If Kerry Decides not to Run in 2008 do you have a Backup Candidate?

[Corey_Baker08]

I have been thinking about this for awhile,in fact every since Kerry conceded on November 3. I think to myself is there anyone that can fill Kerry's gap, anyone that I can truly admire.

With the Clark craze pounding DU I think of Clark as filling Kerry's place, but I just don't see the fit. I respect and admire Clark, but to me he is no John Kerry. He has never gave me hope or optimism or something to look forward to.

I think of Evan Bayh my half home state Senator and he looks like a man with lots of intelligence and like someone fit to lead this country, until he opens his mouth.

As much as I admire John Edwards I don't know that he has enough experience to be the President which is a shame because there is not a greedy bone in him.

All the other possible candidates out there and I cant think of one that can fill Kerry's gap. I pander the thought of a Boxer presidency, I flirt with the thought of another Clinton presidency, but I absolutely love the thought of a Kerry Presidency.

[JI7]

1. i'm not putting all my hopes on another run

i'm going about trying to assume he wont run, that way i can avoid as much disappointment as i can if he decides not to. and if he does decide to run then it would be all good with me.

as for supporting someone other than Kerry, i like Feingold but i didn't really like his voting with Republicans on assault weapons ban. i'm sure he did it for political reasons (last year right before he was up for re-election)and he would be more in support of enforcing it if he was President though. i think he can be a bit naive at times. but overall i like him.

i don't think you need to think about it too much at this point. put your focus on the 2005 and 2006 races. i know it's hard not to think about 2008. but as the primary campaigns start you will have a better chance at looking at those considering running and making up your mind then.

[ginnyinWI]

2. Feingold

He's my senator and he's ok, but I just don't know if he's got enough spark to be our Dem nominee. His floor speeches are nothing to brag about. Good ideas, yes, but the delivery leaves something to be desired. Besides, do you think America is ready for a Jewish president?

[sandnsea]

4. Ya think?

He's my second choice. I don't know about his floor speeches, but you have to remember, my senator is Wyden who isn't too difficult to out-charm. I don't think America is ready for a twice divorced President, being Jewish wouldn't be as big a hurdle as that I don't think.

[JI7]

5. it might depend on how we deal with it as a party

not let us get hung up on it and try to keep the focus on the issues that matter.

Carter was from the South, Christian,moral and whatever else some now think is the key to Democratic victory yet Reagan from hollywood and divorced beat him. the Republicans never let these things that shouldn't matter get to them as much as we do.

it's true Feingold isn't some great orator but i think with him it's more about his overall record. someone else might give a better speech but based on what you know about them you still end up feeling on the same side as Feingold (even taking into account there are some differences).

[sandnsea]

16. True

Twice divorced Jew, latte liberal lesbian (Hillary), WWIII Clark, Edwards the child channeler. Yep, they'd come up with something on anybody.

[wisteria]

3. I don't even want to consider a backup candidate.

I'll wait and see what happens with Kerry. No one else would measure up to Kerry in my opinion. If he came out with a heartfelt endorsement of another candidate after he made a decision not to run I might vote for that person because I trust his judgment. Any endorsements after a primary race are just done out of obligation to the party.

[WildEyedLiberal]

6. Yeah, I feel the same nt

[politicasista]

7. I will wait and see too.

[Noisy Democrat]

33. I'm the same

I'm not even thinking about backups. If I had to settle for someone else, the only person who could come close would be Gore. But honestly, I'm not going to think about backups until such time as Kerry himself announces he's not running. And if that happens, I'll console myself with the fact that he wouldn't be too old to run in 2012.

[Island Blue]

8. I think I'll wait and see too.

People always talk about how great it would be to have an "outside" person in the White House like a governor, etc. I don't know why folks always seem to think that that's such a great idea, because although it has sometimes worked in the past, it certainly ain't workin' right now. At the moment I can't think of anyone other than John Kerry who has what it will take to help us begin to dig out of this incredible mess that Shrub has gotten us into.

[emulatorloo]

10. Personally I am tired of Dumbass Blank Slate No-Nothing Governors

"outsider" = 'ignorant about how to get things done"

[JohnKleeb]

11. Senators though theyre harder to elect

make better presidents than governors since they know how the senate works. LBJ was very effective as president because he knew how the senate worked.

[blm]

12. Damn - you sure have learned alot in a relatively short amount of time.

.

[JohnKleeb]

20. Ive known that

Governors are easier to elect but Senators tend to get their legislation passed. A classic example of this is LBJ, didnt agree with all his policies but the man had such a knack for getting things through.

[elshiva]

14. Good point!!!!

[elshiva]

13. And Dean was not an outsider!

[emulatorloo]

15. Dean isn't a dumbass no-nothing either (but definitely not an outsider)

EOM

[sandnsea]

17. Dean means well

I really think he does. But his health care plan really and truly was bleeding red ink. He didn't implement the tax cuts, his predecesor did. His idea of environmentalism isn't exactly in tune with most environmentalists, it's more regulated land use than preserve. He supported ALOT of DLC ideas, like deregulation, coal power, chain stores, corporate tax loopholes. I think he even wrote a letter supporting arming some of the Baltic States, a GOP position. He did support Gingerich on Medicare. Progressives in Vermont truly disliked him so much they ran their own canidate. All of his ideas weren't bad and he does have gumption, but he isn't exactly what he's billed himself to be either.

[emulatorloo]

18. He does mean well, and chairman of DNC is to me the place for him --

But how a conservative/centrist governor became the do-no-wrong progressive/liberal darling is one of life's great mysteries.

[Mass]

19. No mystery there - Trippi said clearly that he is responsible for that

Few people knew who Dean was before Trippi became his campaign manager, and he decided that the only place he could be successful was at Kerry's left.

So, and particularly on Iraq, they looked at Kerry's position and decided to go a step further, which is why Dean's position in October and in February were different.

[PresidentObama]

9. I'm banking on Kerry....

Though I know of choices I like besides Kerry, and think would make good VP choices.

[JohnKleeb]

21. I am really now just content to support the nominee

[Fla4kerry]

22. Think Kerry will be

on the Ticket one way or another. Count on it, since there isn't any one else even close to his intelligence and knowledge of how the world works. Nominee or Vp choice...will happen for Sen Kerry..Any one but Hillary. Look to Gov Richardson to come out looking good in primary..

Turning Fla Blue 2006!!

[JohnKleeb]

23. I dunno, I really will be content if we just get a good nominee

[jillan]

24. I am a very lonely Biden supporter.

I hated that Biden voted for the credit card companies, but I understand why he did it.

I started noticing him was he was campaigning for Kerry. He has done somethings that have really impressed me. First, and this would only be important to a die-hard Kerry supporter, but I loved it how he immediately put Kerry at ease on the first day that the senate was back after the election. You know that had to be an uncomfortable day for Kerry, and I was feeling nervous for him. And when it was Kerry's turn to talk, Biden interjected and said to Kerry "Senator Kerry, I am not happy at all to see you back." Kerry broke out into a big smile. People laughed and the uncomfortable moment was gone because of Biden.
Being able to put people at ease is a great personality trait.

Then Biden knocked my socks off that day when the senate foreign relations committee was discussing Bolton. And yesterday, thanks to emulatorloo, I did some research on the vote to go to war with Iraq. I found out that Biden was fighting against giving the president the authority to go to war.

I watch him make the rounds on the talk shows. He always impresses me. He is a fighter, well-spoken, has an easy personality, and not afraid to stand up and make his feelings known. And yes, I think he's another handsome older man. (with or without hair :))

But I will delete everything I just wrote if KERRY runs again!

Clark would be the best VP. I was sorry Kerry didn't pick him.

Anybody else like Biden?

[JohnKleeb]

26. dont like him but think he gets a bad deal

I like that he had a huge part in writing the americans with disabilities act and I am uhh learning disabled. He also wrote the violence against women act.

[jillan]

30. That even makes me like him more. Damn it's lonely! n/t

[JohnKleeb]

32. I dont like his personality but hes not as bad as hes made out to be

[BlueIris]

28. Damn, that's a GREAT story about Biden on the first day of session.

I totally missed all news about that anywhere. Thanks for sharing!

"Biden interjected and said to Kerry 'Senator Kerry, I am not happy at all to see you back.' Kerry broke out into a big smile. People laughed and the uncomfortable moment was gone because of Biden.
Being able to put people at ease is a great personality trait."

Not only is it a great personality trait, it's a great trait to utilize with JK, and a great thing Biden managed to do so effectively and magnanimously, with positive results. I've read it can be tough to get Kerry to open up. Hmmmm. Now you've got me thinking. I know this is the thread about alternatives to a Kerry/Whoever ticket altogether, but...I've been thinking since Nov. 3 that Kerry would benefit from a different kind of running mate the next time around, and that a certain sort of emotional compatibility between Kerry and the next person would be essential.

[Noisy Democrat]

34. I'm sorry

I can't like Biden. He made a point of tearing Kerry down in an interview, talking about how some waitress said she didn't know who to vote for, and said, "You're so strong and Kerry's so weak." There was no call for him to tell a story like that. Biden may be nice to Kerry to his face, but he stabs him in the back in the press.

[jillan]

35. hmm - I haven't heard that story!

When was this?

[WildEyedLiberal]

36. I remember that

In the New Yorker.

Yep, haven't liked Biden since. No one stabs my John in the back.

[BlueIris]

38. Ouch.

Yeah, that's...a not so nice story.

[karynnj]

39. That was after the election

I hated the story because it was self serving and like most of Biden's stories large on details a good editor would remove and short on specifics and given when it was pretty unkind.

What bothered me more was that on one of the talk shows BEFORE the election, when asked to explain why Kerry voted for and then against the $87 billion, Biden - in his role as Kerry surrogate (not) - answered it was a mistake and he (Biden) voted yes to both bills. He didn't explain the difference in the 2 bills and that Kerry wanted to pay for it by withholding some of the top 1%'s tax cuts and he wanted Senate oversight on the spending due to problems with earlier expenditures. His ego kept him from doing his job.

If he were running himself this wouldn't be a problem and may reflect that most Senators see themselves as Presidents. It may have been that he was giving his opinion as a Senator and felt he should not defend Kerry on issues they disagreed on.

I really have mixed opinions on him. Sometimes he is fantastic - he is clear and explains things well. Other times he goes on and on with his long convoluted stories that drive me up the wall - especially when he repeats them. An example was the Rice hearings - he was making the point that you not only had to tell the truth, but the whole truth. He then said (I'm paraphrasing):

When I was young I went to Catholic school and this priest told us a story. This young boy, Johnny came to confession and confessed that he had found a chain and had taken it home, but then he lost it so he couldn't give it back. What he didn't say was that a gold watch was on the chain. < and the story went on>

The example wasn't really a good match to Rice - the Bush administration didn't just leave out inconvenient details, they flat out lied. So the story was not only a strange tangent but it didn't work. (Also - as there was someone who was once a nice young Catholic boy named Johnny sitting there, couldn't he pick another name?) Anyway, he told the same story VERBATIM in his speech on the Senate floor - even though in spite of saying Rice was a liar, he was saying he was voting for her.

[TheDonkey]

52. I like Biden, and would support him in the primary sans Kerry

I saw him speak once in person and was floored by his intellegence and focus! The main really made a compelling argument for why Bush was destroying America the entire crowd was speechless. One of the best speeches I've ever heard.

He also was a great supporter of Kerry and I think has some good charisma.

The biggest flaw about him is his hair (shallow) but it's America.

[BlueIris]

25. Feingold, Clark and Boxer remain my top three choices.

Unless hell freezes over and Conyers runs.

[BlueIris]

27. But, I feel certain that Kerry will be our nominee again next time.

And although I will support any Dem nominated, (sorry, no thoughts of scrapping the DNC here) it will be a very empty and bitter support indeed if it's not for my JK. Well, I wouldn't be too bitter about supporting John Conyers. But, BUT--it still wouldn't be my guy, and that would be sad.

PM me if you want to know why I am basically positive Kerry WILL be our President someday, even if he is 72 when it happens. (I'm not putting that up on the boards again to get flamed.)

[jillan]

29. put it up here!

this is the safest place on the web!

[wisteria]

31. Yeah, put it up here, I'm interested! n/t

[emulatorloo]

37. Put it up!!!! EOM

[BlueIris]

41. Okay, fine. My reason:

I had a prophetic dream that John Kerry would become president, or at least be sworn in as president. It happened on the night of November 4, 2004. I spent much of November 3 in major denial about what had just happened. Mainly because, well, I had harbored a decent amount of hope for not so much a Kerry victory as a Kerry landslide, constituting enough votes to trump the inevitable Bush-supported election fraud and Rovian legal challenges to the returns. Then...election night. I simply couldn't believe it. So, I didn't break down until the 4th, (shortly after reading about Mrs. Edwards' health situation). I spent all day miserable and went to bed crying.

All of my life, I've had limited prescient ability--although I am occasionally frustrated by how useless it is. I know what I'll be watching on t.v. a few hours beforehand, or what song will be playing on the radio next. One thing that has always been very reliable however, are these funny nocturnal visions I will sometimes experience; those will almost always come to pass. On November 4, 2004, I had a vision of John Kerry taking the oath of office. It was sunny outside; he was wearing black leather gloves and a maroon tie, looking pretty much like he looks right now (which is why I was convinced last autumn that Kerry's inauguration was immanent). I could also see at least Teresa with him (she was wearing a wide-brimmed black hat, if anyone cares). The justice swearing Kerry in had little dark-rimmed glasses. Kerry was smiling (that aspect of it was great). Because of the visceral nature of this vision, it was extremely difficult for me to accept that Bush would actually remain in the White House. I was sure Conyers' committee was going to be able to convince the media to stop lying, reverse popular (and uninformed) public opinion, and put Kerry's hand on the Bible on January 20. A part of me still has trouble believing that this didn't occur.

Yes, I know, it was "just" my vision. Most would probably say it was the result of a coping mechanism borne of the denial over the election outcome that I mentioned above. But my mindset at the time is another reason the incident continues to have a persuasive hold on me; it happened after I'd already totally given up and begun the painful process of grieving for the future I believed we'd get to enjoy. That's sort of why I'm now certain it was as reliable as any of the other visions I've had in life, I was only off by four years in my estimation about when it would come true. Four years, or, you know, perhaps eight. Kerry looked handsome and vigorous as usual in my vision, but he does have that youthful quality; as another poster here told me, he'd be a young 72.

[BlueIris]

42. And if you think that's wacky, ask me what I think

could most likely undo the farce of the "legitimate" Ohio election results and why.

[wisteria]

44. I'm game, Please explain Ohio. n/t

[BlueIris]

47. Sure. For what it's worth, here goes:

There are a lot of places to look if you want, well, proof that the Ohio election was tainted with about ten thousand different kinds of obfuscation, meddling, incompetence, and disgustingly calculated, flagrantly executed fraud. I personally recommend the now-published book, "What Went Wrong in Ohio," which is the report produced by John Conyers' House Judiciary Committee after the investigation it conducted into the Ohio election. Some people also believe that ex-NSA employee Wayne Madsen's articles about voter fraud in the last election are also essential reading for those who want to know what really happened. I don't want my little post to demean the essential, seminal place the writings of these people and others hold in the canon of research about the election last year. I hope no one thinks I'm trying to do that, or suggest that the issues my wacky insights point to render irrelevant the findings of Conyers, Madsen, or the countless credentialed statisticians and academics who wrote about the likelihood of massive fraud contaminating last year's vote.

It is my feeling--particularly because, despite their persuasiveness even to non-Democrats, non-partisans and non-Kerry supporters, the works of Conyers, Madsen and others remain unknown to the majority of the general public--that the information which may finally blow the lid off the Ohio election scam is closely connected to the scandal still unfolding there related to all of those missing (?) rare coins. I must confess, I haven't followed this scandal as closely as I have the other insanity relating to Ohio and election 2004, so my knowledge of the particulars isn't all that keen. As to why I have this feeling...(again, please hold your cackling laughter)...

...Tarot reading has played a helpful, supportive role in my life for the past decade. No, I do NOT base major life decisions on readings from my decks of Tarot or the decks of others, I only use them to widen or enhance my perspective on my own life and emotions. Also, as an artist, I am drawn to the symbology of the illustrations on most Tarot decks. I rarely, if ever, "use" Tarot to attempt to "figure out" or anticipate exactly "what's coming next." To me, that's (sort of) silliness. However, I cannot deny that there have been a few times in which, well, strong suggestions made by the lay-out of Tarot cards forewarned of impending events of major import to me. My grandfather's death. The end of my last relationship. A significant change in my health status. So, occasionally, this method of divination can enlighten me in a prophetic sense.

On November 2nd, when the weird stuff with the Florida returns began to be broadcast, and the info about a probable Republican victory in Ohio hit the air, I started playing with my Tarot decks. The cards I kept getting seemed strange to me, what with my aforementioned steadfast belief in the eminent recognition of Kerry's success. Unfortunately, they involved cards from the minor arcana like the Seven of Swords, Justice (reversed) and the Emperor, which I came to look at later as portents of theft, injustice and illegality and Bush keeping his throne. I tend to (strongly) resist literal interpretations of the cards, but given what transpired, my thinking was, "well, sometimes, a Tarot message does come through in that manner." But there was this other oddity I kept seeing that night--coins. Every. Single. Last. card from the entire deck with coin imagery on it kept popping up in those readings. No matter which deck I used or what my "energy" was at the time, coins everywhere. That included lots of cards from the Suite of Pentacles, (one deck I use actually labels this set of cards the Suite of Coins) and even cards like the Seven of Cups, which features, in some Western Tarot decks, a goblet filled with jewels and coin pieces. In the weeks following the election outcome, I took these readings to mean simply that the interests of the supporters of the fraud, interests connected almost entirely with the monetary incentive to retain near absolute power had easily overtaken the desire of the public to remove a tyrannical ruler through our legal processes of doing so (not that you need a Tarot deck to tell you that). Yet, I still had my "feeling" about Kerry; connected with the vision and other impressions. I still had a belief that the fraud would be exposed. I just didn't know how.

Ever since the Ohio coin scandal broke, I've been having eerie flashbacks to those election night readings. Sometimes, I wonder if, as opposed to having interpreted those cards too literally, I didn't interpret them literally enough. Lots of people, whose views about the election, the fraud, the media and Kerry I respect, continue to watch the new developments in Ohio very carefully. They've given me a lot of reason to think this way of explaining election malfeasance to the public will stick where other ways didn't. I actually wish I was reading more about it on DU then I am, but what am I supposed to say--"hey, poster, I know we're all tired from pursuing the DSM, Rove/Plame, and other crises, but what about all of that nasty shit with the coins in Ohio? Why do I care? Let me tell you about this sinister Tarot reading from last Novermber..." I mean, we should all care about getting as much info as we can about the fraud because we're all voters and we deserve clean elections. Not because Iris has fun with Tarot sometimes. But if you want to know where I think an untapped resource for more, potentially highly-productive dirt is, that's my guess.

[BlueIris]

50. And just for the record:

I had some VERY strong and weird impressions about today, Bush's downfall, and a return to sanity in this country. Not trying to get anyone's hopes up, not trying to get flamed, I just want my, "I predicted it," online somewhere, in case he gets indicted tommorow or something. :-)

[WildEyedLiberal]

51. That is heartening to know

I really feel that this whole mess is going to tie all the loose threads together and spell doom for him, and that people will wake up and see that they could've had John, then realize that they still can...

[wisteria]

43. Thank you for sharing your vision.

I hope for us all, it comes to pass.

[WildEyedLiberal]

45. That's amazing

I know EXACTLY how you feel. I always had a feeling, an intuition, last year that John was going to be our President. I could FEEL it in my soul - you know how you hope for some things but secretly fear or secretly know in your heart that it won't happen? I had NONE of those feelings last year. I KNEW he'd win. So Nov. 3rd was a huge system shock, and I cried and cried all day... but that FEELING, that I KNOW he'll be president, didn't go away, or even fade. I think something was trying to tell me that he WILL be president, just maybe not when I expect. And that realization, on that sad, sad day, gave me hope to go on.

[Noisy Democrat]

46. I feel the same way

And I don't think it's just wishful thinking. There's something about him. Some people have a destiny that you can just sense; he's one of them.

[politicasista]

40. Put it up

I am interested.

[globalvillage]

48. No.

Actually, I will work for and vote for the Dem nominee, whoever that might be. I just haven't considered that it won't be Kerry, after the anger subsides and people wake up.

[BlueIris]

49. Heh. Nice rationale.

That's much better than mine. People do need to wake up, and psychic visions aside, I also believe they will.