My husband is in AA and he says Bush is

[roseBudd]

drinking again.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

1. That is...

A very fair assumption.

[Stephanie]

2. What's his reasoning?

What is your husband seeing?

[roseBudd]

31. Hubby says mannerisms, facial expresions

He sponsors people and he can tell when they "go out"

[johnfunk]

3. Wouldn't surprise me. Alan Bisbort pegged Bush as a dry drunk in...

...this classic APJ opinion piece.

[NMDemDist2]

4. hubby and I am too, and we think so also n/t

[Stephanie]

5. What makes you think so?

Behavior, or appearance, or what?

[NMDemDist2]

16. appearance is a lot (the "gin blossoms" on his face just get bigger)

and his behavior is either a dry drunk or a bingeing one. Hubby swears that's why he spends so much time in Crawford.

Crawford=binge weekend

[roseBudd]

32. I just showed hubby this picture and he said

you gotta be kidding

and it shows up on white people real easy

[Jokinomx]

39. I am no expert...but I agree.. he looks as though he has been hitting

the bottle a little heavy.


:dem:

[AgadorSparticus]

17. in that book, bush on the couch, dr. frank said that his speech

pattern is indicative of a long term alcoholic. his thought process is incomplete. if you notice, he'll start on a thought, half way through a sentence, will stop on a dime and veer on some out unrelated or semi-related thought. he doesn't finish his thoughts and sentences. i can't remember the clinical term for this. but he does this ALL the time.

[DemNoir]

6. I have thought that for a long time

Look at some photos that show him getting off the helicopter after a Camp David weekend. Both he and Pickles look totally wasted.

[Andromeda]

7. He has that gin blossom complexion...

with blotches and pustules scattered in an irregular pattern about his face. What are those? Boils, probably.

[liberalmuse]

8. My apolitical friend's apolitical mother...

saw Bush on the tv a few months ago, and without knowing anything whatsoever about his past, said, 'That guy is a heavy drinker'. I thought it was interesting.

[ItsTheMediaStupid]

49. Great dialog from old W.C. Fields movie

Mother and daughter discussing Fields, who is pursuing the daughter.

Daughter - So Mother, you think he's a drinking man?

Mother - He didn't get that nose playing ping pong!

[benddem]

9. something is going on

wonder if he threw a fit after he got off the set. He looked like he was about to blow...all those facial grimaces. His skin is really terrible. If they don't find a way to get out of the next debates wonder what they will do to fix him.

[napi21]

12. They'll forbid any closeup lenses on the cameras.

Makeup can do wonders at a distance!!!

[GingerSnaps]

23. They will get a copy of the questions ahead of time

They will plant the people in the audience and he will know the questions and how to answer them.

What's a dry drunk?

[Lancer]

30. A dry drunk

(and most of us don't believe Bush is one), is a person who stopped DRINKING, but never stopped any of the negative behaviors that are associated with drinking or alcoholism. The drinker has only addressed the most visible aspect of the problem.

Is this a fair description, guys?

[roseBudd]

34. Yeah, a dry drunk never went to AA

and Bush definitely never went to AA or NA.

one of the characteristics of an alcoholic is they are selfish and self-centered, and never ever wrong about anything. these are the character defects that must be addressed for an alcoholic to remain sober

[yardwork]

41. Well, not all alcoholics have those particular character defects....

but W certainly does!

[Raenelle]

52. My understanding--untreated, alcoholics are all obsessively self-centered

25 years clean and sober member of AA. But I don't know if he's a dry or wet untreated drunk--but he is untreated. The main manifestation is extreme self-will run riot.

[GingerSnaps]

43. Thanks for explaining what they are like

No one drinks in my family but I had a friend that I couldn't deal with because she was obnoxious when she was sober.

[NMDemDist2]

36. here's a pretty good list of characteristics of dry drunk syndrome

"Dry drunk" is a term describing the state of the alcoholic who is uncomfortable when he is not drinking. The "dry drunk syndrome" is a group of symptoms that occur together and constitute an abnormality. Since the abnormality of the alcoholic's attitudes and behavior during his drinking career is generally recognized, the persistence of these traits after the alcoholic stops drinking might seem equally abnormal. Therefore, the term "dry-drunk" alludes to the absence of favorable change in the attitudes and behavior of the alcoholic who is not drinking.

"Dry Drunk" Traits:

* Grandiose behavior
* Pomposity
* Exaggerated self-importance
* A rigidly judgmental outlook
* Impatience
* Childish behavior
* Irresponsible behavior
* Irrational rationalization
* Projection
* Overreaction

http://www.kenpeterscenter.com/drydrunk.htm

if the shoe fits.......

[Jacobin]

45. WOW. That list pretty much describes Smirk to perfection

thanks for that

[LiberalFighter]

44. That might work

fixing him...

Then the voters would have a lot of sympathy for him going through a vascetomy.

Oh, I would volunteer to fix him. I have a special knife at work that is good for small spaces. Of course, I wouldn't be able to give him a local since I don't have the tools for that. But I suppose he wouldn't feel much if he takes a few swigs of his favorite alcohol.

The only thing is I don't think I would want to contaminate my hands with his body.

[Nancy Waterman]

10. I noticed it for his convention speech

and previously at one of his (rare) press conferences. He seemed clearly on some kind of transquilizer or perhaps boos on those two occasions. It occurred to me they couldn't give him tranquilizers last night because he had to be able to answer unscripted questions, but then he got irritable without the drug.

[DemoTex]

11. He tripped going down the platform steps at the Pa. rally today.

That by itself means nothing. A year ago tomorrow I tripped going down the stairs in Dallas at 5 am to let the dog out. I had not had a drink in days. I broke my left big toe. But, in context with his other physical manifestations, the man is drinking heavily. I, personally, think he never quit. It was another Rovian move, in the 80s, to prep him for where he is today.

[goclark]

14. I heard him on the radio today

and his words were slury.
My first reaction was that he had been drinking.

The radio picks up the sound so much better.

I also saw him getting off the plane with Casper McCain. He almost missed a step exiting AF 1

[Stephanie]

26. You tripped once. How many times has HE fallen in the past 4 years?

And he falls on his FACE half the time. Have you ever done THAT? It's very, very bizarre.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

13. What makes y'all think he ever stopped?

[blondeatlast]

15. God?

At least, that's what Bunny says...

[Stew225]

18. There has never been a doubt in my mind

that the guy is still drinking. Hell, he never got help to quit in the first place. Had he got help the success rate would have been 5-15%. I think he made a resolution to quit drinking.......in public!

[Stephanie]

27. 5-15% is the success rate WITH help?

You're kidding? So what is the rate without help? Are there even stats on that? Wow.

[NMDemDist2]

37. sadly that is true, it's a horrible addiction

thank heavens it worked for me, but it is heartbreaking to watch so few "get it"

[yardwork]

40. There aren't reliable stats, but AA and other groups estimate 10%

of those who enter recovery (ie, join AA or another support group) quit drinking for the rest of their lives. The others (90%) go back out. Lots of people go in and out multiple times. Those of us in recovery (I am one) know that alcoholism is never "cured." A sober alcoholic can start drinking again at any time. It is a day-to-day lifestyle to stay in sobriety. It takes work and commitment.

From what we know of W's past drinking behavior he sounds like a binger to me. That's an alcoholic who doesn't drink every day. He or she can go for sometimes lengthy periods of time without drinking but then they go on benders, binges, toots, whatever you want to call it. Apparently it is very difficult for bingers to stop permanently.

I don't know if W is drinking again, but something is wrong with him. In my opinion he shows signs of early dementia. Google "frontal lobe dementia" and see what you think.

[blondeatlast]

48. Agreed; and last night couldn't have been more obvious.

He must have been BIG fun this morning...

[TXDemGal]

21. Exactly! I doubt he stopped, ever.

But did you ever notice how in all the "news" pieces that mention his abrupt jump on the wagon when he turned 40, it says "Bush stopped drinking at age 40." This is stated as if it's the gospel truth.

These so-called journalists should be saying, in keeping with good journalistic principles, "Bush says he stopped drinking at age 40." Note insertion of "says."

There's no way in hell they can verify that the asshole is or ever was sober. So at least do the reading public the courtesy of practicing journalism, m'kay?

Can you tell this is a point that pisses me off? :mad:

[speedoo]

24. What the "journalists" shoule really say:

"Bush says he stopped drinking at age 40. However there is no evidence to support his assertion. In fact there is evidence to the contrary."

[LiberalFighter]

51. I stopped cold turkey the 3rd Saturday in August of 1993

at age 39 years 5 months. I guess I should had waited another 7 months.


BUT I didn't drink that much. Didn't drink on a regular basis or drink more than 2 or 3 rum cokes on any occasion. Even then I would space my drinks with cokes.

I had a few times being totally drunk.. It was not fun and part of the reason that I didn't get wasted on a regular basis. Didn't even find it that pleasing just having a few. Beer would be worse for me if I had 3 or more. BUT there were a 2 or 3 times when I had a nice refreshing cold beer. It was always the first but never 2nd or after.

[Booster]

19. There never been a doubt in my mind that both of them

are drinking heavily - I think Pickles is worse than Bush. There's months go by that you don't hear or see her at all and no one says a word about where she's been and we all know she's not doing anything.

[Stephanie]

28. I think she went off and got a face lift.

Don't you think? Look at her.

[SayitAintSo]

50. I think you are right...

I've noticed the change ... she looks really good - a lot younger.

[SammyWinstonJack]

20. I bet Blinky tied one on last night after Kerry slapped

him around. :evilgrin:

[Lancer]

22. I don't think he ever quit.

I will study the tape again from last night, but I didn't notice him shaking. Maybe he doesn't go long enough between drinks to get the shakes.

Still, everything else y'all have said seems totally valid to me.

• Bush's skin looks awful all the time, and it's not rosacea. If it was, the WH physician would have issued a statement, and the President would have done a PSA. There's no shame in rosacea, but gin blossoms are another story.

• I can't recall the medical term either for Bush's inability to complete a thought either, but the phenomenon does have a name. His speech patterns are very indicative of someone who has been drinking heavily for a long time. He also appears to have mini blackouts.

• Dry mouth. Bush must have drunk a couple of quarts of water last night.

[SammyWinstonJack]

25. Of course he didn't!

Free booze at the taxpayers' expense! blinky loves free stuff!

[ZombieNixon]

35. Maybe...

it was vodka in the Bush glasses. Vodka, like water, is clear. It has a minimal smell except in copious quantites, and if he had it right there with him, he wouldn't get the shakes, now would he?

:-D

LOL

[LiberalFighter]

47. Would the gw* camp be responsible for the "water" or would that

be the commission?

If it is the gw* camp wouldn't the secret service be checking things out to make sure that it wasn't contaminated?

[newyawker99]

56. Hi ZombieNixon!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

29. I don't think it's just alcohol

I'll bet his mood is alternatively brought up and brought down through prescription drugs. Bush supposedly used drugs in college at frat parties to overcome shyness and feelings of inadequacy with women. If he needed drugs to face his college friends at parties, do you think he would hesitate to use them when facing 60 million Americans and a far superior intellect than his own in a debate?

[RareLubbockDem]

33. I think that too!

He's too red faced. Plus, too many scabs and bruises on his face. He chokes on a pretzel, he falls off his bike, blah blah.... It doesn't happen that often to anyone. Plus, he slurs his words way too much. His father looks better than he does.

[carpe_vinum]

38. I don't know if it's drinking or drugs, but he's got something ...

besides blood in his veins. I actually think he's on anxiety meds. Dosage was off last night. Sounds snarky, but I'm completely serious.

[GDoyle]

42. Hard Work

Drinking a bottle of Southern Comfort a night is hard work. Its hard work dammit! Didn't you hear the Preznit? Its HARD work!

GDoyle

[ItsTheMediaStupid]

46. I'm in recovery

I don't presume to know whether someone is drinking or not from what they look like on TV.

However, how you choke on a pretzel if you're sober?

[gauguin57]

53. And what about this story about him not taking his scheduled physical

before the election?

Hmmmmmmm... the plot thickens.

[zulchzulu]

54. I'd be glad if he was drinking again

He has a pattern of overdoing it, so maybe he'll fall off a podium soon.

[LibertyLover]

55. Bush and drinking

I do think it's entirely possible that Bush is drinking again, but in all fairness, his complexion problems could be due to rosecea. That's the disease that actually caused W.C. Field's nose to enlarge. I happen to have rosecea and when I'm not taking my oral antibiotic(I have to rest periodically) you would swear that I'm hitting the bottle, when in truth I'm hardly even a social drinker.