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Debi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:26 PM
Original message
I'm sorry about this...but...help
I just got this email and don't know how to respond.

I know that there have been several threads here the last couple of days, so I'd love a link to help me rebut this stuff...

I'm trying to get all this political stuff straightened out in my head

> so I'll know how to vote come November. Right now, we have one guy
> saying one thing. Then the other guy says something else. Who to
believe.
> Lemme see; have I got this straight?
>
> Clinton awards Halliburton no-bid contract in Yugoslavia - good...
> Bush awards Halliburton no-bid contract in Iraq - bad...
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Shoeempress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:30 PM
Response to Original message
1. How about Bush starts war in order to award Halliburton no bid contract.
Clinton goes to Yugoslavia to stop ethnic cleansing. A bit of a difference
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Iris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:30 PM
Response to Original message
2. Here's a start - Day in the Life of Joe Republican
Edited on Thu Oct-14-04 04:32 PM by Iris
DAY IN THE LIFE OF JOE REPUBLICAN
>
> Joe gets up at 6 a.m. and fills his coffeepot with water to prepare his
> morning coffee. The water is clean because some tree-hugging liberal fought
> for minimum water-quality standards.
>
> With his first swallow of coffee, he takes his daily medication. His
> medications are safe to take because some stupid commie liberal fought to
> insure their safety and that they work as advertised.
>
> All but $10 of his medications are paid for by his employer's medical
> plan because some liberal union workers fought their employers for paid
> medical insurance - now Joe gets it too.
>
> He prepares his morning breakfast, bacon and eggs. Joe's bacon is safe
> to eat because some girly-man liberal fought for laws to regulate the meat
> packing industry.
>
> In the morning shower, Joe reaches for his shampoo. His bottle is
> properly labeled with each ingredient and its amount in the total contents
> because some crybaby liberal fought for his right to know what he was putting
> on his body and how much it contained.
>
> Joe dresses, walks outside and takes a deep breath. The air he breathes
> is moderately clean because some environmentalist wacko liberal fought for
> laws to inhibit industries from polluting our air.
>
> He walks to the subway station for his government-subsidized ride to
> work. It saves him considerable money in parking and transportation fees
> because some fancy-pants liberal fought for affordable public transportation,
> which gives everyone the opportunity to be a contributor.
>
> Joe begins his work day. He has a job with excellent pay, medical
> benefits, retirement, paid holidays and vacation because some lazy liberal
> union members fought and died for these working standards.
>
> Joe's employer pays these standards because Joe's employer doesn't want his
> employees to call the union. If Joe is hurt on the job or becomes unemployed,
> he'll get a worker compensation or unemployment check because some stupid
> liberal didn't think he should lose his home because of his temporary
> misfortune.
>
> Its noontime and Joe needs to make a bank deposit so he can pay some
> bills. Joe's deposit is federally insured by the FDIC because some godless
> liberal wanted to protect Joe's money from unscrupulous bankers who ruined
the
> banking system before the Great Depression.
>
> Joe has to pay his Fannie Mae-underwritten mortgage and his
> below-market federal student loan because some elitist liberal decided that
> Joe and the government would be better off if he was educated and earned more
> money over his lifetime.
>
> Joe is home from work. He plans to visit his father this evening at
> his farm home in the country. He gets in his car for the drive. His car is
> among the safest in the world because some America-hating liberal fought for
> car safety standards.
>
> He arrives at his boyhood home. His was the third generation to live in the
> house financed by Farmers' Home Administration because bankers didn't want
to
> make rural loans. The house didn't have electricity until some big-government
> liberal stuck his nose where it didn't belong and demanded rural
> electrification.
>
> He is happy to see his father, who is now retired. His father lives
> on Social Security and a union pension because some wine-drinking,
> cheese-eating liberal made sure he could take care of himself so Joe wouldn't
> have to.
>
> Joe gets back in his car for the ride home, and turns on a radio talk
> show. The radio host keeps saying that liberals are bad and conservatives
> are good. He doesn't mention that the beloved Republicans have fought against
> every protection and benefit Joe enjoys throughout his day.
>
> Joe agrees: "We don't need those big-government liberals ruining
our
> lives! After all, I'm a self-made man who believes everyone should take care
> of themselves, just like I have. It1s survival of the fittest, and my life
is
> good because I worked and made it that way.2
> -------------------------------------------
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Debi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Thank you
And have already used it! But I need a line-by-line debunk of the above email. I know people were posting about it w/in the last couple of days. I just didn't pay attention. OOPS!
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Iris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. sorry.
I was a little overzealous - I've had this stuff in my inbox for a while and pull it all out when necessary!
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Road Scholar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #9
18. Thanks a bunch. That's a nice piece of lit. I'm sending it to
some special friends who still "just don't get it."
:yourock:
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Iris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
3.  This is probably the best for what you are responding to:
THINGS YOU HAVE TO BELIEVE TO BE A REPUBLICAN TODAY:


Saddam was a good guy when Reagan armed him, a bad guy when Bush's daddy
made war on him, a good guy when Cheney did business with him and a bad
guy when Bush needed a "we can't find Bin Laden" diversion.

Trade with Cuba is wrong because the country is communist, but trade
with China and Vietnam is vital to a spirit of international harmony.

A woman can't be trusted with decisions about her own body, but
multi-national corporations can make decisions affecting all mankind
without regulation.

Jesus loves you, and shares your hatred of homosexuals and Hillary
Clinton.

The best way to improve military morale is to praise the troops in
speeches while slashing veterans' benefits and combat pay.

If condoms are kept out of schools, adolescents won't have sex.

Providing health care to all Iraqis is soun d policy. Providing health
care to all Americans is socialism.

HMOs and insurance companies have the best interests of the public at
heart.

Global warming and tobacco's link to cancer are junk science, but
creationism should be taught in schools.

A president lying about an extramarital affair is an impeachable offense.
A president lying to enlist support for a war in which thousands die is
solid defense policy.

Government should limit itself to the powers named in the Constitution,
which include banning gay marriages and censoring the Internet.

The public has a right to know about Hillary's cattle trades, but George
Bush's cocaine conviction is none of our business.

Being a drug addict is a moral failing and a crime, unless you're a
conservative radio host. Then it's an illness, and you need our prayers
for your recovery.

You support states' rights, which means Attorney General John Ashcroft
can tell states what local voter initiatives they have the right to
adopt.

What Bill Clinton did in the 1960s is of vital national interest, but
what Bush did in the '80s is irrelevant.

If you don't send it to at least 10 other people, we're likely to be
stuck with Bush for four more years.


FRIENDS DON'T LET FRIENDS VOTE REPUBLICAN
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Debi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. GREAT!!
I just sent it on!! Thanks :loveya:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Iris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:32 PM
Response to Original message
4. And I'm just sending this one
because someone sent me an email that I deleted and a guy on her list sent this back to everyone she had sent the original email to:



One sunny day in 2004, an old man approached the White House from
across Pennsylvania Avenue, where he'd been sitting on a park bench.
He spoke to the Marine standing guard and said, "I would like to go
in and meet with President Bush." The Marine replied, "Sir, Mr. Bush
doesn't meet with the public. The free speech zone is 1/2 mile away
from his public appearances." (cit 1) The old man said, "Okay,"
and
walked away. The following day, the same man approached the White
House and said to the same Marine, "I would like to go in and meet
with President Bush." The Marine again told the man, "Sir, as I said
yesterday, Mr. Bush doesn't meet with the general public. In fact he
has restricted even the release of previous President's papers to the
public." (cit 2) The man thanked him and again walked away. The third
day, the same man approached the White House and spoke to the very same
Marine, saying "I would like to go in and meet with President Bush."
The Marine, understandably agitated at this point, "Sir, this is the
third day in a row you have been here asking to speak to Mr. Bush.
I've already told you that he does not meet with the public. (cit 3)
Don't you understand?" The old man answered, "Oh, I understand, but
he has run up a $1.7 Trillion Dollar deficit in 4 years. I wanted to
ask him how Compassionate or how Conservative it was to mortgage my
grandchildren's futures. (cit 4) I wanted to know why he is touting
his Medicare reform when the Social Security Administration says that
Medicare will be bankrupt in 2019 and that Social Security itself will
be bankrupt in 2042 unless we have 15% higher payroll taxes or a 13%
reduction in benefits *immediately*. (cit 5) I want to know how he
can justify a tax cut that disproportionately goes to millionaires
while interest on the debt consumes 12% of every tax dollar and will
go to 30% by 2009. (cit 6)" The Marine snapped to attention,
and shot him.

1) http://www.townhall.com/columnists/johnleo/jl20030505.shtml
2) http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A20731-2001Oct31
3) http://bellaciao.org/en/article.php3?id_article=3572
Bush in debate #1 in response to the "miscalculation" about Iraq:
"It's a -- and it's hard work. I understand how hard it is. I get the
casualty reports every day. I see on the TV screens how hard it is."
4) http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2002059496_deficit11.html
5) http://www.ssa.gov/OACT/TRSUM/trsummary.html
6) http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/fy2005/pdf/hist.pdf (see page 130)

PS: VOTE KERRY - WE CAN'T AFFORD 4 MORE YEARS OF BUSH SPENDING
PPS: DON'T COUNT ON SOCIAL SECURITY -- IT WON'T BE THERE!
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FredScuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:33 PM
Response to Original message
6. "Clinton is running this year?"
n/t
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Iris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Good one! n/t
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Debi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. Thanks for the chuckle!!
n/t
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Fridays Child Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
12. From another board, see if it helps...
http://www.prochoicetalk.com/message-board-forum/post-31890.html&highlight=

1. Clinton awards Halliburton no-bid contract in Yugoslavia - good...
...because they were already there, having won a bid on a LOGCAP contract in 1992 and started work in the Balkans and his temporary contract award just allowed them to finish what they had started.

2. Bush awards Halliburton no-bid contract in Iraq - bad...
...because of the impropriety of awarding a lucrative contract under conditions in which a clear conflict of interest could be said to exist, and then lying about the VP's role in the decision in an effort to distance the administration from the charge.

3. Clinton spends 77 billion on war in Serbia - good...
...for a total cost of roughly $90 billion, 79 day air war, minimal loss of American life, ending a decade of ethnic cleansing in a multi-lateral effort of NATO.

4. Bush spends 87 billion in Iraq - bad...
...because close to $125 billion has already been approved, with $25 billion more being submitted to Congress, coupled with a long-term occupation that could reach as high as $1.5 trillion over the next 5 years. This doesn't take into account the severe depletion of military equipment and manpower and the costs that will be necessary to re-supply both nor the impact on overall American security abroad and readiness to deploy.

5. Clinton imposes regime change in Serbia - good...
...because actually NATO imposed it.

6. Bush imposes regime change in Iraq - bad...
...because it came at a time when America should have stayed focused on its already-begun war in Afghanistan and the efforts to eliminate al-Qaeda in that region. Our lack of attention has allowed the network to rebuild to unprecedented levels, resulting in a steep increase in worldwide terrorist attacks.

7. Clinton bombs Christian Serbs on behalf of Muslim Albanian terrorists- good...
...because one's religion still doesn't give one the right to commit genocide.

8. Bush liberates 25 million from a genocidal dictator - bad...
...because we were still involved in a war in Afghanistan which we had not finished, not to mention ignoring the worst humanitarian crisis in the world happening in Sudan.

9. Clinton bombs Chinese embassy - good....
...because NATO discovered it was being used to help Milosevic's forces with communications.

10. Bush bombs terrorist camps - bad....
...because it has only been a half-hearted effort and not at all effective in stopping terrorists.

11. Clinton commits felonies while in office - good...
...because the "felony" in question was lying about something which was no one's business in the first place.

12. Bush lands on aircraft carrier in jumpsuit - bad...
...because he used American forces as stage-props for a political photo opportunity and declared an end to combat operations even as American deaths continued to mount.

13.Clinton says mass graves in Serbia - good...
...because he was right and new mass graves are being discovered almost daily near Belgrade and Petrovo Selo.

14. Entire world says WMD in Iraq - bad...
...because weapons inspectors weren't allowed to complete inspections nor given cooperation by America with whatever alleged intelligence was to be had.

15. Stock market cras hes in 2000 under Clinton - good...
...because it ended an artificial inflation based on tech promises that were too speculative. Thankfully, the overall growth of the Clinton economy saved us from Depression.

16. Recession under Bush - bad...
...because his only solution has been voodoo economics, a tried and failed approach.

17. Clinton refuses to take custody of Bin Laden - good...
...because the US doesn't enter negotiations with self-appointed third parties who are only looking to profit, such as what happened between the US and Sudan, not to mention the fact that Sudan couldn't have delivered anyway.

18. World Trade Center falls under Bush - Bad...
...because he spent the year preceding the attack ignoring distinct warning signs such as intelligence that bin Laden was contemplating using aircraft as weapons, not to mention a total lack of interest in counter-terrorism in not meeting with his own counter-terrorism official.

19. Clinton calls for regime change in Iraq - good...
...because it was a call for the Iraqi people to take responsibility for their country and for the international community to lend a hand in whatever way they could.

20. Bush imposes regime change in Iraq - bad...
...because it was the wrong time and method for doing so. America was still involved in Afghanistan and the focus should have been on the terrorist threat, which even the Bush administration said Iraq didn't pose...before 9/11.

21. Terrorist training in Afghanistan under Clinton - good...
...because Clinton worked through diplomacy and calls for international pressure on Afghanistan's Taliban.

22. Bush destroys training camps in Afghanistan - bad...
...because it's the same as the reason above. He didn't do it enough or properly.

23. No mass graves found in Serbia - good...
...because there have been mass graves found in Serbia. See above.

24. No WMD found Iraq - bad...
...because that was the entire premise for going to war in the first place and now that it is blown, the administration is backpeddaling and pushing the humanitarian angle.

25. Milosevic not yet convicted - good...
...because his case is still working through a legitimate legal system.

26. Saddam in custody - bad...
...because there is little chance he will stand a fair trial according to our own touted legal standards.

27. Ah, it's so confusing!

Made even moreso by the disingenuous usage of good and bad when describing these events.

http://www.brianragle.us
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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Your point 1.
Edited on Thu Oct-14-04 04:44 PM by KCabotDullesMarxIII
nails the Halliburton slur against Clinton very persuasively.
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Debi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. YEA!!!
That's what I needed!
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
14. Cheney wasn't VP
With his retirement dependent on Halliburton.

Clinton had executive orders in place to suspend contracts when corporations violated the law. Bush suspended those executive orders.

Corporate control was a growing problem under Clinton that we have to deal with soon, no matter who the President is.
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wadestock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
16. The solution is simple....have them watch THE CHOICE TONITE!!!!!
In my opinion ....actually more factual, more persuasive...more compelling...and more pointing to Kerry as the only way to solve the situation we're facing today.

PBS Frontline....8PM Thurs....at least 2 more showings...then available on line next week.
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RevolutionStartsNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
17. Good God. They just repeat the same talking points.
I got a variation of this email (the Clinton bombs Serbia part) from a neighbor I was debating with. Can't they think for themselves? This is so much nonsense.

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nostalgicaboutmyfutr Donating Member (991 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-14-04 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
19. Any more of these "forwarded emails"???
they are always interesting....and find their way into my outbox...
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