Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Attention Obama and Clinton Supporters! "Missing Positivity" Needed!

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:12 AM
Original message
Attention Obama and Clinton Supporters! "Missing Positivity" Needed!
Fellow Democrats! I have not seen such Democratic negativity since 1972. Pat Buchanan, the man responsible for making the 1972 Democratic Presidential Campaign so negative said on the night of the New Hampshire primary on his gig at the General Electric network:

BUCHUNAN: Barack Obama, he got the young people and he got the educated, the ones with the PHD.s. Now when this goes to South Carolina, Chris, I think what is going to happen is Barack Obama may very well win that and do very well among African-Americans, and the Democratic party will break down into a youth, African-Americans and educated against the Humphrey coalition, sort of McGovern versus Humphrey, working class women, elderly with Hillary.
And this looks like really the paradigm going forward for the Democratic nomination.


Now, there is nothing I hate worse than seeing Pat Buchanan proved right. Can I get an amen on that? Especially when I have strong reason to believe that he and Joe Scarborough and Tim Russert and Chris Matthews and a lot of conservative pundits at Fox and the Washington Post and elsewhere have been attempting to paint Barack Obama as the candidate who represents Blacks and people with college degrees and youth and liberals and Clinton as the candidate who represents women and the elderly and the working class (minus Blacks but plus Latinos). And I know that isnt right, because they both represent me.

I especially hate it when as of Iowa and New Hampshire, the above quote was not even true demographically---except in the devious imagination of conservative dirty tricksters like Pat Buchanan. Now, they have all of us at DU drinking their splitter flavored kool aid. They have the voters identifying with one of the two Democratic because the TV pundits tell them they should. They even have Obama staying out of some states, because he knows those states are Clinton territory and Clinton avoids certain areas because those are Obama territorywhich makes Pat Buchanans divide and conquer games a self fulfilling prophecy.

And we know what the Founders of the country said about solidarity.

We must all hang together or we shall surely hang separately!
Thomas Paine

We know what Cesar Chavez said

You are never strong enough that you don't need help.


We know that Mother Jones said

My friends, it is solidarity of labor we want. We do not want to find fault with each other, but to solidify our forces and say to each other: "We must be together; our masters are joined together and we must do the same thing."


We know that Eugene Debs said

When we are in partnership and have stopped clutching each other's throats, when we have stopped enslaving each other, we will stand together, hands clasped, and be friends. we will be comrades, we will be brothers, and we will begin the march to the grandest civilization the human race has ever known.


And Dr. King moved the world when he said

The oceans of history are made turbulent by the ever-rising tides of hate. History is cluttered with the wreckage of nations and individuals that pursued that self-defeating path of hate. Love is the key to the solution of the problems of the world.


So, I am asking DUers to post links and photos showing Obama in solidarity with women and Latinos and the elderly and blue collar workers. And while we are at, can we get some photos of Clinton with college kids and African-Americans? And maybe even a picture of Obama and Clinton were she isnt trying to stick a knife in his back and he isnt accusing her of sticking the knife in? Can we get links about the candidates talking Democratic Unity and Solidarity and how they plan to unite after the convention to take the White House back from the Party that stole in 2000 and 2004?

Remember, the bosses that run this country do not want us to remember this photo.



And they did not like this one



Nothing delights Republicans more than Democratic infighting. Nothing shakes the Republican Party in its boots like the sight of Solidarity. Show them something to make Dr. King and Eleanor Roosevelt proud and to make Bush and Cheney tremble in fear.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:17 AM
Response to Original message
1. Indeed it is missing from some...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:39 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. That is a nice thread by Obama supporters - put Hill on as VP and get 600 posts - or
dis her and prove Pat Buchanan proved right.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:47 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. Pat Buchanan proved right" - sadly Pat is spot on - I expect Hill denied VP and a 72 repeat
Ondeed it appears a result that seniors/older women will demand if Hill not on ticket.

The VP never really brings votes to the ticket - but if it doesn't unite the party it takes votes away.

The judge nomination fear factor is dead for this election given control of Congress - so that will not unite.

And the Obama folks appear as arrogant as their leader.

I'll be working for down ticket this go round - leaving Pres blank or voting Obama with zero passion seems the role assigned seniors by the Obama fans.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kaleko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. No one can assign anything to you. You're your own man.
Or woman. Totally responsible for what you do and feel.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 07:25 AM
Response to Reply #10
21. You miss Papau's point completely
Based on the feedback Papau gets from observing the demeanor and behavior of Obama and his minions, he has made the wise decision to work for down ballot candidates and let Obama get himself elected without his help.

You have so much to learn, young one.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kaleko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #21
47. Hmm, no. I get the psychodrama that's being enacted online.
And I'll leave the role players to their own devices.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
grantcart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #21
52. Papau specifically has advocated the defeat of Obama in the fall
if Hillary is not on the ticket in the fall in other threads
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #52
59. ...and your point is???
So what? I won't work for Obama either. I won't donate to him. I'll work for down ballot friends rather than someone like Obama. Besides, we're going to need an even stronger Congress when Obama loses 40 states. So I kinda look at it like I'm helping to clean up the mess Obama and his minions have done.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Usrename Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 03:20 AM
Response to Reply #8
17. You can vote for whomever you want.
If you think having a landslide for the Dems this cycle is not important, then by all means avoid the popular movement of anti-war voters.

Fuck them!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:37 AM
Response to Reply #8
29. "arrogant as their leader" didn't you truly mean to type "as uppity as their darkie hero?"
Edited on Fri May-23-08 08:39 AM by ShortnFiery
It's so CLEAR when people begin to USE the racist Buchanan as a rallying cry to come together.

Why do you think that Buchanan is "in the tank" for HRC? Selflessly DEFENDING her at every damn opportunity?

WHY IS THAT?

They're both, at heart, southern racists who know how to play WEDGE politics.

The sooner you FACE THE FACTS that HRC is even playing "racial politics" in Puerto Rico attempting to pit Browns against Blacks ("Now I don't want anyone in Puerto Rico voting for ME just because Barack Obama is Black" :puke: ) ... the sooner you REFLECT - honestly REFLECT and face reality ... the sooner you can distance yourself from both Clintons.

I know it hurts ... yes, it hurts BAD to realize that "the Clintons" are shameless race baiters and do not deserve our respect. For myself, I honestly adored HRC during the 1990s. It still hurts.

It's your choice, either FACE FACTS and come join us against "race baiting" or continue to delude yourself that you are NOT in league with Pat Buchanan and other Southern Strategists, both democratic and republican. :shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cbayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #29
46. why am I not surprised that the first negative, ugly post on this thread would be yours.
This is a very positive and helpful OP written by one of the most thoughtful posters at DU. You just came in here and smeared your same old bile, which requires no thought at all, all over it.

Fortunately I see less and less of your group around.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
noiretextatique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #29
49. hillary clinton is not a southerner
and until very recently, bill clinton had god-like status among many black people.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 06:37 PM
Response to Reply #29
57. Why is it , with you, if some one doesn't support Obama, they have to be racist? It's funny when
I looked up the word "arrogant" in the dictionary I saw absolutely NO reference to race.Not every one that doesn't support Obama is a racist and saying they are is playing the race card. IMO
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
PVnRT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #6
42. Way to completely ignore the point of the thread
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:26 AM
Response to Original message
2. wow, that ages you
even a geezer like me was only 10 years old in 1972

I got real negative though when I saw McGovern on TV saying that the space program was a waste of money. I was almost mad enough to walk to Mitchell and punch him in the kneecaps.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. I was 13. Obama wants to make Cesare Chavez BD national holday.
Edited on Fri May-23-08 12:38 AM by McCamy Taylor
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. that's July 28th, right?
His uncle's birthday is too close to Easter and April fools day. Sinco de Mayo might work better, and it has the added benefit of being Karl Marx's birthday. Nice picture, it's too bad they cannot be on the same side.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JoFerret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:35 AM
Response to Reply #9
28. They ARE on the same side
get used to it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #4
34. Propagandy alert: you forgot to ADD that Bubba fully buys into this concept.
Damn, could you be any more deceptive and disingenous? WAIT! Don't answer that. ;)

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #2
33. McGovern was spot on ... times were hard (I was 14 y.o.) - we have homeless veterans YET
we can shell out BIG BUCKS for "space" and the asinine MONEY PIT known as "missle defense."

These CASH COW programs need not be defunded but THEY MUST BE scaled down.

George MCGovern is an American Treasure. The M$M and the right wing tainted him erroneously - not unlike the once laudable title "liberal."

With the rule of the right and corporate Clintonian DLC, our country is RULED by a right wing duolpy.

Obama may be our last chance to pull our beloved party "back to it's center." It won't happen with HRC on the ticket. :(
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SlipperySlope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:29 AM
Response to Original message
3. *deleted*
Edited on Fri May-23-08 12:30 AM by SlipperySlope
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hokies4ever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:36 AM
Response to Original message
5. Who are the two women in the 2nd photo?
and yes, I reject and denounce my ignorance for not knowing, but please do tell. :patriot:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:40 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Eleanor Roosevelt and Marian Anderson
Edited on Fri May-23-08 12:40 AM by McCamy Taylor
Here is a link

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/eleanor/filmmore/reference/interview/jarrett02.html

I'm not too sure that America realized what that concert symbolized, because it struck at the very depths of racism in America. No one had asked Marian Anderson to integrate anything. The Howard University's music department usually sponsored someone of renown every year, and in 1939 they had chosen Marian Anderson, who had been hailed by none other by Arturo Toscanini as being one voice in a million.

And so they could no longer go to the small high school auditorium, and they asked Washington DC's school board to let them have the Central High auditorium, which was white, because it was bigger. They were rejected. A petition was drawn up, and they finally decided to let them have the high school, but one time only. "We're not going to do this again." Now, this was a public high school, refusing to let one of the great voices of our time sing.

So someone thought of the idea of: Why not go to the DAR, its Constitution Hall, which would certainly be ample? The Daughters of the American Revolution, DAR, said no, because of her color. Mrs. Roosevelt was a member of the DAR. She became a columnist, I think with Scripps-Howard. And she wrote a column titled My Day. She denounced this act and said that she was resigning from the DAR. And then she and the great lawyer Charles Houston, and of course Walter White and some others met, and they decided something even more grandiose. They got together with Harold Ickes. I think he was one of the great advisors to President Franklin Roosevelt. And of course Chapman was one of the other advisors. And they decided to have a big expression of what America should be like at the Lincoln monument. And the idea was accepted. Franklin Roosevelt, because of requests from Mrs. Roosevelt and from Chapman, decided to go for broke. Upwards of 75,000 stood there on an Easter Sunday morning and cheered as this great woman sang. Now, everybody knew that Mrs. Roosevelt was behind this. Now, she didn't do it alone, but she was behind it. And that helped set her off.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:37 AM
Response to Original message
11. I support Obama and Clinton. Keep registering voters everyone!! Whooo Hooo
we got millions and millions more voters already.

Thank you Hillary
Thank you Barack

Keep that train a rollin'

Whoooo Hooooo
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lilith Velkor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:40 AM
Response to Original message
12. Solidarity
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AuntPatsy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:43 AM
Response to Original message
13. Not surprising how little attention your post gets wishing for solidarity
and proving such is just what we need.....its time to make a choice, its time to quit allowing the re pubs to decide our actions....we should be ashamed that we are once again allowing them to direct our actions....

Keep repeating your thread please, your message is needed.....instead of the outrage being directed at who is in charge and destroying out country it has been allowed to once again be misdirected....

Stop and remember..stop and think...

they will steal it again if we don't come together...and we will be able to blame no one but ourselves this time, we have been warned...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillyToad Donating Member (389 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:06 AM
Response to Reply #13
24. This board is about 95% Obama supporters now
Edited on Fri May-23-08 08:11 AM by WillyToad
They have literally driven away half of the board. Do you really honestly believe they are interested in Solidarity with the other half of the party? This board has degenerated into one big anti-Clinton circle jerk, and it mirrors the Left wing media and the party nationally.

I truly believe that this will bode very bad for OBama come November, sadly, and it is largely Obama's fault for standing idly bye and allowing his 'support' to degenerate to such a vitriolic level.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Maria Wr Donating Member (58 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #24
41. Willy Toad
I have tried to have decent conversations on this site and other w/Hillary supporters. It is like some (SOME) of them have covered their ears and sing LALALA real loud so they don't have to hear the truth. And the vile spew ....many of them (SOME) gleefully repeat Repug talking points and smear emails as well. If you do not believe me, go see Hillaryis44, Talk Left, No Quarter and Taylor Marsh. You need an asbestos fire suit to visit their blog sites.
Who going to bring them around? Sheesh...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NBachers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:42 AM
Response to Reply #13
31. I still come here
and I have all along - I just avoid the headlines and threads full of Democrat-clubbing zealots. I've made posts arguing for less inter-party mayhem. The comments I've received have been abusive, insulting and discouraging. Obama supporters need to heed their candidate and practice a little more diplomacy. I support Obama, but I'd vote for Clinton if she were nominated.

I just hate to see the feeding frenzy the blood-militant Obama supporters direct toward the millions who deign to be reasonable about Clinton.

It's the RICO Republican/Corporate/Fascist reptiles we should be fighting, not each other. Back off with the insults. Don't gloat yourself into a corner you can't get out of.

If you think, "It's OK to abuse those people, they don't agree with me!" then you've got a lot to learn.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ann_american2004 Donating Member (480 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #31
43. yahhoooy you get five stars
and the golden goose! Love this reply!

But Democrat-clubbing zealots aren't so bad - they know the best bars' bouncers. Get you in for free!!!! Weeeeeeeeeeee...

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:55 AM
Response to Original message
14. I remember back in '56, when the NPL joined the Dems
to create a winning coalition, the Democratic Non-Partisan League.
Quentin Burdick (Dem-NPL ND) won election to Congress in red North Dakota as a result.

Unity created a winning ticket and a now long history of Dem-NPL Senators in a red state.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quentin_N._Burdick

Quentin Northrup Burdick (June 19, 1908 September 8, 1992) was a United States Senator from North Dakota from August 8, 1960 until his death in 1992. Prior to that he had served in the United States House of Representatives from January 3, 1959 to August 8, 1960. He was the son of NPL North Dakota Congressman Usher L. Burdick. ... Like his father, Quentin Burdick was a member of the progressive Non-Partisan League, which placed its candidates on the Republican Party primary ballot until 1956, when the NPL aligned with the Democratic Party and became the Democratic-NPL.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byron_Dorgan

Kent Conrad (Dem-NPL ND) was next elected to the same seat. In 1992, the Democratic incumbent, Kent Conrad opted not to run for re-election because of a campaign promise. Byron Dorgan (Dem-NPL ND) won the election for the seat. ... that September ... Quentin Burdick, died and Conrad ran for the seat in the special election. Conrad took the new seat in 1992 and Dorgan assumed Conrad's old seat a few weeks early. Dorgan was re-elected in 1998 and 2004. Conrad later was elected for a full term ...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Usrename Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 03:16 AM
Response to Original message
15. Wrong!
Not too many of us here at DU are against Obama for president.

Just a few very loud individuals are disrupting any attempt at total unity here.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AuntPatsy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 03:18 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. More than a few, pretty shocking actualy...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 07:28 AM
Response to Reply #15
22. Translation:
Hillary supporters are disrupting our group think Obama circle jerk.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
skepticscott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 05:15 AM
Response to Original message
18. Pat Buchanan was right
about our little expedition to Iraq being a huge mistake. Did you hate seeing him proved right about that, too? The truth is the truth, and it isn't any more so or less so because of who states it.

And btw, the quote about "hanging separately" is from Benjamin Franklin, not Thomas Paine. Are the rest of your attributions that inaccurate?


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #18
35. Hello! He's a right wing PROTECTIONIST - "state's rights" (racism as a side effect) republican ...
not unlike the lion's share of my extended family.

I know the right wing racists for a member of my family was formally invited to join the John Birch Society during the early 70s. :wow:

When you are citing RW Conservatives (not Neo-Conservatives) you're talking a protectionist policy.

There was no true LOGIC to Pat Bucannan's wish NOT to invade Iraq. We may have been on the same side BUT for different reasons. Not unlike HRC and FOX have enjoyed *racial politics* and have UNITED together. SAME SHAMELESS RACIST TACTICS (HRC, Buchanan, Scarborough and FOX News)- DIFFERENT CAUSES.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #18
48. Pat Buchanan TOLD the GOP bloggers (at DU) what to post to make his prophecy true.
Edited on Fri May-23-08 12:31 PM by McCamy Taylor
When he and the boys started predicting the divide within the Democratic Party along the lines he outlines, it was their way of telling every Republican with a computer "Go online and register at every liberal forum and start doing CREEPy tricks". Because 1972 has a whole other significance for the GOP than it does for the Democrats.

Pat Buchanan was not "right". He has been giving the fascist foot soldiers their marching orders. So has Tim Russert, Tom Brokaw, Joe Scarborough and some others. Live on the General Electric network. At the same time that GE pimps KO to get Democrats to watch so that these guys can spew splitter crap like "Latinos wont vote for Blacks" in advance of California. Not "Latinos like Clinton". "Latinos won't vote for Blacks."

Way to Divide and Conquer a Democratic Party.

Pat Buchanan should have gone to jail for lying to Congress about his involvement in Watergate. He should not be on TV commenting on the Democratic Primary when he criminally fucked with the 1972 Dem. Primary.

I will give my own Amen on that.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TBF Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #48
56. Pat Buchanan had nothing to do with the ad Hillary Clinton ran in which she
declared that she and John McCain were the only 2 candidates capable of running the country. While right-wingers can certainly infiltrate, and they love democratic in-fighting, they don't have to do anything if Hillary makes statements like this on her own. I've been a strong Obama supporter but my husband was supporting Hillary until she told the press that the votes didn't matter because the superdelegates would give her the win. When he heard that statement he switched to Obama.

There is more going on here than republican shenanigans. Until you are honest about Hillary's role in the divisiveness there are many people who are not going to take your words re "unity" seriously.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
budedis Donating Member (26 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-24-08 12:43 AM
Response to Reply #48
61. Buchanan isn't the only one who should have gone to jail.
Cheney and Rumsfled were there with John Dean and "let" Dean take the heat. Does anyone think they were innocent bystanders, kept out-of-the-loop? I wish we could have seen Sam Ervin rip Rummy-cake and Big Time new ones. Buchanan is a dick, right or wrong, if he says 2+2=4 he is right and no less a dick. Buchanan is irrelevant.

The enemy if you are a Clinton supporter is McCain. The enemy if you are an Obama supporter is McCain. McCain is more of the Bush-neocon foreign policy bullshit, more of the market-forces will fix health care bullshit, more of the tax cut cure-all bullshit, more of the "moral values" bullshit, more of the same old shit that fucked everything up bullshit!!

There are many voters who will reject Clinton based on gender and hatred of Bill. Many voters who will reject Obama because of half of his racial heritage, even though they won't admit it, don't wear hoods, don't burn crosses, ...

Please stop bashing one another and focus on the real opponent. He is an easy target. All he really has is his prisoner of war experience and a very rich (and mafia connected) spouse. Hit him on everything else and he will fall.

Is Don Segretti available to call Domino's and order a dozen pizzas for every McCain HQ?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 07:18 AM
Response to Original message
19. Your wisdom should be noted by all Obama supporters
Edited on Fri May-23-08 07:21 AM by Gman
Threads here like: "Recommend this thread if you have lost all respect for Hillary Clinton." (480 recs) or "OBAMA SAID NO-The Nightmare Ticket Is Dead" or "Hillary Clinton should NOT be Obama's VP. Please rec if you agree!" confirm for this Hillary supporter that the right thing to do is sit back in November, work for and donate to down ballot candidates and watch Obama crash and burn in a spectacular 40 state loss. Obama is dead political meat without Hillary's supporters as was McGovern without the Humphrey coalition.

Pat Buchanan is extremely astute and he is exactly right. Funny how other pukes like Rove and even Rush are all exactly right on this one. NOw it goes against the group think of DU to ever say a puke is right, even if he says the sky is blue and roses are red. Sorry, I don't want any part of that.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tom Rinaldo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 07:23 AM
Response to Original message
20. Nice thread. Well done. K&R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EV_Ares Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 07:36 AM
Response to Original message
23. Good post, good points and appreciate the various quotes which are
true. Thanks.

Recommend.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:12 AM
Response to Original message
25. Your argument became specious the moment you cited an undisputed RACIST known as Pat Buchanan
Edited on Fri May-23-08 08:17 AM by ShortnFiery
No, the heart warming PICs didn't make up for "The Southern Strategy" undercurrent. :nuke:

The Clintons have played racially divisive POLITICS since they were sued by the NAACP in 1989 by intimidating AA Americans at the polls.

It's time "Democratic America" wake up to their shameless race baiting. IMO, those who use racial tensions to use as a "blunt force instrument" in order to divide Americans along racial and ethnic lines are, at the least - BIGOTS and at the most - RACISTS.

There's no room for bigots and/or racists in our Democratic Party.

Russell Robinson and Leo Terrell put it best:

A High-Tech Lynching:
The UN-LINCOLNs: Clintons tear country apart (as they lynch Obama)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uz-gR0InIcI&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FVlKY8Ispg


Racism is alive and well in the democratic party! = It is disgusting what the Clintons have done - using a Black surrogate to bring the issue of cocaine. BET is an embarrassment. Bill and Hillary used the "race card" to use as a wedge issue to separate Blacks and Whites AND between Blacks and Hispanics.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Shoelace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #25
45. yet it was Clinton in '93 who fought for "Nat'l Voter Registration Act"!
which Southern Republicans fought him at every step of the way to get this bill enacted. Had it not been for that bill, millions of Blacks, disabled, others, would not have registered to vote.

National Voter Registration Act
On May 20th, 1993 President Bill Clinton signed the National Voter Registration Act of 1993.

This act has had a significant impact on voter registration. In the first quarter of 1995 (when the act was implemented), two million new voters were registered. Georgia registered 180,000 voters in a three-month period, compared to 85,000 for the entire preceding year. In the first quarter, Florida registered 400,000. In addition, during the first year of implementation, 40% of newly registered voters were under the age of 30. Finally, the two-year period after implementation witnessed one of the largest registration increases in American history. Indeed, the National Voter Registration Act has been instrumental in broadening the base of American democracy.

http://www.fairvote.org/?page=1325


The National Voter Registration Act, also known as the "Motor Voter" Bill, makes registration more uniform and accessible, especially for minority and low income voters.

The NVRA requires states to allow voter registration by mail, to allow voters to register when they apply for a driver's license and to allow voters to register at other state agencies such as welfare and unemployment offices.
http://www.votingrights.org/timeline/?year=1971

Before the Republicans began their strategy to vilify the Clintons, he was very popular amongst Black voters.

If you want to see real racism, re-visit Trent Lott's history who had ties with white supremacist groups. He played a major role in the Senate's trial of Bill Clinton. The media downplayed this Southern Republican racism but those of us who lived to see it will never forget how hard Democrats have fought over the years for racial equality against entrenched, racist Republicans and their media whores!


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
noiretextatique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #45
50. bill clinton remained popular among black voters
until the recent race-baiting kool-aid was passed out to the masses. there are plenty of real racists in america, and like you, i know that bill and hillary clinton are not among them. i think bill clinton was the first president who actually knew black people as friends and colleagues, not as maids, dirvers, and cooks. the "racist" meme is a big lie.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Shoelace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:25 PM
Response to Reply #50
53. and he chose Harlem for his post presidential office - "he'll be safe in Harlem"
The capstone to Bill Clintons kinship with black America came when he selected Harlem as the site for his post presidential office. In the words of Norma Johnson, a retiree, from Fisher, Indiana, Bill Clinton will be safe in Harlem.

Several common themes flow throughout the interviews. First, black people are comfortable with Clinton, and he with them. Secondly, Clintons upbringing has endeared him to black America as someone who understands them. Thirdly, Bill Clinton genuinely cares about black Americans and isn't afraid to show his concern, privately and publicly. In short, Bill Clinton is a man who isn't afraid of Black Americans, as apparently his predecessors have been.

As a president Bill Clintons history is sealed but the verdict is still out on what will be his lasting legacy, whether negative or positive. Bill Clinton and Black America makes a strong case for Bill Clintons legacy as the president who accomplished the most for African Americans in the nations history.

(quotes from a review of the book "Bill Clinton and Black America"
http://aalbc.com/reviews/bill_clinton_and_black_america.htm


The Clinton days were good ones for so many of us. I pray we don't forget how it was then compared to before and after!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Marrah_G Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:16 AM
Response to Original message
26. This is a really great post.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:26 AM
Response to Reply #26
27. It's PROPAGANDY! The Clintons have played "racially divisive" politics and it is VILE.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:41 AM
Response to Original message
30. How does this comment fit into your spin:
As for money scandal, who says that Democratic leadership gives a rat's ass if the nominee is connected with the mob or dirty money or any kind of corruption in Chicago? Having powerful, corrupt, ruthless friends might make Obama seem like a stronger candidate than Clinton who is currently broke. They might figure his buddies at the top will be quicker to close ranks and send out suitcases of cash behind the scenes to take care of unexpected problems. That is the way politics really works. We all know that the new kind of politics talk is just for the rubes at home.


Recognize it?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #30
36. If we let either HRC (DLC) or McCain (GOP) win, our country will fully become a RIGHT WING DUOPOLY.
Edited on Fri May-23-08 08:57 AM by ShortnFiery
:(
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CaptJasHook Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 08:42 AM
Response to Original message
32. McCamy, sometimes your intelligence is a pain in the arse, but
I am the better for it. I certainly, certainly appreciate your research and your journals. You maintain a level of discourse here that I am deeply hopeful will regrow after the primaries.

Peace, K&R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
suston96 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 09:05 AM
Response to Original message
37. Yes........Check the popular vote - no, not because Hillary should win because of it....
....but because all those Democrats who voted for Hillary in the primaries will be needed by Barack Obama - the presumptive nominee -to win in November.

Is that simple enough for people to understand?

Great OP. Democrats are on the verge of self-destruction. Wake up and unite - or just roll over and die!


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
PATRICK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #37
54. More central to the threat
is Hillary herself, who alone has the power to keep that negativity alive. It seems this time the party leaders are more than reconciled, even enthusiastic about Obama's chances and appeal, his money and voters key to great coattails and no negativity to arouse GOP fervor. This was NOT true about McGovern when the money was not that grass roots available and the entrenched leadership prepared to lose the election and count their return to the reins as a bonus. Also, patterns and different times are faint hope for the GOP this year. It is a reach, though a pertinent warning.

Will Obama or radical, alienating convention delegates or a perceived wildly liberal agenda turn off half the base? It seems the only danger is Hillary successfully misleading her followers and fading away behind their anger to let the damage happen without the effort necessary to serve the interests of the party. It has little to do with her followers or historic precedents expounded by pundits. It has to do with her serving the interest of her real enemies, denied her satisfying anchorage on the ticket, with being at present a mega Joe Lieberman and whether that will continue down that sordid path much longer.

This time I think only she has the threat to make such a glib scenario possible and we have plain run out of time to outlive another debacle because of one person's ambitions.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #54
55. I see this argument a lot.
But always from Obama people. Brings up the question about how might Barack have behaved if it went the other way. How would his gloating supporters behave if Hillary gets the nomination? Unfair, you say. It would be a travesty. He deserves it because he won some stuff. So did she. Now if the SD's give it to Hillary (doubtful) because they think she would stand a better chance of beating McCain (and very good arguments can be made there) she would have won because she has the most delegates. Isn't that what everyone is saying is important? Would you then enthusiastically support Hillary and meekly submit to a million crowing Hillaryites who keep trashing you fellow? Come on.

What McCamy is trying to say (imho) is that none of that matters. Let's get positive. Let's get unified. Stop bashing Democrats. Let the candidates do what they want, (they will anyway) and control our own lesser angels. If Hillary were leading right now, Barack and his supporters would also be looking to the convention. They would be disinclined to wear sack cloth and confess their horrid sin of errant worship. All we have to do is let the whole thing play out. Then support the candidate. I was a Hillary supporter (eventually) but will support Barack. I think Hillary would have a better chance of beating McCain and would be a better president, but that doesn't mean I have to call him names or his supporters. What possible good does that behavior do?

After all the MSM conditioning we seem to have forgotten the most often repeated phrase eight months ago. Look at the find field of candidates we, as Democrats, have to choose from. Then four months ago, it was how lucky we were to have these two fine candidates to represent us. We have grown dumb of late. We were smarter and less manipulated then. Let's rejoice and rejoin. Holding on the the desire to make the other side say they are wrong reminds me of too many divorced couples I know who don't take joy in their new lives and their children. They continually look back, wanting their partner to admit their sins and beg forgiveness. They, like some Democrats, live in a world that is not real.

Let's go. There are Republicans to beat.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 09:15 AM
Response to Original message
38. Here's your Amen!
Edited on Fri May-23-08 09:16 AM by indimuse
Love is the key to the solution of the problems of the world.


Photographs: Clinton Visits People With AIDS in Africa
Since he left office, Bill Clinton has made a lasting mark in a cause that he came to only late in his presidency.



This is just little something for some of those idiots out there who think Bill Clintons sex scandal was more important then any other of his achievements. Its

really funny what you get when you compare Clintons list with the list (mostly failures) of our president today. Seriously people. Grow up!!!




Clinton presided over the longest period of peace-time economic expansion in American history, which included a balanced budget and a reported federal

surplus.
Clinton left office with a 65% approval rating, the highest end-of-presidency rating of any President that came into office after World War II.
In August 1993, Clinton signed the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1993, which passed Congress without a single Republican vote. It cut taxes for 15

million low-income families, made tax cuts available to 90% of small businesses,<37> and raised taxes on the wealthiest 1.2% of taxpayers<38>. Additionally,

it mandated that the budget be balanced over a number of years, through the implementation of spending restraints.
In 1994, Clinton sent U.S. forces to Haiti as part of the negotiated restoration of Jean-Bertrand Aristides presidency. He also withdrew U.S. forces from

Somalia (1994), where while helping to avert famine they had suffered casualties in a futile effort to capture a Somali warlord. Clinton promoted peace

negotiations in the Middle East, which bore fruit in important agreements, and in the former Yugoslavia, which led to a peace agreement in late 1995. He also

restored U.S. diplomatic relations with Vietnam in 1995.
Clinton succeeded in brokering peace negotiations in Northern Ireland between warring Catholics and Protestants
In 1997, Clinton and the Republicans agreed on a deal that combined tax cuts and reductions in spending to produce the first balanced federal budget in three

decades.
During the eight years of the presidency, the economy expanded by 50% in real terms, and by the end of his tenure the US had a gross national product of

$10,000bn - one quarter of the entire world economic output.
The booming US economy has brought economic benefits right across the income spectrum.
The unemployment rate has dropped by half, to 4%, a 40-year-low, while the economy has created some 15 million jobs.
In December 1999, Clinton was among 18 included in Gallups List of Widely Admired People of the 20th century, from a poll conducted of the American

people.



From August 1986 to August 1987, Governor Clinton served as chairman of the National Governors' Association. During that time, he led the governors' efforts

to reform the welfare system and the educational systems of the states.

By the fall of 1991, Governor Clinton believed that the country needed someone with a new vision and plan, and he decided to run for President. He also felt

that he had the experience and the best ideas for changing our country for the better. He wanted to strengthen the health care system, to improve the school

system, and, most of all, to bolster the economy and create new jobs. He brought his message to the country by going door to door, holding one-on-one talks

with people in town hall meetings, and appearing on various talk shows.

After a long primary process, Governor Clinton was nominated as the Democratic presidential candidate. He chose Senator Al Gore, of Tennessee to be his

vice-presidential running mate. Together, Bill Clinton and Al Gore set out by bus to meet the people of America and to hear about their concerns and their

hopes for the future. They campaigned on the concept of "putting people first'---preserving the American Dream, restoring the hopes of the middle class, and

reclaiming the future for the nation's children.

Throughout his life, President Clinton has worked to make a difference in the lives of others. To him, Hope means more than a small town in Arkansas; it

means working to ensure that each American has the opportunity to fulfill his or her dream.





Thanks again, for a very thoughtful post.kNr!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Career Prole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 09:21 AM
Response to Original message
39. Thanks.
:hug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #39
40. From you post to God's ears.
It would be nice if in this time of everyone demanding change, we could truly change, do something truly different. A true change for the Democratic party would be unity and solidarity. Crying for change and doing the same thing we do every four years is just dumb.

I only come to DU infrequently now since the hate is so depressing. I read McCamy's posts last because they give me hope that there is a way to win, a way to do things better.

K&R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cbayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
44. Perfect McCamy, just perfect.
Edited on Fri May-23-08 12:00 PM by cbayer
This is the message we need to keep repeating over and over again. Those that are trying to keep us divided need to be sidelined.

Thank you!

edited to add image!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Shoelace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
51. AMEN! Let's make Republicans shake in their boots and UNITE
to win in November. It's pure insanity to think that Obama can win without Clinton's 17 million supporters. That we've been invaded here by those who say he can win without her shows the magnitude of the Republican strategy to divide and conquer once again.


The Republican dirty tricksters, with ample help from their corporate media network, are scared to death of a unity ticket which would include HRC and Obama which is why they continue to play up any and all race issues while at the same time taking every opportunity to vilify both Clintons.

If we don't understand our enemies, how can we ever begin to recognize our friends.

Far too many new Democrats are totally unaware of our party's history and how long and difficult a journey it's been for the Democratic party to fight racism on every level for so many generations. Lacking this knowledge leaves them very vulnerable to the Pat Buchanan "divide and conquer" hype as you so amply covered in your wonderful post.

You, McCamy Taylor, are one of the few reasons left for me to visit DU now. Your missives are both intuitive and intelligent and I do hope that our party, it's members will somehow heal this media invented and nurtured divide within our ranks. A huge thank you from this little reporter!




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blkirish03 Donating Member (6 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
58. "Positively" Electable

Greetings D.U.'ers Had to share some VERY positive news I came across this evening that should put an end to any doubts folks might be entertaining re: Barack Obama's electability. Real Clear Politics has the latest poll numbers in several key battleground states and its extremely encouraging. The only conclusion that one can draw is that if the election were held today, the long national nightmare would be over and Barack Obama would be President. Here are the numbers...

OH Obama +1.3%
PA Obama +5.8%
FL McCain +8.3%
WI Obama +1.6%
IA Obama +5.6%
MN Obama +11%
MO McCain +3%
NM Tied
NV McCain +6%
CO Obama +6%
MI Obama +.6%
NH Obama +.4%
NJ Obama +9.3%
VA McCain +1.3%
NC McCain +6%
GA McCain +13.7%
OR Obama +10.4%
WA Obama +10%
CA Obama + 13%

Barack Obama is currently leading in a head-to-head with John McCain in 12 out of 19 so-called "battleground states" - and the General Election hasn't even started yet. IMO the addition of Jim Webb to the ticket puts VA in play and perhaps NC, MO and OH. With Obama's appeal out west, this election does not look likely to come down to FL even as Obama wisely seeks to improve his standing with older Jewish voters there (BTW Hagee's words should play well with that group - why is the MSM not pounding away at this?) All of this makes for some VERY, VERY "positive" news.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
barack the house Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-23-08 10:36 PM
Response to Original message
60. RIGHT ON. For seven years we bought division time to ad and multiply and join in arms to the WH.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue Apr 13th 2021, 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC