakers.

[Vinca]

34. This will get to the Supreme Court and when it does

there needs to be a "Million Woman March." It's hard to imagine we're going back to pre-Roe v. Wade. Very depressing.

[EFerrari]

39. So, Lynne, who do we mail the 12 pack to? Gimme an address.

There's a laundrymat across the street. I can get a good deal. :sarcasm:

:nuke:

[LynnTheDem]

44. Here ya go.

http://legis.state.sd.us/sessions/2006/mem.htm

What insanity...so many women died for their RIGHT TO CHOOSE. Bloody hell...

[EFerrari]

46. I hate these mother f#ckers. And I try really, really hard

not to hate anyone.

Hey, I WILL send them a 12 pack and I WILL post the picture.

If they think we're going back, they are out of their FUCKING MINDS.

[EFerrari]

51. This is the street addy. Send your hangers here:

Legislative Research Council
Capitol Building, 3rd Floor
500 East Capitol Avenue
Pierre, SD 57501-5070

[spanone]

42. I lived thru those years....the neanderthals are gaining. Minority rule.

[EFerrari]

49. We. Will. Not. Go. Back.

And you can take that to the bank.

:)

[chaumont58]

55. What might do the job is a little hard core separation of church and state

I know its too much to ask. Jesus and his dad, God, have done such a good job lately, just ask all the newly created dead in the Philippines or just those that enjoyed surfing on the Tsunami in the Indian Ocean.

[Ksec]

57. Going backwards

Thats what the repub revolution has brought the US. A backward movement .

Forward, back to the dark ages we go.

[in_cog_ni_to]

58. I think we should ALL send a hundred hangers to the SD legislature!

That Julie wench is NO DEMOCRAT. She's a DINO. This is EXACTLY WHY we don't want to "embrace" the anti-choice "Democrats" in our party. THIS IS WHAT THEY WILL DO! They should NOT be trusted. Sorry to any anti-choice Dems on this board....but it's how I feel.

Have we, as a party, learned ANYTHING from this SD decision?

Look at how Harry Reid dragged his feet on the ScAlito filibuster. WHY? Whenever we have a anti-choice Dem in a position of power, we must ALWAYS be concerned about the abortion issue.

We can kiss abortion good bye and we can thank a pro-choice DEMOCRAT for helping to destroy it. They always say they support the constitution and the constitution says a woman has a right to privacy. I call BULLSHIT WHERE I SEE BULLSHIT. They will NEVER have my trust again. NEVER. If someone is anti-choice and a Democrat, they WILL NOT GET MY VOTE. Period!

Flame away.

[EFerrari]

60. Here's my mail to the @ssholes:

[in_cog_ni_to]

62. Excellent! I wonder if they will understand? They seem to be a pretty

ignorant bunch of people.:grr:

Can I get their address from you? I want to do the same thing.:)

[EFerrari]

63. Oh, they'll get it. They are only stupid when convenient. Here:

Legislative Research Council
Capitol Building, 3rd Floor
500 East Capitol Avenue
Pierre, SD 57501-5070

[in_cog_ni_to]

64. Thank you!

:hug:

[EFerrari]

65. Thank you!

Let's show these bastards that we will NOT roll over. :)

[LynnTheDem]

70. WOW...

Now THAT is a protest letter, and so true to the point!!!

WELL DONE!!!

:hug:

[EFerrari]

68. Lynne, I'm sorry if I was the thread killer.

I guess nothing makes me more angry than this.

:(

[LynnTheDem]

72. I hear ya...this pisses me off too.

Women = baby factories???

FUCK THAT and dear men, ya wanna vote for this kinda shit, then NOT FUCKING YOU!

Get the point? Not yet? You will. Right, PRO-CHOICE women?

[Name removed]

74. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LynnTheDem]

76. When the father's life is at risk carrying the foetus.

When the father is pregnant for the 9 months.

THEN it's "just as much the offspring of the male as it is the female" and he can have a say. Until then? HELL NO.

And even when the father can risk HIS life and HE carries the foetus for 9 months, you think the rightwingnuts in this god-forsaken nation will allow men any right to choose, since they're hell bent on taking away any such right for women?

[EFerrari]

77. To quote Whoopi Goldberg,

"Muthafuckah, when was the last time you were pregnant?"

:)

[Greylyn58]

79. Keith Olbermann talked about this tonight on Countdown

and I'm just horrified for any woman living in South Dakota.

I've said it before and I'll say it again--If men could become pregnant--the right to a safe abortion would be a law written into the Consitution!!!

[EFerrari]

81. So, who cares enough about women to send a message

to South Dakota?

Who cares enough about women's health to do that?

[EFerrari]

82. kick

[kevinbgoode]

84. We should all mail packages of wire hangers

to the members of the state legislature.

[arealliberal]

86. Remain calm. Since their is only one abortion clinic in the entire state,

not much has changed. Moreover, this will not make it past the first judge.