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flpoljunkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 09:48 AM
Original message
A question for DU regarding Triad Management Services...
Is this the same Triad Management Systems connected to Koch Industries and discussed in "What's the Matter with Kansas?"

From "What's the Matter with Kansas?", p. 81-82 by Thomas Frank...

"...The Kansas sensibility with which Vernon Smith is most closely connected is not that of populism, but Koch Industries, the nation's second-largest privately held company. Based in Wichita, Koch's primary business is oil, but is far better known for its owners' openhanded political activities than for its petroleum operations. The founder of the dunasty, Fred Koch, was a charter member of the John Birch Soceity. His billionaire son Charles founded the libertarian Cato Institute in 1977, and another billionaire son, David, ran for vice president on the Libertarian ticket in 1980. Koch money flowed through Triad Management Services, which delivered such crucial assistance to Sam Brownback's Senate campaign in 1996; and Koch money, mingled with the money of so many other oil interests,supported the presidential campaign of George W. Bush."
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ohio_liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 09:50 AM
Response to Original message
1. I don't think so
This Triad is called Triad GSI, or Triad Governmental Systems, Inc.
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sui generis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 09:53 AM
Response to Original message
2. Koch industries manufactured the cyanide pellets used
in gas chambers. Now there's a surprise!
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VTGold Donating Member (438 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #2
9. That fits - those around us are taking the soap & going for a shower.
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flpoljunkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 09:57 AM
Response to Original message
3. Google TMS and you get only this--a P.O. Box in Tortola, BVI
http://www.bviguide.com/create.html

For more information: Triad Management Services,

P.O. Box 676, Road Town,
Tortola, British Virgin Islands
Tel: (809) 494 5440
Fax: (809) 494 5440
E-Mail: techrist@caribsurf.com
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Junkdrawer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. Well, Ohio's Triad is a small "Rapp family owned" business...
So unless you can establish a Koch/Rapp connection, it remains a coincidence.
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VTGold Donating Member (438 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 10:02 AM
Response to Original message
4. Doesn't it feel like Triad is 'Zell Miller' of the vote companies?


One could even go so far as to say that Triad and Blackwell have been used and setup as the fools here - its just too blatant - maybe more of a distraction from the rest of the country.

Blackwell is so hungry to move up that he was probably easy pickin's and easy to convince that he's untouchable - that's how he acts - untouchable.

So far only he and Triad have dirty hands. That can't be a co-inky-dink.

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bmoney07 Donating Member (304 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 10:11 AM
Response to Original message
6. I think this deserves further research - probably is no link
but I would love to see one!
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ohio_liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. I don't see a link
This is a small family-owned company out of Xenia OH. If you want to dig for information, look around Triad GSI/Rapp Systems.



Google hints:

Tod Rapp
Dwayne A. Rapp
Brett A. Rapp
Michael Barbian Jr.
Jeff D. Collins
Brandon Sandlin


www.triadgsi.com
www.rappsystems.com
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VTGold Donating Member (438 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 10:45 AM
Response to Original message
7. One weird - round-a-bout thing.....
Edited on Wed Dec-29-04 10:46 AM by VTGold
I googled Triad Management Services and came up with:

http://www.t-msi.com /

This company's website is registered to The Kaseman Companies - based in VA.

CEO Daniel M. Kaseman donated up to $10,000 to University of Toledo Foundation.

So he has a connection to Ohio.

There's another weird thing - the Toledo Blade seems to have gone to court to force this foundation - which is separate from the University - to disclose who its contributors are and what the money is use for (I think - I'm not great at following legal docs):

http://www.case.org/files/AffiliatedFoundations/pdfs/OH...
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flpoljunkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. Is there a connection to Triad Management Services here? Yes, there is!
Edited on Wed Dec-29-04 11:08 AM by flpoljunkie
http://www.triadmsi.com /

Interesting. The above link is redirected to your link: http://www.t-msi.com /
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flpoljunkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. Open Secrets shows one Tod A. Rapp, Rapp Systems, Xenia, OH, gave $500
to George W. Bush campaign on 2/2/04.

http://www.opensecrets.org/presidential/search.asp?txtC...

Candidate George W. Bush

Contributor RAPP SYSTEMS

Occupation STAFF CONSULTANT

Date 2/2/2004

Amount $500

Bush, George W

RAPP, TOD A MR
XENIA,OH45385
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ohio_liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. Yep
All this stuff should be entered in the Demopedia. There was a lot of research done on this company maybe a month ago? Anyway, it's in the GD archives if you want to search for the thread (when the function is available, of course). People here found some links to Repubs via small-time donations but nothing earth-shattering. I do remember that Tod Rapp is the Daddy and founder of the company. Dwayne and Brett are his sons, and Brett took over company operations later. There are some other family members (wives and such) that may be affiliated. This family also took advantage of the so-called Florida "butterfly ballot" and started selling them online as memorabilia after the 2000 election. Yuck.

I think it's important to stress that the Triad Management Services company mentioned in the original post and Triad GSI are NOT the same company. There are a few companies out there using "Triad" in their names.
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VTGold Donating Member (438 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
12. JACKPOT!!! FEC went after Triad Management Systems 1996
FEC v. TRIAD MANAGEMENT SERVICES (02CV1237)
On June 21, 2002, the Commission asked the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia to find that Triad Management Services, Triad Management Services, Inc., (collectively Triad) and Carolyn Malenick violated the Federal Election Campaign Act (Act) during the 1996 federal election cycle. The Commission alleges that Ms. Malenick and Triad violated the Act by, among other things, failing to register and file as a political committee and accepting and making excessive and prohibited contributions. 2 U.S.C. 433, 434, 441a(a)(1), 441a(f) and 441b.

Background
According to its 1996 promotional materials, Triad was a consulting firm devoted to keeping the Republican majority in Congress. From 1995 to 1996, Ms. Malenick operated Triad Management Services as a sole proprietorship, and she became the president, sole director and owner of Triad Management Services, Inc., when Triad incorporated in May 1996. The Commission began its investigation of Triad in response to a series of administrative complaints filed between 1996 and 1998. After failing to reach a conciliation agreement with the defendants, the Commission filed this court complaint.

more:
http://www.fec.gov/law/litigation_CCA_FEC_T.shtml#fec_t...
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VTGold Donating Member (438 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Google Triad Management's owner Carolyn Malenick - some piece of work
Edited on Wed Dec-29-04 11:57 AM by VTGold
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=%22Carolyn+Mal...

Oliver North's campaign manager, no less....
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Alizaryn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #12
17. It would be great if you could link the 2 together, I have not
seen anything that does that as of yet. I'll keep looking.
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VTGold Donating Member (438 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. Link which two?
Based on the original post - I'm going on the fact that the connection between Koch and Triad Management is a given.

The fact that this Carolyn Malenick is obviously a Republican operative is very telling I think....
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kk897 Donating Member (829 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #12
20. TMS may be involved in elections and may be dirty...
Edited on Wed Dec-29-04 01:18 PM by kk897
It would be great to connect TMS to Xenia's Triad. If there is a connection, it will be hidden, that's for sure. I agree that there may be one, but as of now there's nothing tangible.

If you could say, for instance, Tod Rapp sat on the board of directors for TMS or that Xenia's Triad was a TMS subcontractor or something like that, it would be fantastic.

It should be noted that a lot of times in covert ops that companies with a hidden agenda often have similar names, I believe. I think this serves to confuse investigators as well as to organize the operation in a semi-coherent fashion.

For example: Let's say you want to find clandestine ways of gathering intelligence in the diamond trade. You might set up a company called AAA Diamond Trade in New York and AAA Diamond Sellers in South Africa and AAADiamond, Ltd. in London. That way, when analysts are searching for "noise" about the diamond trade, it's easy to spot which are their assets.

Of course, this is all supposition on my part, simply trying to deduce how cover companies and shell corporations might work. It might be instructive to learn about basic covert ops methodologies while doing this kind of research. Anyone have a resource for that?

Edit: added "when"
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Niche Donating Member (687 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
14. flpojunkie, don't let anyone convince you that these...
things are not connected - they are just get names of CEOs etc. and you'll see that quite often they are all connected. I do not know about this particular company but I would NOT BE SURPRISED if it all connects...
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GetTheRightVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 12:07 PM
Response to Original message
16. I would pass this information on to all concerned parties
just in case it is vital to their cases.

:kick:
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dooner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
18. triad gsi and triad management systems
Not sure if this helps... found this cached page from google search of
"Triad GSI" and "Triad Management Systems". Quick read looks like research on Triad. Also looks like the page was removed sometime after 12/19.

http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:0SrzMSqNqF8J:ignoran...
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wendypan Donating Member (29 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. Wow! Great link dooner
see above..

"Triad, or Tactical Resources in American Democracy was founded in 1995, Triad was a profit-making company that funnelled money into Congressional races through two tax-exempt groups associated with it, mainly Citizens for Reform and Citizens for the Republic Education Fund.

Neither of the two nonprofit groups associated with Triad was active before the 1996 election. One existed only on paper as of Oct. 11, 1996, when it opened a bank account.

In the next 20 days, from Oct. 11 to Oct. 31, the group, Citizens for Reform, received $1.6 million from Triad donors in 12 bank transactions. By Oct. 31, $1.4 million of this money had been spent on advertisements, documents show. A second Triad-affiliated nonprofit group received $1.7 million in late October for television attack advertisements.

Triad raised money from conservative donors and sent it to the nonprofit groups that bought so-called issue advertisements on television attacking Democrats and supporting Republican candidates and causes.

Mr. Braden said some Triad donors had been so concerned about secrecy that they insisted on having written agreements with Triad that their names would not be disclosed unless Triad was ordered to do so by the courts. Still, Mr. Braden said, the majority of Triad's donors had been primarily attracted by the conservative candidates that Triad supported and less by a promise of anonymity."

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ohio_liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 02:15 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. The "Triad" in this article...
Is Triad Management Systems. I found something about it on the PBS website:

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/scandal/e...
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wendypan Donating Member (29 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. yea I know..
But this is quite a coincidence. How many companies named Triad are involved in vote fraud?

Hmmmmm.....
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Zan_of_Texas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #24
26. As many as it takes?
Okay, enthusiastic googlers.

Do keep them all straight.

We have at least three Triads here.

1. The Triad Governmental Systems, Inc. (Triad GSI)
In Xenia Ohio, apparently an old, small Rapp family venture involved in punch cards and voter registration in Ohio, and a bit in Florida, (and maybe Tennessee -- can't remember).

2. The Triad mentioned in Thomas Frank's book, having to do with the Koch people (Koch does a TON of stuff that we don't like, folks, and they stay WAY below the radar. It's a huge private firm dealing in energy and such.)

3. CCI/Triad. I think this one is based in Texas.

I agree that sometimes evildoers will use similar names to try to throw trackers off the trail. It might also make financial transactions easy -- write a check to one Triad, have a different one cash it. But, don't mix the three until you have proof they are linked.

There are lots of names like Triad and Triton, in general, AND associated with the bad guys. Keep 'em separate though, unless you have proof (aside from someone mentioning them both on their tripod webpage -- dang, there's that "tri-" again!)
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wendypan Donating Member (29 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #18
22. and a connection to the Saudis?
this is getting good...
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ChicanoPwr Donating Member (536 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
25. Triad and the McLean Group
http://www.mcleanllc.com/news/news_10.html

Largest Staffing Firm Merger in Washington Region
McLean Group Advises Acquired Firm

MCLEAN, VA (Oct. 2, 2003) ? In one of the largest staffing firm deals in the region this year, Kaseman Corporation of Chantilly, Virginia, has acquired Triad Management Systems, Inc., of Rockville. The McLean Group served as financial advisors to Triad.

About The McLean Group
The McLean Group is a privately owned investment bank that provides merger and acquisition (M&A), business valuation, capital formation, corporate finance and litigation support services to clients generating from $5 million to $300 million in annual revenues.

More information is available on The McLean Group?s web site at
http://www.mcleanllc.com .

Contact Information:
Eva Catlin
Director, Marketing
(703) 827-0200, ext. 111
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ChicanoPwr Donating Member (536 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. McLean Group & Carlyle Group
The Carlyle Group
The Carlyle Group is a private global investment firm which originates, structures and acts as lead equity investor in management-led buyouts, strategic minority equity investments, equity private placements, consolidations and build-ups, and growth capital financings. Formed in 1987, The Carlyle Group has invested over $5.3 billion of equity in 200 corporate and real estate transactions with an aggregate acquisition value of over $14 billion.

The McLean Group LLC
The McLean Group LLC is a privately owned investment bank providing merger and acquisition (M&A), capital formation, corporate finance, business valuation and litigation support services to middle-market businesses.

Both companies located in McLean VA.
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Carolab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-30-04 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. Triad Management Systems and RIGGS BANK
http://www.thelaborers.net/court_cases/part_5_investiga...

Koch Industries has refused to say whether it funded the Triad-controlled tax-exempts or any other organizations that ran attack ads in 1996. A September 30, 1997, letter to Koch Industries Chairman Charles Koch from the Committee's Minority Chief Counsel, produced no response. 164 Questions from journalists have been met with ''no comment.'' After the Minority learned of the existence of the Economic Education Trust, Senator Glenn, the ranking Minority member, asked Chairman Thompson to issue a subpoena to the Riggs National Bank of Washington, D.C., where the Trust maintained the account from which money was wired to the Triad organizations....

Other evidence besides the involvement of the same consultants suggests that the donor behind the Economic Education Trust whose identity has been concealed from the Committee funded not only the Triad advertising campaign but also the CCF advertising campaign. In addition: Both Triad and CCF representatives confirmed that both organizations executed written confidentiality agreements with a secret contributor. 178 An unnamed former employee of CCF stated in a news article that the entity that funded the CCF advertising campaign was a trust. (note - 179) The funds for the CCF ad campaign were wired from an account at Riggs Bank in Washington, D.C., the same bank where the Economic Education Trust has an account. (note - 180) Barry Bennett, executive director of CCF stated that the confidentiality agreement was drafted by former RNC General Counsel Benjamin Ginsberg. Ginsberg was also consulted on the substance of CCF advertising, and represents both Dick Dresner and James Farwell, both of whom failed to appear for deposition on any of the numerous dates offered to them. (note - 181) Triad's impact on the 1996 elections....

Evidence includes the public statement by an unnamed CCF employee that the organization that provided the funding for the ad campaign was a trust. 91 Bank records produced by CCF also show that the money for the CCF ad campaign was wired to CCF from a branch of Riggs Bank in Washington D.C., the same bank where the Economic Education Trust has an account. 92 Witnesses for CCF admitted that CCF had entered into an agreement to keep the identity of the contributor secret, but refused to produce a copy of the agreement. Barry Bennett stated publicly that this agreement was drafted by former RNC General Counsel Benjamin Ginsberg. 93 Documents produced by CCF indicate that counsel for CCF was also in contact with Ginsberg on the subject of the CCF advertising campaign. (note - 94Ginsberg also represented Dresner and Farwell before the Committee, both of whom failed to appear for deposition despite multiple attempts to schedule dates with Ginsberg. Moreover, the Committee learned that when the Economic Education Trust opened its account at Riggs bank, the address provided was in care of Ben Ginsburg....
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