Headline 9/2/07: Clinton, Obama and Edwards Join Pledge to Avoid Defiant States!

[RiverStone]

Can someone please remind Hillary what she said last September regarding Florida and Michigan?

:think:

New York Times
9/2/07

PORTSMOUTH, N.H., Sept. 1 — Three of the major Democratic presidential candidates on Saturday pledged not to campaign in Florida, Michigan and other states trying to leapfrog the 2008 primary calendar, a move that solidified the importance of the opening contests of Iowa and New Hampshire.

Hours after Senator Barack Obama of Illinois and former Senator John Edwards of North Carolina agreed to sign a loyalty pledge put forward by party officials in Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada and South Carolina, Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York followed suit. The decision seemed to dash any hopes of Mrs. Clinton relying on a strong showing in Florida as a springboard to the nomination.

“We believe Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada and South Carolina play a unique and special role in the nominating process,” Patti Solis Doyle, the Clinton campaign manager, said in a statement.

The pledge sought to preserve the status of traditional early-voting states and bring order to an unwieldy series of primaries that threatened to accelerate the selection process. It was devised to keep candidates from campaigning in Florida, where the primary is set for Jan. 29, and Michigan, which is trying to move its contest to Jan. 15.

The Democratic National Committee has vowed to take away Florida’s 210 delegates — and those of any other state that moved its nominating contest before Feb. 5 — if it does not come up with an alternative plan.

more:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/02/us/politics/02dems.html?_r=1&adxnnl=1&oref=slogin&ref=politics&adxnnlx=1210006856-EEaF4nlJdIwAiuKPtj+1dQ

Direct link to statement from the Clinton Campaign Office:

http://www.hillaryclinton.com/news/release/view/?id=3134

[habitual]

1. that only counted when she thought it worked in her favor.

now that it no longer does, it no longer counts.

[bowens43]

2. Not fair! That was before she was losing!!

[Double T]

3. Florida and Michigan VOTERS should NOT be disenfranchised.

I'm CERTAIN YOU would be screaming bloody murder if YOUR VOTE wasn't counted. COUNT ALL THE VOTES.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

4. Florida and Michigan voters chose to be disenfranchised.

No one forced those states to violate clearly laid out and agreed upon rules.

[Indenturedebtor]

5. Okay

How about I vote today for the 2012 election. Will my vote count?

Where does it end? Sorry but there have to be rules to this sort of thing and your STATE fucked you... not the democratic party.

False start sorry.

[bowens43]

6. the state knew the consequences.

break the rules, you lose.

[Lucky 13]

7. You are dodging the point of the post.

WHY did she agree to this back in September of 2007? If she had any objections to the votes not being counted WHY did she not say so then?

We'll figure out something to do with Michigan and Florida, but I don't think she should be the one spearheading this effort because it is clearly and obviously self serving.

[RiverStone]

16. Yep.

You got it Lucky 13. It screams of nothing more than political expediency.

As an aside, I do believe that FLA/MI voters got screwed by arrogant state party bosses. And I'm all for a legit redo if possible; but Hillary's attempt to now try and seat delegates or count votes from bogus state elections is transparent bullshit.

She agreed to the terms of the candidate pledge last September and I'm not sure how her campaign can re-write history.

[Lucky 13]

26. WHY won't any Clinton supporters address this?

I can't get ONE of them to answer the simple question:

WHY didn't Hillary voice any objections to this back in September 2007? If ANYONE can give me a reasonable explanation, I'd be a lot more open to the idea.

[Boz]

8. Yeah definitely if I was from upstate New York

I'm CERTAIN YOU would be screaming bloody murder if YOUR VOTE wasn't counted. COUNT ALL THE VOTES.

Yeah I would definitely be yelling and screaming if I was from upstate New York and my vote wasn't counted in florida or michigan

[TBF]

10. Count all the votes cast LEGALLY would be my vote. YMMV.

I have to say I'm not surprised Hillary wants to change the rules because she's losing.

[RazBerryBeret]

12. what I want to know is why

NO one cares about all those people who DIDN'T vote, because they were assured by their state leaders that THE VOTES WOULDN'T COUNT...what about their voices???

[Blondbostonian]

19. I live in South Florida

The only people screaming are Hillary supporters. All 50 of them at the Ft Lauderdale rally last week.

How about all the Obama supporters who were told the primary didn't matter? You realize there were more people voting in the Republican primary instead of the Dem right? It was about a real estate exemption on the ballot. That election was hardy a fair representation of what the voting public thought. I'm sorry that you don't like the results after the fact but you can't change the rules to try and help your candidate win.

Less talking points and more research please.

[Bread and Circus]

20. My vote wasn't counted, I'm in Michigan. I wanted to vote for Obama, I couldn't. The only thing...

that will make me scream bloody murder is if Clinton steals Michigan without ever letting me vote for Obama, which it seems she is aiming to do.

[NJmaverick]

9. You don't expect Hillary to actually keep her word or honor her pledges?

[Yossariant]

11. 9-1-2007:

That's one reason why Clinton's campaign probably hesitated before signing the pledge.

The other is that Clinton's strategists disagree with the DNC about Florida's viability in the general election. Clinton's team believes she can win there; the DNC is more skeptical that Democrats can recover. Clinton doesn't want to give Republicans a heads-up there.
http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/archives/2007/09/the_jockeying_behind_the_four.php

Mrs. Clinton’s advisers said it would be foolish to rebuff an important swing state, especially since doing so could alienate Democratic-leaning independents who could be favoring her. But she is also taking a risk that staying in Michigan will not hurt her in Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada and South Carolina. Those states, all sanctioned by the Democratic National Committee to vote first, forced the Democratic candidates to sign a pledge not to campaign in Michigan and Florida. Clinton advisers said that even though she was staying in the Michigan race, she would not campaign there.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/10/us/politics/10michigan.html?_r=2&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&pagewanted=all&oref=slogin&oref=slogin

[AzDar]

13. What has happened to the Clintons? Have they always sucked and I just couldn't see it?

:puke:

[AZBlue]

15. I wonder the same exact thing every day.

[RiverStone]

17. Absolute power corrupts absolutely

...someone once said.

I will still contend Bill was a great president, and Hillary a great senator --- in the past.

Somehow the need for more power has morphed their personalities into something I don't recognize anymore. Well, actually I do recognize it - it looks like a republican (at the very least, in tactics alone).

[Justitia]

14. Yeah, well, she wasn't losing then. Now she is, so she wants the rules changed for her.

It's as simple as that.

Just like how she looooovvvved caucus states when her husband won them, but now she calls them "undemocratic" because she can't win them.

So, it is what it is. And it's totally transparent.

[Tyler Durden]

18. Whatever you say, kids.

Michigan Will Remember.

Expect to hear it A LOT. Personally, we don't care WHO would win a redo, as long as our voice is heard...

But, to use an allegory to your claims: who gives a shit what THEY think as long as we're winning, and why take the chance? Fuck 'em.

Florida was always a tossup, but the Party NEEDS Michigan. Not a good state to piss on.

[RiverStone]

22. I think most folks here would support a LEGIT redo

And its too damn bad arrogant party bosses in each state chose a path, purposefully - which silenced your vote.

The question is, when you suggest MI should not be "pissed on" - who are you saying is doing that?

We simply won't count votes in a contest which did not have Obama's name (and John's) not even on the ballot.

This whole fiasco could have been avoided. Are MI voters holding the idiot politicians accountable who gave the DNC and Howard Dean the finger?

Yes, yes, yes! Your state should have been allowed a redo - but now it has become a quagmire where the blame game has gone on so long, yet the calender time to get anything done has grown way short.

[Tyler Durden]

24. All of your comments are VALID and completely irrelevant.

Michigan Campaign Obama Chairman State Senator Tupac Hudson vetoed (on instructions from the lawyers for the National Obama Campaign) a revote agreed on by both parties on SUNDAY before a dealine set on THURSDAY by the Republican Controlled Michigan State Senate, Who, by the way, were instrumental in having the Primary moved up.

On that TUESDAY NIGHT, Senator Hudson vetoed the revote because the National Obama Campaign had changed their minds about not allowing the entire electorate of the state of Michigan, which would include Registered Republicans, to vote in the redo.

The National Campaign's solution was NOT to let Michigan's electorate re-vote, but to hold a Caucus. This was unacceptable to everyone in the state, except for Michigan Campaign Obama.

That is the story, and it's no longer Michigan's problem. If Obama gets the nomination, it's likely it's going to be HIS problem.

This is a fact, and I'm sorry if Obama Supporters don't like it. They can whistle in the dark all they wish, but Michigan was never much more than purple tending blue, voting Republican in the Presidential Elections from 1968 to 1992. I would suggest the the DNC and Dean ignore us (as they have been so far) at their peril.

[RiverStone]

29. Obama's explanation

Obama's camp had expressed concern with the proposal. Under the proposal, Michigan voters wanting to cast ballots in the new primary would have to identify themselves as Democrats and certify that they didn't vote in the state's Republican primary in January.

Michigan usually does not require party identification in primary elections. Some said this requirement is unfair to Democrats who voted in the Republican contest, knowing their party's primary was invalid.

"We support a fair solution that allows Michigan Democrats to participate at our National Convention this summer, and we look forward to working with the Michigan Democratic Party and the DNC to achieve that goal," Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton said in a statement after the Senate adjourned.

In an interview with CNN's Larry King, Obama said said he was confident a solution that would be found to make sure Michigan was represented at the national convention.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/20/michigan.florida/index.html

It's easy to place all the blame on Obama after party bosses in MI spilled the milk; too bad the voters got screwed, but Obama took the high road originally by keeping with the pledge and honoring the rules of the DNC.

[Tyler Durden]

30. Define "The High Road."

Is that "lying" and telling an elector in that which we hold so sacred, the right to vote, that I am a Republican, to GAME their primary? I didn't do it. I voted "uncommitted."

I want you to walk up to your child, right now, and tell that child that LYING in an ELECTION like BUSH did is "the high road."

Plus, the number of voters who "crossed" is held to be very low.

AND I'm certain "We support a fair solution that allows Michigan Democrats to participate at our National Convention this summer, and we look forward to working with the Michigan Democratic Party and the DNC to achieve that goal," Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton said in a statement after the Senate adjourned." when the Michigan Senate said they would no longer consider a primary, leaving a CAUCUS as the only alternative (which is what the Obama Campaign wanted anyway), representing 10% of the voters at best.

This is one of those statements that, if you want to keep score, the Obama Campaign can put in the ingenuous and self-serving column.

AND it will make great press for the McCain Campaign: "WE didn't cheat you out of your vote in the primary."

But if Obama wants to shoot those dice, well, feel free.

[RiverStone]

31. So what do you propose as an equitable solution?

We can debate history forever Tyler, but what fair solution do you suggest be implemented for MI voters?

[Tyler Durden]

33. Do the Deal.

The agreed to it once, until the lawyers from Obama's National Campaign stepped in.

Do the Deal. Except NOW that Obama DELAYED it, the Michigan Republican Senate won't finance anything, so it's up to DEAN and the DNC to make it right.

Of course, they won't do it. So it's 1972 all over again, I hope we all enjoy President McCain. My prediction is that history will hold Barack Obama responsible for it.

Maybe it's what we need: "Let all the poisons that lurk in the mud hatch out!" and what comes after will be better.

[Basement Beat]

21. As a Michigan voter....

I'm not pissed that my vote wasn't 'counted' because I knew going in this was a non-valid election. The people I know aren't upset about it either. If anything the anger is towards the state officials- not the presidential candidates....well except maybe one.

[RiverStone]

23. Are the voters holding the state officials accountable?

For being arrogant pricks?

They took your vote away, and I'm sorry for that.

[Tyler Durden]

25. I give up on you all.

We had a deal for a redo, National Campaign Obama changed their minds just before the date set by our Republican Controlled Senate.

We LOVE Levin, and we don't hold him responsible that Dean decided to take away all the votes instead of 50%. And it's not our fault that Obama pulled his name. It was a GESTURE, and no required by any rules.

[BlooInBloo]

28. That's the appropriate place for MI and FL's voters' anger.

[BlooInBloo]

27. Clinton is a pathetic liar. Her supporters support a pathetic liar.

[Avalux]

32. I'll second that. n/t