Deja DU-- Do you remember The 70's? What about Now?

[omega minimo]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=37336&mesg_id=37336

"....one thing that I think is important is we have a recent historical memory, both in the case of Vietnam and in the case of Watergate, of what excessive use of the doctrine of national security and the state of permanent warfare -- the Cold War before, the war on terror now -- the dangers of it. What it can do to us domestically. What the civil liberties risks are. What overweening executive authority can lead to, the dangers of that. And that is relatively fresh in the minds of the generations of Americans living today, at least of a certain age. And in that sense, I think history is very, very much with us and as it well ought to be."

:kick:

[Erika]

1. We need to fight wars that are in defense of our nation

Neither Vietnam nor Iraq qualifies. People need to stop and think about how these tiny countries were never a threat to us. They were never a danger to us. History has shown the Gulf of Tonkin bay attack was pure fiction as was the WMD's in Iraq.

Our losing American lives when our defense is not in question is insane and W should be impeached.

[K-W]

2. We need to undo the domestic conditions that fuel the empire.

If that's still possible.

[omega minimo]

3. "Fuel"

an interesting choice of words :evilgrin:

[EFerrari]

4. Remember the bus boycott?

We need one now.

I was thinking about this while reading "Founding Mothers" today. The Daughters of Liberty organized boycotts of British imports. Effective boycotts.

[KharmaTrain]

5. Bus Boycott?

Damn...why wasn't there ones that took me to school. :rofl:

I remember boycotting Pepsi...I still do...cause Nixon was on its board and I'll bet Pepsico is still a heavy Repugnican donor.

I remember boycotting any products made by Dow Chemical...yep no scrubbing bubbles for me...and Union Carbide cause they were big weapons providers and profiteers.

The problem with boycotts are unless they're very large and widespread, no one plays. When was the last boycott that actually had any major effect in changing a national mood? A corporate policy here or there, yes...but not a political one. Also, the organization is so nebulous, it's all but impossible for the many free-spirited groups on the left to agree on where to have lunch, yet on whom to boycott and how to do it.

I'm still favoring a massive show of feet, arms and voices...the ball was moving in the right direction with Camp Casey and then the Washington DC rally. It got messed up and it's a shame...there are many of us who want some very large, symbolic show of strength...something that sends a message not only to this regime, but also to the leadership of the Democratic party as well.

Cheers...

[EFerrari]

9. LOL! Remember table grapes and Gallo?

I don't! Is it okay to buy those things yet? :)

Even so, it would be worth it to try get people to park their cars or even carpool or use public transport on Wednesdays. Midweek so for maximum coverage. No more abstracted talk about being in hock to foreign oil or about pollution or global warming. JUST PARK IT.

I can't think of any boycott that would make the BFEE sit up as quickly. And, yes, it would be a logistical and organization nightmare. But, what's a nightmare when you're facing the extinction of the republic. :shrug:

[KharmaTrain]

10. No Way In Suburbia

If I lived in the city, or in an area with community planning, but I live in Pleasant Valley Sunday. This area was and lives by the car. It's a symbol of one's independence (many, it's macho...even the women) and giving up one's car even to take a shuttle bus is like pulling teeth. LOL.

My hope is to see a more visible opposition this year. The scenario that gave me the best hope was the candlelight vigil...the first "stand with Cindy" event last year. It was called for across the country and gave millions a chance to speak in a united voice that seemed to really energize those who attended and then carried forward to more attention to Cindy's actions in Crawford. I'd really like to see a national day of unity where people congregate in regional and local locations to demand this regime address our concerns and to serve notice to the corporate media that our voices are strong and our will is even stronger.

One of our biggest enenmies is apathy. It's easy to tap words on a keyboard (and I know, sfexpat, you're definitely NOT in this class). Economic boycotts get bogged down as they get complicated and easy to "skimp on". You may not like a certain grower or are boycotting Gallo wines, yet you may wink and nod and buy the "generic" which is the grown in the same vineyard. Or that there's a boycott on a item that none of us need or use. I have long promised not to by anything with the General Dynamics label on it! LOL.

I think we need something simple, soft, yet powerful. We've seen here the growing number of people who want to express themselves in one manner or another and maybe this is one step that can help set up greater networking and cooperation, and in turn encourage others to come forward and out of the darkness.

Cheers!

[EFerrari]

11. When I was growing up in Sunnyvale, we didn't have buses,

we had Mom. Then, we had buses that didn't go anywhere. lol. But even in Suburbia there is carpooling and so on. Purity isn't the goal -- impact is, right?

Doug and I went to the pre war MoveOn vigils -- they were huge. And, we've held some out at the beach in the last couple of years. December 2004, on Friday night, we had five homeless people come and share the fire. That was really something.

Let's see how we do. :)

[KharmaTrain]

12. Yes, Impact

I'm also trying to be realistic. Being one who works at home and only ventures out when it's absolutely necessary, I could sign on to the idea, but what good what I do? LOL. I'm kinda looking at something that can be tap into something of the 60's that has been really missing from the last several years....fun.

While going to a rally was nothing more than a reason to party, it also had a symbolic purpose. It brought many different groups together that found both differences as well as common cause. This was how Jewish white kids from Brooklyn met black freedom riders from Alabama and they both worked together to affect some real change. It brought the first voices of gay and woman's rights out into the open and taught a generation about tolerance and celebrating our differences, not fighting over them. It'd be nice to create this kind of atmosphere again. Call me a dreamer...(John Lennon influence).

Hopefully either a Moveon or Meetup will grab the reins on this thing in the Spring. I went to a small, but very spirited gathering in what was once a very red suburb. Many who were there were surprised to see so many others (the local paper estimated 1500 had showed up)...and there were other rallies with larger crowds in other suburbs. It was neat to come home that night and see so many different rallies in various locations...it felt like there was some light in the darkness for once.

While I'd love to see a major (and I mean over a million) people in Washington, I've prefered the local angle...something very simple but can get people involved and thinking. Many of the people who attended those Cindy vigils that night felt a lot stronger afterwards and there are many, many more still looking for a chance to come out but need a little coaxing. :grin:

[omega minimo]

13. www.afterdowningstreet.org forums this weekend

[omega minimo]

14. "One of our biggest enenmies is apathy."

That's what the focus on the OP quote (from transcript on link) is about......................................................

[zbdent]

6. Well, the old joke is, "If you remember the 70s, then

you really didn't live in the 70s . . ."

[omega minimo]

8. "The 60's," that was, silly

[tlsmith1963]

7. Well, the Clothes are the Same

And I hate '70s fashions. Ugh.

Tammy

[omega minimo]

15. The clothes now are the cheesy castoffs no one actually wore back then

:evilgrin: