Bill Clinton during '92 primaries, when the Gennifer Flower Scandal broke, what did Bill & Hil do?

[FrenchieCat]

Gennifer Flowers (born January 24, 1950) is a woman who had a relationship with former U.S. President Bill Clinton. She came forward during Bill Clinton's 1992 Presidential election campaign alleging that she had had a twelve-year relationship with him. When Bill Clinton denied having relationship with Flowers, she held a press conference in which she played tape recordings she claimed were of secretly recorded intimate phone calls with Bill Clinton. At least two Arkansas state police officers who had formerly guarded Bill Clinton when he was Governor backed up Flowers' story.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gennifer_Flowers

[indimuse]

1. July 16, 1992: Bill Clinton: I Still Believe In A Place Called Hope

Bill Clinton: I Still Believe In A Place Called Hope

July 16, 1992




I end tonight where it all began for me: I still believe in a place called Hope

I am so proud of Al Gore.

Tonight I want to talk with you about my hope for the future, my faith in the American people, and my vision of the kind of country we can build, together.

I learned a lot from another person, too. A person who for more than 20 years has worked hard to help our children--paying the price of time to make sure our schools

don't fail them. Someone who traveled our state for a year, studying, learning, listening, going to PTA meetings, school board meetings, town hall meetings, putting

together a package of school reforms recognized around the nation, and doing it all while building a distinguished legal career and being a wonderful loving mother.

That person is my wife.
Hillary taught me. She taught me that all children can learn, and that each of us has a duty to help them do it. So if you want to know why I care so much about our

children and our future; it all started with Hillary. I love you.

An America in which health care is a right, not a privilege. In which we say to all of our people: Your government has the courage -- finally -- to take on the health care

profiteers and make health care affordable for every family. But you must do your part: preventive care, prenatal care, childhood immunization; saving lives, saving

money, saving families from heartbreak.

That's why we need a new approach to government--a government that offers more empowerment and less entitlement, more choices for young people in the schools

they attend, in the public schools they attend, and more choices for the elderly and for people with disabilities and the long-term care they receive--a government that

is leaner, not meaner. A government that expands opportunity, not bureaucracy--a government that understands that jobs must come from growth in a vibrant and vital

system of free enterprise. I call this approach a New Covenant -- a solemn agreement between the people and their government -- based not simply on what each of us

can take but on what all of us must give to our nation.

We offer our people a new choice based on old values. We offer opportunity. We demand responsibility. We will build an American community again. The choice we

offer is not conservative or liberal. In many ways it's not even Republican or Democratic, It's different. It's new. And it will work.

It is time to heal America. And so we must say to every American: look beyond the stereotypes that blind us. We need each other. All of us, we need each other. We

don't have a person to waste. And yet, for too long, politicians have told the most of us that are doing all right that what's really wrong with America is the rest of us.

Them. Them the minorities. Them the liberals. Them the poor. Them the homeless. Them the people with disabilities. Them the gays. We've gotten to where we've

nearly them'd ourselves to death. Them, and them, and them. But this is America. There is no them; there is only us. One nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty,

and justice, for all.

How do I know we can come together to make change happen? Because I have see it in my own state. In Arkansas we're working together and we're making progress.

No, there is no Arkansas miracle. But there are a lot of miraculous people. And because of them, our schools are better, our wages are higher, our factories are

busier, our water is cleaner, and our budget is balanced. We're moving ahead.

When we pull together, America will pull ahead.

But I cannot do it alone. No President can. We must do it together. It won't be easy and it won't be quick. We didn't get into this mess overnight, and we won't get out

of it overnight. But we can do it--with our commitment and our creativity and our diversity and our strength. I want every person in this hall and every citizen in this land

to reach out and join us in a great new adventure to chart a bold new future.

I end tonight where it all began for me: I still believe in a place called Hope.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/speeches/clinton.html

[Justyce]

7. Awesome. Thanks for posting this. nt

[FrenchieCat]

19. I'm just trying to calculate that if Bill Clinton was able to survive that

public accusation (that ended up being true) of 12 years' worth of infidelity with tapes (Bill Clinton denied the affair--was lying)......than Obama will survive this, because Obama's issue is child's play compared to an adulterer

With Obama, the only thing they have is a pastor and a 15 second loopDloop of that pastor saying stuff, but not Obama.

[joeybee12]

39. WRong and Wronger! He never denied it,...they went on 60 minutes to

say they would not discuss personal matters like this, and when he was under oath about Paula Jones, he admitted to Gennifer flowers.

Another fact-challenged Bot.

[FrenchieCat]

43. So if that worked for Bill, to be candid and honest, right.....

it should also work for Obama....considering that Obama actually didn't have an affair with anyone, nor did he say the things we keep seeing associated directly to him all the time on the news and cable.

[Life Long Dem]

71. I noticed there was no reply to the double standard.

You got them on this one. And they try to dispute the double standard.

[Justyce]

40. Personally, I would hope that

both of our candidates can survive whatever scandals the media jumps on. They let McCain's affair with a LOBBYIST just drift on by while jumping on old scandals of the Dems & controversial crap from people other than our candidates themselves. The bottom line is that we're going to end up with either Obama or HRC as the nominee, and it's in our best interest for neither of them to be too tarnished by the media. We need the media's negative focus back on McCain, Bush, and the repubs where it belongs. McCains numbers have been rising, and that ought to scare the hell out of everyone here.

[FrenchieCat]

42. I just want to make sure that there isn't a double standard being used by

Hillary supporters who continue to post stuff about Wright...as well as Obama's grandmother, and of course, Obama himself.

I want to make sure that those who want to say...."you mean he just sat in the pews for 17 years" that we realize that doesn't mean a damn thing.

I want to make sure that it is known that Bill Clinton had a 12 year relationship with a women, and obviously, that didn't mean a damn thing in the middle of a primary, when it was found out.

I just want to make sure that we clearly see when the media does it as well.

I want to make sure that if certain people are allowed to lie and cheat, than others shouldn't be held to the standard of perfection.

I just want to think that Hillary supporters would remember that history, and therefore not be so doggit on the total non issue of what somebody's pastor said.

[elixir]

63. Keep on telling yourself that Frenchie. You know it won't hold.

[FrenchieCat]

69. What won't "hold"?

[Dinger]

13. Beautiful, Thank You : )

Nobody seems to talk about the fact that maybe, just maybe, Bill and Hillary love each other.

[elixir]

45. Thanks Indimuse for taking a silly hairball post and turning it into a celebration of 42.

[shaniqua6392]

2. May I ask what the hell this 16 year old story about Bill

Clinton has to do with anything going on right now? It does seem to be an intimate matter between a husband and his wife. I hope we are not suggesting that a wife should be judged on the merits of her husband. I just think that using this kind of crap does not help Obama at all. It just seems so far reaching and judgmental imo.

[Justyce]

6. Not to mention the fact the media is drudging up

these ancient stories while letting McCain slide on the affair with the lobbyist. And McCains numbers are rising. It's time all Dems turn our attacks back in the right direction, IMO.

[Window]

10. With Hillary's 'first lady' schedules being released,

some news snoops have her being in the White House several of the times Bill was with Monica.

[Auntie Bush]

27. So WHAT!

The White House is a pretty big place last I noticed.

Why is this shit being brought up in the first place.?

[FrenchieCat]

30. We should talk about wright 24/7....but forget how Bill, the guy from Hope

was plagued with much worse scandal during his heated primaries?

[Auntie Bush]

49. Yes, he was plagued with scandles...but he survived them because he was a fighter.

If Obama wins the presidency in spite of all this, which he probably will, will be partly due to the fact that he proved he was a fighter...something people had questioned. Now he can be seen as just as hard a fighter as the Clintons. This could help him in the long run.

But I want him win because he is better...not because of Hillary's husband's scandals and I don't think that is playing fair. Unfortunately nothing about politics is fair! I just hope we can all forgive and forget and unite the party when this is all over...that's the most important thing.

[FrenchieCat]

That's what I want as well.....that the candidates be judged on their

merits and not the bullshit.....because I don't find this guilt by association to be more scandalous than what occurred 16 years ago. That's why I brought it up...because certainly the parallels are there, and you mentioned some of them. Thank you for that.

[FrenchieCat]

21. surviving scandals during primary elections.

Bill's was way worse, but Bill isn't Black, and the media (after Bill's signing of the Telecommunications act) is worse now than it was then.....but still, Gennifer had audio phone tapes, but no video.

Bill broke two of the 10 commandments.

Obama didn't.

[racaulk]

35. Then it's a good thing that Bill never took an oath to uphold the Ten Commandments,

isn't it?

[FrenchieCat]

36. This was before he was sworn into the Presidency.......

I'm just seeing that we have an totally different media these days.

Cause something sure is different, when a Sex Scandal that is actually true can help land you into the WH.....but a guilt by association to an out of context rant from a pastor can make you "iffy".

[Cha]

52. Frenchie's point is pretty clear...

if bil clinton can survive that back then when it was true and something clinton actually did then Obama will survive something the media is playing over and over and over again.

[Submariner]

3. what amazes me about Hillary is that she stayed with this cad

I thought with the Flowers debacle, and most definitely with the Lewinsky mess, she would dump him in a heartbeat for embarrassing her in front of the world. When she didn't, all I could think about was those women who stay with their husbands no matter how much abuse they receive.

I thought this woman doesn't have an ounce of dignity or self respect to stay with him, but after awhile it became apparent she likes the power and is willing to swallow her pride to ride his coat tails for higher office, the senate, and now the WH.

[nonconformist]

66. How dare you judge her.

Infidelity is a terrible thing, but for many married couples, it's not necessarily a deal breaker. They work through it and move on.

And bottom line, it's NONE OF OUR FUCKING BUSINESS.

[Submariner]

67. IT IS MY FUCKING BUSINESS

when the president upsets the ship of state and gets the government in turmoil over his childish sex fantasies, which turn out to have a negative affect on the government I voted for. Then you can bet your butt it's my bizness.

[robbedvoter]

4. Once again, DU and FR - look alike...Don't you want to chime in on Gov Patterson

old affair too? I mean, he was a Clark drafter, but is a SD for Hillary - so should be fair game to you for this.

[FrenchieCat]

26. I think that there are parallels here, although Obama is the Choir boy,

and Clinton is the horny devil.

The devil got away with his deed through lies and deception...

[knight_of_the_star]

33. Wow

That is the grossest oversimplification I've ever seen, and I am absolutely floored to see it coming from you FrenchieCat.

[FrenchieCat]

41. So let me see if I get this straight. Pastor Wright actually does say some

valid things. The media reduces his life to 15 seconds worth of soundbytes, and then questions the judgement of someone not on the tapes. It is said that Obama's candidacy is at risk because of this.

On the other hand, 16 years ago, another candidate from hope was also winning primaries, and a scandal broke on him as well; a woman claimed to have had a 12 year affair with him, and had the phone tapes to prove it. He survived and made it to the White House.

Where is the "oversimplification"?

Didn't Flowersgate happen? Why can't it be talked about, but Obama's Grandmother is cool as fodder?

Don't be Floored for my asking questions in one thread. Don't be so "I'm shocked".

Or are there double standards?

Why is the mere mentioning of Gennifer Flowers radioactive in your mind?
And isn't The Wright "scandal" more of an oversimplification in its "Guilt Through Association" .

Why are you questioning my character but aren't outraged by what they are doing to this pastor and to our frontrunner candidate?

[knight_of_the_star]

68. I'm talking about the specific phrase you used

Namely calling Obama a choir boy and Hillary the devil.

[Jennicut]

5. Bill and Hillary believed in hope back then, what happened?

Reading that speech reminded me of what I used to like about Bill Clinton back when I was 17 years old. What happened? Now its all cynicism and praising the Rethug candidate. At least Al Gore has not become like this and he had an election stolen from him!

[Auntie Bush]

31. If Hillary didn't still believe in hope...she wouldn't be running.

It sure take HOPE to win against all the Rethug and far left wing talking points.

[olkaz]

57. "far left wing"

Is code for "I hate the people in my own party".

Seriously, you want a coalition? Start with Democrats. Thanks.

[stellanoir]

8. I remember them doing a damage control appearance on 60 minutes

during which Hillary made her Tammy Wynette baking cookies comment but if memory serves, the controversy sort of calmed down after that. appearance,

[Window]

9. Hillary was just "standing by her man." LOL!

[meow mix]

11. Gennifer Flowers is another Brave Truth-Teller who was Wrongfully Slandered by Hillary

Hillary is the villain in this story, as usual

[DemocratSinceBirth]

12. You Become More And More Unhinged With Every Post But Alas There Is Help

http://www.find-a-therapist.com/

[Justyce]

14. I hope this is sarcasm....

[Recursion]

58. The way Flowers and Jones were treated by Democrats was appalling and misogynistic

And it still troubles me, personally.

Then again, I thought Bill should have resigned after the Lewinsky story broke because a President having an affair with an intern is definitively sexual harassment.

[catgirl]

15. And now she's selling the tapes to the highest bidder

Karma, Bill, karma.

[democrattotheend]

16. If Bill survived that, I don't see how Obama doesn't survive this

Obama has not even done anything wrong! This is a character assassination.

[FrenchieCat]

23. Yep......

Bill had committed adultery and lied to get out of it.....

[olkaz]

17. Here's the funny thing, folks say the Clintons are vetted

And that Obama has alllll this skeletons in the closet.

Guess what? Every scandal, from Vince Foster to Gennifer Flowers to Monica all the way up to what's going to come out of Bill's trip to Kazakhstan is going to get blasted at the electorate 24/7. It's going to all get reopened, re-examined, new interviews, and the media WON'T get tired of doing it.

I'll take a crazy preacher and a screwy land deal over all that any day of the week.

[DemGa]

18. What is the relevance???

[FrenchieCat]

20. Scandal during primaries, and how to survive them.....or who survives them

Bill Clinton lied himself out of his scandal, although there were tapes and a witness.

Obama told the truth and wasn't based on anything other than a some words for an excited old preacher.

Which is a worse offense?

So I'm thinking that Obama will end up doing well in an election.

[Texas Hill Country]

22. dumb and irrelevant. purposely inflammatory.

[FrenchieCat]

24. How's that?

Because what?

This was a scandal that happened during Bill Clinton's, the man from hope, primaries while he was ahead.

I'm looking for the seriousness of the allegation and how Bill came out on top anyways.

[ronnykmarshall]

25. No shit.

This fucking bullshit rivals Freeperville.

[FrenchieCat]

28. it was a scandal that broke, and was meant to take Clinton down....

But it wasn't a smear, it ended up being the truth. Bill lied his way out of it....although everyone knew that it was his voice on the telephone tapes.

How did Bill manage to lie and get away with it? And then do it again, and again later?

[UALRBSofL]

29. Frenchie, this sinks to an all time low, even for you

I had more respect for you then lowering yourself to Rovian Tactics. Sadly even you are getting in on the slime.

[FrenchieCat]

32. Why?

If folks can talk about a pastor and someone's grandmother 24/7 to take down an honest man....

Why can't discuss the parallels that a Hope Candidate faced during his own primaries years before?

What rules tells me that one is OK to discuss freely, and the other is taboo and makes me low?

Please tell me why I am sinking and those Hillary Clinton supporters that continue with the bullshit are A-OK?

[UALRBSofL]

38. I can't tell you what others are thinking

I can just tell you what I think. I don't think anyone on GD-P should flame the other candidate but it seems this isn't going to change any time soon. I'm speaking in a broad statement about everyone on DU. If there is something that comes up I think it should be discussed in a mature way but flaming the candidates just to be hateful is wrong.

[FrenchieCat]

44. So are you in those threads saying to them what you are saying to me?

Cause I would hate there to be a double standard at work, in terms of who gets away with what in this society.

I wouldn't want to have given one person a pass, while we barbeque the other and his pastor.....since we are all Democrats.

[UALRBSofL]

47. Frenchie I am in threads about Obama

But I don't go on for days on end talking about an issue. For example I disagree with the Rev Wright issue but I have already gotten passed that issue. I believe the media more then anything talks about this. Actually, I hardly ever start threads. It seems to me that a lot of what is said on here comes straight from the media like TV and the blogs. It's just repeated on GD-P. Maybe I'm wrong on this and people on GD-P should post what they hear and see. Anyway, I just thought the Flowers issue had been talked about to death, especially from the rethugs. I mean, what more can be said that hasn't been said or investigated by Starr and the rethugs. That was the point I was trying to make.

[FrenchieCat]

50. So you don't find a parallel worthy of discussion in what happened to Bill 16 years ago.....

and what is happening to Obama.....

but yet a true disconnect with the seriousness of each allegation?

[racaulk]

34. Didn't you say, just TWO DAYS AGO, that you were going to rise above the negativity in this forum?

On Tuesday, you made a very compelling and powerful call for unity and positivity that made it to the Greatest page. Well, I see how long that lasted. Figures. :eyes:

[FrenchieCat]

37. Who judges what is PC and what isn't? Why is destroying the life of a pastor

OK......but daring to bring up Gennifer Flowers, who really was a scandal during the 1992 primaries (a scandal that Bill survived) on this forum is NEGATIVITY?

Is there a double standard?


Cause it appears OK for Hillary supporter to talk about Obama's grandmother even.....because of "The Scandal"

[racaulk]

46. OK, here are some of my thoughts...

First off, I don't think that destroying Wright's life is OK. I never personally made that claim. I think the media circus behind his comments, and against Obama by association, is shameful and disgusting.

I'm not sure how you can conclude that there is a double standard, however. The media of today is not the same media as we had 16 years ago, our present-day media is vastly more conservative and vicious toward our candidates, as I'm sure you can agree. We saw the treatment of one media toward one candidate and we see another treatment by a different media against a different candidate, that is true. However, to try to draw conclusions based on two completely different scenarios is at best reaching, IMHO.

To look at it differently, if Obama and Hillary Clinton were involved in similar "scandals" in the present day, during their current campaigns, and the same media gave one candidate a general pass while hammering the other candidate, then yes, I would agree that there would be a double standard there. However, that is not the case when comparing the Clinton/Flowers and Obama/Wright situations. Different candidates, different scandals, different campaign cycles, and most of all, a different media.

I just don't see the relevance of the Clinton/Flowers scandal to the Wright story, but that's where you and I apparently disagree. I just thought this issue was brought up to bring out hurt feelings and old wounds with the Clinton supporters, which would be negative and low, but you have my sincere apologies if I misjudged your reasoning for starting this OP.

One more thing:

Cause it appears OK for Hillary supporter to talk about Obama's grandmother even.....because of "The Scandal"

So if the Clinton supporters are wrong, then it's OK for Obama supporters to be wrong too? Isn't that the sort of thing what you said you were trying to rise above?

[FrenchieCat]

51. Thank you for your thoughts.

I don't believe that this one thread is doing something wrong. As you said, Bill and Hillary successfully weathered the storm, and that scandal has past, and Bill Clinton became President.

However, I do find it ironic that some of those who currently support Bill's wife, seem to be hypocritical in judging Obama as they have (see multiple threads everywhere on this forum), and I wondered if they may have forgotten what happened in the Clinton primary contest back in 1992 that was actually much worse morally and ethically than anything his pastor may have said and the fact that it is being linked directly to Barack Obama.

I believe that there is a hypocrisy present, and I am calling them on it. Maybe other Clinton supporters who are more fair and understand what I am saying will take it upon themselves to impress on the others, that they are going way overboard with this, and that considering the pain that this is causing various communities in our nation, that they would attempt to win the election based on their candidate's merit as opposed to based on out of context quotes and the politics of character assassination and their hopes that this is what takes Obama down. And in fact, that is the double standard that I was referring to.

[madfloridian]

48. I agree with you. They are destroying the life of a pastor...

and they taking away another hope to change the party to something besides Clinton control.

How dare they attack Wright, with all the skeletons in Bill's closet?

[LulaMay]

56. He destroys himself, and sold tapes of it!

[LulaMay]

53. Are you kidding me? Gennifer Flowers in '92??!!!! WHO CARES

[FrenchieCat]

54. enlightening opinion!......

and I agree. It is almost as ridiculous as this big deal in reference to words not said by Obama and the talk of his grandmother being thrown under a bus.

My point exactly.

[SIMPLYB1980]

55. You are so guilty of what you are now speaking against it is funny.

[FrenchieCat]

64. Can you break it down to me......as to what I am guilty of?

I know that the Pastor, and by extension Obama stand accused.....but please, what is my crime?

[Sean Stuart]

59. Why are you digging this up?

This is the kind of crap that prevents Hillary supporters from listening to Obama.

[libbygurl]

60. Goodness, you really gotta dredge up stuff from the bottom of the Right-wing barrel...

...to come up with something to throw at the Clintons TODAY, something which turns out to be completely irrelevant TODAY as it was THEN? Nothing more than old right-wing smears you can come up with? How original. How imaginative.

Oh, my, this is really, truly pathetic. But flail away, little Hillary-hater! Remember that those who throw poop also have poop on their hands.

[Alenne]

61. OMG people get over yourselves

She is saying that Clinton survived a scandal that should have taken him down but didn't. If Clinton can lie about that and still become President than so can Obama.

The fake outrage is silly.

[jillan]

62. DU is turning into FreeRepublic more and more.

[FrenchieCat]

65. Why do you say this? Has FR been asking the same question I am asking?

Are they wondering how those who support one who's husband was mired in real scandal during his own primaries, would now hypocritically now push a fabricated scandal on her current primary opponent?

[rodeodance]

70. Bringing old RW slime to DU-that is what you are doing.