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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-27-06 11:29 PM
Original message
Bush Lied America into War.
Edited on Fri Oct-27-06 11:41 PM by Octafish
Here's what this election's about...

Bush Lied America into War.

It's what the elections in 2000, 2002 and 2004 were about, too.

The War to Deceive America Into War -- And the War to Cover Up the Deception


Before America went to war with Afghanistan, another war was underway -- against its own people: the war to deceive America into attacking Iraq. This is no longer a theory or conjecture; it is a documented fact.

Those in the Mainstream Media, including the New York Times and Washington Post, who choose to ignore this reality, or couch it in qualifying terms (such as "unproven assertions") are no longer trying to debunk a conspiracy, because the deliberate deception that forced America into war with Iraq is not a conspiracy theory.


Consider just some of the following established facts regarding the Bush administration's orchestrated propaganda campaign to deceive America into War:

    1) A 2002 (Downing Street) memo is released in Britain in May of 2005 that documents that Blair thought that he had no choice but to go to war because the Bush administration said that it was "going to fix" intelligence to start one.

    2) In early June of 2005, a British paper reveals that the U.S. and U.K. flew sorties over Iraq in 2002 to provoke Saddam Hussein and destroy his anti-aircraft infrastructure in preparation for the war. Congressman John Conyers calls this the smoking bullet in the smoking gun.

    3) All the Bushevik warnings of WMDs are proven false -- all of them. Not a single WMD was found.

    4) Dick Cheney lurked around the CIA prior to the Iraq War putting pressure on analysts to "fix" the data.

    5) The analysts who came up with the false allegations that "aluminum tubes" were being used for nuclear enrichment story were promoted by the Bush Administration and given bonuses.

    6) Richard Clarke says that Bush personally took him aside and told him to make the facts work for a war with Iraq.

    7) Former Secretary of the Treasury O'Neill wrote in his memoirs that Bush was out to get Iraq from the moment he was sworn in.

    8) The PNAC (Project for the New American Century) plea to invade Iraq was written in the late 90s, primarily by Bush Neo-cons who guided us into the war.

    9) The Bush Administration outed Valerie Plame as a CIA operative specializing in -- ironically and tragically -- tracking the illicit sale and movement of Weapons of Mass Destruction because her courageous husband, Joe Wilson, exposed the Niger documents as a fraud. Thus, the Bush Administration put the national security at risk regarding WMDs to seek vengeance on someone for exposing their phony war based on a lie about WMDs.

    10) This past weekend, it was revealed that John Bolton had a U.N. official fired for trying to seek a peaceful way out of the Iraq War, in regards to Iraq's compliance with chemical weapons accords.

    11) After 9/11, Rumsfeld is quoted as saying that the U.S. would take Saddam and all of "them" out.

    12) Advanced forces were sent into Iraq before the war had even started.

    13) Rumsfeld set up a Pentagon psy-ops operation to create PR for going to war with Iraq. (He claimed to have closed it down, but he never did.)

    14) The Chalabi-Judith Miller-Cheney axis of information was used to claim that created "factoids" were truths, when they were just propaganda. (The New York Times "apologized" for this, but made no changes in its coverage, including keeping Miller on and standing up for her, even though she published lies from a proxy Bush Administration anonymous source.)

    15) The Bush Administration, according to various polls, conducted a successful misinformation campaign to make Americans believe that Saddam Hussein was partly responsible for 9/11 and that the hijackers were Iraqi.


These guys will get off scot-free if they steal this election.

We can stop them with the Truth.
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fooj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-27-06 11:56 PM
Response to Original message
1. TRUTH is our most powerful weapon!
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:22 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Illegal Iraq Invasion lasted longer for USA than World War II
Probably cost a heckuva lot more in money, too, fooj.

Iraq War Will Soon Outlast US Involvement In World War Two

The violence continues in Baghdad, Iraq.

by Claude Salhani
UPI International Editor
Victoria BC (UPI) Oct 23, 2006

In just a few weeks -- on Nov. 28, to be precise -- U.S. involvement in the Iraq war will have lasted a day longer than its participation in World War II. As a reminder, the United States officially entered WWII on Dec. 8, 1941, when President Franklin D. Roosevelt signed the declaration of war, after the Japanese surprise attack on the U.S. Pacific fleet at Pearl Harbor, Hawaii, destroyed much of the American fleet.

The war officially ended on Aug. 15, 1945, on Victory in Japan, or VJ-Day. For the United States, the war lasted three years, seven months and seven days. The war in Europe had ended a few months earlier, on May 8.

The U.S. invasion of Iraq began March 20, 2003, Baghdad time (it was still March 19 in the United States and some sources use March 19 as the official start date). By Nov. 28, the United States will have been fighting in Iraq one day longer than American GIs did during WWII.

But this is possibly the only parallel that may be drawn between the two conflicts.

The defeat of the Axis powers in WWII brought about the unconditional surrender of Nazi Germany, fascist Italy and Imperial Japan, and with the exception of the odd group of Japanese soldiers stuck in some remote Pacific island outposts who continued to believe the war was still on, the act of surrender meant the end of hostilities.

But in Iraq, the defeat of Saddam Hussein and the disbandment of his army and security services, along with the dismemberment of the Iraqi Baath Party, served as the signal for the start of real hostilities to begin.

The defeat of the Axis in WWII set the ground for a new beginning and for the rebuilding of a devastated Europe. The defeat of Iraq set the ground for an open-ended conflict, and with each passing month, the chances of a negotiated scale-back of violence seem more and more remote. In Europe, the deaths of Adolf Hitler and Benito Mussolini and the execution of Prime Minister Hideki Tojo in Japan signaled the end of WWII. In Iraq, the overthrow of Saddam Hussein, on the other hand, triggered the start of the real war, and saw the beginning of the insurgency against the U.S.-led coalition.


These two wars, as measured in lives, both represent infinite loss.
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indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 08:06 AM
Response to Reply #3
9. But WWII was fought to stop totalitarian governments from taking other
peoples lands and natural resources, or largely so, and besides, four major oil companies stand to earn more $trillions than the cost of invasion and occupation and the Halliburtons of the world will not have done badly either.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #9
33. How the Bush Family Makes a Killing from George's Presidency
BFEE's making out OK, too.

How the Bush Family Makes a Killing from George's Presidency

Halliburton scored almost $1.2 billion in revenue from contracts related to Iraq in the third quarter of 2006, leading one analyst to comment: "Iraq was better than expected... Overall, there is nothing really to question or be skeptical about. I think the results are very good."

Very good indeed. An estimated 655,000 dead Iraqis, over 3,000 dead coalition troops, billions stolen from Iraq's coffers, a country battered by civil war - but Halliburton turned a profit, so the results are very good.

Very good certainly for Vice President Dick Cheney, who resigned from Halliburton in 2000 with a $33.7 million retirement package (not bad for roughly four years of work). In a stunning conflict of interest, Cheney still holds more than 400,000 stock options in the company. Why pursue diplomacy when you can rake in a personal fortune from war?

Yet Cheney isn't the only one who has benefited from the Bush administration's destructive policies. The Bush family has done quite nicely too. Just a few examples:

Bush Sr.

Bush's dad has strong connections to the Carlyle Group, a massive private equity investment firm whose Chairman Emeritus is Frank Carlucci, a former college roommate of Donald Rumsfeld's and former Defense Secretary under Ronald Reagan. Imagine the pull Carlucci has with today's White House...

But Carlucci has another secret weapon - Bush Sr. Amid conflict-of-interest allegations, the elder Bush resigned from the Carlyle Group in 2003, but reportedly remains on retainer, opening doors to lucrative profits in the Middle East and elsewhere. Bush Sr.'s specialty is Saudi Arabia; in fact, he was at a Carlyle investment conference with Osama bin Laden's estranged brother, Shafiq bin Laden, when the 9/11 attacks took place.


It may've been Machiavelli who said: "Use money to gain power; use power to gain money."

Thanks to the H-Bomb, the BFEE takes that to another level.
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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:06 AM
Response to Original message
2. Bush gave "Slamdunk" medal of freedom to take the fall for faulty intel...
but the mushroom clouds BS. spewed by Rice Cheney Rumsfeld clearly played the fear factor and Bush is responsible for killing almost twice the amount of Iraqi's as Saddam, so the notion of; " Saddam was a bad guy don't wash unless there is regime change here in the US.!!!
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:29 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. They knew the war was a lie and yet went ahead with it, anyway.
You are spot on, Imagevision. Regime change begins at home.

They Knew

Despite the whitewash, we now know that the Bush administration was warned before the war that its Iraq claims were weak

By David Sirota and Christy Harvey

If desperation is ugly, then Washington, D.C. today is downright hideous.

As the 9/11 Commission recently reported, there was no credible evidence of a collaborative relationship between Iraq and al Qaeda. Similarly, no weapons of mass destruction have been found in Iraq. With U.S. casualties mounting in an election year, the White House is grasping at straws to avoid being held accountable for its dishonesty.

The whitewash already has started: In July, Republicans on the Senate Intelligence Committee released a controversial report blaming the CIA for the mess. The panel conveniently refuses to evaluate what the White House did with the information it was given or how the White House set up its own special team of Pentagon political appointees (called the Office of Special Plans) to circumvent well-established intelligence channels. And Vice President Dick Cheney continues to say without a shred of proof that there is overwhelming evidence justifying the administrations pre-war charges.

But as author Flannery OConner noted, Truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it. That means no matter how much defensive spin spews from the White House, the Bush administration cannot escape the documented fact that it was clearly warned before the war that its rationale for invading Iraq was weak.

Top administration officials repeatedly ignored warnings that their assertions about Iraqs supposed Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD) and connections to al Qaeda were overstated. In some cases, they were told their claims were wholly without merit, yet they went ahead and made them anyway. Even the Senate report admits that the White House misrepresented classified intelligence by eliminating references to contradictory assertions.

In short, they knew they were misleading America.

And they did not care.


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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #2
11. That Tenet ceremony in 2004 was all about inoculating Bush before election
and Tenet knew it. That is what makes him a bad guy still in this story. He deceived the CITIZENS of this country for years before he let any truth leak out.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #11
32. Members of Bush Gang Swore Under Oath Saddam Was Behind 9/11
They're all going to The Hague, blm.

Members of Bush Gang Swore Under Oath Saddam Was Behind 9/11

by Evelyn Pringle | Oct 27 2006 - 9:09am | permalink

Much to the dismay of the Bush administration, Americans can remember all on their own, without any help from Democrats, that in the run up to the war in Iraq, it was top White House officials who were making the claim that Saddam was in cahoots with bin Laden and secretly involved to 9/11.

The fact that the administration's disinformation campaign was overwhelmingly successful was evidenced by an October 2004, Harris Poll, taken three weeks before the last presidential election, that found 62% of all voters, and 84% of those planning to vote for Bush, still believed that Saddam had "strong links" to Al Qaeda, and that 41% of all voters, and 52% of Bush backers, believed that Saddam had "helped plan and support the hijackers" who had attacked the country on 9/11.

As we now know, the basis for these allegations was false, but the saddest part of the sordid tale is that many Americans are just now beginning to realize that Bush knew the stories were false for more than a year when he cited them as justification for taking the country to war.

Documents since declassified and made public show that the administration was warned by the Defense Intelligence Agency in February 2002, that the tale about a trip to Prague by the leader of the 9/11 highjackers, Mohamed Atta, had come from an unreliable drunk, and that the story about Iraqis training members of al Qaeda on the use of chemical and biological weapons was deliberately fabricated by an Iraqi defector.

The debate over who was most responsible for convincing the nation that there was a link between Saddam and 9/11 will probably continue for years but an important piece of the puzzle can be found by zeroing in on a woman by the name of Laurie Mylroie, a person most people have never heard of.

Mylroie had been pushing for an all-out war against Iraq for a decade and in the run-up to the first Gulf war, she, along with the since fired New York Times reporter, Judith Miller, wrote a book titled, "Saddam Hussein and the Crisis in the Gulf."


Well. Maybe not all.

We won't let traitors out of the country.
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Poiuyt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 01:12 AM
Response to Original message
5. Bush talked about how much he wanted to invade Iraq in 1999
He was thinking about invading Iraq in 1999, said author and journalist Mickey Herskowitz. It was on his mind. He said to me: One of the keys to being seen as a great leader is to be seen as a commander-in-chief. And he said, My father had all this political capital built up when he drove the Iraqis out of Kuwait and he wasted it. He said, If I have a chance to invade.if I had that much capital, Im not going to waste it. Im going to get everything passed that I want to get passed and Im going to have a successful presidency.

(emphasis mine)

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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #5
13. Fixated on bein' a ''War Preznit.''
Thanks for the important information, Poiuyt. Bush had delusions of grandeur, even then.

Bush Wanted to Invade Iraq... in 1999?

From Austin Cline,

Apparently George W. Bush began thinking about invading Iraq as far back as 1999. Why? Because he thought a tidy little war would produce enough political capital for him to do anything he wanted back home - and give him a nice reputation as president. Is that appropriate for the President? Should he put his reputation over the lives of others?

Russ Baker writes for GNN:

He was thinking about invading Iraq in 1999, said author and journalist Mickey Herskowitz. It was on his mind. He said to me: One of the keys to being seen as a great leader is to be seen as a commander-in-chief. And he said, My father had all this political capital built up when he drove the Iraqis out of Kuwait and he wasted it. He said, If I have a chance to invade.if I had that much capital, Im not going to waste it. Im going to get everything passed that I want to get passed and Im going to have a successful presidency." Herskowitz said that Bush expressed frustration at a lifetime as an underachiever in the shadow of an accomplished father. In aggressive military action, he saw the opportunity to emerge from his fathers shadow. The moment, Herskowitz said, came in the wake of the September 11 attacks. Suddenly, hes at 91 percent in the polls, and hed barely crawled out of the bunker. Herskowitz also revealed the following:

    -In 2003, Bushs father indicated to him that he disagreed with his sons invasion of Iraq.

    -Bush admitted that he failed to fulfill his Vietnam-era domestic National Guard service obligation, but claimed that he had been excused.

    -Bush revealed that after he left his Texas National Guard unit in 1972 under murky circumstances, he never piloted a plane again. That casts doubt on the carefully-choreographed moment of Bush emerging in pilots garb from a jet on the aircraft carrier USS Abraham Lincoln in 2003 to celebrate Mission Accomplished in Iraq. The image, instantly telegraphed around the globe, and subsequent hazy White House statements about his capacity in the cockpit, created the impression that a heroic Bush had played a role in landing the craft.

    -Bush described his own business ventures as floundering before campaign officials insisted on recasting them in a positive light.

Can Herskowitz be believed? Josh Marshall thinks so:

    He's a Bush family friend. He's co-written numerous 'as-told-to' autobiographies for a slew of famous folks. He was hired to co-author President Bush's campaign autobiography A Charge to Keep. And even after there were some bumps in the road in that process, the president's father asked Herskowitz to write a biography of his father -- i.e., Prescott Bush, which he did (see Duty, Honor, Country: The Life and Legacy of Prescott Bush, 2003). On top of that, the author of the piece, Russ Baker, is a journalist with an excellent reputation. Herskowitz is credible. Baker is credible.

If what is reported in this article is true, George W. Bush might be considered one of the worst possible people to have held the office of President of the United States. A man who would consider invading a sovereign nation, even Iraq, in order to build political capital and advance a domestic agenda, is unfit for any public office. If over a thousand Americans and over 100,000 Iraqis died simply to help Bush fulfill his dreams of creating a "successful presidency," the man should be sent to jail rather than sent back to the White House for a second term.


This was written way back before e-Selection 2004. Before the already monstrous death toll became what it is today, a genocide of the Iraqi people and the unneccessary murder of 2,800 American armed forces personnel.
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KansDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. That's why he let 9/11 happen...
"Operation Northwoods" says it all...

ABC News

Just substitute "Bush" for "Kennedy" and "Iraq" for "Cuba" and there you have it...
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. Bush threw FBI under the bus and promoted turds who kept their wugs shut.
Here's an excellent summation of the facts:

How the FBI Let 9/11 Happen

Never mind Moussaoui, the smoldering gun was right there all the time

Jeff A. Taylor

Anyone paying attention to the Zacarias Moussaoui trial gets it now. All the 9/11 blanks are filled in, and the picture is complete. Sorry, conspiracy freaks and blind partisan hacks. Dull, common, gross incompetence is again at the heart of a deadly government cluster-hump.

Do not linger on Moussaoui's bizarre suicide-by-testimony or the literal cheerleading for his executionHe knew. He lied. And 2,749 people died.

Neither of these is the real story of this case. Rather, the story is the definitive proof Moussaoui's case provides that the U.S. governmentpre-PATRIOT Act, pre-NSA wiretaps and allhad and missed clear opportunities to stop 9/11. The FBI uniquely and repeatedly punted carefully gathered evidence of an attack in favor of adherence to bureaucratic hierarchies and power trips.

The testimony of FBI agent Harry Samit forever buries the quaint notion that 9/11 was unforeseen and unpreventable. Beginning with Moussaoui's August 16, 2001 arrest Samit mounted a global and indefatigable investigation of the man and concluded that an attack involving hijacked airplanes was imminent.

The flipside of Samit is Michael Rolince, former head of the FBI's International Terrorism Operations Section. Rolince is the man who previously deflected questions about the FBI's pursuit, or lack thereof, of pre-9/11 terror suspects with the line, "Would CNN have really aired their photos if we'd asked them?"

Rolince smugly insisted at trial that Samit's "suppositions, hunches and suspicions were one thing and what we knew" was another. Yet Rolince, in service of the government's desire to link Moussaoui to 9/11 and trigger the death penalty, also tried to argue that, had Moussaoui spilled his guts, everything would have changed. 9/11 might have been prevented. In short, Samit's investigation and leads were not enough; Moussaoui had to speak up for the FBI brass to hear anything.

When defense lawyer Edward MacMahon cross-examined Rolince, possibly the first and only time a government security official has been so challenged on 9/11, the disconnect between the official story and reality was plain. Rolince knew nothing of the August 18, 2001 memo Samit had sent to his office warning of terror links. In that memo, Samit warned that Moussaoui wanted to hijack a plane and had the weapons to do it. Samit also warned that Moussaoui "believes it is acceptable to kill civilians" and that he approved of martyrdom. Rolince testified he never read the memo.

On August 17 Samit sent an e-mail to his direct superiors at FBI headquarters recounting Moussaoui's training on 747 simulators. "His excuse is weak, he just wants to learn how to do it... That's pretty ominous and obviously suggests some sort of hijacking plan," Samit wrote.


Before his arrest, they didn't even want to investigate Zacarias Moussaoui.

Then, still before 911, the FBI wanted to deport Moussaoui.

It was only through the efforts of Ken Olberstar and another Democratic congressman that got the FBI to even LISTEN to their own people in Minneapolis.

Know your BFEE: The Stench of Moussaoui Permeates the Octopus

"Treason" may not be strong enough of word for Bush and his cronies.
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upi402 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 02:24 AM
Response to Original message
6. With no media reporting these vital facts and allegations
many Americans are confidently spouting the WH propaganda.
If people were given these facts, all but the zealots would ever forgive these evildoers.

Dang my google hurts.
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jonesn681 Donating Member (3 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 02:47 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. yeah
No doubt. I feel there is a psychology of fear when people claim they approve of GWB. They're cutting their losses at this point. They fear they will be labeled as active supporters of change if they present a logical inquiry for it, so rather they remain passive supporters of blind faith in indifference towards the consequences of the actions of Bush & Co.
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upi402 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 03:13 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. sweet spot comment : post#1 -welcome!
That first comment reads like hitting the ball in the sweet spot of the bat -or the club. Well put.

By "present" I assume you're saying "show" their questioning of the Republican line.
That's what I call getting sticky from painting one's self into the corner. It takes a change in psyche to get past the denial mechanism(s).

Tacit approval = indifference = betrayal of democracy when it is being raped.
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #7
12. Hi jonesn681!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #6
15. The NAZIs nor the commies have hurt the USA more than GW Bush.
The enemies of America were not able to do what George Walker Bush has accomplished:

1. The destruction of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.
2. The near-bankruptcy of the Treasury.
3. Pushed the U.S. Army to the breaking point.
4. Corrupted many of the nation's people to believing it's OK to invade innocent nations and kill innocent people.

Republicans don't need to take my word for it. Here's what a former GOP Assistant Secretary of the Treasury has to say about it:

Bush Has Achieved America's Demise

The Founding Fathers' country no longer exists

by Paul Craig Roberts
October 12, 2006

When does "collateral damage" so dwarf combatant deaths that war becomes genocide?

Bush's illegal invasion of Iraq has cost 655,000 Iraqis their lives. That is the conclusion of a study financed by the Massachusetts Institute of Technology's Center for International Studies and conducted by physicians under the direction of Johns Hopkins University epidemiologists. These are deaths over and above the pre-invasion mortality rate. Bush's illegal invasion raised Iraq's mortality rate from 5.5 deaths per 1,000 people per year to 13.3 deaths per 1,000 people per year. The study is published by the distinguished British medical journal, The Lancet, and is available on the journal's Web site <.pdf>.


When asked about the report, President Bush stated, "I don't consider it a credible report." Bush, of course, is not reality-based, and he knows that any unfavorable news is "enemy propaganda." That's what the neocons who pull his strings tell him, and that is what he believes.

What percentage of these 655,000 deaths were insurgents or "terrorists"? Probably 1 percent and no more than 2 percent. Bush's "war on terror" is, in fact, a war on Iraqi civilians.


The Bush regime is proceeding exactly as the Nazi regime proceeded. First, eliminate every person of conscience and integrity from the government. Second, redefine duty as service to the leader: "You are with us or against us" a formulation that leaves no place for duty to the U.S. Constitution. Patriotism is redefined from loyalty to country and Constitution to loyalty to the government's leader.

Americans are too inattentive and distracted to be aware of the grave danger that the neoconservative Bush regime presents to American liberty and to world stability. The neoconservative drive to achieve hegemony over the American people and the entire world is similar to Hitler's drive for hegemony. Hitler used racial superiority to justify Germany's right to ride roughshod over other peoples and the right of the Nazi elite to rule over the German people. Neoconservatives use "American exceptionalism" and "the war on terror." There is no practical difference. Hitler cared no more about the peoples he mowed down in his drive for supremacy than the neoconservatives care about 655,000 dead Iraqis, 100,000 disabled American troops, and 2,747 dead ones.


Until Bush's approval number is zero, we need to keep bringing these unpleasant facts up. Thanks for giving a damn, upi402.
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AntiFascist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #15
27. Excellent article Octafish!

The parallels between Hitler and Bush are starting to become uncanny, where will it end?
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Senator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
10. No ... They Terrorized the Nation ... into War Crimes
Keith Olbermann heroically "said it" in his most recent special comment.

But it needs to be actually said. Yes, it's important to say the actual words.

People think in words. People think he lied. People think all politicians lie. People think it's "normal."

Ergo, low impact.

If we all start saying it here and to anyone in earshot out there, it will become a meme.

Yes, this is a form of non-physical violence.

But, if we want our reality back and the necessary redemption of our national soul that only impeachment can bring...

...then, "Violence" Is The Answer.

(Yes, I keep reposting the same old journal post. But repetition is necessary too. Rage...rinse...repeat...result.)

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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. ''Intellectual Violence'' means telling the Truth
"In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -- George Orwell

Heckuva post, there, Senator:

The RoadMap to Impeachment: "Violence" is The Answer

Posted by Senator in General Discussion: Politics
Sun Mar 05th 2006, 01:26 AM

I've been asked to create a (votable) thread for this.

It is my reaction to the Harper's Magazine Impeachment event from Thursday night. I found the discussion there brought a specific problem into sharp relief:

We all know what needs to happen, but we seem at a loss for "how to make in so."

The original thread is here.

From Mr. Conyers's blog:

We had a rousing and informative evening last night in New York at the impeachment forum hosted by Harpers Magazine. ...

There was a lot of discussion about how impeachment should be presented, how we develop more support -- among Members and in the Media, and most importantly, where we go from here...

I have no doubt that not only would we take back the House and the Senate, but that we would be able to hold the Bush Administration accountable for their mistatements, misteps, and yes, their lies...

I think last night was a milestone. It was so gratifying to see all of our hard work in action outside the beltway...


Since I was lucky enough to be in attendance, I want to report that the most "rousing" part of the evening -- bringing the audience to their feet -- was the introduction of Mr. Conyers himself.

And while I'll agree that the event was a milestone, I must also agree with the lukewarm reaction of the Salon reporter. Mainly because there was very little from the panel on what Mr. Conyers identifies in his entry here as most important: "where we go from here."

And this is where I must take issue and be frank; because the "where" is not in question. Mr. Conyers held the "where" in his hand; a special committee to investigate charges. It is the "how" that is in question and "develop more support" is not specific enough to be actionable. While I don't claim to have any magic bullet, I would like to suggest where the discussion was lacking on this issue because I think these failures are pervasive (on the left) and, at least to some degree, correctable.

So is most important "how do we proceed?" No, MOST important is "what do we do about it right now!" And there is a big difference between those 2 phrases.

To illustrate I'll report the fuller context of Mr. Conyers's phrase (above) - "and yes, their lies." There was a well-received question from the audience lamenting that none of the panelists used the word "lied." The point needs to be well taken that we've all been trained to speak (and therefore think) in euphemisms; particularly those who speak publicly. Screaming "imminent conflagration" will not compel a movie house crowd to move to safety.

Former Congresswoman Holtzman illustrated a different failure. She remains convinced that "more information" can solve the problem. When enough people "know," they will rise up. Like many on the left, she refuses to accept the fact that only the "reality-based community" prizes knowledge above belief. We cannot "teach" our way to impeachment.

Mr. Lapham, after reading the Conyers report, has correctly concluded intellectually that there is a "slam dunk" case and that our nation is in peril. Therefore he politely lays the burden to act on the Congress, in their collegial, non-partisan capacity as oath-takers. (Insert your own joke/expletive here.)

Mr. Rattner is pursuing and recommends a "legal" solution. While it may be helpful to have the regime "found guilty" of some crime in some court, he urged to panel to focus on the most easily provable (already proven?) impeachable offense(s). He has published a cogent, precise brief of only the clearest violations. Thereby giving them less to fight back against?!?

And of course the entire evening was peppered to some degree with our usual rationalizations for inaction: "but we'll just get Cheney" -- "we must wait 'till we take the house" -- "what about electoral backlash." Not to mention the lobby talk about futility, being doomed, and confident pronouncements of "never gonna happen."

So, how do we overcome this -- what do we do right now?

Get violent. (Come again?!?) No, not physically violent. Rather intellectually, politically, and rhetorically violent. We are dealing with fascist thugs/cowards and must deal with them and their tactics accordingly. The public and euphemedia must be slapped to attention and our "leaders" and/or the perpetrators must be forced and/or frightened into action and/or surrender.

This violence is in self-defense. These people don't listen to reason. In fact, they pride themselves on their preference for "belief." Labels like theocracy, monarchy, totalitarian, and authoritarian are irrelevant -- it's all some form of fascism; the conviction that some minority has a right to rule the majority. Whether it's based on divine right, a master race, a family dynasty, or a power theory makes absolutely no difference.

It is Anti-American. And it needs to fought, not managed.

We need to make "violent use" of whatever means we have.

For nearly all of us that only means contact with "leaders" (in person, faxing, etc) and the euphemedia (emails, calls, LTTEs).
For bloggers, that means public assault (not polite differing). Particularly with those whose silence makes them complicit with this ongoing treason. (See -- just replicate.)

For those with benefit of a larger megaphone, media-related and political "leaders," that means risking the loss of that megaphone -- shouting the unvarnished truth then turning viciously on those who will (euphemistically) try to dismiss and dillute your message.
By ALL these means we must ALL do the same things:

We need to banish euphemisms. Period. In fact, we need to employ hyperbole when possible. But since "war crimes," "torture," and "terrorized the nation into war" are merely descriptive, it could be difficult to find hyperbole. We must try our best.

The simple fact is that a large segment of the public has been well-trained to ONLY hear such language; and worse to equate such anger/alarm with importance/urgency. Sad? Yes, but we must deal with it as it exists.
If you find yourself trying to be polite or subtle, or even just witty, stop it and just be blunt.
The regime DID NOT "sidestep," "ignore," "go around," or "flaunt." They DID NOT "overreach," "cross the line," or "display hubris." They BROKE THE LAW. They VIOLATED SWORN TREATIES. They SHREDDED THE CONSTITUTION. They COMMITTED WAR CRIMES.

We need to up the ante. Make them an offer they dare not refuse. Threaten. Blackmail. Whatever ugly word you want to put on it.

We must hand over for international prosecution those whose actions have warranted it. The torture and war crimes charges are "above our pay grade." We can expect zero moral standing in the world if we do not abide by the treaties these criminals have violated in our names. Redemption of our National Soul demands nothing less.
We will take the money back. Yes, the "tax kickbacks." Yes, the crony contracts. Yes, the not-so-blind trusts. Every penny we can find.
We will reverse ALL acts of this never-legitimate regime. All appointments. All legislation. All Executive Orders. We need to cleanse the social fabric of their contamination.

We must resolve to never stop. We will never "get over it." We must loudly declare that we will have our children take up this challenge if necessary. This will be our legacy.

Perhaps the largest applause (save Mr. Conyers intro) was in reaction to the statement that you don't have to still be in office to be impeached. We need to make it clear that this goes beyond election cycles. There is no short term attention span to hide in. We will impeach and convict them posthumously if necessary.
This is already true with Bully Bill Rhenquist. We must make clear that ALL crimes against the nation will be accounted for. This includes both stolen elections. The Felonious Five and all other perpetrators of anti-democratic, thereby Anti-American, acts will be accused, tried, and punished. No matter how long it take or how many resources it requires.

We cannot get lost in "legalisms," "strategies," or our usual "neuroses."

We waste far too much time and effort falling victim to "paralysis by analysis." It is irrelevant at this point what any ultimate impeachment charges may be lodged. ALL crimes and misdemeanors of the regime will need to be brought to bear. From the first Stolen Election to the latest Indian nuclear "free pass" debacle/PR stunt.
We must stop worrying about what "they do." Will they change the rules? Will there be backlash? Will they start jailing people? This obsession with the perpetrators is akin to a "battered syndrome." We must really let the chips fall where they may.
We must make EVERYTHING about impeachment. Don't be "anti-war," demand impeachment over the "criminal war." Don't be "pro-environment," demand impeachemnt over "defecating on our environment." Don't be "fiscally responsible," demand impeachment for "looting the nation." You get the idea -- don't you "issue wonks?"

That's it. Thanks for reading this far.

Now, let get on with it and FINISH THIS THING.

There really is no other moral or patriotic option.

Agree whole-heartedly. Thanks for sharing this, Senator.

"If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen." -- Samuel Adams
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
14. he certainly did

(a rose by any other name..)
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. Does treason cause insomnia?
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. A Case Of Treason
Larry Johnson, once a Republican, spells things out crystal-clear:

A Case Of Treason

Larry Johnson
October 06, 2005

Larry Johnson worked as a CIA intelligence analyst and State Department counter-terrorism official. He is a member of the Steering Group of Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS).

The investigation into who in the Bush administration leaked the fact that Valerie Plame, wife of former US Ambassador Joseph Wilson, was a CIA undercover operative, is nearing completion. Virtually lost in the recent spurt of press reporting is the fact that the compromise of Ms. Plame (and, as night follows the day her carefully cultivated network of spies) was unconscionable. Ms. Plame, a very gifted case officer, was a close colleague of mine at CIA. Her dedication and courage were clear in her willingness to assume the risks of an agent under non-official covermeaning that if you get caught, too bad, youre on your own; the US government never heard of you.

The supreme irony is that Plames network was reporting on the priority-one issueweapons of mass destruction. Thus, it was made abundantly clear to all, including potential intelligence sources abroad, that even when priority-one intelligence targets are involved, Bush administration officials will not shrink from exposing such sources for petty political purpose. The harm to CIA and its efforts to recruit spies willing to take risks to provide intelligence information is immense.

Shortly after the invasion of Iraq, Ambassador Wilson publicly exposed an important lie, and the president as liar, when he debunked the report that Iraq was seeking uranium in the African country of Niger. Still, as Wilson himself has suggested, the primary objective of leaking his wifes employment at CIA was not to retaliate against him personally, but rather to issue a stark warning to others privy to administration lies on the war not to speak out. Administration officials felt they needed to provide an object lesson of what truth tellers can expect in the way of swift retaliation.

All Based On A Forgery

Indictments or no, the mainstream media will continue to play down this key aspect of the story, andequally importantprescind completely from the event that started the whole businessthe forging of documents to feed the spurious report that Iraq was seeking uranium in Niger for its (non-existent) nuclear weapons program. Together with other circumstantial evidence, the neuralgic reaction of Vice President Dick Cheney to press reports that he was point man for promoting the bogus report suggests that he may also have been its founding father, so to speak. We do not rule out the possibility that he and his chief of staff Lewis Libby may have had a hand in commissioning the forgery, as a way to come up with an intelligence report with mushroom cloud written all over it, in order to deceive Congress into approving an unnecessary war.


Betrayal. There is no other word for it. Except, some might call it treason.


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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #14
20. Fascism: An American reality
Sometimes the truth hurts. It is my deepest hope it hurts TRAITORS.

Fascism: An American reality

By Larry Pinkney
Online Journal Contributing Writer
Jul 6, 2006, 01:07

The American Heritage Dictionary defines the word fascism as "a philosophy or system of government that is marked by stringent social and economic control, a strong centralized government usually headed by a dictator, and often a policy of belligerent nationalism." Moreover, and most importantly, it also defines fascism clearly and succinctly as "oppressive or dictatorial control." There are those who will sarcastically say that the political/social situation in and with America is not "that bad," when in fact things are far, far worse.


It is important not to be fooled by the feigned surprise on the part of some at the limited, tip-of-the-iceberg revelations about U.S. torture, internal spying by the U.S. government and corporations, the militarization of the judicial process, massive national voter disenfranchisement and the demonstrated de facto contempt by the U.S. government and corporations for the Black victims of Hurricane Katrina, etc. Substantively, virtually none of these systemic practices are new but now are integrally part and parcel of an increasingly blatant form of American fascism.

No matter what individual may be the nominal "leader" of the United States, or what political party -- Republican or Democratic -- is in power, fascism has undeniably become an American reality. No matter what name or under what guise America cloaks its fascist policies, the undeniable fact is: America's own style of fascism is a reality here and now.

It is no wonder that Austrian born Arnold Schwarzenegger demonstrated no compunction or inhibition whatsoever in repeatedly and openly expressing his "admiration" for German fascist leader Adolf Hitler before going on later to become the Republican Party's governor of the state of California (see "Events Related to Schwarzenegger.")

Moreover, there is no sustained and overwhelming outrage and incensed repudiation of Schwarzenegger from the leadership of either the Democratic or Republican parties regarding his arrogant and chilling admiration for a fascist leader who was directly responsible for the dehumanization and murder of millions of people. A distinctly American version of fascism has taken root in this nation, and has created a political climate wherein politicians can openly embrace with admiration past fascist leaders without seriously jeopardizing their own political careers.

Furthermore, other than as an increasingly obvious propaganda tool to further its global hegemonic objectives, America's cynical racism and hypocrisy has made a meaningless mockery of words and phrases such as democracy, legality, freedom, fair judicial process and justice. This is a reality which most of the peoples of the world outside of the United States have already acknowledged.


Our best weapon is the TRUTH. People who KNOW don't support these dunskys, unless they themselves are a traitor.
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AntiFascist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-01-06 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #20
40. What is scary is that there could be so many traitors....

Imagine if Schwarzeneggar decides to tap in to his admiration of Hitler once again. So many of Ahnold's followers are potential proto-fascists for the New Order.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 01:16 PM
Response to Original message
22. 25th R
You da MAN.....

The Poison Pill for the GOPer Enablers is the TRUTH
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. The Big Lie & The Reign of Error
If we can get the Congress into DEM hands, we will be able to investigate these liars, thieves, gangsters, mass-murderers and warmongers.

Honest investigations will reveal the traitors. That requires the truth.

The Reign of Error

by Paul Krugman
The New York Times, July 28, 2006

Amid everything else thats going wrong in the world, heres one more piece of depressing news: a few days ago the Harris Poll reported that 50 percent of Americans now believe that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction when we invaded, up from 36 percent in February 2005. Meanwhile, 64 percent still believe that Saddam had strong links with Al Qaeda.

At one level, this shouldnt be all that surprising. The people now running America never accept inconvenient truths. Long after facts they dont like have been established, whether its the absence of any wrongdoing by the Clintons in the Whitewater affair or the absence of W.M.D. in Iraq, the propaganda machine that supports the current administration is still at work, seeking to flush those facts down the memory hole.

But its dismaying to realize that the machine remains so effective.

Heres how the process works.

First, if the facts fail to support the administration position on an issue stem cells, global warming, tax cuts, income inequality, Iraq officials refuse to acknowledge the facts.

Sometimes the officials simply lie. The tax cuts have made the tax code more progressive and reduced income inequality, Edward Lazear, the chairman of the Council of Economic Advisers, declared a couple of months ago. More often, however, they bob and weave.

Consider, for example, Condoleezza Rices response a few months ago, when pressed to explain why the administration always links the Iraq war to 9/11. She admitted that Saddam, as far as we know, did not order Sept. 11, may not have even known of Sept. 11. (Notice how her statement, while literally true, nonetheless seems to imply both that its still possible that Saddam ordered 9/11, and that he probably did know about it.) But, she went on, thats a very narrow definition of what caused Sept. 11.

Meanwhile, apparatchiks in the media spread disinformation. Its hard to imagine what the world looks like to the large number of Americans who get their news by watching Fox and listening to Rush Limbaugh, but I get a pretty good sense from my mailbag.


Thanks for the kick, opihimoimoi!

Most importantly: Truly good to read ya, Opi. Been missing my Brud'.
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B Calm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 02:00 PM
Response to Original message
24. All for corporate oil interests and war profiteering corporations. How
sad for America and how embarrassing for us..
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 08:57 PM
Response to Reply #24
38. Iraq: 'The Greatest Strategic Disaster in American History'
W is for Warmongers. War profiteers. Wastrels.

Iraq: 'The Greatest Strategic Disaster in American History'

By Patrick Cockburn, AlterNet
Posted on October 31, 2006, Printed on October 31, 2006 /

The following is an excerpt from Patrick Cockburn's new book, The Occupation: War and Resistance in Iraq (Verso, 2006).

It has been the strangest war. It had hardly begun in 2003 when President George W. Bush announced on May 1 that it was over: the American mission had been accomplished. Months passed before Washington and London realized that the conflict had not finished. In fact, the war was only just beginning. Three years after Bush had spoken the US military had suffered 20,000 dead and injured in Iraq, 95% of the casualties inflicted after the fall of Baghdad.


The US failure in Iraq has been even more damaging than Vietnam because the opponent was punier and the original ambitions were greater. The belief that the US could act alone, almost without allies, was quickly shown to be wholly false. By the summer of 2004 the US military had only islands of control. The failure was all the worse because it was self-inflicted, like the British invasion of Egypt to overthrow Nasser in 1956. But by the time of the Suez crisis the British empire was already on its deathbed. The disaster only represented a final nail in its coffin. Perhaps the better analogy is the Boer War, at the height of the British imperial power, when the inability of its forces to defeat a few thousand Boer farmers damagingly exposed both Britain's real lack of military strength and its diplomatic isolation.

In many ways the guerilla war in Iraq resembled Vietnam. A year after it started I talked to US sappers with the highly dangerous job of looking for buried bombs, known as IEDs (Improvised Explosive Devices), usually several heavy artillery shells wired together and detonated by a long wire or by remote control. These so-called "convoy killers" were to prove a devastating weapon, causing half of US fatal casualties. The sappers explained they had received no training for the job. "I never heard of an IED before I came to Iraq," remarked one soldier. A sergeant said that he had with difficulty obtained an old but still valid US Army handbook, printed during the Vietnam war, about this type of bomb and the lethal booby traps often placed nearby to kill unwary sappers. He believed the army had not reissued the handbook, useful though it was, because doing so might appear to contradict the official line from the Pentagon that Iraq was not like Vietnam.

There should be no doubt about the extent of the US failure. General William Odom, the former head of the National Security Agency, the largest US intelligence agency, called it "the greatest strategic disaster in American history." Back in the US it took time for this to sink in. Right-wing commentators claimed that the good news about Iraq was being suppressed. US network news programs were edgy about reporting the bad news because they feared being accused of lack of patriotic zeal. The same inhibition hamstrung the Democrats during the presidential election in 2004.


Bush is a disaster for America and the world and the future of all humanity.
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bobthedrummer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
25. They were installed by SCOTUS, immediately purged as much
of the existing federal management (including our military and intelligence communities) with extreme ideological political appointees, ignored all the warnings about impending attacks from the real terrorists that BFEE had supported and armed, then lied (their natural language) and ignored all advice about the decider's WAR, did away with our economy, insulted our Constitution and Bill of Rights, disenfranchised many, committed crimes against humanity and war crimes using mercenaries and corrupted secretive units which has increased danger to Americans-well, yeah they lied big time and they are still lying.

The good thing is that the candlepower of the lights of truth about the BFEE have increased exponentially.

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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Shine a light on this...
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genie_weenie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
28. Nu Uh! He massaged us into war.
Rove et al correctly realized the american people would not support a war to realign the power structure of the Middle East to allow America to control the destiny of the area for the next 50 years with the adoption of client states pliable to American Foreign policy.

After all America has always been willing to sacrifice the dregs of society.
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HardRocker05 Donating Member (486 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 05:09 PM
Response to Original message
29. Yes, but the am. people wanted to be lied to; they wanted an excuse
Edited on Sat Oct-28-06 05:11 PM by HardRocker05
to lash out at any convenient middle eastern enemy after 9-11 and bush gave it to them. there was contradictory evidence all over the place from credible sources (even with the MSM attempt to black out all non-war-cheerleading information); any one who made even a cursory effort to investigate the grounds for war would have found this stuff, and millions did! Add this to the fact that it was obvious that BushCo wanted war so bad that they could taste it, this should have made the american people skeptical from the beginning and made them demand an extremely high level of proof of the need to enter in to a *first strike, pre-emptive war against an enemy that had not attacked us first!* i can't get all worked up about blaming bush, because the truth is that the vast majority of the american people and the congress were complicit in it. Would that it were not so.
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. A lot of ordinary America helped facilitate this nightmare. See post #30. J'accuse.
I want to see the regime pay. But I think there are others in the far lesser rank and file who shouldn't be allowed to completely walk away either.

We know of course they will. They will go on to blend back into the woodwork after the more prominent Nazi's are ousted. They will go on with their careers, their stock options, put their kids thru college, collect their pensions and retire in comfortable amnesia, as if they weren't a mundane but highly essential part of the virulent, lawless and immoral machinery.

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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 09:25 PM
Response to Original message
30. Facilitating Fascism. J'accuse.
Facilitating Fascism

J'accuse by Zbignew Zingh
copyleft 2006

What kind of doctors has the United States trained who stand by idly while prison guards force-feed prisoners in Guantanamo Bay with plastic pipes shoved down the noses of the shackled and tortured?

What kind of psychologists have we educated who assist the Pentagon inventing new ways to torture men and women, breaking their minds without breaking their skin; who help create government propaganda, plant false news stories, devise psy-ops to mislead us all?

What kind of lawyers are these who work for the Department of Justice, the Defense Department, the Pentagon or the White House, who waste their careers finding legal loop-holes justifying torture, deceit, eavesdropping and imprisonment without charge?

What manner of scientists, hardware and software engineers have we graduated who dedicate their intelligence and creativity to devising deadlier weapons, more secretive ways to snoop, and more innovative ways to kill?

What types of ministers, priests, rabbis, chaplains and reverends are these who mutter empty palliatives to their congregations, run through empty chants and mindless prayers and paeans to Love and Holiness in pursuit of a Life to Come, while today, right now, human carrion burns in their names, and naught do they do at all?

What types of writers, journalists, editors, reporters, actors, what types of men and women are these who slavishly say and write and do as they are told knowing that they spread lies and deception and blather?

Although this nation is led by a few, its actions are facilitated by many. We are the facilitators the professionals, the educated, the trained we are the ones whose skills and knowledge keep the whole machinery moving, the cogs oiled, the system operating smoothly. Without the collaboration of the entire class of facilitators, nothing happens. No invasions occur, no bombs drop, no one is tortured, no one is disappeared, no doublespeak is spoken. The minority of Leaders do not actually commit hands-on crimes. You will not find Mr. Rumsfeld's, Mr. Cheney's, Mr. Bush's fingerprints at the crime scenes in Iraq any more than you could find Mr. Kissinger's on the casket of Allende. The leaders lead, but their employees, the facilitator classes, do the deeds.

I deny that America is a land of fools. We all know. Everyone of us. What some do not know, they do not want to know. The myth of propaganda is that it imparts falsehoods to the people. The truth of propaganda is that it discovers the falsehoods that the people want to believe, and imparts it to them as they want it.

The hypnotist cannot hypnotize someone who is not willing.

The falsehoods disseminated by the Leaders and the Media are the alibis for the Many doing what they want to do anyway. Propaganda is the cover for the crime: We did not know what we were doing. We were deceived. We were dupes. We were fools. Therefore, we can profit and do what we do with a clear conscience.


There is no one in the educated world who cannot know the truth if s/he will know it.

The psychologists, lawyers, writers, reporters, ministers, scientists, engineers and doctors who deny the reality of the harm they do as employees and as gladiators-for-hire for this global empire would also deny the nose on their face.

The brightest minds on earth gave us the nuclear bomb... deployed by the dumbest, most venal minds on earth. Science and medicine and the law, in the service of military aggression, do not discover knowledge, heal or seek truth. Rather, they become weapons themselves, no better than cudgels wielded by cavemen. The scientist, doctor, psychologist, chaplain or reporter who sell their services, and their professional oaths, their professional creeds, their professional standards, for the sake of a Job, a Career and Security, do not deserve the name professionals. These are not real doctors, psychologists, lawyers or scientists who research on behalf of their clients and employers how better to harm people, how more efficiently to interrogate them, how more effectively to kill them, how to sell them more drugs, more lies and more harmful products, how to develop more intrusive technologies to probe private lives. They are prostitutes. They are mice. They are the facilitators of crime. They know it. We know it.


It is not endless polite protest and demonstrations - as and where permitted - that will stop war and aggression. Nor will socially responsible investing nor voting for Tweedle Dee or Tweedle Dum nor giving to charity nor meditating nor even publishing trivial little essays like this.

What puts a stop to all is when the majority of the facilitators of fascism the professionals, the psychologists, lawyers, doctors, writers, reporters, teachers, ministers, priests, rabbis, scientists and engineers decide, at last... if ever... to rebel against the employment that makes them well-salaried galley slaves rowing to the beat of a danse macabre.

Let there be Leaks.

Let there be breaks in the ranks.

Let there be Dissenters.

Let there evolve vertebrate professionals and the evolution of a new facilitator class. One with true professionalism. A facilitator class with class.

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Hamlette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 10:56 PM
Response to Original message
34. here's what I don't get, why would he lie about WMD when his lie would
be found out so quickly and easily?

Did he start to believe his own lies? Makes him pathological, doesn't it?
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-29-06 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #34
36. Pathologically eager to please the Bush Family Evil Empire...we've seen it
for decades, now.
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go west young man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-29-06 01:29 AM
Response to Original message
35. Let's not forget Katherine Gunn who went to jail in the U.K.
for trying to expose the bribing of U.N members before the war was started. And also Dr.David Kelly who mysteriously committed "suicide" after being exposed as someone who knew Blair was lying the U.K. into war. How about the way we tried to bribe Turkey before invading or the blatant disregard by our media of the fact that we had worked with Saddam throught the 80's and even supplied him with the Bell Huey helicopters he used to gas the Kurds through an "agricultural act".Our media is complicit and in the pocket of the liars who led us into an illegal and immoral war.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-29-06 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. Karma is a bitch...
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bobthedrummer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-01-06 04:32 PM
Response to Original message
39. The propaganda machine that used to be known as the free press
chipped in to repeat those lies-and what a corrupted system it has become at the decider's whim.

I ask those people that want the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth to demand that the propaganda machine be put to a better use now.

"Reality vs. perception management"
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