It Appears That Pelosi and Reid Have Become The De Facto Leaders of the Democratic Party

[Better Believe It]

That must change! Pelosi and Reid were not elected President.

Reid and Pelosi indicated soon after the election that they would not be "rubber stamps" for President Obama.
Forget the fact that they functioned as rubber stamps for George W. Bush!

If Obama wanted so badly to avoid conflicts with right-wing Republicans in the name of bi-partisanship, Pelosi and Reid correctly assumed that Obama surely wouldn't make demands on them and other Democratic Party members of Congress. Pelosi and Reid saw Obama as a potentially weak President who they could ignore while they persured their political and economic agendas.

Unfortunately, Obama let them take charge of the "stimulus" program rather than present HIS economic recovery program to Congress. He probably did this to avoid any conflict with leaders of the Democratic Party in Congress in the hopes they would present an effective economic recovery program that would have a major impact on and jump start the economy. He was dead wrong.

It's now obvious that the "stimulus" programs offered by Pelosi and Reid won't create the 4 million jobs Obama had hoped for and will FAIL. Pelosi and Reid have become the de facto leaders of the Democratic Party.

Time is running out! Obama must act like he was elected President, not McCain, Pelosi or Reid. If Obama doesn't take charge and demonstrate the leadership he is capable of, the economy will only get much worse over the next four years. This economic crisis could easily turn into another Great Depression. The economy MUST be in much better shape in 2012 than it is now. If it isn't, the Republicans will win control of Congress and the White House by a landslide in three and a half years.

[Peregrine Took]

1. A freind said that very thing to me a few hours ago. Obama's biggest mistake

was in letting the Congress write the Stimulus package. He and his team should have done it and why didn't he?

[onenote]

4. He and his team were directly involved in drafting the bill

The starting point was their bill. Additions were made based on joint discussions between WH staff and congressional staff. The WH signed off on the bill before it was introduced.

[Better Believe It]

8. Link please!

"The WH signed off on the bill before it was introduced."

[global1]

6. Probably Because He Thought Pelosi & Reid Weren't Listening To All......

of his speeches during the campaign. If they did then they would know that 'earmarks' are not acceptable and that this was supposed to be about Jobs and Infrastructure and that we were supposed to 'change' Washington.

The Dems had a chance to seize this moment in history and they are letting all those who supported them down. I don't lay the blame on the President. He can't do everything by himself. He needs support of his Senators and Representatives. In a way - maybe this is good that this is happening now - because it may harden the President and he will learn how to get things through in the future. Unfortunately - he himself the other night during his round of interviews with the press said that his political future rests in whether or not we pull ourselves out of this hole. So this bill is critical to his success. I still wish that the Dems were out there in force to promote this bill and its passage. The Repugs are everywhere slamming it and outside of the President and very few Dems (like McCaskill) it appears that they have gone underground.

This a.m. I got a call from some Democratic Congressional Group that was soliciting for donations for future elections. I told the guy to call me when Pelosi was gone. Yesterday I got another call from the DNC to extend my expired membership. I told the guy I didn't know I was a member - then I recalled that a hard working college girl rang my doorbell during the campaign and I gave her a $25 check for the DNC and to help them elect Obama.

I think a lot of Dems that donated to the campaign and were really enthusiastic about the Dems taking control and changing D.C. like myself are sitting back and waiting until we see some return on our investment into this historic election. In my case - unless I see the Dems in Congress supporting their leader - I'm not going to be handing over any more money to them.

It's time that they react to the mandate that was given to them and seize the day.

[Spider Jerusalem]

14. Ever heard of separation of powers?

It's the job of the legislature to write laws. Not of the executive. If the party of the executive and the majority party in the legislature are the same they work together to achieve common goals on the basis of executive input, but for the executive to write legislation for Congress is as troubling a precedent as the abuses and erosion of checks and balances of the Bush years. I'm surprised you think what you're proposing is a GOOD idea.

[Enrique]

2. you're repeating the GOP talking points

they're saying, hey America, this huge bill we're voting on, it's not the popular guy Obama's bill, it's the unpopular Nancy Pelosi's bill.

They said after their meeting with him, where he reached out to them, that they were glad he didn't feel any "ownership" of the bill. After which they promptly ALL voted against it, and could say they didn't vote against Obama, but voted against Pelosi.

It's divide and conquer.

The reality is that the House gave Obama every concession to the GOP that he asked for. Obama should show some solidarity with Pelosi, to counter the GOP's divide and conquer strategy.

[Better Believe It]

7. GOP Talking Points??? B. S. !!! Links please!

"you're repeating the GOP talking points"

Really? Which of my comments constitute GOP talking points?

This one? "Forget the fact that they
GOP Link please.

Or perhaps this comment? "If Obama wanted so badly to avoid conflicts with right-wing Republicans in the name of bi-partisanship, Pelosi and Reid correctly assumed that Obama surely wouldn't make demands on them and other Democratic Party members of Congress."

Post the link to this GOP talkng point please.

Well, the following must surely be a Republican talking point. You can't be wrong 100% of the time. "Obama must act like he was elected President, not McCain, Pelosi or Reid. If Obama doesn't take charge and demonstrate the leadership he is capable of, the economy will only get much worse over the next four years."

I'm afraid that I and EVERYONE else on DU missed that GOP talking point about wanting Obama to be a stronger President.

Provide a link please.

From your post and nice Pelosi avatar you display, should we assume you're in fact presenting Pelosi talking points? Some here might even think you're acting as an apologist for Pelosi!

If you're claiming that Pelosi's bill was in fact written by President Obama and presented to her please provide some evidence to back up that assertion .... links please!

[Mass]

9. I am no fan of Pelosi and Reid, but you are indeed repeating GOP talking points.

And you missed Graham this morning asking Obama to be a strong president and lead.
http://politicalwire.com/archives/2009/02/05/graham_steps_up_attacks_on_obama.html
In an interview with Fox News, Graham said, "I like President Obama, but he is not leading."

He added: "It's a broken process, and the president, as far as I'm concerned has been AWOL in providing leadership."

Here are some of your earmarks. I guess teachers are not workers and it is fine to fire them, according to all those RWers and you.
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2009/02/sausage_factory_update.php

[Better Believe It]

13. Oh, now Pelosi apologists have been reduced to right-wing baiting?

"Here are some of your earmarks. I guess teachers are not workers and it is fine to fire them, according to all those RWers and you."

You can't be honest and debate the points so now you have to engage in personal attacks?

That's generally what people who have no ideas or no idea of what they are talking about have to do.

I support ALL proposals that will actually create useful public works jobs even if some Republicans and Democrats wish to call them earmarks and I'm absolutely opposed to taking out those "alleged" earmarks in the proposal you linked too.

Period!

And just in case you didn't notice, I fully support adding to the Recovery legislation 18,750 local public works projects designated for 779 cities which will cost 150 billion dollars and produce 1,600,000 jobs in 2009-2010. I'm sure that Republicans and some Democrats will attack many or even most of these projects as "earmarks".

Now if you think my endorsement of the United States Conference of Mayors "Jobs and Infrastructure Project Economic Recovery Report" proves that I'm some sort right-winger you have to be absolutely nuts .... or just plain dishonest.

I started that lead post applauding their report. You didn't. You didn't even bother to comment favorably on their infrastructure jobs proposal! I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't even both to read it!

I wrote:

The Senate should start over and simply incorporate this sensible plan it into a new stimulus bill (if Republicans prevent the current bill from being amended) and present it for a vote. If Republicans filibuster against a real stimulus bill that will "jolt" the economy, let them!

Keep the Senate in session, let a few obstructionist Republicans filibuster day and night on the Senate floor against an economic recovery act until the public gets fed up with their antics and 60 votes are obtained for cloture.

In other words, the Democrats should act like they won the election and the Republicans lost.

What is this plan? It's one that some DU'ers have read or heard about but very few have actually read.

It's "America's Mayors Report to the Nation on Projects to Strengthen Metro Economies and Create Jobs Now".

The Republican and Democratic mayors released a report on January 17, 2009. It lists 18,750 local infrastructure projects in 779 cities costing 149 billion dollars that will create 1.6 million jobs. All of these projects can be quickly started and be completed by the end of 2010!

Read the mayors "Mainstreet Economic Recovery" news release and data which also lists every single proposed project, the cost and the number of people that will be employed in every project.

Download the detailed plan and read it now.

The Senate should include these projects in their legislation. Any really "bad" projects that don't stimulate the economy and job growth can be removed but they are few and far between.

Let the Republicans attack it .... they will attack any Democratic stimulus project that doesn't adopt much or most of the Republican plan which is designed to fail.

It's in PDF format.

Go here:

http://www.usmayors.org/mainstreeteconomicrecovery /

And click on:

Option 1: Download a PDF version of the full report, including the executive summary, list of participating cities and then projects, sorted by project type or by city.
+ Click to download the report (5 MB)

And bring this to the attention of other progressives and your representatives in Congress.

Is there any chance Mass that you might actually read the Mayors report and support it and stop your false right-wing baiting of
those progressives and liberals you disagree with?

And here is where you can view my lead post on the Mayors proposal.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=8164474

[Mass]

17. Ignore.

[Enrique]

12. here's one article laying out the GOP's "Obama vs. Pelosi" strategy

http://blogs.abcnews.com/thenote/2009/01/gop-strategy-op.html

(...)

Politically, the Republican mindset boils down to this: President Obama is popular, but the Democratic congressional leadership is not. They may pay a political price for opposing Obama's plan, but not for opposing House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's plan -- even though that’s a distinction without a difference.

Two weeks ago, House Minority Whip Eric Cantor, R-Va., hired GOP pollster John McLaughlin to conduct a poll on the stimulus plan to define the most effective ways to frame Republican concerns.

ABC obtained a copy of a PowerPoint presentation prepared based on that poll, available HERE.

The GOP poll showed that Obama is popular (71 percent approval) and that an overwhelming majority (64 percent) approve of “Barack Obama's economic recovery plan.”

But it showed that Pelosi, D-Calif., (34 percent favorable) and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., (20 percent) are far less popular. And when asked about the specifics of the stimulus plan without Obama's name attached, the plan loses its appeal.

Cantor presented his poll to wavering moderates as evidence that they could vote "no" without paying a political price. In the end, he convinced even those from districts won overwhelmingly by Obama. Even freshman Rep. Joseph Cao, R-La., -- who beat William “cold cash” Jefferson in one of the most heavily Democratic districts in America -- voted no.

[Occam Bandage]

22. Cold, hard evidence: BBI is polluting DU with more GOP talking points. nt

[onenote]

3. which of Obama's ideas didn't make it into the stimulus package?

The House bill was not produced by the House staff on their own. It was a joint effort by White House staff and Congressional staff. The House added to the Obama proposal as part of that joint effort,but I've seen no indication whatsoever that they took out anything of significance -- certainly not anything to reduce the number of jobs that the bill is designed to produce.

[Better Believe It]

16. You tell me. List Obama specific recovery proposals .... if you can.

[onenote]

27. you're the one claiming that Obama had proposals for 4 million jobs and the bill falls short

Seems like the burden is on you to back up that claim, not on me.

[Mass]

5. There is a little thing called the Constitution. Remember. 3 branches of government;

Executive, Legislative and Judiciary.

People can think that Reid and Pelosi are not effective, but this is working the way it is supposed to work, contrarely to the 8 previous years.

Aside from that, you show no prove that what passed the House is very different from what Obama wanted.

[Better Believe It]

10. Right. Pelosi and Reid didn't mind being Bush "enablers" but they are independent now!

Now they are suddenly asserting their independence!

How convenient.

I'm still waiting for someone to post the details of the recovery package that Obama allegedly presented to Pelosi.

Can you find a link to that?

It seems there are a few Pelosi apologists here who don't mind seeing Obama fail. I want him to succeed.

[Mass]

11. I am not here to do your job for you. You are asserting things without any proof and repeating RW

talking points (See post #12 for quote). BTW, I wished Pelosi and Reid were not at the head of the House and Senate, but that still does not mean you are correct.

BTW, I do not want Obama to succeed, I want the country to succeed.

[Better Believe It]

15. Nothing like an old cliche!

"BTW, I do not want Obama to succeed, I want the country to succeed."

Just a bit overused cliche, don't ya think?

And if Obama fails in his attempt to revive the national economy how do you believe "the country" will succeed?

And who in "the country" are you talking about .... working people, the middle class, banksters, small businesspeople, Wall Street tycoons, the medical insurance industry, everyone????

[Mass]

18. Ignore.

[Occam Bandage]

19. Congratulations!

In honor of your five hundredth ridiculous, bombastic negative OP! Whether it's bashing Clinton during the primaries, Obama during the campaign, and now the Congress and Obama at once, you're as reliable as Old Faithful.

(Although, to be fair, you do occasionally post positive things. That is to say, whenever you're talking about how splendidly the People's Republic of China is going.)

[Better Believe It]

23. So now you've decided to engage in a little red-baiting.

Well, that's certainly taking the debate in a positive direction. Trying just a little diversion to get off subject?

"you do occasionally post positive things. That is to say, whenever you're talking about how splendidly the People's Republic of China is going.)"

I wrote that the government of China is somehow splendid? That's a lie. Link please.

Or are you just making this up as you go .... nothing like a little red-baiting on top of the right-wing baiting.

Seems you're unable to deal with the subject matter in an informed and intelligent manner .... so it's time to engage in personal attacks against those progressives and liberals you disagree with.

Have you joined others yet in their "swiftboat" like character assassination campaign against Krugman? After all, you and other "swiftboaters against Krugman" surely know far more about economic matters than Krugman.

[Occam Bandage]

24. Woohoo! Accusations of Red-baiting! You're in fine form today, sir, fine form indeed.

Why, even mentioning your ridiculously defensive tendencies regarding China usually leads to accusations of both McCarthyist paranoia if not anti-Chinese racism. You're like a Bingo machine, only instead of balls with numbers on them, they have phrases like "anti-liberal," "red-baiting," "xenophobe," and "link please" written on them. Give him a shake; who knows what he'll accuse you of next?

Well, anyway, I'd love to chat, but I have to hop on the 2:35 anti-Krugman swiftboat. :rofl:

[Every Man A King]

20. Oh God move to China already n/t

[Zynx]

21. I agree. The author is a useless, useless person. They have never posted one positive

thing about the party or its leaders. Never. At the same time they are always defending China.

[ddeclue]

25. Um welcome to a multi-branched government...

I realize some of us have forgotten what that means or perhaps never experienced it before - but it's a good thing to have a Congress that thinks for itself again.

[paulk]

26. this is trash

utter nonsense

[Better Believe It]

28. Another Obama hater and Pelosi apologist?

[paulk]

29. you argue like a child

grow up.

[WI_DEM]

30. There is no question that Obama is the leader of the party and without him they would be up a creek.

[cooolandrew]

31. You have a very good point there, one thing he must make them aware of is Baracks very active >

camapaign contact list. They need to fix up look sharp or take the exit sign.