My vote is for C++ as the official language of the US

[imlost]

This isn't about learning English. It's pure racism.
I was born in Mexico, I speak Spanish, English, some French and I would love to learn Mandarin(my husband is Chinese).I also know how to program in Perl, Visual basic and C++. I don't know any Mexican that comes here and says I don't
want to learn English.

Besides does most of the US know proper English? I don't think so.

[Deja Q]

1. And those who do get scolded; told to talk at everyone else's level.

[mhatrw]

94. You are misunderestimating the subliminable stategeries of

non-English speakers.

[Big Kahuna]

2. PHP!

C++ is for housewives and little girls!

[imlost]

4. PHP is for wimps!

If you know assembly I'll have a crush!

[TlalocW]

24. PHP, Coldfusion and .Net

Learn those or get out of the country! :)

I also know assembley.

TlalocW

[michael_1166]

38. Python is also ok... makes a lot of tasks quite easy.

Btw., I know this'll make me sound like a smart ass, but I saw your signature:

"BUSH? Nein! Nicht meine feuhrer!"
Try this:
"BUSH? Nein, nicht mein Fuehrer!"

That'd be the correct German spelling...

:-)

[demnan]

3. C++ is so 1990s!

I thought everybody was programming in C# now. :D

[wakeme2008]

5. Only MS idiots program in C#

[no name no slogan]

32. Write once, debug everywhere

:D

[imlost]

6. I guess you know my age. At least I didn't say Pascal. n/t

[demobabe]

49. Or COBAL!

I love PHP, but you don't write standalone software with it.

[Buns_of_Fire]

57. That's COBOL, ye young whippersnapper! :-)

COmmon Business Oriented Language, I'll have ye know! Ah, I even remember the days when doing an MVCL (okay, I'm segueing into Assembler, here!) into the space at the end of a program would intrude into the operating system -- or another program -- and cause many and varied wonderous unexpected results!

And we liked it that way!

;-)

[demobabe]

70. Oh geez... Am I ever redfaced!

And to think I consider myself a geek. I can't believe I made that mistake. :dunce:

That's funny about the assembly language. The only thing I ever learned in assembly was how to make all the computers in the lab make a high-pitched squeel so the teacher would have to reboot them all.

Oh how I miss those days... ;)

[Jack Rabbit]

72. Another language I spoke well

I wrote poetry in COBOL.

But I never used an ALTER statement.

[Speck Tater]

8. FORTH rules!

But most of my professional work has been in C++, PHP, JAVA, PASCAL, FORTRAN, ASSEMBLY, COBOL, and going all the way back to 1963, IBM 1401 Autocoder with IOCS, and RPG.

[hootinholler]

36. Still the language that implements

Sun's boot rom.

My language progression looks like: Obscure military specific Machine Code->Basic->Assembler->FORTH->FORTRAN->PL/I->C->Java Note I kinda skipped C++, did some work in it but not enough to count, multiple inheritance always confused me.

Anytime you want to crank upthe wayback machine my friend we'll have a nice conversation.

-Hoot

[Fovea]

46. FORTH

The most elegant language I ever used.

[Recursion]

100. Forth *is* awesome

Every Sparc and Mac boots to it initially.

it to used not you're if understand to difficult be can syntax RPN but.

[longship]

11. C# is corporate MicroSloth's attempt to take over the world

Everybody knows that C is the universal computer language.

(FORTH is cool, too.)

[The Revolution]

73. C# is good

I think it's a lot better than Java. It's just more fun to code in, and things run a lot better. The JVM always seems clunky and slow to me.

I've been working with Perl a lot lately though.

But really everyone is still writing in C :)

[Kellanved]

78. C#? Only in MS commercials

I don't get why they are doing the whole "intermediate code" thing. It poses an extreme risk to the windows platform and a redesign of the Win32 API in a QT-like fashion would have been a more reasonable approach.
At the moment the C# API is changing too much and the benefits are just not there; a poor Java/VB clone where a qt clone was called for.

[immoderate]

79. What no APL?

Nothing like a language that requires its own symbols.

I've done some FORTRAN, VB, C, Java. Old time BASIC (Beginner's All-Purpose Symbolic Instruction Code) Whew! Never learned Cobol because I wasn't a great typist.

--IMM

[Solon]

7. I can't believe you forgot about Ruby or Perl.

I'm insulted, can't we have a multi-lingual nation?

[Maven]

65. Don't forget Tcl. nt

[undeterred]

9. Perl. It's the universal language.

[longship]

10. Pathetically Eclectic Rubbish Lister

I vote for LISP - Lots of Insidious, Stupid Parantheses

[Speck Tater]

15. LISP and FORTH have one thing in common...

They are both "Write Only" code. Once written, nobody can possibly read the code, which is why they are both so cool! It's like knowing a secret language that nobody else can speak.

[SnohoDem]

28. Yeah,

Recently I tried to read some FORTH code I wrote about 15 years ago. YEESH! But I did love it back in its day.

[Recursion]

101. They have a lot more in common

And what they have in common is what makes them so awesome:

1. Incremental compilation
2. An interactive system and a batch compilation system
3. Integrated source-level debuggers
4. Options to interpret, run bytecode, or compile natively
5. Applicative features (eg lisp macros: write code that produces more code)
6. Lexical closures
7. First-class functions that can be passed as arguments and returned as values

Learn forth and lisp, and every other programming language gets very easy. And that's not because forth and lisp are hard. It's because they make you think about programs as computations of values rather than a series of instructions about how to store to memory.

I'd also give a shout-out to Haskell and Ocaml.

[TahitiNut]

62. Perl - the throwaway language.

:puke:

[Fovea]

90. Some girls like PERLs

but my heart belongs to
Delphi.

[skids]

92. Perl rocks.

You can learn more about coding by learning Perl than any other language or textbook. And get more done in the process. And train yourself to write clean code instead of expecting the language to force you to.

Cannot wait for Perl6. Bring on the hyperops!

[Gman]

12. There is no good reason to not use COBOL

it has long been the national language.

[mark11727]

29. It ain't sexy but it's payin' the bills.

I also drive a seven year-old minivan.

It ain't sexy but it's haulin' the groceries.

[no name no slogan]

30. Hell yeah. There's more COBOL out there than Java

so says I guy I work with, who does data mining using COBOL and SQL on legacy mainframe stuff.

[Jack Rabbit]

13. I strongly disagree.

Democracy is not a top-down concept. C++ would be a very inappropriate official language for America.

The idea smacks of corporatism.

[paparush]

14. Assembly!! I fart in the general direction of your so-called

Object Oriented Languages...you silly progamming k-n-i-gg-i-t-s!!

[Hugin]

17. Seconded! All you johnny-come-lately carpet bagger C++ers trying to change

us!

Never!

[Marr]

16. Our forefathers spoke BASIC and that's how it should STAY.

[Jack Rabbit]

18. Hear! Hear!

Real Programmers Don't Use Pascal

[hootinholler]

39. A classic!

As is The story of Mel.

Robin Hood/Friar tuck is a good one too.

Who can forget Dykstra's GOTO rant?

-Hoot

[Buns_of_Fire]

60. Or, to put it succinctly...

10 PRINT "HEAR! HEAR!"
20 GOTO 10

[Speck Tater]

20. BASIC is a TOY language invented to teach programming to morons ...

It was never intended to be used for actual serious programming.

In that respect it's a lot like the language "MIX" which I'm sure nobody here but me is old enough to remember. (And if you do remember MIX, do you also remember "MAD" (Michigan Algorithmetic Decoder"))

[Marr]

21. YOU TAKE THAT BACK.

This is about traditional programming vs. slimy liberal nuance!

[demobabe]

51. Being that morons are running the country

BASIC is the perfect official language.

[documaker]

97. ROFL nt.

[kineneb]

19. howz about Python? -nt

[darkmaestro019]

22. Klingon! Klingon! (nt)

[demobabe]

52. Klingon is also a good choice

For a country that is hostile and promotes war...

[Turn CO Blue]

83. EXCELLENT! Should be on a bumper sticker! n/t

[alcibiades_mystery]

23. Python, baby

Not to mention that Perl is the first "postmodern" programming language, or so they say.

I also like C# (I know, I know - I shouldn't, but it has this strange draw for me...I go hours without even noticing it, something that never happened for me with C or C++...weird...)

[imlost]

31. Perl rocks! n/t

[alfredo]

25. At coctail parties I use SmallTalk.

[MazeRat7]

26. I personally prefer Java in the morning..... (n/t)

[Another Bill C.]

27. Machine language

Good old hexadecimal. It's nearly pure and as close to binary as they let us get. Sure, it takes longer but.... Sure, it takes longer.

[meg]

33. I like JAVA

Don't have to worry about those pointer thingys.

[brokensymmetry]

34. No, no, no. JAVA only. n/t.

.

[Renew Deal]

35. VB 2005

Spare me the "VB is not a programming language" talk.

:evilgrin:

[hootinholler]

37. P|-|34R da Penguin! n/t

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

75. I Like VB As Well.

At least I can still use it to code my company's access databases.

[tandem5]

40. C++, se puede! nt

[crispini]

41. ROFL! nt

[ContraBass Black]

42. You will all be left behind by the JAVA economy.

All your job are belong to us.

[Rex]

43. Let's all go back to FORTRAN!

Screw these snotty, bloated code-aholics!!

[Jack Rabbit]

44. Ah, my native language

I have not heard it spoken in years.

GOTO 1000

DO 100 I = 1, 100

100 CONTINUE

[CheshireCat]

45. Hey

After programming for over 30 years, I can count more than 30 programming languages that I have used.

Why should we limit ourselves to one language? Only a *MORAN* would do that.

"This isn't about learning English. It's pure racism."

I agree with you that at heart, that the "English only" concept is racist. My husband and other normally "good liberals" have tried to convince me otherwise, but I still see it as racist.

This doesn't mean that I think that all those who disagree are racist. But many come from "good Southern" families that tried to instill some racist ideas in them.

The dislike of all things not American, really shows the ignorance, born of arrogance, of most Americans.

[BlueEyedSon]

47. Java: compile once, crash everwhere!

[Endangered Specie]

82. Java is blasphemous filth!

People who like it should be hanged, drawn and quartered!! :evilgrin:

[RoyGBiv]

48. How about just plain binary.

#include <iostream>
using namespace std;
int main()
{
cout << "Why do this when you can be really complicated and do this:";
}

0101010101110011011101000110010101100100001000000110100001100001011000100110110001100001001000000110001001101001011011100110000101110010011010010110111100111111

http://nickciske.com/tools/binary.php

P.S.

01000111011100100110111101110110011001010110110001100010011011110111010000100000011100110110000101111001011100110010000001000100010011110100111001000001010101000100010100100001

[DarkTirade]

50. Yes, but now you're descriminating against mathmaticians.

Have you ever seen a mathmatician try to read any programming language? The minute they get to x=x+1, they freak out.

[imlost]

53. Funny. Mathmaticians are hot!

[DarkTirade]

95. Ewww... my uncle's a mathmatician, don't say that. :P

[demobabe]

55. That's why we changed it to x++

[BlooInBloo]

86. Maybe vacuum-tube days mathematicians....

... I don't know any contemporary maths profs who aren't at least part-time programmers.

At the idiot level you example illustrates, matlab and mathematica suffice, and are completely ubiquitous in academia.

Many, if not more, have substantially more programming ability as well (c, fortran, or somesuch).

[DarkTirade]

96. It was a joke.

Mostly about how x=x+1 doesn't work in math, but does in programming.
And now you've ruined it. I hope you're happy. :)

[0rganism]

54. Hmm, do we really deserve a compiled language?

I'm thinking maybe some variably-interpreted, insecure, derivative, non-standard, convenience-oriented, Microsoft-created webclone might be more representative of the current state of affairs. Do I hear any votes for J-Script?

[ElboRuum]

56. Oh, the great programming debate...

Well, fanboys and fangirls, its time for Elbo's clues.

All of the following are a waste of time to learn:

C++, C, BASIC, PASCAL, COBOL, ADA, LISP, FORTH, VB, VC++, Perl, Python, Java, Assembly, HTML, ASP, XML, Javascript, .NET anything, FORTRAN, Smalltalk.

If I've left any out, it wasn't on purpose. All programming languages are a waste of time to learn. You could learn them all and still suck as a coder.

If you really want to be on the bleeding edge, then learn HOW to code. From some of the code I've been unfortunate enough to review, I would hazard a guess that 75% of the coding community can't think in the language they're trying to write in and it shows in the bleary, buggy hacks they produce.

Learn proper object orientation if you're using an object oriented languages, learn top-down design and bottom-up coding if you're using procedural programming, and if you're doing web development on any scripted technology, well then forget everything and keep hacking because that's all script's good for. And if you're still using ROL, ROR, MOV, etc. please bang yourself repeatedly in the head with a hammer until everything goes dark. Time to evolve, sunshine.

If you know object-orientation like you should, you already know every object-oriented language. It's just semantics after that.

I gather from this that DU is now affiliated with Slashdot? Lovely.

By the way, your operating system sucks, too.

:smoke:

[hootinholler]

66. What are you from Elbonia?

Good point about learning how to write code, and this ain't quite so slashdotty yet.

I'd rather have a flame war about XP and test first coding than truthout and Roves indictment. At least I care about the gospel of XP.

As to the OS it's Free BSD boxen here baby.

-Hoot

[Cruzan]

74. Very true. I've worked with some truly sucky coders.

Of course their first language was either dBase or Visual Basic, both of which allow truly sucky coders with enough effort to eventually create a program that runs to spec. And that is the problem: the mindset that 'Well it runs, so I'm done.' This is all so typical of those whose only exposure to programming is with a language at such a high level (and with an IDE to match) that they can get away with creating absurdly designed code (if any thought was even put into design) because either they've documented the hell out of the crap they wrote or the guy they wrote it for has not, nor cares to, have a clue what exactly they did. The advantage of a language like C is that because of its nature, it will weed out the incompetent fucktards, who have no business programming in the first place, at their first pass of debugging and prevent the monstrosities of code they've written from ever seeing the light of day, or worse, to have to be untangled and eventually completely rewritten by those finally hired to clean up the mess and rescue the project.

[Placebo]

58. C++ is the devil!

I took a class in C++ once and almost failed out. Computer programming is not for me. :D

[area51]

59. I'm sorry...

... but my favorite language is Perl. :evilgrin:

[TahitiNut]

61. APL! APL! APL!

Concise. Complete. Flexible. International.

I'd welcome Snobol as the official second language!

[hootinholler]

67. And one you have to buy a new keyboard for...

or at least load macros that will do a nondestructive backspace.

*That* was a real good idea. Other than that though not a bad language.

-Hoot

[TahitiNut]

77. Little decals work ... and I never used a typewriter

... with a 'destructive' backspace. Did you? What idjit made it destructive on the 'puter? Sounds like a BUG to me! :silly:

All the characters are included in Unicode (UTF-8).

' ( ) + , - . / : ; < = > ? < >
\ _ ¨ ¯ × ÷ ← ↑ → ↓ ∆ ∇ ∘ ∣ ∧ ∨
∩ ∪ ∼ ≠ ≤ ≥ ≬ ⊂ ⊃ ⌈ ⌊ ⊤ ⊥ ⋆ ⌶ ⌷
⌸ ⌹ ⌺ ⌻ ⌼ ⌽ ⌾ ⌿ ⍀ ⍁ ⍂ ⍃ ⍄ ⍅ ⍆ ⍇
⍈ ⍉ ⍊ ⍋ ⍌ ⍍ ⍎ ⍏ ⍐ ⍑ ⍒ ⍓ ⍔ ⍕ ⍖ ⍗
⍘ ⍙ ⍚ ⍛ ⍜ ⍝ ⍞ ⍟ ⍠ ⍡ ⍢ ⍣ ⍤ ⍥ ⍦ ⍧
⍨ ⍩ ⍪ ⍫ ⍬ ⍭ ⍮ ⍯ ⍰ ⍱ ⍲ ⍳ ⍴ ⍵ ⍶ ⍷
⍸ ⍹ ⍺ ⎕ ○

[TrogL]

93. APL kept me from making a big mistake

I was in computing science and wanted to work from home. I went to the local IBM store and had a long look at the original IBM PC (yes, I'm old, have gray hair, remember horse-drawn wagons). I ask the salesman how to set up the machine to emulate the APL character set and he blanched and asked "why would you want to do that?". Then I asked him about printing graphics and half a dozen other questions, getting the same answer each time "why would you want to do that?".

I bought a Macintosh the next day - it had an APL font.

[al bupp]

63. It's the thread...

that brings all the code warriors out of the woodwork!

[porphyrian]

64. It is both powerful and versatile. - n/t

[Cruzan]

68. C is the one true language. C++ is an aberration.

All that object-oriented crap is for sissies anyway.

[gristy]

69. What, no one likes awk?

:hide:

[diamondsndust]

71. damn, and here I am still learning HTML....

but Sun Microsystems is giving away their $2000 Studio Site Creator for free.. it's a 175MB download, but well worth it. Then again, I also have a T-1 speed connection downloading 10MB/min.... makes the $110/mo connection worth it to me :)

Get the Studio Creator here: http://developers.sun.com/prodtech/javatools/jscreator/downloads/index.jsp

[Kellanved]

76. As language for the US? No, it'll have to be ADA

n/t

[Brundle_Fly]

80. TCL

nuff said.

[Roland99]

81. Elitist programmer! VB.NET or DIE!

;)

[BlooInBloo]

84. imlost += coolness

:)

[JackDragna]

85. No way!

We all know the only true language for this country is Esperanto.

[onehandle]

87. Esperanto is the language of the future. nt

[rpgamerd00d]

88. Java > all. pwned.

[Theodolite]

89. fortran90

Fortran90/95/2003 has many of the same features but without the complexity and allows more aggressive optimizations than C++. Fortran66/77/IV must be banned, anyone caught using fortran77 should be deported to Fortranistan.

[eppur_se_muova]

91. Haw! Finally someone answered my question ...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=2634930&mesg_id=2636106

[Sgent]

98. JCL is the only way to go

Job Control Language was the first real world programming language I had to learn after college. I know now why old mainframes died.

[Recursion]

99. Pshaw. Lisp

People who don't use Lisp always end up re-implementing it in any big enough project.