Washington State Update: County ditches eVoting for Vote by Mail

[Land Shark]

Only two counties in washington state vote by touch screen voting or DRE (Direct Recording Electronic) machine, Yakima County (Hart Intercivic) and Snohomish COunty (Sequoia).

And now, there is only One county with DREs.

Yakima County voted to switch to vote by mail, except for a handful of DREs to be used for voting by disabled voters.

<http://nl.newsbank.com/nl-search/we/Archives?p_action=doc&p_docid=10B549950CE63348&p_docnum=1>

Meanwhile, I'm advised that (as of today) freeperville has caused more hits on an article I wrote about Andy for washblog.typepad.com in a single hour this morning than they usually get in a whole day. Likely because of a link at bradblog
http://www.bradblog.com/archives/00001588.htm

There are more fun and games happening here than just the above, but we'll leave it at that for now.

A decision was due in the lawsuit against Sequoia by the federal judge last Friday but it is still under advisement (the motion regarding remand to state court and why they would remove the state law based case to federal court and then move to dismiss on the grounds of inability to join a necessary party in the form of Washington's Secretary of State because of the Eleventh amendment immunity of states in federal court, when if they had brought the same motion in state court, it would result in joining the secretary of state to the action, not dismissal). We briefed how even Scalia on the US Supreme Court was suspicious of litigation tactics by state governments removing to federal court and then trying to take advantage of immunity there, which immunity is based on in large part the "indignity" of state governments being "hauled" before sister federal tribunals.

pleadings in the case are at: www.votersunite.org/info/lehtolawsuit.asp The eleventh amendment trap is probably most concisely identified in the reply on the motion for remand.

[LisaM]

1. I don't like vote by mail and here's why

because I think an abusive person could compel people in his or her household to vote a certain way.

[Land Shark]

2. We had an election contest in our state that scoured the state

for things exactly like this, they found no instances i've heard of the complaint you mention, and only alleged 1-2000 illegal votes out of 3 million cast (felons, illegal aliens, voting twice, etc.)

One has to choose between a voting system like VBM that gives a "reward" of a single vote per crime or irregularity and creates evidence in the process, versus a voting system like DREs that allows a single crime or irregularity to get a reward or payoff of thousands of votes, or the entire election.

You correctly spot a risk of VBM. It's not a good risk. But I think the above paragraph is the best general way to navigate among imperfect systems.

[LisaM]

3. I certainly don't like DRE voting - don't get me wrong

but I have been reading books lately about religious cults and this is a huge red flag. Take a place like Colorado City, Utah - or Waco, for example. I'm sure they gather the people together and force them to vote a certain way.

[Land Shark]

4. Yeah, I think we can agree it's a stepin the right direction

from VBM, improvements can continue. Because of the size of "investment" it's not easy to escape the gravitation of DRE systems into an area where things can evolve in a healthier way.

[Amaryllis]

8. Again, what are the numbers? Not a good risk, but compared to

being able to move hundreds of thousands of votes electronically, much less risk.

[GuvWurld]

5. Plus there is the concern over chain of custody of ballots

How is this accounted for?

[Land Shark]

6. This, is the oregon system essentially, which Oregon voting

activists are very happy with. The chain of custody is the classic paper ballot chain of custody in locked boxes except for the sealed transit through the mail system, if a voter chooses to trust their ballot the mail system (many drop them into boxes themselves by showing up at the election office)

We need to get out of something that is totally unacceptable (DREs) and into the realm of the reasonable where reasonable people can differ on best systems.

In not appearing to "see" the good news here, it is equivalent to greeting the successful end of some hypothetical war of foreign aggression with shrugs of the shoulders because there are still intra-country disputes and problems to think about and be concerned about.

[Amaryllis]

7. It's accounted for very well. See here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=315852

But, you have to look at the whole climate of the state. If you imported it to OH or FL,they would find ways to rig it, but then that applies to any system. Oregon has the same system statewide which has been refined over twenty years, so it has many checks and balances built in, and OR doesn't have the history of organized crime or racial discrimination that say OH and FL have. Not that OR is pristine by any means when it comes to crime or discrimination, but it's far less of an issue.

Oregonians can call and see if their ballot has arrived at BOE; if it hasn't and it should have, they can get another, so if someone does make off with their ballot, there is a way to track it. The signature verification process keeps anyone from voting twice; it's very effective. There was one case where someone voted all three of his kid's ballots which came to his home, and three different BOE workers caught the three different forged signatures.

[EFerrari]

9. Land Shark

you make my heart sing.

LOL!

Wonderful news about Yakima Co.

A good day for the Rebellion.

[Amaryllis]

10. Hey, girl! Good to see you back in election reform. I've missed you here

as you've been otherwise more than occupied.

[Stevepol]

11. Are central tabulators used in WA?

It seems to me I read that was the case. Overall, I believe the central tabulators are by far the greatest danger to democracy.

As I understand it, they can be used regardless of the type of local voting method since the results of each precinct or district comes to the central tabulator for the final count.

[kster]

12. Kick and recommend..Thanks Landshark !

Great work.