OK, I gotta say this here: why I don't believe the"took a bullet" story

[Berry Cool]

I feel safer saying it here, where people would at least have to donate to read it. (In other words, true KO political enemies would have to drop a dime for the Dems. Could they bear it? I don't think so.)

Anyway. After much reflection, here is why I don't believe the story put up on Kos...as pleasant and relieving as that might be.

I thought to myself, let's put aside all emotion and think like a person at MSNBC's HR department. If you worked in HR for MSNBC, and this stuff came out, what would YOU do?

I'll tell you what I'd do. And the first step would NOT involve calling Keith into my office.

First step: Determine if e-mails are real and came from an MSNBC account. Do what you have to. Go to the technical department and ask them for a copy of every e-mail ever sent from Keith's account. It's legal; the account belongs to MSNBC, not him. If you find stuff similar to what Grove published, step two is calling Keith in. (The other search alternative is to determine the legitimacy of the e-mails first as coming from MSNBC at all, but that would involve getting the actual headers of the replies--presumably from Grove.)

If they are from MSNBC but not Keith, the next step is to try to find out where they came from. And, fom which computer? You need to trace the e-mails down to the computer(s) used to send them and the login used to access the system.

Let's say they came from a computer or computers used by interns to sort KO's e-mail (and perhaps that of others). Note, I said "sort." Not "answer." Think about it. Would YOU trust some low-level intern to *answer* the e-mail of your on-air talent? Not if you're MSNBC. You may hire interns to SORT the mail, send him certain messages and withhold others--either to trash them, reply to them with form e-mails, or have them dealt with appropriately (threats).

So, let's say these messages were sent from a machine used by several interns to sort mail. Of course, they all have to log on and off the system. Your tech department keeps records of who logged on them, off them, etc. From there, it should be a snap to figure out who was logged into the machine(s) that sent the mails and, if that person is still working for MSNBC, call 'em in and deal with it from there. Tell them "You were hired to SORT e-mail here--not to ANSWER it. Especially not like this!"

If the situation calls for termination of that employee, there is no need to involve Keith at all. You fire the employee, have the PR department issue an announcement of what happened and that the situation has been dealt with, and that's it. Unless Keith wants to say something about it on the air--in which case maybe you make sure what he says is vetted by a lot of people, including your legal department.

The Keith haters will still come away believing that Keith did it and that MSNBC covered his butt and forced an innocent intern to take the fall for him, and will think even less of him for it. But there's not a whole lot anyone can do about that. As an HR person, you did the right thing. You found out it wasn't him and you appropriately punished the right person for doing something foolish that ended up hurting the reputation of an on-air talent.

Keith? He'd find out about it only after the fact. And why would he choose to take the rap? Chances are the offender is young and will get another job. Career not ruined. It's unfortunate, but it happens. This would not be the first intern to be fired for doing something foolish.

I'm sorry, but this to me is a "too good to be true" story that paints Keith as a heroic figure and ignores the reality of any major modern corporation...which is that they KNOW the ID numbers of their computers and they KNOW who is logged in and not logged in and when, and they have records of every e-mail ever sent. I just can't see them not being able to ID an intern that used Keith's name to do this.

on edit: One more thing: if Keith himself issues an apology, I will take it at face value. I will have to. It's just not like him to apologize for what he didn't do.

Oh, and I will admit: one of the great mysteries of ALL of this is exactly how silent MSNBC has been thus far. Of course, they could believe that nobody reads Grove, Olbermannwatch, NewsMax, etc. Or cares! But then again, Bill-O and all of Fox has been quiet, too...TOO quiet.

Makes you wonder, doesn't it?

[Patsy Stone]

1. Okay, but

Riddle me this:

Why did A. Whitney Brown (let's say it's really him) take the time to write this at dKos?

I don't have a problem with the thought of MSNBC calling Keith and asking him if he wrote the emails, if they were planning a response.

"Hey, sorry to bother you while you're on vacation, but what's with this e-mail stuff? Is it you?"

Keith has, IIRC, shown loyalty to staff members in the past, as well as ridicule them for things like that Rolling Stones gaff. I don't know who this PA/intern/whatever is, but I'm saying that it's not that too far out there either.

He's also admitted to replying to hate mail before, giving this story legs. That's the sexier aspect for the mouth-breathers than the fact that he rarely answers mail (I've never received a response from the Countdown address, but have from his own address) in the first place.

MSNBC isn't going to say anything, because all publicity is good publicity. Plus, this wasn't all that big of a contretemps anyhow. It's not like he sent a death threat to the WH.

I don't know. Off to a Marlins' game. Go fish!

[Gogi]

5. I'm off to the Cards game tomorrow!

Wish me luck, it might rain. On a brighter note: Carp is pitching and Eck may be recovered from his mild concussion and play for the first time in several days. I just wish Sir Albert was up to playing.


KO, baby, don't let the bastards get you down!

[Catchawave]

2. Berry, check this out...

http://www.olbermannwatch.com/archives/2006/06/tvnewser_to_res.html

It's that Keithhater site, so the floors are sticky....:evilgrin:

Scroll down to the printed "emails" Keith "sent".

[email protected] ?????

I've always used: [email protected]


Just curious, no ISP track numbers like most email carries also?

[WolverineDG]

3. Did you click on that link to RW's website?

:spray: It has a warning: "Obscenities by Keith Olbermann"

Oh, I'm getting the vapors! Keith Olbermann is using bad words! Quick, Beulah, get my smelling salts before I faint! :rofl:

dg

[Berry Cool]

4. I already checked it out. As much as I hated to.

Of course, those guys are all congratulating themselves like so many Scut Farkases that they finally got Ralphie to beat the crap out of them (or so they say) and now it's Ralphie who's gonna get in trouble instead of them. What morans they be.

You know what? I don't know what this [email protected] vs. [email protected] vs. "his personal private email addy that he wrote me from" stuff is. All I know is that between these guys and the multitude of fans who keep chiming "But I've gotten many, many e-mails from him, and they've never been like this..." I feel like the only fan he's got on the planet who's EVER e-mailed him and never gotten any sort of reply!

OK, so I'm sure it's not really true. But jeez Louise...from the talk, you'd think all the guy did all day was sit at his computer, writing to his "pen pals"!

It just doesn't wash with me.

[RevCheesehead]

6. re: replies to e-mail

1. I've never gotten one, either. Of course, that may be because I've sent him e-mail maybe 3 times; but still.... it's from ME.

2. It's the internets. People lie all the time.

3. It's the internets. People pretend to be people they're not.

Call it Karma, if you prefer, but God is watching us.... and as Maude used to say, "God is going to get you for that, Walter."

[Catchawave]

7. I've never gotten an email response either.

Just wondering, those KOEBies who've received email from him, was it the KO or Keith.O email ?

I agree Rev, it's the internets, and this "story" is only growing legs with KO's non-fans and rabid BOR crazies :evilgrin:

[WolverineDG]

8. The only responses I ever got

were to the emails I sent to him from the Focus on the Family website during the "Sponge Bob is gay" insanity. No bad words used, just lots of obscure cartoon references. I've sent a couple other emails, but got no response on those.

dg

[Berry Cool]

9. Well, aside from the "on the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog" thing...

...does anyone else understand why I disbelieve the "St. Keith of Olbermann sacrifices himself that a lowly MSNBC'er may live" story?

Does it sound great? Sure. Does it make Keith sound wonderful? Yep. But does it jibe with the reality of the work world as we know it today? Not a whit.

Let's not let what we want to believe about Keith overcome good old common sense.

I, for one, will now wait to hear what he has to say about it.

[RevCheesehead]

10. Amen, Berry.

He'll be back tomorrow!! :bounce::bounce:

[WolverineDG]

11. I didn't say anything yea or nay about

the yanked KOS post. The fact that it was pulled makes it mighty suspicious. But see my email experiement post.

dg

[gkhouston]

14. ah, I had a .sig line for a while

"On the Internet, nobody knows you're a blonde." Amazing how few people got it.

As for the reality of the work world, let's say I've known some places where the scenario you describe would be accurate and others where it wouldn't. Without detailed knowledge of how things are done at MSNBC (something I don't see them handing out to the general public anytime soon unless they're terminally stupid), we've got no way of telling which is which.

I didn't read the Kos diary before it got wiped, so my knowledge of it is limited to what's been reported here. To me, the strongest point in its favor is that the insults don't have Keith's "voice", as Bill said. I've seen a lot of flame wars so I've seen what's it's like when someone's normally lucid and persuasive arguments degenerate into "fuck you and the horse you rode in on". These people lose their eloquence, their rationality, and their credibility (sometimes permanently), but they don't lose their voice. I may think, "boy, X has really lost his shit, what's up with that?" but I don't recall having ever thought, "that isn't X". Grove's quotes? Not Keith. Now it could be that Grove took a nastygram KO sent and has paraphrased it or uglied it up by removing some context and in doing so has altered -- I don't know, the cadence perhaps? -- something indefinable that would make those words sound like KO to me.

I can easily believe that someone could ramp KO up to the point where he'd tell them to take a flying fuck through a donut hole. He's human and given enough provocation almost everyone on the planet will eventually respond to insults with hostility. I'm just not believing he used those precise words. It will indeed be interesting to see what KO has to say about it.

[CC]

12. The down side to a semi broken internet

connection for the last couple weeks, missing DU and the KOEB. The upside, missing non-stories like the KO emails and the flame wars in DU. Though I did take time out finally to read the emails. They don't read like Keith but will withhold judgment on was it or not. There are so many ways to make a false email that the real story should be that Grove is stupid enough to take some anonymous person on the net word for it.
BTW add me to the growing numbers of never received a reply to any emails sent to Keith.

[RevCheesehead]

13. Hi, Ferrettessa!

I've missed you! :hug:

[Berry Cool]

15. Me too!

Good to see you and all of the animal gang.