Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Best Fraud Summary I've seen!

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Election Reform Donate to DU
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-04 11:32 AM
Original message
Best Fraud Summary I've seen!
I have sent this to a # of "disbelievers" who, after checking links and being more than a bit stunned at the sheer VOLUME contained in this, have "come to the light" and believe that voting machines are BAAAAAD!!

Would love to see info like this updated daily in a "bullet" format. When you see these many discreps all laid out like this, it becomes clear that the vote was hacked! Does anyone know of a "laundry list" out there?


Since the US presidential election, accounts of voter fraud and malfunctioning voting machines have flooded into local US newspapers, to public-interest groups, to universities, and to weblogs.

This is an overview of those reports.

The stories are summarized here, with links to the original publications. After seeing this evidence - and there is more still to be rounded up -you will most probably suspect that Bush did not win the election.

Many accounts of election tampering are included, but a broad search has still to be done. The following is only what has been learned in the few days since the election. Clearly, an investigation is needed.

The following is a compilation of the initial research of concerned US journalists.

It seems that there is enough evidence in the following to suggest that the electorate may have actually chosen Kerry for President. It cannot be known for sure unless there is a recount. Bush has not yet been chosen by the Electoral College. The Electors meet and vote on Dec. 13. Questions need to be raised about the results (immediately and loudly) to get an investigation launched before that date.

So far,with few exceptions, the mainstream media in not picking up the story. Remember that they moved very slowly after the anomalies of 2000 US election. Here are the accounts of election tampering from four states, plus reports on multi-state problems.

(Please note: some of the newspaper links may expire soon. You may want to print out the stories so that later on, you don't have to buy them from the newspapers' archives.)

FLORIDA:

The most troubling news has come out of Florida. Throughout most of the state, new electronic voting machines were in use. These machines -many manufactured by a company called Diebold - are controversial because they don't leave a paper trail. There is no way to double-check the results.

The final Florida tallies on Diebold machines from Tuesday are literally unbelievable.

In 29 counties where Diebold machines (an optical scanner) were used to count the ballots, large majorities of voters were registered Democrats. But the final results gave all the counties to Bush, sometimes by huge margins.

The individual county data shows how unlikely the machine results were.

For instance:

In Calhoun County, 82% of registered voters are Democrats. But Diebold machines said 63% of the county voted for Bush.

In Lafayette County, 83% of voters are Democrats, but Diebold said 74%
of the county voted for Bush.

In Liberty County, 88% of voters are Democrats, but Diebold said 64%
voted for Bush.

In Washington County, 67% of voters are Democrats, but Diebold said 71% voted for Bush.

This same pattern appears in the results for 29 COUNTIES in Florida. In every one of those counties, the Diebold Optical Scanner produced the results.

The Optical Scanner has been called the voting machine that is most
susceptible to tampering.

Many of you have been watching elections closely for years. Do you
believe that in 29 Florida counties in which Democrats were in the majority- in some cases with 4 out of 5 registered voters being Democrats - they all voted strongly for Bush?

Here are the links.

You can find the voter registration/final result data here:

http://ustogether.org/Florida_Election.htm

You can find a story analyzing these results here:

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1106-30.htm

You can read about electronic voting machines - an untested phenomenon
in American elections, here:

http://wwwmoderateindependent.com/v2i21thoreau.htm

THE OTHER PROBLEM IN FLORIDA:

In 6 counties - again, they were all using electronic machines - more
votes for President were recorded than there were actual voters in the counties.

Altogether, these six counties reported 188,885 more votes for
President than there are voters living there.

Right now, no one knows whether those extra 188,000 votes were cast for Bush or for Kerry. But Bush won the state of Florida by a 5% margin- contrary to what all the polls were showing only days earlier.

In Glades County: 2,443 votes for Bush / 1,718 votes for Kerry / 27
votes for Other. Those add up to 4,188. But the machines recorded the
official turnout as 3,446. That adds up to 742 more votes than voters.

In Highlands County: 25,874 for Bush / 15,346 for Kerry / 271 for
Other.
Official Turnout: 33,996. That adds up to 7,495 more votes than voters.

In Miami-Dade County: 358,613 for Bush / 406,099 for Kerry / 3,841 for Other.
Official Turnout 716,574. That adds up to 51,979 more votes than voters.

In Osceola County: 43,108 for Bush / 38,617 for Kerry / 453 for Other.
Official Turnout 63589. That adds up to 18,589 more votes than voters.

In Palm Beach County: 211,894 for Bush / 327,698 for Kerry / 3,243 for Other.
Official Turnout: 452,061. That adds up to 90,774 more votes
than voters.

In Volusia County: 111,544 for Bush / 115,319 for Kerry / 1,495 for
Other.
Official Turnout: 209,052. That adds up to 19,306 more votes than
voters.

Use this link to get to the data:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/5/18466/2846

STILL MORE PROBLEMS IN FLORIDA

This account comes from partisans. Four Kerry volunteers working in
Broward County sent a letter detailing election tampering to one
newspaper reporter. All four signed it and included their email addresses.

They report a wide, disturbing range of problems, from voters saying
their electronic machines malfunctioned, poll workers denied them assistance, to police putting up roadblocks on the routes to polling places, and so on.

The entire text of the letter, along with the signatures, appears at
the bottom of this letter.

OHIO

In Ohio, there were problems in four counties and one city.

In Howard County, a judge ruled on Election Day that everyone standing
in line to vote at 7:30 p.m. had to eventually be allowed inside.

The order said the ruling was good for the day of Nov. 2. (You can view the order at the website below.) But maybe it didn't occur to the judge that everybody might not make it inside by midnight.

At the stroke of midnight, when the calendar legally clicked over to
Nov. 3, Republican Ken Blackwell, the secretary of state, told all the
waiting voters to go home. His workers gave them paper ballots (i.e.,
provisional ballots), told them to fill them out and bring them back later.

It was an improvised move that undercut the intent of the judge's
ruling,and created chaos. Many people in Howard County still haven't turned in those ballots because they don't know where to take them or what the deadline is.

The only kind of ballot in a federal election that people can legally
take home, fill out and turn in later is an absentee ballot, and those are marked as such. They're marked with clear rules concerning deadlines, postmarking, and so on.

So an uncounted number of people in Howard County - estimated in the
thousands - couldn't get in and were turned away with what may be ruled an illegal procedure. The vast majority of those votes were expected to go to Kerry based on the heavily Democratic population of Howard County.

The Democrats have filed a lawsuit. You can click on the Ohio State
University law school website to read about it. (Reassemble the
following long link, if it is broken by your email browser.)

http://216.239.39.104/search?q=cache:pKbOJwHH7OMJ:morit...


Meanwhile, in Warren County, election officials locked the doors to the County building and refused to allow bi-partisan observers to watch the vote-count. They also denied access to the AP reporter (it is standard procedure for the AP to observe vote-counting in counties all over the country.)

The Sheriff of the county said he did it for "homeland security"
reasons. He never explained or specified what the security concerns were.

Here is the link to the story in the Cincinnati Enquirer:

http://www.enquirer.com/editions/2004/11/05/loc_warrenv...

Meanwhile, in a Columbus suburb called Gahanna, the same problem showed up with electronic machines that we saw in Florida: more votes were cast than there were voters to cast them. In this case, however, the problem was investigated and the extra 3,893 votes were shown to have been erroneously tallied for Bush.

Here is the link to the story on the Ohio Network News:

http://wwwonnnews.com/Global/story.asp?S=2524952

Meanwhile, in Mahoning and Mercer Counties, electronic machines again
malfunctioned, but the effect that had on the vote count is not clear.
The machines had to be re-set, and at one point showed votes of "negative 25 million," according to the head of the local board of elections.

Here is the story from the local Youngstown paper, called the
Vindicator:

http://wwwvindy.com/basic/news/281829446390855.php

INDIANA

In Laporte County, electronic voting machines once again appear to have failed.

They tallied results for 22,200 voters, even though there are 79,000
registered voters in LaPorte County. Assuming the county actually had a 65% turnout rate (comparable to others in the area and its own track record), that means 29,000 votes were not counted.

Here is the link to the story in the Michigan City News-Dispatch:

http://www.michigancityin.com/articles/2004/11/04/news/...

NEW HAMPSHIRE

This is one of several states where original exit polls (interviews
with voters as they are leaving) do not jive with the results produced by electronic voting machines.

An administrator at Bev Harris's group, called BlackBoxVoting (more on this below) has said that they are urging Ralph Nader to press for a recount in New Hampshire. Nader was on the ballot there, so he is in a good position to ask for a re-count.

You can read about Harris and her work at www.blackboxvoting.org /
http://www.blackboxvoting.org /

SIX STATES

In at least six states, there was a large difference between how people said they'd voted, and how officials said they'd voted.

In Florida, Ohio, Pennsylvania, North Carolina, New Hampshire and New
Mexico, there was a large discrepancy between what voters said in the
original exit polls, and the final results claimed by election
officials.

In each of those six states, electronic voting machines were used in
some or most of the counties.

In contrast, in states where paper ballots were the primary method of
voting, there was little or no discrepancy between original exit polls
and official results.

To see an easily viewable graph of this data, go to:

http://www.therandirhodesshow.com/todays_show.html

That graph was originally compiled by a website affiliated with The Raw Story, which often gets quoted in the major dailies. It is regarded as a reputable site.

You can see their original posting here:

http://www.bluelemur.com/index.php?p=388

MORE ON EXIT POLLS

These are routinely conducted in elections by major news organizations and countries around the world use these numbers to decide elections before results are in. In Germany, for instance, the votes take approximately 3 weeks to count, but they are able to call the election that night within a half percent, based on exit polling. That was also the case here in the US until 2000.

Accounts are surfacing that both the Associated Press and CNN (and
perhaps others) later CHANGED their exit polling data to more closely resemble the official results.

None of the news organizations is believed to have offered an
explanation. They may try to justify it on statistical grounds.

Here are two accounts. The first is very brief, the second is in-depth:

http://www.buzzflash.com/analysis/04/11/ana04025.html

http://globalresearch.ca/articles/KEE411A.html

MORE ON ELECTRONIC VOTING MACHINES

Here is an except from the Moderate Independent website about Bev
Harris's work. She is a freelance journalist who has been documenting how unreliable the machines are, and how vulnerable they are to tampering.

"Bev Harris, author of Black Box Voting and the blackboxvoting.org/
web site, has documented numerous cases of electronic disasters. One occurred in Volusia County, Fla., in 2000 in which county election officials hand recounted more than 184,000 paper ballots used to feed the computerized system,after the central ballot-counting computer showed a Socialist Party candidate receiving more than 9,000 votes and Al Gore getting minus 19,000. Another 4,000 votes were received for Bush that should not have been there.

"Election officials eventually tallied Gore beating Bush by 97,063
votes to 82,214. But the wrong numbers had already been sent to the media,which were used by FOX and other networks to erroneously call the election for Bush and swing the public relations part of the recount battle in his favor."

Three Members of Congress Have Asked the GAO to Investigate the
Election

Three Congressmen have asked the General Accounting Office, a federal
agency, to investigate the election, citing questionable results in
Ohio, Florida, North Carolina and California. Click here to see their letter to the GAO:

http://forum.therandirhodesshow.com/index.php?act=ST&f=...

REMEMBER THESE FOUR POINTS:

A. Bush's approval numbers were CONSISTENTLY below 50% throughout the
campaign.

B. New Democratic registrations in Ohio were 10 times that of
Republicans, and in Florida, Democrats held a similar but somewhat
smaller advantage.

C. All the polls that were still giving Bush leads after the debates
were within the margin of error, and when the undecideds started making up their minds over the last weekend, Kerry's poll numbers were surging.

D. The $10 million exit-poll system, specifically designed not to fail
this time, clearly showed, in the original reports, a Kerry victory.

OTHER VOICES TO HEAR:

Here are other voices which are beginning to question the legitimacy of the recent election. Here are some of them. (Reassemble any long links which have been broken by your browser's settings.)

http://www.tompaine.com/articles/kerry_won.php

http://americablog.blogspot.com/archives/2004_10_31_ame...

http://www.ecotalk.org/VotingSecurity.htm

http://www.smirkingchimp.com/article.php?sid=18588&mode...

Here is a report of voter complaints in 7 Southern states:

http://www.abcnews4.com/news/stories/1104/185549.html

There may still be time to do something about this before the Electoral College meets on December 13th.

The first step is to immerse ourselves in the facts. The second step
is to encourage the mainstream media to take the issue. They will only do that if they feel there is considerable popular concern. The local and regional press, and the alternative media, have been doing their jobs; now we need the national press to do its job, too.

If you are concerned about this election being stolen, please do two
things:

1. Send your concerns to everyone you know, both inside and outside
the United States.

2. Send your concerns to the major news organizations. A list of
contacts appears at the end of this message.

-----------------------------------------------

THE LETTER FROM KERRY WORKERS IN BROWARD COUNTY, FLA.:

"Spurred by the unwillingness of the broadcast media to report voting
problems during the 2004 election race, we want to alert others to the widespread voter suppression and disenfranchisement that occurred in Broward County, Florida. We staffed the emergency hotline for the Kerry Campaign Headquarters in Broward County from late October through the election.

All of us were devastated by the margin of Bush's win in Florida,
particularly since polls predicted the race would be extremely close.

Many of the calls to our hotline were from voters who had pressed the
Kerry button on their electronic voting screen, only to have Bush light up as the candidate they had chosen. In some cases, this would happen repeatedly until about the 5th or 6th time the voter pressed Kerry and eventually his name would light up. In other cases, the voters pushed Kerry but were later asked to confirm their Bush vote.

We had calls about a road block, put up by the police at 7am on Nov. 2, which blocked road access to two precinct locations in majority black districts. There was no justification for the road block no accident or crime scene or construction.

Many of our calls dealt with voter suppression, or manipulation, of the Haitian population, occurrences which seem too numerous, and their
targets too indefensible, as primarily poor, first-time-voter, Creole-speaking refugees, to be anything but systemic. In one example, a voter whose hands were bandaged could not press the touch-screen himself; he asked the non-partisan election official to press Kerry for him, but the election official pressed Bush and sent his vote immediately into the machine. Many, many others were denied the right to vote and were not given provisional ballots, while others were refused assistance at the polls, even though provisional ballots and voter assistance are legal rights.

Others were told they had already voted and were turned away, although they had never voted previously. This latter experience was a
complaint not isolated to Haitians but also included other surprised voters with no recourse except their word against that of the Supervisor of Elections.

We spoke with hundreds of voters who were certain they had registered
to vote in the past 6 months, well before the October 18 deadline, but
were not on the rolls. And those were just the people who had the
information to contact us.

The local paper, citing the Supervisor of Elections office as its
source, told all people voting by absentee ballot that they could turn in ballots by hand to any of its seven offices by 5pm on Tuesday, Nov. 2. Every single one of those offices except one was closed on Tuesday.

We had numerous calls from voters on Nov. 2 whose precincts had closed, yet the Supervisor of Elections office had given voters no notification of the closure, and no notification of where to go to vote.

Thousands of people were likely disenfranchised because of inexcusable mishaps such as this. We had many calls from people who had been harassed by poll workers, who were turned away without being allowed the right to vote provisionally (another breech of voter rights). Other people were turned away because the address on their drivers license did not match the address on their voter registration card; again, this is in direct violation of election law.

All of these problems do not even take into account the 58,000 absentee ballots that had been lost by the Supervisor of Elections, in perhaps the most democratic county in the state, disenfranchising thousands of people who were disabled, out of the country, or elderly and unable get to the polls. These events, and many others, have been documented and also reported to lawyers, but we fear they will not get the attention they deserve. This is what we witnessed in just one county. We believe that these "voting irregularities" raise serious concerns about the legitimacy of the results in Florida, and more broadly, about the health of democracy in this country."

- from http://www.bopnews.com -
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
LisaLynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-04 11:38 AM
Response to Original message
1. Wow!
Thanks for compiling all that. It's so hard to keep up with all the evidence. I'm goign to spend some time checking out the links ... Better save this info now!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #1
17. Actually, not me, but Sterling Newberry
over at bopnews.com
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Riceman1974 Donating Member (28 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-04 11:49 AM
Response to Original message
2. FL counties
How do you explain the fact that Calhoun, Lafayette, and Liberty voted Republican in every election since 1984, despite the heavy Dem edge in registration? Was it always fruad?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-04 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
SomthingsGotaGive Donating Member (485 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-04 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. Let me guess......are you trying to say....
DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS DIXIECRATS


OK now that you think you've answered all of our beefs you can go back to sleep until your overlords produce their latest tonic.

How come EVERY SINGLE attempt at refuting the fraud starts with the DIXIECRATS?

Nobody that believes there was fraud is buying it.

And....

There have been more 'conspiracy theories' in the past four years than in the previous 60. People now assume that something must be fishy if they hear people trying to label it a conspiracy theory.

So let them say what they will. Its only fueling the suspicion.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bullimiami Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 07:10 AM
Response to Reply #2
14. OK lets talk about calhoun county fl
yes they do vote republican but have been getting more democratic for 20 years



1984 1.90 66% republican
1988 1.85
1992 1.74
1996 1.31 57% republican
2000 1.33 57% republican
2004 1.79 64% republican


do you find it at all odd that bush v kerry got 7% less than bush v gore. i for one find it very odd.

If you look you will find this pattern all across florida.
if bush was a great president with 70+% approval I might buy it but with his record and popularity? something is rotten in florida.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 09:10 AM
Response to Reply #14
26. Well, now
don't be goin' and MAKING Sense and using logic and stuff, that just won't wash in the media!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #2
18. I explain it THUSLY:
That Calhoun, Lafayette, and Liberty voted Republican in every election since 1984, despite the heavy Dem edge in registration and that it may only have been fraud in '00 the last primaries and '04!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
idiosyncratic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-04 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
3. All I can say is WOW! and Thanks for posting this.
I'm going to save several of those stories to my hard drive so I can look at them later.

Thanks again.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #3
25. Most of this
has received attention in the last few days, but there are some GREAT links in there...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-04 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
5. Please correct the mis-information
This part below contains inaccurate information. I didn't check all of your post for accuracy but you should yourself, please.

Ohio uses mainly punch cards, (about 70%) optical scanners the rest, and only one county uses touch screen no paper trail voting. I appreciate your compiling of evidence but please cull it for accuracy, otherwise you give skeptics easy strawmen to knock down.

The determining factor on the exit polls was where Bush needed to win more than on what kind of machine was used


SIX STATES

In at least six states, there was a large difference between how people said they'd voted, and how officials said they'd voted.

In Florida, Ohio, Pennsylvania, North Carolina, New Hampshire and New
Mexico, there was a large discrepancy between what voters said in the
original exit polls, and the final results claimed by election
officials.

In each of those six states, electronic voting machines were used in
some or most of the counties.

In contrast, in states where paper ballots were the primary method of
voting, there was little or no discrepancy between original exit polls
and official results.

To see an easily viewable graph of this data, go to:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #5
19. I actually DID
Correct, using your catch as well as some friends caught, but some how the older version got kicked instead of the update....sorry.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ektodemo Donating Member (13 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-04 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
6. Summaries and overview is needed
Great. I would like to see even more summaries, for instance a top ten list of the current big points to be made. Perhaps I havent looked hard enough, but there is a lot of info going around, and "outsiders" need to be directed to a place where you can grasp the main points in the attention span of one minute or so. And how about deciding on a name for the scandal? Fragmentation makes it hard to get attention... Votergate?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 08:50 AM
Response to Reply #6
20. My first stop
in the morning is ALWAYS Buzzflash- always up to date stuff!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Rainbowreflect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-04 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
8. Thanks for the info.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
New Earth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-04 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. who put this together?
anyone here? if so, would it be ok if i put it together as a document and hosted it online?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 08:51 AM
Response to Reply #9
21. Stirling Newberry over at bopnews.com
Though this version was edited
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tommcintyre Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 06:37 AM
Response to Original message
10. kick
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 06:50 AM
Response to Original message
11. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 06:55 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. What would you like on your tombstone
granite or marble?

BTW: Welcome to DU :hi: Too bad you be able to stay.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 06:58 AM
Response to Original message
13. Major error regarding FL voting machines
The machines in most of the state are optical scanners made by Diebold, but they do use a paper ballot that is fed into the scanner. We do have a paper trail in most of the state and that is why a recount is of the utmost importance. I am sure the numbers were manipulated and that the paper and the official results will never match.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #13
22. paper trail or not
My feeling on this is that they used a wide range of manipulations THIS time since the statistical anomalies aren't even consistent: Over HERE, it's paperless voting, but over HERE it's optical scanning etc. The least problematic and wisest tactical move would be to hack the central tabulators, though it has been theorized that code could have been inserted in a # of places, including the OS and flash cards.One thing is for certain: It will take ALOT of investigating to turn this around...and time is the one thing the theives DON'T want us to have...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
aikanae Donating Member (165 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 07:17 AM
Response to Original message
15. GREAT! that's about the shortest list for 30,000+ complaints and growing!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 08:58 AM
Response to Reply #15
23. Where?
The reason I keep posting THIS damn thing everywhere is that I haven't found a "laundry list" like this anywhere else!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bullimiami Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 07:20 AM
Response to Original message
16. Your miami dade data is wrong. And about the so called dixiecrats
Edited on Fri Nov-19-04 07:35 AM by bullimiami
Quote ::

In Miami-Dade County: 358,613 for Bush / 406,099 for Kerry / 3,841 for Other.
Official Turnout 716,574. That adds up to 51,979 more votes than voters. .....


well yes those numbers look odd, where did you get them??

And from the Miami Dade elections site stats for 2004 there are 1,058,801 registered voters. so a whopping 73% turnout.
As far as the numbers adding up... these are the totals listed for all the candidates.
361,095
409,732
494
638
323
225
178
2,041
I think they add up ok. 775000 or so total


What does strike a little odd about dade is that the democratic percentage was almost identical to 2000 with democrats taking 53%. It doesnt seem right to me with the bush approval rating, the polls, the turnout and the changing demographic. I think it should have been at least as good as Clinton did in 2003, or better. Clinton took 57% of the vote in 96, I think it looks odd to my partisan eyes by 5-7%.



As for the Dixiecrats. Yes they do have a history of voting republican but have trended more democratic for 20 years until recently. Either they really love W or the counties have been skimmed to the tune of 5-10% of the vote totals.

Maybe they do love W. I sure would like to see proof by hand auditing the ballots before I would take it as gospel though.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monroncrief Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 09:07 AM
Response to Reply #16
24. This has been pointed out
by another DUer on a later post of this article. My caveat to anyone who says, "Well that's not the totals given by the county web page" need only remember watching in shock 11/2 as the exit poll #'s on CNN changed after one in the morning, or the myriad examples of info suddenly being unavailable due to "updating" on websites (The White House website's list of the "Coalition of the Willing" comes to mind). That being said, I would imagine that this info was accurate at the time it was published and that some of the info has lost its timeliness. I encourage "vetting" and would LOVE to find another, more accurate "laundry list" that alarms at a gut level like this one does...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sat Apr 20th 2019, 01:14 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Election Reform Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC