Clinton supporters and Obama supporters...

[Dhalgren]

I've been here on DU since mid '03 and during presidential campaigns things can tend to get nasty, but I have never seen the kind of vitriol between the supporters of two candidates as between Clinton and Obama supporters this time around. Last time there was infighting between Dean supporters and Kerry supporters, but nothing like this. I cannot see how the Clinton supporters here could ever possibly vote for Obama if he should get the nomination - and vice-a-versa for the Obama supporters. If Obama supporters can turn around and vote for Clinton in November, then they must be lying about her now. And the same is true of Clinton supporters who say they will vote for Obama next November.

It is one thing to tout you candidate's position as better than his/her opponent's, but the kind of ugliness going on right now seems way, way out of line. Don't tell me it is "just politics" and after the convention all be forgotten. This is character assassination on a par with the swift-boaters and frankly I want nothing to do with any of it. If half of what either camp says about the other candidate is true, then neither is fit to be president, period.

This has simply become a very stupid exercise and is not just bad for the two Senators' campaigns, but for everyone. That's my two cents, so go ahead and continue the blood-letting...

[mitchtv]

1. Hey, it works

I hate them both now. Ask Phil Angelides who ran for Governor of Calif who did more damage to his efforts, R's or D's .

[Dhalgren]

6. I agree and that is why this seems so unbelievably counter productive.

The bad blood left after this nomination may be too great to overcome...

[BeyondGeography]

2. The Dean/Clark thing was worse, as I recall

and, in the end, we all lined up behind Kerry.

It feels impossible here at times, but I attribute the vast majority of it to passion...the energy will find the proper target in the end.

My two cents.

[zulchzulu]

3. Who do you support?

Je suis curieux, mon ami.

[Dhalgren]

Right now, I'm thinkin' the lady in the barret..

:loveya:


Seriously, though, I support Kucinich.

[zulchzulu]

33. I support Kucinich too...

...although I know Obama is certainly more viable...and actually better than Dennis...

OK. I'll send Dennis another $25... that would make $200 so far.

On your OP though, I think 2003-2004 on DU was a LOT worse. Then again, this movie ain't over.

[Dhalgren]

43. Oh, I think that this time is much worse.

Funny, how we both can witness both episodes and hold opposite views. But then that is what it is all about. I accept that you view Obama as a better representative for the party than Kucinich, and guess what? I don't hate you for it! And you are right, my friend, "this movie ain't over." It can go sideways in a heartbeat; as Sam Jackson said in "Jurassic Park", "Hold on to your butts!"

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TeamJordan23]

9. very classy. nm

[Catherine Vincent]

14. Thank you. nt

[AX10]

10. I am a Biden supporter first, but will..

support the nominee next year.

[mtnsnake]

46. I would believe you are correct, cat_girl

I believe the place definitely became infested once Hillary entered the fray...and with good reason...she gives the repukes their worst nightmares.

[ixion]

5. I agree with you...

I've been here since '02, and it always gets nasty around election time, but I've never seen it this bad. In my opinion, it does a disservice both to the democratic party and to the DU board.

[Dhalgren]

29. Yeah, '04 was not this bad.

If the Democratic Party was strong and united this might not be so damaging, but the Party is in a shambles and this kind of ugliness will only worsen the divisions and make any kind of healing all but impossible.

[BootinUp]

7. I just started watching "One flew over the cuckoos nest"

I think DU put me in the mood for it.

[Catherine Vincent]

12. LOL!

[BootinUp]

44. :-)

[Froward69]

8. I picked the adult

long ago. let them duke it out. :popcorn: it just shows the level of integrity, and Intelligence of those candidates' supporters.

[BeyondGeography]

11. See post #9

[cuke]

13. I disagree with you

I think there are far fewer Clinton supporters (possibly none) who are saying things like

Obama is the republicans candidate. The repukes want Obama

Obama is a republican

Obama is a warmonger. Obama is a neocon

Obama is part of some DLC/PNAC conspiracy

Obama would do anything to win

Obama is a Dominionist

and more

[MannyGoldstein]

16. Of Course

Because it would obviously be ludicrous to say that Obama is most of those things.

[cuke]

18. Thank you for proving my point

[cuke]

And there is nothing I have said that would prevent me from voting for Obama in the GE

Even with regards to the McClurkin debacle

[ilovesunshine]

20. Just as ludicrous as to say that Hillary is any of those.

Not everyone in this country leans way to the left, or hadn't you noticed who is the President?

The majority did elect him.

[cuke]

21. Yet, it happens every day on DU

In fact, one poster has already agreed that Hillary is all those things. I haven't seen any Clinton supporter say that Obama was any of those, so the equivalency the OP is trying to make does not exist IMO

[ilovesunshine]

22. I would have never known about so much Hillary hate if I hadn't joined this forum.

And, I live in Arizona.

[cuke]

26. Surprised?

Some of them sound a lot like freepers, IMO

[BootinUp]

Wait for it

Pretty soon you will be indoctrinated, we haven't lost elections, they were all stolen.

[FatDave]

50. "The majority did elect him."

Not the first time, and the second time is open to debate. Just my two cents.

[rufus dog]

24. I have seen Hillary supporters call Obama

four of those things in the last few hours.

[cuke]

28. I haven't

[Beaverhausen]

48. I have too

All the candidates are getting shit flung at them. No one is exempt. I don't give a shit if supporters of this one or that one think their candidate is treated worse. It doesn't matter.

We are basically all on the same team right? The one that wants to get a democrat in thw White House on January 9th, 2009.

[Dhalgren]

25. I have seen several threads that say he is dishonest.

A couple of Clinton supporters have said flat out that he is a liar. How can you vote for someone in November if you believe him to be a liar and fundamentally dishonest? And, likewise, how can you vote for Clinton if you believe the things Obama supporters say about her? I disagree with many of the policies, positions, and stances that both candidates have put forward - but the personal attacks one against the other has been a spectacle that I would just as soon not have witnessed...

[cuke]

30. He is a liar. So what?

He's a politician. They're all liars. Including Kucinich. Whenever I vote, I vote for a liar.

But I do appreciate your corroborating my point.

[Dhalgren]

36. Just for the sake of clarity, which point did I corroborate?

[cuke]

39. That Clinton supporters aren't saying as bad things about Obama

as Obama supporters are saying about Clinton.

[Carrieyazel]

15. Both candidates could very well NOT be our nominee.

Each candidate's supporters think the other should not be our nominee. And both camps think that they are the only two who will be left standing. The media has pumped both up. Both could fall and leave it open for #3 and #4 currently in the polls. This leaves a great opportunity for Edwards, Richardson or Biden.

[Froward69]

17. Or Biden

[Carrieyazel]

34. Yes, I definitely should put Biden in there as well. He is my second choice right now.

[Froward69]

37. good for all of us

if Biden were your first choice I would have a gift for you.

[Dhalgren]

38. Yes, I have noticed that Clinton + Obama supporters = a minority on DU.

And one of the other candidates could certainly step up after the two "front runners" destroy each other. But I still think that it is stupid to vilify the character of an inter-party opponent like is going on here.

[BenDavid]

19. It's the same shit different day with the obama supporters. Obama

is one shifty person and there is a lot under the surface if investigated. The press will not do it because for some reason they are too busy trying to bring down the HRC campaign, and the only way one can say they have the better candidate knowing damn well he is not is to go negative, attack, attack attack. hate, hate hate.....

This is how it works, folks. Hillary is fucking her female Arab assistant. John Edwards had an affair. It doesn't have to be true; it doesn't even have to have anything to it other than what's pulled out of the obama campaigns ass. All obama's campaign has to do is put something "out there".

Meanwhile, Obama DOES have ties to some unsavory characters and illegal money accusations should be investigated. If the man is a charlatan then expose him before the general election because the right wing sure as hell will. .

Rumors true about HRC. Facts false with Obama

Ben David

[AtomicKitten]

27. Just can't stop the mud-slinging, can you?

Your post is truly disgusting.

[cuke]

31. Bwahahaha!

Hilarious

[zulchzulu]

42. You want the 90's Revisitation Candidate. I already saw that movie...

I heard the new Clinton theme song is Paul Simon's "Slip Sliding Away"...

Slip Slidin' Away

Slip sliding away, slip sliding away
You know the nearer your coronation
The more you're slip sliding away

/ G - Em - / GD / CD G - /

Hillary was a first lady in Little Rock town
She wore her passion for her role like a thorny crown
Bill said Hillary, I live with no fear
My love for other women's so overpowering
I'm afraid that you might have to disappear

/ Em - G - / CD C C7 / G - Em - / GD / CD G - /

{Refrain}

Hillary was a woman, became Bill's wife
There are many ways she uses to describe her life
She said a good war ain't got no pain
She said a bad day is when I lie in the bed
And I think of things that might have been

{Refrain}

And we know of her husband who is known to have fun
He longed to tell her all the reasons for the things he'd done
He came a long way just to explain
He kissed her while she lay sleeping
Then he turned around and headed home again

{Refrain}

God only knows, God makes his plan
The questions have been planted according to plan
Hillary thinks it's inevitable and that it's her turn anyway
Believes she's gliding down the highway
When in fact she's slip sliding away

[Maven]

23. I think it's because the two candidates' positions--despite all the posturing--are very similar.

Thus, beyond nitpicking on this vote or that statement, character assassination is all that's left. The two sides are in a branding war rather than a real ideological dispute, which is why there is no resolve to the endless volley of nonsense.

[cuke]

32. Good point

They are very similar and their time together in the Senate shows similar voting histories. Doesn't leave much room to attack on the issues and politics (and the media) abhor a vacuum as much as nature does

[sandnsea]

35. And Edwards and Kucinich

One of the things I learned in 2004 is that vitriol comes from a variety of places and it is assumed that all of it is between two specific campaigns. It's not, the side campaigns attack because they somehow think it helps their candidate too. Lots of blame to go around.

As for me, I'll vote for Hillary but I most certainly mean every word I say about her, her policies and her political tactics.

[MadBadger]

40. Honestly, I have never attacked other people's candidates, until I came to GD-P

For all my time on DU, i have spent in GD. I have resisted the urge to attack other candidates, because I had always thought that wasnt what this place was about. But then I came to GD-P and saw just how awful it can get. When I saw the Hillary supporters attack my candidate, I attacked back (Not as hard and as mean as some, but still an attack back). Now im not saying that some of the Obama supporters arent bad about this because they are. But when soembody is attacking my candidate in ways that I view are very unfair, I am going to respond.

[ClarkUSA]

41. Don't worry... by Feb. 5, it will be all over. Use your "ignore" button until then.

Works for me. ;-)

[Dhalgren]

47. You know, I went the first three years here with no one on ignore,

now my ignore list is huge! Ha! You give good advice...

[ClarkUSA]

49. Same here.

Kundalini yoga helps too, Dhalgren. :hippie:

[JeffR]

45. Stupid exercise indeed

There's barely any daylight showing between the positions of these candidates on many issues, but you'd think from many things posted here that they're polar opposites.