My uncle, a Vietnam vet and Green Beret, wants to do this to McCain in mid-October

[zulchzulu]

I have an uncle who served three tours in Vietnam and was awarded the Legion of Merit and many other decorations including the Master Parachutist badge. He was a Green Beret while serving there has nothing but complete distrust and scorn for the likes of John McCain.

He has heard all the stories about McCain's accident on the USS Forrestal. He knows about his nearly flunking grades while scraping his ass out of Annapolis and only by the connections of his family did he graduate. He knows about how McCain was denouncing his country no sooner than 72 hours after he was captured after getting shot down, which was probably due to being a shitty pilot that was flying too close to land. He knows about McCain's propaganda films where he was a star in saying that all Americans there were war criminals and gave coordinates and military strategy to the enemy.

My uncle was almost caught several times and essentially would parachute into battles where there was nothing but fire and zero visibility. He saw many of his friends die right in front of him.

What does he think of John McCain as a "war hero"? For a man who rarely cusses, he has nothing but contempt for him and makes it known in colorful clearness. He lets people he knows (lives in Florida) who are for McCain just exactly what he thinks and prefaces it with "as a Vietnam Green Beret who served in three tours..." and their jaws drop. They can't escape the truth.

He wants to have a 527 expose McCain in mid-October as a scoundral and a turncoat... a political punch so hard and effective that it is unsurvivable politically for McCain.

I couldn't agree with him more. McCain can do his childish ads now, but he is in for the kind of blowback that will absolutely sear any chance that he has any respect once the fog clears.

[The Traveler]

1. I can't believe I'm doing this

Frack it.

Ya know, I could defend John "Reverse-Ace" McCain.

But I'm not going to ... :evilgrin:

[billyoc]

3. HAHA! Did the NVA ever acknowledge his ace status for them?

:rofl:

[The Traveler]

5. I understand

they arrange a secret tryst with a notable American actress who once manned an anti-aircraft gun ...

:evilgrin:

:rofl:

[sofa king]

12. There was a guy once....

I believe he was part of the AVG in China--the "Flying Tigers"--who managed to wreck five planes.

One night his fellow pilots painted five American flags under the cockpit of his (current) plane.

That having been said, I'm not sure tit-for-tat is really fair or reasonable. There is no question that whatever else McCain did or didn't do during Vietnam, he was there and he paid dearly for being there.

I recently had no problem spelling out much of what was mentioned in the OP to a freeping troll here, but I did it specifically to point out the freeper's use of the word "pampered" to describe Obama, and to point out that McCain's entire military career was guided from above despite his obvious errors and shortcomings.

In retrospect, I don't think it's very honorable to disparage anyone's war record, even if their bitch-zombies are trying to hold it above the other candidate. I regret doing it.

[roguevalley]

21. Hug your uncle. most men of that age don't talk about war unless

to others who served the same kind of tour. My uncle was first marine on Guadalcanal and only hinted about it when he watched Baa, Baa, Black Sheep. He chuckled and said, "that's just how it was." Hug him for me.

[The Traveler]

25. Alas like my father, my uncles are gone

Survivors of WWII. Irish Catholic sons of a man who came here and watched his older brother die of pneumonia while they waited to be processed in. By the time the war breaks out, this immigrant is wealthy and connected. But his sons went to war.

They certainly had a different view of things. Kennedy Democrats to their dying day.

[yellerpup]

2. Give the man the floor.

He's earned the right to speak freely in any forum. I'd love to hear what he has to say. K&R :kick:

[WeDidIt]

4. Um,...er,....uh...

oh forget it.

I disavoy any knowledge. Yeronyerown.

Give him hell

[zulchzulu]

6. PM me if you are in Northern Florida and want to meet him

He is a very great person. He's near Orlando.

[1Hippiechick]

7. Hear, hear! He gets my vote - I lost friends and family who were drafted in the 60s to go to fight

in that God-forsaken place. FUCK the warmongers who sacrifice our young people!

[Thothmes]

23. You mean President Lyndon B. Johnson

[1Hippiechick]

28. Huh? n/t

[Thothmes]

29. He was the warmonger that sacrificed those youths 1n the mid 60s

[1Hippiechick]

30. Was responding to"He wants to have a 527 expose McCain in mid-October as a scoundral and a turncoat"

[Mz Pip]

8. It may happen

I heard an interview with a guy from Montana a few months ago who was part of some group that was going to do a 527 on McCain. Whether or not they will really do this is yet to be seen. The guy had this who conspiracy thing going on about how McCain was a collaborator and was called "Songbird".

I think it's pretty scuzzy. It's too much like the swiftboating of John Kerry.

[MadMaddie]

27. Is it swiftboating if it is the truth?

There seems to be more than enough men who were there that keep coming out with the same story.

[unblock]

9. would your uncle be willing to speak at the convention?

THAT i'd like to see!

[zulchzulu]

10. He probably would LOVE to...

The guy doesn't mince words. And he does it with a smile.

It was actually pretty funny when he visited me in Madison in 2004. He was (still is) a HUGE Wesley Clark fan. He would just walk up to people and ask if they had heard about Wesley Clark who was running for President. He's kind of a big dude so his intentions were not always read correctly. But the guy would just love to get into people's faces that wanted to call his a "liberal" or worse. I would stand far enough back in case he started swinging.

That said, he's a very spiritual person as well. He's getting close to 80 at this point and is also involved in helping counsel young vets that have come back from the recent wars. He has seen it all.

[eshfemme]

24. He sounds like he'd be a kickass addition to any party, political or fun. :) n/t

[smoogatz]

11. One thing...

I think you misrepresent your uncle somewhat when you say he "has several medals of honor." There's only one medal that's commonly referred to as "the medal of honor," and that's the Congressional Medal of Honor. They don't give out very many of them, and when they do, as far as I know, they only give out one per recipient. So, your uncle may have multiple bronze or silver stars for valor in combat, etc., but he probably doesn't have a Medal of Honor, and he almost certainly doesn't have more than one.

[zulchzulu]

13. Here's more specifics...

He was awarded the Legion of Merit and many other decorations including the Master Parachutist badge. I edited the OP.

[smoogatz]

14. Then you'd probably want to say that.

Those are fine citations and no doubt indicate distinguished and even heroic service, but the Medal of Honor is in a class of its own. In fact, of the 3467 total awarded, 620 were awarded posthumously--which kind of tells you something about the kind of thing you have to do to earn one.

I just looked it up (obsessive me): there have only been 19 double recipients of the MoH in its 145-year history.

[DustyJoe]

17. MOH and Legion of Merit

You are right, very few double awards. Vietnam only had 246 men receive the MOH and 151 of those were killed in combat. The Legion of Merit has awarded 1104 medals since 1942 and is a neck-awarded medal like the MOH. I had the pleasure of serving with a living MOH recipient Charles Litkey a Chaplain who was the bravest man I ever met in November/December 1967.

[sofa king]

16. As best I can tell, there were only 19 two-time MH winners.

Five of them won separate Army/Navy/Marine awards for the same action. No double-recipients served after World War I. One guy won his awards under an assumed name!

Interestingly, 61 Canadians have won the award while serving in the U.S. armed forces.

Since the end of Vietnam, there have been seven recipients of the award. None were alive to accept it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medal_of_honor

(edit: obviously, I'm late to the party, and I wasn't clear about it, either)

[roguevalley]

22. some women won them in the civil war but had to give them back.

ARRRGH! :grr:

[Arkansas Granny]

15. Even if everything you have listed about McCain can be proven to be the truth,

I am afraid that trying to use stories about his military experience and his POW status against him will backfire and cost Obama votes in the long run.

There is enough material that can be used about McCain without doing this.

[JuniperLea]

18. I believe you are right about that

It would backfire big time. The RW has it in their heads that he is a war hero... that will never change, and they will never believe whatever truths that could be found so show otherwise. Best to just leave that part alone.

There is plenty enough other material.

I hope to God Obama understands this... he seems to...

[zulchzulu]

19. It would be 527s doing the realization, not Obama

There is an absolutely perfect reason to expose McCain as what he really is. I doubt it would backfire at all. For the few that would be "offended", there would be plenty that would finally see just really who the real John McCain is.

It's going to happen nonetheless...

[ChimpersMcSmirkers]

20. Tell him to keep us posted. I'd give his or similar group some cash.

I've been thinking that there are alot of vets who aren't particularly impressed with McCrash and his Admiral father, Admiral Grandfather and his 5th from last graduation rank from Annapolis. I'd even wager that there are folks who worked with him, and who aren't impressed, who can tell stories of how McCrash got special treatment.

[zulchzulu]

26. I'll keep you posted

It will happen.