Networking For A Cure by Sanjay Gupta. (He sees benefit of internet speeding research)

[KittyWampus]

As patients diagnosed with incurable illnesses reach out and blog, they are helping speed research and drug trials.

This is relevant to me personally as my family members are subject to Ataxia. Drug trials are very expensive and take a lot of time.

Networking on the internet is a valuable way to get info, share info and advance existing knowledge.

One woman has taken her crusade against ALS to the Web, creating a social networking site in the hopes of finding a cure. Dr. Sanjay Gupta has more.

http://www.searchforvideo.com/watchclip.php?title=Networking+For+A+Cure&link=http%3A%2F%2Fthenewsroom.com%2Fdetails%2F3549906&description=One+woman+has+taken+her+crusade+against+ALS+to+the+Web%2C+creating+a+social+networking+site+in+the+hopes+of+finding+a+cure.+Dr.+Sanjay+Gupta+has+more.&source=US&image=http%3A%2F%2Fcache.thenewsroom.com%2Fcbsnews%2F2008%2F12%2F05%2FEve_Gupta_1205_320x240_96x72.jpg&category=directory&searchterm=%252Fhealth%252Fdr.-sanjay-gupta%252F

[TechBear_Seattle]

1. Has Gupta admitted he lied in his trashing of Sicko?

Every time you post something about Dr. Gupta, I am going to be here with this same question, so you may as well respond to it.

[KittyWampus]

2. do you have ANYTHING else to add to the discussion?

[Alexander]

Sounds rather one-note to me.

[TechBear_Seattle]

21. One might ask the same of you

You have spent the day tracking down and posting articles about Dr. Gupta's positions on many issues. Presumably, this is in response to criticism of his nomination to become the next Surgeon General.

No one is questioning his stand on matters health: criticism has generally focused on allegations that he is a shill for Big Pharma and the medical insurance company. One of the key parts of that criticism has been his use of distortions and outright lies to trash Sicko!, Michael Moore's documentary on the greed of medical insurance companies and the very sorry state of healthcare in the US; lies and distortions that continued even after Moore refuted them with well documented references.

I think my question is relevant. It is certainly more relevant than your cheerleading.

[FrenchieCat]

3. here.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bf3bp72G3Y

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

4. "Trashing of Sicko"

Have you admitted your exaggerating the conflict between Gupta and Moore?

[TechBear_Seattle]

22. He went on national television and spoke distortions and outright lies

Even after Moore refuted those distortions and lies point by point. You may also wish to Google the name Paul Keckley, Gupta's "fact checker" who turns out to be executive director of Deloitte Center for Health Solutions, a right-wing think-tank founded by hardcore Republican Tommy Thompson that focuses on shilling for... guess who? The same pharmaceutical conglomerates and insurance companies targeted by Moore's movie.

Please be so kind as to explain how this is merely a "conflict between Gupta and Moore."

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

25. I've read Moore's point by point rebuttal.

He agrees with Gupta more often then not, and has no decent rebuttal to any of Gupta's arguments.

[Odin2005]

5. One. Trick. Pony. n/t

:eyes:

[Occam Bandage]

10. No. He has not admitted that he lied when he:

1. Said that Moore claimed Cuba only paid $25 per annum per capita in health care costs, when the figure is $250. In fact, Moore, actually did say it was $250. Gupta did not apologize for that lie.
2. Said that his guest was not affiliated with a Republican think tank, when he was. Gupta did not apologize for that lie.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

14. Those would be mistakes, not lies.

"1. Said that Moore claimed Cuba only paid $25 per annum per capita in health care costs, when the figure is $250. In fact, Moore, actually did say it was $250. Gupta did not apologize for that lie."

Gutpa made the point that the U.S. spends $7,000 per patient, while Cuba paid $25. That was a transcription error, Cuba pays $250. His point remains, the U.S. spends drastically more per patient than Cuba does. $7000 is still significantly more than $250. Gupta apologized for the error.

"2. Said that his guest was not affiliated with a Republican think tank, when he was. Gupta did not apologize for that lie."

Gupta, or likely some secretary, didn't do their homework. Big fucking deal.

[Occam Bandage]

16. I agree entirely. I listed out the "lies" so people could see how damn mundane they are.

"OMG HE LIED ABOUT SICKO TO DESTROY UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE" sounds bad. "Someone didn't transcribe a zero" doesn't.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

19. Ah, I get it.

Then there's the one about Cuba's lifespan.

Moore et. al. were all upset about Gupta saying the U.S. has a longer life expectancy.

It depends entirely on which study you look at.

[TechBear_Seattle]

23. If Gupta can make so many mistakes so quickly, is he really qualified to be SG?

Please, take a moment and read the point-by-point refutation of Gupta's "mistakes." Then explain how, after this was made available, Gupta continued to "make mistakes" when discussing the movie on national television.

http://www.michaelmoore.com/sicko/news/article.php?id=10017

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

24. From your link-

1. Gupta points out that Cuba's health care is not as good as U.S. healthcare. Moore concedes the point.

2. Gupta points out that the U.S. pays far more per patient than Cuba does, and makes a trivial math error in the process. Moore harps on the error, fails to address Gupta's point.

3. CNN, not Gupta, but CNN points out the U.S. has a higher life expectancy. Moore claims otherwise, failing to point out that it depends on which survey you look at. There are others Moore choose not to post that show the U.S. with a more substantially longer life expectancy.

4. CNN points out that U.S. patients are most satisfied. Moore concedes the point.

5. CNN, not Gupta, but CNN points out the U.S. has short wait times for elective surgery. Moore concedes the point.

6. & 7. Have to do with Keckley.

8. "CNN: "But no matter how much Moore fudged the facts, and he did fudge some facts…"

* This is libel. There is not a single fact that is "fudged" in the film. No one has proven a single fact in the film wrong. We expect CNN to correct their mistakes on the air and to apologize to their viewers."

Moore fudged facts in his own rebuttal, and is no more libel than Moore's petty accusations of libel.

So, yeah, they had a debate. They both came off looking kind of bad. That hardly means Gupta is diametrically opposed to everything Moore stands for.

[TechBear_Seattle]

26. From that same link

1. That Cuba is ranked worse in healthcare than the United States is not the issue. The movie showed very clearly that, according to national rankings made by the World Health Organization, the United States ranked #37 in quality of care compared to Cuba's #39. But his restating of this fact -- clearly given in the movie -- he ignores the points that Moore was making: that the United States ranked only two notches higher than a third world country held hostage by almost half a century of embargoes, and that Cubans have universal access to what medical care is available, which is still more than what millions of Americans can get.

2. Gupta got his facts wrong, flat out. To date, he still has not admitted his error, much less apologized for how he promoted incorrect information as documented fact. That refusal is exactly the point I wish to highlight.

3. The refutations target what Gupta, on CNN, stated about Sicko!. In the refutation of this "mistake," Moore uses the 2006 United Nations Human Development Report. This source was noted in the movie and documented in the companion book. Which source would you have used?

4. Moore did not concede the point. Rather, he pointed out that 47 million Americans are uninsured and are rarely allowed to be patients at all; they were not included in "patient satisfaction." Gupta also ignored consideration of the fact that the other nations in the satisfaction survey had universal or near universal health care, adding a far broader array of people into the survey.

5. The refutations target what Gupta, on CNN, stated about Sicko!. Moore did not concede point, he states that Gupta quoted a single fact about elective surgery. Moore also notes, again, that the US statistic excludes millions of Americans that lack health coverage, while the other five countries in the comparison all have universal or near universal health care systems.

6 & 7. Has Gupta refuted Paul Keckley? No. The fact that Gupta defended Keckley and his alleged research after Keckley's ties to a right-wing think-tank and lobbying group had been made public is relevant with regards to the lies and distortions about Sicko! that Gupta perpetrated.

8. You can, of course, prove that Moore fudged his facts?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

27. Blah blah blah.

"1. That Cuba is ranked worse in healthcare than the United States is not the issue. The movie showed very clearly that, according to national rankings made by the World Health Organization, the United States ranked #37 in quality of care compared to Cuba's #39. But his restating of this fact -- clearly given in the movie -- he ignores the points that Moore was making: that the United States ranked only two notches higher than a third world country held hostage by almost half a century of embargoes, and that Cubans have universal access to what medical care is available, which is still more than what millions of Americans can get."

Moore implies Cuba has a better health care system than the U.S., and glossed over the WHO list. Gupta simply readdressed the WHO list, if Moore doesn't mind this getting pointed out, he's should have no beef with Gupta on the subject.

"2. Gupta got his facts wrong, flat out. To date, he still has not admitted his error, much less apologized for how he promoted incorrect information as documented fact. That refusal is exactly the point I wish to highlight."

He has admitted the error. He got a decimal point in the wrong spot. $251 instead of $25. Moore, and you, have failed to address the point. You're both being petty over a minor issue.

"3. The refutations target what Gupta, on CNN, stated about Sicko!. In the refutation of this "mistake," Moore uses the 2006 United Nations Human Development Report. This source was noted in the movie and documented in the companion book. Which source would you have used?"

If I were going to use the 2006 UN HDR, I'd point out that there's no statistically significant difference between Cuban and U.S. life expectancy. You'll notice he actually uses this report to justify his argument that the Cuban health system is superior to the U.S. system with his rebuttal in #1. This is a perfect example of Moore fudging the facts. The CIA world facts studies, for instance, show the U.S. with a life expectancy 3 years longer than Cuba's.

"4. Moore did not concede the point. Rather, he pointed out that 47 million Americans are uninsured and are rarely allowed to be patients at all; they were not included in "patient satisfaction." Gupta also ignored consideration of the fact that the other nations in the satisfaction survey had universal or near universal health care, adding a far broader array of people into the survey."

That's neither here nor there.

"5. The refutations target what Gupta, on CNN, stated about Sicko!. Moore did not concede point, he states that Gupta quoted a single fact about elective surgery. Moore also notes, again, that the US statistic excludes millions of Americans that lack health coverage, while the other five countries in the comparison all have universal or near universal health care systems."

And Gupta made a point of saying it was about elective surgery. This completely undermines Moore's rebuttal of point #1, where he says "but I showed the WHO list!"

"6 & 7. Has Gupta refuted Paul Keckley? No. The fact that Gupta defended Keckley and his alleged research after Keckley's ties to a right-wing think-tank and lobbying group had been made public is relevant with regards to the lies and distortions about Sicko! that Gupta perpetrated."

Guilt by association. Has Moore ever refuted Ralph Nader's racism? No, and I wouldn't ask him too.

"8. You can, of course, prove that Moore fudged his facts?"

Done.

[Barack_America]

6. Breaking at 11: Kitten up a tree.

To people serious about public health issues, this sort of public health "reporting" is akin to the bullshit fluff piece you see on the news. You want a serious report on Gaza and they want to tell you the heartwarming story of a kitten up a tree and the heroic firefighters that saved him.

[KittyWampus]

7. So covering Ecstasy as a PTSD treatment is a fluff piece? Exposing the US's pathetic AIDs response

is "fluff"?

You have a warped view of what constitutes fluff.

And informing the public of what is going on in Rwanda, Chad and Haiti as well as our minority population is pretty damned important.

[Barack_America]

8. I thought this thread was about encouraging people to turn to "Dr. Google".

:shrug:

Can get the care you need? Google your ailments! That sort of thing.

[Occam Bandage]

11. You should have read the thread, then. Or at least the headline. nt

[Barack_America]

17. I did, but nevermind.

Where did the video include the references to AIDS, Africa, etc. that were the topic of the OP's numerous other threads?

[KittyWampus]

13. Um, no. It's about a woman with incurable disease who starting blogging, found others

with disorder and in process discovered that Lithium might help.

So some ALS patients have tried Lithium and in essence speeded drug trials at lower cost.

[Barack_America]

18. Sorry, missed the bit about PTSD, AIDS, etc. in the video.

[K Gardner]

9. He has covered what CNN TOLD HIM TO COVER. These pieces you are

posting prove absolutely nothing, except that he did what he was paid to do.

[KittyWampus]

12. except you have ZERO evidence to prove your assertion Gupta has no editorial control

and the FACT he's traveled to various countries and seen what's going on with AIDS and other public health issues, reported on that and also done same in the USA indicates you are making crap up.

[K Gardner]

15. You really need to chill out and take a break. Your personal attacks over this subject

are disturbing to say the least.

People have the right to disagree with you.

[berni_mccoy]

20. All the good he's done doesn't take away the fact that he knowingly pushes untruth

He's done it promoting drugs and he's done it when he epically failed to discredit Sicko.

The guy is a hack who isn't above-board or transparent.

He should be nowhere close to the OSG.