We underestimate Sarah Palin at our immense peril

[dsc]

Sarah Palin was totally unknown in Alaska when she ran for Lt Gov in a primary and came in second. Still decently unknown she ran against an incumbent governor in a primary, beat him, then beat a former governor 48 to 40 in the general election. She did this with none of the things an unknown candidate usually has when he or she wins. She wasn't famous for anything. She wasn't related to a politician. She wasn't a multi millionaire. She was a two term mayor of a town of 6000 people. She then whipped not one, but two, governors. Add to this that the bar for her will be set so low that an anorexic ant wouldn't be able to crawl under it. Yes, she is wholly unfit to govern, but so was Bush. Yes, she is an intellectually incurious idiot, but so was Bush. Bush got in the White House, all she is shooting for is Blair House. We underestimate her at our peril.

[elkston]

1. Obama and Biden are not UNDERESTIMATING her. That's what counts.

And stop standing up for her ass. What she said at the convention was reprehensible.

[4_Legs_Good]

17. Exactly!!!! Obama and Biden are treating her as a serious contender

Over and over and over again, they refuse to take the easy road, this in an of itself is building her expectations up.

And I agree that she will and should get torn to pieces ultimately because of her disgusting performance at the RNC.

David

[BlooInBloo]

2. Obviously we're all doomed.

[Silent3]

43. I'm not very worried about Palin either...

...but your knee-jerk reaction to interpret every comment you dislike in the slightest as if it must be coming from a freeper saboteur bent on the destruction of Obama and the entire Democratic party is tiring.

Having been utterly mystified how the American public could have watched Bush's debate performances and not thereafter giving either Gore or Kerry a theft-proof 15-20% margin of victory, I can't blame someone for still being worried that folksy and stupid can win. I'm not personally too worried, like I said, but I understand these concerns and don't feel the need to denigrate other DUers for having such worries.

[BlooInBloo]

46. Then stop reading it....

EDIT: Alternatively, tell them to stop making these idiotic threads. If you want a different answer, ask a different question, so they say.

[Silent3]

53. "These idiotic threads" meaning whichever...

...threads you deem idiotic, and you're requesting that I help aid in reinforcing your judgments of idiocy by telling others not to create the threads that offend you?

Yeah, right.

I have my own opinion of where the greater idiocy or offensiveness is located, and I will direct my own commentary accordingly.

If you want a different answer, ask a different question, so they say.

Is this your way of saying that you imagine the responses you post are absolutely essential responses that must be made, and whoever has invoked your wrath should have known better and changed their postings to have avoided your absolutely essential responses?

[BlooInBloo]

57. Great - then we're on the same page!

"I have my own opinion of where the greater idiocy or offensiveness is located, and I will direct my own commentary accordingly."

I'm confused as to how we were at odds in the first place!

:rofl:


EDIT: Oh that's right. You don't want to accord the same privilege to *me*.

[Silent3]

60. What's this about "according privileges"?

I'm commenting on your posts. I can neither grant nor deny your ability to post. I happily acknowledge your every right to post stupid, mean-spirited, overly simplistic knee-jerk reactions to things that fellow members of DU post.

And I, exercising exactly the same degree of freedom, no more or less than yourself, will comment accordingly.

[FatDave]

63. DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMED!

[NightWatcher]

3. Bush was daddy's puppet installed after years of Bushco/CIA influence going back to the 60's

Palin is a flake who caught McHorny's wandering eye

[Rosa Luxemburg]

30. she is there becuase she is controlled also

[NightWatcher]

36. I doubt she's a Carlyle puppet. nor James A Baker's tool

[Rosa Luxemburg]

45. someone must control her?

[kimmerspixelated]

44. McHorny?

You think the old goat still gets it up?

[NightWatcher]

50. thanks to the miracles of modern science and viagra

[MidwestTransplant]

4. She IS NOT going to suck in the debate. The format is perfect for her.

[dkf]

5. She is good in a debate when she knows what she is talking about.

I imagine she would be very good at something like the saddleback forum. She looked OK in the governor's debate, until Tina Fey started parodying her.

I think it all depends on the questions.

[Tallison]

13. And Gwen Ifel's a pro

The questions are going to be hard. Hopefully the fact that she's African-American won't bias the perception.

[RichGirl]

35. Gwen Ifill...

...is straight forward, serious, no nonsense. Biden is very intelligent, knowledgeable and an excellent professional speaker who will also be very serious because that's the nature of a debate. Remember Thursday...it was dull as rain. So, Palin's cutesy style, mannerisms, gestures, general goofyness, may appear out of place. It won't be because she's a woman. Hillary never looked out of place at any debate.

[Tallison]

71. Check out the tough questions she asked during the last VP debate

dkf provided this link down thread:

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/9/28/63953/6191

They're encouragingly tough and specific, difficult to fudge.

[dkf]

40. Someone had a list of questions she asked the last time.

I wish I had it.

[Tallison]

52. That would be good to see...

I'll try googling and post if I can find them.

[dontforgetpoland]

64. Here some of them posted on DKOS this morning. Topic Foreign policy.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/9/28/63953/6191

Seems like pretty specific questions.

[Tallison]

70. It's the specificity that's gonna' trip her

There are ways around such questions, as seasoned politicians know, but forging them requires artful rhetorical skill and, more importantly, a comprehensive enough knowledge base from which to draw herrings. Without one or the other, much less both, fudging's going to be near impossible without looking deceitful and stupid.

I'm encouraged by the link you provided.

[Raschel]

68. She is good in a debate when she knows what she is talking about.

She's a flake and an idiot! Why pretend she's a normal candidate like the press is doing.

She's not.

[tekisui]

6. Things are different on the National Stage than Alaskan politics.

She has a helluva a hole to climb out of. In he previous races, she has not dug herself so deep, and been over her head before.

[Seen the light]

7. Alaska is quite different from the United States

She hasn't proven a damn thing on the national stage so far.

[spindrifter]

8. You are right. We can't afford to underestimate her, but

this time around, people know a lot more about her and how she operates.

[Blue_In_AK]

9. You're right to a degree,

but so much more is known about her now than then. I myself said "underestimate her at your peril" when she was first nominated, but thanks to Alaska's bloggers the mask has come off.

She may benefit from diminished expectations, but I think her charm won't get her nearly as far as it did formerly here in Alaska.

Andrew Halcro's column in this morning's Anchorage Daily News is relevant. He ran against her as an Independent in the gubernatorial campaign in 2006.

Debates Prove Twinkle Trumps Facts
http://www.adn.com/opinion/comment/story/539459.html

<snip>

"Andrew, I watch you at these debates with no notes, no papers and yet when asked questions you spout off facts, figures and policies and I'm amazed. But then I look out into the audience and I ask myself, 'Does any of this really matter?' " Palin said.

<snip>

[ClarkUSA]

10. Palin is the greatest debater since Cicero. Biden will fail to overcome her rhetorical brilliance.

There, are you happy now? :eyes:

[BlooInBloo]

12. pwned.

[ClarkUSA]

54. Heh

:toast:

[sufrommich]

15. Soon she will unleash her giant brain on the

unsuspecting public. I'm scared.

[kimmerspixelated]

47. Good One!

[ClarkUSA]

56. I'm sure the OP is pleased with your Palin fear.

Yeah, I'm quaking in my boots, too.

[Tallison]

72. Wait 'til that rears its head in our airspace

Cover! :yoiks:

[Sparkly]

11. All she has is "folksy appeal," but fortunately Biden's got plenty himself.

I do agree that nobody can be overconfident about the veep debate (or anything else). The fact that Chimpy took two terms means ANYthing, however insane, can happen. The Obama camp has been smart not to denigrate her, nor to really talk much about her at all.

[graywarrior]

14. We underestimated independents and they are showing support for Obama

I trust that Obama and Biden have got this covered. Seriously. They have advisors whom they pay.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

16. She could turn into Abe Lincoln, and Biden could get up & crap on the podium

& it wouldnt make any diff at this point.

[rvablue]

25. You owe me a new keyboard, it's covered in water after reading your post! n/t

[Cha]

48. Don't have any liquid near your

keyboard when you're getting ready to read an A Swartzie post:P

[A-Schwarzenegger]

61. 15 minutes in the dryer'll fix that right up.

Throw in some rose petals first to take away that keyboard stank. :hi:

[kimmerspixelated]

49. God, you guys are funny today!

[BeyondGeography]

18. I agree with the "Palin" and "immense peril" part

[tpi10d]

19. "don't underestimate sarah palin"

I saw several of these posts when she was first nominated, and gave them the benefit of the doubt.

At this time she has a track record on the national stage and it isn't good. She's taking shots from both liberal and conservative sources. She's appeared to be a fish out of water on several widely broadcast interviews.

I'd say her biggest upside would be to keep out of trouble and keep out of the limelight. My guess is she won't do that well.

[Webster Green]

20. The pukes are toast..

She is a fucking joke and everyone knows it.

I can't wait till Nov. 4th :toast:

[yardwork]

21. Hey! We queers in the south think alike on this subject.

See my thread. Bumping yours!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=7230961&mesg_id=7230961

[Fluffdaddy]

22. Dsc, You get it. The wingnuts love her to death

A co-worker was not going to *vote for Mc-nuts because he hates him, but now he will because Palin is a hunting and gun nut like he is.................... Don't underestimate the Palin pick

*He was not going to vote for anyone

[SemiCharmedQuark]

31. Yeah, but presumably voters like that are going to vote Palin no matter what she says up there

The debate isn't going to change people's minds who have already decided.

[Fluffdaddy]

59. True. I think my co-worker knows in his heart that Palin is out of her league. But

*Code Speak* "She's like us" Goes right to the heart of "some" white people.

[Raschel]

69. The debate isn't going to change people's minds who have already decided.

I disagree. There are many who have no idea what an imbecile she is.

Some will tune in to the debate and be in shock.

[Beregond2]

23. It is impossible to underestimate her.

[BlooInBloo]

28. You beat me to it. Sigh.

[RichGirl]

24. The only people who will be impressed with her is us!

We are expecting her to sound like a babbling idiot. So even if she does just a little better than the Couric interview she'll sound like a genius and we'll be hyperventilating. My guess is that she will do a little better, but it will be clear (to the non-obsessed) that she is by no stretch of the imagination qualified to be president.

[Davis_X_Machina]

26. Too late.

Bubbles don't un-pop.

She'll never see favorables above 50 again unless it's the day after she bails.

[Dumak]

27. There are so many naive people on this debate issue

Palin will use an audioprompter via an earpiece, so will avoid coming off sounding like a confused idiot.

[Webster Green]

39. That wouldn't help at all..

Adding additional input would just make her more confused than she already is.

She's toast! :smoke:

[Dumak]

55. It all depends on how well she can focus on the audioprompter

If you look at McCain's performance in the debate with this in mind, you will see that he could not be diverted/interrupted during his short speeches. He had a wild-eyed look, staring off into space. Actually, I am inclined to think his handlers told him to focus on some object and not look away so he wouldn't be distracted, and to just say what was being told him regardless of what anyone else says. With a little practice, it's really not that hard to follow audio cues. We'll see, I hope you're right.

[mtnsnake]

29. I still think the person too many people underestimated is McCain

I remember so many times trying to warn everyone that we shouldn't underestimate him, but everyone seemed to think he'd be such a pushover in the debates. The man is as skilled a liar as anyone going, even as good a liar as Bush, and he gets away with it somehow.

Sarah Palin is simply a fucking joke, something out of a circus. She deserves no respect at all, but we just need to be careful not to screw up and do anything that appears bullyish or sexist. If Biden can just be himself without making any kind of a mistake that can be perceived as sexist, he'll handle her easily. Joe is one of the quickest thinkers on the planet.

[CrispyQ]

32. I hope it comes down to a couple of one liners from each of them,

cuz there is no way Ms. "As Putin rears his head" is going to win against "A noun, a verb & 9/11."

The media is pissed off that the McCain camp has sequestered Palin from them. I think they would go easier on her if McCain had let them have access to the air space between her ears, but now, they're pissed!

The only way we need to worry about Sarah Palin is if McCain wins the election. Let's focus on what's really important -- getting Obama elected.

[Loge23]

33. Don't over-estimate her either

Intellectual comparisons to Bush are fair, but so far she makes Bush look like Cicero next to her.
She hasn't been able to even complete a coherent answer in one-on-ones yet.
I welcome the debate - not for the obvious advantage of Biden (Biden will have to be careful, negating the inherent advantage) - but for putting Palin in a national forum without a script.
Look, she may be cagey enough for Alaska but this is different. Even in Alaska, her popularity has gone down as they listen to her on the national stump.
There's one thing that can't be hidden about her - she's not very bright and that will show.

[Born_A_Truman]

34. Running in Alaska discussing Alaska issues is one thing...

Now she has put herself in national politics discussing national and international issues and she has gone from being a big fish in a small pond to the little fish in a big pond. I am offended that some have lowered the bar so low that if she simply shows up, they will say she won the debate. As a woman, I am offended that anyone would change the rules for her and not expect her to be judged on the same basis as a man. She is either ready for the job or she isn't. I say she's not.

[CakeGrrl]

37. "We"? Maybe the blogosphere. Don't presume to include Obama/Biden in that number

There never seems to be a shortage of people who seem to think that Barack Obama and Joe Biden and Obama's whole team don't know what they're up against. Why is that?

[A-Schwarzenegger]

38. Immense is too small a word. It's more like

GARGANTULIAN

[torbird]

41. I own a TV and I can read.

Game, set, match against Palin. Sorry, but no whack-a-doodle warnings needed here, thank you.

[Warren DeMontague]

42. No, we should REMIND people that she genuinely believes the Earth is 6,000 yrs old.

We should REMIND people that she wants to outlaw the birth control pill and put women in jail who have abortions.

We should REMIND people that she thinks there were T Rexes on "Noah's Ark".

There's nothing to "underestimate". She's a fucking fundy goober, which is why the base of the GOP loves her. She is wildly out of step with most Americans. What we need to do is expose her for what she truly is.

[Waiting For Everyman]

51. I don't underestimate the stupidity of the public.

Palin's a zero.

[Meshuga]

58. It is not about underestimating Sarah Palin. It is about overestimating voters

Many are willing to vote based on gimmick. Remember that Bush, who is perceived as an idiot by most, had enough votes that enabled him to steal a couple of elections.

[Vinca]

62. If you consider the damage Palin has done to herself already,

she could come out of the debate looking like Margaret Thatcher and still have a long hill to climb.

[Pithlet]

65. Big difference between Alaska and the entire country.

"I'm going to have to get back to you". "In what respect, Charlie?" "Russia is next to Alaska". Sorry, not worried about underestimating her all that much. I think you're giving her way too much credit.

[dgibby]

66. It's the groups backing her

that we shouldn't underestimate. That's the real threat.

[1Hippiechick]

67. Bog from Mudflats w/pix of Wasilla, and readers' comments. 90% favorable fell miserably after Troop

ergate.

http://mudflats.wordpress.com/2008/08/29/what-is-mccain-thinking-one-alaskans-perspective/

Another link about the witchdoctor-referencing preecher:

http://mudflats.wordpress.com/2008/09/25/palin-and-the-witch-hunter-chapter-ii/

One response:

I’m going to keep saying this until people listen. I am 72, same age as McCain, and I am a Republican so I feel I had a right to say it. The Social Security actuarial tables say that a 72 YO man has a 1 in 3 chance of dying in the next 8 years. That same 72 YO man has a 15% chance of dying in the next 4 years. If McCain wins there’s a chance you might be saying President Palin. Scary isn’t it?

[vanderBeth]

73. OH NOOOOOOOOOESSSSS!11!! !!eleven!!1 1!!