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Does Judaism Believe in Satan? Not the way Christians do.

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heidler1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 01:31 AM
Original message
Does Judaism Believe in Satan? Not the way Christians do.
http://www.beingjewish.com/basics/satan.html


(This article should be read after my article Why Did G-d Create the World?)

The Christians don't understand how an angel of G-d can try to seduce people to disobey G-d, so they came to the unsupported conclusion that Satan must have rebelled against G-d.

This is completely contrary to everything Judaism believes. We reject that interpretation entirely.

What, then, does Judaism teach about Satan?

Did you ever see the movie Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory? (It's one of the few examples of where a story from a book was changed for the screen without ruining the experience.) The story is about a very famous chocolate factory, called Willy Wonka's Chocolate Factory, that produces the world's greatest chocolates, candies -- confectionery in general. No one ever enters the factory, and no one ever leaves.

Mr. Wonka, the owner, runs a contest. The winners of the contest will be allowed to enter and tour the factory together. However, they will have to sign a contract and follow the rules. One of the rules is: no eating of any products inside the factory without express permission.

Afterwards, when they leave, they will go home with a lifetime supply of chocolate.That is, *IF* they follow the rules.

Five children win. They are of course all excited; TV stations and reporters interview them, and the whole world is excited with them. Now they just wait until the day they are to enter the factory and see the great wonders that no one else has ever been allowed to see.

Before the big day comes, each of the winners of the contest is secretly visited by a man named Arthur Slugworth, President of Slugworth Chocolates, Incorporated. Mr. Slugworth shows them a lot of cash, and tells them they will get all that money and more, if only they steal out of the factory a candy called an Everlasting Gobstopper. See, it hasn't been mass produced or marketed yet, and Wonka's competition wants to get an advance sample of this product so he can get it out first, and ruin Wonka.

The day comes, and all the kids are allowed into the factory with one adult relative. They see the most amazing sights, and eat the most amazing (and impossible to actually exist in real life) foods. One of the things Wonka gives each of the kids is an Everlasting Gobstopper, on the condition that they never show it to anyone else.

During the tour of the factory, four of the kids break the rules by taking stuff they should not have taken, and they all suffer the consequences. One gets all swollen up and blue from some gum she should not have taken, and they have to take her away and squeeze her until she gets skinny again. One of the kids jumps into a pool of chocolate and is sucked up into the pipes. And so on. They are all saved in the end, so don't worry, but they must leave the factory without the lifetime supply of chocolate, because they broke the rules.

Charlie, the main character, also breaks the rules. He drinks some Fizzy drink he was not supposed to take, but no one seems to know, so he doesn't say anything. He doesn't get hurt in the process, so he survives until the end of the tour.

At the end of the tour, Charlie Bucket and his grandfather are the only ones left. Mr. Wonka says good bye to them, and tells them to leave. Upset, Charlie asks him for the lifetime supply of chocolate. But Mr. Wonka has somehow found out that Charlie drank the Fizzy drink, and therefore broke the rules. Charlie will not be getting a lifetime supply of chocolate either.

Wonka yells at him for drinking the Fuzzy drink, and Charlie feels bad. But his grandfather is angry, and he tells Charlie that they'll give Mr. Slugworth an Everlasting Gobstopper.

They are about to leave, when Charlie realizes that no matter how he feels, stealing and breaking rules is bad. So he goes to Mr. Wonka's desk and returns the Gobstopper to him.

Wonka sees that, and jumps up in delight! He tells Charlie that he has won! Charlie has no idea of what he's talking about. It seems that Wonka was looking to retire, and so he set up the contest to find an honest child he could train as his successor.

Then Wonka calls in Wilkinson, his aide. And Wilkinson is Slugworth! Slugworth was sent out to each of the children to test them! To see how they would respond. Anyone who either ate food he wasn't supposed to eat or brought a Gobstopper to Slugworth was dishonest, and would not become the successor. (Okay, the parable is not exact, but I think you get my point.) Notice, also, that Wonka himself gave each of the children a Gobstopper. So he himself set up the choice, and then gave them the opportunity to break the rule, using Wilkinsin to offer the temptation.

Christians take Slugworth at face value: a reprehensible competitor who will stop at nothing to undo Wonka. And that's how they view Satan.

Jews do not see it that way, and we never have. Just as Slugworth is really Wilkinson doing what Wonka asked him to do, Satan is also not working for himself.

The Hebrew word "Satan" means "Hinderer." To hinder someone means to hold him back, to try to prevent him from doing something. G-d created the Hinderer to give us work to do in this world (see my article Why did G-d Create the World?). Satan is here to make things difficult for us, so we can overcome our evil temptations, and PASS the test. That is the purpose of Satan. Satan is an angel whose purpose has been determined by G-d.

Temptation is there to try and deter us. It gives us the ability to do the wrong thing. More importantly, it gives us the ability to look at evil and refuse to do it. By presenting us with the opportunity to do evil, it gives us the ability to choose between good and evil.
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Mind_your_head Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:05 AM
Response to Original message
1. No
'hinderer' versus 'great deceiver' ~ father of all lies (father denotes 'seed')

I didn't read any of your blather, but the answer to your question is simply 'No'

next question.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:14 AM
Response to Reply #1
2.  Succinct. And correct.
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:19 AM
Response to Original message
3. I agree with this. Maybe I'm secretly Jewish and don't know it.
I say that because I also agree with other posts on the Jewish beliefs that you have posted and that I have read. (I don't know if I have read all your posts.)
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heidler1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:49 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. I'm not Jewish either, but I have a son who married a Jewish woman.
He converted, which was fine with me. A lot of their ways make sense to me too. I'm an Atheist.
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no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 05:34 AM
Response to Original message
5. No Satan and no Hell according to what I was taught.
There is no mention of Satan or Hell in the Pentateuch, the Torah, the first five books of the Old Testament. Notice that Adam and Eve, or Cain for that matter, weren't consigned to Hell when they died.

When my mother was dying, she asked me where did I think we all went after life, and I replied wherever we existed before we were born, and that seemed to satisfy her.

As far as good and evil and ethics, I was taught it was an injury on humanity to hurt another person or to be indifferent to injustice. While we were also told about the virtues of mitzvahs (good deeds), we needed to focus on the benefits to the world from doing them more than the necessity to perform them.
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Meshuga Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 06:28 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. There is "satan" and "angelic" terminology
in Judaism. Especially in mystical texts. But it is not like the Christian concept.

In Judaism you have an authority like Maimonides explaining that angels and demons are merely imperfect metaphors used to explain laws of nature in Jewish texts.

A lot of the Jewish angelology and demonology comes from Zoroastrianism. One can look at the differences between the Jerusalem Talmud and the Babylonian Talmud as an example. The Babylonian Talmud was written when Jews lived under sassanian rule where Zoroastrianism was part of the predominant culture so the chaotic structure of the Babylonian Talmud with stories of demons and such reflects the influence of that society.
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no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 06:32 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Conceded up to a point. You are citing commentaries to the Pentateuch.
Maimonides is interpreting the text. And with the basic three denominations of orthodox, conservative, and reform, not all believers of the judaism agree with the interpretations as you posited. It depends.

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Meshuga Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 07:22 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. I think he is referring to the terminology which is included in both the written and oral torah
Edited on Thu Jun-19-08 07:44 AM by MrWiggles
I agree that what individual Jews believe is one thing. And that is why Maimonides is addressing this as he refers to ignorant interpretations.

There is no dogma of devil and hell or afterlife in general anyway for Jews to follow. So individual Jews have their own beliefs which can even be influenced from living in a Christian society (as some call it the "Christianization" of Judaism) or even "disbeliefs". For example, one Jew can believe in hell and it is perfectly alright for another Jew not to believe in an afterlife. Since who would care in the point of view of Judaism? Some even believe in reincarnation.

The focus in Judaism is not certain belief but Halakhah to some movements (orthodox movements and conservative) and Jewish folkways to others (Reform, Reconstructionist, Humanist, etc.).

Maimonides in his writing says that many beliefs were thrown in there in order to motivate Jews to follow halakhah. But that doesn't stop Jews today from believing in the beliefs he was mentioning. :-)
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no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 07:51 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. You are correct. My last comment on this topic.
My mother stressed to me when I was growing up that you encounter heaven and hell in your ordinary daily living, and dying was not a prerequisite to visiting either place.
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heidler1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. When we lived in Santa Monica, CA we were in a Jewish neighborhood most of these people did not
believe in Heaven or Hell, however all religions seem to splinter off in many directions. It seems to me that the heads of Churches have to make continual compromises in order to hold their membership together. Those that don't are apt to fall by the way-side.
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