Obama cracks me up - First he publicly endorses the Biden/Gelb plan for Iraq

[jillan]

Then he misspeaks about it.

He says that it probably is the best plan, but we shouldn't force it on the Iraqis"

Obama ~ You may want to educate yourself before you speak!
It is based on the Iraqi constitution! It is not something that Biden/ Gelb pulled out of thin air.
The Plan IS NOT a foreign imposition. To the contrary, it is consistent with Iraq's constitution, which already provides for Iraq's 18 provinces to join together in regions, with their own security forces, and control over most day-to-day issues. On October 11, Iraq's parliament approved legislation to implement the constitution's articles on federalism. Prior to the British colonial period and Saddam's military dictatorship, what is now Iraq functioned as three largely autonomous regions.
http://biden.senate.gov/newsroom/details.cfm?id=264909&


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQ7dSVyP1p4


:rofl:

[Colobo]

1. Obama > Biden.

[jillan]

6. Obama

on edit - to be fair - I share the same disgusting habit.

[Kagemusha]

2. Excuse me, what the hell are you laughing about? This is serious business.

Assuredly, the Kurds need no one to force this on them. The Iran-backed Shiites in the south do not need this forced on them; this is one of their major projects, a mini pro-Iranian state that need not listen to Bagdhad anymore. You will need to brutally and with vicious application of force impose it on the Sunnis, who strenuously opposed that section of the constitution, who only acceded to the process on the understanding that they could democratically fight to change that provision later in government (which has proven a laughable proposition), and who firmly see the establishment of further regions (above and beyond that of the Kurds) as leading directly to the breakup of the country, since, if you did not notice, the Ottoman Army is not occupying Iraq anymore to keep it together through brutal repression.

So what the hell are you laughing about?...

[jillan]

3. Because the Biden/Gelb plan DOES NOT FORCE anything on anybody

and Obama said it does.

If you are going to endorse someone elses plan - don't misrepresent it - duh!

[Kagemusha]

22. Are you blind? Obama didn't say it does at all.

He said it shouldn't be forced. A plan, in and of itself, does not force itself on anyone. They are not inherently self forcing. It's an abuse of language to claim that Obama misrepresented the plan. He said the plan should not be forced... leaving implied, obviously, forced by people, actual human beings. What, forgot they exist here?

Dump the tunnel vision. There is a larger debate, and Obama addressed that, not just the narrow confines of the Biden plan, but addressing its potential or actual place in the REAL world.

Which your comments don't jive with.

[jillan]

31. Ok - I am desperately waiting to hear what Obama's plan is then.

So far, this is the only time I have ever heard him talk about how he would get us out of Iraq.

[MethuenProgressive]

4. Poor Obama, he just can't go off script and ad-lib

His handlers really need to keep him from speaking off the cuff.

[durrrty libby]

5. Ain't that the truth. No wonder he hates debate.

[collegegirl211]

7. couldn't said it better myself

Obama is and was a media creation the media wants to see a horserace too bad obama can't live up to their standards clinton is still the front runner despite all the media love for obama

[babylonsister]

8. Media creation? I think not. And I have a problem with every aspect

of your post, including your spelling, collegegirl. And I don't even have a favorite yet.

[jefferson_dem]

14. The only thing missing was a note of special *concern* that too many of her

fellow Democrats were being swept up in the media frenzy for the "creation".

That one wins the "Bollocks Post of the Night" award.

[Laurab]

36. Actually the spelling is excellent - BUT

there's something to be said for punctuation, maybe a few periods, commas, stuff like that. Spellcheck doesn't help with that. It's hard for me to understand a run on sentence, that doesn't make any sense to begin with...

[durrrty libby]

9. Welcome and bring your friends

:toast: :hi: :loveya: :pals:


p.s. pay no attention to the cranks...(ef em)

I know what it is like to stay up late to study

[collegegirl211]

16. Thanks and btw I'm not here to spell correctly

[emilyg]

24. Welcome. You go girl!!!!

[TwilightGardener]

25. It's a courtesy to spell correctly and use punctuation.

[jefferson_dem]

11. Um...

Predictable set of base-level talking points there. I wonder where you got them from.

[Name removed]

13. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jefferson_dem]

15. So are those who glom onto concern trolls because it suits their low-brow political interests...

:toast:

[babylonsister]

19. Very suave! Thanks! nt

[durrrty libby]

38. "suave"? Well, sure...if you set your bar of standards in the asphalt.

[durrrty libby]

37. "concern troll" = an idiotic apparition of the internets. In other words, someone

who disagrees with you

[Yael]

17. Welcome to DU

It would be helpful to those reading your posts if you could inject some punctuation here and there.

:hi:

[Tellurian]

20. I hate to add this, but will, for the sake of corollary..

another misspeak made by BO was that he was a member of the Armed Services Committee. (he corrected himself as soon as he said it. How can you mistake what committees you sit on in Congress?) IIRC...it happened in IA and on video.

[collegegirl211]

21. That just goes to show he is not ready for prime time

btw i love your aviator.

[Tellurian]

23. Thanks and welcome collegegirl211

anyone is welcome to copy it to their sig line. It used to be available at Hillary is 44.org at one time.

[tkmorris]

30. I love your aviator too

[TwilightGardener]

26. "Aviator"? Or "Avatar"? You should ask for your money back

from your college, collegegirl.

[killbotfactory]

29. If you think he misspoke in regards to the OP

Then you have lost all critical perspective.

[jefferson_dem]

10. Oh, I get it...

There's no risk that a US plan for the arrangement of the Iraq political system could ever be a foreign imposition because the policy paper on Biden's website says it isn't.

Whew...

Seriously, did you retrieve this from a Colbert Report skit or something?

[Jillian]

12. Read the plan

The plan was taken right out of the Iraqi constitution.

The only way we are going to get out of Iraq, without leaving the country in worse chaos is if we help them with a political solution. I'm sure you have heard that coming from Generals, foreign policy leaders....and even from Mr. Obama.
We are not going to force them to do anything. They have their own government, when it's not on vacation.

[jefferson_dem]

18. I appreciate the point.

To me, the plan sounds like the best of all the "no good" options at this point.

Still...the fact that WE have a plan for Iraq, however well-intentioned, is in and of itself a representation of foreign influence. If it's already in their Constitution, as Biden claims, why should WE be supporting a US plan? See the irony?

[sandnsea]

27. Well it's a crappy plan anyway

so I disagree with him and hope he actually rethinks it and comes up with a better strategy.

[jillan]

32. A plan based on their constitution, based on what the supposed Iraqi leaders goal is for their

country...
how can that be a crappy plan?

Tell me one better, because I haven't heard any other plans other then to just leave.
So we leave, and then what?? Then what happens if their civil war spills outside of the borders?

Besides, the Biden/Gelb plan can't be that bad. Obama endorses it. So does Richardson. One of Clinton's advisors endorses it.
hmmm.

[sandnsea]

35. They will end up broken apart with that plan

which is what tends to happen whenever countries divide themselves up that way. Then we'll have 3 groups of people fighting for rights to both the oil and the religious locations. It'll be another I/P. We needed to have a better bottom up system in place to begin with, so that the local cities could govern while the central government worked out the details. I don't know what it will take to bring peace to that country, but sectioning it up would only be a short peace, before the border fighting began and created even further divisions. Look at us and the civil war, it still isn't over, no matter what we say about the past.

[killbotfactory]

28. We have an over 100,000 strong army occupying their country

Everything the US does there is a foreign imposition.

[jillan]

34. You have a point there.....that's why we need a way out.

[DU GrovelBot]

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[Look My Way]

39. I wondered how long it would take me to find a pro Biden thread !

He's the best candidate the Democrats have going. Bar none!