Clarks Tax plan

[sidwill]

Brilliant stuff politically.

Under Wes Clark's Families First Tax Reform, a family of four making up to $50,000 will pay no federal income taxes and all taxpaying families with children making up to $100,000 will get a tax cut. The Families First Tax Reform will shift the tax burden from those who are struggling to get by to those....

Clark is using the repukes own tactic against them.

A. It is a wedge driven into the Republican front, Repukes and independents that fall into these categories will want to vote their poketbooks, this will pare away those "tax cut" voters.

B. It gives the average joe an opportunity to smack those Corporate monkeys who have raided the system for their own benefit.

C. If it ever sees the floor of either house it can be used to unseat the Republican majority and redefine the Tax issue as a democratic issue. Can you imagine Tom Delay and company on CNN trying to explain to their constituencies why they oppose this "tax cut" ha!

This idea is a way to reverse the trend of corporate control of government by getting the masses of lower and middle income people a more direct reason to vote.

[Sir_Shrek]

1. Only thing I wonder about is.....

Narrowing the tax base so sharply and whether upping the rates on higher incomes will be able to make up for it.

[papau]

2. Payroll tax base should be extended to all wages - FIT change is not

a problem.

And yes, hit high income does cover loss - and then some.

Indeed a change in definition to include non-wage income at 100 cents on a dollar would have same effect!

[Sir_Shrek]

4. Ummm....

"And yes, hit high income does cover loss - and then some."

Detail that for me....this is one sticking point that could make or break me on Clark, so I'm interested to know.

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

5. include non-wage income at 100%

Absolutely - tax wealth, not work. You shouldn't be paying taxes on your paycheck while some rich guy is NOT paying taxes on his investments and unearned income.

But don't screw with Social Security, it's working fine right now.

[Sir_Shrek]

7. I don't like this either.....

So all the folks with savings accounts get the interest they earned taxed away? That hits everyone regardless of income. Returns on interest and investments are income-neutral....savings accounts and mutual funds don't know how much you make. And it does exceptionally more damage to lower income people who rely on interest and investment gains to supplement their retirement outside of Social Security and 401(k) and college savings. No way.

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

8. include ALL income and wealth

then make sure that the majority of people are paying low rates. Make up for the low rates with high rates on the upper brackets.

No one wants to hurt working families and the middle class with high taxes, least of all me. But treating investment income differently (and better) than paychecks in fundamentally wrong.

[Sir_Shrek]

11. Ehh.......

I don't think treating investment income differently from earned income is necessarily wrong. With the exception of 401(k)s and traiditonal IRAs, investments are made with after tax money. Even the sheltered stuff intended for retirement is taxed later. But it's the tax benefit that makes these kinds of things and investment in general I guess, attractive.

Plus, you have to take into account that investing in things like stocks, bonds, etc carries risk with it. There's no guarantee you'll make any money, and there's no guaranteed timeframe for returns, except in maybe ultra-conservative investments or things like savings accounts. You can argue that wages are not guaranteed either, but at least wages carry with them a contract enforceable by law that someone who works a certain amount of time is owed a certain amount of money. Investments carry no such guarantee.

[liberalnurse]

3. I have my doubts about this one.....

Here is some feedback from a Libertarian....they have strong insight to our tax dilemma as it is a foundation issue for their party.

www.boortz.com

<snip>

Now Wesely Clark has come out with his grand tax plan. If (huge if) Wesely actually becomes president he will, if the congress goes along, bring about a law that would make all families of four who make under $50,000 completely exempt from all federal income taxes. There will be additional tax breaks for families of four making less than $100,000. And what of the high income earners? What about the businessmen and women who provide employment for the vast majority of Americans? What about the high-achievers who truly power our economy? Well ... Clark wants their taxes to go up.

Open your eyes, folks. This is pure, unadulterated class warfare ... and brilliant political strategy. Think about it.....

You're in an election. Over one-half of the voters don't pay any federal income taxes. Less than one-half do. All you have to do is tell those folks out there who don't pay taxes that if the other guy wins he is going to start making them pay. Easy enough. People love a free ride ... and they'll go to the polls to protect that privilege. Democratic politicians have been working toward this state of political nirvana for decades. Strangely enough, Republicans, on occasion, have been eager to help them.

We were warned over 100 years ago that democracy will fail once the electorate realizes that they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury. We're there.

One more thing. Wesely Clark says he is going to cover the tab for removing all these people from the tax rolls by closing corporate tax loopholes. This is Clark telling you that he thinks you're stupid.

Clark knows that corporations don't pay taxes. He knows that corporations collect taxes from customers, employees and shareholders and pass them off to the federal government. When Clark says that he is going to close corporate tax loopholes he is really saying that he is going to raise taxes on corporate employees, consumers and shareholders. A tax is a tax whether it is paid directly to the IRS or handed to a corporation or business to be passed on to the IRS.

If the celebrity and sports obsessed American people could simply learn this one simple economics lesson politicians like Clark would lose a powerful rhetorical weapon and would be forced to deal more honestly with voters.

//////

This is one way to view where the Clark tax plan will take us.

Oh ...I don't think I want to go with Clark on this....

[sidwill]

6. You miss the point

ThE repukes have been absolutely hitting us over the head with the tax issue for 2 decades, this plan as flawed as it is can reverse that trend and start to get the middle class to once again lean Democratic.

The details are inconsequential, what matters is power. The Repugs know this and have used to inverse (tax cuts to the wealthy) to attain power.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

10. Personally...

I find Neil Boortz a piss-poor source of objective information on the weather, much less Dem campaigns or much of anything else.

Try again.

[Jack_Dawson]

9. It's been widely lauded

And well-timed for tax-averse NH.