"Chemtrails" Debunked

[benburch]

I've had enough of this garbage Art Bell tinfoilhattery, and so have others;

http://www.nmsr.org/chemtrls.htm

http://www.debunker.com/conspiracy.html

They are CLOUDS. Made of WATER.

In moist clear cold air they provide a nucleus that cirrus clouds form around and they can persist for many hours. AND THEY ALWAYS HAVE. Nothing is new about this except for a couple of things of note;

1. There are many more high altitude jets now than there were in the 60s when I was a kid, and high-bypass engines are more likely to make robust contrails. But I clearly remember persistent contrails when I was I kid. (My father was a pilot and I used to take his meteorology book outside and watch clouds.)

2. The growth in the number of contrails is actually changing the albedo and heat retention of Earth and thereby changing the weather.

[Ezlivin]

1. Then please explain our mutant leader

How else can we understand Bush?

[Warpy]

10. Oh, come on, Bush can easily be explained

He's as old as Satan, as common as dirt, he's been here before in every tyrant the world has ever known. It's not like he's done anything new or different, he's a very limited man, capable of being a wrecking ball, incapable of building a single thing.

[Jara sang]

2. Isn't the conspiracy

That somebody is creating them use passenger jets by putting chemicals in the engines unknowns to everyone. I don't really know anything about it.

[crikkett]

3. Hooray! One less worry for today.

Actually I read somewhere that they were used to detect active sectors of the Woodpecker Grid.

Any debunkers on that?

[bullimiami]

4. sorry that is bullshit. ive seen them. weird jets laying down trails

in a grid pattern over the city. low altitude.

anyone who has seen them knows something is up. it is deliberate.





ive never seen a ufo so im a sceptic. let me see one one time and I wont doubt it anymore.

[donsu]

5. agree - chem trails are real - too much evidence

they even tested stuff over Key West. told us it was nothing to worry about, only egg white particles or some such.

[benburch]

7. Those grid patterns are the flight paths.

Due to modern navigational aids aircraft conform to them rather exactly.

[soothsayer]

14. Ha! We have them going in directions where there ARE no

flight paths. Generally ahead of a storm front. That's why i do think it's weather manipulation (for military purposes).

[benburch]

16. The storm front provides the conditions they need...

and the moving air pushes contrails ahead of it for miles and miles. Moving air makes contrails develop a striped parallel pattern;



When they were formed (usually leftmost line in the series in this photo) they did correspond with a flight path.

Also, how do you know where your local flight paths are? Chances are you don't.

[Desertrose]

18. bullshit. If these grids are air flight patterns

we are in deep deep trouble.

If clouds form from so much of this *normal air traffic* then we don't need chemtrails.

They are real- those who have seen them recognize them easily. Saying they are debunked doesn't change anything really- makes it easier to keep putting whatever it is up in the skies. I don't know what it is or why...I do know that it is almost constant and makes a scummy cloudcover when we should have brilliant blue skies. I also know that it is not normal flight patterns in my area...out in the middle of nowhere.

Ever hear of chaff??

Interesting link to the US govt GAO.....
http://www.fas.org/man/gao/nsiad-98-219.htm

a few snippets....
The methods used to disperse chaff have evolved over the years, from
simply tossing it out of airplane windows to launching it with
spring-loaded or pneumatic machines. Currently, the services use
pyrotechnic charges, rockets, mortars, air flows, or motors to
disperse chaff. Many aircraft employ pyrotechnic charges that eject
chaff in bursts from small bundles weighing about 6 ounces, while
others use air flows to disperse ejected chaff.



The continuous stream technique, called saturation chaff, may be used
by aircraft to cover a large area. By 2005 or 2006, the Army also
plans to use saturation chaff to mask vehicle and troop movements.



Air quality issues addressed in the report include the potential for
(1) noncompliance with national air quality standards due to the
release of significant quantities of particulates, (2) release of
hazardous air pollutant emissions, and (3) visibility impairment.
The report takes into consideration the Clean Air Act\6 and its
amendments and includes a literature review of chaff dispersion and
air quality effects as well as its own April 1994 technical report on
chaff particulate testing.

The report's literature review shows that none of the previous
studies had addressed the possible formation of inhalable
particulates or issues related to compliance with the Clean Air Act.

an old thread in this forum...http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=228&topic_id=10717

Now I give this thread about another 5 minutes til its either gone or sent to the 911 basement. :evilgrin:

DR

[sybylla]

6. Yeah, but there will always be those who call science incompetent

They will never be convinced because no amount of scientific fact, no heaps of scientific test results will change their minds. They will hang on to their myths until death do they part. The only difference between them and creationists is that they are carrying a different banner.

[havocmom]

8. I KNOW contrails are water vapor.

What worries me is the fact that jets are flying well defined and well timed grids. I live in the middle of No-friggin-where and we see the 'game-board' most days now.

We did not see such flights before 2001.

My tinfoil theory is they are having the military fly a whole lotta photo taking trips and/or waste fuel to keep the price very high. Airlines are NOT having fun with fuel prices.

Seems like they really wanna keep average Americans from traveling. They don't want us getting news from overseas. They are making air travel as annoying as they can without actually making anything SAFER...
My fear is the construction of an economic Iron Curtain to keep Americans ignorant.

[achtung_circus]

9. Darn

now I'll have to delete half the bookmarks from my Shits and Giggles folder.

The next thing, you'll be telling me the Masons are legit and those UN secret bases are non-existent.

[benburch]

11. Except for the UN secret base on the Moon's Far Side...

:silly:

[Skip Intro]

12. fwiw - some pics I snapped a while back

still doesn't look right to me:





no air show, just a normal sunny day, then the trails, which seemed to disperse into a canopy of clouds which eventually filled the sky.

like I said, fwiw

[Desertrose]

21. very similar to what I see around here....

Nice shot from a pilots point of view....



from Weather Wars...website by a meteorologist....

Without question, contrails have generated a great emotional response to my weather wars work. Some scientists, and sadly that seems a generous use of the term considering their curious absence from this debate, have de ridded the possibility of chemtrails and simply refuse to examine the skies above them and therefore have--so far--excluded themselves from this debate.  Indeed a sad state of affairs considering how long this project has been underway.  In my view, an endlessly curious mind and an open belief system are must haves to be a scientist. In the continuing effort to debunk the chemtrail/contrail issue a closed mind is all these 'intellectuals' seem to be able to bring to the table. They say a lab must prove that they exist before they can believe this project is underway. Then bring that lab to bear on this subject!  Chemtrails appear to exist, and in great numbers. This case is open and should be examined and scrutinized by the atmospheric departments of universities, the EPA, and the FAA should not be so evasive when questioned about the extra aircraft flying that civilians flights must be routed around when the spraying project is heavily underway near busy civilian hubs. Why are ATC (air traffic control) guys so skittish when this topic is brought up? They see and are aware of it day in and day out. They also know the magnitude of this operation.

Above and beyond the issue of the trails themselves. Is why fly these sorties in the first place? These belching trails exist, and what effect would the over five million miles of aircraft contrails DAILY have on our atmospheric environment?  This effect must be quantifiable and not yet significant enough for the desired effect otherwise why continue day after day, year after year in ever increasing numbers.


http://www.weatherwars.info/pilotsview.htm

[soothsayer]

13. You need a certain temp and humidity for contrails to form. CHEM

trails have been documented forming under conditions in which contrails couldn't.

Open yer eyes and open yer mind.

[benburch]

15. I have. And such documentation is bogus.

Scientifically invalid. Temperature and humidity on the ground don't matter.

[Celebration]

17. So now we can debate Chemtrails

In the Science forum? How is that different from crop circles? I don't really have an opinion one way or another on this but just trying to figure out what is/is not supposed to be posted in this forum. Wasn't another thread about this moved out? Or maybe I imagined it.

[Desertrose]

19. give it time...it will go poof n/t

[benburch]

20. Nothing to debate, really.

They are the worst sort of garbage pseudo-science.

[Skinner]

22. Locking.

Chemtrails are kooky.