Just Don't Tell 'Em You Know Me: By William Rivers Pitt

[kpete]

(Kpete to Will Pitt - posting for you today, hoping you come back soon...)

Just Don't Tell 'Em You Know Me
By William Rivers Pitt
t r u t h o u t | Perspective

Tuesday 23 May 2006

You thought you was the cool fool,
Never could do no wrong.
You had everything sewn up tight.
How come you lay awake all night long?
Just one thing I ask of you,
Just one thing for me.
Please forget you knew my name,
My darling Sugaree.

Shake it, shake it Sugaree,
Just don't tell 'em you know me ...

- Robert Hunter

You have to wonder how many congressfolk are wandering the springtime byways of Washington, DC with that old song running through their minds. Probably not too many, in truth; the Grateful Dead don't appear to have gained much of a purchase with officeholders on the Hill, particularly on the Republican side of things. If they did manage to hear it somewhere, in a bar or flowing from the radio of the car next to them at a stoplight, you can bet more than a few would stop cold and cock an ear.

Just don't tell 'em you know me. Damned right.

much more at:
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/052306R.shtml

[liberalnurse]

1. I adore Will Pitt.....

I feel honored to know him. He has a pure heart.O8)

[AlwaysDemocrat]

Great article!

Thanks for posting!

[Mr.Green93]

3. He is Pure

For sure.

[hippiechick]

6. Wow, I want some of what you're smoking ...

I know Pitt too - have for a few years - and let's just say it's not something I gush about.

[liberalnurse]

8. Then I sense you may be a bit on the delusional side

when you say you have known him for years.....Maybe you have knowledge of Will Pitt or something on the acquaintance level....but not actually "know him", call him a friend.....and return the kindness as friends always do.

Maybe I got the wrong message from your post? Feel free to clarify for me.

[KoKo]

10. As a "Liberal Nurse" I assume you must have very "intimate

knowledge" so, indeed, I must go with what you say.

[Maddy McCall]

36. Better shut up or she'll taser you.

:scared:

[liberalnurse]

44. Oh my sweet Maddy......

you know me better than that.:loveya:

[leftchick]

25. non gushable

lol!

[RDU Socialist]

like calling people cretins for disagreeing with him and

jason "grand larceny" leopold? sounds like pure bullshit to me...

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

129. How Dare You.

There is nothing that justifies smearing a voice for our cause like you just did to Jason. Absolutely nothing.

[Llewlladdwr]

134. Since when is the truth a smear?

N/T

[sheelz]

142. It's not...

the problem is some adults never reach maturity--intellectually.

[RDU Socialist]

138. he lied, and he was convicted of grand larceny

ohhhh, pointing out someone lied and committed a felony is a smear if the person who committed the felony and lied is a liberal.

[texasleo]

2. a very nice opinion piece

[Spazito]

4. Good article, thanks for posting! n/t

[Snivi Yllom]

5. Everything except the elephant in the room named Karl Rove

or cretins

[DancingBear]

14. Perhaps you just can't see him

It's magic, man. :)

[KoKo]

16. Well...you are just a "Fuckwit/Cretin" if you can't understand it all...

:shrug:

[DancingBear]

19. Well, you got me there

:)

(but don't forget about fuckshit - that's a keeper)

[KoKo]

23. then there's the "Shit Dogs." we forgot to mention them....

:eyes:

[Maddy McCall]

51. Just a "little fish" in the throes of a "wheat-from-the-chaff moment"

It demonstrates such rapier wit, such noble estimation.



Aaaahhh.... *swoon*

[meisje]

7. Isn't Pitt big enough to make his own posts? Inquiring cretins want toknow

[liberalnurse]

9. Sure he is.....

but think about how the respondants will react. I respect his privacy during this "waiting period".

[CTyankee]

11. Huh? what's that?

After his display here, don't you think he owes this community an apology of some sort (or did I miss it?). Given the high stakes of this controversy, don't you think he should fess us a little bit more with us?

Just askin'......

[liberalnurse]

17. Not yet......I completely believe the information is accurate.

It's the time line that has things in disarray. I believe the article information was validated and the intent to write the story was seeded in the spirit of credible journalistic fashion. The time line for the public knowledge of the indictment is an issue that can not be controlled by the messenger. I have no clue as to why there is a delay, but I do believe there is indeed a firewall of sorts in place. There is a reason.....I just don't know what that reason is at the moment.

[CTyankee]

33. Well, I hope so.

I want to believe that we liberals weren't taken for a ride, just to discredit us in the national media.

Here's hoping...

[liberalnurse]

45. Here Here!

:toast:

I myself am more than open to waiting this out. I don't cut and run when things get close to the edge......that's what makes me a player. I see you are as well.

[KoKo]

47. It's not that we are trashing the Article....but the epithets slung at

fellow DU'ers and DU Administrator. Most of us took a "wait and see" about this.

But we were called: "Cretins, Fuckwits, Shitdogs" and I hear worse that was deleted by the poster who is the subject here.

This isn't about "TruthOut" it's about a fellow DU'er who called us vile names for no reason. Let's get our stories straight here when you try to say that folks didn't believe Will and now he's going to come back like a conquering hero for those of you who would have worshiped any rock star in another time. Let's have some perspective here. That's what I'm saying.

:shrug:

[Ladyhawk]

73. Even if the article IS correct, Pitt's performance here was inexcusable,

especially in light of similar past behavior. I wasn't the target of his personal attacks, but that doesn't matter. I stand with the fuckwits / cretins / shitdogs. Forgiving him YET AGAIN would be akin to a wife making up with her abusive husband.

Trust Pitt again? I don't think so. Ladyhawk don't play that.

As far as I'm concerned Pitt is through.

[demobabe]

80. I really hope you're not saying...

...that it's acceptable behavior to come on here, call the guy who runs the place a cretin, a bunch of us "fuckwits" and "shit dogs" and to tell any of us to shove anything up our ass.

No matter how the article plays out, there's a bit of cleanup to be done here...

[Maddy McCall]

96. And in absense of an apology for his behavior...

he gets what he gets. There's nothing to change the trajectory of the way things are going, as they are.

He could end it. If it weren't for that damned hubris.

[Joe for Clark]

13. That is a great post Liberalnurse.

I so appreciate the sarcasm.

Still laughing,

joe

[liberalnurse]

20. What sarcasm?

I was being polite. :shrug:

[Joe for Clark]

24. Hahahaha

Joe

[liberalnurse]

29. Oh I'm so sorry......

I didn't realize you have dyslexia.....My apologies.:scared:

[Joe for Clark]

37. You are right - I actually typed hahaha wrong.

Well, I never claimed to be able to type very well.

Good one!!

Joe

[Bluebear]

31. Is he waiting to form the words "I'm sorry"? nt

[liberalnurse]

40. When and "if" things fall flat....

Mr. Pitt will indeed be open, honest and sincerely apologetic. He stands by his word. Let me remind my peers here at DU that there was no malice or intent to deceive anyone....on the contrary, it was one giving an honest days work preforming the job they love so much. Jason, Will and all at the Truth Out were doing their job with honor and integrity. O8)

[Bluebear]

42. I'm talking about calling us collective imbeciles including the site owner

I was agnostic about the story. But being that he "stands by his words", there were a whole lot of insults hurled around by "Mr. Pitt" that were pretty malicious.

[liberalnurse]

55. I wouldn't take it to heart.

I didn't see the thread or posts you are referring to where he was malicious. I have seen in the past where he has been definitely rude and out right brutally unkind. I have know problem sharing with him my dislike for such impulsive rants.

Not to rescue him, but I can understand one reacting with words, insults etc... when one may feel insecure, afraid, experiencing serious self doubt....I sense such behavior is covert, reactionary to ones view of them self....building a wall temporary or permanent from the ones you really care for the most. Yes, dysfunctional but understandable. Heck, we all have had such moments ....think about it. Fear and self doubt can be crippling. I don't condone it yet I'm willing to care enough to help a friend, maybe a co-worker or family member ride on thru the emotional storm or conflicting event which evoked the behavior. With employing healthy limits and boundaries, all can embrace a better tomorrow. For me, forgiveness is Liberal. :hi:

[Ladyhawk]

88. Forgiveness after repeated abuse is just plain stupid.

Liberalnurse, I know you have a very good heart, but I have to disagree with you on this one. Words can really hurt. I've never been a target of Pitt's words, but I can't help but notice a pattern of verbal abuse heaped on others. I can't stand by and let someone get away with doing that to my friends. To me, that is liberal.

On another forum, I sat idly by and watched someone verbally rape person after person. I didn't do a damn thing about it. In fact, I stood up for this person as a member of the group. Of course, the time came when I was the target of the abuse. This person ran me through the meat grinder. The forum was a small "support" forum and I'd poured out my heart. He used everything he knew about me to drive me to the brink of completely losing it. After I'd recovered, I was a little smarter, but it came at a steep cost. I can't even begin to convey to you the damage done by this person.

Now that I'm in a position to recognize the same damn pattern, I am not going to stand for it. I'm pointing out that it has happened once too often. I'm pleading with others to notice and not let it happen again.

[Name removed]

93. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

66. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bluebear]

69. "STFU already" and we sound like freepers?

Sorry, Angry Sara, but having grown up with drunks, the "he was inebriated!!!!" excuse doesn't wash with me. I am up to here with being called a freeper, not the least of which for having a healthy skepticism about the original sorry.

[WiseButAngrySara]

76. I have never posted anything other than healthy skepticism about

this story, after the initial euphoric stage of belief. I didn't call you a FReeper, and you never answered my question. Did Will personally insult you?

[Bluebear]

81. "fuckshits of low mental weight" was leveled at anyone doubting him

And it was uncalled for.

[Divernan]

87. Yeah, didn't you love the "low mental weight" part?

When he first came to DU, he was a teacher, right? Or was he only a substitute teacher? In either case, pity any student who dared offer a contrary opinion. Not exactly an appropriate temperament for teaching.

[Divernan]

74. Oh, you're saying he was drunk? Well that makes everything fine!

Yes he did direct ugly words at me personally, many years ago, and I have avoided him since then. And I have received PMs from other long time DUers who got the same ugly treatment. And ne'er an apology was forthcoming to anyone until he finally went completely over the edge and attacked Skinner. It is said that one's true nature comes out when one has become drunk - you know, in vino veritas.

That explains a lot - what you said about him probably being intoxicated. When he blew up at me and cursed me out it was when I suggested there were better things to do on his short, first trip to Europe, than find bars where he could watch baseball w/ other Americans.

Curse me out once, shame on you; curse me out a second time, shame on me. Drunk or sober, there are consequences to our actions.

[Ladyhawk]

79. There's a definite pattern. Anyone who falls for "I'm sorry" again

gets exactly what they deserve.

Yes, Pitt is an excellent writer, but as a person he's a perpetual powder keg. After each of his disgraceful displays, he has apologized, but an apology is only good if that person is working toward never letting it happen again. I don't see that. He'll blow up again and next time it will probably be even worse.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm through with him. I'm not going to take a chance on being within the blast radius next time he goes off.

[WiseButAngrySara]

91. I remember reading about this on a post you made about a week

ago, and I was impressed with it. I could completely relate with what you had suggested to Will about Europe, as I would have suggested the same thing, out of kindness and helpfulness. And if my suggestions were treated with rudeness, I would have been hurt, and angered. I don't know anything about Will other than what I've read, that he has authored. If he has a habit of rudeness, I have only read about it, but repeated bouts of anger are not excusable. But yes, sometimes being inebriated, if you're young, is excusable, IMO. Especially since he posted on DU that he was going out for drinks!

I wish that he'd return, not to apologize for rudeness per se, but to explain why it is that he so trusts this author of questionable credibility, and where his sources are, when he promised that they would be outed!

[Maddy McCall]

98. Then we should never hold George Bush's "youthful indiscretions" ...

against him, according to your logic.

I hold Democrats to no lesser standards than I hold anyone else. Even if others want to pedastalize them.

:shrug:

[Divernan]

116. He's not that young! And people can't have it both ways.

He's in his early 30's; not exactly a teenager learning how to handle his liquor. He wants to be taken seriously and respected, but be excused for repeated episodes of immature behavior. Reminds me of the kid who kills his parents and then throws himself on the mercy of the court because he's an orphan. The thing about alcohol is if you get "inebriated", and behave badly, such that you have to apologize for yourself, you don't have to be of "high mental weight" to figure out that you can't handle alcohol and should stop drinking. He doesn't have to return here to explain the ins and outs of Jason's article; he can do that at Truthout. He's intelligent, he's a good writer; he just doesn't have the capacity for a give and take discussion/debate with others in a civilized manner.

[KoKo]

128. And, that's the crux of it. A grown man who writes well and can

command trust and faith when he's writing well but then throws it away in drunken rants where abuse substitutes for discussion debate or civil discourse. When the abuse is directed at the administrator of this site and those who are here it's particularly disheartening and just plain wrong. Others here who've gone off in abusive rants are "pushing up daisies" with a stone at their head. And, out there in the real world the behavior wouldn't be tolerated...so why do it here?

After awhile apologies mean nothing when there's no change in the behavior.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

131. I'm Not Sure Preaching About Abusive Rants Wouldn't Be Hypocritical Here.

[Maddy McCall]

137. Ever head that ol' saying: "You get what you give?"

Ever heard of Nemesis?

Karma?

If anyone else had insulted DUers the way that Will had, you'd be writing some novella of a post entitled:

"Why I Cannot Tolerate The Hate By Some DUers Here And Why They Should Apologize."

But it's your idol, so you excuse it. Now, talk to me about hypocrisy again?

[Llewlladdwr]

84. Ah yes...

We will be fortunate indeed when the Great One deigns once again to honor us with his presence...perhaps he'll share with us more of his secrety wisdom...

[dalaigh lllama]

12. Thanks for the post, kpete.

Always read your posts and I sure miss seeing Will Pitt's stuff here.

[brentspeak]

15. This song, I think, is more appropriate for Will and Jason both:

"Nothing Was Delivered"

Bob Dylan

Nothing was delivered
And I tell this truth to you,
Not out of spite or anger
But simply because it's true.
Now, I hope you won't object to this,
Giving back all of what you owe,
The fewer words you have to waste on this,
The sooner you can go.

Nothing is better, nothing is best,
Take heed of this and get plenty of rest.

Nothing was delivered
But I can't say I sympathize
With what your fate is going to be,
Yes, for telling all those lies.
Now you must provide some answers
For what you sell has not been received,
And the sooner you come up with them,
The sooner you can leave.

Nothing is better, nothing is best,
Take heed of this and get plenty rest.
(snip).


Copyright © 1968; renewed 1996 Dwarf Music
http://www.bobdylan.com/songs/delivered.html

[KoKo]

21. Here's a Painting to describe the "TruthOut" problem.....

I give credit to DU'er Tahiti Nut for stealing his "jpg" post of this on another thread which had or has nothing to do with my post...but describes our dilemna.

Kudo's to "Tahiti" for stealing this photo.

[Vanje]

68. I dont get it

I dont get it
Whats the point of the painting?

[Jersey Devil]

85. More Dylan for this artsy substring

The Ballad of Frankie Lee and Judas Priest

Final two stanzas:

No one tried to say a thing
When they took him out in jest,
Except, of course, the little neighbor boy
Who carried him to rest.
And he just walked along, alone,
With his guilt so well concealed,
And muttered underneath his breath,
"Nothing is revealed."

Well, the moral of the story,
The moral of this song,
Is simply that one should never be
Where one does not belong.
So when you see your neighbor carryin' somethin',
Help him with his load,
And don't go mistaking Paradise
For that home across the road.

[Catherine Vincent]

18. I wonder how long PItt breaks from DU?

He doesn't have to apologize to me. Of course, I'm not a fuckwit or a cretin. He probably should apologize to those folks because they sure have been wanting that apology!

[KoKo]

22. I guess you'd say..."all animals are equal...but SOME animals are more

EQUAL than others, then.

Some of us are Fuckwits and Cretins ...and we are less equal but all animals are equal. :eyes:

In your world, I guess. :silly:

[bleever]

56. I'm still trying to figure out why someone would see "cretins"

referred to and class themselves in that group.

:shrug:

[Ladyhawk]

82. There's no time like the present. n/t

[Thtwudbeme]

26. oh! The drama! *sniff* it's almost, almost, but not quite.....

as if he were here himself.

[Bluebear]

30. I can practically hear him calling us shitdogs as if he were here. nt

[Maddy McCall]

34. Oh, the memories!

To be called a fuckshit was perhaps the most sentimental, sweet moments of my DU years.

*swoon* *faint*

[Bluebear]

35. Riiiiiight

It still gets me. Right here. (pointing)

[Maddy McCall]

38. I long for the old days...

You know, fighting off muggers with Chef Boyardee cans. Doubting a friend's medical problems. Those kind of days.

Alas! *swoon*

[leftchick]

70. I thought it was a rock

perhaps before editing it was. :eyes:

[KoKo]

39. He's here...reading it all....his "spirit" is here waiting to emerge from

"Stage Right." The GRAND ENTRANCE.... To appear before the "Fuckwits, Cretins, Shitdogs who stand at attention along with the "animals who are More Equal" than others. :-(

[WiseButAngrySara]

72. Will is certainly more talented than most who post at DU. He is a gifted

writer. And since writing opinions is what DU is all about, and he is one of DU's most eloquent mouthpieces, I am astounded at the cavilier treatment of him, and it makes you guilty of what you are accusing him of, IMO.

[KharmaTrain]

27. Hopefully This Will Put A Rest To This Circus For A While

You'd think there's nothing else going on in the world other than this "controversy". From one who takes no sides in this issue, the constant ego games that go on about this thing has turned off people here and reflected poorly on all sides. Such a waste of words and electrons...and I'm willing to say this fiasco sure didn't help DU during their last fundraiser.

The bottom line was the story didn't hold water...time to move on...I thought the enemies around here were Repugnicans.

[mdmc]

28. i bet that Cheney knows that song

[Maddy McCall]

32. Jumping for glee and hittin' that recommend button.

It just won't recommend quick enough for me.

Can I get a lock of his hair? *swoon*

[Thtwudbeme]

41. Maddy, quick! Git to the faintin' couch women! And where the HELL are

those smellin' salts!

;)

[KoKo]

43. All of us are "clutching our pearls" and fainting on the Divan.....

but if you get the smelling salts perhaps we can revive....ahhhhhhhhhh

[Maddy McCall]

49. Tis no nobler a calling than to be ravished by Will Pitt's double-edged...

wit.

Be still, my pounding heart...gasp!

[KoKo]

50. His "rapier" burst his loins and the "Truth" was fully revealed as her

bodice burst in rapture she swooned again and the courtiers fetched her wine.

[Maddy McCall]

52. *heaving bossoms* *heaving bossoms*

Ok, is anyone else getting turned on by all of this--this--talk?

:D

[Ariana Celeste]

54. ...

:rofl:

Best. Sub-thread. Ever.

[Maddy McCall]

48. Loosen my corsette--hand me a hanky....

I'll be ok...but wake me when he appears....

*double swoon* *graceful, ladylike thud*

[KoKo]

53. All that "TRUTH" has left me gasping...get me to the Pub....

where I can work off this thirst...Truth! Truth! give me TRUTH!!!

[SammyWinstonJack]

59. Ouch!

:evilgrin:

[leftchick]

71. I want a whisp of that facial hair

er, maybe not.

[sheelz]

78. oops...

wrong spot

[savemefromdumbya]

46. William!

:pals: :loveya:

[Scoody Boo]

57. "Just Don't Tell 'Em You Know Me: By William Rivers Pitt"

Don't worry Will. I won't tell 'em I know you. I'm pretty embarrassed to have heard of ya!

[Divernan]

67. Yeah, I also thought the title referred to HWMBA.

That's He Who Must Be Adored. (With apologies to Rumpole of the Bailey & his wife, Hilda (She Who Must Be Obeyed)).

When will there be a Harriet Myers smiley face for the adoring fans?

[Name removed]

95. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[greatauntoftriplets]

97. If you check Divernan's profile...

You will find that the member joined in 2002.

[Llewlladdwr]

100. Ah yes....

The obligatory "Low post count = invalid opinion" post.

[greatauntoftriplets]

105. I have a friend who joined before I did...in 2001....

She lurks and rarely posts. Barely 100 posts. I have 16,000-some.

Lots of people read and rarely say anything.

[Scoody Boo]

122. I have lurked here for a longtime...

never registered because I am not a cheerleader, do not scurry behind every story that sounds good and do have a couple of "less than progressive beliefs." All qualities (faults?) that apparently make for a short stay here. I also do not appreciate the hoops a newbie has to jump through before they have a decent enough post count to not have to put up with this shit.

I read every "Valerie Plame Indictment" thread that Pitt posted two summers ago. Sometimes a couple of them a day. How many of those were there in the end anyway?

Who is Will Pitt that he must automatically be forgiven? I do not believe Will Pitt or anyone, I believe the truth. No man should be bigger than the truth he espouses. The truth is the truth, not matter who says it. The truth does not stop being the truth if it comes from the lips of Greoge W. Bush (though we won't live to see that). A lie does not become the truth no matter who speaks it. The Will Pitt, TruthOut, Jason Leopold story was either a mistake or a lie. These guys have to come clean that it was one or the other. Nothing wrong if it was a mistake. What is so hard about admitting to being wrong?

[jarab]

136. Good post ! .... eom

...O...

[bleever]

58. Republican corruption undermines national security.

That's the topic.

It's a really important point to make, given that the FBI raid on William Jefferson's office was directed by the WH to "neutralize" the corruption issue by showing that "both sides do it".

Add that to the list of abuses of executive power we've seen.

[kpete]

60. thank you Bleever

for responding to the article rather than attacking the author. Mr. Pitt still can illuminate the mind!

[KittyWampus]

62. Isn't it amazing how immature so many DU'ers can be on such a consitent

basis?

[WiseButAngrySara]

104. Not only amazing, but also a crying shame, cryingshame! ....n/t

[troubleinwinter]

86. SHHHHH!!! QUIET!!!!

The children are playing a game. Running from thread to thread, playing tag and seeing just how long they can keep the ball in the air.

Nevermind the topic, the children are playing.

[suffragette]

89. Yep, Bleever

It is an important point and it needs to be raised directly and clearly and confronted head on.
Glad Will did that.

Also add to the list the corporate press "balancing" the news stories by endlessly running clips about Jefferson's situation to the mix and that's a big, nasty stew o' abuse that's being cooked up between them. And it's a reeking stew that needs to be thrown in the toilet and flushed.

[KittyWampus]

61. The Majority Of Posts In This Thread Are Pathetic. Will Really Is A Magnet

:puke:

[fishnfla]

77. Ya know...

I took some swipes at the guy while he's down, including one cheap-shot that was the lowest of blows and I regret posting it.

-imagine that: posting something juvenile in the heat of an over-reacting second, that you regret later in a grown-up moment.

But some of the stuff upthread, these folks are barking because WP made us look bad? We dont need his help with that, apparantly.

And I was thinking today about the Swift boat campaign agin' Kerry, and how nobody in the MSM media called out the real truth of the matter at all, and we got purple band-aids and 4 more years.

Now its the same thing, only different. The GOP is gonna hammer the National Security like they own it for the mid-terms,like they always do, when the truth is corruption, and risk unto death. Treason. Will the MSM media call them on it? Anyone?

But instead we get heaving bosoms, hankies, and sesame street theatrics of swooning.

And just when does the next SC justice retire? And just how important are those congressional committee chairs?

[Beausoir]

63. WTF is this? Where's the mention of the Rove indictment?

Good god...what a waste of space.

[Maddy McCall]

64. It's safe to hold your breath.

There's a nurse on-thread.

:D

[Amaya]

83. Do you know Will on a personal level?

You seem to be having too much fun bashing him. Weird.

Anyway, I know him pretty well and he's a good guy .... and wicked honest.

Find something else to do with your time.

[Maddy McCall]

92. Hi, Amaya.

I do not.

I'm just an ordinary DUer, one of the "little fish" who has never met him. Don't really have the desire to.

You see, I haven't let any personal affection for him cloud my judgment about his recent behavior. If I had known him, when he first told me to shut up, I might have done so--not wanting to step on the toes of someone I like for reasons other than what's on the DU boards.

What you and I gauge "good guys" might just be different things. I'm not a masochist. I'm not an egoist. I'm not a sycophant. Not to Pitt. Not to anyone.

Rest assured, the comments I have made re this situation are nowhere near as vulgar, offensive, or abrasive as what was said about the people who ONLY ASKED WILL to answer a few questions about the article.

You may think that I deserved those comments. Remember--all I did was ask questions.

Will wouldn't answer. Instead, he insulted the many of us who asked questions. Whether or not he's your friend, he's fortunate to still hold membership at DU. Part of the backlash for his tirade is that some people don't hold him esteem anymore. Why is that so troubling to you?

I've never been one to tolerate drunken abuse or belligerent ragers. Not from real-life people. Not from people on the internet.

[WiseButAngrySara]

106. Lady, you find your behavior tolerable? I laughed about a week ago at

the first few posts that I read of yours, but later, I found them to be so abusive and intolerant, that I had to stop wasting my time reading the threads, because they were all clogged up with your B.S. And another poster said that you had displayed similar behavior during the Andy thing here (don't know much about it, but apparently you were one of the instigators.)

I don't think that the DU Community deserves your comments!

[Maddy McCall]

111. Hi, Sarah.

You know what? If you find what I have said to be abusive and intolerant, then you must be a tender lil ole thing. I've had some fun, but abusive and intolerant I have not been.

I said NOTHING ugly about Andy. I sure as hell didn't start a thread calling him a fraud on DU with the whole forum watching on.

You don't like my "B.S."? There's a simple remedy. Put me on ignore, sweetheart.

[Kingshakabobo]

113. What you lack in vulgar and abrasive, you make up in volume. n/t

[Maddy McCall]

120. Well, thank you!

:7

[sheelz]

118. You got that special frog.

Is it a breeder? :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[Maddy McCall]

121. It's an ass biter.

It's the real attack dog in these threads. :D

[sheelz]

126. I like her bark

:)

[Donailin]

102. Fitz!!!!

:evilgrin:

[Ladyhawk]

65. Y-A-W-N.

Oh, I'm sorry...did someone say something?

[Name removed]

75. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Llewlladdwr]

90. "Fuck you bunch of dumbasses"

It's almost like having him here!

[Sydnie]

101. Yep ... that's what I think as well.

It's not about the TO story ... it's personal ... and they are going to "ride that donkey" as far as it will take them ... then kick it some more once it dies.

They have become the very thing they say they hate ... and the glee you can read in those posts is disgusting. Let's hope they never "step in it" themselves because they sure can fling it and are decidedly drawn to it too ....

[johnnie]

107. "it's personal" You think? :)

It's obvious what they are doing and I think the majority of people here see that, no matter how "clever" they think they are.

[Donailin]

110. One day

when you mildy disagree in complete civility with a point some poster is making and William Pitt, out of the blue, jumps on your ass and rips you a new one because you even dare to express dissent from HIS point of view, you'll understand how many of us feel. I don't think he lacks integrity, I think he is an excellent writer. But that NEVER is justification for his obscene attacks on folks who express differing opinions let alone think critically about information being disseminated in this and other forums. What he lacks is self control. He is abusive and belligerent. He has lost credibility because he does not command respect. You know who commands respect? H20 man. EmptyWheel. Jane at Firedoglake. They don't bite your head off or go on tirades when doubts are expressed. And why is that? Because they have their shit under control.

(And now, bordlord, go ahead and delete this post like you have my others that dare to criticize the main attraction, just be advised that my designated donation dollars are redirected towards blogs that actually excercize democratic values -- like dissent from the "mainstream" POV)

[KoKo]

114. Just so folks know this subthread is supportive of Will and not attacking

him. It's clever how some of you posted "F**K Will Pitt" to make it seem like it was a criticism of him when you were supporting him. One had to read the threads before one saw they were in support.

Didn't want folks to get the wrong impression about your posts.

[Maddy McCall]

139. Yeah--and have you noticed that most of the deleted posts are...

from Will's supporters?

The only one I've had deleted was one that contained his rant, verbatim. I can understand why it was deleted. His words were atrociously nasty.

[crispini]

94. Thank you for keeping us posted, kpete.

As for the rest of this thread, I'm not a Christian, but this seems appropriate:

"Don't judge, so that you won't be judged. For with whatever judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with whatever measure you measure, it will be measured to you. Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but don't consider the beam that is in your own eye? Or how will you tell your brother,'Let me remove the speck from your eye;' and behold, the beam is in your own eye? You hypocrite! First remove the beam out of your own eye, and then you can see clearly to remove the speck out of your brother's eye."

[kpete]

99. Thanks so much

Judging and trashing others is such a waste of energy...

It accomplishes NOTHING...

And we have SO MUCH TO DO!

[Sydnie]

103. I couldn't agree more

and I thank you too for all your efforts to get the news to us as fast as you do.

You, kpete, are a gem!

[Coexist]

119. I love what you add to DU, kpete -

I can't tell you the number of times I see a new story - think it would be great to share here, and have to "delete-dupe" cuz you were all over it!

You make DU an up-to-the-minute place to be. It is much appreciated.

The kids will get tired of their new toy soon. The tincture of time cures all.

[WiseButAngrySara]

108. Thank you crispini! I was going to write "This has gotten INSANE!"

but...that's judging.

[Name removed]

109. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

115. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

123. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Dora]

127. Oh. I went too far. Such passion! Kpete - lest you misunderstand....

In sum, I gave you a :thumbsup:

Then I joined the "I can't seem to stop touching my ego" trend. :blush: I apologize for creating a deletion in your thread.

[alcibiades_mystery]

112. Defending Will Pitt

Anyone who's been following these threads will know that I've done my fair share (and more) of trashing Saint Leopold (another jibe!), truthout, the indictment story, Will Pitt's apologetics and anything else tangetially related to that steaming heap that was printed on truthout a week and a half ago. I was there at the beginning, holding up my bet to Mister fucking Pitt heself, yessuh, and giggling ferociously when 24 business hours were up, and the supporters were forced into their ridiculous sealed indictment position, in which they demanded that we prove that an indictment was NOT delivered and sealed (it's utterly plausible, they'll tell you, raising a possibility to a probability, and then to an absolute certainty, in the spirit of Mister fucking Ahab heself, and those boys seeking the Big Fish on the day Quentin Compson threw himself in the Charles, yessuh). I've been called a freeper I don't know how many times behind this; I've been accused by some weirdo of stalking; I've been sniped at, insinuated against, denounced with true Stalinesque fervor. The street corner commisars had their long knives out for anyone whgo dared to question Saint Leopold, truthout, Pitt, and anything else that touched their soaring dreams, sho nuf and yessuh. Let me be crystal clear: the truthout story is a load of hooey, Pitt's judgment and that of Mr. Ashe was frightening on this matter, and the whole episode is an embarrassment for truthout, Leopold, Pitt, Ashe, DU, and respectable journalism in general. OK? That's where I stand.

That said (another way of leading into the buuuuuuut part of the argument), I have to say that some of the responses on this thread are out there, as in whoooooo, out there. Whatever my (I thought) friendly jibes at Pitt (I have less friendly things to say about Leopold), the guy is a solid guy, a true supporter and promoter of this site (DU, you and me, kid), a thoughtful, friendly, stand-up guy. Pitt's good people, as we used to say in the neighborhood where I grew up, and some of the attacks here are, well, bullshit. Sho nuf, and yessuh. And I get the whole dance of joy thing, and I get the whole anger thing, and I get the whole didn't apologize yet thing, and I get the whole payback for the drunken rant thing. Believe me, I get the whole drunken rant thing. Been there and will probably be there again, and I hope to God I don't get the same treatment. Used to be a fella could apologize for a drunken rant (Pitt has), and all would be forgiven. Throwing shit back in a brother's face like that seems like, well, bullshit. Sho nuf, and yessuh. So I'ma come out here in defense of Will Pitt. He probably doesn't consider me a friend right about now, but I consider him one, in that groovy, Internet, holy shit if I ever ran into you in one of those bourgeois Boston bars we'd peel the surface off it, sho nuf, kinda way. And while it was fun to beat up on that silly story, it's another thing altogether to beat up on a friend like that. Yessuh. Sho nuf.

[kpete]

117. I don't know for sure...

but I think Mr. Pitt will like your reply...

Thanks alcibiades_mystery

[Maddy McCall]

124. Point me to the apology, and I'll let it drop, too...

not my criticism of Leopold, but my criticism of Will.

Show me where he apologized on DU for his insult-laden tirade, and I'll accept that apology and move on.

I'm serious.

[Catherine Vincent]

133. Have you been drinking?

That's the longest post I've ever seen you write. LOL!

[alcibiades_mystery]

140. Er, no

Check my journal, kid. Those are the real long ones. ;-)

[northamericancitizen]

135. Thanks for your honesty.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

125. To Those In This Thread Trashing Will To The Nth Degree, Let Me Say

that not one of you will ever achieve what he's achieved. Not one of you are more valuable to this site or to our movement than he is. Not one of you are better than he is. As hard as you all try I can say with practical certainty that you haven't even come close to being as committed to, engaged with, and actioned with the progressive cause as Mr. Pitt has been.

No, not even close. All you can do is bash the likes of Mr. Pitt, because that in some small way makes you feel significant, or brings you the attention you are so desperate for. You think going after a genuine champion for our cause somehow makes you honorable rebels but you couldn't be more wrong. Will is an amazing addition to our movement, and an amazing person outside of politics itself. He does not deserve this. In fact, no one deserves to be attacked like this. So to those attacking to a level beyond rationality, I say you don't have the strength to stand with Will. That you don't have the strength for rational argument. That you are weak, and think you have joined some growing movement against Will. That you are just jumping on a popular opinion anti-Will bandwagon, and think the pats on your backs from fellow bashers make you cool somehow. Well I also say you couldn't be more wrong. As many people support and cherish Will as they ever have. And smearing him so insensibly without rational cause doesn't make one cool, it makes them disgracefully foolish.

This is my opinion. This is my judgment. This is how I feel. This is bullshit to string up one of our own like this and right here right now I am ashamed to see it.

I'm going to bed. I don't care if any of you call me a coward for going to bed after posting this. I wanted to get it out before bed. And your opinions mean nothing to me.

As a last statement, to those who are miffed at Will but aren't taking that to the nth level, this isn't at you. It is only for those that have taken it to indefensible heights. And to those who know who Will is, what he's done, his heart, his soul, his passion, his accomplishments and his value, know I weep with you.

[Llewlladdwr]

130. "...your opinions mean nothing to me."

It's all good. The feeling is mutual.

Pitt has, in my opinion, no one but himself to blame for his part in this fiasco. Whatever good he's done in the past has to be balanced against the harm he's done the cause in this situation. And harm has been done whether you admit it or not.

A full coming-clean and disavowal of Leopold would be a good idea right about now. If anyone can direct me to where Pitt's done this I'd appreciate it.

[bleever]

132. Republicans run on "National Security" while selling it off to friends.

Lest people think that one Democratic congressman who was bribed is equal to all the Tom DeLays, K Street Projects, Abramoff scandals, AIPAC scandals, Niger forgeries, and election "glitches", someone may wish to point out the following:

Over the last several years, the Bush administration and their Republican congressional allies have moved mountains to make sure that the myriad national security catastrophes we have endured are blamed on someone else. Their favorite whipping post has been the intelligence community - the CIA in particular. 9/11 happened because of intelligence failures. The fact that no WMD were found in Iraq was due to intelligence failures. Not our fault, folks. The bad spies lied to me. They're probably Democrats, too.

/snip/

It is terribly convenient timing. And lest we forget, the raid was undertaken with the full knowledge of Attorney General Alberto Gonzales. "It would appear," said Hastert in his statement, "that the Attorney General himself was aware that Separation of Powers concerns existed." Given the ham-fisted, politically-motivated power plays that have been the hallmark of this administration, it is not too far a stretch to imagine that the actions of the FBI on Saturday night were undertaken to change the subject in Washington.

Yet even if Jefferson is guilty, and even if the actions of the FBI come to be deemed acceptable - why not, since we appear to be collectively bent on trashing most of our constitutional protections these days - the question asked above still stands. If Jefferson took bribes, he did so to help a Virginia business install phone and Internet lines in Africa. This is a far, far cry from the kind of frontal attacks upon our intelligence branches that corrupt Republicans like Cunningham and his friends have profited from.


/snip/

From the article this post refers to.

[johnaries]

141. Thank you for posting this, kpete.

Will Pitt is the best political writer I have ever read. Period.

I know a lot of DU'ers think he owes them an apology. Perhaps so, but I think those DU'ers owe him an apology, as well. I didn't see much civility thrown his way.

[Warren DeMontague]

143. I dunno, I think this is a "New Speedway Boogie" kind of era.

but I think this verse from Sugaree is probably more apt for those of us in the Democratic Party who keep hungering for real leadership that isn't afraid to kick some ass, and get served up flag burning, video games, and neocon pandering in return:

you know in spite of all you've gained
you still have to stand out
in the pourin' rain...

Yeah. You know, it's cool if you're pro-choice, or gay, anti-war or an 'atheist whackjob'.. We appreciate your passion, just keep your mouths shut and let the "grown-ups" (the same gang that has led us to the stunning victories of the past six years) set the agenda. Oh- wait? Agenda? That's too strong of a word. Might alienate Mr. and Mrs. Values voter. Um, we'll have to do a focus group before we decide whether we have one.

As far as the Rove story, it would seem to the untrained eye that Mr. Pitt has some 'splainin to do to DU-in-general. But I aint in any hurry to need that for myself. Color me in the "wait and see" camp.

Or, if you will, watch each card you play, and play it slow.

[pinto]

144. Locking.

This round robin of accusations and counter accusations isn't constructive to discussion here on Democratic Underground. Thanks.