What has to be said, cannot be said in a campaign. The only way out of Iraq

[CK_John]

and Afghanistan is a military draft and about 750,000 troops on the ground and 300,000 support personnel. In order to pull out Blackwater and then the National Guard we have to get control of the situation, or continue to flounder for another couple of yrs and be right back where we are at now.

Else we just packup and leave, neither of which will be acceptable or win an election.

With K Rove working for McCain be ready to face this issue or getout in front of it.

[Evergreen Emerald]

1. over my dead body

Will my daughter be used to clean up GW's bigfuckingmess.

[MadMaddie]

2. I am just guessing that Obama has many, many fired or retired

Military leaders adising him and I am sure they are working on a plan.



No doubt about it.

[tekisui]

3. mcdubya has already acknowledged the need for a draft if his Iran bombing

fantasy happens.

Get if front by saying Mcdubya wants to re-start a draft to clean-up after War Crimes Chimpy.

And then say, aw fuck no! We're leaving, No New Draft.

[kentuck]

4. I fear that a draft would not solve the problem either...

I recall when we had 548,000 troops in Vietnam under the same logic. It didn't work.

I think there will still be a civil war in Iraq, and in the short term, we stand a better chance for success in Afghanistan.

The violence in Iraq will be kept under wraps until the money machine is turned off. If the Congress does not allocate $200 billion per year to bribe the different tribal leaders, then it will turn bad. The number of troops in the surge had very little impact on the present situation in Iraq. The Sunni had already made deals with the Americans even before the surge began. The "surge" is nothing but an illusion. It always has been.

But now, the Taliban is re-grouping in Afghanistan and Pakistan. We lost 9 troops in Afghanistan last week - none in Iraq. The troops now in Iraq will be sent to Afghanistan to fight the Taliban and Iraq will be left to their own devices for awhile. I am skeptical that anything good is going to come out of the situation in Iraq. It will bedevil Barack Obama or the next President for entire next term, in my opinion.

[CK_John]

5. In Nam we started small and then threw in 500,000 but never defined the situation.

In Iraq the situation is now defined but not under control. Afghanistan is totally undefined, poppy dealers and pipe lines vs an 8th century culture. Do we pick one or the other to try and destroy or can be buy our way out?

These are the things that we as a people need to discuss and if not the perception of our candidates will be made on the unspoken solution.

How do we get to that point?

[Danger Mouse]

6. no way in hell should my generation have to clean up for bush's clusterfuck.

[CK_John]

7. I agree but your generation is the the ones in Iraq and the problem is getting them out. n/t

[Danger Mouse]

9. just leave. no more american blood for bush's mistake.

[AndyTiedye]

8. Pack Up and Leave Sounds Pretty Good

[CK_John]

10. How a solution is framed and who frames the solution will win the election. This will take a lot of

framing but the tougher of the two solutions I presented. But may be doable, if framed right. The goals of both is to get out of Iraq and win the election.

[AndyTiedye]

11. A Draft Will Do Neither

We would become even more entrenched there with all those troops,
and we would be slaughtered in the following elections, because the war is already as unpopular as Vietnam ever was,
and forcing everyone's kids to fight it would be twice as unpopular as that.

Ask the UN to help. Tell them our country was taken over by criminals but we're better now.
Turn Bush and Cheney over to the Hague for war crimes trials.

The mess Bush** and DarthCheney have created over there cannot be "cleaned up" with any number of American troops.
They don't want us there and we should leave.

[CK_John]

12. How and who can present that solution and win the election. n/t

[quakerboy]

14. If someone were to present a working solution

they would win the election. The problem is that there is NO such working solution. My generation, and the one after us are not ok with being drafted. Nor are our parents. Nor our grandparents, for those who still have them. 5 years ago maybe. 2 years ago, doubtful. Now, not a chance in hell. Dropping it all and leaving is distasteful to many as well.

There is NO solution to Iraq that will win the election. Not this year. Its not a winning issue for McCain. And it is now a problem for Obama with those who percieve him to have changed on this issue. Keep dreaming.

[spag68]

13. Draft is not the answer

I could be wrong, however I don't think so , when I say that if it is announced that we are leaving It will work. My prediction is that we can get out in much less then 16 months. Then the biggest fight will be between the Iraqi's and the oil people trying to steal their oil. All the equipment there is junk, so just leave it. all the buildings are junk, so just leave them, perhaps after a few of their people get electrocuted in the showers they will tear them down. Why should we care who gets the oil? Let them fight over it if they want, we need renewables any way. Let's just get on with our life,it will be hard enough after bush as it is.

[JohnnyLib2]

15. Bush bequeaths the quagmire very soon--

I think you are correct in seeing that this will be a big loud issue in the next few months. Sigh....

[skooooo]

16. It won't happen.

No way, no how.