Why do so many crazy and angry people turn to religion?

[MrScorpio]

And once they get religion, they figure out that their adopted faith isn't crazy and angry enough for them... So they have to "fix" it.

Seems to me like a cross-cultural phenomena.


BTW: This is in no way bashing of religion. Practically every faith teaches good and positive things... It's just a certain segment of the so-called followers, like Jones, that I'm talking about.

[JCMach1]

1. and it's the 'converts' who really make you want to bash your head on a wall

Who slip on a shampoo bottle one day and find jeebus.

[MrScorpio]

"You guys have been doing it all wrong..."

"I'm going to show you how it's done!"

[PetrusMonsFormicarum]

2. Absolution from responsibility

for their actions.

[CanonRay]

25. Spot on

If you pray to God, God "tells" you what you want to hear, so you no longer bear responsibility for whatever stupid shit you are doing. Magic formula.

[JerseygirlCT]

26. Yes

You can contrast them to the more peaceful religious folks with that -

the peaceful and peace-seeking people tend to accept their faith AS a responsibility - toward others, toward peace.

Those seeking absolution can only find it in rules they construct - rules that make sure there are "them" and "us". So long as they're "us", it's easy and acceptable (in their framework) to make enemies of the "us" - to demonize them. Then they can't be responsible for acting out their hate - they're simply following "the rules".

[lunatica]

3. I think they're the product of their religion and upbringing

Something sure made them angry. Maybe it's the constant fear of their vengeful God and instead of directing their anger at their God or those who teach their God is jealous they direct it at 'sinners' in the hope of pleasing that big bad ass angry man in the sky. They're buying their ticket to heaven by carrying out the smiting that God seems unable to.

[MrScorpio]

4. JCMach1 is so right about "converts"

A lot of those guys are extra nutty

[seabeyond]

5. they dont have confidence or trust in self and need outside power

placing faith in the outside power they have to protect and control to attain a sense of control

the thing is the boble in an odd way, can show them how to go within self and obtain that self empowerment. tehn you are suppose to let go of the religion. but too many get stuck in the guiding from religion and never bring it to self.

[MrScorpio]

7. But even the non angry and crazy faithful feel that way about religion

So it has to be something more

[seabeyond]

12. religion is a conditioning. it is how it works. if you look at it today, compared to the past

the conditioning is done differently. if you have not noticed, the last decade has been all around angry. it feeds into the religion as it is in every other part of our society. when we adopt battle mode, battle we will receive. action/reaction. movement instead of stillness.

we always have a choice in all things to walk in a higher vibration that will ultimately end up in stillness, peace, serenity, or walk it in lower vibration that will create battle. all things. good bad and ugly.

people are chosing religion in lower vibration. so we have battle. anger and fear.

religion is not inherently bad. any of them. it is just another path to enlightened. we can get the same story be it bature, animals, music, arts, children, ..... they all have the same story in it.

[MrScorpio]

19. So it's society that's corrupting religious practice?

Well.. that makes a lot of sense.

Wow.

Thanks

[seabeyond]

31. collective conscious is part of the whole. where one goes, we all do

as the energy directs.

you heard the saying we are weak as our weakest... or whatever.

[saltpoint]

6. It's a socket with a high-voltage authoritarian component.

To use Christianity as an example, an ardent pacifist can see in the New Testament a ministry of peace and inclusion. An angry or frustrated person can see a path to validation of his or hert anger or frustration.

Jesus, then, comes in several manifestations, like Barbie. There's Beach Barbie, College Barbie, and so forth, and also there is Pacifist Jesus and Rout the Money-Changers Jesus and so forth.

The seeker projects onto Barbie and Jesus and Barbie and Jesus wear those clothes and assume those roles.

[MrScorpio]

9. It seems like most other religions have the same kind of fanatics

Like I said, it's cross cultural

What is it about religion in general that attracts these people?

[saltpoint]

20. Hi, MrScorpio. Yes. Agree -- I just used one of the

major traditions.

The authoritarian component seems to be the draw for the violent or fanatic personality. It offers an authority a nutbag might not ever have on his own and also a 'purity' of purpose that select passages of religious text can confer.

In THE TRUE BELIEVER, Eric Hoffer posits that fanatical faith in a given religion comes from "an acute lack of faith in oneself."

[CanonRay]

27. It seems like all religions

develop people who say "listen to me, I have an open channel to God. I talk to him personally, so you should do what I say". And there's enough people out there desperate for somebody to tell them what to do they get followers. It's an easy way out of responsibility. God has a plan for me.

It's all bullshit.

[saltpoint]

28. Hi, CanonRay. Yes -- I've run into way too many people

who use just that language -- "God has a plan for me."

It is an immediate shut-down. I stop listening to them and begin to look around for the exits.

I don't ridicule people's desperations but I sure wish they would stop turning to authoritarian fundamentalism, of any stripe.

[CanonRay]

34. I started thinking about this in college

after a number of friends who were really, heavily into drugs, turned to fundamental religion. It seemed to me at the time that they were substituting one drug for another kind. Religion gave them absolution for their lack of personal responsibility.

I haven't seen any evidence to the contrary in the subsequent 35 or so years, either. Religion allows you not to think.

[saltpoint]

39. Often true. It is always interesting how few of the

nutbag fundies in the U.S. have never read the New Testament.

They seem to prefer that an egomaniac like Jim Jones or Terry Jones or any number of others spoonfeed tem from the pulpit on Sunday mornings.

This Koran-burning event is real, real low-rent stuff.

[madokie]

8. Religion of any kind is a crutch only

when you die you die and thats it. Theres no heaven or hell to go too. Maybe there is reincarnation but I'm not betting the farm on that one either.

[MrScorpio]

13. I don't have a problem with religion, per se

Practically every faith preaches the same things: Be a good and moral person. treat others as you wish to be treated, honor the articles of faith and so on.

But why do all the crazy and angry types take all the good stuff about faith and turn it on its head?

That pretty much has confused me for most of my life.

[JerseygirlCT]

24. They're frightened

Very frightened - of people, including themselves, making decisions on their own, of thoughtfulness and consequences and gray areas. Nuance.

They want someone or something to tell them precisely what the "rules" are and they want to be sure that if they follow them to the letter, then all is well.

They aspire to be the one to make those rules.

The corollary of course, is that if someone doesn't follow the rules as they understand them, they HAVE to be punished.

[seabeyond]

33. old testament/patriachal. dominant/control. new testament/maternal

nurturing and caring. first break a person down thru old and walk them to new....

[madokie]

37. Back when I was in Navy bootcamp that was the plan

this was back in early september through late november '67. Break you down and then build you back up as a sailor, with me they failed :-) as I figured them out early on.

[seabeyond]

41. yup. nt

[cleanhippie]

58. Were you drafted?

[JerseygirlCT]

42. I think that's too simplistic

There are certainly parts of the Old Testament that are angry and violent, but not all. I don't think it's useful to make it into that sort of dichotomy.

In fact, if you'll forgive me, it's that sort of binary thought that gives rise to people like those celebrating their hate-filled Koran burning.

I think when we move from an all or nothing sort of view, there's a lot more to see, you know?

[seabeyond]

43. lets see, talking huge subject, reduced to subject line

ya... pretty simplistic.

[JerseygirlCT]

45. Yeah, not really a topic that can be successfully

reduced to that. As complex and confusing as people are!

[seabeyond]

17. it is a crutch. but that crutch is not meant to be used always.

i feel the purpose is to use the crutch until a point you dont need the crutch anymore. so many dont get that.

[madokie]

44. True, I live by the golden rule

taught to me early on in my church days. My dad started a Southern Babtist church that is still having services today when I was 3 years old so I spent a lot of my early lifetime in that church but his funeral in '77 was the last time I've been there. I quit the church scene shortly after the Cuban missile stand off with Kennedy. Trust me when I say this I'm a happy man today and its largely due to the fact that I laid that religious crutch down back then.

[seabeyond]

46. do unto others as you would have done unto you.... lots of people dont want me to do unto them

what i would have done onto me.

i always argue the golden rule. and people get pissed at me. lets see how you do, lol. talked to hubby just a couple nights ago about it.

this is one of the saying we continually repeat, but it is all wrong. and the words we put out matter.... in my opinion.

it is saying treat people as you want to be treated.

if i treated people like i want to be treated, i would have a lot of people pissed at me

or

am i gonna treat people like i want to be treated, cause as humans, that is wht we do. and other people have to suck it up, cause in their uniqueness they will do the same

do you see why my life is so odd? do you see why people may not want me to treat them, as i want to be treated. my family goes bonkers.

but it is funn, too

[madokie]

47. Reading what you have to say as I've said before

leads me to believe you are a wonderful person and I'm richer for having crossed your path.
Peace.

[seabeyond]

48. you... have me chucklin.

backatcha.

:hug:

[KansasVoter]

10. It is a crutch for weak minded people!

[PassingFair]

11. "Revealed Truth"

They claim to have it.

It's what's really wrong with religion.

[madrchsod]

14. they are weak in their faith

oh ye of little faith is the best summation i can think of to describe those who seek guidance from those who use faith for their own glory.

[cynatnite]

15. Two reasons...

Many are raised with it. The other reason is because of fear. They are so afraid of death that religion helps comfort them.

[mikeytherat]

16. Isn't believing in the unbelievable a bit of insanity in itself?

Plus, my Invisible Sky Wizard can kick the crap out of your Invisible Sky Wizard!

mikey_the_rat

[dynasaw]

18. Desperation

Turning to god . . . aka Big Daddy.

[Philosoraptor]

21. Now there's a question for the ages

[JerseygirlCT]

22. They tend to turn to authoritarian strains of their chosen religion

because that's where they're comfortable - either being told exactly what to do, or (their aspiration, probably) getting to tell others exactly what to do.

They're usually quite uncomfortable in any religion or sect thereof where a person's own judgement is allowed or even expected. Grays bother them - the world is black and white and nothing in between.

You know, "you're with us or against us."

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

23. Because religion gives them something to turn to for affirmation...

and often allows them to justify or hide behind hatred/intolerance of others.

Bible was used to justify the enslavement of blacks and the subjugation of women, among other things.

[old mark]

30. ...and the murder often by horrible means of millions of people who did not

believe in it, or believed in the wrong one...

In god's name, or course...


mark

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

52. Of course. It's amazing that you can get an otherwise decent human being to

commit atrocious acts "in the name of God."

[InvisibleTouch]

29. It gives them a "safe harbor" to say and do things...

...which in any other context would be utterly unacceptable in any society. But if they can claim it's their "religion," they can often get a pass in the eyes of others, and most significantly, in their own eyes. Some are very consciously and with premeditated calculation hiding behind the guise of religion, but many, I suspect, have completely deluded themselves. After that, there's no more need for uncomfortable self-examination.

[zipplewrath]

32. Same reason they are drawn to conspiracy theories

metaphysical explanations, as well as most conspiracy theories, are very mallable. They can be structured to accomodate any need or situation. Furthermore, they rest heavily upon an explanation that ones own circumstance is beyond ones own control. We are all mere pawns in a game played by gods, or the powerful. It's a bit similar to denial, or even part of it.

[QC]

35. The same reason many crazy , angry people turn to politics

(as we are reminded here every day): because it provides a justification and outlet for the anger and craziness that is already there.

[deacon]

36. Looking to justify their beliefs. To make themselves feel right, by combing through

readings to find one word or line to make them feel good about their angry self absorbed selves.

It's not religion, it's about people turning and twisting, twisting and turning to somehow make themselves right.

[Octafish]

38. Same reason calm and sane people kill.

"We Think the Price Is Worth It" is how Madeline Albright put it, describing the deaths of 500,000 Iraqi children due to punative economic sanctions post-Gulf War I.

BTW: This is no way bashing of warmongers. They're people, too.

[ismnotwasm]

40. Religion is powerful

For many reasons, it's a part of the human condition.

Religion, the myths, the imagery, the dogma, perhaps especially the dualities or conflicts in it give an unquiet mind fertile ground in which to grow malignant.

[piratefish08]

49. construct ANY belief, no matter how far-fetched and I guarantee that

somebody, somewhere will buy into it.

the cargo cults of the south pacific come to mind..............

[msongs]

50. insecure people who doubt their beliefs protest in the streets at the slightest perceived insult nt

[cleanhippie]

59. You are exactly right!

Which may explain your posts in the gungeon.

[w8liftinglady]

51. unfortunately,here it has devolved into a radical White Supremecist organization

The KKK has actively recruited these individuals
(Read this only if you have a strong stomach)
http://www.unskkkk.com/

[leftjohn]

53. Religion hijacked by politics

Seems like religion has been hijacked by politics. In particular, the Republicans have hijacked Christianity. They are now spewing their hate message and many Christians are loosing focus on what it means to be a Christian. They are becoming angry and that is not what God is all about. It is the politics that has made religous people angry.

I know it looks bad to promote my website, but I wrote an article not too long ago about Republicans and Christianity. I would love it if some of you read it and gave me some feedback. I don't sell anything or have any adds, so hopefully you won't hate me too much for giving my link.

The article can be found at-
http://www.leftjohn.com/religious_correctness.html

[kenny blankenship]

54. Because Politics was all full up?

[ladjf]

55. Because it's easier to make up answers than to objectively

research real evidence. nt

[humblebum]

56. It's not just religious people who get angry and crazy by any means.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJfijlxQVbQ&NR=1&feature...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIfBMBMZtOs&feature=rela...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fM5BJGECQH0&feature=rela...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTms4hPBA40&feature=rela...

[cleanhippie]

60. The OP never stated that, so whats your point?

[humblebum]

61. The point is quite obvious when religious people are singled out,

which is the case here.

[cleanhippie]

62. and rightly so.

Not seeing what your point is.

[humblebum]

63. An image is worth a thousand words. I provided the images - you

figure out what they are saying.

[cleanhippie]

64. You provided no such thing.

You provided links to youtube videos that I'm sure are nonsense and a waste of my time.


How about just summarize what the videos state?

[humblebum]

65. I classify videos as images. They don't require any explanation. nt

[cleanhippie]

66. But there are no videos in your post.

Just links.


I guess you are just unable to summarize what they state.

[charlie]

67. Metal makes you burn bibles

So put all bibles in a safe place before listening to Slipknot. I suggest in a deep hole in the backyard.

[cleanhippie]

68. It does? I listen to metal all the time and never once had the desire to burn a bible.

Is that what the videos he linked to stated?

[charlie]

69. There was the unmistakable chugga-chugga

of Mesa Rectifiers warping impressionable minds in the videos. Metal just... does things to people.

That, and Stalinism.

Good heavens! Could they have been Stalinist METALHEADS?

Lock your doors.

[ChadwickHenryWard]

75. The first three were hugely useless and a waste of time.

The fourth one was a surprisingly insightful and level - some metalhead broke down the action of burning a Bible, and how it's really kind of childish.

[rrneck]

57. They're scared and lonely.

Religion attracts authoritarians and authoritarian leaders.

http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/

[dimbear]

71. Yeah, bingo. There's an innate human desire to be in control,

and if you're an otherwise ordinary and slightly loonie person, you haven't too many choices. You can take weapons to the post office and break loose, or you can preach.

[struggle4progress]

70. Last I look, there wasn't any shortage of crazy angry people

And last I looked, most people were calling themselves religious

So a priori one might expect the following from any careful calculation: (1) you're really likely to encounter crazy-angry sometime or other, and (2) when you do they're more than likely to turn out to be religious

But drawing justifiable statistical inferences from this seems to be beyond the abilities of many R/T posters

[Enthusiast]

72. They are gullible.

And they are easiliy manipulated. They don't turn to religion because they are crazy and angry. They are first firmly entrenched in religion then become crazy and angry because they listen to Reich Wing sources of misinformation.

[jeepnstein]

73. In any population...

you'll have a certain number of crazies. They tend to draw attention. Religion has nothing to do with it. It does, however, give people who wish to paint all religious folks with a broad brush a wonderful palette. Some of the anti-religious set gets just as crazy.

A perfect example is the guy down in Florida getting ready to burn a Koran. Since I've not heard his actual scriptural basis for doing this yet I have to think he's on board the crazy wagon. And of course he gets the attention of folks who are just as far off the bubble in the Islamic world, a perfect storm. It's been that way since man left the Garden.

[TZ]

74. You can find zealots of every stripe everywhere

In politics, sports, movies, etc. Though to me, the religious zealots are almost as dangerous as political zealots because they have quite a bit of power and influence AND can influence politics.

[DeSwiss]

76. Why do so many crazy and angry people turn to religion?

Because they're enthralled and awe-struck by someone who can totally kick ass! I mean, http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2010/04/drunk-with-blood-gods-killings-in-bible.html">how many has Yahweh killed? ANSWER: An estimated at 25 million!

- Nobody, but nobody puts on the angry and the crazy like Yahweh.....

[humblebum]

77. Atheists 1, God 0

Roughly 130 million murdered under atheist dictators and state atheism in the 20th century alone.


http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/