Santorum smacks Casey; trouble in PA

[espera17]

If Casey's debate performance this morning is replicated in the other debates, expect Santorum to be reelected in November. This is PA, not CA, and the people here won't vote for someone with no position on issues. (aka Lynn Swann)

[flyarm]

1. WHAT WERE YOU WATCHING???..HMMM...N/T

[eccles12]

69. I thought Casey was terrible. Grinned too much when he should have been

shouting back at Rick. These Dems need to take some lessons from Al Sharpton if they want to be able to handle the RW-talking points.

[Erika]

2. Did you see the debate?

Santorum played the idiot son part.

[acmavm]

3. The very thought that we might have to suffer through another term

for Santorum just gave me a headache. It really did. I don't think I can listen to his crooked, hypocritical, lying, obscene mouth any more.

[blue cat]

4. Wow

Santorum looked like an idiot. Oh wait, he always does. He looked like a spoiled ignorant brat.

[Warpy]

5. I posted a year ago that Casey was trouble

He's just another bland, antichoice, DLC conservative.

[napi21]

12. I disagree with you. Santorum IS a very arrogant person,

and it sure showed today! I was really surprised when I saw the poll results of that debate! It showed 79% thought Ricky won and 23% thought Casey won. Igrew up in Pgh. and still have a lot of friends there. EVERYONE I talk to says theywant Ricky GONE!

He's pissed off a lot of women by writing in his bookthet "Most women work because they WANT TO not because they NEED to. Awoman's place is in the home, raising her children full time."

[sendero]

29. I didn't see it..

... but assuming that arrogance is a disqualifier for public office is a mistake.

[madfloridian]

6. Not what I have read elsewhere today.

I did not watch it, but I hear Casey did very well.

[Cosmocat]

44. He didn't do very well, but I think he "won" ..

by a hair, a draw at worst ...

First, I was surprised that Russert actually was tougher on Santorum than Casey ... He nailed him on the house issue, would not let him skate around it until he finally blurted out that he spends maybe a month a year there ... He also would not let him lie about the Saddam/Al Queda connections or the bizarre 500 mustard gas shells being proof of WMD ...

I think the debate showed the weaknesses of both candidates ... Casey, not the sharpest tool in the shed ... Santorum as the arrogant, win at all costs, saying anything he needs to win freak he is ... Casey did not shine, but as others noted, Casey did come across as the lying puke, and maniac he is ...

I would ask anyone who saw the debate to note what Santorum's plan was for Iraq ... Check out the repeat tonight, and you will see, his plan for Iraq basically is to put things in motion to start another war with Iran ... Casey does not impress me a lot ... But, he is a decent man at least ... Santorum is freakin insane ...

[Yupster]

68. Agree with you Cat

I wasn't impressed with Casey at all, but I'd say he won slightly or drew.

Santorum said he had no ideas, and Russert stuck with that point for a while, and he really didn't have anything.

On balancing the budget he said he'd raise taxes on the wealthy which Russert said would raise about 1/4 what he needed. Then he said he'd make a 3.5 million estate tax, which he said would save money, and Santorum correctly said that would actually cost money since current law has it going back to 1 million.

Santorum was bad and Russert got him time after time, but Casey didn't impress me either.

I'd call it a win for Casey since he's ahead and doesn't need to win. Bland is fine when you're up double digits.

[blue cat]

7. Don't frigging post something

and take up more space when you already posted the same shit. Vote how you want, but don't be so rude as to post another diary. It's unnecessary and thoughtless to everyone who posts.

PLEASE DELETE!

[nini]

8. love your CA bash

:eyes:

That whole recall mess was a fucking joke and not setup where the majority would win. Let's not even start on CA. two words for that comment: BARBARA BOXER

[TheDebbieDee]

21. Nini: Your baby has a beautiful smile! : ^ ) n/t

[nini]

25. That's my grandson

:D Thanks!


Grandkids are wayyyyy more fun than our own!

[globalvillage]

9. I thought Casey was impressive.

Ricky was angry and defensive, while Casey appeared rational and intelligent.

:shrug:

[ruggerson]

10. Santorum came across as defensive and unlikeable

and very angry.

Casey came across as smart, charming, calm and charismatic.

What planet did you watch this debate from?

[otohara]

67. That's How I Saw It Too

Santorum was pissed off and especially nasty when he took a shot about Casey's deceased father "I think his father would be very upset if, if he were alive today and, and heard him be supportive of something like this." (Plan B)

[MoonRiver]

11. It's interesting to see how much attention the reichwing gives DU.

:rofl:

[blue neen]

14. Ain't that the truth, though.

You can smell Santorum's desperation all the way from Virginia!

[MoonRiver]

16. He FEARS us!

SWEET!! :kick:

[kentuck]

13. Santorum got his ass kicked.....big time..

I watched the entire debate.

[Singular73]

15. I didn't think Casey clearly won

Santorium came off as his usual nutty self, but Casey had no stance on any issue.

[Mira]

34. That's how I saw it, too. I was disappointed in Casey.

There he is, facing a nationwide forum as he has a an arrogant ass-wipe, Bush - clone opponent who is scared and running behind. Yet,even in the face of all this support of failed policies mentioned many times by Russert (I think it was 93 or so percent blind support of Bush votes on his record) he is unable to wipe the floor with the guy.

I had to mute it a number of times just to wipe the cursewords I muttered off the screen.

[Mass]

37. I agree

[MH1]

52. No stance? What were you watching?

I won't say he was perfectly direct on every issue, but he was pretty direct on most of them:

IWR - yes with the SAME evidence today as in 2004 he would vote for it
IWR - NO with TODAY's evidence then, in 2004 he would NOT have voted for it
Balance the budget - repeal the tax cut for the top 2%
Morning After Pill - it is contraception not abortion and it is good for it to be available

I could go on...

[leesa]

17. Funny. I'll bet you think Bush is a master debater as well.

[Sparkly]

18. "I'd do X, Y, and Z."... "See? He has no plans!"

"No position on issues?" I thought Casey did a fine job stating his positions. You may agree or disagree with them, but he was quite clear.

Santorum kept trying to say Casey didn't have positions, didn't answer questions, and didn't have plans, while Casey kept stating his positions, answering questions, and outlining specific plans!

It's interesting you're repeating Santorum's line.

[espera17]

55. he didnt have positions

the only things he mentioned were repealing the tax cuts and the estate tax reduction.. thats it period.. he had no specifics for anything just generalizations. he wouldnt even name one gov't program he would get rid of. one!

[Orangepeel]

58. he did say he'd hire fewer consultants, stop tax breaks for outsourcing

and reduce corporate welfare.

[karynnj]

59. Is there a program you would get rid of?

This is a Republican trick. They don't consider that you can also eliminate some of the huge tax cuts scheduled to take place. This increases the money coming in at a later point - same effect as decreasing spending.

He did say control waste - everyone does. Most discretionary programs aid people and were fought for by Democrats. Cutting the military is not a winner now.

[fuzzyball]

61. We need many more government programs....NOT less!!!

This is a rich country and no one should be forced
to work for small wages. The minimum wage should be
hiked to atleast $15/hour so everyone can afford a
decent living. We need more government spending to help
the underclass and get that money from hiking taxes on
every one making more than $100,000/year. Tax the hell
out of the rich so the poor can live well without being
forced into slave labor.

[DemInDistress]

19. rick said,,but I live in PA for a month out of the year I even go to

a PA dentist..(rotf)..

While Casey didn't impress me much Ricky certainly looked like the loser he is.. PA is a Democratic state only given to Rick by the hedger's and I now feel those hedger's will vote Democratic in Nov.

[globalvillage]

24. Well, his teeth aren't that nice.

Maybe he should find a dentist near his home in VA.

[countingbluecars]

27. Loudoun County, where Ricky really lives,

was just named the wealthiest county in the nation. Lots of good dentists here. LOL

[Mountainman]

20. Well this is going to be an interesting political season. Fighting it

out right here on DU, what fun. Both sides posting their talking points. To me this was a debate by two right wingers. I don't know why Dems can't find someone who is pro choice in PA. I hope women turn out in great numbers and some time in the future run a woman in this state and really knock the chauvinist pigs back into their mud holes where they belong. I want the Dem to win because it increases our numbers but please lean a little more left next time.

[MoonRiver]

23. We're in battle with freepers on DU.

I can deal with it. :kick:

[SPCAworks]

33. I'm surprised

the thread hasn't been deleted.

[karynnj]

60. Casey is not RW - nor LW

But he is a Democrat.

[Bluzmann57]

22. From what I saw

Santorum never shut up. He wanted Casey to "let me finish" and never finished and also interrupted Casey a number of times. I don't know about the good people of Pennsylvania, but here in Iowa, a performance like that would sour people on the candidate.

[ruggerson]

26. Santorum was angry and hostile

Casey was engaged and charming.

A blind bat can see who won this debate.

[Auntie Bush]

45. That bothered me too. He tried and many time succeeded in

using up more of his share of the (hot) air time.

[Vinca]

28. I loved Santorum's response to "Plan B" and the follow-up

question about why he would vote for an anti-abortion bill that had exceptions for rape, etc. The nonimplantation of an egg which may or may not be fertilized vs. a fetus. I hope he has services over the toilet once a month when his wife has her period, because you never know when another offspring might circle the bowl.

[saltpoint]

30. Casey wins this seat in November.

[tularetom]

31. Wasn't watching but I could hear it from another room

Sounded to me like Santorectum was angry and defensive and it also sounded like russert for once was attempting to hold his feet to the fire at least a little. I'm not that familiar with Ricky but the sound of his voice is unpleasant and a turnoff to voters.

[retread]

32. I'm going to assume we saw the same show. If you equate shouting,

interrupting, petulant defensiveness, and a general tone of anger, as "winning" a debate then you are correct.

[kstewart33]

35. Unfortunately, being a jerk sometimes works.

I saw the entire debate. Casey was too soft and vague on some issues. He needs to come out swinging on some issues and not let Santorum lecture to him, especially about his dad.

But, hopefully the Casey campaign will make the needed adjustments before the state level debates before the election. I'm assuming there will be one or two, when people really begin paying attention to the race.

Little Ricky did sound shrill and defensive at times but he stayed more on attack than Casey, IMHO.

[PBass]

36. SLICK RICK

Santorum looked like a phony used car salesman, with canned answers. He looked like a career politician who mastered the art of talking out of both sides of his mouth.

Casey is not as progressive in his politics as I would like, but he looked calm and rational.

[tsuki]

63. Most RWers do ewuate shouting, etc, along with a large dose

of lying and cheating as "winning a debate."

[creeksneakers2]

38. I thought Casey was lame too

He gave mostly rambling answers with few specifics. Casey looked especially bad when he couldn't give a succinct answer about why he favored over the counter morning after pill sales while being pro life. Russert asked Casey when life begins and Casey didn't answer the question at all. That showed no courage or convictions.

Casey angered me when Russert asked Casey if the Democratic Party in Congress is obstructionist and Casey agreed. I hope others didn't notice and Casey gets a good quiet talking to.

On the other hand, I thought Santorum, while not losing to Casey, lost to Russert. Santorum did a good job defending himself under the circumstances but Russert brought up too many negatives about Santorum for Santorum to explain away. Santorum got very angry and spent most of the last 10 minutes pointing his finger in an aggressive manner.

Anger runs counter to Santorum's previous strategy. Santorum saturated the airwaves with ads that made made him look like a warm fuzzy moderate. It was a perfect strategy because the votes Santorum needed to pick up were among moderates. It also put Casey in a bind because Santorum was positive and moderates don't like negative campaigns against warm fuzzy moderate guys. Casey would have had to go negative if Santorum picked up the moderates and made it close.

Santorum's strategy was brilliant and I praised it myself. The only problem the strategy had was it didn't work at all. It picked up no votes for Santorum.

So if Santorum now wants to be the angry guy that frees up Casey to go negative. Santorum has far more to lose in a negative/negative race because there is so much dirt on Santorum. Casey didn't offer new targets this morning.

I think Casey lost the battle but may have helped himself in the war.

[rep the dems]

40. Casey clearly stated that he believes life begins at conception.

<http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14568263/page/8/>

[creeksneakers2]

41. Thank you

I was wrong.

[rep the dems]

48. No problem.

:)

[DeepModem Mom]

39. Santorum's strong, simple, wrongheaded, big-picture debate, indeed, WON.

I agree with you. His performance, IMO, outweighs whatever was said in the eyes of most viewers.

[kentuck]

43. I disagree...

I watched the entire debate, body language and all, and it seemed to me that Rick Santorum was responding like a desperate politician. I did question why Casey would go on national TV to debate, MTP nonetheless, with such a huge lead. Why would he gamble?

That said, I was surprised by Casey. I actually expected him to do worse. I thought he did very well. Santorum simply has so much baggage that it is impossible to explain away. Livng in VA, sending his kids to private school at PA taxpayer expense, voting himself pay raises in Congress as he criticizes the state employees of PA, voting with George W Bush 98% of the time, his totally irrational explanations for the war in Iraq, etc... I cannot understand how anyone could look at this same debate and think that Santorum won??

[DeepModem Mom]

50. You could be right, kentuck.

And, I'll admit, I was distracted and missed the part when his living in Virginia was addressed.

[rep the dems]

62. But what made his performance all that great? And it seems to me

that while some people might agree with some things he said, they may have been distracted by how desperate and antsy he was. And as I've said many times today: Remark about Casey's father=Below the belt.

[DeepModem Mom]

65. That remark was contemptible, indeed. nt

[AX10]

42. I saw it. It was a wash. Neither one gained any ground.

Still, Casey has time to polish up fr the state level debates.

[Joanne98]

46. Santorum vs Grandson Gorilla....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dU5YZzn37Y

[Connie_Corleone]

47. I thought both of them sucked.

But, hopefully this debate won't matter and Casey will win in November.

[NJ Democrats]

49. I saw part of it

and while I think Casey was pretty bad, Santorum came off to me as a crazy, angrey man with bad ideas. Like, claiming he's indeoendent of the prez when there was a list thatr went up showing he voted w/ Bush, 96, 97, 99, 100! (How the hell do you vote with someone EVERY TIME?), 95. Someone explain to me how that is independent?
Casey won the debate of Santorum, bairley though, and I think Russert did a better job against Santorum then Casey. But Casey still wins this seat.

[Cosmocat]

51. Yep ..

I live here in PA, and I can honestly say that I have felt that Casey is not the sharpest tool in the shed all along, but that he was the only shot to take down Santorum ...

Santorum is insane ... If you paid any attention, his "plan" for Iraq basically is to start another war with Iran ...

I also agree that Russert was tougher on Santorum ...

[SOS]

53. Your forecast,

"expect Santorum to be reelected in November", is smashed by the latest Gallup poll (August 23-27):

Santorum: 38%
Casey: 56%

Bye Ricky!

[Penndems]

54. Here's my response:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=2808956&mesg_id=2809409

[blue neen]

56. I also thought that Casey did the right thing by acknowledging

O'Connor's death. That is showing true respect.

Contrast that to Santorum saying that Casey's dead father would be ashamed of him. Santorum is disrespectful and beyond rude. There are not enough words to describe how despicable he really is.

[Hippo_Tron]

57. Casey would have a problem if Santorum wasn't batshit insane

Santorum arguably did better in the debate than Casey did, but his positions are so extreme that he continued to make himself look like an ass.

[bluedog]

64. Remember this quote from Santorum..and use it often!

Remember this quote from Santorum..and use it often!

" President . . . is once again releasing American military might on a foreign country with an ill-defined objective and no exit strategy. He has yet to tell the Congress how much this operation will cost. And he has not informed our nation's armed forces about how long they will be away from home. These strikes do not make for a sound foreign policy."
--Sen. Rick Santorum (R-PA)

[AtomicKitten]

66. I thought Casey did great on M-t-P

Santorum parroting the nonsense about WMD should make him ineligible for public office.