Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Pizza Redux - Cooks Illustrated strikes again!

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » DU Groups » Home & Family » Cooking & Baking Group Donate to DU
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 08:07 AM
Original message
Pizza Redux - Cooks Illustrated strikes again!
As many of you know, I have been on a lifetime quest for the perfect pizza at home. And I've been fortunate to have many that could define 'perfect pizza'. Chewey crust with a bit of char on it, but light and bready inside. But they've all been in commercial places that have very hot ovens - 700°F, even 800°F. Home ovens get to 500°F, maybe 550°F. The oven we replaced a few years ago was badly out of calibration and could get to just a hair over 600°F. Our new one goes no higher than a digitally-perfect 500°F.

The current issue of Cook's Illustrated has a story about pizza. And key to it is an often overlooked and unsung hero - cake flour. I've used cake flour in fresh pasta dough and know it makes for a more delicate and tender pasta. I'd kinda thought it could od the same thing for pizza, but never tried it. Now I will.

Here's the recipe they published:

1-1/4 tsp instant yeast
1 cup water (room temp)
1-3/4 cups all purpose flour
1 cup cake flour
1-1/2 tsp salt
2 tsp sugar

The resulting dough should tend toward being just a tad sticky; adjust water or flour at the end. Allow the dough a single rise and make your pizzas. The recipe yields two.

I had originally made my pizzas with all bread flour because that's the way I was taught in school and in observing it in commercial places over my career. When I started making them at home, my oven was already off, so it was probably already hot and the bread flour worked. When I got the new oven, my pizzas started taking longer and tasting tougher. Cooks Illustrated explained why. The bread flour works great in a fast oven because the gluten never fully develops. In a slower oven, the gluten goes all the way with the longer time. Their cure was to reduce the gluten to start. AP flour was better. A mix of AP and cake was the key.

I've not tried this yet, but I intend to very soon. Probably in the next week, since Saprkly's sisters and their spouses will be here all of next week and they're all foodies. We always go on a cooking orgy when we get together. I'll do pizzas at least twice ...... once on the grill, which I had planned, and once to try this new oven version.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
bearfan454 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 09:09 AM
Response to Original message
1. I am going to try making it that way
It is hard to get a good crust in a home oven.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. In the CI article, they had a sidebar with an interesting tidbit
They made their 'new' dough with cake flour and took it to a cemmercial pizzaria with a hot oven. They baked it along side a pizza made with the pizzaria's bread flour dough. The 'new' recipe came out soft and wimpy and 'cakey' while the bread flour pizza was perfect. They then took the pizza dough back home and cooked it alongside the 'new' dough. This time the 'new' dough was near perfect while the pizza dough was tough as all hell.

The hot oven didn't allow the bread flour to fully develop the gluten since it cooks so fast. The home oven really developed the gluten becuase of the longer bake time and resulted in the tough crust with bread flour.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #5
18. That's why I love them
Only CI would think to test the dough that way.

The recipe I use is mostly AP flour with a little bread flour. IIRC, about a 7:1 ratio. The recipe is supposed to be a good recreation of the honest-to-goodness, Italian, regulated pizza dough. It involves 10 minutes of kneading in the KitchenAid, so what gluten there is gets developed to hell and back.

My oven only goes to about 500. I'm sure my crust isn't perfect, but I like it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. That's pretty much what I used to do with my old (hot) oven
And that's what started tasting *very* different in my new oven.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gormy Cuss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 09:35 AM
Response to Original message
2. Interesting.
I'll pick up the Cook's and put it under the nose of my personal pizza maker. I can't let him read your post because he'd be in the kitchen with pliers trying to 'fix' the calibration on our pre-digital era ovens.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NashVegas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
3. All-Purpose Flour Worked Surprisingly Well
A couple of months ago, I was out of bread flour and resorting to using AP. The result was the perfect NYC-style crust. I'm hard put to decide whether or not I want to go back.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. I used to be right where you are .......
...... thinking bread flour was the only way to go. As I said, my experience with the new oven disabused me of this mindset. And now I'm ready to leap into the cake flour milieu!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NashVegas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 07:42 AM
Response to Reply #4
17. Yeah, I've Just Got to Deal With
This nearly-full cannister of bread flour :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 11:54 AM
Response to Reply #17
19. Make bread
I love the Alaskan recipe with Carl Griffiths' sourdough.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Duer 157099 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 03:06 PM
Response to Original message
6. LOL, this is funny
As you recall, my first pizza-making attempt ran me straight into this question.

Ironically, just yesterday I finally picked up some actual bread flour (I've been using King Arthur's AP from Trader Joe's).

I'm going to try this for my next pizza. I've also got guests coming next week and had planned to do the homemade pizza thing at least once. If only the weather would cooperate (it's been in the 90s here for the past several days!)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 09:28 PM
Response to Original message
7. let us know how this turns out....
I haven't seen the latest issue of CI yet :-(. I gave up on pizza at home for exactly that reason-- I mean it's a servicable pie, but the real thing is so cheap at the local pizzaria that there's little point in putting the time and effort into a substandard pizza at home. I'll be real interested in the outcome of your experiments!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. The article also claims that with the instant yeast ....
.... the results take 90 minutes from thinking about it to chomping on it.

I accidently bought instant yeast once. That stuff's ***fast***. No flavor development to speak of, but if you want fast, that's the ticket.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. hey, just out of curiosity do they still recommend stretching the dough...
...instead of rolling it? Doesn't seem like there'd be much point with a low gluten dough.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Yeah, they say to stretch it
I'm not partial to stretching it on the board, though. I actually know how to toss it and the fact is - naysayers notwithstanding - tossing it does, indeed, stretch it nice and evenly. When properly tossed you get the thing spinning like a frisbee. Centrifugal force is your friend!

I usually just roll them out with a french rolling pin - like this one.

The taper allows you to give the dough round a rotation with each roll and the taper also gets the thinner middle and thicker edge you want. It takes some practice, but as far as I'm concened, this type of pin is the cat's pajamas.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #10
20. I saw a master chef make pizza with Julia once
He did a stretching thing that didn't involving tossing it into the air.

He started out with pressing out the dough with the tips of his fingers. Then he put one fist underneath it and pulled on it with his other fingers (gently). He'd do a little flip to turn it on his fist and pulled again. He went on flipping and pulling until it was the size and thickness he liked.

I don't have the technique down perfect, and I don't end up with something perfectly round, but maybe if I keep practicing...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 02:54 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. That's a non-flamboyant in-the-air-twirl with-a-twist
The full-out Libarace flamboyant in the air thing is done entirely on the back of balled fists.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 05:04 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. Can we put that in shorthand?
n-f i-t-a-t w-a-t

Oops, I don't think so. :evilgrin:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. OMG!
Iyain't **even** gunna go there! :rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 06:48 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. LMAO
I just looked at it again. Oh, no, I di-in't. :rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Duer 157099 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. How fast?
I don't think I have instant yeast -- but what's the time difference?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 06:53 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. Maybe two or three times as fast
But keep in mind .... this is NOT for everything. The fast rise causes less flavor development.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bettyellen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 10:16 PM
Response to Original message
11. hey H2S, please check out this link...
it's all pizza, all the time!

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Thank you!
I've followed that forum for a while, but have never posted there. I like the pizza equipment forum and have read all of it in researchng my notion of a backyard wood fired pizza oven.

I think I need to spend more time in the dough forums! Sparkly will shred my mozarella ass if I start another project (like my backyard oven!) :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bettyellen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-22-06 10:59 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Anytime, friend.. you should also discuss this with Tab.....
who as i recall has been experimenting with dough for a while also.
:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 06:51 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. I had hoped to report back
I live about 45 mins from the King Arthur Flour Company, and they offer baking classes all the time - artisan breads and whatnot. I'm a cook rather than a baker, but one of their classes is on pizza making - they offer it every three or four months. I've always had a conflict, but finally my evening was free last Thursday - my son was at his grandmothers - no obligations. I was down in Cambridge and planned to leave early enough to get back to the class. Finally! My King Arthur Pizza class from the dough experts of experts.

Except... my car wouldn't start. Fuel pump as it turns out. Repair costs into the four digits (for a Saab). I was stuck in Cambridge for days because, as it turns out, you can't use a Mastercard that's secretly a debit card to rent a car.

Will I EVER get to a King Arthur Pizza-making class? The next one is July 13th - I'll shoot for that. Closer together than previously - that's a good thing.

If anyone lives in the Northeast, they offer "public" classes - for most of the "you and me", and then they also offer professional seminars. I'm not a baking professional, but I do fall into the "you and me" class...

Some upcoming examples are:

The Magic of Wild Yeast: Sourdough
Learn techniques for baking with sourdough, as well as how to achieve the degree of flavor you prefer. This hands-on class teaches techniques for hand-mixing sourdough. Care and feeding of sourdough starters, shaping, slashing and steam baking of traditional sourdough boules will also be covered.

The Knave of Hearts: Strawberry Tarts
Strawberry season is upon us, and local berries guarantee the best possible fruit tart. See why this glamorous tart is truly the tart supreme, as you mix a classic Pâte Sucrée; make silky pastry cream; design and decorate with fresh strawberries and finish the tart with a glistening glaze!

How Does Your Garden Grow?
Bake up a garden of edible delights! This week of classes for children continues the exploration of baking with a curriculum geared towards the garden. From cookies to cakes, explore a world of flora that's as pretty as it is delicious to eat! This class is for children who have completed grades 1 & 2.

Be Fruitful! Summer Pies & Tarts
Summer is the season for lighter pies and tarts. This class focuses on mastering crusts and then devising fillings, using seasonal fruits to their fullest advantage. In that class you will mix and roll pastry from scratch, make seasonal fillings, and bake both a pie and tart to take home learning decorative edging techniques.

Mediterranean Breads
We've combed the Mediterranean for the most authentic bread recipes, and come up with a selection sure to whet your appetite for these regional breads. You’ll master the simple techniques for reproducing these specialty loaves in your own kitchen while you mix rustic bread dough using a preferment and work with regional ingredients to create flavorful breads.

Hearty Loaves
Healthy and hearty baked breads are the focus of this three-hour course. These are the breads that pair beautifully with any meal, from soup to salad! In this class, you’ll create a hearty yeast loaf from scratch, make a nutritious whole grain quick bread and learn to use a variety of grains, nuts and seeds

Cool & Creamy: Cheesecake
Cool, Silky, creamy, rich, velvety, melt-in-your-mouth. Cheesecake is the perfect summer dessert, and we’ll give you guidance for the best cheesecake ever, along with some tips for customizing recipes to fit your palate (and your hips!). Students will customize their cake with flavor options, create a number of fillings and learn methods of baking.

That Takes The Cake: Divine Decoration
Learn the techniques you need to design and decorate festive cakes for any occasion. You will make the icing you need, then plan and execute a design for a double layer cake. Bring your imagination---we'll provide the rest, as you apply icing to create a level cake, practice making an essential crumb coat and use a pastry bag to pipe decorations.

Brew Up Some Breads
Bake your own loaf of fragrant yeasted bread using beer! Learn shaping techniques for other successful loaves, and understand how ingredients work together to create breads of loft and delicious flavor.

Beauty & The Baguette
At last! Tame the beastly baguette with this hands-on class to help you make the best possible baguettes in your home oven. Learn how to work with a pre-ferment to achieve the maximum flavor. During the course you will mix a traditional baguette dough, get experience shaping and slashing loaves and learn steaming techniques for home ovens.

Sticky Fingers: Breakfast Buns
These are the old-fashioned cinnamon buns just like grandma made. You'll make a trio of sweet temptations--the classic iced cinnamon buns, both a yeasted and a quick version, and sticky buns with a finger-licking gooey caramel topping!

Yeast Breads: The Basics & Beyond
Overcome yeast anxiety forever with this class on basic yeast bread! Plunge your hands into the dough and learn to mix and knead bread that is successful every time. Bake your own loaf of yeast bread, and learn shaping techniques for other loaves, and understand how different ingredients affect the outcome of your loaves.

Pizza Perfected
We love pizza, and we've come up with techniques to rival any pizza you can buy. You will prepare classic Neapolitan pizza and learn to customize it for flavor and texture. You'll also hand-stretch dough, shape calzone, and get information on simulating a brick pizza oven at home.

With Master Baker Jeffrey Hamelman
If you love artisan breads, spend the weekend learning the art of baking in our beautiful new wood-fired oven. Our own Bakery Director Jeffrey Hamelman, a Master Baker and author of the IACP award winning book Bread: A Baker's Book of Techniques and Recipes, leads the class in mixing dough, shaping loaves and firing the oven. Chef Hamelman will explain wood-fired baking techniques and help you create crackling, crisp loaves. Saturday lunch included.

Summer Pasta
At last! Summer is here! We'll make pasta that's tender and toothsome, and we'll let the season be the inspiration for saucing it! Join us and learn to make a simple elegant egg pasta dough by hand, create elegant sauces using seasonal produce and create unique pasta shapes.

Bite Into Biscotti
See how simple it is to make these delectable cookies. A double bake gives great biscotti their crisp crunch, and in this class on authentic Italian biscotti, you’ll experience both a classic and chocolate recipe for biscotti, learn the Italian “well method” for mixing dough and practice shaping and mixing techniques unique to biscotti.

Light My Fire: Creme Brulee
From the classic famed Le Cirque Restaurant, New York City version, to an irresistible fruit and grain combination, we’ll teach you techniques to produce this velvety custard with its caramelized sugar topping as you create your own pastry cream, layer a fruit and nut version and torch a caramelized sugar topping.

Advanced Cake Decoration
Already know how to bake a delicious cake with simple frosting? Now master the art of more advanced decoration. This class explores using a silky butter cream frosting (along with a pastry bag and tips) to pipe elegant designs onto your masterpiece. You’ll also create your own double layer masterpiece, work with marzipan and chocolate plastic for originality in design and practice piping techniques for a number of unique combinations.

The Whole of It: Baking with Grains
Is the fear of heavy baked goods holding you back from healthy whole grain baking? This class will unveil the mystery to making grain goodies that actually taste delicious! Say goodbye to those doorstops as you overcome the challenges of whole grains, bake using a variety of whole grains and understand the nutritional value of whole grains.

Breads & Pastries for the Retail Baker
King Arthur Flour and the Retail Bakers Association join forces for a new seminar series. Instructor Jeffrey Hamelman will help you master techniques for breads and pastries that will be easy to apply in your own shop. In an in-depth learning experience that will stretch over three days, you will experience a combination of hands-on activities as well as technical and academic instruction. Products you will explore include:

• white breads

• whole grain breads

• sour dough breads

• savory products such as pizzas and focaccia

• laminated pastries

• other yeasted viennoiserie pastries

• and more

Learn techniques to help you maximize production efficiency and product quality. Discover how you can create good product diversity without using an excessive number of mixes. Practice methods for using basic doughs in a variety of ways to produce a number of different products. Price includes lunch daily.

Focaccia & Fougasse
Learn how to create and handle the slack doughs required for these rustic flatbreads. Discover the secrets to chewy flavorful focaccia, and fabulous fougasse including the role of preferments in rustic breads and shaping techniques for artisan breads.

Classic French Pastries with Master Baker, Ciril Hitz
Want to learn the secrets of the world's best pastry? World-renowned pastry chef Ciril Hitz returns to King Arthur for a class on pastries. Chef Hitz most recently won Best of Show at the 2004 Bread and Pastry Championship. The Brioche: You may be familiar with this sweet and buttery delight that adorns many European breakfast tables, but are you aware of its versatility? In this class we will discover the seemingly endless possibilities of this true classic and its contemporary variations. We will start with covering the basic Grande Tete shaped brioche and then take the same dough to another level by means of a summer fruit tart and a tasty savory creation, too. We will also take a closer look at its northern European relative, the Stollen, and the southern cousin, the Panatone, both of which share the same basic ingredients with some tasty twists. Come and experience brioche as you never have before!

Bread & Soup Suppers for Summer
Ready to nurture your friends and family with freshly-made whole-grain bread and a simple soup? This Baking Education Center offering is sure to launch you into a light and healthy summer season! You'll learn techniques for making a whole grain yeast bread, then have a chance to customize your loaf and help make two seasonal soups.

Merlin's Magic Oven Baking Camp for Kids
Silver Bells & Cockleshells
Spend the week creating a garden of edible delights -- from flower-shaped breads to butterfly cakes. For children in grades 3, 4 & 5.

Baking in a Wood-Fired Oven
with Rosemary Hubbard and Scott Woolsey of Killdeer Farm
The season is right to join two of the Upper Valley’s most knowledgeable Foodies for a slow-food wood-fired extravaganza! Scott Woolsey, manager of Killdeer Farmstand, and Rosemary Hubbard, a baking instructor and former Dean & Deluca pastry chef, team up to pair local produce and bread with the art of wood fired baking and roasting. We’ll prepare a bevy of local veggies Friday, and on Saturday, the focus will shift to methods for preparing dough and topping a variety of pizzas and flatbreads, and culminate in a wood-fired oven bake of these savory breads. This promises to be a very special class, but space is limited, so sign up early!

Bread 101
Overcome yeast anxiety forever with this class on basic yeast bread! Plunge your hands into the dough and learn to mix and knead bread that is successful every time. Bake your own loaf of fragrant yeasted bread; learn shaping techniques for other successful loaves, and understand how ingredients work together to create breads of loft and delicious flavor.

Ethereal Cakes and Summer Compotes
Don’t let the dog days of summer get you down; these light-as-a-feather sponge cakes and their cool, fruity counterparts can give your summer desserts the lift they need. Bring fresh, new desserts to your repertoire as you learn the skills needed to make a light-as-air cake and use seasonal fruits and berries to create a flavorful compote.

Merlin's Magic Oven Baking Camp for Kids
For students in grades 6, 7 & 8.

Cool & Fruity Summer Desserts
Taste the freshness of the season as you create memorable summer desserts. Create a cool silky pastry cream and pair it with summer's fruit bounty and crisp pastry made from scratch!

Pastry Miniatures: More Than A Mouthful!
Small in size, but full in flavor—miniatures are all the rage in the pastry world. The class will feature making three types of petite pastries. Students will learn to intensify flavor for maximum impact. We also include presentation tips for miniature pastries.

Bread: Principles & Practice
This comprehensive class explores every aspect of bread baking for the home baker. Lecture topics include the function of ingredients, pre-ferments, and how to facilitate maximum rise. There is extensive hands-on work in yeast breads, from basic bread through whole grains, sweetened breads, sourdough and starter-based breads. Some class time will also be devoted to techniques for baking powder breads, and the action of chemical leavens through the production of quick breads and scones.

Pastries of the French Countryside with Mitch Stamm of Johnson & Wales
Join Mitch Stamm, instructor at the College of Culinary Arts at Johnson & Wales University and recent Gold Medal of Des Nautes winner for Best Bakery Display from the Société Culinaire Philanthropique, as he and his students create rustic sweet and savory French pastries inspired by those of the small towns that dot the countryside.

It's the Berries!
We are taking full advantage of summer's ripened berries to create memorable desserts, from flaky fresh raspberry napoleons to blueberry crisp!

Advanced Bread Baking with Jeffrey Hamelman
The Advanced Bread Baking class is designed for professionals seeking to further their knowledge and refine their hands-on skills. Building on the Fundamentals of Bread Baking class, the curriculum offers a more complex and technical examination of the bread baker’s art. Lecture material will focus extensively on the creation, use, and maintenance of sourdough and levain cultures, as well as the production of laminated pastries. Students will produce various breads of both French and German origin.

Hands-on time will also be devoted to decorative breads. Breads will range from those using 100% white flour to those using 100% rye flour. A key focus will be on breads that are naturally leavened, with emphasis on various ways to incorporate them into different production schedules. Students will produce viennoiserie, including brioche, croissant, Danish, and variations of these, such as French brioche feuillété and German bienenstich.

Product evaluation and time allotted for questions and answers will be incorporated into each day’s class. Lunch is provided daily.

The Magic of Wild Yeast: Sourdough
Learn techniques for baking with sourdough, as well as how to achieve the degree of flavor you prefer. This hands-on class teaches techniques for hand-mixing sourdough. Care and feeding of sourdough starters, shaping, slashing and steam baking of traditional sourdough boules will also be covered.

Mom & Me: We All Scream for Ice Cream
Spend the day with someone you love and let us clean up the mess! Keep your cool making ice cream sandwich treats from start to finish. Tuition covers both child and adult participants. While you spend some quality time with your favorite little baker, you’ll create delicious “sandwich” cookies and make a creamy smooth ice cream from scratch.

Easy As Pie
Does the thought of making your own piecrust strike terror in your heart? Do you sneak frozen pre-made crust from the grocery store into your home? This class will banish even the worst case of crust anxiety! Students will roll out perfect, delectable pastry for a two crust pie and blind-bake a pie shell. Fillings will feature seasonal fruits, and everyone goes home with delicious pie to dazzle friends and family!

Far-Flung Flatbreads
We've combed the world for the best flatbreads, and come up with an international assortment sure to whet your appetite for these ancient breads. You’ll taste your way across countries and continents, from Italy to India, mastering the simple techniques for reproducing each country's specialty in your own kitchen while you discover cultural settings for different flatbreads, and their serving traditions, how to fabricate both dough and batter flatbreads and work with specialty flours, such as gluten-free, and how to use them.

Fundamentals of Bread Baking with Jeffrey Hamelman
The Fundamentals of Bread Baking class is designed for professionals and those with basic professional experience who wish to elevate their skills. The lecture portion of each 8-hour day is designed to build a sound academic understanding of the entire bread-making process. Extensive hands-on work, with an emphasis on proper shaping techniques, will be a focus of each class day. Students will learn about the function of ingredients in bread, the control of the fermentation process, the various forms of yeasted pre-ferments and how to use them, as well as practical applications, such as determining proper dough temperature, baker’s math, and how to adjust the weight of bread formulas to meet production demands.

This class also provides a discussion and introduction to the production of croissant and brioche. The criteria of what makes good bread will be discussed along with daily product evaluations. Time will be allotted each day for questions and answers. Lunch is provided daily.

Setting up a Successful Bakery
with Jeffrey Hamelman and Special Guest Peter Franklin
If you’ve always dreamed of opening a small bakery, this class will help you on your path. Pick the brains of Jeffrey Hamelman and Peter Franklin, on all the aspects of beginning an artisan operation, from what equipment to buy to how to write a business plan.

Students will also have the opportunity to mix and bake a variety of products to better understand the choices involved in product and equipment selection, costing, and market assessment. Specific topics will include: bakery layout, equipment selection, product selection, cost control, market assessment, business plans, and management plans.

Introduction to International Pastries with Jeffrey Hamelman
Introduction to International Pastries is a class designed to offer bakers and pastry chefs a hands-on exploration of pastry products from a number of countries. The class is intended to increase each student’s understanding of pastry techniques, and to expand his or her repertoire of fine pastry production. In the class the focus will be on traditional and modern pastries from France, Italy, Germany-Switzerland, and the United States. Combining lecture and production each day, the class will examine the historical context of the pastries, and focus on proper ingredient choice, mise-en-place, and detailed production techniques from mixing through finish work, to ensure consistently superior results.

Within the historical baking traditions of the different countries, the students will make cakes, tarts, creams and fillings, individual pastries and desserts, and representative cookies. Finish work will include the decoration of various cakes and tarts with buttercream, piping chocolate, and fresh fruits in season. Time for product evaluation, as well as for questions and answers, will be incorporated into each day’s class. Lunch is provided daily.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #15
25. wow! that's a heck of a list of classes
:wow:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #15
26. I envy you being that close to King Arthur
Their products are first rate and their cookbook is nearly a bible. Their website is also a great resource.

Now I'm nearly as excited as you waiting for your report on the pizza class!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-23-06 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Most of these cost some money
From $45 to $80 (pro classes cost more) but frankly if there were a few people interested, I'd be willing to take the class and report back.

The pizza class I'm going to do, but if anyone sees some other class they'd like to know about, let me know, I'll try to get to it and tell you what I learned.

- Tab
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Duer 157099 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-30-06 06:03 PM
Response to Original message
29. I sort of tried this recipe
But several factors intervened that made it a suboptimal experiment.

1) I didn't see an oven temp, so I used my max heat (550) plus a pizza stone -- does that sufficiently mimic a pizza oven or is that considered proper conditions for this recipe?

2) Didn't have instant yeast, so used a whole package of dry active -- should I have used only 1-1/4 of dry active? My thinking was that the main difference between dry active and instant is the amount of active yeast, with instant having about 2x -- so, I used approx 2x the amount when I used the dry active. But now I saw on a yeast website that you substitute equal amounts of dry active for instant (but that wasn't a pizza specific site). So... how much active dry yeast to use in this recipe?

3) the dough sat in the fridge for a couple days because of circumstances, so it wasn't optimal.

However! I was able to roll the dough really thin, and it baked crisp.

Going to try again, hopefully with more info first.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-30-06 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. I'm trying this tonight
This past Monday I did the grilled pizza recipe from Cook's Grilling issue and tonight I'm comparing it to this cake flour recipe. The dough's proofing as I type.

To answer your question ..... no ..... a home oven with a pizza stone is better for pizza than a home oven without a pizza stone, but the temp is the thing. No home oven on earth can get to the 750° a commercial pizza oven attains. When you read the article (it was also discussed in this thread, above) you'll see why they substituted cake flour for bread flour. To save the pizza in the far slower home oven.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Duer 157099 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-30-06 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. Great news! I can't wait to hear your report
I'm also going to try to do it again tonight. I was just out trying to find the CI issue to no avail.

I've been recording the show "America's Test Kitchen" lately, saw the grilled pizza one a few days ago, but still haven't gotten my grill out.

The pizza stone I got broke, twice, already. No doubt I did something wrong (no, I didn't drop it). I had laid it on the bottom of the oven as suggested by Alton Brown. It was dry, or at least I thought it was. So, now I'm thinking I'll wrap it in heavy duty foil, put it between two half-sheet pans, and wrap the whole thing up and keep it on the bottom of the oven. That should do something, right?

So what do you think about the equivalency of the yeasts -- dry active vs. instant, in this recipe? That is, should I use just the 1-1/4 tsp of dry active?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 12:09 AM
Response to Reply #29
33. Pizza stones
I used to just heat my oven with a pizza stone in it, and got lame results.

Then I read that the stone should be heated for at least an hour. In retrospect it made sense, but I didn't think in that fashion at the time. Let it build up and retain heat, not just measure the temperature of the air.

I don't recall if it was Cooks Illus. or something else, but they determined there was no noticeable diff between an oven with a stone at 450 degrees and one at 500, other than the higher temp tended to smoke more. I would agree - there seems to be more control (or at least tolerance for timing issues) at 450, so that's what I've been using.

So, yes, a stone - you just have to preheat it for a while.

I'm also experimenting with putting a metal bowl of water in the oven on the bottom to inject some steam. Initial results are positive, but I don't have it down to a science yet. Yet, as the magic 8-ball would say, "signs say yes".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 05:26 AM
Response to Reply #33
34. Yeah, pizza stones must be heated a long time to be useful
The ones bought in most stores in the $20 range are about a half or 3/4 inch thick. I used those for years with pretty good result. And yes, they do inexplicably break from time to time. I have some theories as to why, but no proof for any of them. Call it the work of the oven gods ... or would that be oven devils? Of course, I assume that one is starting them in a cold oven. The thermal shock of placing them in an already-hot oven will often shatter them.

About six or seven years ago I came into posesssion of two very special oven stones. Each weighs in the 25 pound range! They're made of a special ceramic from which the floors of commercial wood fired ovens are made and in fact, are cast from surplus material left from the casting of those ovens. They are **very** dense, but with sufficient porosity to abosrb moisture and have a high heat retention. But they take forever to get hot all the way through. An hour preheat is an absolute minimum, with and hour and a half or more being preferred. Last night, when I made my latest experimental pizzas, I rushed things a bit and only preheated for 45 minutes. That cost me a nice bottom char. The bottoms were done, but just barely.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #34
37. Another thing I've done do great success

One of my pizza stones also did the inexplicable breaky thing, but instead of throwing it out, I used it as a second stone on top.

I had to buy a new stone to put the pizza on, of course, but basically I have a stone on the bottom, and the broken stone on top, so it's radiant heat from both, and since it's a convection oven there's still air circulation.

And, no, the second stone doesn't actually contact the pizza, but it lives as close to the top as possible on a rack above. If you can get it really close (the trick is to keep your dough from bubbling up so it doesn't get attached to the top stone), the results are great - it really made a difference in the way the top of my pizzas came out.

I've also started working with pizza pans - I bought some from creativepizza.com. They do make a difference, if only for convenience (I can use all the corn meal I want, and still about 20% of my pizzas get stuck coming off of the pizza peel).

Actually, creativepizza.com is an interesting site - it's run by a guy Dominick, who basically is interested in pursuing creating quality pizza for pizza's sake. He does sell his custom flour, which is good, but you can also get similar stuff from King Arthur. The difference is about $1 for a 3-lb bag - basically nothing for home use, but for commercial use it'd make a difference in your profites. Regardless, you can also get quality pizzaria pizza pans, servers, etc. I basically brought a couple of hard-coat anodized pizza pans and a pizza screen. I also got some other stuff, but just helpful other stuff - nothing that would affect the quality of the product. I do like the pans. I haven't tried the screen yet (I tend to do more pizza in the non-summer months - right now it's just too frickin' hot).

He does sell a pizza stone made of Cordierite, (a magnesium iron aluminum cyclosilicate, common in commercial ovens), but I'm pretty sure it isn't the stuff my pizza stones are made of. I think it'd be worth a try. I didn't see it the first time through. You can get them at other places like zesco.com too.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
spinbaby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. Here's how to do steam
I haven't done it with pizza, but I did it while I was experimenting with artisan bread one dreary January a couple of years ago. You put a pan full of rocks--yes ordinary limestone driveway rocks--on the rack under your baking stone. Pre-heat for at least an hour, then slide the bread (or pizza) onto the stone and throw a large glass of water onto the rocks under the stone right bebore slamming the oven door shut. It helps to have a really good vent fan here. This method produced an absolutely perfect french-bread crust for me--thick and chewy with tiny blisters.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-30-06 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
32. *****FLASHNEWZ: Pizza Update********
Okay, we made it tonight, but with one difference. I allowed it to do two rises. I also made two recipes and divided it into six pizzas.

The results were quite good. It still needs work on my part to get used to it, but it made a very nice pizza. Crunchy/crusty outside and soft inside. I made four plain margarita pizzas and two 'specials' with (leftover) BBQ shrimp, roasted peppers, and )also leftover) sauteed mushroom mix (shitake, baby bellas, oyster, and enoke). My comments go only to the margaritas.

I used fresh, salt slaked sliced raw tomatoes, fresh mozz, raw garlic, olive oil, and some reggiano. I used my supoer heavy pizza stone and set the oven to convection and 500 degrees and preheated for 45 minutes, which was a problem. I should have gone the full hour since the later pizzas were better than the early ones. They had a bit of char that the early ones lacked.

This has some real promise. I'll post another update.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #32
36. kewl! I'm hoping my older gas fired oven in the new place heats
better (hotter) than my newer electric oven here

I haven't given that pizza stone I scored nearly enough of a work out !!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
38. H2S, any thoughts on this?
http://www.zesco.com/products.cfm?subCatID=245&PGroupID=ZP99071005

Not for deep-dish, just for regular (NY style?) za.

I was a little concerned because it mentioned par-baked products, not from scratch, but if it goes to 650, it gets us closer to the magic grail.

I want to put a real pizza oven in my next house, but I'm not there yet. $500 is about as much as I'll spend at the moment (yeah, I like a good pizza).
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Apr 19th 2024, 05:48 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » DU Groups » Home & Family » Cooking & Baking Group Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC