McCain: Joe the plumber right about Obama's socialist tax plan

[Douglas Carpenter]

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2008/10/mccain_joe_the.html

snip: "In his weekly radio address today, John McCain uses the ubiquitous Joe the plumber to all but accuse Democratic rival Barack Obama of being a socialist. "


snip: "Joe, in his plainspoken way, said this sounded a lot like socialism," McCain says in his radio address. "And a lot of Americans are thinking along those same lines. In the best case, 'spreading the wealth around' is a familiar idea from the American left. And that kind of class warfare sure doesn't sound like a 'new kind of politics.'

snip:""Well, that's the key to Barack Obama's whole plan: Since you can't reduce taxes on those who pay zero, the government will write them all checks called a tax credit. And the Treasury will cover those checks by taxing other people, including a lot of folks just like Joe. In other words, Barack Obama's tax plan would convert the IRS into a giant welfare agency, redistributing massive amounts of wealth at the direction of politicians in Washington."

Democrats have pointed out, however, that McCain's plan to make healthcare more affordable also includes a "refundable" tax credit that would go to people who don't pay income taxes.

But McCain presses his attack: "At least in Europe, the Socialist leaders who so admire my opponent are upfront about their objectives. They use real numbers and honest language. And we should demand equal candor from Senator Obama. Raising taxes on some in order to give checks to others is not a tax cut it's just another government giveaway." "

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2008/10/mccain_joe_the.html

[Eric J in MN]

1. Is Obama going to send checks to people who don't owe federal taxes,

...and if so, how much?

[endthewar]

2. I guess the stimulus package proposed by Congress falls into this category

otherwise, this claim is an outright lie.

[GoesTo11]

7. A lot of people pay more in social security tax than in federal tax

and social security taxes have just been used to fund ongoing government operations like any other tax (although SS gets promissory notes in return). So even if you don't pay Federal income tax, you can still have your taxes reduced without it being welfare. This is part of the lie of the last 28 years. Taxes aren't progressive once you count the 12.4% you and your employer pay in social security when thre is a ceiling above which you no longer pay the tax.

[RagAss]

3. You mean....Joe the Skinhead !...he's not a plumber.

[frogcycle]

4. ironic that socialism is such a pejorative

"socialism" is used as a pejorative because we have been taught that "capitalism" is good and it is the opposite.

Well, my friends, socialism and capitalism are economic, not political terms. Unfettered, unregulated capitalism leads to oligarchy and fascism. Stirring up the masses to "fight socialism" as if it were a threat to their very being is ironic. Socialism is a philosophy that we all contribute to the common good - that there are things we need as a society. Pure capitalism gives you medieval Europe. All those people "fighting socialism" want to be serfs, I guess.

Building roads is socialism. The defense department is socialism. We have seen in the past eight years what a government that makes every decision based on capitalism vs socialism yields, and it ain't pretty.

One can argue all day about how much should be spent and where the funding should come from, but trying to draw a line and say "NO SOCIALISM" is just stupid.

[WallStreetNobody]

5. How can McCain continue with this Joe the Plumber nonsense when its completely fake

the guy is only making $40,000 per year so would pay less taxes under Obama than under McCain, he even ended up admitting that. He has absolutely no plan to buy his boss' business which in any case doesn't make anywhere close to $250,000. And even if it did it is a 3% increase on the amount over $250,000. Not to mention the guy is not even a real plumber and not a real independent. He has the classic Limbaugh/Hannity talking points as his "platform" and he can't even think for himself when it comes to what would be best for him. The guy is nothing but a fraud who gets his marching orders from right-wing radio and McCain is using him as a campaign prop? How stupid are his supporters? Seriously.

[frogcycle]

6. How stupid are his supporters?

very, very stupid