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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:22 PM
Original message
If another country invaded America, would citizens fight back?
2nd Amendment concerns aside, where it's kinda hard to get a gun in the first place... :D

I used to be for gun control, but the above just crossed my mind and the 2nd Amendment came into play because precisely that. Being invaded and we all had to pitch in together to win.

Given the purported antipathy toward the United States, it seems likely the US will be invaded at some point. By either an organized country or terrorists who won't crawl around like covert cowards like they had on 9/11. America is in such disarray, you bet I'm worried.

Would you fight back? Do nothing? Or jump sides?
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:24 PM
Response to Original message
1. I, for one, would welcome our new Canadian overlords.
Depends on a lot of things, I guess. I wouldn't just automatically turn into an insurgent.

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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:24 PM
Response to Original message
2. the obvious reply is not politically correct :-) nt
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:26 PM
Response to Original message
3. Of course we would fight
This is America and I am an American.
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:33 PM
Response to Reply #3
13. The question I would need to answer is...
...When is America *not* America anymore? Is it possible that it can reach a point where it is obvious it needs to be reformed with outside help?

Sounds terribly unpatriotic to even suggest such a situation is possible, but consider Germany or Italy at the end of WWII. Neither country saw extensive 'insurgent' action after the Allies took over, in part because *most* citizens of those countries realized that their current governments and leaders were just FUBAR, and mean, and dangerous to the rest of the world, to boot.

Could America ever reach such at state, and at *that* point, would the 'right' thing to do be to fight against a (potentially righteous) foreign invasion, or fight for the homeguard Nazis just because "they're American" (or claim to be...)?

I don't know what I would do ahead of time. I would need to have all the specifics of the situation (and the history of it), to decide.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #13
22. That wasn't the question
The question was posed in such a way as to make the invasion hostile; for example, if terrorist (read: Osama and al Qaida) invaded.

Now, I can't imagine the military not being able to handle that. But under those circumstances, I would fight.

I think as an answer to your question would be that the question itself is almost an non sequitor. Even as things are now, push has not come to shove; that push can come to shove is more possible than I have ever seen in my 54 years, but it's not there yet. When it does, we'll break out into civil war before we suffer a foreign invasion.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:48 PM
Response to Reply #22
29. THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!
You seem to understand.

(though with our military undercut right now... don't underestimate anything or anybody. And I do all the time.)
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #13
27. America has changed often over its near 230-year existence.
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maveric Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:45 PM
Response to Reply #3
75. Would that make us "Insurgents"?
Just wondering.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #75
77. Yes, it would
Or resistance fighters or guerrillas or whatever name you wish to give it.

And I'd be damn proud of it.
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Sinti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:27 PM
Response to Original message
4. Fight to the death, it may be F-ed up, but it's my country
And our responsibility to make it good again.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:31 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. So you would defend the US under * if outsiders came in to kill & destroy
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 07:31 PM by HypnoToad
Just to clarify. DU gets its share of unsavory posts, but I am making it clear that if an outside invader comes to destroy us, do we unite. Regardless of who the President is, like or dislike or otherwise.

And I would defend America and * in such a situation.

Let's hope it never happens. (America being invaded.)
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Sinti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:35 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. I would not be fighting for *, I would be fighting for my countrymen
and country. I can't stand *, and look forward to being rid of him and his ilk, but he's our mistake you know. I love my country and the people here. An invading army would surely be killing people like my neighbors, to allow them to do so would be unacceptable for me. I could not continue to live with myself if I did.
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dustdevil28 Donating Member (23 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #15
36. perhaps it is best termed with a old saying
"I may not agree with what you say, but I'll fight to the death to defend your right to say it."
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Smarmie Doofus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:27 PM
Response to Original message
5. Depends on what the TeeVee tell's 'em to do. n/t
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Bobbie47 Donating Member (386 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:30 PM
Response to Original message
6. Lots of hunters here in S. Illinois
they may be suprised how many people own guns here.
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:30 PM
Response to Original message
7. Fight back.....but it's not the terrorist or invaders from foreign
countries we should be more afraid of...

We should be more afraid of the terrorist in the White House and their absolute power grab of the US.....I am starting to think that if the Dems do not take control of the Congress and Senate in November there will be a Civil War in this country....
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. ewww I've got mine locked and loaded.
Stand back yall....boom boom stick at the helm!
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Sinti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:37 PM
Response to Reply #10
19. LOL n/t
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:34 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. I doubt it.
More people care about the department store sale.

But I am not talking about civil war.

Would you make a new post containing your response here? It's not deliberate, but I think you're straying from the point of my post's topic.
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #14
81. Sorry about that....but to answer your question I would fight for
America...
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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:31 PM
Response to Original message
9. What's worse: invasion, or the bloodless coup d'etat
of 2000? Our legitimate government was overthrown by big oil, big energy and big pharma, and nobody fucking noticed--let alone took up arms and resisted.
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kath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. hear, hear, smoogatz!
I'm with ya all the way on this one.
We had a coup, and people didn't much care.:-(
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:40 PM
Response to Reply #9
20. Will people please stop hijacking my thread?
Or I'll have this thread locked.

There are enough posts on "coup this", "big oil" that already. That's not the intent of my post.
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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:45 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. Are you always this controlling?
I mean seriously. You want to tell everybody the proper way to respond to your post?
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. I wanted it to remain FOCUSED and relevant.
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 07:46 PM by HypnoToad
Too many are trying to make it into something that it is not.

And I should have worded my original post with greater clarity in the first place.
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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #26
33. Huh. I usually kind of let go of what I want after I hit the "post"
button. I figure people will respond how they respond. But hey--whatever. See? I can't stop...
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Sinti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #9
23. If they had taken up arms, the US Army would have put them down
very quickly, I would venture to say, and things might actually be worse now than they are.
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #23
96. But at least we wouldn't have enabled a dictator
Civil War II should have started in 2000
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Joe Fields Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:32 PM
Response to Original message
11. I cannot imagine an American not willing to fight for this country.....
If the cause was just.
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tanyev Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:33 PM
Response to Original message
12. You mean, if another country invaded us to overthrow our
evil dictator and give us democracy?
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:37 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. That's one way to perceive it, but America does not have a monopoly on
taking out leaders perceived as dangerous. So, in a way, it's probable other leaders are thinking the same of *.

OTOH, it's also possible that what the people think and what the leaders think are two very different things.
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Tin Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:37 PM
Response to Original message
17. Red Dawn was only a movie
The only folks seeking to overthrow our Constitution already live here. Most drive SUVs wearing W'04 bumper stickers...
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:41 PM
Response to Original message
21. What are their intentions? n/t
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. Does it matter why they would invade? They just are. What do you do?
Invaders from another country. None of the usual talking points I was hoping people wouldn't filter into this thread because that wasn't the point of this thread.

Though on reflection, it's probably far-fetched... but 09/11 happened. Other countries have attacks. What would people do if it happened to the USA as regularly as other Western countries?

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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:49 PM
Response to Reply #24
30. Depends who invades and what their intentions are.
If Canada invaded our sorry, bankrupt asses after another 20 years or so of Republican dictatorship, freed the politcal prisoners from the KBR internment camps and reestablished Democracy, I'd rush into the streets and welcome them with fresh-baked muffins and showers of rose petals. Wouldn't you?
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Radio_Guy Donating Member (875 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 09:53 AM
Response to Reply #30
95. I agree
If Canada or Venezuela were to liberate us, I would welcome them with open arms. If Mexico tried to invade us, it would only bring this country down to the economic level they are on now and I would help fight.
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #24
52.  I'll take "liberty & justice for all" any way I can get it.
and the current power structure isn't offering it anytime soon.
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atreides1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:47 PM
Response to Original message
28. I would defend my country from any invader
And once we've won that battle, we turn towards Washington and take our country back from those whose inability to protect us got us invaded in the first place.

Then we have another Constitutional Convention, and this time we make sure that the religious fanatics can never use their belief system to sway politicians, we insure that there is a Constitutional amendment against creating laws based on discrimination.

Once that's taken care we put on trial those responsible from the top, all the way to Liberty University!!!!!!
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #28
34. Well, we do that at the voting booth.
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 07:51 PM by HypnoToad
Anything else is something I typically ask Mods to have deleted because for DU to become a breeding ground for people contemplating revolt would not be a good thing! Especially for DU Admins, who undoubtedly can only afford so many lawyers already. (never mind that I will not incite or tolerate treason, for God's sake. x( )

And the amount of responses I've seen clearly shows I've touched a nerve. I talk about outside invaders, most everyone else transposes that with "Bush Adminstration" and one would think we have enough posts about that already.

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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:50 PM
Response to Original message
31. We have already been invaded and we haven't fought back.
A cabal of criminals has taken our nation hostage.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #31
35. YOU MISREAD MY POST.
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 07:55 PM by HypnoToad
I'm sorry if people can't figure it out that there's more to this world than America's political leaders. I am not here to incite civil war or anything else. x(

If other people are so inclined, they can make all the posts they want. I do not want mine perverted into something it is not.


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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #35
47. Well, then I don't understand your post.
Would we fight if we were invaded? Collectively? Individually? Now? At this very moment? I mean, I guess that would depend on who was invading and the level of cowardice of the individual person. You'll never know on a blog. It's fantasy to say what you would do in that situation. It depends on the context.

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dustdevil28 Donating Member (23 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:50 PM
Response to Original message
32. do I fight back?
you bet. Our country has never been occupied and never will. I find it surprising that you think a invasion is imminant (sp?). While we may not be the flavor of the month with many countries out there, they will always see that we have the worlds greatest military and that any military actions towards us would only end in their swift removal from power.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #32
38. Anything is technically possible.
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 07:57 PM by HypnoToad
I don't think an invasion is imminent. (what makes you think that?)

But I think it's possible. We've seen stranger things happen.

The 2nd Amendment was created for such an event. (Fighting back England, intent to wipe us out because they didn't like our leaders at the time had something to do with it.)

I was making a (rather feeble, obviously) attempt to put a 1776 issue into a theoretical 2006 one. Instead I get a lot of responses about civil war and other shit...
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #32
44. We won't have the world's greatest military for long
No one's signing up, and can you blame them? Meanwhile, other countries are arming up to protect themselves from who but the "world's greatest military". That's the problem with illegal invasions. People start to get a little worried.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #44
49. Well, it'd cost less if Americans helped defend their country...
if they had to because our military forces were too busy. We do complain that a disproportionate amount of money goes to military spending. And thes 2nd Amentment was made to allow us be our own military in the time of invasion. Just like in 1776 and for anyone else who wants to come in.

I'm just grateful we don't have terrorist attacks on a frequent basis.
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #44
50. Oh, I get it.
You're insinuating that we're all going to have to defend our country from foreign invasion because the damn military is in every other country but here. Point taken. I'll take up a gun.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #50
53. THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!
And, again, it could be terrorists who do suicide attacks or foreign countries.

Hypothetical, yes.

Hyperbole? Obviously. As nothing has happened since 9/11, any fears I have are obviously silly.

But you are one of a few who saw through my confusing post. Thank you! :)
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #32
97. Our status as "Worlds greatest military"
Is dependent upon having thousands of nuclear weapons we don't dare ever use. I guarantee if the rest of the world wanted to come at us conventially they would hand us our asses.
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DanCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:53 PM
Response to Original message
37. Can I have a hand gernade - I have lousy aim
In the words of Angus Young "I don't have a gun, I don't got a knife, dontcha start no fight." :D
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:58 PM
Response to Original message
39. Most Iraqis didn't give a crap about Saddam
and they fought back anyway. Yes, I'd fight, and keep fighting to get W turned over to an international war crimes tribunal.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #39
42. Who did that poll and how many were polled?
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #42
48. Are you saying you want me to back up my post???
That you don't TRUST ME?? ;-)

No poll, just reading a lot of interviews with Iraqis, Riverbend, etc. I think most Iraqis except a hardcore Sunni element either hated or would welcome someone new, if (and a big IF) it didn't involve turning the country upside down.
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 07:58 PM
Response to Original message
40. This question is impossible to answer.
Are we talking about if our country was invaded by radical fundamentalist non-christians who would demand that we speak a new language and instill Sharia law? Well, duh. Of course we'd fight. But the chances of that happening seem slim to none. I see no evidence of this on the horizon.

Are you talking about Canada or France or Sweden invading us RIGHT NOW? Well, it's absolutely not going to happen and to comment on it would be stupid.

Are we talking about the UN invading us after we strike Iran and kill 3 million people in 12 hours for no reason? Well, if that's the case then I will be ashamed that I did not stand up to the fascist cabal who has taken over our democracy. America would only be a "word" at that point. A memory. What would I be fighting for? They would be right to stop us. I would just surrender.

Are we talking about fighting the unelected corporate entity that has taken America by force *at this very moment*? Then yes, I am standing up and fighting for my country, to save my country from humiliation, murder, and despair.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:02 PM
Response to Reply #40
46. Agreed - and notice the amount of people trying to put words in my mouth.
Which just shows how people would rather talk about what they want than the topic I had started. And I will take blame for not saying it good enough.

Like I said in my post, an organized country (such as those you mentioned, but a flea is more likely to make friends with a dog than those countries attacking the US) or terrorists. Outside invader was the phrase I used and I thought that would be easily understood. (apparently not, I had no idea that Bush, Rumsfeld, Condi, and the rest weren't US citizens?! Apparently that's what they must think... :crazy: )
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:00 PM
Response to Original message
41. I'm sure we'd devolve into a chaotic ungovernable mess within weeks
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #41
43. You mean we're not already?
:rofl:
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:01 PM
Response to Reply #43
45. We're just governable by a little bit.
Anyone who tips this apple cart is going to have a fucking mess to deal with.
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:06 PM
Response to Original message
51. If you fought back wouldn't you too, be an insurgent?
If you fought back, do you think the invaders should torture you, if you are then captured? Should the invaders torture your family, even the under aged kids, until they tell where you are hiding? Would you kindly forgive the people who set dogs on you and let them bite pieces out of your legs? Would that make you eager to embrace the strange unknown new type of government, the invaders were trying to shove down your throat with tanks and fighter aircraft? Would you fight for your home and family?

Keep in mind, that there are no known links, between the people who live in Iraq and the radical evil people, who attacked America on 9/11, period.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #51
55. Despite being tangential to my original post, your response is interesting
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 08:10 PM by HypnoToad
So hopefully the INS and customs agents are keep an eye on anyone from the Middle East who comes to America.

We may have illegally invaded, but there's no question there are far more people in those very same countries these days who would come to America just to slaughter us if they could.

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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #55
59. I'm sure the number of people who hate America is on the rise.
Even in America. It's sad to me that we use the country's wealth to kill instead of to heal. To make children suffer and die instead of feeding them and giving them a chance at a better life.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #59
62. Right now I'm talking more about world perception than anything frm within
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 08:23 PM by HypnoToad
We always get lots of posts of the perceptions of people from within.

I didn't mean to add to the usual same-old, amongst other things.

And, yeah, I don't understand.

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Turbineguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
54. Put up roadsigns
to Washington DC.

We've been invaded already. The problem is many people voted for the invaders.
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DELUSIONAL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:11 PM
Response to Original message
56. Red Dawn -- the movie -- America is invaded and the citizens fight
Iraq -- is invaded for real.

Do they fight back?

But what happens if we are invaded from within?

Bush is not of America -- he is of another place and time (or species) -- and he is the leader of the current invasion. His target is the middle class. He is an unevolved sub-human.

How do we fight this sort of invasion? They have all the weapons -- and they are re-writing the laws and counting the votes.

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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #56
57. "Red Dawn" - I will rent it. Thank you for some relevance.
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 08:13 PM by HypnoToad
As for the rest of the post, as with how many other responses, was not the point of my message and I'm sorry people want to make my post no different than all the others.

I've also made 3 attempts to have this thread deleted because of the amount of responses not relevant to my post. I will keep that in mind.
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walldude Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #57
67. Don't bother renting it.. it was a crap film.
Designed to bolster the Cold War.

As far as your original post, yeah I think if we got invaded there would be a huge INSURGENCY!
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:16 PM
Response to Original message
58. Here's a scenario
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 08:17 PM by wtmusic
A nuke goes off in an American city. We have no idea who did it. America responds by dropping a nuke on Tehran because public opinion forces them to do something. Another (smuggled in) nuke goes off in another American city. The shit is hitting the fan. Society starts coming apart as people scramble to get away, and more nukes go off at strategic military locations. We're getting our ass kicked but we don't know by whom.

When we're softened up the Chinese military launches a massive invasion. We've been defeated from the inside out, and all the brave citizens with shotguns in their closets don't amount to squat. :scared:
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:20 PM
Response to Reply #58
60. Well, dirty nukes are possible, but to my knowledge they're very heavy.
At least 50 pounds and even then damage is marginal. Read it off the net. But who needs to know more? The stuff is heavy and rather easy to trace.

Unless all these locations are ran by total idiots, such an attempt would be foiled.

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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #60
66. I'm talking about the clean kind
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 08:28 PM by wtmusic
a full-scale nuke in the 1-3 kiloton range (what destroyed Hiroshima) might weigh in at 1,000 lbs or less. Would it be difficult to sneak 10 or so of these across our thousands of miles of border by a determined enemy?

Not difficult enough.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #66
73. Possibly. Maybe not. Don't care. Not my job.
And if it happens, it happens.
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DELUSIONAL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #60
76. Americans can't get along -- even if invaded they would battle
each other.

Seems like this is what happened during the Revolution.

Also America is so huge -- physically huge that any invasion by aliens would fail.


BUT . . . if the invader first took control of the media -- who would know that an alien take over was in progress.

I just don't see how any nation in the world would be stupid enough to invade America.

Only American leaders current in occupation of the white house are too dumb to understand that invading and occupation of another country isn't wise.

The British failed at invasion and occupation -- twice -- during the Revolutionary War and the war of 1812. I had ancestors involved in the fighting during both wars.

But the bloodiest war of the era was the US civil war.

Destabilization of a country leading to civil war could be more effective than invasion.

Right now we have two economic crisis -- the raising price fuel & the dollar is starting to slide against other major world currencies.

Red Dawn was an interesting study in what could happen -- and if we ignore the countries involved and just imagine an invasion of any country by an alien culture/nation -- we have a pretty good idea of how ineffective an invasion of a country as huge as the US would be.

HOWEVER -- if the plan is to break away just part of America -- and a large percentage of the population has gone over to the invading country's side -- then an invasion might win. At the same time the bush league probably would allow a whole region to leave the "united states".

To me the greatest danger is from within -- I started watching the religious right grow from a small movement in the 1980s to domination.

The Revolutionary patriots did fight -- the signers of the Declaration of Independence put their lives on the line. England was arrogant and didn't understand that the colonies had become a Nation.

In a fantasy world -- where a huge army bombed the hell out of America and pissed off (and woke up) the citizens of the US -- yes many would fight. Others would fall in line -- depends on which Nation invaded.

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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:21 PM
Response to Original message
61. Only if the invaders cut off cable TV
Or stopped beer sales. Or threatened to do any of the above.

Otherwise, no.

There are far more serious safeguards of the American way of life that are being destroyed daily.

All they'd need to do is follow the pattern set by this president.

It's like the frog in the boiling water.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #61
63. !
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 08:22 PM by HypnoToad
:spray:

:rofl:

Very true, however.
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Robbie Michaels Donating Member (612 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:24 PM
Response to Original message
64. What about the Chinese?
If it's true they own half of our treasury bills, then they won't need guns to take us down.

Thanks a lot, Chimpy! :grr:
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
65. The 2nd Ammendment was NOT ...
...so we could protect ourselves from foreign invaders.
The 2nd ammendment was so we could protect ourselves from our government.

The entire Bill of Rights was written to protect us from our government!

The Democratic Party is a BIG TENT, but there is NO ROOM for those
who advance the agenda of THE RICH (Corporate Owners) at the EXPENSE of LABOR and the POOR.

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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #65
69. A little of both
When the founders declared independence, King George was their own government. With the stroke of a pen he became a foreign invader.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #69
72. Please stop altering the defintion of 'foreign invader'.
Make your own post. And not that anybody needs to, we get those posts all the time.

I was trying for a different concept... and failed. Because I couldn't get my point across. (by and large, but still... my ability at communication is problematic, obviously.)

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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #72
74. HT the line is not so clear-cut
The problem was not in your wording but that you want to get people to pledge allegiance to what has become a nebulous entity. What is the US? Is it the Bush administration, or the military, or the Constitution, or the people, or the land itself, or a mix?

While people feel most threatened by their own government you will get these kinds of responses.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:31 PM
Response to Reply #65
70. Here's what Amendment II reads - in its entirety
"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."

So when our main military is too busy (like they are now :think: ), it becomes our responsibility to defend an outside enemy who comes in with the intent to slaughter us.

All these responses about "the enemy is in Washington" are not relevant to my post and it sure as hell wasn't intended to become that way.

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tabasco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
68. I welcome our Dutch overlords with open arms !
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 08:32 PM
Response to Reply #68
71. I won't deny there is a proportionate sense of hyperbole to my OP...
:)


Still, the mods have yet to delete it, so maybe they don't think it's all hyperbole after all.

Or maybe they merely read the wrong responses.
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #68
88. gotta have a dream
another thread says Mexico is legalizing it.
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BiggJawn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
78. Depends how long they hung around after the Cabal was executed.
If they were here just long enough to round up and hang all the ReTHUGlicans, cool. After the scourge of the GOP had been wiped from the face of Murka, their welcome would start wearing pretty thin pretty fast.
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serryjw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
79. You think with an annual $ Trillion budget
our government can't fight back? What do you think your 'saturday night special' is going to do?
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jerry611 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 09:52 PM
Response to Original message
80. It is impossible to invade America...
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 09:53 PM by jerry611
"Invasion of America is impossible. It is suicide for any army that dare attempt it. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass."
-Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto
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teknomanzer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 10:12 PM
Response to Original message
82. The question is broad in scope...
and we can't really be fortune tellers, but its okay to speculate about these things from time to time. I never would have guessed that we would be in the kind of mess we find ourselves back in 2000... even after the election. I just figured Bush would make a complete ass out of himself, people would pull off the blinders and vote his ass out in 2004. But whether we like it or not 9/11 has really changed everything. And this administration has gone beyond the scope of my wildest imaginations in exploiting the sentiment caused by that tragic event. Given recent events with regard to Iran I believe we are standing on a precipice. Bush and Ahmadinejad are both ratcheting up the belligerent rhetoric. Iran almost seems to be goading Bush, and after Iraq I assume little to nothing can stop this administration from doing the insanely stupid. Its becoming a throw of the dice at this point, and we could end up on the receiving end of an invasion.

The true answer really depends on who is doing the invading. So lets consider who would be a possible invader. I am taking a rather wild guess as to who could be the only coalitions that could effectively even pull off an invasion of the US. I'm going to say they would be NATO, The United Nations, and a possible Russo-China pact.

I couldn't consider an invasion by terrorists because I don't believe for one minute that there are enough terrorists out there to engage in any kind of invasion. There is no army of terrorists. Osama bin Laden is the boogie-man. He whips out a tape every now and then to scare all the little children. Osama isn't the great terrorist mastermind he's portrayed to be. Al-Qaeda isn't the ultimate evil organization with operatives in every country across the globe just waiting for orders to release some toxic gas or deadly disease. These are invented tales, which just like Saddam's weapons of mass destruction were created to mislead us. I do realize they pulled off what may go down as the single most devastating act of terror ever to happen in this country. However, I think that its fairly safe to say that 9/11 happened because someone was asleep at the wheel. Whether you think willfully or no is up to you, but our guard was down that day. So with that said I shall move on.

NATO - If NATO invades the US I would have to consider that whatever my government did to provoke this action was really, really bad. I would have to heavily consider defending the USA if its own alliance group felt the need to stay its hand. If the NATO forces were lead by Great Britain I would have to guess that the act perpetrated by our government was so horrific they decided to unhitch their wagon from our falling star. Time to start thinking about who's side I'm on.

The United Nations - A United Nations invasion would pretty much give me the same impression as above with just a slight difference as to my choice of action, and that depends on what countries are leading the UN invasion. With a Western European led UN invasion I would have to think about whose side I'm on. Any other leadership I'd just keep my head down and think about the survival of those near and dear to me.

Russo-China - In this scenario I could only speculate that a whole chain of events has occurred where a great east - west conflict has evolved. I would have to defend the country. I don't care for their brand of governance. I'll take my chances with what is left of our democracy thank you very much.

I think the fact that I feel our country has headed off into the dark woods has definitely affected the way I feel about defending it. If there is no constitution what is there to defend. The supreme law of the land is what holds this country together and it is the very source of our liberty. At that point I have to look after my brothers, and sisters and keep them out of harms way as best as I can. If civilians are attacked by any invader regardless of who it is and I'm there I will take up arms to defend them and myself. Likewise for any armed body that attacks the people.

At that point I might be called an insurgent.
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hatrack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
83. If they distributed beer, plasma TVs and Vegas vacations, no.
Not a chance.

Which, come to think of it, is pretty much where we are at the moment.
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DanCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 10:16 PM
Response to Original message
84. Would they let me walk
because thier anti science and science could cure parkinsons.
Oh and a side note are they white. (That was sarcasm folks)
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shanti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 10:16 PM
Response to Original message
85. i believe so!
that's taking it to a whole nother level.
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kevsand Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 11:29 PM
Response to Original message
86. There's a great moment in "Casablanca" ...
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 11:30 PM by kevsand
... where Conrad Veidt (Maj. Strasser) is talking to Humphrey Bogart (Rick):

Strasser: Are you one of those people who cannot imagine the Germans in their beloved Paris?
Rick: It's not particularly my beloved Paris.
Heinz: Can you imagine us in London?
Rick: When you get there, ask me!
Renault: Hmmh! Diplomatist!
Strasser: How about New York?
Rick: Well, there are certain sections of New York, Major, that I wouldn't advise you to try to invade...
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politrix Donating Member (163 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 01:04 AM
Response to Original message
87. If They Offered More To Blacks And Natives...
I don't know WHAT I'd do, frankly...
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 02:06 AM
Response to Reply #87
90. they're offering to take blacks and native's jobs
what are you doing tomorrow?

anything?

or nothing?

or are you actively supporting bringing in illegal immigrants to make sure a black laborer can never get a fair wage?

because THAT is the offer my friend

invaders aren't nice, they are out for themselves as are we all, no one is invading us to do us a favor!

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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 02:04 AM
Response to Original message
89. mexico is invading, we're not fighting back
the answer is looking you in the face, toad

people don't care, they just really don't effin care

it makes me sick
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sweetheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 02:09 AM
Response to Original message
91. Occupation probably not
If the US is attacked in war, i'd wager that the
attack would wipe out either the west or the east
coast cities, and send a message of MAD to nuke
dropping MAD nutters in washington to stop.

Then the country would never ever be the same,
and all the guns in the world won't stop
radiation sickness.
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CPMaz Donating Member (246 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 02:13 AM
Response to Original message
92. Fight back
Edited on Mon May-01-06 02:27 AM by CPMaz
It's an easy call when the enemy is a foreign invader.

The more realistic scenario (imho) is something where a controlling influence has an American group fronting for them to create an armed insurrection.

We'd be fully involved in a war for our home before realizing it was a war, not just a little unrest.

edited to add:

And I am NOT talking about immigrants; more likely, one of the many anti-immigrant groups that wrap themselves in the flag.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 02:17 AM
Response to Original message
93. apparently not
given the history of the past six years
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expatriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 02:27 AM
Response to Original message
94. it is very hard to imagine a scenario in the foreseeable future in which
any country or even realistic alliance of countries could even begin to pull off a successful conventional invasion of our shores. Our strategic defense system, our naval and air power, etc. The only countries with the MANPOWER (forget technology and arsenal) to invade us are China, India and POSSIBLY the EU. China is at least 10 years away from being able to take Taiwan amphibuously and that is just with ONE of our fleets (the Seventh, I believe) in the area.


In any hypothetical scenario in which an invasion of the UNited States were plausible, the geopolitical reality would be so very different than today's that the mindset, attitudes and general state of the American people would be so different that it is of real use to speculate as to the American general reaction.


BUt I would think it would follow the general rule... the defense would be tenacious as all hell, but once occupied it would depend on the occupation. Overall, people have a VERY strong desire to "get on with their lives" and if the new authority is clear that they are not going to kill our children and that they let us start working and living our lives while all rebel activity was met with the most fierce and deadly force... it wouldn't take long for a vast majority of people to "get oon with their lives."


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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 10:08 AM
Response to Original message
98. Some would. Many others would collaborate with the invaders
We are told by our leaders that in Iraq those who collaborate with the invaders (us) are the good Iraqis. So I guess the Americans who would collaborate with whomever invaded and occupied our country would be the good guys too using their logic.

Don
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paparush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 10:46 AM
Response to Original message
99. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzz. Huh? Whah? WTF ?
who turned off the cable?
why is wal mart closed?
how the f*ck am I gonna watch hockey.

This is how 'Murikah will react to the 'invasion'.
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deaniac21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-01-06 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
100. It really depends on the attackers, doesn't it?
If France or Canada or basically any liberal European country was the invader it would be hard not to side with them.
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