Dean is not going to let this be a quick nomination

[killbotfactory]

Good.

This year is very different. The media and the party insiders will attempt to declare Kerry the winner on February 3 after fewer than 10% of the state delegates have been chosen. At that point Kerry himself will probably have claimed fewer than one third of the delegates he needs to win. They would like the campaign to be over before the voters of California, New York, Texas and nearly every other big state have spoken.

....

We believe that when the voters of the post-Wisconsin states—which constitute 75% of the delegates that will be chosen in the states—compare Howard Dean and John Kerry, they will conclude that Dean, not Kerry, has the best chance to beat George Bush, because only Dean offers a clear vision of change and a record of results that contrasts against the rhetoric emanating from Washington. We believe they will increasingly reject the rubber stamp presented to them by the media.

Has such a strategy ever worked before?

No. It's never been tried.

But prior to this year, no candidate had ever raised $46 million dollars, mostly from ordinary Americans giving $100 each. Prior to this year no candidate for President had ever inspired the kind of grass-roots activity that has been this campaign’s hallmark. Prior to this year no candidate for President had so clearly revitalized his party, allowed it to reclaim its voice, and shifted the agenda so clearly to a call for change.

Let the conventional wisdom and the media declare this race over. We’re going to let the people decide.

Roy Neel
Chief Executive Officer
Dean for America

http://blog.deanforamerica.com/archives/003471.html

[patricia92243]

1. I Roy Neal the new guy in place of Joe Trippi

[killbotfactory]

8. Yeah, he's the new guy

And so far, I like what I'm hearing.

[arewethereyet]

20. you liked what Trippi said too

its the candidate that is the problem.

You can't fire the candidate.

[ibegurpard]

27. Trippi said no such thing.

I DARE you to back that up with proof.

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ibegurpard]

30. Oh, okay... I got you now

Have a good one!
:hi:

[arewethereyet]

31. I'm glad thats settled positively

you have a good one yourself.

[BattyDem]

2. Great!

Someone needs to remind the media that there are 50 states in this country and everyone of them should have a fair chance to participate when it comes to picking a candidate! :bounce:

[PVnRT]

3. How dare he not roll over

The nomination belongs to Kerry - doesn't he watch the news?

[joshcryer]

35. I know! It's insane! Kerry is our President!

How dare they! My god! It's appalling what they're doing to our DEMOCRATIC PROCESS!

[jsw_81]

73. Isn't it appalling that the voters are choosing Kerry over Dean?

What an outrage!

[progressivebydesign]

89. Yes. Kerry won two primaries, it's all over..

Move along. Nothing to see here. I'm so grateful that DLC, DNC, and the Media, and some overzealous DUers have given me back hours of my free time that I would have foolishly spent campaigning for Howard Dean. Now, all I have to do is take 10 minutes to vote for Kerry in November. I'm extremely grateful that you've given my life back to me... I won't worry my pretty little head over things like.. caucuses or primaries. I'm all set til November, right? :hi:

[freetempe]

67. Dean didn't get the memo...

that its time to quit on Feb 3., when less than 10% of the delegates have been declared. Gosh darn him for actually taking his case to all the 50 states. I mean, this is a Democracy after all, what is he thinking???


Silly Goose, Dean, didn't you know this was all a set up for our coronated sacrifical lamb, John Kerry???

[ibegurpard]

4. Holy shit!

That's pretty fucking audacious!

[Eloriel]

59. Go read the rest of it on the blog

And if you missed it, read his introductory message from yesterday. I think you'll like the new guy in town.

[girl gone mad]

5. Dean had planned..

all along to have organization in all states. I just re-read an article in the Nation from 3 weeks ago comparing his campaign to Reagan's 1980 campaign (remember Bush beat Reagan in NH and IA).

What happened? Did he get sidetracked from that plan, or is it still in place?

[Eloriel]

60. He has volunteers in all 50 states

All self-organized (altho some states now have paid staff in them). Some are larger than others, some are better organized than others. Georgia's (my state) is, IMO, phenomenal. But we definitely HAVE organizations in all 50 states.

[jsw_81]

74. In '80 Bush won IA, but Reagan recovered to win NH and the nomination

[mlawson]

6. As an Edwards supporter, I hope you are right, killbotfactory.

This is turning into a nightmare (not for the WH!), but for many of us. I predicted this would happen, a year ago, and damned if it ain't.

I have never said one word against Dean; I wish him my best. And Clark as well. I hope this works, but it seems to me that the die is cast. The 'fix' is obviously in...

Sadly, primaries are rarely about which canidate does the best in the general election. This one is *reported* to be, but it isn't.

[slinkerwink]

7. exactly.

[killbotfactory]

9. It's a gamble

But Dean supporters are hardcore and will ride this out as long as Dean says to. If were the last one standing next to Kerry, I hope we are well positioned to get supporters of other candidates to join us.

[mikehiggins]

53. How is it a gamble? You win or you lose but you don't give up.

That's not a gamble, that's a campaign.

Dean and Clark; bad boys to the end.

[Leilani]

28. As a Clark Supporter, I hope you are right, too

I feel like we're being railroaded, with so few people having voted.

I want to hear from the South, & the West, I the Midwest, & the Southwest, & the large states with diverse populations.

And then, if Kerry wins, I'll be happy to support him.

And I wish the media would do their job, but too much to hope for.

[Nederland]

49. This isn't the first time

The same thing happened to Gary Hart in 1984.

Mondale and Hart slogged it out in the primaries all the way to the convention. After all the voting was done, Hart had actually won more delegates than Mondale. However, despite the fact that the day of the convention Hart was polling up 15pts over Reagan and Mondale was polling 5pts under Reagan, Mondale got most of the super-delegates to go his way and ended up with the nomination.

The fix was in then, and it may be in again.

[Joseph Thule]

10. There's no hurt in dragging it out a little. So the RW won't soley attack

Kerry

[Freddie Stubbs]

94. Dragging it out "a little" is fine

But if Dean loses primary after primary he will not be doing his party any favors by slogging on. He needs to start winning some primaries.

[slinkerwink]

11. you can post the full text, killboxfactory

Roy Neel: Where We Go From Here
This campaign has always defied conventional wisdom. Our extraordinary rise last year defied conventional wisdom—so did our fall in Iowa, and so did our comeback in New Hampshire after most pundits predicted Howard Dean was finished.

Conventional wisdom has been consistently wrong about this race.

So when conventional wisdom says a candidate must win somewhere on February 3, or that John Kerry will have wrapped up the nomination after fewer than 10% of the delegates have been chosen, we disagree.

Our goal for the next two and a half weeks is simple—become the last-standing alternative to John Kerry after the Wisconsin primary on February 17.

Why Wisconsin? First, it is a stand-alone primary where we believe we can run very strong. Second, it kicks off a two-week campaign for over 1,100 delegates on March 2, and the shift of the campaign that month to nearly every big state: California, New York, and Ohio on March 2, Texas and Florida on March 9, Illinois on March 16, and Pennsylvania on April 27.

In the meantime, Howard Dean is traveling to many of the February 3 states, sending surrogates—including Al Gore—to most, and conducting radio interviews in all. We believe that one or more of our major opponents will be eliminated that day, and that the others will fall by the wayside as our strength grows in the following days. As a result we have elected to not buy television advertisements in February 3 states, but instead direct our resources toward the February 7 and 8 contests in Michigan, Washington and Maine. We may not win any February 3 state, but even third place finishes will allow us to move forward, continue to amass delegates in Virginia and Tennessee on February 10, and then strongly challenge Kerry in Wisconsin.

Regardless of who takes first place in these states, we think that after Wisconsin we’ll get Kerry in the open field. Remember one crucial thing about the 2004 calendar—in previous years a front-runner or presumptive nominee would typically emerge after most of the states had voted and most of the delegates had been chosen. The final competitor to that candidate, even if he won late states, as many have done, has not been able to win a majority of delegates under any scenario.

This year is very different. The media and the party insiders will attempt to declare Kerry the winner on February 3 after fewer than 10% of the state delegates have been chosen. At that point Kerry himself will probably have claimed fewer than one third of the delegates he needs to win. They would like the campaign to be over before the voters of California, New York, Texas and nearly every other big state have spoken.

Democrats in Florida, who witnessed a perversion of democracy in November 2000, will not have a choice concerning the nominee if the media and the party insiders have their way.

We intend to make this campaign a choice. We alone of the remaining challengers to John Kerry are geared to the long haul—we’ve raised nearly $2 million in the week after Iowa, over $600,000 in the 48 hours since New Hampshire. No candidate—not even Kerry, who mortgaged his house and tapped his personal fortune to funnel $7 million into his campaign —will have sufficient funds to advertise in all, or even most, of the big states that fall on March 2 and beyond. At that point paid advertising becomes much less of a factor.

And we alone of the remaining challengers offer a clear choice to Kerry. Howard Dean is no Johnny Come Lately to the message of change—he has actually delivered change in Vermont. Howard Dean has the courage and conviction to stand up for what’s right, even when it’s not politically popular, as opposed to the cautiousness, compromise and convenience that has characterized John Kerry’s 19 years in the Senate.

We believe that when the voters of the post-Wisconsin states—which constitute 75% of the delegates that will be chosen in the states—compare Howard Dean and John Kerry, they will conclude that Dean, not Kerry, has the best chance to beat George Bush, because only Dean offers a clear vision of change and a record of results that contrasts against the rhetoric emanating from Washington. We believe they will increasingly reject the rubber stamp presented to them by the media.

Has such a strategy ever worked before?

No. It's never been tried.

But prior to this year, no candidate had ever raised $46 million dollars, mostly from ordinary Americans giving $100 each. Prior to this year no candidate for President had ever inspired the kind of grass-roots activity that has been this campaign’s hallmark. Prior to this year no candidate for President had so clearly revitalized his party, allowed it to reclaim its voice, and shifted the agenda so clearly to a call for change.

Let the conventional wisdom and the media declare this race over. We’re going to let the people decide.

Roy Neel
Chief Executive Officer
Dean for America

[sacman]

12. dean

let's face it..dean is dead lets try and work with what we have

[slinkerwink]

13. nope....not gonna work with kerry......he'll be dead soon.

[ibegurpard]

14. 600,000 in the last 48 hours dead, you mean?

Not a bad way to go.

[RetroLounge]

47. Your first impresses me

not...

But this does...

[NewHampster]

15. Dean supporters this is our call to arms

I didn't fight this hard to give up now and obviously Gov. Dean won't either.

Focus on the 7th, Focus on Wisconsin and write anyone you know or get a mailing list from your Dean HQ.

We can and we will win this no matter how many times the Kerry Media tells us it's over.

and Maybe my other dream will come true.

[slinkerwink]

16. I'm going to answer the call to arms in the MA primary

[Anwen]

36. Same here...

I didn't fight this hard to have the media tell us it's over after 2 small states. Dean is a force to be reckoned with!!!!

GO DEAN!!!!!!!!!
:bounce:

[jsw_81]

75. "Dean is a force to be reckoned with"

Didn't you see that new polling data? Dean is fourth in SC, third in MO (thirty points behind Kerry), third in AZ, second in ND etc. Dean is hardly a force at all.

[Anwen]

91. As we all know

polls can change dramatically overnight. You better pray that Kerry doesn't get the bad press treatment that Dean got, and you better hope and pray that people don't realize Kerry is one of the weakest candidates, or you my friend will be singing an entirely different tune.

[mzmolly]

17. Im likin Mr. Neel more and more...

:toast:

Trippi explained today the difference between a campaign financed by the people or one financed by *a wealthy candidate* somehow financing via the people sits better with me than a man buying himself the presidency.

[slinkerwink]

18. same here too---sounds like neel's buckling down for a long, hard fight

[mzmolly]

19. Interesting strategy that's never been tried before *vintage Dean*

:)

[slinkerwink]

21. we've kept bucking conventional wisdom for a long time....

here's to hoping we'll keep on doing it!

[mzmolly]

25. All the way to the White House Slinker!

:toast:

[slinkerwink]

26. cheers!!!

:toast:

[NewHampster]

22. Crack the freekin bat

http://www.deanforamerica.com/contributenow

[THUNDER HANDS]

23. interesting theory

Lets see if it pans out. History would indicate it wouldn't.

[slinkerwink]

24. history would indicate that since clinton didn't win IA and NH

that he wouldn't win the nomination, but hey, history was wrong.

[Blitz]

33. Clinton didn't campaign in Iowa

and he was a Southern governor who did surprising well in NH ... more like Edwards or even Clark than anything else. Dean's campaign can draw no reasonable comparison to Clinton's.

If money were votes, Dean would be way ahead. They're not and he's not. Expect to hear a very telling speech from Dr. Dean on Tuesady night. The writing should be on the wall in neon by then. Frankly, I think that Dean knows it already and is running for a seat at the table at the convention so that he can influence the agenda and perhaps secure a promise of some position in a possible Dem administration. He'll also want to give a major speech like Cuomo did in '88. The nominee will also want that since, unless he loses it again, Dean may be able to fire up the base and deliver some of his supporters without scaring off the rest of America. A good convention speech may set Dean up for '08 if Bush is re-elected. If Dean doesn't finish in the top 2 or 3, he may find himself shut out entirely.

Question: If and when Dean drops out, who, if anybody, do you think he will endorse (if it's not a completely done deal by then)?

[MODemocrat]

85. Dean won't endorse anyone; but would work for the nominee

and do what's right for the Democratic party. Dean's savvy enough to get out, if and when he needs to. He is not dead, and far from it. :)

[Zomby Woof]

55. Clinton was never the frontrunner before the primaries

Clinton came from nowhere. Dean was on top. Momentum has been down for Dean. It only went UP for Clinton.

Nothing is certain, but Dean went from 30 point frontrunner to 13 point underdog. Clinton only went up, up, and up. I doubt if Dean can overcome that kind of deficit after he loses next week.

The comparison between Dean and Clinton is rendered null and void.

[Duder]

98. Wrong...

'Six weeks before the New Hampshire primary, the media annointed Bill Clinton as frontrunner, with cover stories in Time and the New Republic along with stepped-up television coverage. Inside the Beltway, the conventional wisdom saw Clinton as the media's man. The New Republic's Hendrik Hertzberg remarked that Clinton's support among political journalists approached "unprecedented unanimity." In the New York Times, Maureen Dowd described the press corps as "smitten and worshipful."'

[SadEagle]

32. History is no guide there.

Previous campaigns did not have proportional delegate allocation, or internet fundraising (although they also did not have that tight a schedule)

[bearfartinthewoods]

37. internet funding isn't new.......mccain raised half a million in a day

[Eloriel]

61. Uh, totally internet and small contributor fundraising is pretty new

To try to claim that it's old hat -- even tho it HAS been done before (sorta) -- is IMO a little short-sighted.

THE PEOPLE are funding this campaign -- and we've broken all sorts of records doing it. We surpassed Bill Clinton's 1996 3Q fundraising, and then in 4Q we surpassed it again, which is really phenomenal because 4Q is usually considerably LESS than 3Q -- in Clinton's and Gore's case it was 40% less than their 3Q.

[Zomby Woof]

86. and yet

He has yet to win a single caucus or primary.

[PVnRT]

93. So he's 0 for 2?

Well, shit, I guess it's all over then.

[dansolo]

40. History also says that an incumbant president loses seats in Congress

During the midterm election. Funny how the DLC managed to royally screw that little bit of "history".

[Nederland]

54. The Incumbant President did lose seats in 2002

...if you remember that the incumbant President is actually Gore :D

[Duncan Grant]

34. Best thread of the day!

Let's get off the pity pot :hurts: , it ain't over yet. Don't forget to put on your thick skin...it's a mf jungle in here.

Thanks killbotfactory! :yourock:

[ibegurpard]

38. kick

:kick: :party: :D

[Toucano]

39. I like that fighting spirit. n/t

[slinkerwink]

thanks----clark and dean supporters have the best fighting spirit!!!

:hi:

[Hoppin_Mad]

41. 100% Dean ! On to a Brokered Convetion ! -nt-

[Ramsey]

42. Dean rocks!

That's from a rocker!!

Crack the bat!!

https://secure2.convio.net/dfa/site/Donation?ACTION=SHOW_DONATION_OPTIONS&CAMPAIGN_ID=3405

[Skip Intro]

43. YEEAAAHHH!!! (and, can I toot my own horn for a minute?)

This is F***ING EXCELLENT!

And look, please forgive me here for a minute. I'm a very modest guy, but I called this, pretty much, earlier this morning, and took a lot of jabs because of it (or because of the accompanying idea), but look, from earlier today:

---------
Should Dean supporters vote Kerry in Feb?..... ( looking back, a very bad idea)

If Clark and Edwards are blown away by Kerry Tuesday, which is not certain to happen at all, I know, but if it does, that would leave Dean as the only realistic anti-Kerry candidate by March. A thinned field would definitely benefit Dean. If this is the new strategy, its starting to make sense to me.

If it comes down to Kerry v. Dean by Super Tuesday, we'll be looking at Kerry having to get 50% plus of the vote to continue his streak. I don't think he can pull off that kind of support in CA or NY, etc.

Should we Dean supporters in Feb. primary states vote Kerry to try to bring this scenario about? (Or do I need another shot of caffeine this morning?) (the bad idea again)
----------
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=231988&mesg_id=231988
----------
The only reason I bring this up, and I'm not the kinda guy to say "told ya so," is because I got slammed by a lot of posts in that thread. Granted, most of the hits were due to the "vote" idea, but I just feel a little vindication. Please pardon me tooting my own horn, doesn't happen a lot. Do I want a cookie? NO, I WANT A PRESIDENT DEAN!

Dean supporters who may have strayed in the last few days, come on home. This ain't over by a long shot!

GO DEAN!!!!!
YEEEAAAHH!

[David Dunham]

44. Dean needs a win soon or he's done, toasted, etc.

[TheStateChief]

58. "Win or Leave" Is Pure McAuliff...

But Dean better be ready to weather a lot of heat from the party apparatus if he's the only one contesting Kerry...TM wants this thing over with quick and the longer it takes for Kerry to get the nomination the more of a problem it is for the DNC. That's why you hear Carville and Begala and McAulliff talking about the win one or be gone litmus test. As long as more than two candidates stay in the race, however, I don't see anyone getting the necessary delegates before March.

[ibegurpard]

65. Even if Dean goes down in flames

it will be worth it just to send a big fat FU to those arrogant assholes.

[Freddie Stubbs]

90. Would it be worth another four years of Bush?

If this thing drags out to the convention, Bush's chances increase. Kerry and Dean will be throwing every but the kitchen sink at each other rather than at Bush. Meanwhile the Republicans will be attacking Kerry and Dean.

[Eloriel]

62. Let's let the people -- and Dean -- decide when he's done

'Kay?

[Zomby Woof]

87. The people ARE deciding

Come Wednesday morning that decision will be the cold water of reality splashing across Dean's face.

edit: typo

[Renew Deal]

45. No other candidate before ever blew $40 Mil. on 2 primaries.

:shrug:

[Ramsey]

51. Please get your facts straight

Dean has had on the ground in campaigns in over 27 states for over a year.

But call that 2 primaries if it please you.
:eyes:

[Renew Deal]

97. And then he closes shop in 7 primaries in a day.

Yeah, I know. Dean is going to win.

[isbister]

63. It was 35 wasn't it?

and bush spent 31 which is close.

[NoPasaran]

46. History is made by those who try

Let's see if this works! YEEARGH!

[RetroLounge]

48. Roy Neel

I like this guy already!

[mikehiggins]

50. Yes! Make them fight for every vote

After all, it will only make them stronger.

I remember that was the argument for beating up on Dean.

Turnabout is a bitch.

[ibegurpard]

52. Mike

There were some pretty rude Clark supporters there for a while but I remember you making an effort to be civil. Thanks for the encouragement!

:thumbsup:

[mikehiggins]

57. Well, just because

Dean is the Anti-Christ and all you Dean supporters are the spawn of Satan doesn't mean I have to be rude.

Seriously, I'm coming to see this campaign as not being against Kerry but against the media. There are millions of Democratic voters out there and the media has changed from reporting the news to trying to shape the news.

It's as if old man Hearst was fighting the Spanish AMerican War again.

Everytime a vote gets cast for Dean (or for Clark) an angel gets his wings, and a FOX editor gets an ulcer.

What a payoff!

[Duncan Grant]

56. From your lips to God's ears! n/t

[slinkerwink]

66. you've got that right!

[Polemonium]

64. What you mean I might have a voice in this even if my

primary is later. Madness.

[Zomby Woof]

68. I am pretty sure

IT'S THE MEDIA'S FAULT!

[ibegurpard]

70. I hear that complaint a lot from Kucinich supporters

And it's valid, IMHO. Why would you say NOT in this case, particularly when they PUBLICLY ADMITTED to manipulating and promoting "the scream" footage?

[Zomby Woof]

88. Dean himself took responsibility

He didn't blame the media for his poor showing in Iowa and NH. He said he "took a gamble and lost". There is a thread in here about it, and I gave Dean sincere credit for his claim.

The 'scream' tape is a non-issue - it came AFTER he got drubbed in Iowa. The media cannot be retroactively blamed for his Iowa loss.

Bringing up DK is again, off-topic, and disingenuous.

First, I am not "most Kucinich supporters". To say the least.

Second, I don't blame the media for his numbers. The message is out there, and if people choose not to respond to it, it is their loss.

Third, if asked, DK would also take responsibility for his campaign numbers, like Dean did.

I am hoping (vainly perhaps) that Dean's supporters take a cue from their leader, and learn to buck up and accept loss with dignity.
Life is hard.

[Freddie Stubbs]

92. Kucinich has blamed his poor numbers on the media

http://www.kucinich.us/supporter_resources/isuespdfs/TVstudy.pdf

[kurtyboy]

69. I hope so!

The battle-hardening of a long-fought primary campaign will be a blessed quality in the General election, whether Kerry gets the Nom-nod, or Dean, or Edwards, or Clark, or Kucinich, or Lieberman, or Sharpton, it's ALL GOOD.

Bring the fight, we'll only be stronger for it. Bring the passion, our children will love us and revere us. Bring the dedication to our party values, and our nation will thank us with its heart.

Bring it on, for America, a nation that remains the last, best hope for the world.

Thank You Howard Dean, for making this the most important primary in my memory.

Kurt

[jsw_81]

71. Dean is becoming increasingly irrelevant

This thing might be over next week, especially if Kerry can beat Edwards in South Carolina. Dean's "Let's skip ten primaries in a row and then win big in Wisconsin" strategy is a joke.

[joshcryer]

72. Only if you think democracy is a joke.

:)

[jsw_81]

76. No, just the opposite

You see, the voters are selecting Kerry over Dean. Do you have a problem with voters expressing their preference? Apparently, you do.

[joshcryer]

77. Are the voters really selecting Kerry over Dean?

We've only had two primaries. Are you going to call Kerry's win on two states? Wouldn't that be a bit... undemocratic?

[ibegurpard]

78. Answer your own question

There've been two primaries so far. If Dean wants to skip every last primary until mine in Montana, the last one, and he has the funds to do it then that's his prerogative.

edited for spelling

[joshcryer]

79. And that's another thing, he's not 'skipping them.'

He's just foregoing the TV ad thing. Word of mouth, and grassroots campaigning does not equate 'skipping.' There will still be focus, it just won't be as great as the other candidates.

[jsw_81]

81. When a presidential candidate in 2004 doesn't run TV ads in a state...

He's skipping it. Your "grass-roots" stuff is only wishful thinking.

[joshcryer]

83. He actually... uh... traveled... to a few states.

You know, made a physical appearence. You can't call that "skipping them."

[jsw_81]

80. What is a perogative?

[ibegurpard]

82. typo

prerogative:1 a : an exclusive or special right, power, or privilege: as (1) : one belonging to an office or an official body (2) : one belonging to a person, group, or class of individuals (3) : one possessed by a nation as an attribute of sovereignty b : the discretionary power inhering in the British Crown
2 : a distinctive excellence
- pre·rog·a·tived /-tivd/ adjective
http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?va=prerogative

[Feanorcurufinwe]

84. Your comment would be appropriate

if Dean were winning elections and support. But in actual fact, Dean is losing elections and support.

[joshcryer]

101. We'll see after today.

I predict some interesting turn of events.

[Hep]

95. It's a neat strategy, if not only because it plays up to the ignorance

of Dean's opposition.

[Freddie Stubbs]

96. The strategy will only work

if Dean can start winning some primaries. If he doesn't, the media will ignore him and other candidates will surge.

[Ripley]

99. They haven't been ignoring him so far.

And he is such a looooooser already according to so many DUers. You know what I think will be interesting is if Dean ever pulls ahead of Kerry...we'll see if Kerry people think it would be prudent then for him to drop out, since he would be "hurting" Democracy by challenging Dean.

Hah. Fat chance.

[Cuban_Liberal]

100. You do your part, Dr. Dean, and we'll do ours.

I'm doing everything I can to prevent this from being wrapped up quickly. :)