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Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (01/01/06 through 01/22/2007) Donate to DU
 
phrenzy Donating Member (941 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:05 PM
Original message
Revenge When We Take Back Power.
Yes. I want it. Use every tool the RW has exploited under the power of Shrub and turn it against them. Ten fold.

Where to start?

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tsuki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:06 PM
Response to Original message
1. No revenge. But I would like a general clean-up, beginning with
K Street.
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unblock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:07 PM
Response to Original message
2. search and seizure and probable declassification of presidential papers
Edited on Tue Jan-24-06 06:07 PM by unblock
i want every american to see what that bastard did. poppy, too.

ok, to SOME checking for LEGITIMATE national security, things that REALLY SHOULD be secret.

but release all the CRAP.

ALL OF IT.
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acmejack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #2
23. Poppy has buried the bodies!
The man is dirty, dirty, dirty!
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havocmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:07 PM
Response to Original message
3. Revenge will fuck us. Work for truth & justice
That is the worst payback we could give them anyway. Tit of tat just doesn't work.
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unblock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. game theory says "tit for tat and then forgiveness" is most effective
never you have to somehow punish the other guy but you can't escalate or carry a grudge.
a measured response is appropriate and necessary.

otherwise, they learn they sometimes gain but never lose by pulling that kind of crap.
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BillZBubb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #3
13. WRONG! Tit-for-Tat is the most successful strategy.
Buy a book on game theory. When more Democrats and progressives understand this, we will finally have a chance.
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Lori Price CLG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #3
48. We did that. Now, they're building detention centers for us! It's time
to treat this as a war, as Rove does. That's why the Reichwing wins every single battle, and mocks us.

Lori Price
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havocmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #48
51. I do treat it as war. And know the penalty of failing
Talking revenge is NOT how to get the people behind us.

Nobody who knows me would call me a doormat nor a shrinking violet. But I will not talk revenge. That is wasted energy and gives fuel to one's enemy.
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Avalux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:07 PM
Response to Original message
4. Nope.
I refuse to use their tactics, we only need the truth to take them down. Not interested in revenge, otherwise we are no better than them.
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mikelewis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #4
18. I agree...
I want the criminals to go to jail but other than that, I'd rather forgive these past 10 years or so. Revenge only leaves a nation hollow.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:30 PM
Response to Reply #18
25. IMO, Truth & Reconciliation Hearings might be best. People would have
more of an inclination to cooperate and spill their guts that way.
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #18
29. That is not revenge - that is justice.
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AZBlue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #4
40. Bingo!
Undo the tax cuts for the wealthy, prosecute the criminals, make sure all votes count, restore programs they greedily cut, provide health care coverage for the uninsured, get corporations out of our government, and clean up the messes they made domestically and internationally...but the minute the Dems lower themselves to the Reps' level, THAT'S when I leave the party!
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elehhhhna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:07 PM
Response to Original message
5. JUSTICE is not revenge, though it will seem so to them
Bring it on!
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NanceGreggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. Hear, hear!
Rescind all tax cuts to the wealthy, retroactively!

Slam Big Corporations with a bill for the taxes they SHOULD HAVE BEEN PAYING all along, retroactively!

Companies who have outsourced American jobs will not be allowed to sell their products in the United States!

Corporations who have cut wages of their workers while awarding themselves huge bonuses will RETURN every penny, to be distributed among the workforce - retroactively!

GOD, THIS IS FUN!!!!!

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Skeet Donating Member (44 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #12
42. I don't think that would work since ex post facto laws are
unconstitutional. But I guess this is just fantasy.
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tabasco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #5
24. That's the right answer.
Revenge is not a valid objective.

Justice is a valid objective. It will seem just the same to criminal republicans, who have robbed us and weakened our Nation.
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Salviati Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. We give them the truth, they think it's hell...
We'll give them justice, they'll think it's vengance
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BlueEyedSon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:09 PM
Response to Original message
7. Revenge, AND plug up all the holes in the system that enable neofascism.
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mandyky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:10 PM
Response to Original message
8. Oh gawd, please no more revenge
We have to unite and educate our citizens. If we take back Congress, we need to lead by example, not become as corrupt and mean-spirited as the GOP.
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hwmnbn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
9. hmmm, that's a close call.....
ummmm, let's see.......uh.......well.....

I WANT REVENGE for what they've put our country through. I want justice and restitution, call it what you will.
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
10. I was thinking we'd just shave all their heads
It worked for the French after WWII.

:shrug:

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maveric Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:13 PM
Response to Reply #10
37. I was just thinking that.
Imagine seeing Anne Coulter with a shaved head and swaztika painted on her forehead.
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:17 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. Doesn't she already have a swastika on her forehead?
Oops, nevermind. I'm always confusing her with Charles Manson...

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phrenzy Donating Member (941 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
11. Justice Must Be Done
What they have done to this country is unforgiveable. Once in power, we will need to use every tool possible to expose the crimes that have been committed against this country. There MUST be accountability.
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meganmonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #11
32. Justice and accountability are NOT the same as revenge. n/t
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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:19 PM
Response to Original message
14. Clean up their mess
reinstitute ALL articles and amendments to the Constitution. Make sure ALL elections are fair. THis isn't vengence-it is justice.
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Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:19 PM
Response to Original message
15. Change the flag to just blue and white
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Dave Reynolds Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:20 PM
Response to Original message
16. I think that whole "two wrongs do not make a right" thing
would be appropriate in this spot.
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NanceGreggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:26 PM
Response to Reply #16
21. How about the "Too Many Wrongs Do Make a Right-Winger" ...
Edited on Tue Jan-24-06 06:27 PM by NanceGreggs
... thing?

There are too many Republicans who, under the auspices of their beloved leader, have DAMAGED my country -- yes, MY country, not THEIRS.

The past five years have not been 'politics as usual', with one side snapping at the other.

You don't let TRAITORS walk away at the end of their tenure, with a wave of the hand and a, "Let's let bygones be bygones."

As someone posted above, setting JUSTICE back on track is not REVENGE -- it will just SEEM LIKE IT to the deserving people who will get their just desserts ...
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Dave Reynolds Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #21
28. Justice, yes.
Revenge, no. Revenge dressed as justice, no.
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NanceGreggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #28
30. Where would the injustice be?
I posted (above) what I would like to see done. Forcing corporations and Bush cronies to pay back the taxes they've gotten away with is not revenge, it's justice.

Not allowing US corporations that outsource American jobs to sell their wares in-country - again, fair's fair.

Bringing charges of treason against those who LIED us into a war that has cost innocent lives, and has depleted the country's coffers of TAXPAYERS' dollars, those who sold their political favours for money, those who manipulated our voting machines so that the will of the people was thwarted -- no, not revenge. Justice.
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BillZBubb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:21 PM
Response to Original message
17. Start by reigning in the corrupt right wing media.
Bring back the fairness doctrine. Force the corporate media whores to honestly report instead of parroting the RNC line. Cut back on the size of media conglomerates. Etc.
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1620rock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:26 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. String them up by their heels and burn down their houses.....
...and then salt the earth where they stood that nothing shall ever grow there! :mad:
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Gidney N Cloyd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:23 PM
Response to Original message
19. Job One: Figure out where all the money went.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:25 PM
Response to Original message
20. It depends if we can get revenge
with a rightwing ideological court (though it will force them into a quandry about the "unitary executive" part.
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ToolTex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 06:39 PM
Response to Original message
26. I doubt that power can be taken back in our lifetimes.
Why should they give it up? They hold the cards. After Alito is installed they will hold ALL the cards. We won't get back to even, let alone control. Quit being silly, our democracy has been lost.
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meganmonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:05 PM
Response to Original message
31. Rise above it, man
Really. Revenge is a dark, dark thing.
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cascadiance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:06 PM
Response to Original message
33. I want CORRECTIVE tax rates on the wealthy!
Bring back the top marginal rates before JFK lowered them in the 60's!
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mitchum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:07 PM
Response to Original message
34. Up against the wall
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upi402 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:11 PM
Response to Original message
35. YES, anything else is seen as weakness by prison mentality neocons
And they always always always exploit our "make-nice" weakness.

Time to wear a mit and cup and use a bat, when playing hardball.
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Fire Walk With Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:11 PM
Response to Original message
36. We need a check and balance against corrupt lawmakers.
Everything Abramoff (sp) supported should be immediately negated, for example.

Somehow, this sort of legal trash remains and festers. It should be tossed immediately. This is something we can try to make happen right now.
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LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:14 PM
Response to Original message
38. Hypocracy. We've been decrying all these tactics
Why? Because the Republicans were using them, or because they were wrong? If only because the Republicans were using them, then that's not what I've been fighting for. Because they were wrong? Then why would we want to be wrong?

So then, when the Dems become as corrupt as the Repubs, and the Repubs take power again, they exact revenge in return.

I'd hate for someone to tell me that's what's been going on all along. Did the Dems use thses tools before? Is that why the Republicans use them now? And then we use them. And then they use them. Whoopie. :sarcasm:

Surely not.

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Throd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 07:59 PM
Response to Original message
41. Someone has to be the adult
Revenge is very tempting to be sure, but it can be very self-destructive. I remember a few instances in my life when people who had wronged me expected revenge. Had I taken such revenge they could have then donned the cloak of "victimhood" therefore justifying whatever they had done in the first place. The best route is to dismantle any mechanisms that have been used unfairly against you when you have the ability to do so.
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upi402 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #41
44. Geez, but that's why we get our ass kicked
by these thugs.
We better learn from the pain cuz these bullies do not operate on the same plane as we would like to.
They nave only gotten worse, more emboldened by out restraint.
Prison mentality.

Time to face the circumstances and deal with it as it is.
Not as we would feel good about ourselves doing it.
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Throd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #44
49. Bloodied but unbowed...
I'm just sayin' I have some heavy regrets concerning how I retaliated against some people in my past. I used to be a violent idiot. Now I'm still an idiot but have lost my appetite for violence.

Let me rephrase and say that any retaliation within the law would be okay. Its when people start to advocate means beyond that is when I get off the bus.

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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 08:50 PM
Response to Original message
43. Where to start?
With yourself. I say that respectfully.
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foreigncorrespondent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 08:57 PM
Response to Original message
45. Revenge is too right wing like!
Who wants to turn into them?

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RandomKoolzip Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 09:05 PM
Response to Original message
46. That's the thing; THEY think they're getting revenge on US
Edited on Tue Jan-24-06 09:05 PM by RandomKoolzip
right now. The rightists see the stripping away of government programs, the gratuitous buildup of the defense industry, the repeal of environmental protections, the eventual death of Roe v. Wade, etc. as revenge for the 60's. For whatever reason, the 60's really traumatized these people, and their every move, every piece of legislation, every thunderous speech, is a reactionary gesture to the social changes the underclasses demanded and won back then. They see Bush's reign as Divine Retribution to the progress the past decades have brought.

So when we plan "revenge," remember: they're seeing US as the antagonists in this scenario (even though we're not.)
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 09:07 PM
Response to Original message
47. Start With Not Being Vindictive, And Restoring Integrity.
We shouldn't want to take back power just to become just like them but on the winning side of the evil. That is just counter-productive to ALL that we are doing here and quite simply wrong.
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 10:20 PM
Response to Original message
50. No revenge. Just get back governance and run things well. And help
people. And sit back and let the intellectuals disect the rats. So humanity can learn ... one more time.. about the personality types who should never be alloud power.

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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 10:30 PM
Response to Original message
52. I WANT JUSTICE!!!
I want justice for the murder for my fellow Americans WHO DIED, and were MAIMED FOR LIFE, and were left HOMELESS AND DESTITUTE because of this administration.

To those who support these neo-Nazis: WARNING!

Justice will be HARSH! It will feel a lot WORSE than revenge, AND we will NEVER LET YOU FORGET WHAT YOU DID TO AMERICA FOR AS LONG AS YOU LIVE!!! :grr:


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bluestateguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-24-06 10:32 PM
Response to Original message
53. We're going to have so much fun with the Patriot Act and the NSA spying
Heh, heh, heh....
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