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Was 2004 A Stolen Election? Listen To Mark Crispln Miller.

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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 07:08 PM
Original message
Was 2004 A Stolen Election? Listen To Mark Crispln Miller.
Edited on Fri May-05-06 07:26 PM by Kurovski
Yesterday on Wolf Blitzer's "Situation Room", Paul Begala, in the manner of the cheerfully obsequious Bennigans' waiter he so often resembles, stated his belief that George W. won the 2004 election "fair and square."

The rest of us don't have to worry about remaining on CNN's payroll, and so may be freer to examine that statement more closely.

If you are someone who is still not as certain as Begala, (and even if you are) I urge you to please listen and watch the talk by Mark Crispin Miller, author of "Fooled Again: How the Right Stole the 2004 Election & Why They'll Steal the Next One Too (Unless We Stop Them)" which is currently provided online by C-Span at the following link:

http://www.booktv.org/feature/index.asp?segid=6941&sche...

If it moves you to read his book--which has been blacked-out by the Corporate Media since last November--all the better. If you want to continue informing others about the topic, and contact your representatives, even better.

And what would be the best thing of all is to organize a protest, as DUer goclark has suggested in the past:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Evidence of the ease of election fraud by Republican-owned machines is revealed on a daily basis in this country. It is no longer so far a stretch to see evidence of an outright theft, nor to expect future theft of elections on a scale never before seen in America's history.

My thanks to goclark for suggesting this post! :hi:





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neoblues Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 08:56 PM
Response to Original message
1. Why is this topic not at the top of our list?
Especially here at DU? Without REAL Election Reform, we are almost surely doomed to continue losing...
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Not enough photos of Norah O'Donnell in a bikini?
Edited on Fri May-05-06 10:03 PM by Kurovski
:shrug: That could help.

EDIT: Seriously, it's not a sexy topic, it can get confusing. The media, Republicans and some Dems have expended a great deal of energy in making even the thought of a stolen election unpopular if not unthinkable.

People don't like stepping out front when they see that people who do are treated viciously, or considered "nutjobs". Partly groupthink, partly denial, and maybe a whole lot of bad information.
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Amend that to "...MOSTLY a whole lot of bad information." (nt)
Edited on Fri May-05-06 11:05 PM by Kurovski
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #4
13. Get over it?
Most of us are over it. Sure, we all trust that the elections this year will be just fine. The press, bless their cold money loving hearts, have seen to it that the stolen election story has not been told. Just imagine if they had told the story...

The shallow faith people now have in the governors would evaporate overnight. Nobody would believe anything - just as they should - if the press told them the story about how the election was stolen, so we owe the press for not screwing up everything and bring the house down.
:sarcasm:

All those conspiracy theorists who keep bringing up facts about the election are left swinging in the wind by those pre-occupied by the petty shenanigans brought on by the election stealers. But hey, they like swinging, so, no harm, no foul!

In the meantime, bolstered with having gotten away scot-free with the theft of elections, the criminals have instituted their unmoral propositions upon the ignorant citizens who are just now beginning to notice that 'something ain't right'.

The press ain't right, or is Right, but the Right looks all wrong, as long as one looks at them the right way. Right on!

They like to call it a revolution but the process is plain old modern day technologically adapted to plain old criminal theft. And we are getting over it, just like they figured.

People get the government they deserve, and even tho they never once elected the criminals to office, they are getting what they deserve, because the price of a gallon of gas is more important these days than the price of democracy.

Ah well, I've got mine, and to hell with the rest of the world. Yes, I've fallen into the same trap which ensnares the rest of my people. When in Rome, they say, do as the Romans do.

Peace.
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Right ~That's why we must BE the MEDIA

We can not keep waiting for the Media to "get it" because they are being paid off NOT to GET IT!

We MUST START an EMAIL BLITZ CAMPAIGN now!

About a year ago, someone on DU talked about a Newspaper that could fit in the palm of your hand, it could be put in shopping carts and between the pages of the magazine at the doctors office etc.

We must educate the grass roots!

I will look for that link and we must DO IT! :bounce:
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Mr_Jefferson_24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 12:20 AM
Response to Reply #13
17. "...When in Rome, they say, do as the Romans do."
We may not be in Rome, but we're very near the point of doing exactly as the Roman Empire did, and for similar reasons. Understanding history's lessons is one thing, successfully applying them in order to head off disaster is quite another.
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #4
14. A thousand thanks Kurovski for your post and Mark's video link!
Election Fraud is The Cat On The Hot Tin Roof for America.

We can talk about Goss being fired and Snow Boy getting a new Phony Op job until the cows come home and ~ it will NOT MATTER!

Nothing matters if we can't have FRAUD FREE ELECTIONS!!!!

Nothing else M -A- T- T-E-R -S!

IRAQ can burn to the ground and we won't be able to do anything about it, cause DIEBOLD will put them in office again!

Our CIVIL RIGHTS will continue to dry up like raisins in the sun and we won't be able to do anything about it, cause DIEBOLD will have our grandchildren under NAZI CONTROL!

NOTHING ELSE is more important than this FRAUD FREE ELECTION! Nothing!

Now what are WE going to do about it!?

As my uncle would say, " We Need Action Jackson!"

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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 12:21 AM
Response to Reply #14
18. I can see that viewing Mark Crispin Miller's talk has inspired you.
I hope it will do the same for tens of thousands more. Millions.

Really folks, no matter where you stand on the issue, you should give a listen.

Thank you for kicking, and kicking up a storm, goclark! :-)
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #14
41. Spread that link to Mark Crispin Miller around,
that's a good start!

People won't be able to do anything without knowing what's going on.

We can build a grassroots movement, as I think you've said elsewhere in this thread.

Please Send out this link, everyone!
http://www.booktv.org/feature/index.asp?segid=6941&sche...
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #41
43. Absolutely sent to all my email buddies

Can you just imagine how powerful it would be if we all sent an email to our Internet address books.

As of today, DU has 88,872 user registrations!

Let's get busy, somebody must be able to make up a flyer for us to email to our friends!

Yes I will beg because it is URGENT! :patriot:
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 07:09 AM
Response to Reply #1
22. We have a forum dedicated to this topic:
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #22
24. Thanks rman, I have posted to that forum
and for me, Josetta Average Voter, the answers are far too complicated for US.

It is a wonderful forum for computer geeks and those that can read 500 words or more to look for answers.

It is a wonderful forum for those that want to learn the technical points and/or to discover the latest laws and updates for each state.

It would be wonderful if there could be a " All We Want is TRUTHisALL" thread there every day that would contain email ideas of 20 words or less with NOTHING BUT THE FACTS graphics that we could send to our friends and they could forward to their friends.

I'm talking about US being the Media!

Note: I know that the first thing someone will say is ,"Go on GoJOSETTA CLARK and make that happen!"

I wish I had the skills to do it but I don't.

If I could consult with someone that understands what I know will work and has the skills in graphic design and communication to put my ideas on paper, we would have a winner! :)

Goclark was a Kindergarten teacher for many years.

I know how to think that way!

That is what this Issue needs RIGHT NOW ~ someone who THINKS like a Kindergarten teacher that can communicate and OK ideas made up by someone that understands the issues like TRUTHISALL.

Anyone can email me with ideas that could work.

TRUTHISALL :yourock:
I read down thread that TRUTHISALL is not well. Please say it is not so!

We need to KICK this ELECTION FRAUD issue just for our hero TRUTHISALL. :kick:
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #1
28. If we keep it kicked we can STOMP OUT Election Fraud!


Yes!

I am with you one million percent!
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 09:10 PM
Response to Original message
2. It's not a question to me any more. It's blatantly obvious WHAT they
set up--to steal U.S. elections starting in 2002 and on into the future--WHO set it up, WHO has been corrupted by it, HOW it works and HOW it benefits Bushites and warmongers.

The story begins with the two biggest crooks in Congress, Tom Delay and Bob Ney, who engineered the "Help America Vote Act," as a $4 billion electronic voting boondoggle for Bush's buds at Diebold and ES&S.

Diebold: Until recently, headed by Wally O'Dell, a Bush-Cheney campaign chair and major fundraiser, who promised (in writing) to "deliver Ohio" to Bush-Cheney in 2004; and

ES&S: A spinoff of Diebold (similar computer architecture), initially funded by far rightwing billionaire Howard Ahmanson, who also gave one million dollars to the extremist 'christian' Chalcedon Foundation (which touts the death penalty for homosexuals, among other things).

Diebold and ES&S have an incestuous relationship; they are run by two brothers, Tod and Bob Urosevich.

These are people who "counted" 80% of the nation's votes in 2004, using "TRADE SECRET," PROPRIETARY programming code, with virtually no audit/recount controls--as the result of the piece of crap legislation that Tom Delay and Bob Ney (and also Dem Christopher Dodd) pushed through the Anthrax Congress.

HAVA (aka, the "Hack America's Vote Act," and the "Help America Vote for Bush Act"), not only permitted private, corporate "trade secret" vote tabulation, it failed to require any kind of paper trail, failed to ban partisan vendors, failed to ban or control lavish lobbying, failed to ban secret industry "testing" of the machines, and set up an underfunded Bush-appointed regulatory group (the EAC-Election Assistance Commission) that has been bribing, corrupting and bullying county/state election officials around the country, to purchase these crapass, insecure, hackable, Bushite-controlled voting systems.

All rushed into place for the 2004 election. This is the egregiously NON-TRANSPARENT, UNVERIFIABLE, CORPORATE-CONTROLLED voting system that kept Bush in office.

That is the starting point for any analysis of the 2004 election results. They deliberately, consciously installed a non-transparent voting system, controlled by Bushite corporations. They could have fixed it, at any point. Transparency is not difficult. It's a no-brainer, really. They did not.

Election Day, 2004. Bush was doing so poorly in the pre-election polls that Zogby (independent pollster) said he could not win. The Democrats had blown the Republicans away in new voter registration, in 2004, nearly 60/40. It was showing. All day long, Kerry was winning. People were flocking to the polls to oust Bush. Biggest turnout in history. The corporate news monopoly "consortium" exit polls said Kerry was winning, and the final exit polls said he won the election by a 3% margin. But we never got their final result. There was a suspicious computer "glitch" in the reporting system. It went down for an hour. And when it came back up, the corporate pollster had DOCTORED the exit polls--filled them with false numbers--to force them to 'FIT' the results that were coming in from Diebold/ES&S's secret vote tabulation formulae--that Bush won.

Exit polls are used worldwide to verify elections, and check for fraud. Not here. Here, they 'fit' the exit polls to the non-transparent "official results."

Biggest journalistic crime I've ever witnessed. They put false numbers one everybody's TV screens, then tried to hide the real exit poll results from the American people. Fortunately, alert bloggers and analysts took screen shots of the early exit poll results, analyzed them, and eventually forced the pollster to admit that Kerry had won the exit polls. Word got around the blogosphere in the week after the election--and many experts got involved. Meanwhile, reports began coming in of massive vote suppression against Democratic voters in Ohio--a critical battleground state, and a state that had NOT fully converted to Wally O'Dell's vote counting system, due to protests against the machines.* The vote suppression was blatant and visible--unnecessary shortages of precincts and voting machines in poor black and other Dem areas, resulting in 4-10 hour long voting lines; open intimidation and unfair challenges of voters. Also, the touchscreens, by far the worst of the election theft machinery, were reported to be changing Kerry votes to Bush votes--over 80 reports of this (with only 2 or 3 going the other way), and those were just the ones that voters caught and managed to report. Other investigators found out why Warren County was locked down by a phony "terrorist alert" during the count. They were taking un-numbered ballots with votes for Kerry to precincts where Kerry was on a different position on the ballot, thus 'disappearing' the Kerry vote.

In summary, based on overwhelming inferential evidence, in non-transparent conditions, Kerry won the election. In non-transparent conditions, the only evidence you HAVE is inferential. That's why the case cannot be conclusively proven. Where are the ballots for a recount? A third of the country voted with no paper trail at all, let alone a real ballot backup. You can't even recount it. But from the exit polls, the pre-election poll trend (toward Kerry), the overwhelming Dem success in new voter registration, direct analysis of what happened in the vote count in some cases, and all sorts of corollary evidence (such as hundreds of newspaper editors who had endorsed Bush in 2000 switching to a Kerry endorsement in 2004)--and from the deliberate set-up of non-transparent conditions, and secret partisan control of the count, it's just about as conclusive as it can be.

Kerry won.

And if you believe otherwise, prove it to me. Show me the ballots. Tell me how they were "counted." Tell me who "counted" them. Tell me, with the vast majority of new voters voting for Kerry, the vast majority of independent voters voting for Kerry, the vast majority of former Nader voters voting for Kerry, and, figuring Gore/Bush 2000 voters as a wash (about equal, canceling each other out), HOW did Bush win? Show me!

The whole thing was a goddamned BushWorld, corporate news monopoly DELUSION.

Next question: Why did the Democratic Party leadership not object? Are they insane? I thought that for a while--sent buggerhouse by fear of the Bush junta. But now I think it's a more complex answer--involving corruption on electronic voting, as well as on Bush's war, and fear. Fear of the junta. Fear of Diebold/ES&S's power. Fear of overpowerful, corrupt election officials. Word came down from the top--Terry McAulife, Donna Brazille, et al--don't rock the boat. Christopher Dodd (corrupt on electronic voting) was Kerry's adviser on the machines. My guess, they misinformed and bullied Kerry (who was facing a hostile Congress, a hostile press, a hostile Supreme Court, and the party wouldn't get his back, because they had become so fucking corrupt.) I don't fault him for his concession as much as I fault THEM. Our party leaders betrayed us, and sold away our right to vote.

A word about Diebold/ES&S vs. Ohio. I suspect that the massive vote suppression in Ohio occurred because Kerry's win was bigger than the rigged machines around the nation could handle. The riggable machines were Plan A. Ohio (massive, visible vote suppression) was Plan B. If true--if the machines have to be pre-programmed, and are not so easy to change on election day--this means that we can beat the machines with massive turnout. With the "trade secret" computer programming, they could shave off a half a percent here, two percent there, whatever they needed to pad Bush's popular majority, and to secure just enough electoral votes. These machines are easily hackable--just a line or two of code, one hacker, a couple of minutes, leaving no trace. The testing procedures are laughable (done in secret, by industry testers). The "trade secret" code is so secret that not even our secretaries of state are permitted to review it. The hacking probably occurred in the central tabulators, rather than individual machines (except for the touchscreens, which were blatantly changing votes).

When our Calif (Dem) Sec of State Kevin Shelley, newly elected in 2003, got onto this Bushite scam, sued Diebold and decertified the worst of their election theft machines, prior to the 2004 election, the Bush junta targeted him for a "swiftboating" and later destroyed him (early 2005), while the Calif Dem Party leaders hid under their desks, or openly sided with corrupt county election officials.

I have never been so shocked. I thought Calif was relatively safe on elections, with Kevin Shelley in charge. (As part of his suit, he demanded to examine Diebold source code, for instance.) Down he went--the victim of completely bogus corruption charges--aided and abetted by the war profiteering corporate news monopolies and the new Dem Party legislative leadership (the old guard had all just retired the year before). Now we Diebold shill Bruce McPherson--APPOINTED BY SCHWARZENEGGER in collusion with the Dem Party legislative leaders (who have a 2 to 1 majority in both houses, and could have stopped it). McPherson has now ILLEGALLY reversed Shelley's decertification of Diebold touchscreens. Sickening.

Things are turning around in Calif. Debra Bowen, a real election system reformer, a state senator, is running for Sec of State against McPherson. She was just endorsed by the Calif Dem Party, with 80% of the delegates votes. The grass roots are rising!

Why do I think the Bush junta stole the 2004 election? It is not just the exit poll evidence and everything else. It is also a classic case of Means, Motive, and Opportunity. And added to these: evidence of pre-planning. We could have had a transparent election system. They went out of their way to see that we did not. (There is also the Clint Curtis affidavit--a computer engineer who was hired by a FLA Repub Congressman to WRITE an election theft program!) Lying, deceit, unlawfulness, torture, mass murder, bribery, corruption of every kind. These are criminals. Give criminals the opportunity to control all evidence against them, power over the courts and the justice system, freedom to loot the federal government, massive unaccountability, and a corrupt, non-transparent election system to keep them in power, and what do you think they will do? Suddenly become virtuous and democratic?

Bah.

It's the naysayers who are living in fantasyland, and us 'conspiracy theorists' who are living in reality, on this one. Feel free to live in the corporate delusion of democracy, if you want to. But if you really want your country back, you need to face and understand the powers that are arrayed against American democracy, how power operates, what power is, what it means to be a sovereign people, how we exercise our sovereignty through voting, and that our vote is virtually equivalent to our sovereignty. It IS our power. They have taken it away. And we MUST get it back, for any other change to be possible.




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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Thank you for a reply that touches on so many points.
There are still people who are not convinced, are unsure, or who perhaps have not given it much thought. I was hoping the info here would give them more to think about. You've done a great job of helping that cause along.

As for those who for whatever reason refuse to consider it, well, what'cha gonna do? Thanks.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #3
19. Kurovski, if you can engage doubters and naysayers, if they want to talk
about it, keep it simple. Point out the "trade secret," proprietary programming code. The numerous tests proving these machines insecure and hackable. The companies fighting a paper trail. The $4 billion boondoggle by Bushite Congressional crooks, corrupting so many. The haste and pressure with which these crappy machines were purchased. The lavish lobbying. The partisan ties of the three main vendors (also Sequoia). Non-transparent, unverifiable elections. It's just plain unAmerican! It's common sense to have transparent elections, where everybody can see and understand how the votes are counted. That's what they have destroyed: transparency.

You don't have to start with the second stolen election. It's a mind-boggling story. It may be too much for some people to take in all at once--if they're not up on things. The news media. The Bushites. The Dem Party. The county/state election officials. Everybody failed us. We can rely on NO ONE. That's hard to take in. It's scary. So just stick with the obvious non-transparency, and that we MUST fix this. And give them something do.

If you stop at that point, they are not overwhelmed. The stolen election is IMPLIED by this blatant non-transparency and corruption. Let them think it through. Also tell them: We CAN beat the machines (which have to be pre-programmed for fraud) by massive turnout. And DO request an absentee ballot, and deliver it to you polling place (if that is allowed) rather than mailing it. (In Calif, we can request a paper ballot--we have that option--at the polling place, but this is not an option in many places.) Absentee ballots are by no means the ultimate answer (because they are scanned into computers, and subject to the secret vote tabulation programming), but they ARE a paper ballot record of your vote--useful for recounts and election challenges and investigations--and they ARE a protest against the machines. If enough people requested AB ballots, we wouldn't NEED the machines at all! --and maybe we could then get rid of the central tabulators, and hand-count the absentee ballots.

Make it an upper, not a downer. Bumper sticker: "Help Us Beat the Machines--VOTE!"

-----

Here are some resources and activist sites...

-----

SOME RESOURCES FOR AMERICAN REVOLUTION II:

Hopeful signs - latest news:

California voters sue the state over Diebold:
www.VoterAction.org is suing the state of California and 18 Calif county registrars on behalf of 25 California voter/plaintiffs, on the illegal Diebold "certification" by Schwarzenegger appointee Bruce McPherson.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
Seven of these counties just promised the judge they would use PAPER BALLOTS, and were dismissed from this lawsuit (4/27/06).
http://kcbs.com/pages/29285.php
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Maryland rejects Diebold:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Florida - anti-trust accusations against Diebold, ES&S and Sequoia, re: heroic Florida election official Ion Sancho:
(FLA AG subpoenas the companies)
http://www.computerworld.com/governmenttopics/governmen...
http://www.tbo.com/news/politics/MGBKSY8W8LE.html
(info & discussion)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Utah county clerk fights back!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

-----

More resources for American Revolution II:

www.votersunite.org (MythBreakers - easy primer on electronic voting--one of the myths is that HAVA requires electronic voting; it does not.)
www.UScountvotes.org (statistical monitoring of '06 and '08 elections--they need donations)


(Activist sites with links to state activist groups or info)
www.votetrustusa.org (news of this great movement from around the country)
www.votersunited.org (good general info, and state links)
www.verifiedvoting.org (great activist site)
www.solarbus.org/election/index.shtml (fab compendium of all election info)

www.freepress.org (devoted to election reform)
www.bradblog.com (also great, and devoted to election reform)
www.TruthIsAll.net (analysis of the 2004 election)* :patriot: :applause: :patriot:
www.votepa.us (well-organized local group of citizen activists in Pennsylvania, where important legal issues are at stake, including state's rights over election systems)
Provisions of the PA lawsuit:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

The Voter Confidence Resolution
http://tinyurl.com/rlnr2 (We Do Not Consent)
http://guvwurld.blogspot.com (GuvWurld blog main page)
http://tinyurl.com/amryg (Voter Confidence Resolution

www.debrabowen.com (Calif Senator running for Sec of State to reform election system)
www.johnbonifaz.com (running for Massachusetts Sec of State on strong election reform and antiwar platform)

*Some tributes to TruthIsAll, who is very ill:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Congressional bills:

Russ Holt's HR 550 requires a real paper ballot, bans secret software in "voting machines", and has more than 170 co-sponsors, but the audit required is too weak, it promotes electronic voting and centralized power, and the secret software might be permitted to continue in the central tabulators (the bill is not clear). To sign the HR 550 petition: http://www.rushholt.com/petition.html
At lot of discussion at DU of the loopholes/pitfalls in HR 550:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
(Note: Senate Bill-SB 330 and House-HR704 simply require a "voter verified paper audit trail" (VVPAT), which may be best for the moment.)


Also of interest:

Michael Collins (Autorank)'s searing election reform article for New Zealand's Scoop.com
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Bob Koehler (-- four recent election reform initiatives in Ohio, predicted to win by 60/40 votes, flipped over, on election day, into 60/40 LOSSES!--the biggest flipover we've seen yet; the election theft machines and their masters are now dictating election policy! Title: "Poll Shock" 11/24/05)
http://commonwonders.com/archives/col321.htm

Bob Koehler's latest: "Trust us: Take this box and stuff it" (3/16/06)
http://commonwonders.com/archives/col337.htm
More Koehler:
www.tmsfeatures.com/tmsfeatures/subcategory.jsp?file=20...

Amaryllis (Diebold, ES&S, Sequoia lavish lobbying of election officials - Beverly Hilton, Aug. '05)
www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=vi...

HOWARD DEAN remarks on electronic voting machines 04/06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

------------------------------------------------

Throw Diebold, ES&S and ALL election theft machines into 'Boston Harbor' NOW!

:think: :patriot: :woohoo: :patriot: :think:

-----------

"That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it." --Thomas Jefferson, The Declaration of Independence
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #19
25. Loved your post, it contained info for us to Bookmark!
Your bumper sticker idea is a winner!
That's what I'm talking about!

I've seen several stickers around that say,"IMPEACH GEORGE BUSH!"
Great thought but the ISSUE is we can't do that with ELECTION FRAUD in the bag for the RepubliCONS!

Thanks for the links, I checked as many as I could to see if I could find ideas for what I am talking about.

This was the closest that I came to..

http://www.votersunite.org/info/flyers.asp

There is one there that is a garbage can with the votes thrown in it that is almost on the money.

But, it doesn't have the daily update on what Joe/Joesetta Average CAN Do Today!

DU is the perfect setting because every day we have thousands of creative people that visit our site and enjoy emailing all their friends.

I see it as a way to have INSTANT EMAILS/FLYERS to select from that could encourage EVERYONE to WATCH OUT for ELECTION FRAUD and make their voices heard.


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Raster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. Here, here!!! Not a doubt in my mind. Not a one.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. It started with the theft of the 2000 election with the help of the....
...U. S. Supreme Court 5-4 vote.
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #9
16. And it has now reached perfection unless WE stop it!


The American people must become informed and they are still asleep.

They can not continue to take Ambian while the DIEBOLD Machines are continuing to be put in place!

We can shout PAPER BALLOTS NOW! and No One will hear us because they don't know what to DO.

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Kansas Wyatt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 09:26 PM
Response to Original message
5. I still recall Begala laughing and snickering at
Ken Mehlman the night of the election, because Ken claimed his sources (Karl's computer bank) said Bush still had a shot to overcome what appeared to be a Kerry landslide. Begala even made the comment that he had been in Mehlman's shoes before, and had to put his best face on while knowing it was over. Even Novak was in a gloomy dismal mood from the results they were getting about who was going to be the winner, without question.

Yet, Begala claims nothing unusual happened, again.
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #5
30. The fix was in and it will be again


They are going to have to steal way more votes this time because they are desperate!

If they can get us this time, they will hold America forever.

After 8 years of Bush, the stacking of the Supreme Court

All of his DIEBOLD folks in order, even down to the ELECTION officials in key states like Blackwell, we are in for a rude awakening.IT IS NOT TOO LATE!

Let's work to get the info out to Main Stream America!

WE can BE the MEDIA on ELECTION FRAUD!
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nicknameless Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 11:07 PM
Response to Original message
7. K&R
The media is owned by, and is a tool of the reich-wing.

In spite of the garbage teeveeee spoon-feeds their viewers 24/7, only 32% (backwash) still believe the lies.
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Bill Bored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 11:13 PM
Response to Original message
10. kick and thanks for the C-Span link! nt
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livvy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 11:16 PM
Response to Original message
11. K&R n/t
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-05-06 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
12. K and R and Everyone MUST take an hour while on your computer
to listen to the brilliant Mark Crispin Miller. :patriot:

I was totally blown away when I heard it and I will get the book.

You MUST hear him lament about his talk with John Kerry,

He TALKED to John Kerry about the fact that the election was stolen!
You MUST hear him say what KERRY told him!!!!!

You must send this thread to everyone you know so that the GRASS ROOTS will finally HEAR what is going on with ELECTION FRAUD.

We tap the keys on our computers all day and all night bitching and complaining about ELECTION FRAUD.

We are wasting our time!
Listen to Mark and make this the # 1 topic on our keyboard agenda!

Let's throw the damn plastic DIEBOLD machines in the harbor ~ wake up America, wake up!

It's Tea Party Time!!!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph... : :toast:
:bounce:
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #12
36. I used to defend Kerry after the election, because of the promise
Edited on Sat May-06-06 02:55 PM by Kurovski
he made to protect our vote, I took him at his word that he was working on defending our vote, even after he conceded the race much too early.

after the GAO (Government accountability Office) came out with a report on election machine problems indicating fraud, and Kerry had the perfect back-up, an opportunity to speak up, he let it go right past. He has yet to make good on his promise, and at this point--it's much too late for him to regain my confidence.
http://www.bradblog.com/archives/00001964.htm

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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-07-06 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #36
48. This is an action the Dem PARTY has to take on to secure machines BEFORE
the vote. AFTER is too late. Rigged machines are set-up for onetime use and then all evidence disappears.
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Touchdown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 01:07 AM
Response to Original message
20. Can't watch the vid but I read the book already.
Bought it in January when Miller was interviewed by Sam Seder. Everybody here should get a copy, whether you believe or not.

There are no conspiracy theories here. Just questions. Questions that people in power are refusing to answer. Why?
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LaPera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 03:35 AM
Response to Original message
21. Kick!
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I Have A Dream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 07:34 AM
Response to Original message
23. Kick.
:kick:
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #23
26. I have a DREAM too, I have a DREAM
that DU'ers will wake up and realize that without informing the general public about what to do when they go to vote in the next two months, we are DOOMED!

Nothing else matters but STOMPING OUT ELECTION FRAUD.

Yes! I can see the visual!
A graphic with a cute little child,with a multi racial look, carrying an American flag and the words say....

SAVE America From ELECTION FRAUD!
BEFORE YOU VOTE, DEMAND A PAPER BALLOT if you live in _________!
TAKE YOUR BALLOT to your polling place and PUT IT IN THE BOX. :patriot:
DO IT FOR ME!

Please someone, make that a cute visual for us so that we can send it to all our friends that live in the STATES that can have Paper Ballots. I heard California is one state, is that true?

The 1st person to make a visual that meets my ideal, I'll donate $20 to DU.
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helderheid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 11:04 AM
Response to Original message
27. a
:kick:
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #27
29. Helderheid you are the best!


My offer still stands DU, $20 donation to DU for anyone that can make an email visual of my post above.

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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 12:42 PM
Response to Original message
31. After reading people's praise of Begala for so long on DU,
- a phenomenon that mystified me in the light of his Beltway stance on economics - and now reading this, Begala strikes me as being the ultimate fink. The finks' fink. I think I'd prefer Lieberman.
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. Nobody can win if we don't fix Election Fraud

I agree with you totally.

Begala is a wimp and Mark Miller has taught us that fixing ELECTION FRAUD is not for WIMPS.


Begala would not hardly want to "get cut from his $$$'s job to point out to the American public that the FIX is in. None are brave enough that I know of, not even KEITH. :(
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #31
34. Begala has used that "fair and square" line before.
He's quite proud of his ill-informed "bi-partisanship".

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The Wielding Truth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 01:43 PM
Response to Original message
33. Amazing! Thank you,Kurovoski . "Political Activism is Crucial"
"Most people are not inexplicably stupid."

We must keep the right to have our votes counted.
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. Thank you for watching it T WT, please share the link with others.
Spread the word, build up some steam to fuel demonstrations.
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Viva_La_Revolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
37. kickypoo!
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #37
38. Hehehehe...
Now stop that! :rofl:

Is it a carving of Job?
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bleever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
39. K&R, especially for the detailed and informative responses.
:kick:
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 05:52 PM
Response to Original message
40. Kick(nt)
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 08:18 PM
Response to Original message
42. Read the book. Heard Miller talk at UNC-Chapel Hill
He told the story of Kerry privately agreeing the election was stolen and then publicly denying he'd said that.

Frankly, I think Miller is correct. And the fact that the Dems won't talk about it does not bode well for future elections.
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autorank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 10:24 PM
Response to Original message
44. K&R. With wit and style, Kurovski quickly dispatches Begala;)
Edited on Sat May-06-06 10:25 PM by autorank
What a goof ball. I've always thought that people on cable news had a bonus program that paid them
extra bonus amounts when they said something (a) ridiculous and (b) against the talking heads
political interests. Begala is not a fool so one can only imagine why he'd make such a statement.
Maybe he just doesn't like to read or something. Or maybe he's just bitter because Jon Steward
ended his show with one appearance. What a day that was...Tucker and Begala bite the dust in
minutes while they see the vast majority of their free-pass audience immediately turn against
them. Can't be a nice experience.

This is a great post.

My highest compliments.
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-07-06 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #44
46. In the era of fighting "fire with fire", Begala has fizzled out.
And he used to work in something called a "war room"?
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autorank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-07-06 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. "We are the hallow men...stuffed men, Leaning together..."
The Hollow Men

T. S. Eliot (1925)


I

We are the hollow men
We are the stuffed men
Leaning together
Headpiece filled with straw. Alas!
Our dried voices, when
We whisper together
Are quiet and meaningless
As wind in dry grass
Or rats' feet over broken glass
In our dry cellar

Shape without form, shade without colour,
Paralysed force, gesture without motion;


Those who have crossed
With direct eyes, to death's other Kingdom
Remember us -- if at all -- not as lost
Violent souls, but only
As the hollow men
The stuffed men.

II

Eyes I dare not meet in dreams
In death's dream kingdom
These do not appear:
There, the eyes are
Sunlight on a broken column
There, is a tree swinging
And voices are
In the wind's singing
More distant and more solemn
Than a fading star.

Let me be no nearer
In death's dream kingdom
Let me also wear
Such deliberate disguises
Rat's coat, crowskin, crossed staves
In a field
Behaving as the wind behaves
No nearer --

Not that final meeting
In the twilight kingdom

III

This is the dead land
This is cactus land
Here the stone images
Are raised, here they receive
The supplication of a dead man's hand
Under the twinkle of a fading star.


Is it like this
In death's other kingdom
Waking alone
At the hour when we are
Trembling with tenderness
Lips that would kiss
Form prayers to broken stone.

IV

The eyes are not here
There are no eyes here
In this valley of dying stars
In this hollow valley
This broken jaw of our lost kingdoms

In this last of meeting places
We grope together
And avoid speech
Gathered on this beach of the tumid river

Sightless, unless
The eyes reappear
As the perpetual star
Multifoliate rose
Of death's twilight kingdom
The hope only
Of empty men.

V

Here we go round the prickly pear
Prickly pear prickly pear
Here we go round the prickly pear
At five o'clock in the morning.

Between the idea
And the reality
Between the motion
And the act
Falls the Shadow

For Thine is the Kingdom

Between the conception
And the creation
Between the emotion
And the response
Falls the Shadow

Life is very long

Between the desire
And the spasm
Between the potency
And the existence
Between the essence
And the descent
Falls the Shadow
For Thine is the Kingdom

For Thine is
Life is
For Thine is the

This is the way the world ends
This is the way the world ends
This is the way the world ends
Not with a bang but a whimper.


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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-07-06 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #47
49. Well, there's some reason why so many want
BushCo to like them, to really, really like them, even as the twinkle fades.

Always a pick-me-up, that one. So I take it you're getting back at me for killing your thread the other day? :D

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autorank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-07-06 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #49
53. My thread was about morbidity, it died a glorious death at your hands.
"FuneralGate"...my lard, what an unpleasant subject...but has Hillary said when protesters challenged her for voting for the Iraq War resolution, "sometimes you have to make the tough decisions."

O8)RIP O8)
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Pale Blue Dot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-06-06 10:33 PM
Response to Original message
45. It's a great book.
And the fact that the Republicans in congress aren't behaving like the scared little shits they should be has me very concerned that they know the fix is in again for November.

Everybody needs to read this book.
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Protagoras Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-07-06 03:51 PM
Response to Original message
50. Phenomenal talk
I don't always accept all that MCM says but this speech as a whole is going to leave me sleepless because he does nail so much dead on.
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mdmc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-07-06 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
51. John Kerry and John Edwards didn't think so
:mad:
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-07-06 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #51
54. Yes
But now they do. They just can't talk about it too much because there aren't enough people who share their wisdom. But they will talk. We have our ways!
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mdmc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-08-06 09:23 AM
Response to Reply #54
55. chicken shit conformist like their parents
the more things change, the more they stay the same...
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KAT119 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-07-06 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
52. This book should be required reading-K&R!!
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