No. I really don't want to see repukes in the cabinet of a dem president.

[cali]

I don't want to "honor the other side", or make nice with them after the last hellish years they gave us. There are plenty of capable democrats to fill the cabinet with. I don't give a shit that Norm Mineta was bushco's transportation secretary or that Cohen was Clinton's defense secretary.

Furthermore, you NEVER hear the repuke candidates talking about putting a dem in their cabinets or sending dems off to be goodwill ambassadors. I wish the dems would just shut up about using repukes.

[napi21]

1. They're pandering to the voters that are upset with the awful partisanship

that's existed in DC since Clinton was elected back in the 90's. I don't think it will help, but I think that's what they're hoping for.

[MADem]

12. The appointment of Cohen was inoculation for Clinton. It was to shut the GOP up.

They were on him about the draft dodging shit, so he fixed their little red wagon by forcing them to criticize one of their own in order to criticize him. It was a deft trick, actually.

Bush just shoved Norm into transportation because he wanted to check the copycat block (no one can say AH AIN'T Bye-Party Sin, TEW!!!!) and he got himself a spare Asian to boot. No one goes for "appearance of diversity" more than BushCo, even though their supporters lack much in the way of ethnicity save the caucasian persuasion, by and large.

[truebrit71]

31. I agree...I think that is the strategy we're seeing in operation right now...

...whether it comes to fruition or not is another matter...we still need to make sure that all the votes get counted first...

[jgraz]

2. We agree again. Must be the vicodin.

Anyone who's still a Repuke is basically saying they support genocide. War criminals have no place in our government.

[TwilightGardener]

5. There aren't any GOPers who are against the war? News to me.

[jgraz]

10. Besides Ron Paul?

If they're as outspoken as Paul AND not as much of a whack-job, then you have to wonder why they're still Republicans.

[TwilightGardener]

16. You never heard of Chuck Hagel, or Gordon Smith, or Walter Jones, or Wayne Gilchrist?

All have been outspoken, especially Hagel--and I don't think any are whack-jobs like Paul.

[jgraz]

21. They're still supporting -- and voting with -- the war party.

It's not just the war on brown people in Iraq. They're still voting against poor people, women and immigrants in this country.

[TwilightGardener]

22. Well, what do you want? You asked if there were GOPers who didn't

support the war, and I named some. Now you're saying, "well, they're still in the party, that's the same thing"--no, it's not. And Hagel (my Senator, so I'm familiar with him) is pro-immigrant. Not so much pro-poor people or women, though.

[jgraz]

24. No you asked that. I said they support genocide

Which all rethugs do, whether it's at home or in Iraq.

[TwilightGardener]

25. What? Who supports genocide in this country or anywhere else? That's crazy shit.

[jgraz]

26. I've already explained why I said that

Add up the war on drugs, support for mandatory minimums, militarization of police and denial of healthcare, education and voting rights and you've effectively implemented a passive form of genocide in this country.

[TwilightGardener]

27. Who in this country is being denied health care? Who is turned away

from a hospital ER for inability to pay? Yes, we need everyone to be insured, and many can't afford to pay the bills for their treatment, but that's different from not having ACCESS to health care, and you're crazy for suggesting that it's a deliberate plot to make a certain class or race of people extinct--that's bullshit. Who's being denied access to pubic-school education? Not even illegal immigrants are denied an education. Who can't vote in this country, provided they meet the criteria? Are there still Jim Crow laws somewhere on the books that I'm not aware of? Jesus, yes, there are problems with all of the issues you've mentioned, and not everything is as fair as it should be, but GENOCIDE is a positively ridiculous term to use. We've veered into melodrama and hyperbole-land here.

[cali]

28. Have you seen Sicko?

Hospital emergency rooms are not adequate health care. Not even close.

[TwilightGardener]

29. Of course not--BUT the poster is saying that this is deliberate GENOCIDE--

come on! We obviously need better access to health care in this country, but no one is lying dead on the sidewalk from hospital employees deliberately refusing to allow a patient in because of his skin color or checkbook.

[jgraz]

33. Did I say deliberate?

Intentional or not, the effect is the same.

[TwilightGardener]

37. There is no genocide going on in this country, intentional or otherwise--

there will always be rich and poor, there will always be instances of inequality, some classes of people will always be underrepresented, but to suggest that it's actual genocide is an affront to those people who actually lived through REAL genocide (like Native Americans in the 1800's, for a home-grown example).

[jgraz]

39. Hokay, as long as you say so

:eyes:

[Selatius]

36. When they put profit ahead of people, you have a situation where 18,000 die/year due to lack of care

That's because they're too poor to afford the profit mark-ups. Is it intentional? No more than slashing wages to increase profit margins or off-shoring jobs. Nobody wants to kill outright, but on the same token, there's always pressure to increase profit margins because the Board of Directors and the rest of the shareholders want bigger dividends.

[TwilightGardener]

40. How is this genocide?

Is it a crying shame that needs to be rectified? YES! Is it the purposeful extermination of a particular group of people? God, no.

[Selatius]

42. Did I say it was genocide?

It doesn't fit the legal international definition of genocide à la Rwanda or the Jews at Auschwitz. It's just greed, and there is no legal definition for that.

[TwilightGardener]

43. Genocide is the term that Jgraz is using. No denying there's greed in the health care system.

[jgraz]

46. health care + drug war + education + courts + voting rights

All that tends to add up. And that's BEFORE you count overt genocidal acts like having the CIA flood black neighborhoods with cocaine in the 80s.

Maybe they should have used smallpox-infected blankets. Would THAT have met with your approval?

[jgraz]

32. I personally saw this on Monday

I was in a Bay Area ER and they brought in a very drunk domestic violence victim strapped to a backboard and wearing a cervical collar. The cops were around taking her statement and the first thing the ER staff did was to ask about insurance. She said she didn't have any and asked how much this would cost.

They said not to worry about it, then left her sitting alone in the ER until she unstrapped herself from the backboard and walked out. The staff just watched her leave and made no attempt to stop her. They made no secret of the fact that they were glad to see her go.

Meanwhile, I'm in with my broken ankle and high-end employer coverage and they're handing me brand new crutches and arranging appointments with specialists.


ETA: Yeah, she was black and I'm white, in case you didn't know that already.

[TwilightGardener]

35. If we're sharing anecdotes and presenting them as evidence

of the state of our nation, I'll share mine: I worked as an RN for five years, all of it in ICU, the most expensive in-patient part of the hospital, and treated all manner of people. Rich, poor, black, white, Asian, Indian, etc. Some confessed to me that they couldn't pay, and we had to arrange a social worker to visit with them and their families to work out an arrangement or find financial assistance, but I treated them the same as somebody who had insurance, and so did my colleagues. In fact, most of the time, their specific insurance status was not even known to me--upon admission, I would ask them if they were concerned about their ability to pay, and that was it. So no, in my experience, most people get treated pretty well regardless of their socioeconomic status.

[jgraz]

38. You asked "Who in this country is being denied health care? Who is turned away"

I gave you one example. Are you trying to pretend that I just happened to see the only instance of a poor person not getting the health care they needed??


And once again, the ER and ICU are not where the most lives are saved. How many of these uninsured are given health screens and preventative care BEFORE the end up in intensive care?

[TwilightGardener]

41. Yes, not giving away free health care screens for the uninsured is GENOCIDE.

OK, I'm done with this nonsense.

[jgraz]

44. OK, we're clearly straining your reading comprehension abilities

Or maybe you just want to argue for argument's sake. Either way, you're not dealing with my responses logically.

[BestCenter]

48. This is asinine.

Are bad government policies regarding health care aimed at a particular race, culture, or creed? If not, they're not genocide. There are plenty of white Christians who are poor, you know.

Not to mention that you're essentially watering down what the word means.

[jgraz]

50. wienerdog narrowed it to health care, I did not

See my other posts. The Rethugs have been targeting black & brown folks for decades.

[cali]

8. Or something.

I don't like it when you agree with me. You're one of my favorite people to fight with around this joint. Can't you just keep it zipped on the rare occasions when we agree?

:hi:

[Happyhippychick]

3. I don't think it's honoring the other side.

I think it's honoring the people of this country. As much as it disgusts me, half of the U.S. population is Republican and as long as they have representatives who can behave as though this is a democracy and not a kingdom then other viewpoints should be welcome.

That doesn't mean the other viewpoints are taken, it just means they are heard.

[TwilightGardener]

4. Yep--excellent point. I sure wish Chimpy was a President to more

than just 30% of us.

[cali]

6. Actually, half the county is not republican. Not even close.

Tens of millions aren't repuke, dem or indie. There are millions more dems now than repukes, and there are millions of indies. Furthermore, there's a range of viewpoints within the dem party. You don't have to go to the repukes to get that. And lastly the repukes don't do it.

[Happyhippychick]

11. I know that the repukes don't do it but why would we model ourselves after them?

I say we govern the best way and that would be by doing pretty much the exact opposite of what the repukes are doing.

But I really don't feel all that strongly about it. I'm so disgusted by the administration that I'm suffering from outrage fatigue. I think we should just win and then worry about who is in the cabinet.

[MADem]

7. How about a recovering Republican? Linc Chaffee, for example?

He's just gone indy. He's a good guy, too. He's a better Democrat than some Democrats, even though he isn't one!

Or perhaps Jumpin' Jim Jeffords for Secretary of Education. That would get several birds with one stone (a capable individual, subject-matter expert, helped us out when we needed the help) and it really would piss off the right....

[cali]

9. Sure. Recovered repukes are no problem.

Sadly Jim's now in a care facility suffering from dementia.

[MADem]

14. Oh, how dreadful. I hadn't heard that. Well, then appoint his WIFE. Education was

near and dear to her heart as well, and it would serve those bastards who shunned HER when her husband jumped right.

[cali]

17. Oh, dear. Jim lost his wife to cancer just before he started his

decline. She was a wonderful woman though.

[MADem]

19. Jesus!!! I can't win, can I? I'd better not nominate anyone else, they'll get hit by a bus!

How incredibly SAD.

OTOH, the cruel reality of dementia may have obviated his memory of and his sadness over the loss of his wife.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

45. You mean Alzheimer's? -nt

[cali]

47. I don't know if it's Alzheimer's

or not.

[Recursion]

13. It's a tradition even * honored in his first term

I could see putting Warner in the VA or something

[maximusveritas]

15. Are there any candidates saying they won't include a Republican?

Kucinich maybe?

[cali]

18. None of the repukes are saying this shit about how they'll

reach across the aisle. And I haven't heard of anyone besides Obama and Edwards say they'd do it, but Clinton says she'd use repukes as "goodwill ambassadors".

[TwilightGardener]

20. McCain is. Although he refuses to budge on my most important issue, which is the war.

[Doctor_J]

23. Our new prez can pick one of the 3 repukes that's not in jail in 2009

Oly Snowe, John Voinovich, and Christine Whitman.

[LeftishBrit]

30. Unfortunately Gordon Brown seems to have picked up the same idea

He hasn't put any Tories in his Cabinet; but he appointed two to advisory posts. One of them I can accept; he is on the far liberal ('wet') end of the Tory Party and people keep expecting him to switch parties; but the other isn't and was kicked off the Tory front bench for some dodgy racial remark!

[annie1]

34. especially at a time like this when the main task is going to be to undo the last 8 years

[ClarkUSA]

49. I don't mind Ahnuld being asked to head up a Fitness For America program or something similar.

Obesity is a big national problem and Arnold would be a good spokesperson on the issue, I guess. What harm is he going to do? It's not
like he's going to be Secretary of Defense, as Richard Cohen was under Clinton I.

Arnold is a RINO, which conservatives in CA will gladly tell anyone who stops to listen. They think he sold out and his top strategists
are Democrats.

[Perry Logan]

51. Bipartisanship is TREASON, goddammit.

[Maven]

52. Agreed. They need a complete time-out from the Executive Branch

This conciliatory crap is exactly why we get nothing done.