C-SPAN: Democrats press conference on Lobbying and Ethics Reform - Live

[RSchewe]

Tune in...

[FreedomAngel82]

1. Yay!

I love the music.

[liveoaktx]

166. A few VIDEO and AUDIOS from that on CanOFun

AUDIO- Reid speech-entire

AUDIO- Louise Slaughter-entire

VIDEO-Reid Snippett compares RNC to Mob

VIDEO- Obama Lobbying Reform -who really runs the government

[LSK]

2. got it on n/t

[TahitiNut]

3. Reid: "Culture of Corruption" ... addresses K-Street Project first!

Go Harry. Equates it to Organized Crime! Good!

[Beaverhausen]

4. thanks

:hi:

[helderheid]

5. he sounds pissed - it's great! K&R

[rocktivity]

6. It's on C-Span radio, too

Good news for cube rats with firewall problems!

LOL Reid says he'll put Leiberman against Santorum any day of the week!

:woohoo:
rocknation

[RSchewe]

7. "The infamous - You are doing a good job Brownie" haha n/t

[babylonsister]

8. I could get used to that phrase 'culture of corruption'! Nom! nt

[cyberpj]

25. All Dems should be using it loud and often, I agree. And seems they are.nt

[Beaverhausen]

9. Obama!

[Beaverhausen]

Love the backdrop- HONEST LEADERSHIP, OPEN GOVERNMENT

[Pacifist Patriot]

62. Great slogan. Now act on it folks! Every single Democratic candidate

needs to use that in their campaign for November and then follow through dammit.

[helderheid]

10. kick!

[LSK]

11. so thats every democrat in the house?

[Habibi]

12. Anybody see Hillary?

Is she there?

[oasis]

33. Hill has temporarily strayed from the plantation.

;-)

[Horse with no Name]

129. self delete

Sorry

[radio4progressives]

136. Yeah, I saw her - she was on the far right side of the screen..

I'm glad we had a chance to hear Slaughter, because i couldn't place her name before - and my goddess she was GRREAAT!!

Hillary get's plenty of lime light, and there's a real danger of not highlighting others who have served with honor and dedication but with little to no name recognition.. i thought it was appropriate to have Slaughter from Up State New York be a spokesperson in this event.

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

13. cable coverage

fox - no

msnbc - yes

cnn - briefly then ed henry tells us what reid is saying

[Roxy66]

15. MSNBC NO!! now

[liveoaktx]

17. I really hate that... I want to hear firsthand, not have it regurgitated

by some guy who wants to justify his job and existence

[cyberpj]

29. I'll bet cspan replays it tonight. Especially if other Dems speak as well

[Pacifist Patriot]

31. Must filter. God forbid we hear it from the horse's mouth.

[Roxy66]

14. This is good!!!!

[TahitiNut]

16. Pelosi's 'oratorical skills' drive me up a wall.

Why can't she say it without fumbling, "uh explaining", digressing, and "er" stumbling? It's like she's reading it for the first time -- fresh from a staffer. What's written is written language, not spoken language. Anyone with any speech-writing skills whatsoever should know the stylistic preferences of the speaker and write for the speaking style of that speaker.

[Roxy66]

28. I know..I like her, but I cant stand it when she fumbles around

[Roxy66]

30. Obama will hit it home!!

[TahitiNut]

39. He, at least, seems a bit more polished in his speaking skills.

He tends to be more stilted and formal than I'm comfortable with ... but he delivers.

[Pacifist Patriot]

38. Agreed. Honestly, I don't particularly care for Reid's talking style...

either. But I have to confess ministerial bias.

[TahitiNut]

43. Harry tends to be overly 'reflective' ... ponder-us in a sense.

To much air and not enough punch in his style.

[cyberpj]

93. Agreed. But I'll take her heart and intentions. Our bodies have flaws.

[TahitiNut]

120. True. My heart is still in the Bay Area. Mike Honda was my Representative.

Mike Honda has almost no oratorical skills ... he's more comfortable one-on-one and in small groups. He's got more heart and integrity than any representative I've ever met or even heard of. I NEVER had a better representative. Not ever.

[ProfessorGAC]

140. I Find It Objectionable Too

It's one of the reasons i can't stand to listen to Silverspoon. He's incapable of uttering a cogent thought without stumbling. She makes it look like it's an epidemic.
The Professor

[rocktivity]

18. Pelosi: Oil companies make "historic and obscene" profits

The Republican have turned Congress into an auction house!

:bounce:
rocknation

[madokie]

21. Go for it dems, the jugular

[cyberpj]

19. Is Lieberman there? Isn't he working with McCain & Santorum on this?

[babylonsister]

37. Yes, Liebermann is there and was mentioned by Reid. nt

[FreedomAngel82]

46. Good!

How about Hillary? He was at the SS rally too and she was as well.

[babylonsister]

53. Don't know about Hil. nt

[oasis]

20. "No more Halliburtons" Pelosi says. (eom)

[helderheid]

22. NO MORE HALLIBURTONS!! We need another recommend!

[sabra]

26. done

[babylonsister]

23. No More Halliburtons! nt

[LSK]

24. ending no-bid contracts

"No more Halliburtans"

"Browning wasnt doing a heck of a job"

[Pacifist Patriot]

27. Halliburton and Brownie in less than 90 seconds. Great stuff!

[helderheid]

32. fantastic!!

[cyberpj]

34. Obama speaks!

[RSchewe]

35. Obama is up... n/t

[helderheid]

36. *swoooooooooooooooooon*!

[babylonsister]

40. LOL! Ditto! nt

[Pacifist Patriot]

41. double *ssswwwwooooonnnn*

[cyberpj]

44. He's not only brand new and squeaky clean, but he's seen it all in Chicago

no doubt.

[cyberpj]

47. Abramhoff, Scanlon, K-Street are Republican sins and Republican sins alone

THAT'S A SOUND BYTE THAT WILL PLAY WELL.

[Roxy66]

42. Go Obama!!!

[Pacifist Patriot]

45. "corruption far worse than we could have imagined" ...

"shocked by...." I love the fact that Obama is hitting home on the scale of the problem.

"Republican sins alone!" He is so smart to point out that Democrats are not flawless, but this is just egregious and Republican.

[babylonsister]

48. Yes, Barack! (Abramoff) Sins are REPUG sins! nt

[Twist_U_Up]

49. Is Bob Barr there ?

nobody has seen him anywhere else

:wtf: :shrug: :sarcasm:

[Pacifist Patriot]

51. Why won't anyone listen to me? I told you the GOP operatives

have him duct taped to his bedroom wall.

[helderheid]

50. Republican sins and Republican sins ALONE re: Abramoff!

[Pacifist Patriot]

54. "morally repugnant legislation" Beautiful!

[Catherine Vincent]

52. Barak Obama...

I want to have your baby!

:P

[Pacifist Patriot]

58. LOL!

[helderheid]

59. oh.. to have a uterus again!! :)

[gkhouston]

75. you could have fun pretending...

"why Mr. Obama, I have no idea why it's taking so many attempts to make this work." ;-)

[helderheid]

114. LMAO!!!

[babylonsister]

60. Fitz might get mad. Just sayin'... nt

[helderheid]

64. LOL

[Catherine Vincent]

73. LOL!

No he won't. I can handle both! :hi:

[madokie]

55. This is too good, go obama

[rocktivity]

56. OBAMA'S ROCKING THE MIC!

Is this scandal bipartisan? though Dems are not without sin, K street, Scanlon, and Delay are Repub scandals alone!

Mentions secret energy meetings!!!!

:headbang:
rocknation

[Pithy Cherub]

69. Obama is being very articulate!

:applause:

[cyberpj]

57. While they talk about no-bids, runaway profits, big money... will they

talk about offshore accounts?

and missed US taxes?

WHEN WHEN WHEN...

[madokie]

61. Just to be talking, is great. Big Al then Hill now this woohoo

[cyberpj]

68. Agreed.

[babylonsister]

63. 'Our friends on the other side of the aisle have found religion...

and I think that's commendable!" :rofl: :rofl:

[Pacifist Patriot]

65. I choked on my coffee on that one.

[No DUplicitous DUpe]

72. I'm still laughing! Brilliant! N/T

[cyberpj]

66. Obama is a perfect front man for this. And SO WELL SPOKEN.

[Twist_U_Up]

67. Wheres this being held ?

How did they get a venue ? Did they have to pay ? And why isn't Fox covering this ? :sarcasm:

[babylonsister]

70. Library of Congress, I think. nt

[Pacifist Patriot]

71. LOL! Fortunately they still have access to the Library of Congress.

The personnel at Fox are busily figuring out how to spin this. They are getting positively breathless and dizzy. Here's hoping they pass out.

[babylonsister]

82. LOL!

:thumbsup:

[Twist_U_Up]

86. Rep. Slaughter taking MOBSTERS

Whoa shes got the gloves off. Talking bombs and shit but she aint flinchin. Nice !! She fears for our Democracy.

Dems meet Spine :bounce:

[Pacifist Patriot]

74. Slaughter is a hoot. Sheesh, I know she's from New York but she

sounds like my grandmother from Georgia. Weird!

[cyberpj]

76. "They don't call me Slaughter for nothing!" nt.

[Pacifist Patriot]

80. Another mention of the secret energy policy meetings!

[helderheid]

79. noticed that too

[Pacifist Patriot]

90. Small world! You know my grandmother too? ;-)

[rocktivity]

Slaughter: "Shameful...degradation...

Lobbyist write bill that hurt Americans...care only about enriching themselves...endangered safety of our troops...money has disappaered into a black hole...attempt to kill medicare...whoo hoo!

:headbang:
rocknation

[Pacifist Patriot]

77. Whoa! Did you hear those growth numbers in lobbyists since Clinton

left office? Holy shit!

[gkhouston]

83. and heavily, HEAVILY Republican. Used to be the lobbying

action was prettily even split between parties.

[babylonsister]

78. Waxman looks like he's getting a big fat kick out of this; nice

to see him smiling for a change.

[Pacifist Patriot]

84. Who is over Slaughter's left shoulder?

[babylonsister]

89. I don't know; I don't recognize her either. nt

[Pacifist Patriot]

I want to know if Bill Nelson is there.

[Twist_U_Up]

111. Ummmm

someone told me it was his turn to keep an eye on Barr.

[Pacifist Patriot]

117. LOL!

[bettyellen]

81. i give dean total credit for getting people on message this week.

:applause:

[LSK]

87. they are on message and on the ATTACK!

[cyberpj]

105. That's just what I was thinking too. Good Job! Will we add Alito? nt.

[SharonRB]

108. This is fabulous

They're all on message -- House and Senate together. I have goosebumps listening to them. Let's just hope they can pass their legislation.

:hi:

[LSK]

85. energy policy written by lobbyists

[Roxy66]

88. Slaughter is going for the jugular!!!

[helderheid]

92. Bill intended to KILL MEDICARE!

[suffragette]

100. Yeah for Slaughter for pointing that out.

Absolutely agree with her.

Edit for typo

[gkhouston]

106. and such good timing, as many seniors are just now finding out

how extensively they've been screwed. Glad my Mom had the option (and the sense) to stay with a private plan associated with Dad's pension.

[Roxy66]

95. I am Laughing so hard....she is a crack up!!....

[Pacifist Patriot]

101. I realize their topic today is congressional corruption but....

it sure would be nice if they at least mentioned Gore's comments about a criminal executive.

[rpgamerd00d]

109. Damn, she is kicking ass! I love her subtle southern accent.

That has to have a subliminal psychological effect on the red states.

[LSK]

91. prescription drug bill intended to kill medicare

[bettyellen]

103. same as social security.....

[babylonsister]

94. AUDACITY to try to export democracy abroad while killing it here

at home! :wow:

[helderheid]

96. Spreading "democracy" abraod while killing it here in Washington!

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOT!

[helderheid]

110. makin' me soooooo proud

[bettyellen]

97. exporting democracy while killing it here at home...

go slaughter!

[flpoljunkie]

98. There can be NO REAL REFORM w/o banning lobbyists from holding fundraisers

That is fundraisers for members of Congress! I do not see that the Democrats have recommended this as part of their HONEST LEADERSHIP ACT.

Correct me, if I am wrong. I would love to be wrong!

End the campaign money chase

Attack the root of the problem: The campaign money that makes lobbyists and the contributions they solicit from their clients so invaluable.

As long as congressional races costs hundreds of thousands, and sometimes millions of dollars, elected officials will rely on lobbyists to help them raise the campaign cash they need. Jack Abramoff and his lobbying colleagues raised more than $5.3 million from their clients, including a few Indian tribes, and gave to 364 federal candidates between 1999 and 2004, according to The Washington Post. All these millions gave Abramoff unprecedented power and access, and put the priorities of his clients above the priorities of the average American.

Common Cause long has advocated clean campaigns for federal and state elections, permitting candidates to run for office, agree to voluntary spending limits, and receive public funds for their races. In 1974, the Watergate scandal spurred Congress to create the Presidential Public Financing system. This year, a scandal spurred Connecticut to approve public financing for its state executive and legislative races. The Abramoff scandal should be the catalyst for enactment of publicly-funded campaigns for Members of Congress, and a revamped and strengthened public financing program for presidential campaigns.

http://www.commoncause.org/site/pp.asp?c=dkLNK1MQIwG&b=196480

[flpoljunkie]

137. Duers: Remember what Gore said in his speech Monday...

Those of us who have served in the Senate and watched it change over time, could volunteer an answer to Senator Byrd's two questions: the Senate was silent on the eve of war because Senators don't feel that what they say on the floor of the Senate really matters that much any more. And the chamber was empty because the Senators were somewhere else: they were in fundraisers collecting money from special interests in order to buy 30-second TV commercials for their next re-election campaign.

http://www.tpmcafe.com/story/2005/10/5/14301/6133

Those fundraisers were no doubt, being held by lobbyists!

[rocktivity]

99. Slaughter: Repubs "exporting democracy abroad

while killing it at home1"

:headbang:
rocknation

[Pacifist Patriot]

107. "We throw the gauntlet down today." Sweet!

Why does my phone keep ringing? I missed the exporting comments.

[LSK]

102. citizens sold out for gifts

[gkhouston]

116. OUCH. That's gonna stick. n/t

[babylonsister]

104. Report due out soon: America for Sale, pointing out all that's been

going wrong with the house. Sounds like a titillating read!

[MelissaB]

112. Standing ovation in my family room for Slaughter!

:applause:

[Pacifist Patriot]

113. Declaration of Honest Leadership?

[cyberpj]

115. All signing The Declaration of Honest Leadership and Open Government

They could have chosen a snappier title...

But its A REALLY PRETTY PICTURE and energy.

[babsbunny]

121. Will this really stand?

Can the Repubs stop this???

[gkhouston]

123. they'll damn sure try

they are in deep shit with this one if the Dems hammer on this message.

[cyberpj]

134. I think the Repubs just submitted their own, this morning. nt.

[Roxy66]

118. This is history is the making..I'm crying!!

[madokie]

119. Louise Slaughter is awesome, today we throw the gauntlet down

[cyberpj]

122. Delawarean here -- still looking for Biden. Will have to call him. nt.

[madokie]

126. Can you believe what we are witnessing today, hell this week

[Pacifist Patriot]

135. I am of two minds.

Thank heavens!

and

What took you so long?

[cyberpj]

142. Well said. nt

[helderheid]

124. Hoorah!! :)

[Roxy66]

125. OBAMA for President...and Slaughter for VP!!

[madokie]

127. That has a good sound to it.

just heard Louise is to be on wj tomorrow morning

[Pacifist Patriot]

133. Nope!

Slaughter for President / Obama for VP ;)

[ClayZ]

128. This was GREAT!

Good for the Dems!

[radio4progressives]

130. I have to say, this was a proud moment...

I really really like the Declaration for an Honest Governement, is so MUCH MORE ON POINT than the Lizard's so called 'Contract ON America' ..

:applause:

[RSchewe]

131. Very nicely presented and orchestrated, now I want to see the details.

CREW has some good points on what needs to be added.

CREW QUESTIONS EITHER PARTY’S COMMITMENT TO REAL ETHICS AND LOBBYING REFORM

OVERSIGHT AND ENFORCEMENT MECHANISMS ABSENT FROM PROPOSALS

"...pieces missing from both parties’ proposals are limitations on the use of appropriations earmarks, restrictions on the employment of Members’ spouses and children, and restrictions on the use of corporate jets. Further, the Democrats have failed to include an important provision stripping pensions away from Members of Congress who are convicted of crimes related to their official actions."

http://www.citizensforethics.org/press/newsrelease.php?view=101

[flpoljunkie]

139. Dems also neglected to ban lobbyists from holding fundraisers for them!

A biggie, if we are to really clean up the "culture of corruption" in Washington. Remember what Gore said in his speech on Monday...

Those of us who have served in the Senate and watched it change over time, could volunteer an answer to Senator Byrd's two questions: the Senate was silent on the eve of war because Senators don't feel that what they say on the floor of the Senate really matters that much any more. And the chamber was empty because the Senators were somewhere else: they were in fundraisers collecting money from special interests in order to buy 30-second TV commercials for their next re-election campaign.

http://www.tpmcafe.com/story/2005/10/5/14301/6133

Those fundraisers were no doubt being held by lobbyists!

[flpoljunkie]

141. Even CNN has figured it out! "NEITHER PARTY WILL FORBID LOBBYISTS HOLDING

fundraisers for members of Congress" and "delivering those campaign checks" which Gore told us in his speech on Monday are used to pay for those 30 second TV ads.

[cyberpj]

143. That was quick. Perhaps the noting of it can help it happen. nt

[Pacifist Patriot]

144. I'm off to write the Democrats and find out why.

[flpoljunkie]

145. It's even worse than I thought...

From Common Cause, Ethics in Government:

Prohibit registered lobbyists from acting as fundraisers and campaign treasurers for federal elected officials. According to the Center for Public Integrity, 79 Members of Congress have named lobbyists to serve as treasurers of their campaign committees. Hundreds more lobbyists have become effective fundraisers for presidential campaigns, pulling in contributions from clients or corporate political action committees. Indeed, Abramoff raised $100,000 for the Bush campaign in 2004 and was designated a Pioneer. Lobbyists raise campaign funds because they want to become indispensable to people in power, knowing that the services they perform will be rewarded by the access and influence they gain.

http://www.commoncause.org/site/pp.asp?c=dkLNK1MQIwG&b=...

[cyberpj]

147. WHOA! I think this info deserves it's own thread. Pass the info

and all that.

Wow.

[flpoljunkie]

148. Look at this thread. Folks too excited about Dems' plan to notice.

I think they will realize it eventually. CNN has reported on it. Ed Henry just said the Democrats are talking about "ending congressional dependence on lobbyists" while at the same time they, along with the Republicans, "will still take those $1,000 checks from lobbyists."

This is because neither party's reform plans will prohibit lobbyists from holding fundraisers for them. Some lobbyists, Center for Public Intergrity reports the number at 79, actually serve as their campaign treasurers!

[sandnsea]

132. Absolutely Outstanding!!

I could just kiss Louise Slaughter. She was straight-up and tough as nails, and not one overstatement or misstep. Just awesome. I'm going to have to watch her on Lehrer tonight too. I hope they keep it rolling.

[flpoljunkie]

149. Please read my post #139, sandnsea, and the several that follow it.

The Democrats' plan will not clean up the "culture of corruption" in Washington as long as lobbyists are allowed to hold fundraisers and even serve as members' campaign treasurers. The Dems plans does nothing to stop this.

[sandnsea]

150. I refuse to participate in this bullshit

If you're so perfect, go run a campaign and get elected and fix it all yourself. I am sick of those who pick apart every single good thing that happens. There isn't even a piece of legislation yet, just a general outline. Just stifle for once and let our leadership lead.

[flpoljunkie]

151. Boy, are you deluded! If lobbyists can still pass out $1k campaign checks

to Democrats and Republicans--they own them, not us.

A third major area -- campaign finance laws -- would go untouched, an omission that amounts to a gaping loophole in efforts to distance lobbyists from the people they are paid to influence.

Anything that members of Congress can now do in the pursuit of money for their reelections will still be permitted in the future -- including accepting lobbyist-paid travel and in-town meals -- unless campaign finance laws are altered.

"Political contributions are specifically exempted from the definition of what a gift is in House and Senate gift rules," said Kenneth A. Gross, an ethics lawyer at Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom. "So, unless the campaign finance laws are changed, if a lobbyist wants to sponsor an event at the MCI arena or on the slopes of Colorado, as long as it's a fundraiser it would still be fine."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/17/AR2006011701311.html

[sandnsea]

152. No, I'm not deluded

I would just have to jump off a cliff if I were as negative as you are. Today was a great day for Democrats. It's sad you can't take one day to help Democrats get their message for change out. Like so many of us have said, Democrats have a message. If you don't like it, maybe you're just not in the right party.

[flpoljunkie]

153. What the Democrats did today will not change the "culture of corruption"

in Washington. The Democrats' message today was we are not serious about cleaning up the system and making it work for us, we the people. Instead, they chose to line up with the Republicans and support only superficial reform. They have again missed a golden opportunity to differentiate themselves from Republicans.

Do you think a Congressman can be bought for a $50 meal? No. But they can be influenced by the same lobbyists who hold fundraisers for their campaigns, and neither party is talking about changing this. Meals are not the problem. As James Carville might say, "It's the fundraising, stupid!"

I am a lifelong Democrat, and I would like my party to take the lead and really clean up this rotten system we now have. How about you?

[sandnsea]

154. No

I'll take it the way it is as opposed to ripping it apart, thread by thread. You knock yourself out though.

[flpoljunkie]

156. Wake up. Gore got it right in his speech on Monday.

Those of us who have served in the Senate and watched it change over time, could volunteer an answer to Senator Byrd's two questions: the Senate was silent on the eve of war because Senators don't feel that what they say on the floor of the Senate really matters that much any more. And the chamber was empty because the Senators were somewhere else: they were in fundraisers collecting money from special interests in order to buy 30-second TV commercials for their next re-election campaign.

http://www.tpmcafe.com/story/2005/10/5/14301/6133

Those fundraisers were no doubt being held by lobbyists!

Our system is broken. The Dems plan does nothing to address this. Harry Reid admitted it when Jim Leher asked him tonight about this gaping "fundraising loophole" in both parties' reform plans.

[sandnsea]

157. Lobbyists aren't just corporate

They include the ACLU, Sierra Club, NAACP, LCV, NARAL, NOW, etc etc etc. I bet the Green Party even has lobbyists, and Greenpeace and even PETA. Do you really think a lobbyist who works with one of these groups on a campaign email is doing something illegal that needs to be stopped?

[flpoljunkie]

159. Of course, not. What a silly question.

No one is saying that people should not have a right to petition their government through lobbyists, but letting lobbyists serve as fundraisers and campaign treasurers for members of Congress' campaigns raising the huge amounts of money necessary to run those 30-second TV ads Gore spoke about--corrupts the system and serves the special interests, i.e, pharmaceutical companies HMO's, Exxon-Mobil--not than the public interest.

I think we can agree on this.

[sandnsea]

160. What about these ads??

http://www.msastrategies.com/adsissue.html

What do we do about these guys lobbying for stem cell research? Shouldn't they be able to gather together 10 or 20 stem cell advocates, and Michael J Fox and Dana Reeves and whoever else and raise a bunch of money to get politicians elected.

Or, maybe McMahon is just getting paid by some fat pharmaceutical to get a bunch of federal money and stem cell research really is just another boondoggle. He was a staffer at one point, after all.

[flpoljunkie]

161. What about them? Aren't these legal "issue" ads?

Lobbying reform will accomplish little if the proposed rules to limit lobbyists' influence can be circumvented simply by the lobbyist holding a fundraiser for the member of Congress-- as campaign contributions are not considered "gifts." Voila!

Lobbying reforms that do not address this issue make both parties' promises to "clean up the culture of corruption" in Washington, a hollow promise, indeed.

[sandnsea]

162. So

Those issue ads are paid for by special interests, interests who McMahon lobbies for. Do you think McMahon should or shouldn't be able to organize a stem cell event and the people at the event be asked to contribute to the election of a politician?

Do you think a single payer health care lobbyist should be able to gather together doctors, activists and others, present the pertinent information, and ask for contributions to specific candidates who support single payer health care? If they don't ask for the money at that time, what about just telling the attendees which congressional members support single payer. Wouldn't that still end up with money related to the lobbyist going into the campaigns?

People have a tendency to think about these things only in context of their particular political agenda. They don't stop to think about how the very same things are used to benefit their agenda. They don't stop to think about how the money they contribute to a group like the ACLU ends up in an office in DC, with people who go talk to Congress. Whether a fundraiser with kaboodles of money happens here and is sponsored by a grassroots group, there will still be humans in DC who will go talk to Congress.

It isn't as simple as stopping lobbyist fundraisers. I'm not opposed to that in principle, btw, I'm just not willing to say that nothing else matters and piss all over the attention to corruption in the process. Because all that will do is muddy the waters and end up with the Republicans gaining traction on it because they have a united front.

Wouldn't it be a shame if Republicans got the credit for lobbying reform? Especially when what the reform they're calling for is a pittance of what Democrats are calling for.

[flpoljunkie]

163. Lobbying fine. Lobbyists serving as fundraisers for Congress members leads

to the"culture of corruption" that Democrats decry. You may be fine with this system, but I am not. It works at the expense of and to the detriment of the American people, i.e., the "bankruptcy reform" bill. The lobbyists who hold fundraisers for members of Congress have an inordinate amount of influence over these members--how can they not? Those 30 second TV ads to get them re-elected require vast sums of campaign funds.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/17/AR2006011701311_pf.html

Loophole in Lobbying Bill Leaves Wiggle Room
By Jeffrey H. Birnbaum

Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, January 18, 2006; A04

<>The only requirement would be that whenever a lobbyist pays the bill, he or she must also hand the lawmaker a campaign contribution. Then the transaction would be perfectly okay.

"That's a big hole if they don't address campaign finance," said Joel Jankowsky, the lobbying chief of Akin Gump Strauss Hauer & Feld, one of the capital's largest lobbying outfits.

The plan* offered by Republican leaders yesterday would change two of the three areas of law or regulation that govern lobbyists' behavior: the congressional rules that limit gifts to lawmakers and the laws that dictate the amount of disclosure that lobbyists must give the public.

A third major area -- campaign finance laws -- would go untouched, an omission that amounts to a gaping loophole in efforts to distance lobbyists from the people they are paid to influence.

Anything that members of Congress can now do in the pursuit of money for their reelections will still be permitted in the future -- including accepting lobbyist-paid travel and in-town meals -- unless campaign finance laws are altered.

________________

The Democrats' plan does nothing to address this 'gaping loophole" either, altho the article notes that "McCain said he knows the loophole exists and vowed to close it before the bill becomes a law." We will see.

[sandnsea]

164. You're not answering any questions

You just keep referring to interests that you oppose without acknowledging that not every lobbyist is pandering for corrupt corporate interests. If you don't consider all aspects of any given situation, you can't make good law. I don't exactly know why you've picked on one issue to sandbag the entire Democratic attack on Republican corruption, but that's what you've done and it isn't helpful. Louise Slaughter said today that the Democratic proposals are just the beginning. I don't know why you can't take that approach instead of another round of attacks on Democrats.

[flpoljunkie]

165. If you don't think I've answered you, I suggest you reread my posts.

Lobbyists who serve as fundraisers for members of Congress exert an undue influence on legislation which tends to serve the special interests, rather than the public interest, i.e., the one-sided bankruptcy reform bill. We Democrats ought to take this golden opportunity (Abramoff scandal) to really clean up the "culture of corruption" in Washington.

I heard Rep. Slaughter say that this morning on C-Span. I look forward to see just exactly what she meant by the Democrats' reform legislation "has to get much, much stronger." On that, I agree with her wholeheartedly.

As a last effort to communicate with you, I would recommend you read this from former Democratic lobbyist Hilary Rosen, writing on Huffpost.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/hilary-rosen/proposed-lobbying-reforms_b_14013.html

Hilary Rosen
01.18.2006

Proposed Lobbying Reforms Won't Work

How strange to be a former lobbyist sitting back watching the hand wringing debate over lobbying reforms and ethics.To date nothing I've seen from Capitol Hill makes sense to me and the media is too consumed with ethics and revelation to talk about the real problem.

Damn straight when I gave a $1,000 or $2,000 to a lawmaker I wanted him to listen to my business proposition.

And when I helped organize an event that raised $50,000 or $100,000 you bet I expected their vote. Why else do it? Now you can argue that the Member of Congress already took that position and I and my colleagues were just showing our support for their position. But how can the public really be sure of that?

The proposed reforms that everyone is talking about limit relationships between lobbyists and lawmakers - no trips, no lunches, no ball games, etc. EXCEPT FOR ONE THING! It turns out that when you limit access to lawmakers for all of these things, the only time a lobbyist can talk to a lawmaker is at fundraisers. Any kind of fundraiser by the way.

<>Members of Congress are CONSUMED with raising money for their re-elections (or if they have a safe seat, they raise money to give to colleagues to increase their internal power). It has become a burden. And no matter how cavalier they are about it in public, their hand wringing in private is certain. And anyone, including lobbyists, who lessen that anxiety, is considered a better friend than those that don't. It is just a fact. No lobbying reforms will change that fact.

Corruption is sometimes obvious, like with Jack Abramoff, but just as often in Washington it is a subtle thing that happens to decent people. The ONLY answer to all of this is public financing of elections. Then lobbying becomes genuine "education" and relationships are built on respect and constituent interest. It seems so obvious.]

[sandnsea]

167. Repeating yourself isn't an answer

I asked very specific questions about the different perceptions of interest groups and their lobbies who influence congress. You brushed them all aside. Abramoff used non-profits to launder some of his money. Cunningham could have set up his kickback operation without campaign money at all. It isn't just about campaign money. You've picked one thing to beat Democrats over the head with which will only serve to sabatoge their entire message. My house is perpetually a mess. If my husband goes to clean up the kitchen, I don't beat him over the head because he isn't cleaning the bathroom instead. That's all I'm saying. When the Democrats take steps in the right direction, join the chorus and then sing acapella once in a while. Don't get mad and tear it apart because it's not a symphony.

[cyberpj]

138. Here is a PLEDGE and Dean's letter - Is this what the Dems signed?

http://www.democrats.org/a/2006/01/dean_we_need_to.php

[Sapphire Blue]

146. Yes... **** EVERYONE, PLEASE SIGN ****

Related threads...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x175706

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=106&topic_id=26214&mesg_id=26214

[Beelzebud]

155. But will it even be mentioned by the corporate controlled media?

[Sydnie]

158. Kick so I can find it later

and for others (like me) that might have missed it today.