Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Al Sharpton is on his way to the NY Post to raise hell about this toon

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:18 AM
Original message
Al Sharpton is on his way to the NY Post to raise hell about this toon
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 09:20 AM by CatWoman


this was run in today's paper.

Heard about it on the Tom Joyner Show, while driving to work.

This dumb shit isn't even funny. It fails on so many levels.

Statement by Reverend Al Sharpton, President of National Action Network

New York, NY (February 18, 2009) --The cartoon in todays New York Post is troubling at best, given the racist attacks throughout history that have made African-Americans synonymous with monkeys. One has to question whether the cartoonist is making a less than casual inference to this form of racism when, in the cartoon, the police say after shooting a chimpanzee, now they will have to find someone else to write the stimulus bill.

Being that the stimulus bill has been the first legislative victory of President Barack Obama (the first African American president) and has become synonymous with him it is not a reach to wonder whether the Post cartoonist was inferring that a monkey wrote it? Given that the New York Post cartoonist has come under heavy fire in the past for racially tinged cartoons including the infamous cartoons depicting 2001 mayoral candidate Freddy Ferrer and me in very unflattering ways (that ultimately was used as a campaign tactic to inflame racial prejudices), one cannot ignore that history when looking at this mornings cartoon.

The Post should at least clarify what point they were trying to make in this cartoon, and reprimand their cartoonist for making inferences that are offensive and divisive at a time the nation struggles to come together to stabilize the economy if, in fact, this was yet another racially charged cartoon. .

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:19 AM
Response to Original message
1. That is disgusting on so many levels. Whoever approved that
should be fired, right along with the cartoonist.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Deep13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:30 AM
Response to Reply #1
24. +1
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #24
242. +2!!!
!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #242
365. Rupert Murdoch?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Faygo Kid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #1
30. Grotesque in so many ways.
The Right thinks it can get away with anything now. They are in steep decline, led by Rush.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
truthrocks Donating Member (160 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #1
236. Email your outrage to NY Post. I just did. Email address below:
I just emailed this letter to:
letters@nypost.com
webeditor@nypost.com
scuozzo@nypost.com
dlandsel@nypost.com
mshain@nypost.com
rjohnson@nypost.com

A "cartoon" depicting the annihilation of the writer of the stimulus bill is a pretty straightforward portrayal of . . . well . . . the annihilation of the writer of the stimulus bill! And who might that be? Oh, yes ... it's OUR PRESIDENT. Political satire is one thing. Generating attention through controversy is another. All good. This "cartoon" is neither. And it's really, really bad. In fact, it takes the expression of anti-American sentiment to a new and very frightening low. Not to mention making light of the tragedy of the woman who's face and hands were mangled, and may not survive.

BOYCOTT NY POST!

PLEASE email your outrage to these NY Post editors and writers now.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
skooooo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:20 AM
Response to Original message
2. OMG
Where did this appear?

He should be raising hell about it. What is wrong with people?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
davepc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:20 AM
Response to Original message
3. I don't get it...at all
Even trying to interpret it from the worst angles...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #3
34. The insinuation is that the bill was very poorly written.
That's all really.

Those that choose to see more, will.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #34
42. Glad to see this post...
I thought I was the only one thinking this.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #42
47. It's easy to see why people might think that at first.
But with a little thought, it just doesn't seem that's the artist's intent.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #47
54. I agree.
It makes me think of that oft used phrase "a monkey could do it". You know? As in... "What? He makes $20 bucks an hour?! A frigging monkey could do that job!" Couple that with the psycho chimp in the news and there you have it.

Its almost more twisted, imho, to conclude that the chimp in the cartoon = Obama. I still cant find my way to that conclusion.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #54
128. Even if it is not the author's intent...
People have to be very sensitive when making any comparisons to black people and monkeys, no matter how loose. Historically, blacks have been referred to as monkeys by racist in order to degrade them. And by them, I mean US. I am a black person, so when I see that, that is what I think.

Even if that is not the authors intent, had he chosen any other symbol it would have been fine. But putting a monkey to even loosely represent the president, a black man, is a dangerous thing to do because of the historical context of the slur that has been used for years.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #128
143. I dont disagree with you.
Its just that I didnt see it as the chimp = Obama. Its like I said above, I'm very used to people saying "a monkey could do it". Kinda like the geico caveman thing - which is exactly what I thought when I saw the cartoon. Clearly though, most people see something in it that I didnt automatically see, so surely *someone* must have pointed that out to the cartoonist.

That said, it was insensitive to run it (at best) & hateful bigotry (at worst). I understand your point. :pals:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #143
146. Exactly. I think he knew it could be taken in different ways, one of which is very bad. eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tblue37 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #146
211. Exactly.! It's a dogwhistle. His "base" will understand what he means, but
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 05:10 PM by tblue37
those who don't automatically think that way might be fooled into thinking it's an innocent cartoon That others are reading too much into.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #128
145. That's a fair point.
If it weren't for the shooting the other day, then there would be no question of intent here.

The flip side of your point is that no one can use a chimp in a political cartoon for the next 8 years because they'll be considered 'racist' regardless of the context they use it in.

Racists often use chimps to refer to black people.
The use of chimps in media does not automatically translate to racism even though it might indicate it.

That's all I'm really saying.

It's interesting to watch the way people react to vague implications by assigning concrete values and establishing certainty.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #145
149. As unfair as it is...
No, people should not use a monkey as a symbol for anything relating to the president or any other black person. I was not aware of the shooting, maybe I would have a different thought.

I think back to the various monkey references that happened during the election, some loose, some blatant and my main issue is that people know what could be thought when they do it and they decide anyway. Even if the criticism is unwarranted, or unfair, it should not be unexpected.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #149
151. But that's a contrived connection.
You say the chimp is supposed to represent the President. No?

Then what you are saying is that no chimp can appear in a political cartoon for the next 8 years regardless of context.


Perhaps the artist isn't racist, but he knew just how to ring some bells. Either way, this thread is proof that his stock went up.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:00 PM
Response to Reply #151
153. No, not regardless of context...
I don't *think* the monkey is exactly supposed to BE the president. But, because a good cartoonist or a good editorial guides people to think in different ways, not just one way, it is not too far off base that for some it could represent the president.

That is the issue. What you said...he knew he would push some buttoms, which meant he knew that some would feel that the monkey represented the president. To that end, it was somewhat purposeful and in that case, the criticism is he getting is warranted.

I don't believe the author is racist, but I would not be surprised if this exact cartoon was to show up and be used by racists because of the symbolism using the monkey.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #153
159. Then the criticism he's getting is what he was after.
Ok, so it makes a bit of sense; The artist, recognizing the nebulous nature of his depiction, the convenience of a recent event, and the tendency for outrage by the racially "over"sensitive, set out to create publicity... mission accomplished.

It's not unreasonable, however, to also assume that he may have simply decided to link the event to the bill merely to comment on the bill.

That's kind of the point; it requires an assumption to trigger the outrage. If everyone just took the message to mean, 'this bill sucks', then most of us still wouldn't know his name.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #159
161. But it also requires an assumption to think that he didn't mean anything.
So, I will say he is very clever. I think it is naive to think that the possibility that people would not think this way never crossed his mind. I am sure it did. To him, an editor, or someone. I would not say that he is racist. I will say that he knew this would ruffle feathers and ran it anyway. To that end, I would say that he probably doesn't give a damn about political correctness. And should he? That's not up to me. That's up the NYPost and how much they want to sell their papers.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #161
164. Read your SL wrong. Yes, one would have to also 'assume' he was innocent.
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 12:28 PM by The Doctor.
I think I can agree that he may have known what he was doing, but that is still an assumption... no matter how reasonable.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #164
167. Yes, we can agree its a "reasonable assumption" that he knew what he was doing. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #164
169. "Dog whistle Racism"
This was the term that was used by a friend of mine. Interesting.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #169
188. I was thinking "plausible deniability".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:13 PM
Response to Reply #169
255. indeed.......................
The most dangerous kind of prejudice to humanity as a whole isn't dressed in white sheets, doesn't have a shaved head and isn't hanging people in a foreign land. It's coming from the smile of a friend and most times, they don't even know it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 02:28 AM
Response to Reply #255
316. Going by some of the responses in this thread making excuses for this God-awful cartoon
it would appear that there are plenty of people who are under the mistaken impression that if it doesn't wear white sheets, a swastika, or burn crosses then it's not racism.

It's generally a lot more insidious than that and when those instances come up we get people claiming that the ones who recognize the racism are the actual racists. These folks need to wake up otherwise we will never be able to do anything about racism because we won't be able to convince fools it still exists.

The amount of excuse making for this jackass cartoonist is appalling and all those people who refuse to acknowledge the racism that's right in front of their noses on the computer screen as per the OP are as much part of the problem as the bigot who drew that asinine cartoon.

Regards
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 03:24 AM
Response to Reply #316
319. And screw AG Holder


"The amount of excuse making for this jackass cartoonist is appalling and all those people who refuse to acknowledge the racism that's right in front of their noses on the computer screen as per the OP are as much part of the problem as the bigot who drew that asinine cartoon."


"we must feel comfortable enough with one another, and tolerant enough of each other, to have frank conversations about the racial matters that continue to divide us."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #319
345. Eric Holder is 100% right
But I am sick and tired of trying to pretty up the obvious. I am not interested in making people feel comfortable by allowing them to think their deliberate blindness is legitimate. If you want to do so that's certainly your prerogative but it doesn't work otherwise we would have had an actual honest discussion about race a long time ago. If you think what I said was bad then you're really going to be uncomfortable if you ever overheard an honest discussion on race.

Regards
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tblue37 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #149
215. Don't forget the idiot at the Palin rally who showed a monkey doll
labeled with an Obama bumper sticker. He waved it around, proudly snickering and calling it "Little Hussein."
http://gawker.com/5062352/yes-sarah-palin-your-fans-are...

I can't find the original video, but here is a later one:
http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/10/11/politics/fromth...

And then there is this:

http://yedda.com/questions/TheSockbama_com_Obama_sock-m... /



Do NOT tell me that his "base" doesn't know what he means by that cartoon. There's nothing innocent about it!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #149
225. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:13 PM
Response to Reply #225
254. Pelosi looks like a monkey?
I've never heard that one before. :shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #254
260. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Proud_Lefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #128
238. I agree that this toon is in bad taste
But honestly, I always compare a chimp to Bush, not Obama. I think I've even called him Chimp many times. I can even see him shaking his head around and up and down, with his lips puckered. Can't you see it?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 06:32 AM
Response to Reply #128
322. It does suck that it comes to being that PC, because I too don't think there was racist intent
But that is the bed this country made for itself and anyone with any comprehension of our history wouldn't have drawn that. Also, this is the Post we're talking about here. Garbage in, garbage out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
paulkienitz Donating Member (313 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #54
228. OK, then why is the monkey shot?
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 06:23 PM by paulkienitz
Why would a monkey be shot by a cop, if it's not a reference to incidents such as the Oscar Grant BART shooting. If the monkey is a reference to authors of the stimulus, why are cops in the cartoon at all? With the best will I can't see this as other than an attempt to tie our new administration to street crime through a common thread of chimps. And the only way that makes any sense is as racism.

<edit> Woops, I didn't know there was a recent news story about cops actually shooting a chimp.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bettyellen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #47
272. then you haven't seen other work by this "artist" his stock in trade is racism
thanks for talking out your ass!
little thought was spot on.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 06:33 AM
Response to Reply #272
323. Didn't realize he had a history of racially charged toons
That does put a finer point on it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-09 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #323
411. Yeah, that would certainly be telling. Haven't found one yet though.
I've got a little time, I'll take a look.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
stevedeshazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #34
69. You can't see the blatant racism in that?
Wow.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #69
76. Don't waste your time. This is COMMON for the NY Post.
They have been knwon for making blatant racist remarks and cartoons and get off when people like the above just push it to the side. And they'll continue doing it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #69
84. It's only 'racist' because you choose to see racism.
You've ignored the intent of the cartoon to do so.

So, explain how the cartoon is 'racist'. Because there's a chimp in it and that automatically means 'Obama'?

That requires a stretch, but when people seek to find offense, they'll often reach for it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #84
86. Remember the guy at the McCain rally in PA with the monkey with an Obama sticker?
That is what MONKEY means to racist bastards. They use MONKEY references to degrade black people. They could have chosen any animal...they could have chosen lots of different things. They chose a monkey for a reason. For the same reason as that guy who took the monkey to the McCain rally.

If you don't see it, it is because you have decided not to see it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #86
93. That was obviously racist... a direct implication.
This is not.

It takes a greater stretch to see racism than to see the simple implication; "The bill sucks, as though an enraged monkey wrote it."

Since so many people wrote it, it's simply illogical to assume this is racism directed at Obama.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #93
97. The original author was President Obama.
Yes, many people wrote it, and if they had a cartoon with the police rounding up a gang of monkeys, to represent the entire democratic house and senate then I would agree. But clearly, they are insinuating the one person who authored the bill, and that was the president. Now look, I am not one of those people who see racism in everything. But I am no dummy...I know what it is when I see it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #93
132. I understand your argument.
Though the "a monkey could do it" angle did not occur to me until it was pointed out. I immediately saw the racial overtones, but I'll admit this could be my own over-sensitivity (middle-aged white liberal that I am).

But one question: Why are the police gunning down a chimp?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #132
136. What he doesn't seem to get is the history behind blacks being portrayed or referred to as monkeys
Even if it was not the author's intent, he should have been more careful. Now, I think this guy KNOWS the history behind it and decided to do it anyway. Its just vague enough that people who are mad will look crazy. But its blatant enough for everyone else to think that this guy is not as slick as he thinks he is.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #136
273. There are certain people, some of whom try to be well-meaning
but who still refuse to accept our country's torturous racial history.

There is a very good chance that the author of this cartoon did not have any DELIBERATE racial intent. Does that mean that his cartoon is not racist? My personal thought is that this cartoon, in addition to not being even the slightest bit funny, is definitely racially insensitive.

Some people believe that unless something is DELIBERATELY created for the purposes of disparaging people of a certain race, it cannot be racist. They fail to understand that some things can be unintentionally racist, but racist nonetheless. To be honest, sometimes something unintentionally racist can be far more hurtful than something that was deliberately crafted to be racist.

There are so many examples of this, I can't even name them. This is a picture of Michelle Obama that is currently all over the Internet. It portrays her as a chimpanzee and is deliberately racist. Some could easily argue that the NY Post cartoon was not DELIBERATELY racist, but honestly, would that a bit of difference to the people who know our President personally?

There was a story last year about a woman in Texas who got smacked down because she ran out to two children climbing a tree in their own yard and accused them of "acting like monkeys." The two children were black; the woman was not. She may not have been INTENDING to be racist in her comments, but they were certainly taken that way by the childrens' parents who filed a complaint against the woman and who was fined because of her actions.

Like I said, I don't know if the author of this cartoon was trying to be racist. He probably didn't even think about it that way. I don't think that he'll have the luxury of ignorance ever again, though.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #136
358. That's precisely the point I've made repeatedly;
"Even if it was not the author's intent, he should have been more careful."

What you've just said is that now, every artist, writer, cartoonist, or TV personality has to screen themselves against saying anything that can be interpreted, even loosely, as racist simply because Obama is President.

Here I am trying to reach a higher level of discourse over this issue, but some just can't drop the blinding outrage. Unfortunately, that makes most of their opinions nearly worthless.

Thanks for being rational, it means you have opinions I'll be able to respect.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #132
144. Because recently, the police literally gunned down a chimp.
It went crazy and mauled a lady. It was someones pet. On Xanex, I think. For real.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #144
181. Hadn't heard that.
Sounds like he had a paradoxical reaction to the Xanax.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mdmc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #132
237. the other day some local cops gunned down a rabid chimp
honest to God.

They had to take down this chimp gone wild.

As a cartoonist I see this - the bill sucks, looks like it was written by a insane chimp,,

I also see that the cartoon is not brilliant, it is only controversial.. kinda..

So the toonist did his job and works another day..
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #132
250. Why are the police gunning down a chimp?

Because it was THE lead story in the NY-CT area yesterday.

They gunned it down because it nearly mauled a woman to death after taking Xanax.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #250
298. OK. That story didn't make it to the ass of Iowa.
Nor MSNBC primetime.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 03:15 AM
Response to Reply #298
318. It happened in Connecticut and is a saturation story in the New York Post media market /nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cash_thatswhatiwant Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #93
192. yeah, it seems to be referring to that crazed monkey that's been in the news..NOT obama.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:16 PM
Response to Reply #192
257. So, where's the monkey-stimulus bill connection? nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:59 PM
Response to Reply #257
268. It's in the implication that the bill was so bad a chimp could have written it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
October Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #268
328. So they murder the author/chimp?
It fails in its logic.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #328
370. That's because that's not the message.
If it were, I would agree.

The death of the chimp is incidental, the message is that it was the chimp who wrote the bill... so they'd need another chimp. The most visible commentary, of course is that the bill sucked. I do not dismiss the possibility that the artist may have intended racist undertones, but they're pretty far 'under' considering the relevance of current events and the artist's known displeasure with the stim bill.

You did hear the story of the chimp shooting... right?


I'm wondering if many people were not aware of the incident, immediately saw the cartoon as 'racist' due to their ignorance of the incident, and then found themselves 'decided'.

I'll admit, if I didn't know about the shooting, that might have been my first conclusion as well.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
stevedeshazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #84
92. You're right. I choose to see racism, and I'm proud that I do.
You choose to ignore it, in fact defend it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #92
330. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Every Man A King Donating Member (534 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #84
104. So who does the chimp represent genius? n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:58 AM
Response to Reply #104
111. It is a commentary on the bill, not necessarily a description of it's authors.
But if you must draw direct comparisons, then I suppose it would represent congress.

If you want to believe it represents Obama, then by all means do so... and we can all be on guard for artists use of non-human primates for the next 8 years.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Every Man A King Donating Member (534 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #111
135. How do you know your interpretation is the authors intention? n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #135
148. Of that none of us can be absolutely certain.
The author has been bashing the stimulus bill consistently for a long time. So it stands to reason that his is a direct commentary on the bill.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bettyellen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #111
279. no, the cartoon implies that they just shot the author- it clearly refers to a singular writer
who else would that singular person be? everyone is referring to it as Obama's plan- you tell me how it;s not about him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #279
393. you are wrong...this bill is so closely identified as O's plan to fix the economy
It is called that by the corpmedia.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #84
183. Oh bullshit!
This is the NY Post, it has never missed a chance to show its ugly racist colors. It certainly does not deserve the benefit of the doubt although considering the imagery I would not give anyone the benefit of the doubt on this cartoon.

Frankly, your willingness to jump through hoops to defend them makes me wonder about {b]you.

Regards
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #183
270. LOL!
I'm not 'defending' anything, I'm applying reason.

If you don't understand what I'm saying, then wonder is all you will do.

Let me explain a simple test for this episode; Say McCain had become President ( :scared: ), the same chimp was shot, and this, or another artist chose to state his displeasure with a similar stimulus bill exactly the same way.

*POOF*

No racism.

What does this mean? It means that the perception of racism is based entirely on the fact that Obama is President... something completely out of the hands of the artist. It means that suddenly all artists have to screen their work just in case it might be interpreted as racist because Obama is President.

Your 'willingness' to engage in outrage and insinuation tells me that you aren't even qualified to 'wonder about me' Frankly, any such opinion that you might have, knowing nothing about me, and choosing to believe that I'm somehow defending racism, is absolutely worthless.

All I'm saying is that we have to make an assumption, and ignore the author's intent in order to be so certain of mal-intent to indulge in outrage.

Is it racist? There's no way to know for certain whether that was the author's intent. It certainly could have been. But the fact is that one cannot draw a material conclusion.

Since you're in outrage mode, as indicated by your subject line, I sincerely hope this hasn't gone over your head.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #270
277. By your logic, any and all racist imagery assigned to Obama would be voided
If someone hangs up a noose with Obama's name or picture attached, by your logic it can't be racist because what if they'd done the same for McCain??

If someone draws a picture of Michelle Obama looking like a chimpanzee, by your logic it can't be racist because what if they'd done the same for Cindy??

If someone calls the Obama kids "nappy headed hos" (and sadly, that has been done), by your logic it can't be racist because what if they'd done the same thing for Meghan McCain??

Do you see how faulty your logic is? There is a reason that certain imagery is defined as racist. It is because it has historical precedence aimed at members of certain communities. Someone putting up a swastika next to a picture of John McCain has a completely different context than it does if they put it next to Rahm Emmanuel. Someone alluding to internment camps when mentioning John McCain has a completely different context that it does if they mention it when speaking about Daniel Inouye.

And because of the racist overtones that have been well-documented throughout hundreds of years of Western history, using monkey references when speaking about black people will get you into trouble. Every single time.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bettyellen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #277
282. by his 'logic" , context doesn't even exist! and the cartonist racist history doesn;t matter...
i think he just admires the plausible deniability aspect.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #282
394. And therein lies the crux of the matter. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #277
283. Just the opposite. First, you aren't even differentiating between 'implicit' and 'explicit'.
"Explicit" are the three examples you gave. Those are certainly explicitly racist when applied to the Obamas, they are also direct regarding the McCains.

"Implicit" regards intention, and in this case, the only way to believe that the artist intended racism is to make an assumption that ignores the more explicit message in the depiction; that the stimulus bill was written by a psychotic chimp. Unlike your three examples, there is no direct reference whatsoever... so the stretch must be made by the reader.

Considering how many people were involved in the bill, it's a stretch to assume he's indicating Obama.
None of your first three examples are even likely if McCain ( :scared:) were President... and none of them, in either case, would be making any kind of a point.

This particular cartoon, however, was easily as likely given that all the referential elements are there; A dead chimp and a bad stimulus bill. The only reason to equate it with Obama is because Obama is President. Were McCain President, the message of the cartoon would be clear; "This bill sucks"... and no one would be throwing a fit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #283
286. The examples I gave could be construed as either implicit or explicit
There will always be those who will try to rationalize what is obvious to many.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:07 PM
Response to Reply #286
287. Ok, you're disqualified.

I'll try again; your examples are direct analogies, metaphors, and depictions.

The NYP toon has no direct reference to Obama at all.

That's the difference, in this case, between 'explicit' and 'implicit'... and it's still a stretch to say that the toon in any way implicates Obama any more than it does either congress or the bill alone. In fact, the reference to the bill is explicit, and it implies that the bill was poorly written.


If you don't know or can't tell the difference between explicit and implicit, then there's no point.

Believe what you will despite the lack of substance.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:31 PM
Response to Reply #287
299. Are you always this nasty or just when you're on the losing side of an argument?
You are the one who is contorting yourself into a damn pretzel trying to defend and find EXPLICIT racist imagery in this cartoon. I'm beginning to understand why you would need things to be so black and white because it appears that your analytic skills are a bit lacking.

The NYP toon has no direct reference to Obama at all.

Don't you find it even the slightest bit odd that you are the ONLY PERSON who feels that way? Who in God's name could that cartoon have been about, if not Obama?

As I stated in an earlier post, there are some who believe that because something may not have been DELIBERATELY created to be racist, that somehow makes it non-racist. That is simply not true. The creator of this cartoon may not have DELIBERATELY set out to make this a racist cartoon, but there is no doubt that it is racially tinged and very racially insensitive. Why? Because Obama is black and throughout history, images of monkeys have been used as a DELIBERATE way to insult black people. You were the one who foolishly imo brought up that this would not be considered racist if the author had drawn this cartoon in response to a McCain bill. I tried to post something other than "no shit" in an effort to be civil, but I see that I'm wasting my time.

Words matter. History matters. You not only refuse to see that, but you've also DELIBERATELY chosen to be nasty as hell because you've (rightfully) gotten your ass handed to you by about 100 different people in this thread. Please don't be angry at the rest of us because we are able to see the forest AND the damned trees.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:22 AM
Response to Reply #299
333. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #299
357. Nasty? Hardly. 'Nasty' is when people insinuate you're a racist
because you don't share their narrow interpretation.

You don't know the difference between explicit and implicit and you obviously don't know the difference between 'fact' and 'opinion'.
If you did, then you wouldn't call the fact that the NYP toon has no direct reference to Obama a 'feeling'.
Facts don't give a damn about anyone's feelings, and after I stated a fact, you called it a 'feeling'.

You also don't appear to know the difference between 'winning' and 'losing', because I can hardly 'lose' against someone that can't seem to understand the rules.

You've just tripled-down on your disqualification.

I have not been 'nasty' to anyone, what I've been is factual and rational. The only people who find that 'nasty' are those do consumed by outrage they can't tell the difference between things like 'facts' and 'feelings'.

It's you opinion that it's 'nasty' of me to point out the fact that you are deficient in this exchange, and I never get nasty until someone gets rude first.

So far, you've seen nothing 'nasty' from me except for facts. Other, more rational posters have managed to understand what I've said, but leave it to the rage junkies to see an enemy in anything they can't understand.

'Handed me my ass'... *PFFFT!*... hardly.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 04:42 PM
Response to Reply #357
362. LOL
What's funnier, or perhaps sadder?? Your insistence that I somehow don't know the difference between explicit and implicit (which is the weakest part of your entire pitiful argument) or your claim that no one has handed you your own ass despite at least 143 posts in this thread that say otherwise???

:rofl:

You sir, are completely dismissed. Your typo riddled posts in which you have the audacity to imply that you are somehow mentally superior to the rest of us are no longer worthy of my time or energy. And the fact that you topped off this entire asinine discussion with the standard "you insinuated that I am a racist!" when I did no such thing has displayed to every poster here what type of person you are. Pathetic.

If you had any sense at all, you would have quit this topic YESTERDAY but it's apparent that you've got attitude in spades, but sense is an entirely different matter altogether.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 08:33 PM
Response to Reply #362
366. You, a person who can't tell the difference between facts and feelings, are laughing at me?
Edited on Thu Feb-19-09 09:08 PM by The Doctor.
I'll go you one better;




You've actually demonstrated that you are ignorant of those distinctions. That's the difference between you and I. I can cite examples, link to posts, and paste excerpts... but when I ask people like you to do the same to back up your insinuations about me, you go after my typos. :wtf:

When I deal with global warming deniers, I am also accused of exhibiting 'attitude in spades' because the people I'm dealing with can't get the concept; "Heat=Energy". Yes, when I deal with people so devoid of understanding, I often appear to them to have 'attitude in spades'.

Your attempt at derision in order to stymie me does you no good at all because I have those pesky little things like 'facts' and 'reason' on my side.

You know what the truly sad part is?

You haven't even bothered to try to understand what my point is, instead opting to assume I've said something that justifies your totally misplaced outrage.


I know that this concept is alien to you, but if you had decided to attempt reason and ask questions, you know... be
rational instead of leaping to attack, you, like others, could have understood my point and had a constructive discussion. But you have made your inability to do so a fact, and you have shown that your blind outrage will drive you into and right back out of an argument.

Because the enraged can't deal with the rational. And that is a terrible weakness I'm sorry to see. Plenty of others have put me on 'ignore' because they know that they cannot back up their accusations or justify their attacks. For them, it is easier to ignore me than to admit they cannot, drop the blind rage, and actually discuss a given issue rationally.

You may as well admit you cannot deal rationally either and do the same.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 11:51 AM
Response to Reply #270
340. I don't find your (deliberate?) obtuseness the least bit funny
If McLame had become president the monkey wouldn't have been drawn in the first place and you know this. Your prolific excuse making is more than enough evidence for me to form quite the informed opinion about you. So don't worry, there is no wonder here, you are no better than the racist jackass you defend. I don't know which bubblegum machine you got the piece of paper you got your "doctor" credentials from but it's clear that this entire conversation is completely over your head and I'll leave the schooling to those who have the patience to deal with imbeciles.

I am not that one, so piss off.

Simple enough for ya doc?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #340
361. You're making assumptions you can't support.
The extant factors; a euthanized chimp, a poor economy, and a badly written stimulus bill could easily have precipitated a similar cartoon under McCain.

Saying he wouldn't have done this cartoon if Obama weren't President is a presupposition of racism on the artist's part... by you.

On the other hand, we can actually say with a degree of certainty that no one would be outraged over this same cartoon were McCain ( :scared:) in the White House.

I'm always amused when someone without a knack for relatively simple logic calls me an 'imbecile' and starts getting nasty. It says more about your disposition than it does mine. Would you like me to explain what I mean by that?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #361
390. There is nothing wrong with my ability to process logic
You are the one who started getting nasty so I return that which you've started. But as per usual your arrogance brought on by your belief that you are intellectually superior, precludes you from considering that you might be wrong. I'll make it real simple for your sorry ass and then I'm done with you. I don't like to waste time arguing with bigots or their sympathizers and you've wasted enough of my time on this topic.

1. Just because you disagree with the vast majority of people on a topic doesn't mean you're a free thinker. Sometimes it just means you're wrong. In this case, you are wrong.

2. You don't get to tell me what is or is not racist. I think I have more experience dealing with veiled (although this cartoon is not remotely veiled) racism than you do. I am sick and tired of jackasses like you who go on and on and on telling me why something that is clearly racist isn't. And as you can't stop yourself there's no need to continue with this.

3. You, as an apologist for racism are as bad as the racist who drew this cartoon. So you and your cartoon drawing, friend can kiss my black ass. I'm done with you. You're a small person trying to make yourself feel like a bigger person by attempting to bully others by pretending to be mentally superior. It's not working.

Piss off little person I'm done with you
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #390
398. Please, tell me where I 'Started getting nasty first', and if it is so, you'll have my apologies.
Other than that, I've never 'apologized' for racism, but I've seen plenty of instances where people cried 'wolf'.

My point, the entire time, has been that there is nothing explicitly racist in the cartoon, and it requires an assumption to conclude that it is. Was such the artist's intent? Neither you nor I know for sure.

You have not even attempted to understand my point, so it's quite impossible for me to take anything you have to say seriously.

Like I've said elsewhere, people like yourself seem to do away with reason so that you can feel free to vent your hatred on those who've committed no offense. I would challenge you to excerpt just what I've said that is 'offensive' or an 'apology for racism', but I know darn well that you can't. Instead you'll just say it's in my 'attitude' without even understanding anything that I've said.

I've seen otherwise nice people ruin their own day because they insisted they were being discriminated against when they were not... much to their embarrassment. If you want to see it everywhere then you will see it everywhere. If I didn't know about the chimp shooting, then I would easily conclude the same thing you have, but because I knew about it, like others, it just seemed a reference to current events as most cartoons are.

But you want to be offended so you can be offensive... as you have very well demonstrated. Well, have at it. Opinions based on selective cognition are generally worthless.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #183
332. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
happy2day Donating Member (13 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #84
210. I think that anyone
Who thought this was Obama as soon as they saw the Cartoon has a Racist personality or else the first thought in their head wouldn't have been Obama.
First thing I thought of was that the crazy Chimp that was shot, wrote the Pork filled Stimulus and it is so easy to write a screwed up Package that a Monkey could do it, I never dreamed of "The Cops shot Obama" until I read & heard everyone screaming Racism.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:06 PM
Response to Reply #210
269. That is asinine
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 09:06 PM by Raineyb
You don't have to be a racist to know a racist cartoon when you see one. But considering the RW talking points you're using I suppose it would be too asking too much to expect more than this weak sauce argument.

Regards

On edit: ran spellcheck
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Every Man A King Donating Member (534 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #84
219. Its a stretch to assume the chimp isn't Obama n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Elderon Donating Member (23 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #84
226. Well in my opinion and just an opinion
It's pretty obvious what reaction the author of that cartoon intended to get from his base.

and believe me... it's not a stretch or a reach to find that racially objectionable

Monkey - Stimulus - Obama

yeh... a stretch huh?


Fail
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tomreedtoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 07:58 AM
Response to Reply #84
326. One change could have saved the cartoonist.
If they had made one of the cops black, especially perhaps the shooter, it would have saved the situation. Remember how in South Park how their "racist" flag became non-racist?

This is the racist South Park flag:



And this is the non-racist flag:



But, of course, the New York Post couldn't imagine a black man being a police officer.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
populistdriven Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #69
96. i already have this person on ignored so i was spared
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #96
129. Goodness knows what effect reason may have had on you.
:eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #129
301. yes, your "reason" as you put it
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 11:19 PM by shellgame26
may have led her to realize without a certainty what a not so closeted racist you are. But Not to worry. Everyone has your number now.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #301
360. Wow.
You really have absolutely no idea, do you?

Here's the key to the truth; Show me exactly what I've said that indicates that I'm a 'closeted racist' to you, and I'll show you how intentionally oblivious to reason you are.

I won't hold my breath.

Meanwhile, I have plenty of friends and ex-lovers that would find your 'closet racist' accusation very amusing.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #360
372. Please
spare me the details about your ex-lovers. EVERYTHING you have said on this post indicates that your a TOTAL RACIST.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #372
373. So, you continue to make a claim you can't back up. Whatta shock.
You can't explain how anything I've said is racist, so you resort to the Anne Coulter school of screaming bullshit.

Your opinion is worthless.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #373
376. You've already proven that claim yourself
going out of your way to defend something that is so clearly offensive! It's funny that you would mention Ann COulter, she would probably agree with you! Keep on bloviating with your pseudo-intellectual crap and denying the long history of racist propaganda. I'm sure the holocaust didn't really happen in your world either.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #376
378. 1) I haven't 'defended' anything. 2) It's not 'clear.
That's all I've said. There's nothing 'clearly' offensive about this unless you assume the artist intended racism.

That may be the case. Right now, neither you or I know for sure... unless we make the stretch and assume a connection that is not explicitly there.

If the use of simple logic appears 'intellectual' to you, then perhaps it's time to go back to school.

I'll try and remember that if I want to dismiss what someone who knows more than I do is saying, all I need to do is call it 'psuedo-intellectual'.

I'm sure he'll have a good laugh too.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #378
381. You have the logic of a 3 year old
"if they did they same thing to Mccain, then that wouldn't be racist"
You are a fool!
For someone who (thinks) he knows so much, you know very little about history. Go and read up on the history of racist propaganda then come back and tell me the cartoon wasn't EXPLICITY racist.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #381
399. That you have to resort to misquoting me is telling.
It tells me that you have no idea what I've said, and instead have superimposed your perception on both the cartoon and this thread.

It's a shame that the 'logic of a three year-old' escapes you.

In history, racist assholes have referred to black people as 'chimps', 'monkeys', 'apes' etc. Also in history, cartoonists have put animals in cartoons... including non-human primates, for purposes other than disparaging people.

Here's what's fascinating about your post;

You have decided, before any other consideration, that this was "done to" Obama. That much is obvious. What your perception filter has created is an absolute presumption of intent... which is why you imagine that this cartoon would be directed at McCain were he President. It can't occur to you, even on the stage of an alternate scenario, that the cartoon represents any other commentary than the one you've decided it must... despite the fact that there is no reference to the President unless you presume intent.

Basically, you made up your mind based on one piece of criteria and only because Obama is President. Everyone, yourself included, is in a heightened state of prejudice because Obama is in office. I can't blame anyone for that, and I'm sure that the 'dogwhistle' theory may hold water. But again; to conclude that the artist's intent was 'racism' requires making presumptions about his intent rather than relying on what's in the depiction. As I say; "Were McCain President, this cartoon would just indicate the artist's distaste for the stim bill." No one would think it was 'done to' McCain.

If what you're saying is that no one can put a non-human primate in any cartoon or commentary for the next eight years, no matter how innocent, simply because Obama is President, then say so and we can discuss that rationally. If you just want to insult and accuse, then feel free. Only one of those choices deserves respect.

Try asking questions if you don't understand what I'm saying, I'll answer them honestly and you will see my intentions are fair and reasonable.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #399
401. Are you really this ignorant or just dumb?
Edited on Fri Feb-20-09 10:29 PM by shellgame26
"If what you're saying is that no one can put a non-human primate in any cartoon or commentary for the next eight years, no matter how innocent, simply because Obama is President"

Are you suggesting that using racist images is some new phenomenon? For you to even suggest the "innocence" of the cartoon tells me something about your own filtering system.

As for resorting to insults, Your feelings are hurt. boo hoo, Don't throw stones if you live in a glass house.

And since you're obviously not aware, there is a difference between missquoting and paraphrasing.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #401
402. Oh my....
I'm sorry, I really did laugh my ass off there. So when you put your "paraphrase" of my actual words, and put words that aren't mine in quotes as though they were mine, you're not actually misquoting me?

Wow

(BTW; since were on the 'language' subject, 'Miss' Quoting was born in 1832 in Bristol, lived to 18 years and died of pneumonia.

Look, I'll never pretend to be perfect. See... I admit it; "I'm not perfect"... There.

But you've, ummm... kind of obviously misquoted me again because you haven't learned how to read a sentence with commas. I'm not picking on your grammatical failure, I'm pointing out that it showed up because you deliberately removed text from the statement.

That's pretty low. Most people around here got wise to that sort of tactic over the last eight years.

Here's the whole thing; "If what you're saying is that no one can put a non-human primate in any cartoon or commentary for the next eight years, no matter how innocent, simply because Obama is President, then say so and we can discuss that rationally. If you just want to insult and accuse, then feel free. Only one of those choices deserves respect."

But this;
"Are you suggesting that using racist images is some new phenomenon?" - says everything. You saw "Chimp=Racist" because Obama is President, and that was it. As you have been dodging, all the elements were there and easily could have been under a McCain administration. A bad economy, a controversial stim bill, and that chimp was gonna blow one day. Cartoonists always draw upon current events to make a point. Was it tasteful? Ummm... notsomuch. But, as I've stated, and the logic is solid; The only extant factor that makes this appear 'racist', is that Obama is President.

Even HE would agree that regardless of the tastefulness, or lack thereof, of the cartoon, public perception of the intent of the artist is altered by Obama being President.

It's really that simple.

It doesn't mean I don't think it may be racist, but until I know more about the artist and his prior work and attitudes, it's not enough to get out my pitchfork.

Neither you nor anyone can find anything explicitly racist that I've ever excused.

In fact, you'll find just the opposite. But if you're a rage-monger, you'll avoid even trying to back up your asinine opinions.

That's why I find your mindless attacks toothless.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #402
404. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-09 02:21 AM
Response to Reply #404
407. So you can't answer the questions?
Of course.

Focus on my admittedly sorry sense of humor if you must, but I've asked you a few questions and made a few points... and all you can do is insult and attack my family.

Done with you.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #96
391. Lucky you. You didn't miss anything.
This person is literally nothing.

Regards
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
whistler162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:08 PM
Response to Reply #69
252. Don't people refer to a certain ex-President as
the chimp?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Pool Hall Ace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #252
331. That is what I was thinking.
Many of us have referred to Bush as the Chimp. Then again, I'm not familiar with this cartoonist's work, and I can't determine whether the intent is racist or not.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
genna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #252
343. How about the website THE SMIRKING CHIMP?
It is one of the reasons I stayed away from calling W anything in the animal kingdom. I might have slipped and called him a jack ass but I'm not sure about that one.


I stay away from any monkeys, apes, or primordial man because these images of AAs are too deeply held to just throw them out there. I haven't gotten over some of the intra racial terms AAs give/identify each other with, but Rev. Al I am working on it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #252
369. That had merit...
It was based on his chimp-like disposition.

Referring to Obama as a chimp is unrealistic on every level, and would therefore be quite racist.

The NYP cartoon, however, does not refer to Obama as a chimp unless the reader makes the stretch to interpret it that way.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yes We Did Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #34
72. Seriously?
wow.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:27 AM
Response to Reply #34
82. The insinuation is that the bill was so poorly written that it could have been written by monkeys...
And it was written in part, by the first black president. Black people have been referred to as monkeys by ignorant racists. Its not a giant leap to see that they were trying to say something else.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #82
88. If the insinuation that EVERYONE who had a hand in the bill is a 'monkey', then
it's a pretty universal insult. That's not 'racist'.

I call my own children 'my little monkeys', I call all children 'monkeys', does that make me racist?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:36 AM
Response to Reply #88
95. Apples and Oranges.
There are lines you don't cross because of the historical context of it. There is a historical context to blacks being called monkeys by racists. So yes...if you caricature a monkey to represent a black person, then it is far from harmless.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #95
114. But the chimp wasn't "caricatured to represent a black person".
That's you choosing the artist's intent.

The intent is clear; the bills authors sucked.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #114
122. The author of the bill was a black person. The person being shot in the cartoon is a monkey.
Racists people call black people monkeys to degrade them. Yes, I believe the intent of the author was to be controversial and that is what he has done.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #122
127. The bill had many 'authors'.
Perhaps if it was written soley by Obama, there would have been nothing to criticize.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
traxster Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #127
130. And if he had lined up a bunch of monkeys, and labeled them "Congress" then it would have been clear
He did not do that, so now the author has to understand that they were will be some issue. And the mere fact that SO many people see it and its not just an isolated thought should let you know that it is not a far stretch that he has crossed the line.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #130
141. I haven't dismissed the possibility that the author is an asshole.
But I just went through three months of his work and the worst I can say about it is it borders on tasteless sometimes. This one example is not enough to make such a judgment.

The fact that he didn't label the chimp is just as likely because he was commenting more on the character of the bill than on it's authors.

I've seen plenty of racism, and plenty of people seeing it where it is not.

A black man was acting like an asshole in a hospital once. I told him to chill out because he was acting like an asshole. Guess what he called me... 'racist'.

No, I didn't say he was an asshole because he was black, I said it because he was an asshole.

The artist is making a direct commentary on the character of the bill. Perhaps he really is racist and found recent news a convenient baffle, but that still requires looking past the more direct intent.

For the next 8 years, any chimp in a political cartoon is going to set off the 'RACISM!' brigade regardless of intention. That's what we're seeing now.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
genna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #88
346. We must have argued this point on HuffPo last year
BTW, I think my membership was restored sometime after that.

Dude, just because you have the bad taste in calling your children, family, or your loved ones names like this...barely justifies your belief that other people call people the same names for the same reasons. It seems that you want to exist outside of history. FINE, DO THAT.

For the rest of us who live inside today's context which is steeped in historical memory (that really was a mouthful), your opinion is noted and understood but it is wrong for the nation.

For the comment earlier in thread that discussed a woman calling her black neighbor's children "monkey" or "monkeys" being deserving of that old fashioned whipping she received, probably correct. I don't condone violence for the sake of violence. The town sanctioned the name thrower for being inflammatory. I suggest you rethink your strategy in your neighborhood when you are calling your loved one affectionate names who other people can be offended by. Your love might be mistaken by other people as hate.

One way for cartoonist to avoid the label is to dial down the private love in public places.


Take note: most of this entry was sarcastic for the mere reason that this loved one excuse is so flimsy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #346
371. ??? That was strange.
What you're saying is that I'm not allowed to affectionately refer to my own kids as monkeys when they're climbing all over me (in case you weren't aware, there's this 'evolution' thing that makes all of us closely related to other primates) as 'monkeys' because some in society will deliberately decide that I'm insulting them.

Yes, that is your point. I get it. "We in society must be careful of what we say because someone could choose to interpret it as an insult."

I used to do this thing for kicks when I was younger; someone would say something, anything, like; "I just got a new blender today!", and I'd suddenly become sad and morbid and mourn; "I watched my brother lose his hand in a blender when we were kids.". The speaker would suddenly feel guilty and apologize for bringing up her new blender. Then, after an interminable few seconds, I'd say, "nah... just pulling your leg.".

Try it sometime, if you sell it, it works every time.

The point?

If we decided that we had to censor our speech because someone might choose to interpret any given thing we said as an attack, we would be a silent society.

I call children 'monkeys' sometimes, because they sometimes act like monkeys, not because they're black. Being 'colorblind' might get me in trouble sometimes because I treat everyone the way I treat anyone. If every time I opened my mouth I had to consider my audience and screen what I said 'just in case' it might offend someone, then I would be deferring to color, wouldn't I? That wouldn't be colorblind, would it?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
olkaz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #34
102. Exactly.
Now I'm going to sit back and watch while everyone bloviates.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #102
118. You know what?
Me too.

There's no way to reason with witch hunters anyhow.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bullwinkle428 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:12 PM
Response to Reply #34
178. Well, "Doctor", at least you're consistent - both racism and homophobia
are pretty much non-existent these days, according to you.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #178
359. Why lie?
Oh, I know why... you can't hate or be outraged without ignoring the substance of what I've said.

Show me where I EVER said anything about racism or homophobia being 'non-existent'.

You can't.

I really get sick of pointing out how not one of you outrage junkies can back up your twisted opinions of me. Don't think I should call you that? Then stop lying, back up your claims, and start using rational dialogue.

If you can't do that, then the shoe fits.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CLANG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #34
222. Well, then who was the monkey supposed to remind us of?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #222
375. The Chimp that was shot the other day. It's been all over the news.
If I didn't know about that incident, I'd think the same thing you did.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JayMusgrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:32 PM
Response to Reply #34
262. So, how many Republcians were shot in the NY Post in the last 8 years?
in cartoons?
Give me a list of them. Even any that were portrayed as human beings?

Oh wait, those were Republicans. None of them were shot in cartoons.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #34
263. The clear and irrefutable evil in this unsigned "cartoon"
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 09:14 PM by ooglymoogly
is that Obama and black folks in general are monkeys. I see no insinuation whatsoever in this cartoon that it was an attempt to say the bill was poorly written; How you can minimize the malevolence of this pile of elephant crap is beyond me. The "bill" is the identification marker to Obama and that pugs do not like the bill and this cartoon is a cracker kind of justice that only someone as sick as a ku klux clan member would try to pass off as humor. What; They thought a monkey hanging by the neck from a tree might be to disgusting for folks to handle with that ridiculous caption?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 10:07 PM
Response to Reply #263
377. Huh... I've 'minimized' nothing. Here's what's fascinating to me;
You say that you "see no insinuation whatsoever in this cartoon that it was an attempt to say the bill was poorly written", yet the cop clearly and directly indicates that the bill was written by a psychotic chimp. If you can't see how that is commenting on the bill, then perhaps you should think it through again.

If a student turned in a paper, and I asked him 'Why'd you have a chimp write this?", the insinuation is very clear. If the student thinks I'm telling him I thought a black student wrote it, then that student should examine his perspective.

LOTS of people don't like the bill... especially the artist. That doesn't mean that mentioning the bill is any direct reference to Obama. If you have something that makes the case besides supposition, then I'm all ears. I'm just not convinced one way or the other whether all the screaming rage is justified.

I'm guessing you made up your mind about this before you knew about the chimp shooting the other day too?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #377
392. The clear indication is not that the bill was written poorly
whether or not it was; The insinuation was correctly identified in your later paragraphs as something the pugs do not like period, no matter how it was written. But now we are delving into the pug mind of the cartoonist. The fact that it was clear to any honest editor that the cartoon was, in the least, offensive to most people and especially to blacks; Editors who should have squelched the cartoon even on the ambiguousness alone. That we have called B*sh a chimp all these years is a red herring; He is white and there is no mistake implied or otherwise as to the meaning of that humor. Blacks have for over a century been cartooned as monkeys; O is black and this bill is considered by most to be his doing, so the whole effect of the cartoon is plain pug malice no matter what cover story they contrive. Yes I did write the post before I learned or connected it to the chimp shooting but still hold that the cartoon was offensive on too many levels to ever have been published.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #392
400. I understand. That brings us to the next point.
Saying that something appears to be written by a psychotic chimp is a commentary on both the bill and its authors. That's a fairly simple and obvious fact.

If we can agree on that, we can get to the next point.

Is it possible the author meant to single out Obama? Sure, but it's also a simple fact that there is no direct reference to him in the cartoon. If it weren't for the shooting that occurred earlier in the week, then the indirect reference would be fairly obvious. The next question is; did the artist knowingly use the incident to deliberately make such an inference?

The fact is, we don't know. As I've said before; if there is evidence this guy's a racist asshole, then I'll certainly agree that was his intent. I personally went through a couple months of his work, from December to February, and didn't find anything that seemed even remotely racist. That's by no means definitive though.

It's quite possible that he, like all political cartoonists, used a current event to make a point. Had the victim been a pig (perfectly representative of the bill's authors), the point would have been much better, but 'psychotic chimp' is a fairly harsh commentary on the nature of the bill and its authors as well.

Those questions may not be answered, but perhaps time will tell more about this person.

Meanwhile, an interesting question comes out of all of this; "Must all artists, columnists, and commentators carefully screen their depictions for words or images that could be construed as 'racist', no matter how otherwise innocent they are, simply because Barack Obama is President?"
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-09 01:40 AM
Response to Reply #400
405. Hmmmm...posing an argument....The dilemma then is; Are we now
Edited on Sat Feb-21-09 02:06 AM by ooglymoogly
to limit our "humor" to safe subjects as regards to blacks? My reply to that is; That blacks have suffered enough at the hands of cracker cartoonists and that such ambiguous cartoons as this one is in spades; Should be, at the very least, screened to weed out most obvious and careless, hypocritical insults, whether real or so easily perceived; To blacks who more than and always have carried their weight in our society, like many of our other parts, have made it something far grander than it would have been without them and all of us pulling together. For that we owe them, at the very least our respect and gladness that they are an integral and indispensable part of us and a part of that which makes this country great; Despite B*sh and his disastrous and criminal ilk tearing at the very fabric of our republic.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-09 03:03 AM
Response to Reply #405
409. Now there's a brilliant piece of prose... for all its breathlessness and grit.
Absolutely.

It's late, and this deserves a more thoughtful response. Looking forward to responding after sleep.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #34
264. Yeah right, those that are offended shouldn't be. Give me a break. nm
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
October Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 08:39 AM
Response to Reply #34
327. Well the "murder" aspect is chilling
Especially when combined with the wording. I was confused, and asked myself "Ok, who wrote the plan, and why are the cops killing him"? It's a poor editorial cartoon, and fails because it's not clear. I later read of the chimp attack, but then the cartoon makes less sense.

It's offensive before you even consider the racial aspect.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Rockholm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:51 AM
Response to Reply #3
147. I don't get it either.
And sorry, I don't go looking for hidden meanings in everything I see.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:20 AM
Response to Original message
4. oh crap that is NOT FUNNY at all.
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 09:22 AM by bdamomma
and saying "Sorry" is not going to cut it either. The person who did this should be terminated.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Optical.Catalyst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 06:53 AM
Response to Reply #4
324. There is no humor in that cartoon.
It lacks humor on so many levels.

It is simply deplorable.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Optical.Catalyst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 06:53 AM
Response to Reply #4
325. Oops, duplicate
Edited on Thu Feb-19-09 06:54 AM by Optical.Catalyst
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:21 AM
Response to Original message
5. I can't believe they ran that in the paper!
That is blatantly racist, imo!

Go get'em Al!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
skooooo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:22 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. Not only racist..

..but treasonous, imo.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #11
23. Yah - I thought "just joking" about killing the President was NOT a defense?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:53 AM
Response to Reply #23
45. That's not supposed to represent the President.
The point is that the stimulus bill was written as though by an enraged chimp.

Or are we saying that for the next eight years, no one will be allowed to put any primates other than humans in political cartoons?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #45
49. Thank you for proving my prediction correct.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #49
56. What do you mean?
How is the chimp supposed to represent the President?

Seriously... are you saying that no artist can put a primate other than humans in a political cartoon for the next eight years regardless of intentions?

This is not deliberately racist if one makes an effort to understand it rather than fixating on the fact that there's a chimp in it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Elderon Donating Member (23 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #56
229. Well
The insight you have on the author of this Cartoon is amazing.

You literally know exactly how his mind functions!!

Kudos!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #229
374. Actually, you have that exactly backwards.
All I've been saying all along is that we don't know... that I don't know, and that you don't know 'exactly how his mind functions'.

The folks, like you I presume, who have decided the artist is racist despite the relevance of the imagery and no direct connection to Obama are the ones who assume they know the author's intentions.

It's really something to watch people twist and invert logic to support their assumptions. Are you another such person?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Elderon Donating Member (23 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #374
396. Sure
Are you not playing the same game as I?

Look into the Mirror Doc
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 05:04 PM
Response to Reply #396
397. I'm playing no games.
I'll admit that this really is a fascinating study in perception. People seeking the catharsis of directed rage will see much that is not there. This may be worthy of a paper.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
skooooo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #45
67. People can and will interpret it different ways....

...despite your "clarification."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #67
80. People can interpret it however they like, but
they have to ignore the intended message of the cartoon and read into it in order to arrive at the conclusion that it was deliberately racist.

Like I said; If it were a rabid dog that was shot the other day, we wouldn't be having this discussion. Now we get to spend the next eight years decrying every instance of a primate not human in a political cartoon... no matter how innocent it may be.

People who want to be outraged will always find an excuse to be.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #80
89. And people who choose to be blind to racism always find an excuse to say they...
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 10:34 AM by Spazito
aren't blind, everyone else is overreacting, 'Nothing to see here, move along'.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #89
105. Then, like I've asked before... how is it racist? Simply because there's a chimp?
That makes all zoos racist. They lock up their chimps, that means they think all black people should be locked up!

-Same stretch you have to make to see this is racist.


I've seen too many people actually overreact to perceived racism to think all such claims are valid.

One such incident involved a group of ladies who came into a restaurant I worked at years ago. Two of them ordered the special, Chicken, extra crispy. It was pretty popular that day, and preparing it took an extra ten to fifteen minutes. One of the ladies became very upset when she was told she'd have to wait, and started insinuating that the restaurant was 'racist'. After my manager tried to mollify them, the one lady convinced her friends to get up and leave. Her outrage would not be placated.

As they stood up, their waitress brought the lunch special, chicken, extra crispy, to a gentleman at the table right next to them who had been waiting patiently while the others at his table were already eating. "Here you are, thank you so much for waiting... is there anything else I can get you?"

The ladies left... not a little embarrassed.

The point is that when people see 'racism' or bigotry where it is not, they show a narrow-mindedness, an unwillingness to see another perspective. Sometimes a visual cue, like a chimp, overwhelms perception by virtue of it's possible implications, and the simpler, less insidious message is discarded.

That has clearly happened here.


I know I can't reason with outrage.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #105
110. Please provide me with examples of chimps 'writing stimulus bills'...
and I will agree this was not grotesquely and knowingly racist. I will look forward to your evidence.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #110
126. That makes no logical sense.
The point is simple; 'The bill was written as though by a crazy chimp'.

Like I said, I call my kids 'monkeys' all the time, how does that make me racist?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #126
131. LOL, you do seem to have a vested interest in defending this...
interesting. My post made perfect sense given your pathetic attempts to whitewash what is clearly a racist cartoon.

As to what you call your kids, it has NOTHING to do with the subject at hand, nice try though.

Please carry on defending the indefensible, the hole you are digging just keeps getting deeper.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #131
155. There's nothing 'clearly racist' about saying a monkey wrote the bill
because many people wrote the bill.

Like I said, I call all children monkeys... how does that make me racist?

As for 'defending' anything... I'm not. I'm just pointing out that in order to see racism here, one has to make assumptions. Whether those assumptions are correct or not cannot be determined merely from this cartoon.

The clearest message in the cartoon is that the bill sucked. I'll go with that message rather than make an ass of myself by drawing conclusions based on a subjective interpretation. Nor will I contribute to the artist's popularity the way people in this thread seem determined to do.

I think that it's quite possible that the author isn't racist, but found a perfect way to push people's buttons and raise his stock.

I don't let people push my buttons the way that some here do until the crime is substantial. The assumption being made is not... that is the nature of assumption.

As for those who think I'm somehow 'racist' for pointing these things out, their opinions are of no value because those are derived from assumptions and outrage.

So rage away.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #105
139. Well....
Every cartoonist working understands that black people have been portrayed as monkeys in cartoons for a couple of hundred years in this country.

Your entire stance can be exposed for the flaccid pseudo-intellectual pap it is with a visit to the Museum of Tolerance.

:hurts:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #139
142. ???
Right, so no chimps are allowed in political cartoons for the next 8 years because it's automatically a racist reference to Obama regardless of context. :eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #139
281. "flaccid pseudo-intellectual pap"
Oh SH*T!! Ladies and gents, may I present the phrase of the decade! :rofl:

That was awesome. :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 02:34 AM
Response to Reply #281
317. THANKYOUVERYMUCH......I'll be here all week,
please be sure to tip your wait person......
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 10:17 PM
Response to Reply #139
379. Wow... that's like calling a dislike for bee stings 'cognitive dissonance'.
You have no idea what you're even saying.

Maybe if, instead of just tossing out insults, you actually tried to rationally dispute what I've said, or at least understand it, you'd have some credibility.

At this point your opinion, and that of the one who can't tell the difference between 'facts' and 'feelings', is completely worthless.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-22-09 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #139
414. Very nice.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Politicalboi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #80
235. He never would have drawn the cartoon
Had it been a dog. It's only because it was a monkey that he did it. He took the opportunity to get himself that 15 minutes of fame. I hope it backfires big time for him. I know the NY Post won't fire him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #11
79. I agree!
I am truly shocked.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:21 AM
Response to Original message
6. OMG. They actually ran that?
:wow:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AllieB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:21 AM
Response to Original message
7. This is outrageous.
Who was the editor that allowed that to be printed? His ass should be fired immediately.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
n2doc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:21 AM
Response to Original message
8. Why is this kind of racist crap even published?
What is the Post, some kind of time warped rag from the 1920's?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kimmylavin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:47 AM
Response to Reply #8
38. Yeah, pretty much.
Its just about a step back from the Enquirer.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #8
48. An exercise; "How is it racist?"
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
n2doc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #48
61. ok, slowly now
Who is responsible for the last stimulus plan- Obama. How have blacks been characterized in the past- As Monkeys. The implication in the cartoon is that a monkey wrote the last stimulus plan.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #61
75.  Obama didn't write the bill.
You assume that because it's a chimp, then it must represent Obama. The reason for the chimp is that it's top news.

If it was a rabid dog that was shot the other day, and the artist used the dog, explain how that would be racist?

Certainly there are racist assholes that compare black people to chimps, does that mean that every depiction of a chimp is racism?

Of course not.

Is it possible that was the artist's intent? Sure, but it's not likely when held up against the more logical analogy; "The stimulus bill sucks, it's as though an enraged chimp wrote it."

Now there are a bunch of people making fools of themselves because they deliberately perceive what is not necessarily there. I know that now I'm to be called a racist because I don't automatically join in on the grouprage, but that's the price of perspective, I guess.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #75
90. Keep in mind the media and Obama has said it's HIS own.
There is no wanting to see something. Second of all the Post has done stuff like this in the past. This is nothing new of them. And you continuously defend their act when they are blatantly implying something. They could have have taken anything not a chimp since I've never heard of that analogy. Second, again this is very typical of The Post and they've been called on it before...but always there are people who defend their actions as though it's a-okay.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #90
162. Lol! Well, I never said it was 'a-ok'.
All I'm saying is that the simple message is that the bill sucked. The term 'a monkey could do it' has no racist connotations. The cartoon obviously says 'a monkey did it'. (yes... chimp, same thing)

Did the artist have an ulterior motive?

I don't know. That's the point... one has to reach, to make assumptions in order to come to that conclusion.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hileeopnyn8d Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #75
98. "Obama didn't write the bill"
You know, you can say that over and over again, but the fact remains that EVERYONE associates this bill with him.

Republican politicians have repeatedly whined about how "he" wasn't being bi-partisan, how the bill came from or was written by the "White House" aka President Obama, how it had all of "his" pet projects in it. He went on television, to townhalls around the country, all in an effort to promote "his" stimulus bill.

You can say we're not being logical, but I think you are very, very mistaken as to who that chimp is meant to represent.

I do believe what you've presented will be the excuse given by the newspaper, but that doesn't make the cartoon any less disgusting.

The shooting alone makes it abhorrent.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
greguganus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #75
163. One problem is not everyone who saw this cartoon knows about the shot chimp story.
I didn't hear about the shot chimp story. Maybe if I had, I would have thought different of this cartoon, maybe not.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #163
204. Right, that's the funny thing about perception. It also depends on which one is exposed to first...
I suppose if I knew nothing about the chimp story, I'd be scratching my head wondering why this guy was so blatantly racist. Many people, after they've formulated their opinion can't revise it very easily.

Good point.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hansel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #204
265. Actually, knowing about the chimp story makes me scratch my head even more.
There is a woman in the hospital with her face and hands half eaten off as a result of the chimp. I'm scratching my head as to how the "cartoonist" would think taking a symbol from this tragic event and inserting it into some completely unrelated political statement was supposed to be humorous.

Why not use the plane crash in Buffalo? Wouldn't that have been 50 times as funny? :sarcasm:

The cartoon is not funny in any way. And the cartoonist knows his audience.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:50 PM
Response to Reply #265
267. Oh, I agree, there's very little 'humor' in the piece.
The simple point- 'the stimulus package sucks' barely warranted the depiction.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #48
191. The word "niggardly" isn't racist either.
But you'd better be damn careful how you use it. If you were to tell a black person "quit being so niggardly", could they not reasonably assume you were trying to start something?

I'm leaning towards this being innocent (having found out about the escaped monkey story, which provides the much needed context) but I'm still not convinced the artist wasn't trying to carry the analogy farther. But he's got plausible deniability, so his ass is covered regardless. Nothing to do but shake my head and move on.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:04 AM
Response to Reply #191
304. Of course
Because in your world Blacks are all semi-literates who couldn't possibly know the meaning of "niggardly".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
last_texas_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 01:22 AM
Response to Reply #304
312. Or maybe he's just making the reasonable assumption that most people
of all races don't know the meaning of the word "niggardly," but that black people would have more reason to be offended than those of other races by being called a word that sounds like the n-word?

:shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #304
338. Wow, that's quite an assumption you jumped to there.
I'm saying nothing at all regarding literacy. I'm saying that it could be used, because of being a near homonym to the most racist word in our language, as a way to poke at a person of color and deny you were doing it.

Pretend for a moment I'm black. I've got a good vocabulary, including the word "niggardly", which I know should have no racial overtones whatsoever. I'm at a store with a white acquaintance. Maybe somebody I work with. As I'm being checked out, I complain to the cashier about a recent 1 cent raise in sales tax. The guy I'm with says, "Jeez, Dave, don't be so niggardly."

Now, why did he use a vernacularly obscure word that closely resembles the big daddy of racial slurs? Why not miserly? Why not something much more common, like stingy, or cheap? These all mean basically the same thing, but he chose to use a word that' pretty rare in modern English (probably because of it's similarity to that other word). Would I not be justified in considering that it was probably a passive-aggressive (emphasis on the aggressive) attack?

That's all I'm saying.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #338
339. O.k I'll give you that 'bro
Having taught school in Ny it is rare to find a young person possessing much of a Dickensian lexicon. But it's a sad statement on public education for sure.
BUt what the hell, it's a weird-ass word any way you look at it!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #8
241. ask Ruppert Murdoch
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Demi_Babe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:21 AM
Response to Original message
9. you have go to be kidding me...this actually ran? SICK!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dcindian Donating Member (881 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #9
71. A quick run through his political cartoons shows ya what he is all about.
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 10:20 AM by dcindian
Opps
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #71
123. That would be telling.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dcindian Donating Member (881 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #9
74. A quick run through his political cartoons shows you what he is like.
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 10:21 AM by dcindian
another opps.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Thrill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
10. Its hard to imagine. Anyone would think this was a smart thing to run
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #10
185. Well it is the NY Post which may as well be a subsidiary of Faux News.
This rag has been this way for years. Unfortunately, I am not surprised.

Regards
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #185
216. Yup, tabloid Rupert Murdoch at his finest - yuck. -eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
12. Whoa. Hardcore.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Aloha Spirit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:23 AM
Response to Original message
13. There was that chimpanzee that was taken down yesterday...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:24 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Yup. I assume that'll be their "benefit of the doubt" line, that white folks will use...
to excuse this.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:25 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. yes, but what does that chimpanzee have to do with writing a stimulus bill?
the chimp that was killed yesterday didn't run in political circles, if I'm not mistaken.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:27 AM
Response to Reply #16
18. Exactly. Absolutely nothing. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #16
20. Nothing. And everybody knows it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Aloha Spirit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #16
21. You are correct. Only someone with a twisted mind would be able to decipher its meaning.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
high density Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:46 AM
Response to Reply #16
37. Person who wrote the bill = Xanax Chimp
Which I guess is Nancy Pelosi?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:00 AM
Response to Reply #37
51. You realize that comparing Pelosi to an enraged chimp is racist, right?
I don't know how... but I'm sure it is.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #16
50. The insinuation is that it was a bad bill.
Would it be racist to say; "This bill looks like it was written by an enraged chimpanzee."?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #50
99. question: what kind of "doctor" are you?
I think I want a second opinion.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:46 AM
Response to Reply #99
101. LOL!
:thumbsup:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AspenRose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #99
103. Oooh, snap
:rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #99
121. The kind that doesn't give in to grouprage.
And it's apparent you only want one opinion on this issue... the one that reaffirms your perspective. In that case, no Doctor can help you.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #121
221. No, you just give in to 'group racism and homophobia'. You're a real "individual."
:eyes:

You can also be skeptical that 2+2=4, that doesn't make you a critical thinker.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #99
175. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
stlsaxman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #99
249. I think they call them "turkey doctors"- you know, the kind that would flay the skin off living...
humans because the freshest ones make the best lampshades and descendants of David better till.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:05 AM
Response to Reply #50
305. Yes, and all those that are offended should be ashamed of themselves. nm
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:24 AM
Response to Original message
15. ok now let's bombard them with e-mails.
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 09:36 AM by bdamomma
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sarge43 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #15
41. FWIW, this is my letter
"Stimulus 'cartoon'

In case you were asleep during all your American history classes, portraying African-Americans as primates was a common habit of racists and, it seems, still is.

It doesn't take an advanced degree in astrophysics to figure out the connotation.

Have you no shame, at long last sir, have you no shame?"
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #41
52. great letter we need more,
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sarge43 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #52
60. Thanks. I'm sorry I missed the assassination implication.
The MiBs should pay the editor a visit. They rousted a high school kid for an online silly picture of Bush. Editor should get minimum a "We're not amused" warning.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #60
115. that is very sad the implication of assassination.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:22 AM
Response to Reply #15
306. Get a list of all the ads posted in the NY Post today
and send them emails too.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
billyoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:25 AM
Response to Original message
17. Rupert Murdoch at his best.
:puke:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #17
36. I doubt he would approve this.
He knows better and likes his powerful friends. It's the idiotic cartoonist and editors that are responsible.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
billyoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:53 AM
Response to Reply #36
46. Watch and see if anyone is punished for this.
I promise you, Murdoch will do nothing about it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #46
217. I agree. This is pure Murdoch. -eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Connie_Corleone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:27 AM
Response to Original message
19. WTF??
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ellacott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:29 AM
Response to Original message
22. I was about to post this
I also heard it on Tom Joyner this morning. This is inexcusable
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #22
26. link to Al's site (which I forgot to put in the OP)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mystieus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:31 AM
Response to Original message
25. Some would look at this as a death threat to our president.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #25
59. Yeap, "wrote" the stimulus bill...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Billsmile Donating Member (63 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #59
233. On the page before the cartoon...
Is a giant half page photo of President Obama signing the stimulus bill.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
catgirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #25
106. I agree

This strong suggestion equals a threat. This is upsetting and shocking. They should be shut
down.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
marylanddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
27. unfuckingbelievable.

it is both racist & treasonous (assassination implication)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
28. Kick their ass, Reverend. That is unacceptable.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TheCowsCameHome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:33 AM
Response to Original message
29. New York Post - what else is there to know?
Did anyone expect something different?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mira Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:33 AM
Response to Original message
31. K&R while choking on vomit
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jennicut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
32. This actually happened in Stamford,CT
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 09:37 AM by Jennicut
I live about an hour away from there. It was a sad story. Apparently the chimp was out of control (he was a pet) and a neighbor tried to help. She got mauled and is in critical condition at a nearby hospital. The police had to shoot it. This "cartoon" is disgusting.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tatiana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:39 AM
Response to Original message
33. So a "chimp" wrote the stimulus bill? This is unacceptable.
The assumption drawn is that our President is a chimp. This is outrageous!

And I wonder how many cartoons like this ran we really did have a pResident that looked like a chimp in office...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
35. This is going to get ugly
I'd say that's pretty overtly racist.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The_Commonist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
39. There's another layer to this story that y'all are missing.
It's not just some random comparing black people to chimps cartoon.
There was a BIG story here in New York yesterday and the day before about a pet chimp that went nuts and the police had to shoot it.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,494067,00.html

Of course, that gave this cartoonist the "excuse" to compare black people to chimps, but it's not just totally out of the blue...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #39
44. you're certainly late to the party
you need to scroll up
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ecstatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:09 AM
Response to Reply #39
63. sorry. not following your logic
There's no connection between a chimp running wild in NY, black people, and the author of the stimulus bill.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sarge43 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #63
91. Recommend you google Obama's name, then go to Images,
then count the number of pictures portraying him as a chimp or monkey. If you have the stomach for it, then go to the sites using those pictures.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #91
117. Remember that stuffed animal that was being sold during the Primaries?!
Same bullshit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
demokatgurrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #39
73. I- and I'm sure most of the others here- KNEW about that story
that doesn't excuse it or modify it or lessen it or diminish the hatefulness of it in any way.
Opportunistic racist hatred is still racist hatred. :grr:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hileeopnyn8d Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #73
108. "Opportunistic racist hatred is still racist hatred. "
Exactly. Perfectly stated.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
yellerpup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
40. Disgusting!
Al Sharpton knows how to apply pressure and organize. Nails in the coffin (I fervently hope) for the Murdock-owned NY Post. Take 'em down, Al!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:50 AM
Response to Original message
43. Why would someone even draw something so awful?
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 10:36 AM by LaurenG
Why? :cry:

edit: left out a word
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:01 AM
Response to Original message
53. And to make matters worse, the asshole media is showing it often.
No discretion whatsoever. No surprise.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #53
55. our media should be our next target of kicking them to the curb.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:05 AM
Response to Original message
57. WTF?!?!? NY Post!? I thought it was Skin Head rag or something!! This is crazy
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ecstatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
58. complete and total racist bullshit
:mad:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:09 AM
Response to Original message
62. A-typical of The Post....they are of the Hannity/Limbaugh supporters. n/t
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 10:14 AM by vaberella
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
demokatgurrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:10 AM
Response to Original message
64. Oh my god, that is disgusting.
I cannot believe it. I hope Sharpton rips someone a new one.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:13 AM
Response to Original message
65. How could anyone in all good conscience think this is 'funny' in
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 10:14 AM by Fire1
any way, shape or form. This is sick! Which brings to mind all the past posts and threads depicting Sharpton and Jackson, as well, as 'publicity seekers.' To those, I say, NOW, you see, WHY THEY ARE NEEDED!!!!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:17 AM
Response to Reply #65
68. I always wanted to know who read the Post I found out it was the Housewives of NY.
I've always thought Al was needed. This is the Post I'm surprised by the surprise of the actions. They've done stuff like this before. They're notorious in New York.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
newview88 Donating Member (80 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
66. Wow....i'm in shock.
Who the heck thought this would be amusing??
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #66
230. Exactly. This is one of those things that you can only take one way. Why
would any 'media' face this kind of bad publicity?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Brewman_Jax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:19 AM
Response to Original message
70. If not Sharpton
maybe a visit from the Secret Service will wake them up. Threats against senior federal officials are illegal.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:21 AM
Response to Original message
77. Geez, that is both grotesquely racist and, imo, an implied threat to the President...
I am sickened by those who, in this thread, have defended this as innocuous and having no connection to President Obama, thankfully they are VERY FEW.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Laelth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #77
157. Agreed. n/t
-Laelth
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dcindian Donating Member (881 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:22 AM
Response to Original message
78. The Post knows full well what kind of cartoonist he is and what he meant.
He is one twisted and sick racist. And an anti Democrat to boot no doubt in my mind what he meant by it.

http://www.nypost.com/delonas/delonas.htm

Be sure to hold your nose when viewing.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AspenRose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:25 AM
Response to Original message
81. Sharpton shouldn't be the only one raising hell about it
There should be some prominent and very vocal white Obama supporters raising hell too. Otherwise the media will paint it as only black folks being upset (and therefore they can be ignored because they're "sensitive" about it.) For good or for ill, when white folks are vocal about racism and race-baiting, people listen. When black folks do it, they're playing a "race card." This type of stuff is only seen as inappropriate by the dominant culture when whites condemn it as strongly as blacks.

And personally I hope the cartoonist gets a visit from the Secret Service
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #81
85. You're absolutely right on that one!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:58 AM
Response to Reply #81
113. exactly, not only Black prominent figures should be weighing in on this.
and the Secret Service should pay a little visit, this cartoon is totally shameful, and I do not want to hear the same "sorry" stuff, this is no silly situation, and has a number of treasonous and racial overtones.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
salinen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:28 AM
Response to Original message
83. I'm sick of gallows humor
That chimp should not have been shot to death. And birds filling the engines
of passenger jets should not become humor either. Has comedy become the offensive
weapon that has no deterrent? The "I was only joking" confessional. Yuck.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
87. This is what the opposition is reduced to
Expect more of the same for many years to come. :puke:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:35 AM
Response to Original message
94. That is scary and disgusting.
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 10:36 AM by Starry Messenger
That's like something straight off of Stormfront. And yes, I know about the news-story with the zoo. This fails on so many levels and should never have been published. Sharpton's statement is awesome. I hope there is more than just "clarification" coming out of this.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BklynChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:46 AM
Response to Original message
100. fuck the NY Post and all the assholes who associate themselves with it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OnionPatch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:53 AM
Response to Original message
107. I'm sorry but this is the most racist thing I have seen in print in a long time.
And yes, I read the story about the real chimp who had to be shot. The insinuation here is that there is something in common with the chimp and the person who wrote the stimulus bill. It's disgusting.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:55 AM
Response to Original message
109. Calling Bush "chimpie" for 8 years hasn't helped...
We on the left have been using this racially charged term against Bush in the exact same way and with the exact same meanings that it used to be used to describe black people. The whole reason chimpie has the meaning and the weight of insult behind it is racial history. Few probably realize it when they describe Bush as a monkey, but they were just perpetuating an insult that was born out of racism. And the cartoons which depicted him as a monkey could have been taken right out of a KKK manuel, just shade his face black. I was always uncomfortable with the comparison, and now you see why. I think that we, as progressives, should not adopt insults born of racism, there are much more accurate and creative insults to choose from.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #109
116. I don't even understand your post.
Bush was white. How does calling him 'chimp' connote racism? :shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #116
124. besides that
Bush ACTUALLY LOOKS LIKE A FUCKING MONKEY!!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #124
138. ..................
yes indeed he did catwoman!!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #116
137. It doesn't
But the whole reason calling him a 'chimp' was an insult in the first place was because it used to be used to describe blacks in the same ways many people described Bush. 'Chimp' became an insult through racism. That's where it's power was derived from. Using it to describe even a white person using the same meaning it had to deride black people perpetuates its racial meaning. It's not racism, but it's taking an historically anti-black term being kept alive by applying it to a white person with the exact same meaning it had in history.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
genna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #137
350. That is how I felt about the term when I heard it applied to Bush too.
I just felt kind of queasy about it. It was like should I do that uncomfortable laugh or should I scold someone for saying that?

If you want to say Bush was dumb as rocks, I did, fine (it is uncivil to say but if you believe it fine). To say he's an animal (again with the honest admission to having called him a jack ass), it is more than simple incivility...it's pushing discourse away from democratic standards. It's another reason I try not to call Republicans anything other than Republicans. Once you sink to blatant name calling, then you are not far from fisticuffs.

I think one ideal in democracy is agreeing to live by our disagreements without warring in a Civil War.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #109
120. heh
:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #109
152. There is a world of difference in depicting a privileged white man as a chimp...
and doing the same to a black man. There is NO history of racially stereotyping white people as chimps, none whatsoever.

Please read this, you may see why there is legitimate outrage on the cartoon in the OP as opposed to there being none when George Bush, a privileged white man was depicted that way.

http://www.miller-mccune.com/article/studies-expose-%E2...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #152
165. There is and there isn't...
There is not the same history for whites, you are right. But when you take the "ape" steryotype from it's racist past and apply it without any real change, besides the fact that it is now against a white man, what you are doing is borrowing an insult that was born of racism and derives its power as an insult from racism in the past.

Though I must also say that there is SOME history of whites being associated with monkeys racially. For example the Irish. However, it was so long ago that few remembered it when they saw similar insults directed at Bush. And of course, the Irish were not considered "white". But I think it just reinforces my point that the ape in America was transformed into a racial insult. So when we use it, we should at least realize why "chimp" is even considered an insult in the first place. Past racism.

I read the article, and while interesting, I didn't find it very convincing. I think a lot more studies have to be done on it (though personally I hope not, it seems like a waste of time and money). I think that the study suffers from some pre-drawn conclusions. The whole reason they started the study was because some parent called a child a little monkey? Hell, my parents called me a monkey as a kid. And then there is that song with monkeys jumping on the bed. Basically, I think they are thinking they see things that aren't there. What was probably the most shocking to me is that in one study they said only 9% of the test subjects were aware of the past racial steryotype of apes and blacks. That seems impossible to me and signifies the small sample size and large error probably inherent in their studies. Some of their experiments also don't seem to say anything. Priming viewers with black faces then showing them an ape might just signify that the color black is more identified with apes, who usually have dark fur, than the color white. Really, I don't think you can draw any real scientific conclusions from such a silly test. And they also never say whether the non-white students reacted compared to white students. Like I said, I think they are testing to their expectations.

As for this cartoon, considering it is from a conservative paper, there may be a veiled jab at Obama racially, which I find shocking in this day and age when such things are publicized and denounced. It just seems stupid that they would try something so blatent. I think it is insensitive and ignores certain histories, but like I said, so has much of the Left been for 8 years with Bush. It has become commonplace to compare the President to a monkey, so those with less knowledge of racial history will see no problem continuing the trend.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #165
173. I found the study to be quite reflective of my life experiences and the racism..
I have seen around me. Being caucasian, I have not been the victim of racism but loved ones and dear friends certainly have.

When parents (whatever their skin color) refer to their children as "monkeys" it is in reference to their activities, ie bouncing on the bed, climbing on the furniture, etc, not reflective of their skin color, racial heritage.

Bush had definitive facial features and his walking style with his arms out in a way that was reminiscent of a chimp, imo,which was what cartoonists were reflecting. I think you will find that Bush was always depicted as a white chimp. Had he been depicted as a black chimp, I would find your argument more compelling.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blisteringcold Donating Member (84 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #109
189. Makes no sense
It's not racist to call a white man a chimp. That's like calling a black man a cracker. It's more comical than anything.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #189
193. I don't think it's racist...
but it is derived from racist terminology. And while it is comical to call a black man a cracker, that's because cracker really doesn't have much meaning as an insult for whites compared to calling a black man an ape. That's why calling Bush a chimp wasn't done for comedy as much as an insult. It's insulting because of its racist meaning for blacks. That's where the power of the word comes from. If it hadn't been for that history, "chimp" wouldn't be much of an insult today.

By calling Bush a "chimp", implying he was less than human, stupid, a beast, etc., we were imitating exactly what that word meant when it was applied to blacks. And imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Let's not flatter ourselves over using a word that only has negative conotations because of its racist history.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Politicalboi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 07:18 PM
Response to Reply #193
245. I have always associated
Comedy with Bush being a monkey. I always thought it was an insult to the monkeys. I never thought of it to be insulting because of it's racist meaning. In the 60's there was a kid show Sir Lancelot with monkeys in dress and talking. It was funny. Just like depicting Bush as a monkey is funny. Had this been a mad dog he never would have written the cartoon. He knew what he was implying with the monkey. And I would think it's the looks not the less than human, stupid or beast.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #245
295. Well everyone will interpret it differently...
but when Bush was called a chimp, I couldn't help but be reminded of where that insult started from. I agree that depicting Bush as a monkey definitely can be funny and was used as comedy, but I saw a lot of instances when it was used as an insult rather than comedy. I wish we lived in a world where that didn't matter, but as you can see, it still does with the reaction to this cartoon. I just think that we on the Left should try not to perpetuate the use of the ape as an insult, period, because of its sordid history.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NYC_SKP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:58 AM
Response to Original message
112. MOVE ALONG-- (nothing to see here)
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 11:00 AM by NYC_SKP
(sarcasm in subject line plus reference to our police people everywhere)

I'm more disturbed by the depiction of police and violence than of the monkey, though both aspects are outrageous.

:wtf:

The "monkey could have written it" point could have been made without the police--guns--violence part.

What have police shootings got to do with the stimulus package?

This is beyond creepy, but I feel very badly for police officers everywhere.

Shit, I feel badly for everyone everywhere. Someone should seriously join the ranks of the unemployed.

:patriot:



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #112
119. Ditto...I was telling my sister just that. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NYC_SKP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #119
133. I guess in a different story, police had to shoot an escaped chimp... but WTF
It's still f'ed up.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:07 AM
Response to Original message
125. contact numbers for the ny post are listed below if anyone wants
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 11:30 AM by bdamomma
to contact them.

http://www.nypost.com/contact/contactus.htm

I think this horrible cartoon is on Page Six and if you go under contacts there is an e-mail address saying Page Six.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NancyG Donating Member (483 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
134. First impression I had was assassination of the President and I'm appalled.
The racism is a secondary and awful affront.

That's what I saw, and my mouth is still open in awe that this was printed.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bigmo472 Donating Member (2 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:39 AM
Response to Original message
140. OUTRAGEOUS!!!
Wow, It's amazing that no matter how much everyone talks about this election uniting the country, there has to be an idiot who wants to continue with racist behavior. This guy is a political cartoonist/satirist. His job is to take events and look at them from all angles and determine if he can spin them to get a laugh while also promoting more extensive thought on the subject. This isn't some kid who draws pictures and doesn't realize the implications. To say that he doesn't think about the racial implications because he's not black is a copout. I don't have to be Mexican American to know not to depict them taking a siesta or climbing out of a river. I don't have to be Native American to know not to depict them unconscious with liquor bottles scattered around or chasing wolves with bows and arrows. This guy knew exactly what he was doing and chose to do it anyway. The moment I saw the cartoon I immediately saw the racist context. Even trying to say that President Obama is not the only one who worked on the bill doesn't wash either because everyone calls it The President's Stimulus Package. When we listen to an Obama speech we give him credit if we like what he says or blame him if we don't like it. Nobody asks "Who is this guy's speechwriter?". Bottom line is this guy screwed up and should have to face some consequences.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
firedupdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #140
150. Well said Bigmo472, and welcome to DU!
:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #140
154. Well said!
:thumbsup: and Welcome to DU!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #140
158. +1, some are acting as if Obama had nothing to do with the stimulus
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
156. People, don't feed the trolls.
They know it's racist. The artist knew it was racist. Everybody knows it's racist.

Don't let them playing dumb throw you off. That's the shallowest of plausible deniability.

Anybody arguing that it's the same as calling Bush a chimp clearly has shit for brains.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
160. Proof That Perception Is The Most Overwhelming Force In Humanity. People Will See What They Want To
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 12:22 PM by OPERATIONMINDCRIME
see.

On one hand, it is quite easy to understand why some perceptually view the cartoon as racist. It's obvious, when using their perception as a base, why it would appear that way. On the other hand, using rational logic and deduction, which can overpower flawed perception, it is also quite easy to ascertain that the artist's intent was far more innocent and meant to portray stupidity and ineptness on the part of the writers of the bill.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
demokatgurrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #160
166. Yeah. Innocent . n/t
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 12:35 PM by demokatgurrl
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
168. It's fucking stupid..I'd
expect it in KKK newsletter where brains aren't required.

And, I know the NY Post..but, that's in NYC where the voters went overwhelmingly for OBAMA with good fucking reason.

Go Al Sharpton!! :patriot:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
InAbLuEsTaTe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
170. This is nothing new for the NYP. Beyond disgusting.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
StrongBad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:51 PM
Response to Original message
171. If they had said "something else" instead of "someone else" I would have given them a pass.
Otherwise the argument doesn't fly.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
172. The BLATANT racism is ASTOUNDING!
Beware of Dogs:



Cops shooting.

Not to mention the disturbing message of assassination inherent in the "cartoon".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
174. Can we save outrage for something that actually matters?
This one reminds me of the South Park episode about the town flag.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RBInMaine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #174
176. Sorry, but there are lines with this stuff that should not be crossed. This goes too far.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #176
177. Only if you read it the way you WANT TO.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #177
179. Listen, you can stick your fingers in your ears and pretend this isn't racist...
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 01:56 PM by HiFructosePronSyrup
but don't expect honest, rational people to do the same.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:28 PM
Response to Reply #179
180. It's in poor taste, but I don't find it racist.
Unless you ASSuME the monkey is Obama.

However, I don't think a cartoonist, no matter what side he is on, would submit a cartoon that is THAT racist.

I think they are more refering to congress as being a group of rampaging apes.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #180
182. I don't believe that you don't find it racist.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #182
184. Ooookay. Don't believe it.
But, the reality is that I didn't even THINK of the racist angle until people started pulling their hair out over it.

I thought it was in poor taste because a woman might lose her lift b/c of that monkey attack. Further, thought it was poorly done b/c it suggests that the people writing the stimulus bill MEAN to do harm.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #184
186. I don't believe that either.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #186
187. Of course not...
Because in your world, everyone has to think just like you or it doesn't make sense.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #187
190. I just don't believe you're as stupid as you're pretending to be.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ganja Ninja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #190
197. You might be wrong about that.
The intended racism and violence is about as clear and despicable as it could be. And I don't believe for a second that the post printed it because they thought it would get a laugh from someone. You are correct. There's really only one way to read it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #190
199. Stupidity is making issues out of non-issues, when real issues exist.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #199
202. The fact that Delonas is a bigot is a non-issue.
That's well established.

Why you're trying to make an issue out of it is beyond me.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #202
207. LOL
Yes, the several posts and the fauxrage from Sharpton and so many on this board shows what a non-issue it really is.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blisteringcold Donating Member (84 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #180
195. You're missing the point!
Whoever he is trying to refer to the cartoon is implying that they should be shot. Pretty simple... Raging chimp should be shot!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:54 PM
Response to Reply #195
201. Yes.... poor taste and a stupid cartoon.
I don't discount that at all... but crying racism just isn't necessary.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
demokatgurrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #201
208. not necessary because it is so obvious? n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #208
209. Because it isn't there unless you force it in.
And there is no reason to do that.

We, as a society, need to STOP being hypersensitive and looking for racism and sexism everywhere.

http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/103452

2:00 minutes -> 2:45

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #209
212. Really. Because being less aware has worked so well for us in the past.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #212
214. We have never tried it before.
Would be nice to give something new a spin.

The PC BS has run its course.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #214
218. Not according to your new attorney general.
And frankly, people who object to "PCness" are generally objecting to a lot more, like respecting other people.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #214
223. Ahhh! There it is!!! The "Political Correctness" CYA for blatant racists. I knew it would come
:puke:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #223
288. And then comes the racism tag.
You dare to not get offended by something and that makes YOU the racist.

This is why PC is such BS.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:22 PM
Response to Reply #288
292. Wow, everyone here offended by the cartoon is racist!
:crazy:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 01:19 AM
Response to Reply #292
308. Uhhhhh... no.
Nor is everyone not offended by it racist.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #288
300. The cartoon is racist as hell. You....I don't know about. Quoting "PC" is to excuse racism.
People that quote "political correctness" as an excuse for blatant racism - you tell me - are they racist?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 01:19 AM
Response to Reply #300
309. The cartoon ain't racist, so the PC BS tag applies.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 07:27 PM
Response to Reply #309
363. Nope, you're just being willfully obtuse, but you keep on defending the indefensible.
Go ahead and hang YOUR hat on that disgusting fucking racist cartoon.

Speaks volumes.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #363
367. Luckily there is a whole world in between.
One does not have to "hang a hat" on the cartoon to not believe there was any racist intent behind it.

It's a shitty cartoon for a billion reasons, but intended racism isn't one of them.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #367
380. The Post has now publicly apologized for the racist cartoon, yet you still defend it.
How very bizarre.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #380
384. I care as much about the post as I do people who search for racism.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #384
385. You've worked real hard to defend this "cartoon", so you've shown your stripes - thanks. -eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 10:50 AM
Response to Reply #385
386. Thank you for your useless assessment.
I'll file it where it belongs.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 10:53 AM
Response to Reply #386
387. And I've filed your username as a defender of violent racism against Democrats - thanks!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #387
388. Yet, I did no such thing.
But, thanks again for your useless opinion.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #223
289. Yup..."political correctness" is trotted out
And it looks like South Park is the gold standard by which all political discourse should follow.

It's pretty clear which side of the aisle this dude came from.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:22 PM
Response to Reply #289
291. Of course...
He doesn't buy into the BS PC world thus he MUST be from the other side of the aisle.

Who cares about real issues like health care, tax reform, human rights...

screw it... just don't use the wrong words at the wrong time.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:23 PM
Response to Reply #291
293. Whatever you say, Bub.
:crazy: :dunce: :freak:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #293
311. Quick, pull out the emoticons.. they prove points without logic!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #214
243. it's not PC BS.. it's called being considerate and showing respect
something bigots have very little tolerance for.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #243
290. I have no tolerance for hypersensitive idiots.
If people can't distinguish between fauxrage and real issues, I have absolutely no use for them or their fear of words.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #290
294. I have no tolerance for racists.
Hey, let's see some links to your many anti-racist web pages and comments.

Your credibility is on the line. You may begin when ready.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 01:20 AM
Response to Reply #294
310. What on earth are you babbling about?
So people have to justify themselves to satisfy your fauxrage?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 03:29 AM
Response to Reply #290
320. You need to brush up on some history
You might find for example that the Nazis used cartoons to depict Jews as rats and it actually influenced the way the society as a whole treated Jews. Racist propaganda is very dangerous! And I'm very sorry for you that you choose not to see that.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #320
344. And therein lies a difference
Can you find the difference between... Depicting an actual specific individual or race/religion in a negative light

VS

Having to assume that the chimp in the cartoon represents Obama.

If the chimp had any Obama caricatures, I would be there, but it doesn't. It's just a chimp on the heels of a newsstory about a chimp that went crazy and had to be shot.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #344
364. So then
where does the stimulus bill come in???
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #364
368. Congress wrote the stimulus bill.
The idea of the cartoon is that the stimulus bill is so insane only a crazed chimp could have written it. Its a shitty cartoon for a million reasons... but racist intent wasn't one of them.

I don't think ANYONE actually believes that the cartoonist intended the chimp to be Obama OR that the cartoonist was condoning the murder of the president over the stimulus bill.

Those are claiming racist intent are doing so only for effect, nothing more.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #290
341. I can but I don't think you can
nor do you want to.

"If people can't distinguish between fauxrage and real issues, I have absolutely no use for them or their fear of words."


yet you post as if you do... who is the real sensistive one here. I see you lobbing the insults.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #174
297. Got some more wisdom from South Park?
Please, share with us your enlightenment.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 01:22 AM
Response to Reply #297
313. You should try humor sometimes... It does wonders.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rvablue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
194. I like the first sentence of the last paragraph of Sharpton's letter...
basically challenging them to explain it at minimum.

So, NY Post, what exactly were your intentions. He's going to let them sink themselves.

Go, Al!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:31 PM
Response to Original message
196. Get 'em Rev. Al!
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 03:05 PM by politicasista
No, this isn't funny.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:44 PM
Response to Original message
198. I love Al Sharpton. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 02:54 PM
Response to Original message
200. My letter....
The cartoon depicting the "Stimulus Bill" writer as a Chimp gunned down by the police is appalling. Considering that Pres. Obama, our first African-American President has said himself that this was his bill makes the historical racial implications that the illustration connotes beyond grotesque, as does the depiction of an assassination. I understand that some will pretend that the toon has nothing to do with our President but they would be badly lying.

In 2009, as a nation, we must do better than finding humor in police action, dead animals, and our dire economic predicament. Whomever had the brain fart to come up with this editorial cartoon should find him or herself standing in a job fair line that snakes around the block while drawing their up their plan on how they will be paying next month's bills. In otherwords, I am totally disgusted.

Respectfully,

XXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ZombieHorde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #200
205. What happened to your avatar? It was cute.
Oh and, you have the weirdest name. No offense, but XXXXXXXXXXXXXX is just strange. How do you even pronounce that?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #205
206. I became a "Non Donor", and I guess it got taken away!
I lost my Credit Card, and am awaiting a new one....so I can't donate till then!

As for my name; it's French! :rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ZombieHorde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
203. I don't know the intent, but you know the KKK LOVES that cartoon.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BanTheGOP Donating Member (596 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
213. 100% Republican Through and Through...
...the NY GOP must be held accountable. There should be a suit against the republican-owned NY Post, hopefully enough to bankrupt it. As it is a Fox news affiliate, we should consider a more massive suit that would maim Fox News and the republican party as much as possible.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
iandhr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 05:52 PM
Response to Original message
220. Thats horrible
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CLANG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:06 PM
Response to Original message
224. I'm sorry people I have to disagree
Most of you seem to think this isn't a big deal, that this wasn't representing the president.

But let me ask you: What would the monkey have to do with the stimulus bill? Nothing. But President Obama had a lot to do with it. He only happens to be half african which a lot of racists like to refer to various names related to primates other than humans.

This is blatant. Sorry, JMO
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hekate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:17 PM
Response to Original message
227. That's just ... sick. Go get'm Rev. Sharpton. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Politicalboi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:27 PM
Response to Original message
231. If the monkey doesn't mean Obama
Then why does it say "They'll have to find SOMEONE else to write the next stimulus bill". This bill has been talked about as Obama's bill. Who is the monkey representing? I wonder if the "artist" would go into Harlem and see if he can find someone who would laugh at his funny joke. I doubt he would have the balls.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gen. Jack D. Ripper Donating Member (547 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:29 PM
Response to Original message
232. I don't understand why the policeman shot a monkey
Is it so common for police officers to open fire on random primates that the depiction of which in a political cartoon requires no context? I think I remember a news story regarding one, or several, escaped monkeys recently. It may be a reference to that. If it was, the author might have drawn something to help us understand the correlation. So, it's either a rather poor cartoon, or potentially racist.

Of course, to be fair, president Bush was also (and often) depicted as a monkey, of several varieties. Though, that was likely because he looked and, well, actually acted like one.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jeff30997 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:39 PM
Response to Original message
234. WTF?
I knew that the NY Post was garbage but this is something so sick that I could only imagine

that a cartoon like that would only be published in a Neo-Nazi or KKK crappy newsletter. :puke:

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:57 PM
Response to Reply #234
239. Yup. NYPost: Stormfront Edition -eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
240. boy was that stupid...
first off, the racial overtones are pretty obvious knowing the history and usage of the word "monkey" to describe blacks.

second, the implication of gunning down a President ... WTF

As a cartoonist or illustrator one is responsible for his/her work and thinks real hard before getting their work published. I find it hard to believe this cartoonist didn't once think about all of this.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
stlsaxman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 07:09 PM
Response to Original message
244. Jesus H. Fucking Christ.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
KalicoKitty Donating Member (777 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 07:19 PM
Response to Original message
246. Is this what the cartoonist would like to see happen
to the writer of the stimulus bill? This is so disgusting and hope the NY Post gets boycotted.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Politicalboi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 07:32 PM
Response to Original message
247. Close to the Rodney King beating
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 07:34 PM by Politicalboi
Cops where known to use the term "Gorilla's in the mist". I wonder who they were referring too? I know Los Angels can be a zoo sometimes but I doubt that is what they meant. Just like this "artist".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 07:35 PM
Response to Original message
248. Absolutely terrible and racist. They should be sued.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #248
251. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
JayMusgrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
253. Those people who do not see the offensiveness of this are obviously
too white, too insensitive, too stupid, too rich, too linked to white mythology, too unschooled in racial history, too insensitive to the feelings of other people on this planet, especially too insensitive to Americans who are members of minority groups.

Or else, no one has made me understand how this is, in any way, funny.

Please show us how this is funny. I invite you all to explain this, if you are not white, not employed, and willing to laugh at yourself as being someone's pet that should be shot.

Please explain how any of this is funny to any American.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #253
259. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #259
261. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
JayMusgrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:15 PM
Response to Original message
256. FWIW..........Olbermann making the publishers of this cartoon.
look like the fools and insensitive idiots they are.

This hour, Eastern time. watch it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:17 PM
Response to Original message
258. Disgraceful does not begin to cover this. The "cartoon" is not signed
who would take credit for this pile of elephant shit?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
what0now0toons Donating Member (32 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 08:47 PM
Response to Original message
266. "What Now Toons" response to the "New York Post's Racist Cartoon!"

The New York Posts cartoon?!! What can I say, this is a despicable cartoon, for all too many reasons.
For years the racists have referred to African Americans as monkeys, this is a throwback to those terrible Jim Crow times. Then you have the issue of domestic terrorism, because that is what this cartoon implies, shooting a beloved president, this cartoon is just irresponsible on so many levels. The cartoonist has crossed the line of bad taste and fans the flames political threats.
I'm a political cartoonist from the left side of the fence, and it would NEVER cross my mind to draw a cartoon of this nature about Bush, I never did, check out my toons to see
It's up on my website right now
www.whatnowtoons.com
left of center political cartoons.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #266
275. The clean up crews are out in force on this indefencible "cartoon"...
Even to take the more than sophomoric take on the "cartoon"; That the thrust was that the bill was "poorly written" but in a condescending manner, allowing that others would take it differently ....Get A Grip for cripes sake; Even if those arguments held any water the mere fact that it could be taken in the way that most are taking it should have been burning, neon red flags up the gazzoo for the editors of the Post to not let this elephant shit onto the pages of the paper. There is nothing to say but shame.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
genna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #266
355. I've liked what I saw at your website...but Obama as Superman
ok
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WoodyM Donating Member (127 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
271. Being in my eighties,
and I am white, and having lived all my life in the south, I instantly see the racism in this cartoon. This is the kind of stuff one would expect to see in a KKK hand out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MsUnderstood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:30 PM
Response to Original message
274. STOP THE PRESSES! and read the paper
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jvlkK...

It appears that in STAMFORD, Conn a chimpanzee pet attacked a woman and was then shot by police.

So if we are aware of other news events we can then link this chimpanzee story to the joke implied in the cartoon.

To automatically credit the artist with being a racist by jumping to the conclusion Al sharpton did is racist in itself because it implies that white people cannot fathom black people as anything but monkeys.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Every Man A King Donating Member (534 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #274
278. So no one is a racist since only a racist would recognize racism?
:eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #278
395. Wow, from what asshole did you pull that bit of
idiocy. Lesson; Any honest mind of any intelligence at all and whose mind has not been locked in bigotry, can recognize racism when it rears its ugly head.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
demokatgurrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #274
280. we KNOW this!!!! Sheesh. It's been posted about 10 times
that doesn't excuse the cartoon.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Milo_Bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 01:28 AM
Response to Reply #274
314. It doesn't matter what the facts are.
People WANT to be outraged. They WANT there to be massive racism against Obama.

Forget the fact that Obama didn't write the stimulus bill.

Forget the fact that a crazed chimp was actually shot by police.

Forget the fact that people often make comparrisons between crazed animals and politicians when they feel they have gone too far.

Forget the fact that the monkey represents a congress gone wild in a minority of people's minds.

Forget it all and get OUTRAGED!!!


Can't you see there is only ONE POSSIBLE WAY TO INTERPRET THIS CARTOON?!??!

2 steps forward, 3 steps back!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Highway61 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
276. I said it earlier
and I will say it again...everyone here seems to have a "take" on this. Pure and simple...it is DISGUSTING! How must Obama feel when he saw this? My God. How very sad there are folks out there willing to print this shit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:55 PM
Response to Original message
284. WTF!!!!!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 09:56 PM
Response to Original message
285. Massive, Epic Fail
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
progressivebydesign Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 10:28 PM
Response to Original message
296. Not even considering the racial aspect, this is a DESPICABLE cartoon in so many ways.
The chimpanzee incident was extremely tragic on all levels. WTF is wrong with the NY Post? Do they have NO peer review of these things? Did anyone think, even for a moment, that this was a colossally bad cartoon?

What a bunch of assholes.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:20 PM
Response to Original message
302. I expected worse but Sharpton pulled it off on Rachel.
Edited on Wed Feb-18-09 11:29 PM by AtomicKitten
I don't think the cartoon is racist per se. It's a timely and topical juxtaposition of two unrelated current events that just happened to be in extremely poor taste just as a natural inference.

Sharpton focused on the violence of the piece and on that point he was right on.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-18-09 11:49 PM
Response to Original message
303. From Huff Po.: This is for you Doc
the games racists play....

Rules:

1- Use stereotypes to diminish and insult.

2- Pretend you aren't aware of stereotypes (example: The California Republican Club president who printed and distributed "Obama Bucks Food Stamps" with pictures of watermelon and fried chicken, who "never knew these things were associated with black people"), or at least pretend the stereotypes never occurred to you.

3- Be incensed that others recognize the stereotypes, and in a pinch, display righteous indignation.

4- Secretly take pleasure in getting away with getting racist material in the public eye and enjoy the reactions ---keep playing dumb

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Honeycombe8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:23 AM
Response to Original message
307. Whoa. This is a disturbing cartoon. WhoEVER approved that toon should be fired.
But Sharpton shouldn't be the one to do it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 02:03 AM
Response to Original message
315. Sharpton must be loving every minute of it.
He's back in his element and being interviewed by the media. His outrage is over the top, as usual. The Post will not fire the cartoonist and so far they have refused to apologize. Somewhere Murdoch is probably laughing at the whole thing.

:eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shellgame26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 03:50 AM
Response to Reply #315
321. and clearly, so are you
Is it Pumas night out again?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #321
337. Oh geez,
There's plenty of legitimate cause out there for outrage over real incidents of racism. This is not one of them. It's a manufactured outrage over a cartoon that was meant to make fun of Democrats, as are all political cartoons on the Post. This cartoonist takes the headline of the day and spins it into a political cartoon, usually skewering the Dems since it's for the RW Post. He would have probably submitted the same cartoon regardless of who was president. It was not implying that the dead chimp was Obama, let alone suggesting an assassination attempt. Sharpton is an instigator, always has been.

:eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #315
347. Someone draws a racist cartoon and the villian in this story according to you is Sharpton?
You read the Post on a regular basis don't you? Is that why you've got it twisted? Sharpton is not the problem here your obvious dislike for him notwithstanding.

:crazy:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #347
348. Yes, I don't like Sharpton at all.
But no, I don't buy the Post. I actually make it a point of not giving Murdoch a penny of my money if I can help it.

As far as the cartoon, the cartoonist always takes the headline of the day and makes a political cartoon out of it. Yesterday, the big news around these parts was the chimp and what he did to that poor woman. I honestly don't think that he meant to equate Obama to the dead chimp. Though he was definitely poking fun at the Dems, but the Post does that on a daily basis. Nothing new there, it's a RW rag.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #348
354. I live in these parts and I saw the story about the Chimp
And there's still no way in hell that cartoon chimp wasn't a reference to Obama.

You can make all the logical twists you want to tell yourself that it wasn't but, to borrow a phrase, that dog don't hunt.

Regards
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #347
349. The poster has admitted to liking the Obama sock monkey.
So that should tell you everything you need to know.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:42 PM
Response to Reply #349
351. I happen to like sock monkeys.
Edited on Thu Feb-19-09 12:44 PM by Beacool
I have two of them and would have gladly bought a Hillary sock monkey if they had made one. Just as I like the Vermont Teddy Bears representing Hillary, Obama and McCain.



;)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #351
352. Tell it to somebody who believes you or respects your opinion.
That ain't me.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #352
353. Whatever....................
:eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 08:51 AM
Response to Original message
329. Did we die and wake up in in 1870??!!
I mean that's the type of racist shit I'd expect to see in the NY Post if it was 1870.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:24 AM
Response to Reply #329
334. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 10:09 AM
Response to Reply #334
336. But come on - there has to be a level of logic when you use these images
Calling Bush a chimp for 8 years was safe because he was not a person of color. It has been well documented that for centuries the image of a chimp/monkey/gorilla has been used as a racial slur against African-American people.

They could have easily built that same cartoon and put another image in there other than one that is widely accepted as a racial slur against a race of people.

Obama is going to be insulted the next 8 years - insult him because you find him unacceptable as a president NOT because of the color of his skin.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
paparush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
335. Its not a reference to a million monkeys typing and one of them writing Shakespeare?
Yeah. I didn't think so either.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AyanEva Donating Member (428 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
342. This cartoon fails so hard...
I didn't even understand it until someone explained it. Not only is it offensive but it also just generally sucks.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EnviroBat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
356. Gunning down the likeness of Glenn Beck
Now I find that slightly offensive... But they should have gone with this:

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
npk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 10:53 PM
Response to Original message
382. I never thought I would say this but GO Sharpton GO
Me and the reverend haven't always seen eye to eye, but on this issue I hope he uses every last bit on influence he has to absolutely destroy that piss poor publication.

There is simply no way to explain that stupid parody any other way to Sunday, except that it is a racist dig at the president. Like someone else said at best the cartoon is implying that Obama is no smarter than a crazy chimp. That is still racist. Damnit what is wrong with this country. It is funny. It just isn't.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-19-09 11:40 PM
Response to Original message
383. This thread is awesome.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SoxFan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
389. The cartoon is vile. So is Sharpton.
He only makes matters worse when he starts flapping his gums. All he is going to do is make the cartoonist a martyr for the Fox News set, and probably win him a book deal with Regnery.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-09 02:28 AM
Response to Reply #389
408. I love how revealing these threads are. It's like a gift, really. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-09 08:03 AM
Response to Reply #408
410. It certainly is. n/t
Regards
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-20-09 11:28 PM
Response to Original message
403. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-09 02:15 AM
Response to Reply #403
406. You my friend are a fool in fools gold rags, if indeed you have any clothes at all.
Edited on Sat Feb-21-09 02:31 AM by ooglymoogly
If you do not "get" that most of the country including the media perceive this as Obama's plan to get us out of the astronomical crisis that B*shco has left us with, you just are not getting much of anything.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
deaniac21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-22-09 03:06 PM
Response to Original message
412. Wonder what Chimpy thinks?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Clio the Leo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-22-09 03:15 PM
Response to Original message
413. For crying out loud! Is Al not there YET!!!!
He's been on his way to the Post for DAYS now..... lol, I think that every time I see this thread back on top of the page.

Could he NOT get a CAB!!!?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sat Sep 23rd 2017, 11:56 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC