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pokerfan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:10 PM
Original message
Ancient humans had sex with everyone
By Daniel Stolte, University Communications September 5, 2011

Anatomically modern humans interbred with more archaic hominin forms even before they migrated out of Africa, a UA-led team of researchers has found.

It is now widely accepted that anatomically modern humans of the species Homo sapiens originated in Africa and eventually spread throughout the world. Ancient DNA recovered from fossil Neanderthal bones suggests they interbred with more archaic hominin forms once they had left their evolutionary cradle for the cooler climates of Eurasia, but whether they exchanged genetic material with other, now extinct archaic hominin varieties in Africa remained unclear.

In a paper published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, or PNAS, a team led by Michael Hammer, an associate professor and research scientist with the UA's Arizona Research Labs, provides evidence that anatomically modern humans were not so unique that they remained separate.

"We found evidence for hybridization between modern humans and archaic forms in Africa. It looks like our lineage has always exchanged genes with their more morphologically diverged neighbors," said Hammer, who also holds appointments in the UA's department of ecology and evolutionary biology, the school of anthropology, the BIO5 Institute and the Arizona Cancer Center.

http://www.uanews.org/node/41580
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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:12 PM
Response to Original message
1. I thought that animals able to mate and produce fertile offspring were
considered the same species?
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Not entirely.
It's a good general rule, but is not ironclad. Some inter-species hybrids are fertile, at least sometimes. A lot depends on the separation of the genomes.

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Curmudgeoness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #1
9. There could be offspring that were not fertile, but
had DNA from both species, so proof of inbreeding without proof of fertile offspring. :shrug:
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pokerfan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #1
17. It's complicated
It's also pretty far outside my area of expertise but there's this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Species_problem
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mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #1
18. that's only one of several species concepts...
Edited on Tue Sep-06-11 08:06 PM by mike_c
...none of which is universal. The biological species concept, championed by new synthesis folks like Ernst Mayr, is the one you're referring to. Unfortunately, it breaks down when morphologically distinct "species" can hybridize, when organisms reproduce asexually (that's LOTS), and when organisms are known only from fossils (that's most life that has existed on earth). It very often breaks down DURING speciation, when conspecifics are diverging and reproductively isolated but actually still capable of producing fertile, viable offspring. Even for morphologically discrete, extant organisms, the biological species concept only works when the complete sexual natural history is known, and it's simply not known for the majority of organisms on Earth today-- even the minority that have been described.

It's a good idea, but none of the working definitions of "species" is universal. Not even close.
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mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. here you go....
Edited on Tue Sep-06-11 08:15 PM by mike_c


Oops, meant to respond to the OP, but never mind....
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Bluzmann57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:12 PM
Response to Original message
2. Guess they were horny
It happens.
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MrScorpio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:15 PM
Response to Original message
3. Let's say friendly strangers visit your village
Guess what happened!
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:17 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. True, and when the guys are out of town at the convention...
well...enough said.Lots of stray stuff going on, even today. Imagine a word before religion made it shameful to have sex.
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JHB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:20 PM
Response to Original message
6. Geez, how old is Newt, anyway?
Had to get some of that "modern human" nookie, didn't he?
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Ikonoklast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:22 PM
Response to Original message
7. What Happens In Rock Vegas, Stays In Rock Vegas!
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Xithras Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:24 PM
Response to Original message
8. I just saw a bit on TV about people having sex with trees.
People sleep with people of the same sex, and of the opposite sex. Black people sleep with white people. Fat people sleep with skinny people. Beautiful people sleep with horrifically disfigured people. People have sex in large groups, or with inanimate toys. People sleep with shrubbery, their cousins, their siblings, their dogs, farm animals, and complete strangers in bathrooms. People screw the gas fillers on their cars.

If there's one thing that humans have clearly demonstrated, it's that we'll have sex with anything if the mood is right. Sexual inhibitions are a mental construct, and a substantial part of our population has always been willing to do away with the whole "one man, one woman, forever and missionary" mindset.

Is it really such a shock to hear that some of our ancestors slept with other species which were nearly human in appearance, and who they could likely communicate with, live with, and even fall in love with? In a pinch, I'd bet that I could find 10 people willing to sleep with Chewbacca in less than a day. Neanderthals were much prettier.

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Curmudgeoness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:27 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. What in the hell do you watch on TV? Yikes. nt
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Xithras Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:33 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Lol, it was a news bit.
Saw it yesterday, but it was just a two minute bit talking with some guy who thought it shouldn't be a criminal offense to masturbate on a tree in a park. I didn't catch the beginning and don't know why they were talking about it, but it caught my attention as I was walking through the room...a real WTF piece. It's called "dendraphilia" or something like that, and it's an actual sexual disorder.

While I disagree with his position on the parks, I really don't care what people do for fun. If you want to bump uglies with an oak knothole, just be courteous enough to check for squirrels first.
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Curmudgeoness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. LOL, yep, that would have caught my attention too.
Talk about tree huggers.
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Bosso 63 Donating Member (759 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. Beautiful long limbs on an attractive trunk, and then I know
I've got wood.


Seriously people,
keep it with in your own species.
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:26 PM
Response to Original message
10. Most of that was during freshman year /nt
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:49 PM
Response to Original message
14. Sounds like a night at the baths. Nt
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 07:52 PM
Response to Original message
15. well, that explains this


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Ter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-11 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #15
25. Hey, trolls need loving too!
:D
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FBaggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 08:18 PM
Response to Original message
20. But they called it rishathra. nt
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On the Road Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-06-11 09:25 PM
Response to Original message
21. Thanks a Lot, Pokerfan
Makes me feel a lot better. And here everyone was dumping on me for that incident with the bonobo.
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pokerfan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-11 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. So this Scottish farmer walks into the pub...
This Scottish farmer walks into the neighborhood pub, and orders a whiskey.

"Ye see that fence over there?" he says to the bartender. "Ah built it with me own two hands! Dug up the holes with me shovel, chopped doon the trees for the posts by me ownself, laid every last rail! But do they call me 'McGregor the Fence-Builder?' No..."

He gulps down the whiskey and orders another. "Ye see that pier on the loch?" He continues, "Ah built it me ownself, too. Swam oot into the loch to lay the foondations, laid doon every single board! But do they call me 'McGregor the Pier-Builder?' No."

"But ye shag ONE sheep ..."
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Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-11 01:31 PM
Response to Original message
22. "I did not. Have. Sexual. Relations with that species."
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pokerfan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-11 02:49 PM
Response to Original message
23. Take me now, sub-creature....
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