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babsbunny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:44 PM
Original message
How many people are missing in the Gulf
after Hurricane Katrina?
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louis-t Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
1. Bet it's in the thousands.
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Brotherjohn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:57 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. Nope. N.O. isn't built like that. A good number may have been lost in...
... Mississippi that way, though. But I would say maybe dozens, at most. The population's much lower, and by and large, the areas very close to the coast where a body could have washed out to sea were ghost towns before Katrina hit (not that some people didn't stay).

As for New Orleans, the areas along the actual Gulf, where someone might actually have been "washed out", are extremely sparsely populated. And very (and I mean VERY) few people remained in those places. Buras, Venice, etc... I'd be surprised if ANYONE stayed there.

The hardest hit flooding areas (9th Ward, St. Bernard Parish, Lakeview) were in the city. Any bodies there would have remained relatively close to where they perished, and would have been or will be found by locals/relatives if they haven't been found already.

Now, many of the bodies found, and turning up in the near future, may never be identified. And a few may never be accounted for.
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Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:47 PM
Response to Original message
2. It is going to be a VERY high number...
FEMA, La. outsource Katrina body count to firm implicated in body-dumping scandals

Miriam Raftery

The Federal Emergency Management Agency has hired Kenyon International to set up a mobile morgue for handling bodies in Baton Rouge, Louisiana following Hurricane Katrina, RAW STORY has learned.

Kenyon is a subsidiary of Service Corporation International (SCI), a scandal-ridden Texas-based company operated by a friend of the Bush family. Recently, SCI subsidiaries have been implicated in illegally discarding and desecrating corpses.

Louisiana governor Katherine Blanco subsequently inked a contract with the firm after talks between FEMA and the firm broke down. Kenyon's original deal was secured by the Department of Homeland Security.

In other words, FEMA and then Blanco outsourced the body count from Hurricane Katrina -- which many believe the worst natural disaster in U.S. history -- to a firm whose parent company is known for its "experience" at hiding and dumping bodies.

The Menorah Gardens cemetery chain, owned by SCI, desecrated vaults, removed hundreds of bodies from two cemeteries in Florida and dumped the gruesome remains in woods frequented by wild hogs, investigators discovered in 2001. In one case, a backhoe was used to crack open a vault, remove corpses and make room for more dead bodies.

SCI paid $100 million to settle a lawsuit filed by outraged family members of the deceased.

A secretary at the lawfirm that sued SCI over the Florida cemetery scandals gasped when informed that FEMA had outsourced handling of Katrina victims' bodies to an SCI subsidiary.

"Oh, good lord!" she said.


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spinbaby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:51 PM
Response to Original message
3. No one knows
Because they didn't have the foresight to set up one central list for matching the missing to the found.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:57 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Either no foresight, or the powers that be didn't want a solid,
truthful number to remind them of how inept they were.
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Epiphany4z Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:12 PM
Response to Original message
6. Katrina Missing
I found this on another message board about a week ago.

National Center for Missing and Exploited Children - has a downloadable Excel file "Hurricane Katrina/Rita List" (available here) with names & ages of 2,099 kids who are still missing OR who are looking for their parents.

National Center for Missing Adults - has a downloadable file (available here) with names of over 7,400 adults who are still missing.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Thanks, Epiphany4z, I wasn't aware of that site and will
bookmark it. And welcome to DU! :toast:
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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Keep in mind that those aren't "missing"
they are being looked for by someone, and they aren't fully verified. The missing kids list, for instance, includes kids who are living with one parent but being searched for by another relative who has lost track of them during the investigation. The web site says this.

As for the missing adults, again, these are people that someone is trying to find, not necessarily people who are actually missing. Someone may know where they are, just not the person searching for them. And since of the over 1000 bodies they've collected in New Orlean and the over 200 in Mississippi, only a fraction of them have been identified, so these lists, sadly, will include some of those already included in the body count.

Here are two emails I got from an inquiry to this site on 10/12:

As we initially took reports of approximately 11,000 cases, and have had resolve to approximately 4,000 that # would seem reasonable however those #s apply only to Katrina cases also, it is difficult to say if all cases have been reported or how many people have been located without our agency being notified

Wade Smith


At this time the cases reflect the number of reports made but should not be used as a statistic of the number of actual missing persons. The safety of each missing person reported to NCMA must be validated. This is a time consuming effort due to the limited information the reporting party provided, evacuations of those reported missing and reporting parties, minimal records in storm damaged areas, and then repeat evacuations that occurred during Hurricane Rita.

This is the information we have to date on our activity.

Recovered Safe: 4,095
Recovered Deceased: 68
Resolved Other: 1,042 (includes duplicate reports, reports of minors handled by NCMEC, and other)

Total Cases Resolved: 5,205

Total Cases Being Worked: 6,976 (Follow-Up + Ready for Web + Posted to Web + Posted to Web w/o Bio)
Total Case Backlog: 386 (Total Cases - Cases Worked Cases Resolved)

Total Cases at NCMA: 12,567

Our priority is to identify those missing persons who are high risk, meaning those with disabilities and those who remained in areas that were devastated. We are currently facilitating DNA collection with many of the families. Due to the potential that there are numbers of individuals who remain under tons of debris and mud and the number of individuals who still remain missing the actual number of deceased and long term missing may not be known for quite some time.

I hope this helps. Please feel free to email me should you have additional questions.

Kym L. Pasqualini
Chief Executive Officer

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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:40 PM
Response to Original message
8. Do you mean in the Gulf region, or in the Gulf itself?
There's much debate on both.

In the second category, there were officially 101 people listed as still missing two weeks ago in Harrison County, MS. I haven't heard the numbers on the others. Hancock County was hit harder than Harrison, but it doesn't have the same type of beachfront, so probably fewer people could have been carried out to sea. Plus, it's a smaller county. Jackson County, on the other side of Harrison County, probably has very few to none. It does not have a regular beach front, some of the beach is undeveloped land and reserves, and the storm was weaker there than in Harrison or Hancock.

So of the 101 from Harrison, maybe half could have been carried to sea? From Hancock, maybe a similar number. There were about 40 people, IIRC, who were listed as missing after Camille, and that's a good guess as to where many of them wound up.

No one from New Orleans would have been carried to the Gulf. It was a different type of flooding, through broken levees, so there was no backwash when the water left. Maybe a few wound up in Lake Pontchartrain, since the levees broke on canals that led to the Lake. But again, because they were levee breaks, there was no sudden backflow of water into the Lake.

Louisiana has a long coastline, but it's mostly swampy, marshy, illdefined land--fishing camps, harbors, stuff like that--with some small towns, like Grand Isle. Most people evacuated the coastline days before--there were a lot of reports that everyone was out of Grand Isle, and I'm sure that was true for most of that reason. So again, probably not many people could have been washed out from Louisiana's coast, but I haven't seen counts on the missing, so I couldn't say for sure. I'm sure the number, at worst, is in the dozens, not the hundreds.

If you are asking how many are still missing in the Gulf region, there is little accurate information on that. The Harrison Count officials said 101 a couple weeks ago, but I don't know if that number changed. The Civil Defense website last I saw listed over 1000 "missing," but went on to explain that this was just a compilation of the number of reports of people searching for other people from various sources. In other words, if I reported a friend missing, they would include that, without verifying whether anyone else knew where this person was. You even have people posting that are looking for each other.

There are similar lists in New Orleans that have around 7000 adults listed, though I emailed on such site and they claimed the number was closer to 4000, and they were still verifying. Some people on these lists are entries that will say "James. Last name unknown. Race and gender unknown." In other words, they aren't close to verified lists.

There is a list of missing children with around 2000 names. Again, many listings are incomplete. Also, the web site says a lot of these kids aren't missing, that they are, for instance, living with one parent and being sought by the other, or by a grandparent or other relative.

Obviously, New Orleans will be very hard to verify, given the widespread evacuation. I imagine in a few months they'll have a pretty accurate count of missing.

So no one knows, in either case, but that's a rough summary of the kind of numbers involved, to the best of my knowledge, though my research hasn't been thorough on the matter, and I guess all those who post that the government is covering up tens of thousands of deaths could be right. My grandfather believed that man never landed on the moon. He could be right, too. He was from New Orleans.

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