Clinton: Gore And Kerry Lost Because They Were Viewed As Elitist

[babsbunny]

Thank You Obama for saying you think Gore won!


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/13/clinton-gore-and-kerry-we_n_96452.html

[tokenlib]

1. This is not going to win Hillary points with a lot of SD's and activists...n/t

[Me.]

6. Especially Not With The Big Kahuna SD....Gore

She may be deciding some very potent SD votes for them

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[leftofcool]

4. What are you implying with the "Good German" line?

Are you suggesting Hillary supporters would also be supportive of Adolph Hitler? You better be very clear here.

[msongs]

5. another day another obama's slimer calling people disgusting names

"good german" hillary supporters

I dont even like her but I find your vitriol to be scandalous. then again, maybe you are true representatives of the nature of your chosen one.

Msongs

BTW - what ever happened to the low life claim that people who don't worship obama are "gestapo"? maybe you all would like to drag that one up again.

[Why Syzygy]

3. She is out of touch.

[K Gardner]

7. Kick

[Robbins]

11. Gore

Why Is she so stupid to diss the true winner of the 2000 election? And her calling Gore a elite Is
a joke.At least Gore makes money working on an Issue that Is Important.He spoke out on Iraq In 2002 when she was kissing Bush's ass.And In 2005 spoke out on Bush's Illegal wiretapping.Another thing
some may forget Is she often keeps quit on Bush's abuse of power like Torture and Illegal Wiretapping.Hillary Is trying to put Gore under the bush like she did Kerry In 2006.When she was the Inevitable nominee she said Gore won to reduce the dynasty question.

[MadAndy]

8. Even if that were true, people still liked them MORE than Mrs Klinton. eom.

[ClassWarrior]

9. Reinforcing RW frames AGAIN. Please Mrs. Clinton, don't think of an elephant.

NGU.

[Skidmore]

10. Gore and Kerry were LABELLED as elitist by the Rove machine.

And that label was amplified by the lapdog media that Rove whipped into shape by calling "leftist" and "elite" as well.

Hillary has more than jumped the shark.

[mod mom]

14. while in fact it was Clinton & the DLC fighting for the powerful over the people:

Al From, the DLC's founder and CEO, opened a freewheeling discussion forum by arguing that Democrat Al GORE MADE A HUGE TACTICAL MISTAKE by continually emphasizing that he would "fight for the people and not the powerful" as the nation's first president of the 21st Century.

-snip

http://www.progress.org/goredlc2.htm




ARTICLE | posted May 17, 2007 (June 4, 2007 issue)
Hillary Inc.

ARI BERMAN


-snip
It's a rousing speech, though ultimately not very convincing. If Clinton really wanted to curtail the influence of the powerful, she might start with the advisers to her own campaign, who represent some of the weightiest interests in corporate America. Her chief strategist, Mark Penn, not only polls for America's biggest companies but also runs one of the world's premier PR agencies. A bevy of current and former Hillary advisers, including her communications guru, Howard Wolfson, are linked to a prominent lobbying and PR firm--the Glover Park Group--that has cozied up to the pharmaceutical industry and Rupert Murdoch. Her fundraiser in chief, Terry McAuliffe, has the priciest Rolodex in Washington, luring high-rolling contributors to Clinton's campaign. Her husband, since leaving the presidency, has made millions giving speeches and counsel to investment banks like Goldman Sachs and Citigroup. They house, in addition to other Wall Street firms, the Clintons' closest economic advisers, such as Bob Rubin and Roger Altman, whose DC brain trust, the Hamilton Project, is Clinton's economic team in waiting. Even the liberal in her camp, former deputy chief of staff Harold Ickes, has lobbied for the telecom and healthcare industries, including a for-profit nursing home association indicted in Texas for improperly funneling money to disgraced former House majority leader Tom DeLay. "She's got a deeper bench of big money and corporate supporters than her competitors," says Eli Attie, a former speechwriter to Vice President Al Gore. Not only is Hillary more reliant on large donations and corporate money than her Democratic rivals, but advisers in her inner circle are closely affiliated with unionbusters, GOP operatives, conservative media and other Democratic Party antagonists.

It's not exactly an advertisement for the working-class hero, or a picture her campaign freely displays. Her lengthy support for the Iraq War is Clinton's biggest liability in Democratic primary circles. But her ties to corporate America say as much, if not more, about what she values and cast doubt on her ability and willingness to fight for the progressive policies she claims to champion. She is "running to help and restore the great middle class in our country," Wolfson says. So was Bill in 1992. He was for "putting people first." Then he entered the White House and pushed for NAFTA, signed welfare reform, consolidated the airwaves through the Telecommunications Act of 1996 (leading to Clear Channel's takeover) and cleared the mergers of mega-banks. Would the First Lady do any different? Ever since the defeat of healthcare reform, Hillary has been a committed incrementalist, describing herself as a creature of the "moderate, sensible center" whom business admires and rewards. During her six years in the Senate, she's rarely been out front on difficult economic issues. Given her proximity to money and power, it's not hard to figure out why she keeps controversial figures close to her--even if their work becomes a liability for her campaign.

-snip

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20070604/berman

[Chulanowa]

18. Hillary is one to talk?

When she's practically wearing a straw hat and slurping from a jug like some Hatfield vs. McCoy's stooge, in a desperate attempt to "connect to the common man" she's going to call someone else elitist? Hell, maybe we'll see her in blackface to try to win the black vote next.

Senator Clinton jumped the shark, then came back to beat the shark with a waffle iron.

[MadAndy]

23. I'm surprised she hasnt baked some cookies and had teas to show how non-elitist she is.

But she does stand by her man like Tammy Wynette.

[ananda]

12. No

Gore and Kerry DIDN'T lose.

Those elections were fixed.

[Zynx]

13. Kerry did lose. Gore won.

I've never seen a convincing argument on fraud in 2004.

[sampsonblk]

17. Same here

Its pretty plain that Gore won. As for Kerry, I need some real convincing.

[ClassWarrior]

19. You must have missed the voter disenfranchisement in Ohio.

Try Googling Greg Palast, or look up Bobby Kennedy's 2005 Rolling Stone article.

NGU.

[Zynx]

21. I have. Just because they wrote it doesn't make it true.

I'm sure there were plenty of cases of voter disenfranchisement. There always are. However, I look at the increases in turnout in Democratic bastions and I see no evidence of dramatically supressed Democratic turnout. Certainly not enough to overturn 118,000 votes.

[ClassWarrior]

24. Yeah, right.

:eyes:

I find it extremely difficult to believe that any Progressive who has truly read those two sources could ever claim, "I see no evidence of dramatically supressed Democratic turnout."

NGU.

[Zynx]

25. I don't automatically believe most things I read.

People manipulate statistics all the time. I look at the information and then compare it to raw data and historical trends if those apply. In so doing, I didn't see evidence of Democratic voter supression. Cleveland saw a 28% jump in voters from 2000 to 2004. Cuyahoga county saw the largest turnout since 1964, nearly equalling it, despite a 250,000 decline in population in that time. Franklin County went Democratic by the biggest margin since 1964. I can go on and on.

[ClassWarrior]

26. Greg Palast and Bobby Kennedy MANIPULATED DATA?? To lie about disenfranchisement??

Wow. Simply wow.

NGU.

[Zynx]

27. No sources are infallible. People on this message board did the same

to try to prove Kerry won an election I don't believe for a moment he won. He did 3 points worse than Gore nationwide. If anything it is surprising that in that environment where his margins versus Gore's were cut in Michigan, Pennsylvania, New York, Illinois, and virtually everywhere else and he did worse in virtually all states generally than Gore how his margin in Ohio was actually better.

If anything the vote in Ohio is surprising as to how close Kerry came, not that he lost. I have no doubt voters were disenfranchised, but I do not believe them to be enough to cost Kerry the election.

[ClassWarrior]

29. So you stand by your claim that KENNEDY and PALAST MANIPULATED DATA?

That tells me plenty.

NGU.

[ClassWarrior]

30. No answer?

Or did you get tombstoned?

NGU.

[ellacott]

15. That's one of the things I'm bitter about

Gore won.

She just proved how out of touch she is.

[redqueen]

16. Anybody shocked?

Anyone?

This woman repeated the White House's lies about Iraq 10 months into the war. So it's really very far from surprising to see her doing this now... especially considering the fact that she doesn't seem to be able to help her own candidacy.

At least she changed her mind about supporting torture. As far as I know, I mean. She may have changed her mind again... not sure.

[Buzz Clik]

20. Your comment about Gore reminded me of an amazing comment ...

... on Jeopardy! of all places.

It was awesome -- check it out: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=3154784&mesg_id=3154784

[JPZenger]

22. Does she know Gore will endorse Obama?

Is Hillary that reckless and short-sighted to attack Al Gore twice in one day?

Or is she doing a preemptive strike, because she knows Gore is about to endorse Obama?

[paulk]

28. she's right, of course

It's always been the Republican strategy to paint the Democratic candidate as an elitist, out of touch with the common man. Mondale, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry - the only one they failed in this strategy with was Bill Clinton, who was able to successfully cast himself as a "good ole boy". The others walked right into it face first - just like Obama is doing..


BTW - your "Gore and Kerry actually won" is the usual strawman that the Obama team sends up whenever Hillary says something that hits the mark. Divert! Divert!

[anonymous171]

31. Gore did win.

It's not a strawman, it's a fact.

[paulk]

32. the whole point is that that's not the point

The Republicans were successful in painting Gore as some kind of pointy headed elitist, and that's why the election was close enough to steal.

[Butch350]

33. Gore...

got cheated out of the the White House and Kerry turned the other cheek.