Gates is Poppy's guy-this takes us to another data-dumping thread

[bobthedrummer]

Rumsfeld is "resigning" and Gates has the "fresh eyes" needed, huh?

That opens up George H. W. Bush, Iran/Contra, The Carlyle Group and a lot of other ethical, criminal and conflicting interests for our Democratic controlled Congress leadership to investigate.

Here's a bit about what Mr. Rumsfeld's DoD was about.
The Shadow Pentagon by Dan Guttman
http://www.public-i.org/pns/report.aspx?aid=386&sid=200

New Pentagon Vision Transforms War Agenda by Bruce Gagnon
http://globalresearch.ca/articles/GAG501A.html

Office of Force Transformation to Close
http://www.fcw.com/article95834-08-29-06-web

The guy announcing the closure of the Office of Force Transformation is the Rumsfeld DoD replacement for Douglas Feith, Eric S. Edelman.
Mr. Edelman was Richard Cheney's National Security advisor at one time, among other things.
http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/1143

Cheney/Halliburton in the Rumsfeld DoD
http://cryptome.org/dod-kbr.htm

Mr. Gates has always been very close to Poppy, (since it's still the BFEE we're talking about) oh yes, they're Republicans with fresh eyes regarding Iraq
http://www.populist.com/02.17.burns.html

Poppy is great friends with the Saudis, and defense and oil interests-yet commissions from some of the arms deals were used by Saudis to finance Osama bin Laden. The Bush and bin Laden families are friends.
Poppy is friends with a lot of United Kingdom notables too.
http://cryptome.org/soil/soiled-dove2.htm

Some of those worldwide friends of Poppy, to whom Robert Gates is very loyally attached, are members of The Carlyle Group.

Rumsfeld's DoD is really into IT, propaganda, information warfare and other data based things (even PsyOps).
The Carlyle Group arranged for Northrop Grumman Corp. to acquire government IT markets (including FAA, NASA) with Federal Data Corp/FDC-FDC was folded into Logicon, Corp and this deal was announced to the world on 9-11-2000 by another coincidence.
http://www.fcw.com/fcw/articles/2000/0911/news-fdc-09-11-00.asp

Rumsfeld's DoD had some objections to some of the use of data
http://www.businessweek.com/technology/cnet/stories/980889.htm

But those concerns were ignored
Rumsfeld's Roadmap to Propaganda
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB177/index.htm

So Robert Gates, G.H.W.Bush's loyal pal has been chosen to replace Mr. Rumsfeld as Secretary of Defense of The United States of America.

Funny how the Taliban have made a comeback in Afghanistan, you know, the place where American military are still dying fighting Osama bin Laden's followers. And the great ally in the "war on terror", Pakistan, they have a bit of explaning to do too.
The Getaway by Seymour Hersh
http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/020128fa_FACT

There's lots more to add to this.

Help me out.

One more thing, Rumsfeld's DoD and this administration should be compared to 14 characteristics of fascism.
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Fascism/14_Characteristics_Fascism.html

Add your own data to this thread.

[Catshrink]

1. Thanks for the set of links..

this is helpful info to have.

:kick:

[bobthedrummer]

3. Add to it or use it as needed-we must demand our Democratic

leaders follow through on what so many of US already know.

[blm]

5. Establishment Dems are working overtime to put their coverup team in place.

The coverup team has been actively fanning the flames against the anti-corruption, open government wing of the Democratic party. They have the corpmedia attacking any anti-corruption Democrat as a radical leftist or an object of ridicule and scorn.

I hope more Democrats wake up and smell the beginning of the next COVERUP Dem administration being readied to coverup for Bush2 the way Clinton did for Bush1.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

14. Probably get chastised... but will keep my opinion visible

'Corporism '... and your leverage


Unfortunately, we didn't have access to the 'real math', because we(individual voters), cannot throw $$$$$ millions or billions $$$$ at our targets.

Take a look at what these assholes propagate. All the obfuscation and intentional alienation serves to divide and conquer. Divided we stand, because they have campaigned to break our trust. We are in limbo... or so they conceptualize.

Our only, and I truly mean ONLY, deliverance from the hell created by voter apathy, and their preying upon human nature, is to not be a statistically, predictable, entity. So think radically, act rationally, and let's surprise 'our gov't' with a duplicitous personality. One that actually benefits the people that hold democracy sacred.

[bobthedrummer]

2. Cambone, Addington, Haynes III, Sanchez, Miller, Fast, Pappas

these people associated with Rumsfeld's DoD have made Americans and our military much less safe.

These folks have names and histories.

Cambone is checking out.

Richard Cheney really needs TO GO.

Add to this thread or cross-post it.

[bobthedrummer]

4. Btw, like Joseph Wilson said "there are no tin-foil hats" anymore. eom

[stillcool]

6. It seems with each new name...

brought forth by this administration, comes a renewed thirst for all things Iran/Contra. I've tried several times to get my head wrapped around all the players. There are so many who have surfaced that were never mentioned in books...or...their names meant nothing to me so it didn't stick. It's kind of like sitting around the kitchen table shooting the shit, and getting side-tracked from a story you're telling, because of another's relation to things involved.

[AntiFascist]

8. Keep in mind also the Religious Right connections....

if you look at the CNP membership. "Fighting the godless communists" turned into a much broader strategy to thrust the world into war and bring about theocratic rule.

[BeHereNow]

7. Yes, the usual suspects...

Too bad Americans don't know their own histroy
and therefore have no idea who these men behind
the curtain are.
Oh wait, they're NOT behind the curtain anymore!
They are center stage for all to see-
Baker, Hamilton and now, Gates.
Like I said, too bad most Americans don't know their
own history well enough to be outraged by the line up of
thugs and criminals who are now operating in the
open for all to see.

BHN

[Octafish]

9. Independent Prosecutor Judge Lawrence Walsh on the BFEE turd Robert Gates...

Gates not only works for the BFEE, he's a "made man."

Here's what the Republican IP who investigated Iran-Contra has to say about the sniveling dirty little rat:

Lies, Cover Ups and Slanted Intelligence

Robert Gates and Iran/Contra

By LAWRENCE E. WALSH
CounterPunch November 8, 2006

The day after Clair George's arraignment, we turned to Robert Gates. The Senate intelligence committee's hearings on his appointment to head the CIA were scheduled to begin within a few days. Craig Gillen and I met the committee's chairman, David Boren, and ranking minority member, Frank Murkowski, and staff counsel in Boren's office. Reiterating what I had already told Boren, we said that two questions had not been answered satisfactorily: Had Gates falsely denied knowledge of Oliver North's Contra-support activities? Had Gates falsely postdated his first knowledge of North's diversion of arms sale proceeds to the Contras?

We then described what our investigation had turned up about Gates. Alan Fiers had told us that he had kept Gates generally informed of his Contra-support activities, through written reports and regular face-to-face presentations, although his oral reports had been guarded because Gates had not always had a note-taker present. The CIA now claimed it could not find the notes of these meetings.

We said that Richard Kerr, the CIA's deputy director for intelligence, had informed Gates in August 1986 of Charles Allen's belief that North had diverted funds from the Iranian arms sales for the benefit of the Contras; Allen himself had told Gates the same thing in early October. Allen had told us that Gates, who had appeared irritated, had told Allen to write a memorandum for CIA director William Casey and had said that he did not want to hear about North. To us and to the congressional committees, Gates had denied having any recollection of either conversation. Whenever questioned, Gates had always claimed that he had first learned of Allen's concern about the diversion on the day after Eugene Hasenfus was shot down. Gates said that he and Allen had then reported this to Casey, who told them that he had just received much the same information from another source.

That day, according to North and Gates, Casey had invited North to lunch in his office, which was next to Gates's office. Gates had joined them, and according to North, had heard Casey tell North to clean up the Ilopango operation. North claimed that he had then begun to destroy records. Gates claimed not to remember the discussion of North's Nicaraguan activities. Although he had heard North mention Swiss accounts, Gates said, he had not understood the reference. He claimed to have been in and out of the room. All he remembered, he said, was that North had told him that the CIA was completely clean regarding the Contra-support operation.

We suggested to the senators that they specifically request the notes of Fiers's reports to Gates. We told them that we did not think we had enough corroborating information to indict Robert Gates, but that his answers to these questions had been unconvincing. We did not believe that he could have forgotten a warning of North's diversion of the arms sale proceeds to the Contras. The mingling of two covert activities that were of intense personal interest to the president was not something the second-highest officer in the CIA would forget. Moreover, Gates had received the same reliable contemporaneous intelligence reports about North's activities that Charles Allen had. The information suggesting that North had overcharged the Iranians would surely have caught the attention of anyone as astute as Gates.

When, after Eugene Hasenfus's aircraft was shot down, Gates and Allen had told Casey about Allen's concern that North had diverted funds to the Contras, how could Gates have forgotten that Allen and Kerr had warned him about the diversion a few weeks earlier?

CONTINUED...

http://www.counterpunch.org/walsh11082006.html

Lying, thieving, murdering, warmongering, traitor like the rest of his ilk.

Great post, bobthedrummer. K&R. And much appreciated.

[nolabels]

15. Written ***November 8, 2006***

Like wow, nice to see many are still manning their stations

[Octafish]

27. October Surprise. Iran-Contra. CIA drugs. BCCI. Iraqgate. Murder Inc. Pure BFEE.

The great Larry Chin spelled things out in real black and white:

Bush administration’s Trojan Horse gift to America and the Democrats: Former CIA Director and Iran-Contra insider Robert Gates

By Larry Chin
Online Journal Associate Editor

Nov 10, 2006, 00:52

With the Democrats and Democratic Party voters euphoric over a purported election victory, and a possible “change of course” in Iraq, the Bush administration quietly added poison to the Democrats’ celebration champagne by dredging up former CIA Director and Iran-Contra participant Robert Gates to replace Donald Rumsfeld as defense secretary.

The “war on terrorism” will not only continue, it will expand and deepen with Gates heading the Pentagon.

Who is Robert Gates?

Robert M. Gates was the CIA’s Deputy Director for Intelligence (DDI) from 1982 to 1986. He became CIA Deputy Director of Central Intelligence (DDCI) in 1986, and moved up to Acting Director of Central Intelligence (ADCI) that same year. In 1991, George H.W. Bush nominated Gates to head the CIA (as Langley’s DCI).

As a protégé of the infamous William Casey, and as both deputy director and director of the CIA, it goes without saying that Robert Gates was involved in every geopolitical crime and cover-up of the Reagan-Bush and George H.W. Bush era.

The encyclopedic list includes Iran-Contra, CIA narcotics trafficking, criminal covert operations, the infamous October Surprise, and the Bank of Credit and Commerce (BCCI) scandal.

Gates, Iran-Contra, and CIA drug trafficking

During the George H.W. Bush administration, with the Iran-Contra crimes still fresh, Gates survived the confirmation hearings (from a much fiercer Washington Congress) that elevated him to director of Central Intelligence. He was tarnished, but survived, the hobbled and corrupted Lawrence Walsh probe of Iran-Contra, which left the vast majority of Iran-Contra crimes unaddressed.

Despite its limitations, the Walsh probe managed to expose and tarnish many of the operation’s players, and resulted in convictions for several participants (and, soon afterwards, pardoned by George H.W. Bush), one of them being Gates.

Robert Gates, like many Reagan-Bush era players, has a lot to answer for.

Subsequent research documents the fact that the CIA, National Security Council (NSC), and branches of the US military engaged in a host of massive narcotics trafficking operations, the most noteworthy of which were named Amadeus, Watch Tower, and Pegasus.

These operations, combined with related operations and geopolitical programs, comprise what is popularly known as “Iran-Contra."

Robert Gates was there for it all.

CONTINUED...

http://onlinejournal.com/artman/publish/article_1419.shtml

Gates' nomination presents us with a rare jiu-jitsu moment in history. Smirk thinks he's got the perfect guy to get him out of his big warmongering jam. Instead, Gates could open up the files on all things BFEE. No matter what, you, nolabels, bobthedrummer and all good DUers have a chance to shine light on these cockroach gangster NAZI traitors.

[jazzjunkysue]

40. The money line, at the end of the Online Journal article:

The Bush administration has done what it has always done: replace a political liability with something even more dangerous, a loyal insider to the very highest positions of authority. The move adds insult to six years of injury, an openly provocative act that dares the perplexed Democrats to do anything to stop it, knowing that they will not.

If Robert Gates does with his new Pentagon power what he did at the CIA during his previous tenure, the world is in for tremendous suffering and death, and more covert and overt warfare -- all well-“managed," packaged and sold to Congress. Gates, unlike the divisive Rumsfeld, is a criminal who is capable of uniting the elite consensus.

[Binka]

18. Hi Octa Wanna Know Another Fun Fact? Craig Gillen Is My Cousin!

K & R. Thanks Bob this is important stuff. Very. Important. Stuff.

[Octafish]

28. Wow! You DO have some kind of guardian angels, Binka!

And thanks to your cousin's public service, so do we all.

The difference between the good guys and the bad:

Cocaine Politics

by Peter Dale Scott and Jonathan Marshall
University of California Press, 1991, paper

EXCERPT...

Signs of any new thinking about drug issues in Congress are hard to find. The U.S. Senate confirmed the nomination of Robert Gates as CIA director by a vote of 64 to 31 on November 5, 1991, despite voluminous testimony suggesting that he lied as to his ignorance of key matters in the Iran-Contra affair and that he distorted the production of intelligence estimates to serve the political ends of his boss, former Reagan campaign director William Casey. In this respect, one critic testified that Gates pushed the administration line on "narcoterrorism," which blamed drug trafficking on leftwing states and insurgent movements (see Chapter 2). Accusing Gates of shopping for analysts to make that case, Mel Goodman testified that "a senior analyst was called in by Bob Gates and told that Bill Casey wanted a memo that would link drug dealers to international terrorists. This senior analyst looked at the evidence and couldn't make those conclusions. The evidence wasn't there. He was told to go back and look again. He did that. Said the evidence wasn't there. Gates took the project away from him and gave it to another analyst. I believe there is an ethical issue here." Gates admitted asking analysts to look into accusations of a linkage between traffickers and terrorists but said in his defense that three separate agency analyses concluded any such linkage was weak.

CONTINUED...

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Drug_War/Cocaine_Politics.html

BTW: Your cousin is very lucky to have a noble cousin like you, Binka.

Imagine how lucky we are at DU.

[symbolman]

38. I've been screaming about this from the rooftops

and we need to get in lockstep on the web about this before it get's too deep..

The key is to let people know out there that BAKER IS DEFENDING the Saudis against the Families of the Victims of 911, nice little catch phrase that Joe Sixpack can wrap his mind around..

Cousins, eh? But YOU are a wonderful person Binka!

For folks that want to see what general DU'RS think about some of this here's a thread :

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2681709


And I wrote a commentary that Buzzflas will be posting called "Poltergeists in the White House?"

We've GOT to get this info out NOW.

And Binka is one hot, and COOL momma :)

[bobthedrummer]

20. It's all BFEE all the time with these folks that underestimated US

some have paid attention to history. And now a lot more give a damn!

I wonder what "the news" will be from the decider this weekend???

[blm]

25. Parry is going to update his commentary, too.

I requested we be given permission to spread his ENTIRE commentary in full around the web.

Help me when it does, guys.

[Octafish]

29. like the lawyer Tom Hagen to the Corleones, Gates is Poppy's adopted son.

Unlike Poppy's own kids, Gates is smart, too.

Some patriot in the new Congreff may want to get to the bottom of this:



SOURCE mit LINKs, ja:

http://www.wethepeople.la/ciadrugs.htm

Thanks for all you do, blm.

[blm]

32. Back at you, Octa. The internet has to back up Parry to the HILT on this.

.

[Octafish]

33. Robert P was on Amy Goodman's DemocracyNow! program...

...for those DUers who missed it:

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/11/09/1444242

Real Journalist Juan Gonzalez and former CIA analysist Melvin Goodman chip in with their usual solid information. Good folks there.

[blm]

44. Here it is, Octa - spread it EVERYWHERE.

http://www.consortiumnews.com/2006/111106.html

[Solly Mack]

10. recommended

:)

[young_at_heart]

11. You can almost see the grinding of Bush's teeth....he and Dad are not close!

When he didn't allow his father to speak at the last Republican convention it was obvious that the two have a problem. Oh, and "I talk to a higher father" was also a clue.

[babylonsister]

12. That leads me to suspect dimson is at his wit's end, relying on

dad to save his ass, despite the fact that it probably is too little, too late. Gates isn't going to do it, nor Baker. He's pulverized his way into history, in the worst way, by shedding blood he didn't care about. History won't be kind.

[mom cat]

13. I am sending this to my senators now! They must fight Gates!

[Karenina]

16. The recycling of criminals

really MUST STOP.

[Binka]

17. Ah Sister You SAID It!!!!!!Can't These Assholes Give It A Rest?

:hi:

[Karenina]

23. Na Du, Binkers!!!

Folks gotta realize that our nightmare has just begun. I mean (and I really don't want to piss in anyone's cheerios BUT) the plan to overtake America was launched 40 YEARS AGO. And what do we get today? Poppy's team has taken over the reins. As the kids say, "Jaaa, SUPER." :eyes: ANYONE who thinks one diddly election is all it will take to stop this juggernaut is FUCKING DREAMING. I wanna see some subpoenas, then CONVIVTIONS, then SERIOUS JAIL TIME.

[bobthedrummer]

21. Some of them need an education-and I don't mean no child left behind.

n/t

[bobthedrummer]

19. kick and add your own links to these, they've all got to GO NOW.

[seafan]

22. Kick. These Iran-Contra criminals have to be dealt with, and this time for good. n/t

[Lars39]

24. Thread on Gates I've collected the last few days:

Robert Gates

Robert Gates: A criminal from the Iran/Contra days…NNN0LHIs thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Iran-Contra Robert Gates? That Robert Gates?... Solly Mack’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Larry Johnson (ret. CIA) warns of Robert Gates..... Postmans’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...


Larry Johnson:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/larry-c-johnson/bob-gates...

"From the Shadows" (Gates' Autobiography)…H2O Man’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Gates was heavily implicated in a 'secret' program in the '80s providing satellite info to Saddam:…bigtree’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Iraq/Saddam%27s_Hidde...


Robert Gates - one of most consequential CIA operations: Funneling $ to Mujahhadin…The Straight Story’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Old Names, Old Scandals: Robert Gates was a controversial figure in the Iran-contra affair…struggle4progress’ thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Robert Parry: The Secret World of Robert Gates…reprehensor’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...


Robert Gates’ Main Qualification for Secretary of Defense…Time for change’ thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

The Cheney-Gates Cabal by Ray McGovern (ret.CIA)…Postman’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

1980: Robert Gates Prevented Iran Hostage Release…DiktatrW’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...


Poppy with Robert Gates on Nov. 4, 2006 – pic…Kadie’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

We need to fight the Robert "Trojan Horse" Gates appointment as SOD…bobbie’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

The Secret World of Robert Gates…0007’s thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

[bobthedrummer]

34. That's what the people need to know-thanks to all that have been

keeping track of these criminals.

The history hasn't been sent down the rabbit hole.

[Emit]

26. Important -- needs a kick n/t

[Octafish]

30. Only 104 reads. 104.

DUers must know all this stuff.

Meanwhile, crap on Carville's jealousy toward Dean gets thousands.

[Emit]

39. Gates has been a member of Baker’s commission

formally known as the Iraq Study Group.

Since March, Baker, backed by a team of experienced national-security hands, has been busily at work trying to devise a fresh set of policies to help the president chart a new course in--or, perhaps, to get the hell out of--Iraq. But as with all things involving James Baker, there's a deeper political agenda at work as well. "Baker is primarily motivated by his desire to avoid a war at home--that things will fall apart not on the battlefield but at home. So he wants a ceasefire in American politics," a member of one of the commission's working groups told me. Specifically, he said, if the Democrats win back one or both houses of Congress in November, they would unleash a series of investigative hearings on Iraq, the war on terrorism, and civil liberties that could fatally weaken the administration and remove the last props of political support for the war, setting the stage for a potential Republican electoral disaster in 2008. "I guess there are people in the party, on the Hill and in the White House, who see a political train wreck coming, and they've called in Baker to try to reroute the train."

The fact that Baker is involved has sent the Washington rumor mill buzzing with the theory that the commission is really a Trojan Horse for the views of Baker's friend and former boss, George H.W. Bush. It has been widely speculated that the former president never agreed with his son's decision to invade Iraq, and the son appears to have repaid that perceived dissent by largely refusing to reach out to his father for advice on national security, despite the elder Bush's knowledge and experience. In any case, for reasons that may be Oedipal or that may have to do with neoconservatives' disdain for realists associated with Bush 41, or both, Bush 43 has so far kept the 41 circle at arm's length--including Baker; his confrere Brent Scowcroft; and even, during his ill-fated tenure as secretary of state, Colin Powell. But with the situation in Iraq sliding towards irretrievable chaos, a moment of receptivity may have arrived.

It's hard to know what the commission is really up to because its inner workings are nearly as secretive as those of the White House. Baker has imposed an ironclad gag order on all of its participants. The 60 people involved in the effort have been instructed, in the strongest of terms, not to comment to reporters on the task force's work. Every one of the participants I spoke to flatly refused to comment for the record, and several did not want to talk even off the record. Some were palpably nervous. "We're not allowed to talk about it," said one person involved. "We get about every month a warning: 'Do not discuss in any context the substance of what is happening in this group.' You know how bad it is? Initially they wanted us to end all of our contacts with the media, make no statements, write no op-eds--in other words, become monks. Then they realized, how can you take the entire community of Iraq experts in the United States and have them all stop talking?"

~snip~

The president may have had another political motive for giving his blessing to the endeavor. If--and it's a very big if--Baker can forge a consensus plan on what to do about Iraq among the bigwigs on his commission, many of them leading foreign-policy figures in the Democratic Party, then the 2008 Democratic presidential nominee--whoever he (or she) is--will have a hard time dismissing the plan. And if the GOP nominee also embraces the plan, then the Iraq war would largely be off the table as a defining issue of the 2008 race--a potentially huge advantage for Republicans.

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2006/0609.dreyfuss.html


Bush mentioned the Baker-Hamilton Commission four times in his news conference Wednesday. And now I see Dems coming out, deferring to the Baker-Hamilton Commission as a panacea for Iraq:

Sen. Byron Dorgan, D-N.D., chairman of the Democratic Policy Committee, on JIM LEHRER the other night:

Iraqis should handle security
MARGARET WARNER: Now, let's turn to Iraq, because we know a majority of voters said they wanted a change in Iraq. How much can Democrats deliver on that?

SEN. BYRON DORGAN: Once again, I think that the voice of the American people was really important here. I mean, they made some progress in sending a message to everybody in Washington, D.C., they didn't like what's happening.

~snip~

MARGARET WARNER: But, I mean, the White House says that's what they've been saying to the Maliki government all along. I guess my question is, are Democrats ready, for instance, to go so far as use the power of the purse, if you don't see that the president is willing or stepping up to really changing policy in a way that you think needs to be done?

SEN. BYRON DORGAN: We will not do anything that in any way ever undermines the troops. They serve this country because they're asked to serve this country. We won't do anything that undermines the troops.

But I think it's also clear that we now have this Baker-Hamilton group that will be reporting. Clearly, change is on the way, and we want to work with the president, with the Hamilton-Baker organization as they report and come up with some change that will move us in a position to be able to come out of Iraq at some point.

~snip~

The Democratic plan for Iraq
MARGARET WARNER: Now, some Democratic candidates ran calling for a pretty quick withdrawal of troops. You have others -- not yourself, you voted against the war resolution -- but some voted for it who haven't gone that far. Do Democrats now need to come up with a consistent position of their own on Iraq, on what to do going forward? Or is this still the president's responsibility?

~snip~

SEN. BYRON DORGAN: Let me just say that we Democrats will attempt in every way possible to come up with an approach that makes sense for our country and reflects our best interests. We want to do that with the president, with Hamilton-Baker. But is that going to be easy? No, it's not. But the American people clearly said Tuesday night, "We want some changes."

~snip~

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/politics/july-dec06/dorgan_11-09.html



And, Sen. Joseph Biden (D)

said Wednesday that the Baker-Hamilton commission’s recommendations could give the White House “the necessary political room to make a radical change” in Iraq policy.

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascitystar/news/politics/15965831.htm


So, with regard to Iraq and Bushco foreign policy, seems that "Bush is still 'the decider'":

November 9, 2006

MANY AMERICANS are breathing a massive sigh of relief now that the Democrats have apparently won both houses of Congress and President Bush has sacked his hawkish Defense secretary, Donald H. Rumsfeld. At home and abroad, expectations are being raised that the power shift in Washington will rein in the Bush administration, restoring centrism, moderation and pragmatism to American foreign policy.

Not so fast.

~snip~

But expectations of an about-face on foreign policy are illusory. There will be more continuity than change; the ideological excesses of the Bush era are not yet behind us. At Wednesday's news conference, Bush did not budge on Iraq policy and stood by his bellicose vice president, Dick Cheney. It may well be up to the Democrats to ensure a change of course on foreign policy, but control of Congress does not give them the power to do so.

The U.S. Constitution grants the president a wide berth on matters of war and peace. Congress can chip away at the margins and seek to obstruct the White House, but it cannot dictate policy. Though it wields the power of the purse, Democratic leaders know it would be political and moral suicide to seek to force a withdrawal from Iraq by cutting off funds to U.S. troops deployed there. Such action would also enable the Republicans to shift the blame for failure in Iraq to the Democrats.

~snip~

Amid the political confrontation that will ensue when the 110th Congress opens in January, the Democrats may well be able to force changes to the Bush administration's domestic agenda — which was running out of steam well before this week's vote. But Congress is less likely to be able to shape precisely those foreign policies that helped turn the electorate toward the Democrats. On matters of statecraft, Bush is destined to remain "the decider" for another two years.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-kupchan9nov09,0,129222.story?coll=la-news-comment-opinions

[AntiFascist]

46. And Baker is know for his anti-Semitic remark....

"fuck the Jews, they don't vote for us anyway."

Could this indicate a stronger alliance with wealthy Arabs?

[Octafish]

47. B-I-N-G-O.

Bush's jesters are jettisoning PNAC, JINSA and AIPAC right and left.

They're going driving with bin Laden or his enemies. They are the same. And they're where the really big private wealth is.

It's logical. Bushco has pretty much looted all the public wealth America had and put in hock what they couldn't carry.

Besides, America's Number One Crime Family has permanently silenced most of the witnesses on the Israeli side over the years.

So now, there's really no one around who can still blackmail them, besides the Saudis...

And the Wall Streeters.
And the MI-Industrial-Intel Complex.
And the mafia.
And Dope Inc.
And the mafiya.
And Nuke Inc.
And the Red Chinese.
And the NAZIs.

Pretty much just the BFEE.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/cgi-bin/texis.cgi/webinator/search/?query=airport+maps&pr=default&order=r&cmd=context&id=42b620ae540

These aren't nice people. And they make up an even larger part of today's government. And they are traitors.

[shanti]

31. lots o links

:kick: thanks for this!

[bobthedrummer]

35. So fresh eyes are plucked to replace Rumsfeld-Gates was on the Iraq

Study Group-nothing but a BFEE reunion dominated by James Baker III
"A Higher Power" by Robert Dreyfuss
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2006/0609.dreyfuss.html

And who replaced fresh eyes Gates on the Iraq Study Group- another good old Henry Kissinger Associates Director (like Brent Scowcroft) Lawrence Eagleburger.

Anyone else recall the "scandal" about financing Iraq and acting as a shadow WMD enabler (among other things) through the auspices of the Banca Nazionale del Lavoro/BNL?

Lawrence Eagleburger was a big part of that.
http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/congress/1992/h920428g.htm

A Kissinger guy-like L. Paul Bremer.
Poppy and Henry reminds me of Prescott Sheldon Bush and The Third Reich.

There's so much more to add to this.

[AzDar]

36. Kick n/t

[bobthedrummer]

37. Fresh eyes Gates has left another BFEE pal on the Iraq Study Group

Edwin Meese III, who was part of Iran/Contra and is BFEE.
http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/1299

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Edwin_Meese_III

[Octafish]

41. Meese is BIG in The Fellowship Foundation.

He may not be Mr. Big, but he's definitely a Big Turd of the BFEE.

Will Ed Meese Force Katrina Victims to Glean for Dinner?

by Kurt Nimmo Another Day in the Empire
Entered into the database on Tuesday, September 20th, 2005 @ 15:38:18 MST

EXCERPT...

It should also be noted that Meese is connected to the Council for National Policy, “a secretive forum, formed in 1981, for leading US conservative political leaders, financiers and religious right activist leaders,” according to SourceWatch. Members include Pat Robertson, former AG John Ashcroft, and Rev. Rousas J. Rushdoony, founder of Chalcedon Foundation (now deceased). Rushdoony was an advocate of Christian Reconstructionism and the Chalcedon Foundation promotes the idea that “historic, orthodox, Biblical Christianity should govern every area of thought and life. Chalcedon’s cause is simple, radical, and comprehensive. It admits no division between the ‘private’ and ‘public’ spheres. If God is sovereign and Jesus is Lord, this divine sovereignty and Lordship is designed to engulf every aspect of human existence-not just the private and ’spiritual,’ for instance.”

It is not difficult to connect the dots here. Meese, as the “unofficial adviser for New Orleans area reconstruction” and a follower of Christian Reconstructionism—or so we can only assume since birds of a feather flock together—will likely attempt to force his “faith-based” theocratic dogmatism on the victims of Hurricane Katrina. Not only do reconstructionists believe (under Mosaic Law) homosexuals and fornicators (and those engaging in pre-marital or extra-marital sex) should be stoned to death, they also believe minimum-wage laws should be abolished (note Bush’s revoking of the 1931 Davis-Bacon Act in ravaged areas of Alabama, Florida, Louisiana, and Mississippi) and “old-age security would be covered by … care from adult children” (no word on what the elderly who lost their adult children to Katrina will be expected to do), and (my favorite) the poor will be allowed to “glean” (gather grain left behind by reapers) “on private farms,” according to the Christian Century. Just in case you think Meese and the Christian Reconstructionists are lone voices in the spiritual wilderness, consider the following: “approximately half of the members of the U.S. Congress say they are members of these communions,” according to a white paper released by the Boston Wesleyan Association.

CONTINUED...

http://www.lookingglassnews.org/printerfriendly.php?storyid=2579

Meese. Gates. Solid BFEE types.

[symbolman]

42. Don't forget that during the Reagan Bush years

MORE people in their admin were held liable for CRIMES than any other administration, more than a 100 BIG TURDS in that admin.. I remember someone put up a page in the newspaper showing a FULL PAGE of small photos of all the CROOKS who'd be caught in the Reagan Bush Regime..

and now they are BACK.

Time to call ORKIN on this one :)

[happydreams]

57. Kick. Alot of smart hardworking people here.

[bobthedrummer]

43. The Rumsfeld/Cheney DoD, a Veterans Day indictment

They appointed their own politicized extremists into leadership positions

Special Plans Cabal by Seymour Hersh
http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?030512fa_fact

They wouldn't listen to professionals outside of their ideology whether in or out of uniform

Pentagon Muzzles CIA by Robert Dreyfuss
http://www.prospect.org/print/V13/22/dreyfuss-r.html

They wouldn't listen to officers outside of their ideology-Rumsfeld often acted on behalf of war profiteers when he "spoke" to Congress
http://www.spacewar.com/2003/031017165230.3bqnyqw6.html

War profiteers like Cheney, Rumsfeld and the Bush family itself
"All in the (profiteering) First Family" by Margie Burns
http://www.populist.com/04.7.burns.html

They hired mercenaries (aka Private Military Companies/PMC's) part of Rumsfeld et al's failed Revolution in Military Affairs-mercenaries that committed war crimes, atrocities, tortured, raped and looted and made OUR military and Americans many enemies all for $$$
Windfalls of War
http://www.publicintegrity.org/wow/
Making a Killing:The Business of War
http://www.theexperiment.org/articles.php?news_id=1884

Yet these mercenaries hired by the Cheney/Rumsfeld DoD and rubberstamped by the RW Republican led "Congress" had such contempt for OUR military that they CHARGED COMBAT WOUNDED MILITARY MEMBERS FOR THEIR MEALS IN US MILITARY HOSPITALS
http://www.estripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=21368


They are dedicated believers in a high-tech EMPIRE of permanent war in the 21st Century which came from ideologies similar to, and influenced by, the neo-conservatives and Straussians like those in the Project for a New American Century
http://www.newamericancentury.org/

There are many sources that state that the invasion and occupation of Iraq was planned years before 9-11-2001, and this administration LIED to US and the world when the "War President acted" and sent OUR military into Iraq.

We need a lot more than fresh eyes, and our newly elected Democratic leadership must clear out these criminals.

There's so much more, add to this thread or cross-post it.

[bobthedrummer]

45. Extreme RW politics influenced our intelligence and military leadership

before Rumsfeld.

So much that by the time of President Clinton the efficacy of military coups were being written about as "reports from the future"-here is a good example, and this reflects the type of "thinking outside the box" that has influenced our military leadership for decades-but particularly in the Cheney/Rumsfeld DoD.

"Melancholy Reunion: A Report From The Future On The Collapse Of Civil-Military Relations In The United States" USAF/INSS Occasional Paper 11 October 1996 by Charles J. Dunlap Jr.
http://www.guerrillacampaign.com/coup.htm

The BFEE doesn't care about anything outside it's own objectives. The time has come for that to go.

The Bush Intelligence Manipulation Scandal documented by TruthIsAll
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x1256201

Intelligence failures were cited by this administration to explain what has gone wrong in the war on terror and in Iraq. More lies to cover-up crimes.

Robert Gates can't fix that since he is part of a longstanding problem of politicizing everything.

Robert Gates-Gate by Ray McGovern
http://www.commondreams.org/views06/111-22.htm

[Octafish]

50. Melvin A. Goodman also pegged Gates for the turd he is.

This is just the tip of the BFEE iceturd...

Wrong man to replace Rumsfeld

By Melvin A. Goodman
Originally published November 10, 2006

Secretary of Defense Donald H. Rumsfeld's resignation has unloaded a great deal of unwelcome baggage for the Bush administration, but the nomination of Robert M. Gates is unlikely to help resolve the disastrous war in Iraq or the uniformed military's opposition to the civilian leadership at the Pentagon. Unlike successful secretaries of defense in the recent past, Mr. Gates lacks essential experience in military and industrial affairs and has had serious problems with the congressional confirmation process.

Two previous presidents, Ronald Reagan and George H. W. Bush, nominated Mr. Gates for the position of director of central intelligence. In 1987, Mr. Gates had to withdraw his name because a majority of Senate Intelligence Committee members did not believe his denials regarding prior knowledge of the Iran-contra scandal. The independent counsel in the Iran-contra investigation, Lawrence E. Walsh, shared their disbelief.

In 1991, Mr. Gates was confirmed after receiving more than 30 negative votes, far more than any other nominee to the position of CIA director had garnered over nearly six decades. Key senators were convinced in 1991 that Mr. Gates had a major role in the politicization of intelligence on the Soviet Union, Central America and Southwest Asia. During his testimony, Mr. Gates, known for his outstanding memory, testified 33 times that he did not have any recollection of the facts of Iran-contra.

Mr. Gates became the first career CIA analyst to take over the reins of the agency, ultimately doing more harm to the mission and mandate of the CIA's intelligence directorate than any previous director - even his mentor, William J. Casey. His strong ideological agenda in support of the White House often led him down the wrong analytical road, causing him to be wrong about the central issues of the day involving the decline and fall of the Soviet Union and the impact of ethnic violence on regional conflicts.

Some of his statements led to strong and unprecedented reprimands from Secretaries of State George P. Shultz and James A. Baker III. In 1987, Mr. Shultz confronted Mr. Gates and told him, "You have a big, powerful machine not under good control. I distrust what comes out of it." In 1989, Mr. Baker had to stop a speech against Soviet leader Mikhail S. Gorbachev that Mr. Gates was going to deliver that would have compromised Mr. Baker's diplomatic initiatives.

CONTINUED...

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/oped/bal-op.gates10nov10,0,3393156.story

Great thread, Bob. Sorry I've been so slow in reply...been a bit under the weather.

[bobthedrummer]

48. kick-add your thoughts and links to this thread, pass it around. n/t

[Octafish]

66. All war. All the time.

It's a reccurring nightmare I keep living.

Will Gates Open the Floodgates in Iraq?

That's the question posed by Tom Engelhardt in a new piece that deflates some of the hype surrounding the retun of Robert Gates and Jim Baker. The conventional wisdom is that "daddy's boys" have arrived to (once again) save George W. Bush's butt from a fiasco of his own making. (See this week's Newsweek cover for the short version of this satisfying pop psych-meets-poli sci analysis.) But Engelhardt suspects that rather than advocating redeployment or withdrawal, Gates and Baker may just prolong our involvement by signing onto the recently floated plans to send more troops to give it the old school try:

...(P)erhaps the disaster behind us will be nothing compared to the disaster ahead, especially if Daddy's Boys, the Iraq Study Group, other Democratic and Republican movers and shakers, and all those generals and former generals floating around our world decide that this isn't the moment to rediscover a Colin Powell-style "exit strategy," but "one last chance" to succeed by any definition in Iraq. Then, god help us -- and the Iraqis. Sooner or later, we'll undoubtedly be gone from a land so determinedly hostile to being occupied by us, but that end moment could still be a long, long time in coming.

CONTINUED...

http://www.motherjones.com/mojoblog/archives/2006/11/2957_will_gates_open.html

Thank you for one heckuva thread, Robert of the Mighty Drums.

Most enlightening, DU, wot?

[bobthedrummer]

49. "Bush's Belated Accountability Moment" by Nat Parry

http://www.consortiumnews.com/2006/111106a.html

This administration needs accountability on things like torture, which the Cheney/Rumsfeld DoD, the AG and others endorsed.

Bush Administration Documents on Interrogation
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A62516-2004Jun22.html

Outsourcing Torture
http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/060227fa_fact

[bobthedrummer]

51. Some of this bears repeating about Robert Michael Gates

Like when this October 18, 1991 NYT Editorial was read into the Congressional Record after Poppy named Robert Michael Gates as his candidate for CIA Director
"The Once and Future CIA"
http://www.fas.org/irp/congress/1991_cr/s911031-gates.htm

Ray McGovern and others have consistantly told us the truth
"The Cheney/Gates Cabal"
http://www.tompaine.com/print/the_cheneygates_cabal.php

Namebase has an Iran-Contra book selection that is worth a glance
http://www.namebase.org/books58.html

It's all BFEE with these criminals.

[bobthedrummer]

52. What else can we take note of in regards to this latest BFEE ploy?

[bobthedrummer]

53. Kissinger Associates, Kissinger mentored people like L. Paul Bremer

Henry Kissinger was the Decider's original choice to head the 9/11 Commission.

Henry Kissinger is a wanted war criminal with at least 37 arrest warrants outstanding. Henry Kissinger got a lot of people killed in S.E.Asia, Central and Southern America, Africa and the Middle East.

Henry Kissinger has always protected George H. W. Bush's connections with Saudi Arabians like the bin Ladens and former Saudi Intelligence chief Ghaith Pharaon.

Henry Kissinger is "consulting" with those Iran Contra criminals in the Iraq Study Group.

Henry Kissinger should have been prosecuted decades ago along with the BFEE. These people have to GO.

[bobthedrummer]

54. "Blackmail & Bobby Gates" by Robert Parry

http://www.consortiumnews.com/2006/111406.html

[bobthedrummer]

55. We voted for a real change of direction-they've got to go. n/t

[Karenina]

56. What to do to get folks to

PAY SOME FUCKING ATTENTION TO THE BIG PICTURE other than
:kick: :shrug:

[bobthedrummer]

59. Keep repeating it and updating it, that's one approach. You can't

give a crash course on this-and a lot of people are ahistorical or programmed to "trust the experts", experts that are often corrupt.

Countering the propaganda networks and psychological operations is getting easier thanks to all the whistleblowers, the tough part is that most of the ploys against getting the facts out are designed to prevent effective organized opposition-that's already failed yet there is a "lag".

[Karenina]

60. Errrraaaa....

:kick:

Psssst, BtD :loveya:

[Imagevision]

58. Poppy finds it necessary to step back in the limelight rescuing stupid!!

[bobthedrummer]

61. Lots of crumbs that fell off of a table could make a meal-kick.

[bobthedrummer]

62. A kick into the "damage controllers" offices...

[bobthedrummer]

63. A lot of this open source material, necessary for an informed "electorate'

could become subject to some arbitrary and vague interpretations under the tortured "legalese" of the BFEE to plug the leaks of what it fears most, the TRUTH.

In another of it's quiet announcements that further erodes our Constitution and Bill of Rights, just before leaving for Vietnam, the Decider "gave" even more secrecy powers to the Director of National Intelligence (despised death squad dirty war criminal and former BFEE UN rep. John Negroponte) which can be delegated in this "war on terror" to those that are with BFEE.

This is the kind of "damage control" of anything but a democracy. Check it out for yourselves and add to this thread as a response.

To the DNI from the Decider
http://cryptome.org/pm111406.htm

[bobthedrummer]

64. If you're not deer hunting this weekend, why not add to this thread?

If, as it is being "reported", Gates gets to become Sec. Def, at least some questions can be raised about all this "politicization" and something can be done about that.

Meanwhile, a lot of innocent people are being "hunted", our military and Americans worldwide are targets of hatred and revenge-mostly because of the criminal failures of the War President's administration, and Poppy's crew isn't the solution.

[Octafish]

65. Many liberals I know think he's 'OK.'

Which makes me sad that they don't remember the turd from the first time around.

Case in point: Gates made his bones as a spy on the Carter White House for Bush's Secret Team.

http://www.search.com/reference/October_surprise_conspiracy

Thank you for a heckuva thread, Bob!

Those interested in copying all the links and text can put it into "printer-friendly format" above the OP. That makes it easy to cut and paste every morsel of this information harvest -- which is a hell of a lot better than shooting Bambi and his relatives.

[Imagevision]

67. Dems remaining silent on Gates (Iran-Contra etc.) is worrisome... and

disappointing!

[bobthedrummer]

68. A kick in rememberance of John F. Kennedy

[bobthedrummer]

69. "Secretary Rumsfeld Speaks On '21st Century Transformation' Of US

Armed Forces" remarks and Q&A session from January 31, 2002 at Ft. McNair.

Notice that at that time there was a lot of cheering, laughter and applause from the audience-some of them war profiteers and criminals that are now very quiet or attacking each other.

Take a little time to read what extreme politicization and militarism Rumsfeld et al are leaving for the criminal and liar Mr. Gates to work with if he is approved.

http://www.defenselink.mil/speeches/2002/s20020131-secdef.html

They've got to go.

[bobthedrummer]

70. a kick for the links that got scrubbed since the last kick-add to this thread