Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login

Who Killed John O'Neill part II

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » September 11 Donate to DU
DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 01:22 AM
Original message
Who Killed John O'Neill part II
Edited on Sat Jul-01-06 01:39 AM by DrDebug
Continued from:

Who Killed John O'Neill

Who needs a plane?
An Updated MIHOP

Who did 9/11? A question we all want to know answers to.
Meet the CIA of the 21st century. Privatized, independent and hidden from view.
  • AIG as Money Laundering Inc.
  • Marsh Crisis Consultancy as Terrorism Inc with Osama bin Laden played by Paul Bremer
  • Kroll as the privatized CIA Inc.
  • al-Cokeda as the Drug dealers in the Flight school who are later called terrorists in the OCT

  • Learn how they all work together.
  • Learn how they make fortunes on 9/11 with insider trading.
  • Learn how sophisticated psyops ops and black ops is.

  • Learn what the government and the OTCers don't want you to know

Video + previous discussion: (it is better if you watch the video first)


The video
Ty Rauber made it and it has one actor playing all the parts -a conspiracy theorist, a paranoid "they're after us" type, an OCTer, a philospher and they are all discussing 911-it's kind of like this forum. He ties Kroll, CIA, AIG together, speculated that Kroll is a sort of privatized CIA, running on drug money but able to do what the CIA can't because they aren't allowed. Some of this relates to the Hopsicker story.

Why are these Kroll types anti terrorism experts; where do they get the information? Then they show how people move between these corporations and CIA . Doesn't spend a lot of time on the hows and why's of the actual day, more about drugs insurance companies/ CIA and the piece de resistance -what Al Qaeda really is and what Mohammed Atta's function was, his opinion will make a lot of sense as to Atta's behavior.

This is all for the same video , I gave different links in case some didn't work:

    Movie Downloads:


    Iran-Contra II

    How the 9/11 flight schools were being used for narcotics trafficing to finance black operations like 9/11 which was covered up by labeling the drug dealers, terrorists. The drug import just continued after 9/11 as if nothing happened and were involved in the biggest cocaine shipment ever...

    Mohammed Atta's girlfriend

    Learn about drug planes being used also for illegal CIA rendition, the (hidden) owner of the flight school committing insider trading on 9/11, scams with non-existing companies which miraculously produce DC-9s, and much more...

    In dedication of the top anti-terrorism expert of the Federal Bureau of Investigation, John O'Neill



  • American International Group = Maurice "Hank" Greenberg
  • Marsh & McLennan = Jeffrey Greenberg
  • Ace = Evan Greenberg (not featured in the story thus far)
  • Bear Stearns = Alan Greenberg
  • Kroll always had AIG as shareholder and is currently part of Marsh.

    Possible teams for 9/11:

    October 11, 2001 Marsh established specialized terrorism team called Marsh Crisis Consultancy
    The following teams were added to it: Control Risks Group, a British ex-SAS team and Versar homeland defense team. The same group could have known each other from 9/11

    Kroll has military team in their company and merged with Armor Holdings on August 23rd thus adding Defence Systems Limited, another Private Military Corporation, to their operations, an ex-KGB team called Alpha Firm was earlier acquired by Defence Systems Limited.

    That makes at least four teams which could have been used on 9/11.
    Additional teams from the military could have been used as well.

    They had the means to do this.
  • Marsh had full control on WTC1 where they occupied all floors.
  • Marsh had the top floor of the WTC2 "impact" and could have worked their way down, however the main occupant was Fuji bank with whom AIG did a lot of work and also featured in Iran-Contra.
  • WTC7 contained a CIA office and Kroll and AIG are very closely related to the CIA and it is very likely that Kroll is the privatized version of the CIA
  • The Pentagon was of course under their own control.

    They had the opportunity to do this.

  • AIG/Kroll/Marsh are closely connected to the Bush administration, to Henry Kissinger.
  • AIG/Kroll/Marsh are also closely related to the Intelligence Community.
  • AIG/Kroll/Marsh capitalized on 9/11 and it was good for their business.
  • AIG was laundering drug money for al-Cokeda.
  • AIG was involved in the oil and gas line to Afghanistan
  • There is reason to believe that the Taliban either cut back on the drug trade or that they went into business for themselves. Either way the flow of heroin from Afghanistan was drastically limited.
  • Greenberg and Khasshogi had a business relation and benefited for the narcotics from Afghanistan and had interest in the oil and gas line as well
  • The Greenberg family and the Bush family are partners in fraud.

    They had motive to do this.

    There are main objectives to 9/11 and additional subgoals persuded that day. The main objectives are:
    1. Enabling the war in Afghanistan
    2. Bush administration gets an enormous popularity gain
    3. Enabling Homeland security
    4. Oil and drugs in Afghanistan
    5. Massive insurance fraud
    6. The missing trillions of the Pentagon
    7. Added later: War in Iraq (not part of the original plan. See below )

    Sub goals:
    1. Making Silverstream software owned by Marsh the standard risk software by inviting all experts over the whole world to Windows of the World and eliminating competitors.
    2. Cantor/eSpeed was the #1 company in electronic bond-trading and suddenly Kyoto Mo takes over.
    3. Some of the companies who survived were in some sort of problems which gets solved.
    4. Massive destruction of evidence in the Enron scandal, the price inflation fraud for Silverstream, the WorldCom scandal many other scandals.

    9/11 and Iran-Contra
    There are many similarities between 9/11 and Iran-Contra. One could even say that the same blue print was used and the terror event added as a quick justification of their goals

    Objectives of Iran-Contra:
    1. October Surprise: President Ronald Reagan and Vice President George H.W. Bush
    2. Guerrilla warfare in Central and South America
    3. A war between Iraq and Iran

    Objectives of 9/11:
    1. Madame Butterfly and vote spoilage: President George W. Bush and Vice President Richard Cheney
    2. A war with Afghanistan
    3. Guerrilla warfare in Venezuela and Lebanon?

    Bonuses (W. tries to double H.W.)
    4. A war with Iraq
    Not in the original plan, however on September 12, 2001, George W. Bush told Richard A. Clarke: "Go back over everything, everything. See if Saddam did this. See if he's linked in any way"
    This is the probably reason why Germany, France and Canada bailed out, because they had given approval for Afghanistan and at least Germany played a part in the Venice scheme.

    5. If you can rig one election, might as well take the next one also.
    6. Iran? (option or coming soon...)

    Why the Pentagon had to be included as well

    By Minstrel Boy

    They say I shot a man named Gray and took his wife to Italy.
    She inherited a million bucks and when she died it came to me.
    I can't help it if I'm lucky. - Bob Dylan

    (...) At least among those with a mind for such things, it's fairly well- remembered that on September 10, 2001, Donald Rumsfeld made the shocking announcement that the Pentagon "couldn't track" $2.3 trillion of its transactions. "Iroquois" observes, "What's interesting to me is that he made his press release on a Monday. In DC, I always see bad news given on a Friday, usually late in the afternoon on Friday. The exception, of course, would be when someone happens to know that there is a far bigger story coming out."

    And we know that Flight 77, allegedly piloted by an incompetent, made an aerobatic, spiralling descent over Washington, effecting a 270-degree turn to strike the Pentagon from a western approach at ground level. The side struck was the only one with an exterior wall hardened against attack, and was relatively empty while renovation continued. (...)

    WTC building insurance and ownership
    What were the 3 companies who insured the WTC?

    AIG, Marsh and ACE. All run by Greenbergs at the time.

    They then sold stakes of the original contract to their competition, a process called reinsuring. Once the towers came down, the reinsurers got caught holding the bag.

    Who mortgaged the WTC? The Blackstone Group, headed by Peter J. Peterson, current head of the CFR. The Blackstone Group bought into Kroll in 1993 at the same time as AIG took majority control. Henry Kissenger sits on the board of the Blackstone Group.

    On July 24, 2001, 6 weeks prior to 9/11 Silverstein took control of the lease of the WTC following the Port Authority decision on April 26. Silverstein owned all the buildings. Later he wanted to collect twice on $3.6 billion of policies because it were two seperate events. Only ACE, XL Reach - strategic partners of AIG and currently owned by AIG - included a WilProp in their clauses, so Silverstein "only" got $5 billion.

    Larry Silverstein

    Larry "Pull It" Silverstein

    "I remember getting a call from the, er, fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were gonna be able to contain the fire, and I said, 'We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it.' And they made that decision to pull and we watched the building collapse."

    - World Trade Center lease holder, Larry Silverstein, commenting on the collapse of Building 7 in the PBS documentary "America Rebuilds" that aired in September of 2002.

    Or watch a video clip of them here:

  • Victims and Survivors
    There are some strange victims and survivors in WTC. It makes sense that the lower floors survived, but the top floors have some anomalies as well.

  • Alliance Consulting Group (unknown yet)
  • AON Corporation (risk management)
  • Cantor Fitzgerald Securities + eSpeed (risk competitor)
  • CARR Futures (risk management)
  • Euro Brokers (risk competitor. the four survivors even got the advice not to go down)
  • Hotel and Restaurant Employees International (union)
  • Keefe, Bruyette and Woods, Inc. (unknown)
  • Sandler O'Neill and Partners (investor in eSpeed)
  • Windows on the World (Risk meeting and only a restaurant)

  • American Bureau of Shipping (destruction of evidence. Little affair with Spanish government)
  • Banco LatinoAmericano de Exportaciones Sud America (unknown)
  • Bank of America (inside trading)
  • Deutsche Bank (inside trading)
  • Dun & Bradstreet (their buddy in risk)
  • Fireman's Fund Insurance Company (used to be owned by Myron Du Bain, owner of Huffman Aviation)
  • Fuji Bank (doesn't make sense, since they were right on the impact area)
  • Kyoto Mo (competitor of Cantor Fitzgerald)
  • Lehman Brothers (inside trading)
  • Morgan Stanley (inside trading)
  • Port Authority of New York and New Jersey (84/3000, however 37 were cops so that leaves 47 including the executive director Neil D. Levin)
  • Raytheon Company (only lost four on the "planes")
  • Seabury and Smith (part of Marsh)
  • ZimAmerican Israeli Shipping Company (decided to move out one week earlier)

    Pre-9/11 inside traders
  • American Airlines (involved in the planes)
  • American Express Corp
  • American International Group (involved in Kroll/Marsh/CIA)
  • AMR Corporation
  • Axa SA (owner American Airlines. #2 global insurer)
  • Bank of America Corp (in WTC1)
  • Bank of New York Corp
  • Bank One Corp
  • Bear Stearns (Alan Greenberg was former CEO. Always tied up with the Bush family)
  • Boeing (involved in the planes)
  • Cigna Group
  • the Citigroup Inc. (did major scam in Brazil with Kroll)
  • CNA Financial
  • Carnival Corp
  • Chubb Group
  • Continental Airlines
  • Dean Witter & Co.
  • Deutsche Bank (CIA's favorite bank, since DB bought Alex Brown. Their building got partially destroyed as well. Biggest inside trader of them all)
  • General Motors
  • Genesis Intermedia (Adnan Khashoggi owner Huffman Aviation)
  • John Hancock Financial Services
  • Hercules Inc
  • L-3 Communications Holdings, Inc.
  • Lehman Brothers Holdings, Inc. (In WTC1 and WTC3. Links up with Blackstone group)
  • Lockheed Martin Corp.
  • Lone Star Technologies
  • LTV Corporation
  • Marsh & McLennan Cos. Inc. (In WTC1 as well as WTC2. Prime suspect in Who Killed John O'Neill.)
  • Martin Progressive
  • MetLife
  • Morgan Stanley (In WTC2)
  • Northwest Airlines
  • Progressive Corp.
  • Raytheon (In WTC2. Everybody in the building survived despite being above impact)
  • Royal Caribbean Cruises, Ltd.
  • Royal & Sun Alliance
  • Southwest Airlines
  • United Airlines (In the planes)
  • US Airways
  • Vornado Reality Trust
  • W.R. Grace
  • XL Capital Ltd. (Part of AIG.)

    Index of previous discussions
    Kroll (privatized CIA)

    Marsh (scene of the crime)

    Marsh Crisis Consultancy (terror group lead by Paul Bremer)

    Paul Bremer (Links to Marsh, Bush administration and Henry Kissinger. Spider in the web)

    AIG (Mother of all fraud)

    Risk management (How to become market leader by eliminating competition)
  • Silverstream Fraud Class Action June 20, 2001

    Greenberg cartel (A family that preys together, stays together)

    Al-Cokeda (Drugs for black ops)

    Venice (The new Mena)

    Mohammed Atta (Terrorist or drug dealer?)

    Willy Hilliard (CIA and drugs?)

    Adnan Khashoggi (Oliver North II)

    John O'Neill (We don't want an investigation into 9/11)

    Inside traders (How to make a profit by killing 3,000 people)

    Reinsurance/ownership of the World Trade Center:
  • Blackstone Group (Let the competitor of AIG pay for the damage)
  • Silverstein / Port Authority (Make billions by blowing up WTC)
  • Chubb / Allianz / AXA / Swiss Re (AIG's competition)
  • Ace / XL (owned by AIG) + WilProp (It's almost like they knew in advance)

  • Sibel Edmonds (Overheard Turkish intelligence talking about 9/11)

  • Richard Grove (Silverstream)

  • Indira Sangh (Windows on the World meeting)

    Other subjects (A-Z)
  • 2 tons of coke in Paris (al-Cokeda as well?)

  • 5.5 tons of coke in Mexico (Something's rotten in the town of Venice)

  • Afghanistan

  • Airlines (cartel / inside traitors)

  • American Bureau of Shipping (destruction of evidence)

  • Armor Holding (Two more teams for 9/11)

  • Alpha Firm (KGB enemies? Hell no, their former top team can joined us)

  • Anthrax (Add some bio terrorism as well)

  • AON Corporation (Risk management victim)

  • James R. Bath (Bush's former buddy. Strange that the name of his company was similar)

  • BEA Systems (Risk management victim)

  • Bush family (Partners of Greenberg family)

  • Buttonwood, the company that didn't exist
  • Cantor/eSpeed (Competition elimination during 9/11)

  • CARR Futures (Risk management victim)

  • CIA privatization (Independent, lawless, unrestricted. And they didn't even tell us)

  • CIA rendition (How to use drug planes for other illegal things as well)

  • Controlled Demolition (How come there were two companies at the scene who also specialize in controlled demolition)

  • Convar (How to buy a company to stop investigation into inside trading)

  • Defence Systems Limited (The UK top team was there as well)

  • Deutsche Bank (They may sound German, but they are very buddy buddy with the CIA)

  • Dow Jones & Company (Didn't miss a beat. Were they prepared?)

  • Doubles (How many Atta's were there?)

  • Enron (Destruction of evidence. Involvement of AIG)

  • Euro Brokers (Risk management victim)

  • Fireman's Fund (Another CIA front?)

  • Louis Freeh (We don't want a FBI director who wants to investigate)

  • Global Crossing (Destruction of evidence)

  • Guatanamo Bay (Heroin dealers and terrorist flight school owners are allowed to fly to Guatanamo Bay)

  • Insurance cartel (Oil cartel, airline cartel and insurance cartel?)

  • Iran-Contra (Almost the same script)

  • JFK (A history of treason)

  • JM/WAVE (The old terror team and what the effects were on South Florida)

  • Jerome Hauer (The man who appointed John O'Neill)

  • Thomas Pickard (The temporary director when everything was being planned)

  • Martin Progressive (A happy survivor)

  • Mena (The predecessor of Venice)

  • No planers (Optional. Are planes really necessary?)

  • Robert Mueller (He did a marvellous job covering up Panama and BCCI. Let him to 9/11 as well)

  • OKC (Another terror event which doesn't make sense)

  • Operation 40 (The first team of the shadow government and all the presidents it spawned)

  • Operation Northwoods (Similar to 9/11. Even though it was decades earlier)

  • Passenger lists (What happened to human greed?)

  • Pentagon (The other building with a mystery plane)

  • Promis (Are Saddam and Osama enemies?)

  • Rayed Mohammed Abdullah Ali (New Zealand deports a spy)

  • Sander O'Neill (Risk management victim)

  • Skyways (9/11 didn't change anything. Lots of drug dealing in Venice)

  • Standard Charter Bank (Terrorists and WTC7)

  • Stewart Airport (The weird detour of the planes)
  • Trilateral Investment (George W. Bush and AIG. Partners in fraud)

  • UAE Port deal (Port deal related to drug dealing)

  • Victims and Survivors (The winners and the losers of 9/11)

  • WTC 1993 (Prior history)

  • WTC Security (Let's put a Bush in charge of security and see what happens)

    Thanks to:
    Ty Rauber, Richard Grove, Sibel Edmonds, Daniel Hopsicker, Wayne Madsen, Michael Ruppert, Al Martin and many more...

    Disclaimer / Copyright
    Applies to all my posts in this thread:
    All text taken from wikipedia is available under the terms of the GNU Free Documentation License ( ). This post contains copyrighted material in accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107 ( )

    You are free to copy this post within 'fair use', if you wish to use the copyrighted material from this post for purposes of your own that go beyond 'fair use', you must obtain permission from the copyright owners (see links). Full permission for whatever purpose is granted for these compilations.

    None of the contributors or anyone else in any way whatsoever can be held responsible for the appearance of any inaccurate or libelous information or for your use of the information contained in or linked from these web pages. No guarantees are made, in any way whatsoever, about the validity of the information found here. Any information found on this page can be incomplete, outdated, incorrect and it is upto the user to check the validity of any information found here.

    No consequential damages can be sought for this post, as it is a voluntary developed freely to create various online educational, cultural and informational resources. This information is being given to you gratuitously and there is no agreement or understanding between you and the author.
  • Refresh | 0 Recommendations Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 01:50 AM
    Response to Original message
    1. Bank of America
    Bank of America based in Charlotte, North Carolina, is the second largest commercial bank in the United States, measured in assets, and the third-largest company in the world by the 2006 Forbes Global 2000. The Bank traces its roots back to the Bank of Massachusetts, founded in 1784, making it the second-oldest bank in the United States. (1)

    Bank of America (which had been the third biggest banking corporation behind Citicorp Inc.) said Monday that its acquisition of Fleet will give it about 33 million customers and 2.5 million business clients in the United States and 34 countries." The acquisition will move Bank of America to second place in terms of assets behind Citigroup ....and ahead of "J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. with more than $740 billion in assets, according to a ranking published earlier this year by the trade publication American Banker. (2)

    Bank of America had offices in WTC1 on 9/11 and had 2 casualties out of 400 employees which is not much considering that they had offices as high up as the 80th floor. Bank of America was also one of the inside traders on 9/11. (6)

    BCCI's founder, Agha Hasan Abedi, started the bank in Pakistan in 1972. Abedi had previously set up the United Bank of Pakistan in 1959. Following the nationalization of United Bank in 1971 he sought to create a new supranational banking entity. BCCI was created with capital from Sheikh Zayed bin Sultan Al Nahayan, emir of Abu Dhabi in the United Arab Emirates, the Bank of America (25%) and, allegedly, the CIA. It is claimed that the CIA were seeking a funding route for the Afghan Mujahideen, similar to the Investors Overseas Service and the Nugan Hand Bank in the 1970s. However, the vast majority of BCCI's assets were initially from Abu Dhabi. (3)

    The Bank of America became a shareholder alongside Sheikh Zayed bin Sultan al-Nahayan; Kamal Adham, Saudi Arabia's former head of intelligence; and Faisal Al-Fulaij, president of Kuwait Airways; as well as rulers from the different emirates that make up the United Arab Emirates. (4)

    From the Forbidden Truth
    U.S. Taliban Secret Oil Diplomacy and the Failed Hunt for Bin Laden

    By Jean-Charles Brisard & Guillaume Dasqaui

    Investcorp Investment Holdings Corp., is registered in the Cayman Islands, and its main subsidiary overseeing international activities, Investcorp SA, is registered in Luxembourg. (5)

    Inspired by the movement toward autonomy and the financial emancipation of the Persian Gulf after the first oil crisis - especially in view of large Western financial institutions - Investcorp was established on similar principles to those that led to the creation of the BCCI in 1972. Though the two entities are not in the same industries - the BCCI is a banking institution, while Investcorp is meant to be an investment company - they were both created with the joint support of the Emirate authorities, Saudi investors, and Western banks (Bank of America in the case of the BCCI, and Chase Manhattan in the case of Investcorp) (5)

    (...) Five of Bank of America's senior officers were either on BCCI's board of directors or helped to manage Abedi's bank. For the nest decade the two banks would move billions of dollars a week through each other's international offices, and the Bank of America would be an invaluable, if hidden, ally, since it would continue to accept BCCI's letter-of-credit business after virtually no other Western bank would touch it. Indeed, it could be argued that Bank of America became the single most important financial institution helping BCCI stay afloat.

    In the United States alone, Bank of America transferred more than $1 billion a day for BCCI until the moment of BCCI's global seizure in July 1991.

    (...) Thus Bank of America acted as a sort of global vacuum cleaner, sucking up many BCCI branch deposits and thereby providing the fuel Abedi needed to keep his Ponzi scheme alive.


    Bank of America was one of several banks linked to the fraudulent activities committed by Enron. In 2004, they settled a class action lawsuit brought on by Enron investors, for $69m. The suit specifically claimed that Bank of America had "actively engaged and participated in the fraudulent scheme" and "furthered Enron's fraudulent course of conduct and business in several ways".

    Under the settlement, the bank denies that it violated any law and explains that it settled the matter solely to eliminate the uncertainties, expense and distraction of further protracted litigation. (5)

    See also:
  • Where would Jesus bank?

  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 02:26 AM
    Response to Reply #1
    4. So the World Trade Center
    was like a big organized crime hub.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 02:38 AM
    Response to Reply #4
    6. Sibel Edmonds said the same thing
    Edited on Sat Jul-01-06 02:39 AM by DrDebug
    Is it not the corporations as a whole, but a lot CEOs must have known about 9/11 and used it to their advantage.

    Intelligence is also gathered by certain semi-legitimate organizations - to be used for their activities. It really does not boil down to countries anymore.... When you have activities involving a lot of money, you have people from different nations involved.... It can be categorized under organized crime, but in a very large scale....

    There are certain points..., where you have your drug related activities combined with money laundering and information laundering, converging with your terrorist activities

    The amount of people who knew that 9/11 was going to happen is probably extensive and one of the greatest mysteries.

    There was a lots of talk that a lot of companies moved into the WTC at the last moment. If somebody has a list of which companies, it'll be a great help. In the meantime, I'll just continue putting up the list of those who knew and what their relation was.

    Remember that Enron was the main topic of discussion prior to 9/11 and we were starting to get a sense of the extend of white collar crime and after 9/11 it was all forgotten above. Notice that for Enron, WorldCom, Global Crossing and American Bureau of Shipping there was massive destruction of evidence during 9/11 as well. That couldn't have been a coincidence.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    sabbat hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 08:52 AM
    Response to Reply #6
    64. if so many people were involved
    how come the truth hasnt come out. the bigger the conspiracy, the more likely someone is to talk about it, either bragging or a confession.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 09:56 AM
    Response to Reply #64
    66. Many organizations involved
    In each organization there are probably several people in the top levels who know enough for it to be revealing if they would talk. But those people were carefully selected and are compromised so that their talking would be to incriminate themselves. Not talking is far more beneficial to them.

    In the lower echelons probably some people know something, but not enough for it to be compelling if they would talk. More likely than not they don't even know who's calling the shots.

    It is very much like organized crime: a network where everyone knows only on a need-to-know basis, as to provide plausible deniability and security from exposure. And everyone benefits from participating - and from not talking.

    Following your logic, organized crime does not exist, because "someone would talk"...

    And then look at those who do talk: they're gagged, ignored, ridiculed, marginalized, and sometimes killed.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    Ferry Fey Donating Member (289 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 12:32 PM
    Response to Reply #66
    123. Who hears about what WTC workers who survived later died from?
    And then look at those who do talk: they're gagged, ignored, ridiculed, marginalized, and sometimes killed

    There have not been, and will not be, obits saying that this person had worked at the WTC, but survived because their alarm didn't go off that morning and they got to work late. The grunts who do the dirty work rarely will appear on the radar, even in the event of their suspicious demise.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 03:53 AM
    Response to Reply #64
    86. The whole point is
    Edited on Tue Jul-04-06 03:58 AM by mirandapriestly
    they are interconnected. Also, chain of command, mostly people are doing what they are told. Also, a lot of people who were in the building that day were people who woeren't going to say anything.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 07:41 AM
    Response to Reply #1
    41. Bank of America and WTC 7

    Mortgage bonds held on trade center could be in danger of default

    Bloomberg News

    Thursday, September 13, 2001

    GMAC Commercial Mortgage Corp. of Horsham, Pa., sold $563-million in bonds in connection with a loan to Silverstein Properties Inc., a New York-based property developer, which teamed with Los Angeles-based shopping centre owner Westfield America Inc. to lease the twin towers. The 99-year leasing deal was struck two months ago. There are also $383- million in securities related to a Bank of America Corp. loan involving World Trade Center 7, which also collapsed in Tuesday's attack.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 10:38 AM
    Response to Reply #1
    121. WTC 1 and WTC 2. Corporation index
    An overview of the companies with links to the different pages. Companies with little or no relevance are not listed. And the lower floors of both buildings were considered less relevant.

    Bold = Inside trader
    Italic = Victim
    ?? = Interesting, but too little is known.

    Main companies in WTC1

    Floor # - Company (tot/vict) - Comment
    107 - World Trade Club = Windows on the World (75/66) - Owned several bars/restaurants
    107 - Hotel and Restaurant Employees International (277/77)
    106 - Windows on the World (75/66)
    106 - Hotel and Restaurant Employees International (277/77)
    105 - Genuity = L-3 Communications (10/1)
    105 - Cantor Fitzgerald / ESpeed (1000/685+125)
    104 - Cantor Fitzgerald / ESpeed (1000/685+125)
    103 - Cantor Fitzgerald / ESpeed (1000/685+125)
    102 - Cantor Fitzgerald / ESpeed (1000/685+125)
    102 - Alliance Consulting Group (22/7) ??
    101 - Cantor Fitzgerald / ESpeed (1000/685+125)
    100 - Marsh USA (1900/295)
     99 - Marsh USA (1900/295)
     98 - Marsh USA (1900/295)
     97 - Marsh USA (1900/295)
     96 - Marsh USA (1900/295)
     95 - Marsh USA (1900/295)
     94 - Marsh USA (1900/295)
     93 - Marsh USA (1900/295)
     93 - Fred Alger Management (36/36) - Used eSpeed
     92 - CARR Futures (141/69)
     91 - American Bureau of Shipping (22/0)
     90 - Dun & Bradstreet (80/0) - Silverstream
     89 - Metropolitan Life Insurance Company (52/2) - Inside trader
     89 - Banco LatinoAmericano de Exportaciones Sud America (20/0) ??
     86 - Trading Technologies (7/0) - Deutsche Bank
     83 - Global Crossing Holdings - Destruction of evidence
     81 - Bank of America (400/2)
     79 - Virtual suite 7967 with for example Buttonwood
     78 - Korea Local Government Center (8/0) - Must have told South-Korea. Just imagine the scandal if they didn't
     77 - Martin Progressive (80/0)
     65 - Boeing
     62 - CARR Futures (see above. This lower floor survived)
     59 -">Sidley Austin Brown & Wood (600/1)
     58 -">Sidley Austin Brown & Wood (600/1)
     57 -">Sidley Austin Brown & Wood (600/1)
     56 -">Sidley Austin Brown & Wood (600/1)
     54 -">Sidley Austin Brown & Wood (600/1)
     53 - AIG Aviation Brokerage part of AIG
     53 - French Embassy Financial Services - See South-Korea
     50 - Dai-Ichi Kangyo Bank (unk/0) ??
     49 - Dai-Ichi Kangyo Bank (unk/0) ??
     48 - Dai-Ichi Kangyo Bank (unk/0) ??
     40 - Lehman Brothers (618/1)
     39 - Lehman Brothers (618/1)
     38 - Lehman Brothers (618/1)
     37 - Government of Thailand (>9/0) - See South-Korea
     36 - Kemper Insurance Companies part of Marsh
     35 - Kemper Insurance Companies part of Marsh
     34 - Royal Thai Embassy Office - See South-Korea
     34 - Port Authority 3000/74)
     33 - China Daily Distribution Corporation - Nothing is known about the company ??
     32 - Cantor Fitzgerald - See above
     31 - Port Authority - See above
     31 - Empire Blue (1914/5) - Sad story of Abe Zelmanowitz who stayed behind with his friend in the wheel chair.
     29 - ZimAmerican Israeli Shipping Company - Moved out Sept 4. Left some equipment though
     28 - Port Authority
     28 - Empire Blue
     27 - Empire Blue
     26 - Garban Intercapital (675/1) - ??
     25 - Garban Intercapital (675/1)
     24 - Port Authority - See above
     24 - Empire Health Choice = Empire Blue
     23 - Empire Health Choice
     22 - Virtual suite 2201
     20 - Empire Health Choice
     19 - Empire Health Choice
     19 - Port Authority
     17 - Empire Health Choice
     17 - ZimAmerican Israeli Shipping Company
     16 - ZimAmerican Israeli Shipping Company
     14 - Dun & Bradstreet
     14 - Port Authority
     11 - Bank of America
     10 - Bank of America
      9 - Bank of America
      3 - Port Authority

    Main companies in WTC2

    Floor # - Company (tot/vict) - Comment
    104 - Sandler O'Neill and Partners (180/63) - Owned several bars/restaurants
    101 - AON Corporation (1350/170)
    100 - AON Corporation (1350/170)
     99 - AON Corporation (1350/170)
     97 - Fiduciary Trust Company International (645/76)
     96 - Fiduciary Trust Company International (645/76)
     95 - Fiduciary Trust Company International (645/76)
     94 - Fiduciary Trust Company International (645/76)
     93 - AON Corporation (1350/170)
     91 - Raytheon Company (unk/4 on planes)
     90 - Washington Group International Inc (190/13) - ??
     89 - Keefe, Bruyette and Woods, Inc. (171/63) - ??
     88 - Keefe, Bruyette and Woods, Inc. (171/63) - ??
     87 - NY Department of Taxation and Finance (224/39) - ??
     87 - Corporation Service Company (100/0) - ??
     86 - NY Department of Taxation and Finance (224/39) - ??
     86 - Marsh USA (1900/295 in WTC1)
     85 - Marsh USA (1900/295 in WTC1)
     85 - Harris Beach (113/5) - Represented Gov. Carey
     85 - Keefe, Bruyette and Woods, Inc. (171/63) - ??
     84 - Euro Brokers (285/61 survivors on lower floor)
     84 - Mass Electric Construction Co - Mystery wire expert
     83 - IQ Financial Systems (110/3) - Deutsche Bank
     82 - Fuji Bank (625/9)
     81 - Fuji Bank (625/9)
     80 - Fuji Bank (625/9)
     79 - Fuji Bank (625/9)
     78 - First Commercial Bank (27/1) - Note: small office of a small bank. Most likely unrelated
     78 - Baseline Financial (175/3)
     77 - Baseline Financial (175/3)
     74 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     73 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     72 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     71 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     70 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     69 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     68 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     67 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     66 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     65 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     64 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     63 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     62 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     61 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     60 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     59 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     58 - Dow Jones (900/0)
     57 - Dow Jones (900/0)
     56 - Morgan Stanley (3700/6)
     55 - Garban Intercapital (675/1)
     54 - Guy Carpenter (700/1) = Marsh
     53 - Guy Carpenter (700/1) = Marsh
     52 - Guy Carpenter (700/1) = Marsh
     51 - Guy Carpenter (700/1) = Marsh
     50 - Guy Carpenter (700/1) = Marsh
     49 - Guy Carpenter (700/1) = Marsh
     49 - Seabury and Smith = Marsh
     48 - Guy Carpenter (700/1) = Marsh
     48 - Fireman's Fund Insurance Company (190/0)
     47 - Guy Carpenter (700/1) = Marsh
     46 - Fireman's Fund Insurance Company (190/0)
     45 - Fireman's Fund Insurance Company (190/0)
     44 - Fireman's Fund Insurance Company (190/0)
     43 - Fireman's Fund Insurance Company (190/0)
     40 - Thacher, Proffitt and Wood (300/0) - ??
     39 - Thacher, Proffitt and Wood (300/0)
     38 - Thacher, Proffitt and Wood (300/0)
     36 - Frenkel and Company (180/0) - ??
     35 - Frenkel and Company (180/0)
     34 - Oppenheimer Funds (600/0) = Massachusetts Mutual and not Oppenheimer & Company
     33 - Oppenheimer Funds (600/0)
     32 - Oppenheimer Funds (600/0)
     31 - Oppenheimer Funds (600/0)
     30 - Hartford Steam Boiler = ITT
     29 - Weatherly Securities Corp (60/0) - ??
     23 - SCOR U.S. Corporation (120/0) - ??
     22 - Mancini Duffy (150/0) - ??
     20 - Thacher, Proffitt and Wood (300/0)
     20 - NY Shipping Association (140/0)
     19 - NY Shipping Association (140/0)
     18 - 4 U Services Inc (25/0)
     17 - N.Y. Institution of Finance (65/0)
     16 - National Development and Research Institute (130/0)
     15 - Mancini Duffy (150/0)
     12 - Verizon Communications (400/2) - See: Thomas Kean
     12 - Euro Brokers (285/61 survivors on lower floor)
     11 - Verizon Communications (400/2)
     10 - Verizon Communications (400/2)
      9 - Verizon Communications (400/2)
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 02:01 AM
    Response to Original message
    2. Lehman Brothers
    Lehman Brothers Holdings, Inc. founded in 1850, is a diversified, global financial services firm. It is a participant in investment banking, equity and fixed income sales, research and trading, investment management, private equity, and private banking. It is a primary dealer in the U.S. Treasury securities market. Its primary subsidiaries include: Lehman Brothers Inc., Neuberger Berman Inc., Aurora Loan Services, Inc., SIB Mortgage Corporation, Lehman Brothers Bank, FSB, BNC Mortgage, Inc., and the Crossroads Group. The Firm's worldwide headquarters are in New York City, with regional headquarters in London and Tokyo and offices throughout the world. (1)

    Lehman Brothers Kuhn Loeb, Inc. resulted from the 1977 merger of Kuhn Loeb & Co. and Lehman Brothers. (2) Lehman Brothers is one of the owners of the Federal Reserve and are also co-owners of the Bank of England and the European Central Bank.

    The largest and most influential American banking house was Kuhn, Loeb & Co of New York. Founded by Abraham Kuhn and Solomon Loeb in 1867, the firm was later directed by Jacob Henry Schiff (1847-1920) who sided with E.H. Harriman in 1901 against J.Pierpont Morgan and James Jerome Hill in the battle for the Northern Pacific. Kuhn, Loeb & Company was related to the house of M.M. Warburg of Hamburg (3), Germany. The main partners of Kuhn, Loeb & Co were interrelated by marriage. (4)

    In 1899, under the guidance of Philip Lehman, the Kuhn, Loeb & Co. partnered with Goldman, Sachs & Co., to bring the General Cigar Co. to market, followed closely by Sears, Roebuck & Company. During the following two decades, almost one hundred new issues were underwritten by Lehman Brothers, many times in conjunction with Goldman, Sachs. Among these were F.W. Woolworth Company, May Department Stores Company, Gimbel Brothers, Inc., R.H. Macy & Company, The Studebaker Corporation, The B.F. Goodrich Co. and Endicott Johnson Corp. (5)

    Peter Peterson is a former chair/CEO of Lehman Brothers (1973-1977) and former chair/CEO of Lehman Brothers, Kuhn, Loeb (1977-1984). (6) He is currently the chairman of Blackstone Group. (7)

    Stephen Schwarzman joined Lehman Brothers investment bank in 1972, eventually heading its mergers and acquisitions unit. In fact, Schwarzman initiated the failed 1980s merger of Lehman with American Express. Schwarzman quit in 1985, co-founding the Blackstone Group with his ex-Lehman mentor Peter Peterson. (8, 7)

    Lehman Brothers had offices in WTC1 with 685 employees. All but one survived 9/11. They were named by the SEC as one of the inside traders. (9)

    3. One of the other owners of the Federal Reserve.
    7. From the Port Authority / Larry Silverstein deal and links with AIG as well
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 02:11 AM
    Response to Original message
    3. Bear Stearns. Let's throw in the Ace (Greenberg)
    The Bear Stearns Companies, Inc. is the parent company of Bear, Stearns & Co. Inc., one of the largest and best-known global investment banksand securities trading and brokerage firms in the world. The company was founded in 1923 and serves corporations, institutions, governments and individuals. The company's business includes corporate finance, mergers and acquisitions, institutional equities and fixed income sales, trading and research, private client services, derivatives, foreign exchange and futures sales and trading, asset management and custody services. Through Bear, Stearns Securities Corp., it offers global clearing services to broker dealers, prime broker clients and other professional traders, including securities lending.

    The former CEO of Bear Stearns was Alan Greenberg, currently chair of the board, and is the cousin of Maurice Greenberg and part of the AIG group of course. (1)

    Bearn Stearns was named one of the inside traders of 9/11. Their stocks were traded 60 times the usual amount as well. (2)

    Bush family
    Bear Stearns, of course, is where the Bush family, the Cheney family, George Schultz, James Baker, etc. all do business. It is the leading brokerage firm of the great and all powerful Bushonian Cabal. (1)

    Harken Energy, Texas Rangers and Clear Channel

    by Al Martin

    The $7 million that Bush Jr. put into the deal came from the Harken Energy stock fraud. He and his father George Bush Sr. entered into a conspiracy with Bear Stearns and others to artificially manipulate the price of Harken Energy stock, wherein the Bush Family illicitly proceeded to trade their shares "against the box," through the Pilgrim Investment Trust, the Bush Family-controlled Panama-registered investment entity, wherein the price of Harken Energy stock was pumped up from 1-1/ 4 up to 7-3/8 and then dumped all the way back down again. This whole round trip as it were was accomplished in only about 4 months time. By being long at the bottom through the Pilgrim Investment Trust with shares that they had borrowed from Bear Stearns -- by the way. They didn't even put up their own damn shares. It's one thing to commit a scam, but the Bushes added a new twist. They commit scams with Other People's Money. They take it one step further by using OPM to commit the scams. Thus they generate the money for nothing.

    So then Bush Jr. takes the $7 million out of the Harken Energy Stock Swindle that he and his father orchestrated with their longtime ally Ace Greenberg, chairman of Bear Stearns. He then invests in a syndicate to buy the Texas Rangers sports franchise. Then Bush becomes part of the general management of the team and proceeds to run the team into the ground, financially speaking. Then he is allowed to sell his interest back to the syndicate, including his shares in Mays Hicks for 4 times what he paid for them. Despite the fact the franchise was worth only half of the purchase price since he had "managed" it . In order to bail the whole deal out, he as governor of Texas then authorizes the expenditure of $345 million of public monies in order to build the new stadium and surrounding complex for the Texas Rangers.


    The syndicate was composed of the Hicks Muse crowd essentially. James Baker was an investor in it and so was Dick Cheney. Then how this ties in to Clear Channel Communications is that Hicks was the regent of the University of Texas, which is another whole scam. This is a scam within a scam. The regents of the University of Texas is an infamous scam.


    Everybody promoted Clear Channel stock then, not only Bear Stearns, but Merrill Lynch and JP Morgan, and they ran it up. They got everybody to promote the stocks. so it got as wide as possible distribution. All these stocks were coming out of Clear Channel, and there was an enormous amount of money coming in with virtually no accountability as to how they have to spend that money. Then they can start paying 2 or 3 times what radio stations are worth just to own them. It was simply for the ownership of the market. It doesn't have anything to do with making any money. And yet the stock, which is now in the 40s, still trades in what is over a 35 P/E I think. It is still considered a high P/E stock.

    Trilateral scam: Link in the OP


    The Wall Street Journal reports that Bronx lawyer Bernard Glatzer is still pursuing Enron and Bear Stearns over a strategy he says he developed in the late 1980s to securitize natural gas production. Glatzer, who filed suit in New York in 1995, claims Bear Stearns passed the strategy on to Enron and Jeff Skilling. Glatzer hadn't been heard from for several years. He showed up in some New York Times stories in early 2002, after his falling out with lawyer David Boies. Glatzer said he fired Boies after finding out the lawyer was representing former Enron Chief Financial Officer Andrew Fastow.

    Glatzer settled with Bear Stearns several years ago, but now claims that settlement was violated, according to the Journal.

    Glatzer says Skilling is the only one who knows the answers that can prove his case. If Glatzer succeeds in getting Skilling named as a witness, Skilling's lawyer says he'll try to get the case postponed until after the Enron criminal trial in January.,,SB111810792577952529,00.html?mod=todays_us_money_and_investing

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 07:53 AM
    Response to Reply #3
    119. And the other Ace (Ltd.) did not have a good description either
    Ace Limited is a property & casualty insurer based in Hamilton, Bermuda. (1). Ace is a part of the AIG family cartel and its CEO is Evan G. Greenberg, son of Maurice Greenberg. Ace should not to be confused with cousin Alan "Ace" Greenberg from Bear Stearns. (4)

    Ace plays a minor role in 9/11 since it had part of the reinsurance of WTC and added a very specific and usual clause in their contract called WilProp. (3)

    Ace sells property & casualty insurance and reinsurance in the US and about 50 other countries. ACE Global Reinsurance, primarily through its Tempest Re unit, provides catastrophe reinsurance to personal and commercial clients. In 1998 in bought Cigna's property and casualty insurance business for $3.5B cash (2)

    Through Ace Global Markets, the firm owns four Lloyd's of London managing agencies. Ace USA provides US commercial and casualty insurance. (1)

    Through Ace USA, the company owns ESIS, a risk management services company. (1)

  • Chairman: Brian Duperreault (5)
  • CEO: Evan G. Greenberg (4)
  • CFO: Philip V. Bancroft (6)

    4. Biographies of the Greenberg family
    6. Related to the late Philip Bancroft?
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 02:32 AM
    Response to Original message
    5. Citigroup
    Citigroup Inc. is a major American financial services company based in New York City. According to Forbes Global 2000, it is the world's biggest company and the most profitable financial services firm. Its formation was announced on April 7, 1998 through a merger of Citicorp and Travelers Group. It was the first US company to combine banking with insurance underwriting since the Great Depression. The company has 300,000 employees and over 200 million customer accounts in more than 100 countries, with total assets of nearly 1.6 trillion USD. It is a primary dealer in U.S. Treasury securities and its stock is a component of the Dow Jones Industrial Average. (1)

    One of the ancestor companies is Kuhn, Loeb & Co. (2) They were named one of the inside traders of 9/11 and their stock were traded at 45x the usual amount. (3)

    Enron & WorldCom
    Citigroup was also accused of helping Enron and other companies hide their losses by loaning money to those companies in a special way that would reduce liabilities visible on the balance sheet. In May 2004 the company agreed to pay $2.65 billion, or $1.64 billion after tax, to settle a class action lawsuit brought on behalf of purchasers of WorldCom securities. (4)

    The investigation into WorldCom was disrupted because much of the evidence was in WTC7 which got pulled by Larry Silverstein. Salomon Smith Barney says that back-up tapes of corporate emails from September 1998 through December 2000 were stored at the building and destroyed in the attack. (5)

    August 26, 2004
    Citigroup Sued Over Enron Scandal

    NEW YORK (Reuters) - Citigroup Inc. faces a lawsuit from angry investors who allege they were defrauded in a massive scheme of deception when they bought securities tied to the credit-worthiness of bankrupt energy trader Enron Corp.


    Terror Inc.

    October 18, 2004

    A tale of suicide bombers, Saudi princes, cash payments to terrorist groups and how Citigroup got caught up in all of it.

    By Robert Lenzner and Nathan Vardi, Forbes

    IN AMERICAS WAR ON TERROR, cutting of the financial flow to the bad guys is a key goal. But it is a particularly elusive one. Even when a patriotic U.S. bank spots something suspicious, it may be hard-pressed to do much about it.

    And so it is that Citigroup, the worlds largest financial institution, finds itself confronting the fact that a bank it partly owned and managed in Saudi Arabia may have funneled thousands of dollars to terror groups and to the families of Palestinian suicide bombers at the behest of the Saudi royal family.

    The allegations involve Saudi American Bank, also know as Samba, the Riyadh-based affiliate in which Citi had a 20% stake. In late 2002 Samba was added as a defendant in a federal lawsuit filed by relatives of September 11 victims against prominent Saudis and charities to which they appeared to be connected.


    Samba, the second-largest bank in Saudi Arabia, with a 12% share of bank profits in the kingdom, earned $383 million in 2003. It was the linchpin of Citis close ties to the Saudi elite. The royal familys Prince Alwaleed Bin Talal al-Saud, the worlds fourth-richest man, owns $9.4 billion in Citigroup stock and a 7%-plus stake in Samba. Sambas chairman was billionaire Abdulaziz Bin Hamad Algosaibi, who died last year; his family, too, owns 7% or more of Samba.

    (...) In still another lawsuit a, the Saudi committee is alleged to have funded through Arab Bank suicide bombers and Hamas, the Palestinian group that has claimed responsibility for dozens of suicide bombings in Israel in recent years. That suit, filed in July in U.S. district court in Brooklyn on behalf of eight families of terror victims, alleges that $42 million was distributed to terrorists and/or their beneficiaries. ... Arab Bank, publicly traded on the Amman Stock Exchange, denies it.


    See also:
    Remember Brazil's largest corporate scam. Citigroup was the partner in crime with Kroll.


    The Citygroup watch

    2. See Lehman Brothers
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 02:50 AM
    Response to Original message
    7. Genesis Intermedia. Adnan, fraudster, arms dealer and drug dealer?
    In September 2001 the Saudi billionaires company, Genesis Intermedia went belly up. This led to the demise of Native Nations Securities firm and of the StockWalk Group, a Minnesota-based brokerage firm. When StockWalk group was wiped out, it was the largest brokerage firm failure in 20+ years.

    Some have wondered if Adnan Khashoggis firm was somehow involved in the mysterious stock trades in airline shares just before the terror attacks of September 11, 2001. Rafi Khan was making a lot of money with Adnan Khashoggi's GenesisIntermedia on 9/11. It is also curious that Adnan was behind Huffman Aviation.

    The SEC,Adnan Khashoggi, GenesisIntermedia and me

    Where could Mr.Adnan Khashoggi be? Why can't the SEC contact Adnan Khashoggi or any other person who opens a public company using U.S. and or Nevada, (Khashoggi used Delaware incorporation I believe, perhaps to give his GenesisIntermedia scam a little more 'class' I guess), incorporation to do so ? And even more so for a Saudi national who wielded so much power as arms dealer and financier during the Iran-Contra era of the Ronald Reagan-George H.W. Bush 1980's. Didn't Adnan Khashoggi have some 'business' in Armenia as recently as 2004 ? And why has the DOJ or FBI not stepped in to aid the SEC in its persuit ?

    The SEC,Adnan Khashoggi,GenesisIntermedia and me

    In a first for the U.S. SEC or Securities Exchange Commission since the chaos of post 9/11 and a claim by the Bush administration to fight money laundering in the UAE and elsewhere an interest is being taken by the SEC in Middle Eastern involvement in the corrupt U.S. penny stock market with its potential for money laundering around the world through unaudited shares the SEC allows so far to be distributed and sold in an international black market. In this instance it is Adnan Khashoggi of Iran-Contra fame himself and his Genesis Intermedia pump and dump scam that defrauded over one hundred million dollars of investor money that the SEC has taken on.

    And even though Mr.Khashoggi has wielded so much influence in Washington, D.C. and is connected to both the Bushes and the bin Ladens including as an arms merchant for Iran-Contra, Oliver North, etc. of the 1980's, he reverts back to what he and so many of the ruling class or international con artists, arms merchants or carpetbaggers see as class privilege, the defrauding of the peasants with penny stocks with perhaps a little money laundering in the confusion of penny shares changing hands.

    Just as he profitted from all his cheap or free Barrick Gold shares and just as Poppy George Herbert Walker Bush who literally gave an estimated 10 billion dollar U.S. gold mine to Barrick Gold for ten thousand dollars profitted in some ways...

    And just as George W. Bush benefitted from his Saudi friends in high places, including Adnan Khashoggi and the bin Ladens, when he needed investors in Harken Energy which is no doubt why he was given a position at Harken in the first place. Promise of an oil drilling concession in the Persian Gulf arranged by his Saudi connections no doubt aided in promoting or 'pumping' up the price of Harken Energy followed by the inevitable insider dumping of shares on investors. Anyway it was at least the first 'clean' money seeing as how the SEC looked the other way, that W Bush probably ever made in his life.


  • Securities Exchange Commission vs. Ramy Y. El-Batrawi, GenesisIntermedia, Adnan Khashoggi,

    Interesting case below of failed attempt by the SEC to convict apparent television stock talk personality, Courtney D. Smith, of promoting GenesisIndymedia on business talk stations for a pay off.

  • SEC v Courtney D. Smith

  • Poppy Bush,Adnan Khashoggi,Barrick Gold
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 02:56 AM
    Response to Original message
    8. Morgan Stanley
    Morgan Stanley is an investment bank, retail broker, and credit card provider with headquarters in New York City's Times Square. (1)

    Morgan Stanley employed 3700 people in WTC2 just below the impact area of the second plane and in WTC5. Morgan Stanley began evacuating its offices soon after the plane hit the first building. (2) They only suffered 10 casualties (11), while only four people of Euro Brokers managed to get out of the building. (3) There is a communication between a fire fighter and the director of Morgan Stanley where he says that the 78th floor (above Morgan Stanley) is full of dead bodies. (4) Also it is strange that their security officer Rick Rescorla made a whole plan about what to do if an airplane struck the building. (5)

    Morgan Stanley was also involved in the pre-9/11 inside trading. Their own stock traded at 27x times to norm. (6)

    They also used Silverstream software for internet transactions (7) Morgan Stanley was also involved in the Silverstream Fraud Class Action (8) where they and FleetBoston Robertson Stephens (9) performed artificial price inflation to reap enormous profits by buying Silverstream stock at the $16.00 IPO price and then selling it later for a profit at inflated aftermarket prices, which rose as high as $32.50 during its first day of trading. The complaint further alleges that Silverstream was able to price the secondary offering of Silverstream stock at an artificially high $114.00 per share due to the continued effects of the foregoing violations. (10)

    9. Merged with Bank of America after 9/11
    11. Some sources say 7
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 02:17 AM
    Response to Reply #8
    58. Rick Rescorla
    I had wanted actually to start a thread on this, but I'll stick it here. Here is a web site which talks about Rescorla on 9-11. They don't let you cut and paste so I'll paraphrase.

    He was, according to a friend, really burning mad at Port Authority because it was one of their officials who made the decision to tell people to stay in their offices. So it wasn't random security guards like people say. I think this is very important. If Rescorla had not screamed at them and started escorting people out (at least from what we hear) 1000's more would have died and it would have been part of policy. (did they want a higher toll?)
    and yes, he told people that a plane was going to be next (after 93 bombing) what did he know and is that why he died? He was seen as far as the 72nd floor.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 09:49 PM
    Response to Reply #58
    77.  Rescorla
    could probably hear explosions just like so many of the people who were in there and he was not the type to keep quiet about it. He probably figured out something else was going on. His last hours were described as "shrouded in mystery". Who's going to know if he died another way first, they couldn't even find his DNA (supposedly) according to his wife, she had to go to a hospital to get something of him to bury (a blood sample or something)
    He was supposed to be on vacation, but his deputy wanted to go to Lebanon, so he was there that day.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 10:48 AM
    Response to Reply #58
    99. Yet officials from Port Authority canceled a meeting at the last moment

    Partners In Perseverance
    By Jeff O'Heir, CRN
    New York, 4:56 PM EDT Fri. Sep. 06, 2002

    Other New York solution providers, however, have seen an uptick in sales in since the events of Sept. 11. Chris Cangero, vice president at Epoch Data, located at Sixth Avenue and West 30th Street, said the solution provider's disaster-recovery and business-continuity sales doubled in the months following the attacks, and that growth has since ebbed to about 50 percent. Document management and mirroring solutions, as well as consulting business, also have been brisk in the SMB space, he said.

    Epoch had three customers in the World Trade Center and at 10 a.m. on Sept. 11, half of Epoch's staff was scheduled to roll out a document management solution for the law division of the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, located at the World Trade Center. But Port Authority officials canceled the meeting minutes before Epoch closed on Sept. 10.

    Paul Bremer wanted much more. The psycho talked about tens of thousands in 2000 during his Pearl Harbor speech at the Heritage Foundation because the result would be that the people were screaming for the President to use the military.

    And there are plenty of more speeches like that from him and some even date back to the Reagan era. He probably thought that 9/11 was a bit of failure because it was only 3,000 out of 48,000. He made up for it in Iraq...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 11:09 PM
    Response to Reply #99
    109. He recommended the use of intelligence assets
    Edited on Tue Jul-04-06 11:11 PM by mirandapriestly
    despite the fact that the CIA says they don't work. Yeah, but they make great patsies. He was also talking about biological terror and the specific technology for it - cross ventilation systems, etc...that should be controlled for export. I think I know what's coming next...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 03:01 AM
    Response to Original message
    9. XL Insurance
    XL Insurance is a Bermuda insurance company which is currently owned by AIG. It used to have a strategic allience with AIG. It is well known for its massive fraud and was one of the reinsurances used by Larry Silverstein for the World Trade Center. Both Ace and XL Insurance had a specific clause called WilProp (1) which prevented Larry from getting a double whammy like he did with all the other reinsurance companies.

    XL Capital Ltd, a sister company, was also named as one of the inside traders on 9/11 and their stocks were traded at 60 times the usual amount. (2) They were part of Bear Stearns, a company which used to be run by Alan Greenberg.

    See also:


    That's the last of the major inside traitors. The others are in the A-Z list.
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 04:46 AM
    Response to Original message
    10. 9/11 Encyclopedia
    One of the most extensive resources on 9/11 was GlobalFreePress, however that site is no longer online. All the information has been copied by somebody and put into one huge PDF file.

    This book was compiled with the help of results of members of GROUND ZERO Forum NYC, with other members of an investigative thinktank in the 911-folder at, with members of and the team of Shadowgovernment TV.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 05:12 AM
    Response to Original message
    11. MIHOP
    For those who want an overview of all the physical evidence as well

    By Stallion4

    This is some of the most compelling evidence and information that I've been able to compile over the past few months that supports a 9/11 cover-up. The official government story says that an Arab named Osama bin Laden (still at large) engineered the whole thing while located in a cave somewhere in Afghanistan with the help of 19 other Arabs who hijacked U.S. commercial jets with box-cutters and flew them into the World Trade Center Towers and Pentagon with pinpoint accuracy. This is only a small portion of evidence and information that proves we've all been lied to by the United States government about what really happened on 9/11 (Most complete version)


    By Spooked911

    I (=Spooked911) am dedicated to finding out the truth about 9/11. I think the evidence is incontrovertible that the WTC towers were blown up by controlled demolition on 9/11, as well as WTC7. Other aspects of that day are less clear, but all in all 9/ 11 appears to be a massive and cruel hoax foisted upon the American people to generate bloodlust.

    By Dr. David Ray Griffin
    The 9/11 Commission Report: A 571-Page Lie
    115 lies in the official report

    In discussing my second 9/11 book, The 9/ 11 Commission Report: Omissions and Distortions, I have often said, only half in jest, that a better title might have been a 571-page lie. (Actually, I was saying a 567-page lie, because I was forgetting to count the four pages of the Preface.) In making this statement, one of my points has been that the entire Report is constructed in support of one big lie: that the official story about 9/11 is true. Another point, however, is that in the process of telling this overall lie, The 9/ 11 Commission Report tells many lies about particular issues. This point is implied by my critiques subtitle, Omissions and Distortions. It might be thought, to be sure, that of the two types of problems signaled by those two terms, only those designated distortions can be considered lies.

    Simple Math Proves that the 9/11 Account is a fabrication
    by Elias Davidsson

    The term official 9/11 account refers to the account of the events of Sept. 11, 2001, as presented in June 2004 by the Commission of Inquiry appointed by President George W. Bush, and complemented by other official documents issued by US government agencies. This account includes various details, such as identities of the alleged hijackers, identities of aircraft, timelines and other data used to prove that the crime of 9/11 was perpetrated by the named individuals under the orders or the inspiration of Osama bin Laden and other al Qaeda leaders.

    It can be demonstrated by two straightforward mathematical techniques that the official acccount on 9/11 is simply not true.

    How many coincidences are there? Isn't it time to reinvestigate 9/11?

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 07:48 AM
    Response to Original message
    12. Reinsurance is a common practice
    Edited on Sat Jul-01-06 07:49 AM by DoYouEverWonder
    in the insurance industry. Anything that costs millions+ dollars to cover is too big for any one company to carry that kind of risk. You might buy insurance from someone like Zurich, but that policy is then divided up among sometimes hundreds of companies. The process is called reinsurance and there are even treaties that cover the terms of these agreements. The result is that no one person is left holding the bag.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 08:01 AM
    Response to Reply #12
    13. In this case the timing is odd
    Edited on Sat Jul-01-06 08:03 AM by DrDebug
    The lease went to Larry on 24 July 2001 (1) and before that AIG was the main insurer and they moved the policy to their main competitors. So ultimately the Greenberg cartel paid $365 million and their competitors in excess of $4.5 billion. (2)

    So not only did all the building change hands to Larry, but also AIG made their competitors responsible for the damage and put in the WilProp clause on their contracts, because Larry did a little bit of insurance fraud as well and collected almost double from the rest.

    Not to mention that Larry got the contract due to the Blackstone group which once again links in AIG.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 08:44 AM
    Response to Reply #13
    14. Who owned the buildings
    before Larry?

    I would assume a change of insurer would come with a change of ownership, that's not unusual. But if people colluded with each other because they had inside info and then knowingly let their competitors take the hit, that would be worth figuring out.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 08:53 AM
    Response to Reply #14
    16. Blackstone had it before Larry
    Edited on Sat Jul-01-06 08:54 AM by DrDebug
    And before Blackstone it was Teachers Insurance and Annuity Association

    On October 17, 2000, eleven months before 9/11, Blackstone Real Estate Advisors, of The Blackstone Group, L.P, purchased, from Teachers Insurance and Annuity Association, the participating mortgage secured by World Trade Center, Building

    Business Wire, 17 October 2000 via

    So Blackstone got the building a year before and then moved it to Silverstein and Port Authority. And Blackstone links are above and tie in AIG, Henry Kissinger and the management came from Lehman Bank. Blackstone is also an owner of Kroll, the private CIA.

    The Blackstone Group has ties to American International Group, Inc. (AIG) and Kissinger Associates, Inc./Henry Kissinger. According to the Blackstone website, AIG acquired a 7% non-voting interest in the company in 1998 for $150 million "and committed to invest $1.2 billion in future Blackstone-sponsored funds".

    The history of Blackstone

    Did a lot of business with Bush as well.
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 09:18 AM
    Response to Reply #16
    17. Thanks for spelling that out for me
    You've got a lot of good info that you're tracking down, but it does get a bit complicated for someone whose not immersed in it.

    That is incredible, Blackstone buys the building the year before and then everything changes hands again right before the attack. It's interesting to see how the chessboard was set during that year before the attack. They got in, set things up and then got out before the event so they wouldn't be directly connected, stuffing their pockets with money in the process. Nice folks. :sarcasm:

    Marvin Bush did the same thing on the security side. Gained access and control over security for key locations and then got out prior to the attacks so that there wouldn't be a direct connection.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 09:26 AM
    Response to Reply #17
    18. There is a lot of changes of hands prior to 9/11. That makes it complex
    Edited on Sat Jul-01-06 09:34 AM by DrDebug
    So the first team is usually the most important team and second team which gets the building or whatever just prior to 9/11 plays a part in the cover-up.

    Marvin Bush is part of the first team and then hands it over to the cover-up team, so there is no direct connection. The same applies to using AIG/Kroll/Marsh instead of the CIA, because once again it's an indirect link. There was no direct involvement of a government agency or the Bush administration.

    The year before is funny, because that was before Bush. So that's why I think that just like October Surprise was the predecessor of Iran Contra, the 2000 Election fraud was a predecessor of 9/11. So they already had the plans in 2000, but needed a government who was willing to go ahead with the plans (and as you probably remember Clinton opposed the PNAC plan, so Al Gore could have opposed it as well).

    So the game begins when George W. Bush and Richard Cheney enter the White House and it still takes 9 months to set everything up. The war with Afghanistan would have required much more planning than 1 month. That would have started at least a year in advance as well.

    And all these things are more a sequence of events and every time they manage to get one objective is when they move on to the next. So Iran is very tricky, because that's probably the next objective.

    Bush ran Harken into the ground. Then ran Texas Rangers into the ground. Now he is running the United States into the ground. He more or less managed to run Afghanistan and Iraq into the ground as well and he'll just continue, because that's his game. He is not incompetent, he is very competent in breaking everything he touches.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 11:09 AM
    Response to Reply #16
    19. Clarify, please
    WTC original site (including WTC 1-6 but NOT WTC 7) was built 1960s by Port Authority of NY & NJ, which owned it until 2001.

    Transfered 2001 under 99-year lease to Silverstein, in "largest privatization in American history" (as celebrated shortly before Sept. 11).

    WTC 7 was built in 1985 to the north of original WTC. It was always owned by Silverstein straight through to today.

    Mortgage on 7 purchased 2000 by Blackstone Group (Peter Petersen) but ownership officially still Silverstein.

    Blackstone Group never owned a piece of original WTC or its mortgage.

    I find this post overall fascinating, and I liked the movie a lot. But unless you're willing to dig into Marsh McClellan (also Kroll et al.) it's ultimately useless. By that I mean, actually finding people who worked there and trying to figure out if there was, for example, strange construction going on. Sounds dangerous, if you're right, but ultimately the scenario is entirely speculative until you dig for empirical evidence one way or another. After all, there are counterintuitive elements involved. Many might ask, isn't MMcC the victim here, being the company that was in the target area with great losses in personnel? (It's a mini version of the larger question of "why would perps strike WTC, symbol of American economic might?" The larger question is totally naive, but show me that the mini version is not.)

    Also, show me that competitors to Silverstream were invited to Windows on World.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 11:16 AM
    Response to Reply #19
    21. You are not going to get people from the internet
    Edited on Sat Jul-01-06 11:17 AM by DrDebug
    Because that's the problem with corporations. They are black box, so you'll never know who in the company is behind it. That's why it is private. The links show major involvement and that they had 4 teams of professionals who could do this operation, but you can't go deeper than that. At least I can't. You need a real investigator for that.

    Blackstone took the lease on 2000. That's in the link above and that is from the mainstream media and the original reference is supplied.

    What Silverstein did 6 weeks prior was to get ALL the buildings. He had a couple and suddenly he gets the rest. That was to hide Blackstone.

    Indira Singh like in the top where she talks about the meeting. That's direct testimony from somebody working in the industry who was supposed to be there. The same applies to Richard Grove who was supposed to be present at Marsh and validates the movie and the link found thus far.

    And you are not going to find any government agency or the Bush administration. Nobody found anything thusfar, because it's not that directly. The direct guys are these corporations which are black box. They did that for a reason.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 11:31 AM
    Response to Reply #19
    22. As far as Kroll/Marsh goes
    Edited on Sat Jul-01-06 11:32 AM by DrDebug
    Kroll is current a part of Marsh, but they were always closely related. Both the Brazilian government as well as the French government named them a CIA front. In case of Brazil it was because they were at the center of the biggest scam ever (See: part I post) and French intelligence has a tendency to leak those secrets if America pisses them off and don't underestimate the French because they are just as good as the Mossad or the CIA. They always know everything first as well.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 12:30 PM
    Response to Reply #19
    24. One point about the Marsh victims
    We know that Richard Grove was supposed to be one of them and he personally believes that it is because he knew about the money laundering and complained about the $10K bribe. We don't know about the other 295. Those lists exists, but haven't been checked and they are very important. Personally I checked a lot of larger companies or companies which were higher up and that is reasonable less stressful. Checking individual victims is much harder.

    The victim list of companies was strange though, because most were involved in Risk management as well. The Marsh employess, the 47 people at Port Authority starting with Neil D. Levin. Rick Rescorla at Morgan Stanley who made a big plan about what to do if an airplane struck the building, but didn't survive himself. The cops and fire men are no surprise, since it is part of their job, but there are quite a number of FBI officers are well who died and that could hold clues as well. The same applies to all the people on the plane, because there are some anomalies there as well.

    Either way that is very stressful work, so I am kinda hoping that somebody else did some parts.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 02:36 AM
    Response to Reply #24
    36.  i've been meaning to
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 02:58 AM by mirandapriestly
    look at individual Marsh employees who were victims for a long time. I did finally get a few books which talk about the last hours and those who died, but I never get to them. I thought if you wanted to murder someone or a group of people and you knew 911 was going to happen in the world trade center, that would be one way to do it, no questions would be asked. People could have been there that we don't know about.
    I found a list that has everyone and where they worked, I'll start going through it tomorrow.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 11:50 AM
    Response to Reply #36
    46. Here is the list for Marsh victims
    I started to look, and so far it reminds me of when I looked at who died at the Pentagon. Accountants,analysts and infromation technologists. Exactly the same as the Pentagon. I wonder if they were supposed to be there "early" for a meeting. Quite a few vice presidents
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 01:37 PM
    Response to Reply #46
    50. Thanks. Let's start with the names which have been added later
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 01:38 PM by DrDebug
    slightly condensed

    Kenneth Zelman

    As a consultant for Oracle Corp., Kenneth Zelman had many different clients. The morning of Sept. 11 found him with Marsh & McLennan on the 99th floor of the World Trade Center, where he was on a year long assignment.

    Wife; father of two; 14-month-old son.

    Zelman is survived by his parents Ruth and Jack, three sisters, and a brother.

    Suresh Yanamadala

    Consultant at Marsh & McLennan Cos. Inc. Confirmed dead, World Trade Center, at/in building, Indian

    Loretta Vero

    Loretta lived in Nanuet for 15 years. She was a corporate consultant with American Express and is survived by her sisters.

    Unfortunatly, my cousin Loretta Vero (a corporate travel consultant) was in her office at American Express on the 94th floor of the North Tower. She was never recovered.'Anne%20Colavito%20Durst/Story%20Details.htm

    Faina Rapoport

    Faina Rapoport carried a mental portrait of New York City for years. It was a means of survival while she and her family waited to hear from the United States goverment about whether they qualified for the refugee program. Her family, Jews from Moscow, wanted to escape religious persecution.

    In 1994, New York City was no longer a painting in the gallery of Mrs. Rapoport's mind. It became real the family received refugee status. They were free to worship as they pleased.

    Mrs. Rapoport, a computer programmer, studied English, while her husband, Yuriy, a civil engineer, became a construction inspector. Their children, Alex, 25, and Elena, 19, attended school.

    Soon Mrs. Rapoport, 45, learned enough English to pursue a job. Eventually, she became a computer programmer at Accenture at the World Trade Center. Her salary helped buy a condominium near the beach.

    THE NEW YORK TIMES on February 3, 2002

    Jonathan Randall

    By David Shaiken 82

    Jonathan Randall 82 died in the North Tower of the World Trade Center on Sept. 11.

    Some classmates have expressed surprise to me upon learning recently that this same Jonathanartsy, warm, gentle Jonathan had worked for years in the Information Technology Department of J&H March and McLennan Inc., an international insurance brokerage firm, in a corporate Wall Street environment 95floors up in the North Tower of the World Trade Center. Jon had found another path of exciting ideas and new challenges working with computers and supervising others. That was Jonathanunbound by your or my expectations, willing to take a turn when it felt right.

    Some years ago, Jon told me that, during his daily commute from Brooklyn to the financial district in Manhattan, Jesus had tapped him on the shoulder. Jonathan became a devout Christian, joining and taking a leadership role in the Zion Lutheran Church and forming a Bible study group at work. He found a path to spiritual peace through his work in the church, study of the Bible, humility, relationship with God, and many acts of charity. At Christmas, he asked his family to forgo buying gifts for him and instead to give to a needy person.

    Anne Ransom

    Dear Anne: I think of you just about every day. All the times we laughed together when we both worked at Bobst and all the times that followed through the years

    Shreyas Ranganath

    Software Developer Adored Indian Food, Film

    Nov. 7, 2001

    He was a pro at software design, a lover of good food and he knew his Indian motion pictures.

    Before coming to the United States to work on a three-month project with Marsh & McLennan, Shreyas Ranganath was awash in the high-tech excitement of Bangalore, a place known by some as the Silicon Valley of India. In the Southern India city, Ranganath soaked up knowledge and experience in software design and became an expert.

    His expertise landed him the job in New York City and he went to work on the 97th floor of One World Trade Center. Baalebail, who works for the same consultancy as Ranganath, allowed the young man and another software designer, Shashi Kiran Kadaba, to stay in his Hackensack, N.J., home.

    -- Fred Aun (For Newsday)

    Hemanth Kumar Puttur

    Wipro names halls after its September 11 victims

    Indian software giant Wipro Ltd, planning a solemn memorial on the anniversary of September 11 attacks, has named four halls in a sprawling campus after workers it lost in the tragedy, company officials said.

    The sprawling campus is among the several sites the software service company has in Bangalore. About 4,000 of its 11,000 engineers work at the campus and hundreds at client sites abroad.

    The four victims, Shreyas Ranganath, Hemanth Kumar Puttur, Shashikiran Kadaba and Deepika Kumar were working on the 97th floor of one of the World Trade Center towers in New York for a Wipro client at the time of the attack.

    Deepa Pakkala

    Deepa Pakkala never wanted to call it a day. Determined to not only succeed but excel, Deepa worked long hours in order to provide for her family. A young mother who had just begun working for Oracle Corporation, Deepa was with a client in the World Trade Center on September 11th. Last January, Deepa gave birth to a healthy baby girl, Trisha. The two months she took to spend with her daughter was the only time she has ever slowed down, according to her husband of ten years.

    Lamar D. Hulse
    Confusion about who the name with the picture

    security guard, Advantage Security Confirmed dead, World Trade Center, at/in building

    I am the Uncle of Mr. Hulse. His name is not Mychal Lamarr it is Lamar D. Hulse. If you have any questions you can contact me at the above e-mail address. We the family thank you for your support, and thank you for making the quit square.

    Shashikiran Kadaba

    Wipro names halls after its September 11 victims

    Indian software giant Wipro Ltd, planning a solemn memorial on the anniversary of September 11 attacks, has named four halls in a sprawling campus after workers it lost in the tragedy, company officials said.

    The sprawling campus is among the several sites the software service company has in Bangalore. About 4,000 of its 11,000 engineers work at the campus and hundreds at client sites abroad.

    The four victims, Shreyas Ranganath, Hemanth Kumar Puttur, Shashikiran Kadaba and Deepika Kumar were working on the 97th floor of one of the World Trade Center towers in New York for a Wipro client at the time of the attack.

    Phoenix working for a project at American Express Bank

    Stanley McCaskill

    Stanley McCaskill was called a mama's boy in the housing projects on West 112th Street, where he lived from the time he came into this world. Everyone knew that his 77- year-old mother, Ella Mae McCaskill, had a tight hold on him. But he did not mind being picked on about it. Neither did she. Mr. McCaskill would call his mother every day from his job at 1 World Trade Center, where he was a guard for Advantage Security. She told him to. She gave him a prayer cloth and a tiny red Bible for his wallet. His mother knew the size of his belt, his pants, his shirt, even the name of his barber. At age 47, he had not moved out, even though his mother did not care for some of his girlfriends. "He loved her," said his cousin, Carolyn Louallen. "He just didn't want to leave her."
    Profile courtesy of THE NEW YORK TIMES.

    Lucy Crifasi

    Name does not exist on the internet. No information on memorial either, except some notes form co-workers.

    Gennady Boyarsky

    travel agent, American Express Confirmed dead, World Trade Center, at/in building, Russian

    So the last additions were:
  • Oracle Corp for an unknown project
  • Indians from Wipro, Bangalore for a project for American Express Bank (97th floor)
  • Travel agents American Express
  • Advantage Security guards
  • IT 95th floor
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 12:44 AM
    Response to Reply #50
    54. what do you mean added later? Here are some Marsh
    I just started looking at what jobs people had at Marsh and it seemed there were a lot of financial and Higher Ups, lots of VP's. I mean they must have had lots of customer service and what not, but these are mostly higher ups (but not TOO higher up) (CEO'S) These are all MARSH
    William Abrahamson, business analyst
    There were his colleagues from the Federal Reserve Bank

    Richard Anthony Aceto, 42, of Wantagh, New York, a tax specialist

    Christy Addamo was on the 98th floor of Tower One when the first plane hit it. A senior accountant

    Gertrude Alagero
    Walther and Trudi had met at their offices at Marsh Inc., a subsidiary of Marsh & McLennan where they each worked and where Trudi was a Senior Vice President for Private Client Services.

    Jon Albert vice president of information technologies
    Jacquelyn Aldridge accountant finance
    Richard Allen mailroom clerk 98th (dad survuved port authority)

    Janet Alonso email analyst for Marsh & McLennan on the ninety seventh floor of Tower
    Victoria Alvarez Brito finance department of Marsh & McLennan i

    Cesar A. Alviar accountant 94th floor
    Marilyn Bautista accounts payable
    cecile caguicla assistan v.p. finance
    manuel lopez tax accountant
    larry sumaya technology manager
    kermit anderson vice president systems analyst 97th
    Doreen Angrisani financial manager 98th
    Jack Aron information technology
    Thomas J. Ashton 95th floor of the north tower on an electrical contracting job for Marsh and McLennan(what kind of electrical contracting job?

    Tatyana Bakalinskaya hostess (from ukraine) 93rd
    Michael Baksh insurance executive(?)
    Sharon Balkcom computer systems manager
    Mike Bane casualty claims
    Kathryn Bantis
    Richard Anthony Aceto, 42, Wantagh, N.Y., tax specialist,
    Scott D. Bart, 28, Malverne, N.Y., vice president, Marsh & McLennan Cos. Inc
    Paul James Battaglia, 22, New York, N.Y., consultant, Marsh & McLennan Cos. Inc
    Marlyn C. Bautista, 46, Iselin, N.J., accounts payable, Marsh & McLennan Cos. Inc.
    Jane S. Beatty, 53, Belford, N.J., technical supervisor, Marsh & McLennan Cos. Inc
    Nina Patrice Bell, 39, New York, N.Y., senior manager, Marsh & McLennan Cos
    William Reed Bethke, 36, Hamilton, N.J., computer programmer, Marsh USA
    Gary Bird, 51, Tempe, Ariz., senior vice president, Marsh USA
    On Sept. 10, he began a new job as senior vice president at Marsh & McLennan. He was to work out of Phoenix, but spent the first two days in New York for meetings. On Sept. 11
    On Sept. 11, he had a three-hour meeting starting at 8:15 a.m. at the Marsh offices in the World Trade Center
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 01:23 AM
    Response to Reply #54
    55. Is this the meeting?
    Gary Bird had just been promoted to senior Vice President, but he worked in Phoenix. Was this the meeting that got people there early? He was last seen on the 99th floor.

    "On Sept. 10, he began a new job as senior vice president at Marsh & McLennan. He was to work out of Phoenix, but spent the first two days in New York for meetings. On Sept. 11, he had a three-hour meeting starting at 8:15 a.m. at the Marsh offices in the World Trade Center. He told his wife he'd be home in Tempe by 8 p.m. for dinner. "
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 01:32 AM
    Response to Reply #55
    56. electrical contractor on the 95th floor at Marsh
    Thomas J. Ashton 95th floor of the north tower on an electrical contracting job for Marsh and McLennan(what kind of electrical contracting job? )

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 04:53 AM
    Response to Reply #56
    60. 16 electrical contractors died in wtc
    (There might be more/less, that is what I read in another article)
    If you do a search for electrical you can get the names of their companies on the above list.
    There were more there , they survived, I remember reading about them.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 05:12 AM
    Response to Reply #54
    61. Added later as in not on the first list of people
    There was quite a lot of confusion about who was there.

    It appears that there were three main group there. Executives some who didn't usually work in WTC either. A financial group and a big group of software engineers (Silverstream?) with lots of people from other companies which were hired to get the system up and running before 9/11.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 03:42 PM
    Response to Reply #46
    51. Fast majority were software engineers
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 03:44 PM by DrDebug
    Just a couple of accountants and other people. Fast majority was IT. Some for other companies like Oracle and some working for American Express (was not listed on those floors??). Quite a number of recent immigrants and hired Indians as well.

    A lot of vice presidents - I do think that vice president wasn't a rare title either:

    Louis Joseph Minervino
    Senior Vice President recently transferred from Guy Carpenter.

    In 1988 booked on Pan Am Flight 103 which exploded over Lockerbie, Scotland, but he took a different flight.

    Michael Gregory McGinty
    Senior vice president at the Power Group in Boston
    Two days a week in NY in the U.S.
    He was a nuclear engineer.
    Served in the U.S. Navy until 1989.

    McGinty, of Foxboro, Mass., was a senior vice president in the Power Group of Marsh, Inc., of Boston and New York and worked as an insurance broker specializing in coverage for the nuclear power and utilities industries.

    He is one of five victims from University of Rhodes Island.

    The others:
  • Lynn Edwards Angell and her husband David Angell. American Airlines Flight #11. David started working for the Pentagon and became a scripwriter for TV.
  • Christine J. Barbuto American Airlines Flight 11. Worked for TJX Companies. One of half-dozen employees on that flight
  • Christian L. DeSimone. Marsh
  • Michael G. McGinty, Marsh (see above)
  • Frank Schott Jr., Marsh

    They are all from different years though, so it is not likely that they met each other at URI.

    Frank G. Schott
    Assistant vice president

    In his freshman year, he was arrested as one of "The Minnesota 9," in protests against the Vietnam War.

    Sal E. Tieri Jr.
    Though his office was in Midtown Manhattan, Tieri, 40, managing director at Marsh & McLennan, was attending a meeting on the 99th floor of One World Trade Center on Sept. 11.

    Susan Sauer
    managing director was in Manhattan for a meeting

    Harry Taback
    Mr. Taback, a 56-year-old Bronx native, was a managing regional director and executive vice president in risk control strategy and consulting at Marsh & McLennan, where he worked for 30 years. His office was located on the 100th floor of 1 World Trade Center. He normally was not in the office at the time of the attack, but had a conference call scheduled for 9 a.m. that morning.

    Harry Taback dedicated his professional life at Marsh & McLennan to helping companies plan for disasters

    Kenneth F. Rice III
    Assistant vice president IT 96th floor was usually overseas

    Gary Bird
    Senior vice president of Marsh USA.
    Lived in Tempe, Arizona

    Worked on the New Mexico Workers' Compensation Guarantee Fund Commission

    Susan Ann Ruggiero
    Assistant vice president IT

    She enjoyed traveling and would often fly across the country and the world on business. She went to Thailand, Mexico and Malaysia, always scheduling a few more days to explore the country.

    Jenny Seu Kueng Low Wong
    Assistant vice president, market information group

    Jenny Low Wong had just been promoted to assistant vice president at Marsh & McLennan.

    Alex Ciccone
    Assistant vice president

    Roger Mark Rasweiler
    Vice president with Marsh Inc.

    Lisa Marie Terry
    Vice president with Marsh & McLennan Cos.

    Salvatore J. Zisa
    Senior vice president at Marsh

    Jeffrey David Wiener
    Manager of risk technologies group

    Lars P. Qualben
    Vice president

    Jon Albert
    Vice president of information technologies

    Non-vice presidents:

    Sean Booker
    Worked for of Xerox Corp. Fixed photocopying machines for the Marsh & McLennan. Was also a pastor at Tabernacle Outreach Ministries in Newark. Always started early.

    Sandra Fajardo Smith
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 01:44 AM
    Response to Reply #51
    57. List of everyone & where they worked

    Marsh had more financial people casualties than the other companies, but also quite a few IT. There are a lot of vice presidents. Given the meeting that started at 8:15 and lasted for 3 hours , I'll bet that was for vice presidents. Was it the same meeting Grove spoke of? Because everyone who went to it would be killed, probably - 8:15& above impact. I want a better understanding of the structure of Marsh to be able to understand the significance of the people and what their titles were. Also were they rehired? These seem to be the upper echelon of a corporation unless maybe they didn't have the customer service/ people clerks in that office. I guess I can list everyone then figure out the percentage of what kind of division they were from. Without understanding the company, though this is not very helpful.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 04:49 AM
    Response to Reply #24
    117. Neil D. Levin, executive director Port Authority
    Neil D. Levin was the former Executive Director of the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey. He was killed during the September 11 terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center where Levin had his office.

    Levin was an aide to Senator Al D'Amato and to the U.S. Senate Banking Committee in Washington in the 1980s. He later moved back to New York to become a vice president at Goldman Sachs. He spent seven years as the Chairman of the Federal Home Loan Bank of New York. He was a member of the Board of Directors of Farmer Mac. He was a member of the Council of Foreign Relations.

    In 1995, Levin was appointed by George Pataki as New York's Superintendent of Banks. In this role, Levin was the state's chief banking regulator, head of the Department of Banking, and Chairman of the State Banking Board. In 1997, Pataki named Levin as the state Superintendent of Insurance. Pataki also named him the Chairman of the Commission on the Recovery of Holocaust Victims' Assets, which arranged for the return of assets to families in New York.

    On March 31, 2001, George Pataki, who moved out of the WTC a couple of month prior to 9/11, and Donald DiFrancesco (NJ) named Levin as the Executive Director of the Port Authority. He succeeded Robert E. Boyle.

    In this role he was the chief executive officer of the agency which runs the World Trade Center, various bridges and tunnels around New York City, the three airports in the New York City area, the seaports in New York and New Jersey, and various international trade programs. Levin was executive director for 5 months before his death and Pataki appointed Joe Seymour as his successor.

    Based on:

    Neil was involved with the Silverstein deal and many other events leading upto 9/11. No details are known why he was one of the few of the Port Authority who didn't survive. Interesting point about Pataki moving out of WTC prior to 9/11.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 05:51 PM
    Response to Reply #117
    127. Didn't know that about Pataki
    When I see that people died in the wtc and they were in leadership or decision making positions, I tend to think that they might have posed some difficulty to the planners of 9-11 and, of course they probably did not have pre-knowledge.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 08:48 AM
    Response to Reply #13
    15. Another bonus was that Larry only paid 14 million
    Edited on Sat Jul-01-06 09:04 AM by DrDebug
    and collected +/- 1.4 billion more than the buildings were worth in the first place. Other problems like asbestos which would have cost about $1 billion as well (1) and twin towers were not a huge success either with many floors empty or half empty. (3)

    Many of the companies were large corporations who only had a couple of people in the building and probably used it because it sounded prestigious and was a wonderful place to entertain guests, while keeping their main offices on a cheaper location.

    WTC 7 alone made Larry half a billion

    In February of 2002 Silverstein Properties won $861 million from Industrial Risk Insurers to rebuild on the site of WTC 7. Silverstein Properties' estimated investment in WTC 7 was $386 million. So: This building's collapse resulted in a profit of about $500 million. (2)

    These may not be the main reasons, but they were more sub goals and Larry played a vital role in this game. The real question is why Swiss Re went along with this plan even though they tried to fight the double whammy a bit. As far as Chubb and Allianz goes, there was overlap so it would have been harder from them to say no.

    The Larry scam is the most transparant of them all, because he couldn't hide like the rest and has been known for a long time now. Yet nothing happened, so I think that says enough...

    The Greenbergs will be harder. The Bush administration and all the other conspirators are even more indirect. It's what the CIA called Plausible Denial. That's why the insider trading investigation was stopped, since Deutsche Bank could have lead directly to them and now nobody knows whoexactly did it and we only have companies which had at least one person who knew about 9/11.

    1. (1989 estimate for WTC)
    2. Facing Our Fascist State, page 47
    3. and especially
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 03:49 AM
    Response to Reply #15
    85. Old Post of mine- Haaretz article on Silverstein
    This is interesting because there was this lawsuit against Silverstein and this strip club Runway 69. Some Queens local paper tried to cover it up by putting an online article saying that it was a "Lawrence, not a Larry Silverstein", but I have a copy of the lawsuit and it's Larry, plus there is an article in Haaretz the Israeli daily on it. It is funny and scary how all the stories about it got wiped off the internet until Haaretz put it up. But their article got taken down, too, but fortunately Beam Me Up gave me the cached article. Anyway..notice the money laundering references.


    "Many Israeli politicians are acquainted in one degree or another with
    the 70-year-old Silverstein. For 10 years, he tried to bring
    about the establishment of a free-trade zone in the Negev,..."
    "Harry Miller, a Vietnam War veteran, sued Silverstein, who owned the
    Runway 69 dance club in Queens, for his alleged involvement in the
    trafficking of heroin."
    This is the lawsuit:
    it was dismissed as "frivolous", but you got to wonder what Silverstein
    was doing with a dance club called "Runway 69"? In the suit Captain Miller, says that they
    were using Runway 69 as a MONEY LAUNDERING joint for heroin from Laos.
    Money laundering comes up again with Silverstein in something else from the article.
    It was dismissed and it also included Clinton and Nixon (!), but if you've
    read Michael Ruppert then it really isn't that unbelievable.

    The article emphasizes how eager he was to get the wtc contract.

    "The Israeli political world got to know Silverstein when he tried to create a
    free-trade zone in the country. He became friendly with Yitzhak Rabin,
    Benjamin Netanyahu, Ehud Barak and Ariel Sharon.
    Ahaz Ben Ari, ..., remembers Silverstein as being "not easy to deal with,
    a hot-tempered type who spoke aggressively to the prime minister...." (How did a guy who was born into a lower class sounding family and owned a dance club called "Runway 69" have this kind of clout with these guys?)

    Criticism of "free trade zones":
    "...Peres and Beilin objected: Free-trade zones of the kind envisaged were usually created
    in the Third World and had the reputation of being slave markets. The local workers
    earn starvation wages, while the entrepreneurs enjoy full tax exemption and make high
    profits. "
    ..."I told them that in the end, the zone would become a MONEY-LAUNDERING center and that
    no one apart from lawyers would make a profit from it."
    (my emphasis)

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 03:54 AM
    Response to Reply #13
    159.  "AIG made their competitors responsible for the damage"
    Interesting topic.

    "Lloyd's shared some of A.I.G.'s risk at the World Trade Center by selling it insurance known as reinsurance. Now Lloyd's must reimburse A.I.G. and other American insurers for some of their losses in the attacks."

    Does anyone know if Lloyd's coverage for AIG was specifically property or aviation or both?
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 11:10 AM
    Response to Original message
    20. Culhavoc Interview with Ty Rauber
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 11:57 AM
    Response to Reply #20
    23. Thanks
    Your work is appreciated by those of us who are really interested in this. I forgot to look at that link. I will today.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 01:40 PM
    Response to Original message
    25. Michael Cherkasky
    Edited on Sat Jul-01-06 02:04 PM by DrDebug
    Michael Cherkasky started working with the Manhattan district attorney's office. While serving as Robert Morgenthau's chief of investigations, Cherkasky supervised local investigators assigned to the federal and state investigation of the 1993 World Trade Center terrorist bombing (1) as part of the Joint Terrorist Task Force (2). The report on WTC 1993 forgot to mention that it was FBI themselves who did not stick to their deal with Abdul Rahman Yasin which caused the explosion. (3)

    He also supervised the investigation of the Bank of Credit and Commerce International, which was accused of defrauding customers around the world and illegally accepting drug-tainted accounts. The case prompted U.S. and British authorities to close the bank in 1991. (1)

    He started working for Kroll since February 1994 and in 2000 he was working as head monitor at the LAPD on behalf of Kroll which means that the private company monitors the public LAPD. (4) As we all know from the Michael Ruppert's testimony (7), it was actually the CIA who caused the majority of problems within LAPD so having an alledged CIA front (5) monitoring them for five years does not solve any problems.

    Michael Cherkasky became CEO of Kroll Inc in May 2001. Six weeks after 9/11 Michael Cherkasky echoed Bush speak at the CEO2CEO conference with statements like "The war will be long-term" and "It will be worldwide." (6)

    Since October 2004 he is CEO of Marsh & McLennan. (1) The irony is that the previous CEO resigned due to the Eliot Spitzer investigation. It is ironic that it was Michael Cherkasky who gave Spitzer his first job. (8)

    Marsh & McLennan: THE MARSH BIRDS

  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 05:24 PM
    Response to Original message
    26. Greenberg-Traurig. Many Bush connections. Election Fraud 2000
    Maurice "Hank" Greenberg, owner of AIG, is the Greenberg of Greenberg Traurig, their own law firm. (1)

    Greenberg Traurig, LLP is a Miami-based 1,350-lawyer full-service international law firm "with the fourth-largest number of lawyers in the United States and eighth-largest worldwide. The firm was founded in 1967 by Miami lawyer Mel Greenberg. Much of Greenberg Traurig's growth has been achieved through several mergers, including its 1998 pairing with Atlanta entertainment practice Katz, Smith & Cohen, and its 1999 acquisition of Minkin & Snyder. (2)

    Bush-Greenberg Traurig Connections A Selection
    1. represented President Bush in the Bush-Gore 2000 Florida election vote recount (3)

    "Court's reputation being tested," Associated Press (, December 11, 2000: "Barry Richard, a partner in the firm, is the lead Bush attorney in Florida. Richard, who is a Democrat, said he was called Nov. 8 about representing Bush." re Barry S. Richard (4)

    "Ethics experts say Scalia, Thomas connections not conflicts of interest,"CNN, December 12, 2000: See "Justice Scalia's sons": "Another Bush lawyer, Barry S. Richard, is a partner in that firm's Tallahassee office." (5)

    "Florida Attorneys for Bush and Gore to Debate 2000 Presidential Election Recount,"University of Florida, College of Liberal Arts & Sciences, March 25, 2003: "Barry Richard, chief Florida attorney for Bush ... an attorney of Greenberg Traurig law firm in Tallahassee,..." (6)

    "Greenberg Traurig Instrumental in Florida Vote Recount Victory,", January 13, 2004.

    2. personally represents Governor Jeb Bush (3)

    3. Hired son of Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia on election day 2000 - after which Justice Scalia cast one of the 5 to 4 deciding votes which placed Bush in presidency (3)

    4. Firm has prominent administrative positions in Massachusetts 9/11 Fund which also involves Bush family banking house Brown Brothers Harriman (3)

    5. One appointed as General Counsel of the Department of the Navy and its Office of Naval Intelligence just 90 days before the 9/11 attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon. (3)

    6. Firm works with 9-11 victims on planning out their U.S. gov't hushmail/bribery estates (3)

    7. Greenberg Traurig represented Diebold Election Systems, Inc (3)

    8. Jack Abramoff and the Indian Casinos (3)

    etc. etc.

    Content from Sourcewatch is available under GNU Free Documentation License 1.2.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    autorank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 08:27 PM
    Response to Reply #26
    27. Abramoff, Diebold, Barry Richard, Bush ties...did somebody say election
    fraud. Good grief! I had no idea the depth of these connections. I think it's a safe bet to be highly suspicious about elected officials and the varieties of political fraud when the name
    Abramoff shows up on the front door of this firm. This reminds me of "Devils Advocate."

    Much to study and absorb here but my highest compliments to DrDebug for putting together such
    an insightful and thought provoking collection of links and relationships.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 01:22 AM
    Response to Reply #27
    31. These Greenbergs are Bush's partners
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 01:24 AM by DrDebug
    The 9/11 event was planned much earlier. Paul Bremer is talking about this in detail back in 1999 and in 2000 they started to get control of the World Trade Center.

    This law firm has helped facilitate the election fraud and links in Jeb as well. The Greenberg cartel wanted the Bushes and there were already working on 9/11 so George W. Bush would have been vital, because they needed politician wouldn't care and use it for their political advantage. They were prior partners in Harken, Texas Rangers, Trilateral Investments.

    It's very big, but that's because it's a bunch of major companies who have their tenticles in each other. Enron and WorldCom just to be one of their pals as well. It's one big pile of greed, fraud, scams, drugs. They needed Bush because he was one of them. It would have meants as well that Bush knew before the election that they wanted to blow up the World Trade Center to start their oil/drugs war in Afghanistan.

    I think Greenberg-Traurig is so big that it definitely requires a thread of its own with all the Election 2000 and Election 2004 stuff. The first overview shows that this company is right in the middle of everything related to Election Fraud and Jeb Bush. The research will be hard because it seems only people like Stew Webb, Tom Flocco and Lyndon LaRouche have looked into Greenberg-Traurig spider which links Election Fraud, Bush family, Greenberg family and Henry Kissinger.

    And they wanted Henry to do the 9/11 investigation...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 12:08 AM
    Response to Reply #26
    29. ChoicePoint?
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 12:14 AM by mirandapriestly
    According to this article they were set to buy Kroll in 1997. I wonder if they did and sold it again? Or could they buy it, take it's databases then resell? I don't get it, but I'm going to put it in here. They also ID'd the DNA for the world trade center (hmmm) and you can see how government (military) people move around which could be awfully convenient, as you can see from Carol Di Battiste's resume.
    Choicepoint, as everyone knows, is the one who scrubbed the felons names who weren't really felons off the list in Florida which may well have jhanded the election to u-know-who.
    ChoicePoint, the Equifax Insurance Services Group, has announced plans to acquire Kroll Associates Inc., a provider of corporate intelligence and risk management consulting services. The acquisition should be completed soon after the spin-off of ChoicePoint from Equifax. Kroll is a privately held firm and is considered the world's foremost provider of investigative and corporate intelligence consulting. Kroll will retain its name and management structure. Equifax Insurance Services Group provides information and custom systems to mitigate insurance, business and government risk and fraud.
    ATLANTA and NEW YORK, April 1, 1997 -- The Equifax Insurance Services Group today announced an agreement in principle to acquire Kroll Associates Inc., the world's foremost provider of corporate intelligence and risk management consulting services. This follows last week's announcement that the Insurance Services Group, due to be spun off from Equifax this summer, has selected ChoicePoint as its new company name.

    The acquisition of Kroll Associates is expected to be completed shortly after the spinoff. Terms of the transaction were not disclosed.
    If Vice President Al Gore is wondering where his Florida votes went, rather than sift through a pile of chad, he might want to look at a "scrub list" of 173,000 names targeted to be knocked off the Florida voter registry by a division of the office of Florida Secretary of State Katherine Harris. A close examination suggests thousands of voters may have lost their right to vote based on a flaw-ridden list that included purported "felons" provided by a private firm with tight Republican ties.

    Early in the year, the company, ChoicePoint, gave Florida officials a list with the names of 8,000 ex-felons to "scrub" from their list of voters.

    Government agencies rely on ChoicePoint to help complete their most difficult tasks - using ChoicePoints DNA laboratory to identify victims of the World Trade Center attacks
    DiBattiste was formerly deputy administrator and chief of staff at the Transportation Security Administration; under secretary of the Air Force; deputy U.S. attorney and assistant U.S. attorney at the United States Attorneys Office, Southern District of Florida; director of the Executive Office for U.S. Attorneys; and principal deputy general counsel of the Navy. She served 20 years on active duty in the United States Air Force and was one of the Air Forces lead prosecutors. She was also a partner at the Law Firm of Holland & Knight.

    Carol DiBattiste, Chief Credentialing, Compliance and Privacy Officer
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 02:09 AM
    Response to Reply #29
    33. The ChoicePoint-Kroll merger was cancelled on August 8, 1997
    Choicepoint Inc., the insurance services company to be spun off by Equifax Inc., said on August 7, 1997 that its acquisition of Kroll Associates had been called off after the two companies could not reach a final agreement. (1)

    So it's not a direct line, but they are probably all going around in the same tight circle. They are also clients of the Ashcroft Group (2, 3) and we all know that Ashcroft didn't want to know anything about terrorism prior to 9/11, because he knew so he didn't want to hear anything about it. (5)

    Given their scandaleous behavior in Florida during the 2000 Election (4), it makes them the most unreliable bunch to do the World Trade Center victims identification.

    According to documentation unearthed under the Freedom of Information Act by the independent Electronic Privacy Information Center, ChoicePoint representatives were on the scene at the World Trade Center tragedy in Guinness-Book-of-World-Records-ambulance-chasing time. The company won contracts September 12 to match victims with its growing DNA data bank.

    (more at link like how they sold illegal info about 300 million Latin Americans to Ashcroft as well)

    It's almost like they knew :sarcasm: It means that the victim list may not be 100% reliable...

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 02:24 AM
    Response to Reply #33
    34.  Ok, thanks, well, it is still interesting
    about the DNA. It goes to show how you really can't be sure of any of the information we're given. There's bound to be a crooked link somewhere .
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 02:28 AM
    Response to Reply #29
    35. ChoicePoint and Khalid Almihdhar
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 02:31 AM by DrDebug

    The FBIs New York office techically began an investigation to locate Khalid Almihdhar on August 29 (2001), but in fact the one inexperienced agent assigned to the search, Robert Fuller, is busy for several days and only begins the search at this time (see August 29, 2001)

    Robert Fuller claims that he conducts a search in the ChoicePoint database. ChoicePoint is one of several companies maintaining commerical databases on personal information about US citizens. The FBI has a contract to access the ChoicePoint database, but none of the others. Fuller doesnt find any record on either Alhazmi or Almihdhar. He suggests this is because of variations in the spelling of names.

    However, the chairman of ChoicePoint will later confirm that although the database did have information on the hijackers before 9/11, the FBI did not ask to search the database until shortly after 9/11. The 9/11 Commission will conclude the database was not searched, and notes, Searches of readily available databases could have unearthed their California drivers' licenses, car registrations and telephone listings.

    Thomas Pickard, acting FBI Director at the time this search is made, will later falsely claim in public testimony before the 9/11 Commission that the FBI was not allowed to search the ChoicePoint database before 9/11.

    Source: US Department of Justice, 11/2004; New York Observer, 11/28/2004; 9/11 Commission, 7/24/2004, pp. 539

    Talk about a whole lotta bullshit. The names were never in the database, were they and they weren't there for a reason. So 9/11 commission and ChoicePoint cover it up.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 03:00 AM
    Response to Reply #35
    37. and there is no accountability
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 03:02 AM by mirandapriestly
    for the 911 commission.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    hang a left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 11:43 PM
    Response to Reply #29
    111. I have to give a big shout out to both DrDre and mirapriestly for this
    research. I applaud your efforts. Sadly, it reinforces how futile it is to fight this octopus. What evil. Dark dark forces. Who can save us? I think they want us to know.

    Why are they monitoring our internet usage, our phone calls and emails. The books we buy or check out. Where we drive down the street. Who visits our homes. They know (or can find out) anything about us they want to know.

    While nothing is more fascinating to me than 9-11 research. It is like they knew the curious would look. They knew the curious would find out. And they knew, once we dug real deep, we would be crapping our pants, knowing that there was nothing we could do.

    I always peruse this forum. I don't post. I always read. I just had to comment on your post.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 01:15 AM
    Response to Reply #111
    112. They're monitoring us so that
    when they pull off the next job they will be able to put people like me into those prisons they're building.
    I get the feeling they want us to know too, so that we know that we are powerless over them.
    9-11 made a few people extremely rich(er) and a few people extremely powerful. And guess what , it wasn't "al Qaeda".
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 03:04 AM
    Response to Reply #111
    114. You can't stop it, but knowledge scares them
    Preventing this or holding the guilty responsible is something which is not likely to happen. The immense propaganda efforts in the media make it clear that they want to keep the masses dumb and ignorant. The main change since 9/11 is that the group of people who have looked beyond the veils of deceipts has increased immensely and other projects like 7/7 where immediately greeted with a great amound of sceptism.

    There are many people - even on this board - who think that JFK is not more or less solved, but it has been solved suffiently already. There are many more who think that 9/11 is not more or less solved, but I consider it solved even though it's not perfect, the overall concept is clear.

    It used to be more government agency based and nowadays they have hidden themselves in corporations as their main outlet. Most people knew about the Bush family cartel and the Greenberg family cartel was not that obvious. Not anymore, the Greenberg family cartel has been identified as partners behind the scenes.

    They knew that people would look, but most who looked spend a lot time arguing over physical evidence and that was the original plan to keep the curious entertained. Hardly anybody used the direct evidence like the inside trading and it seems it immediately resulted in a much clearer picture.

    But stopping them is not very likely. Henry K. at age 76 still couldn't resist to add another crime against humanity to his endless list. The positive thing is that he will not be remembered as the great statesman, but as one of the human rats. The same to the Bushes and the same for the Greenbergs, Bremers etc. And maybe it prevent Rudy from his dream of president...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 01:19 AM
    Response to Reply #26
    30. It's literally all connected
    When people talk about the impossibility of conspiracies because they would involve too many people, it's ridiculous, because it's all the same people with different names.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 01:32 AM
    Response to Reply #30
    32. It's the same bunch
    Greenberg-Traurig also started the Waymark Group who financed the Oklahoma City Bombing. We already seen that 9/11 is the same script and contains the same players as Iran-Contra.

    They function as a shadow government. It's a mix of intelligence community, semi-legitimate corporations and corrupt politicians. The reason why they can keep it secret is very simple. They have so much dirt on each other that nobody dares to break the silence.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 03:27 AM
    Response to Reply #32
    59. It's a mix...
    Certainly it is, but i think it is inaccurate to say that part of it is "the intelligence community". After all John O'Neil (and several other 'good guys') also were/are part of the intel community, but are not part of a shadow govt. Not that i think that you think he was...

    I'd say it's a criminal network that extends throughout government, corporations (including financial institutions), the intel community, and segments of the 'traditional' criminal community.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-01-06 11:14 PM
    Response to Original message
    28. Deleted message
    Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 03:04 AM
    Response to Reply #28
    38. Know your BFEE: Homeland Czar & Petro-Turd Bernie Kerik
    by Octafish

    Not to belabor the point, this guy is little more than a shill for the Rudy the Wife-swapping Turd Giuliani and the Bush Organized Crime Family, Saudi Division. Campaigning for the drunken coke-whore AWOL psychotic moron, Kerrick had the cheek to say if Kerry were elected, Osama would strike again.

    How interesting. Does he know something we don't know? How many dots did Smirko miss? Well, the Bushes and the bin Ladens have been business partners for years. Hey, Kerrick! Buy a clue, uh? -- before it's too late for Metropolis.

    The following article from Newsday, which should know a bum when they see one, says this turd was in over his bald head as a narc and police commissioner of Gotham. It also spells out areas of interest where he and the BFEE can make money in the future -- Carlyle, Trireme Partnerships and whatever else the Big Money War Boys have going. So, as head of Homeland Security, we can be certain he won't mind doing whatever he's ordered to do by satan's monkey.

    Kerik nomination is a ticking time bomb
    Ellis Henican
    December 3, 2004

    Campaign bodyguard to Rudy Giuliani.

    Errand boy for the Saudi royal family.

    Energetic exploiter of Sept. 11th tragedy.

    Tough-talking publicity-hound vowing to bring law and order to Iraq - then hightailing it out of there after a disastrous 14 weeks, leaving the place far less safe than he found it.

    Oh, the bullet points on Bernie Kerik's real-life resume just go on and on. But is this really the guy we want standing between us and the terrorists?


    Much more at:
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 11:56 AM
    Response to Reply #38
    47. He reminds me exactly
    of a Mafia thug. Interesting that he worked in Saudi Arabia. I read somewhere that Hitler also hired people from positions such as "bodyguard" for high government jobs, like bushler tried to do
    Did you ever see the video of Giuliani at a press conference and when he can't remember something Kerik whispers it out of the side of his mouth..
    Underneath all the lies, they're all just a bunch of heavy crime types.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 12:33 PM
    Response to Reply #47
    48. Power corrupts... absolute power corrupts absolutely
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 12:36 PM by DrDebug
    Loyalty is the most important aspect and bodyguards are extremely loyal to their bosses, because that's inherent with their job. Capabilities are not that important, because you don't want to know too much. You need a couple like Cheney who know everything, but it's not important.

    Hitler had three very big guys, Goebbels, Goering and Rommel who ran their own kingdom and they weren't loyal at all. Bush is the same, because he does want to know details, because what you don't know, you don't know, so he wants loyal people and not more Cheneys, Perles and Jebs who run their own kingdom.

    Milosevic was probably much like Cheney. It was clear during his case. It was very sad that very little was made public, because Milosevic was fascinating in a weird sense. He kept on going until he scored a point and was proven right and then he sat back and smiled and wanted to move on and didn't even care whether it was relevant. He knew every single detail and had a brilliant (evil) mind.

    Bush on the other hand is more the Hitler type, he has big ideas, but he doesn't want to know details and wants loyalty instead. He probably has a similar temperament with sudden outbursts of anger. They try to conceal it but sometimes it shows.

    Rudi and his goons are thugs. I'm sure that he was in London for a reason as well. He didn't just happen to be there. So he must fit in this story somewhere as well and probably high up, because they needed him to do London as well.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 08:42 AM
    Response to Reply #28
    43. Let's work towards Rudy. We've looked at WTC1 and 2. WTC7:Rudy's bunker
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 08:47 AM by DrDebug

    The amazing fire which caused WTC 7 to be pulled.
    The Secrecy-Shrouded Building Holding Giuliani's Command Center

    Building 7 was the dark flat-topped 47-story skyscraper immediately north of the World Trade Center super-block, across Vesey Street. Its designation as 7 World Trade Center is somewhat misleading: whereas WTC 1 through 6 surrounded the WTC plaza and were completed in the 1970s, Building 7 was 300 feet from the plaza and its construction did not begun until 1985. (1) It was of an entirely different architectural style than the other six buildings. It was completely destroyed late in the afternoon on September 11th. (2)

    Emergency Command Center

    The 23rd floor of Building 7 had received 15 million dollars' worth of renovations to create an emergency command center for then-Mayor Rudolf Giuliani. The features of the command center include:

  • Bullet- and bomb-resistant windows
  • An independent, secure air and water supply
  • The ability to withstand winds of 200 mph

    These renovations were applied only to the 23rd floor. (3, 4) The command-center bunker was the the subject of much ridicule when it was created. (5)

    Documents and Command Center Destroyed

    At the time of its destruction, Building 7 housed documents relating to numerous SEC investigations. The files for approximately three to four thousand cases were destroyed, according to the Los Angeles Times. Among the destroyed documents were ones that may have demonstrated the relationship between Citigroup and the WorldCom bankruptcy. (6)

    Compiled from:

    Interesting tenants:
    The building has many interesting tenants like Secret Service and the CIA, however those tenants are black box. Other candidates: (8)

  • Salomon Smith Barney: part of Citigroup, inside trader and they also stored the evidence with regards to WorldCom.
  • Standard Chartered Bank: Moussaoui incident. (7)
  • Office of Emergency Management: See above
  • American Express Bank International: Inside trader.
  • ITT Hartford Insurance Group: Name sounds familiar... Kissinger... Chile... John McCone... $1 million... I'll think I'll add a reply to Henry K. as a reminder...

    Well even though we do not focus that much on physical evidence in these threads.

    "Amazing, incredible pick your word. For the third time today, its reminiscent of those pictures weve all seen too much on television before, where a building was deliberately destroyed by well placed dynamite to knock it down." (9)

    5. Divided We Stand, Basic Books, 1990, page 151
    9. Dan Rather, CBS News, September 11, 2001 +/- 5:30pm EST
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 01:17 AM
    Response to Reply #43
    80. Deleted message
    Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 01:20 AM
    Response to Reply #43
    81. Rudy Foreknowledge & Anti-Rudy Article
    His temporary headquarters were in a back office of Merrill Lynch.
    "Foreknowledge of the Collapse: One more possibly relevant fact is that then Mayor Rudy Giuliani, talking on ABC News about his temporary emergency command center at 75 Barkley Street, said:
    We were operating out of there when we were told that the World Trade Center was gonna collapse, and it did collapse before we could get out of the building.<59>
    For Giulianis complete statement, see Who told Giuliani the WTC Was Going to Collapse on 9/11?, What Really Happened, n.d. it can be heard at

    (But he DID NOT mention knowing they were going to come down at the Moussaouii trial.)

    "Mayor Giuliani -- a former federal prosecutor who won notice for 'pursuing' the Mafia -- had relatives linked to organized crime, including a mobbed-up cousin who was gunned down by FBI agents in 1977, a new book says. Lewis D'Avanzo, a son of the mayor's uncle and a guest at Giuliani's first wedding in 1968, was a 'ruthless and widely feared mob associate' who headed a massive stolen car ring, according to FBI documents and interviews detailed in Rudy! An Investigative Biography of Rudolph Giuliani, by Village Voice senior editor Wayne Barrett....

    . . . The book sketches a largely unflattering portrait of the clan, depicting his father, Harold, as a hothead and the "muscle" behind a brother-in-law's loansharking operation, run out of a Brooklyn bar. Along with cracking heads, it says the mayor's father served time in state prison for a stickup, rarely held an on-the-books job and once was a gunman in a mob shootout in Brighton Beach, Brooklyn....

    ...According to the book, Giuliani's cousin Lewis D'Avanzo was known as Steve the Blond and listed as armed and dangerous in FBI bulletins. His criminal record included a 10-year federal sentence for the armed hijacking of a truck loaded with $240,000 worth of mercury. The book alleges that he was suspected of taking part in several murders. D'Avanzo was gunned down by the FBI in October 1977, when he tried to run down an agent after being stopped on a warrant that accused him and two associates of transporting 100 stolen luxury cars."...

    ..."Leo D'Avanzo, who was known in family circles as a black sheep, ran loansharking and gambling operations out of a Brooklyn bar where Giuliani's father worked as a bartender. In his role as debt collector, his father 'broke legs, smashed kneecaps, crunched noses . . ." And so on and on
    Youve come a long way Rudy to World Hero. Or have you? Remember that slip of the tongue from Tom Kenney of FEMAs National Urban Search and Rescue Team, telling Dan Rather of CBS News that FEMA had arrived in New York on the night of September 10, 2001 (what a coincidence). And you, Rudy, were supposed to use this as your command post on 9/11/2001, after you were to evacuate WTC 7.
    And there you were at the trial, telling the people to listen to the tapes of dying people in the Towers, when it was your crew that told those people to stay in the buildings. Why didnt you tell the courtroom like you did Peter Jennings that WTC 7 was going to fall, or even that Towers 1 and 2 were going to fall? You could hear the detonations going off from both buildings. You knew all this and ran around like Captain Video with his Video Rangers, and never said a word.

    And those tapes from the planes. Theyre baloney. More CIA productions like the Osama tapes. First of all cell phones didnt work then from nearly seven miles up. Its a scientific fact. It wasnt till 2004 that American Airlines spent millions to install cell towers in the nosecones of their planes so that cell phone calls could be made. And the ones being played are fakes, cruel jokes. Is that why the public is not allowed to hear them?

    Kristen Breitweiser on Rudy:
    ..." just listen to what this 9/11 widow, Kristen Breitweiser, posted under Giulianis Deadly Impact? at on Wednesday.

    Can someone please explain to me why Rudy Giuliani gets to give a victim's impact statement at the Moussaoui penalty phase hearing? Which family member did Guiliani lose in the attacks?

    Forgive me, but Giuliani is the person responsible for deciding to locate NYC's emergency command center in the World Trade Center along with a diesel fuel tank (against the advice of certain FDNY officials) before 9/11."

    she goes on to describe how this decision to put a command center in a "terrorist" target caused calamity because because commuications were terrible & was no central command because of course when the target was hit it would be useless. So you don't put a command center in a target

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 02:36 AM
    Response to Reply #81
    82. Moderator
    the above article mentions "What really happened", but it is not from that web site, and it is not a link. I can not edit it it's been up too long.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 05:19 AM
    Response to Reply #43
    89. Kerik Started Police Force In Iraq.
    Edited on Tue Jul-04-06 05:24 AM by mirandapriestly
    "Within days, the Daily News published the results of a six-month investigation finding Kerik failed to report thousands of dollars in gifts, became entangled with a company long suspected of mob ties and had carried on two simultaneous extramarital affairs in a secret apartment near Ground Zero.

    This week, The News ran the content of E-mails Kerik sent to a friend in 1999 that suggest he was willing to divulge confidential details of a city investigation to the subject of the probe, Interstate Industrial of Clifton, N.J.

    The paper's hard look at Kerik flowed from previous News investigations that led to the arrest of two high-ranking officials promoted by Kerik when he headed the city Correction Department.

    Giuliani's firm announced yesterday that Giuliani-Kerik, an affiliate of Giuliani Partners, had been renamed Giuliani Security & Safety. Daniel Connolly, special counsel to the city Law Department under Giuliani, was named acting chairman and CEO.

    Giuliani said he is not angry at Kerik, adding that he hopes people will remember that Kerik risked his life as a cop and in starting a police force in Iraq.

    "He put his life at risk to protect them," Giuliani said.

    He stood before a judge in state Supreme Court in the Bronx and admitted to having illegally accepted $165,000 in free renovations from a contractor with alleged links to the mob while he was the city correction commissioner.

    Kerik also admitted making calls on behalf of the city contractor, Interstate Industrial, even as the company was under investigation by city, state and federal authorities.

    "I admit that I took a gift from Interstate Companies or a subsidiary, and thinking they were clean, I spoke to city officials about Interstate on two occasions," Kerik said before Judge John Collins during the 10-minute proceeding.

    The second charge involved Kerik failing to report a $28,000 loan from Nathan Berman, a prominent real estate developer - money that authorities said Kerik used to help buy the apartment."

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 05:30 AM
    Response to Reply #89
    91. And they've renamed the company again...
    These threads are filled with sudden name changes after some sort of scandal...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 11:13 PM
    Response to Reply #91
    110. Yes! I've noticed that
    now the company is for "safety and security".
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 03:42 AM
    Response to Original message
    39. Henry Kissinger, Butcher of Cambodia
    Let's start with some 9/11 links discover upto now:
    Henry K. -> American International Group
    Henry K. -> Marsh
    Henry K. -> Marsh Crisis Consultancy
    Henry K. -> Paul Bremer (former CEO of Henry and Associates)
    Henry K. -> Adnan Khashoggi
    Henry K. -> Enron
    Henry K. -> Blackstone Group
    Henry K. -> Peter J. Peterson
    Henry K. -> CFR
    Henry K. -> Greenberg-Traurig
    George W. Bush wanted to add Henry K. -> 9/11 Commission as well


    Henry Alfred Kissinger, (born May 27, 1923), butcher of Cambodia, former United States Secretary of State in the Nixon and Ford Administrations who played a dominant role in foreign affairs between 1969 and 1977.

    Kissinger played a role in the September 11, 1973, coup by Augusto Pinochet against the government of Chilean President Salvador Allende.

    In December 1975, Kissinger and Ford met with President Suharto of Indonesia; on that occasion they gave their approval for his invasion of East Timor, which led to the massacre of 200,000 Timorese.

    He continued to participate in secret lobby groups such as the Trilateral Commission and the Bilderberg and to do political consulting, speaking, and writing. The Who Killed John O'Neill investigation names Henry Kissinger over and over again as deeply involved with the 9/11 attack. Nevertheless President George W. Bush in 2002 wanted to appoint Kissinger to chair a committee to investigate the events of the September 11 attacks.

    Kissinger was sadly rewarded the Nobel Peace Prize for his efforts in the peace negotiation in Vietnam. His war crimes were sadly overlooked, because the number of deaths Kissinger was responsible for is enormous.

    Kissinger and War Crimes

    The February and March 2001 issues of Harper's Magazine featured a two-part series of articles by British journalist Christopher Hitchens on the case for charging Kissinger with war crimes

    Kissinger and War Crimes

    Aliases: Henry Alfred Kissinger, Heinz Alfred Kissinger, Butcher of Cambodia Age: 80+ Sex: Male Build: Heavy Race: White

    In the minutes of a secret 1975 meeting of the National Security Council attended by President Ford reveal Henry Kissinger grumbling, "It is an act of insanity and national humiliation to have a law prohibiting the President from ordering assassination." - Lost Crusader: The Secret Wars of CIA Director William Colby, by John Prados, Oxford University Press, 2003

    The February and March 2001 issues of Harper's Magazine feature a series by Christopher Hitchens on the case for charging Kissinger with War Crimes. Part I: The making of a war criminal Part 2 will feature an extensive section on East Timor.

    Christopher Hitchens' Trial of Henry Kissinger: A Review By Mike McGlothlin ... ( )

    Hitchens presents a rather straightforward argument that establishes two seemingly undeniable propositions: on at least one occasion, Henry K. conspired to commit murder, and that on numerous other occasions, Henry K. was the primary force behind certain acts that could quite plausibly be considered war crimes. The case for Henry K. as murder conspirator is what Hitchens calls a "lay-down" case, i.e., one that stands out for its clear facts and clear law.

    The murder victim is General Rene Schneider, who was the Commander in Chief of the Chilean Army, whom Hitchens misidentifies as the Chilean "Chief of Staff."; According to Hitchens (and the 09 September, 1970 minutes of the "40" Committee, the Kissinger chaired secret panel that oversaw U.S. covert operations), the Chilean military had a strong tradition of neutrality in political affairs, a rarity on the South American continent. General Schneider was known as an officer committed to upholding the Chilean constitution and therefore opposed to the rumored incipient coup against newly elected Socialist President Salvador Allende by a right wing would- be junta of current and former Chilean military officers. Using U.S. Government communications cables from the CIA and documents from the State Department, and White House, Hitchens relates the facts of Kissinger's direct involvement in the direction, planning, financing, and general support by the organs of the U.S. Government in the plot to remove General Schneider.

    LA Weekly: WLS Review: Henry: Portrait of a Serial Kissinger ( )

    The Case Against Kissinger

    The Case Against Henry Kissinger
    By Christopher Hitchens

    Here is the secret in plain words. In the fall of 1968, Richard Nixon and some of his emissaries and underlings set out to sabotage the Paris peace negotiations on Vietnam. The means they chose were simple: they privately assured the South Vietnamese military rulers that an incoming Republican regime would offer them a better deal than would a Democratic one.

    In this way, they undercut both the talks themselves and the electoral strategy of Vice President Hubert Humphrey. The tactic "worked," in that the South Vietnamese junta withdrew from the talks on the eve of the election, thereby destroying the peace initiative on which the Democrats had based their campaign.

    In another way, it did not "work," because four years later the Nixon Administration tried to conclude the war on the same terms that had been on offer in Paris. The reason for the dead silence that still surrounds the question is that in those intervening years some 20,000 Americans and an uncalculated number of Vietnamese, Cambodians, and Laotians lost their lives. Lost them, that is to say, even more pointlessly than had those slain up to that point. The impact of those four years on Indochinese society, and on American democracy, is beyond computation. The chief beneficiary of the covert action, and of the subsequent slaughter, was Henry Kissinger.


    The Kissinger Videos

    Very much recommended!

    Wilfried Huismann - The Kissinger File

    Pinochet barely got away with it. Milosevic was not so fortunate. He was arrested and then extradited to the War Crimes Tribunal at the Hague. Both one time heads of state stand accused of Crimes Against Humanity - both were dictators. Henry Kissinger, however, could be the first representative of a democratic country to stand before the Hague high court.

    Video at:

    BBC Four - The Trials of Henry Kissinger

    Assassination, secret bombings and massacre. War crimes committed by Kissinger.

    Video at:

    Henry K. scandal overview: (not complete...)
  • 9/11
  • AIG
  • Salvador Allende
  • Argentina
  • Bank of Credit and Commerce International
  • Bilderberg Group
  • Bohemian Grove
  • Chile
  • Council on Foreign Relations
  • Cyprus coup
  • Election fraud 2000
  • Election fraud 2004
  • Al Haig
  • Lavoro Bank
  • Mack McLarty
  • J.P. Morgan and Co
  • Operation Condor
  • Operation Jennifer
  • Richard Perle
  • Augusto Pinochet
  • Trilateral Commission
  • Unocal
  • Watergate

    External links:
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 07:06 AM
    Response to Reply #39
    40. Kissinger Commission
    It is very useful to read the first paragraphs in the link as well since it clearly explains the Philip Zelikow/ Condoleeza Rice/ Kean Commission as well who later became known as the 9/11 Omission.


    The Kissinger Commission

    "When we first envisioned this commission, we did not envision it made up of ex-senators and ex-Navy secretaries and all of this other stuff," says Beverly Eckert of the Family Steering Committee. "We thought it should be professors and writers, scholars and also people who are involved in the news, but not necessarily a part of it. These people are all a part of it. In many ways the government is part of the problem."

    By a hair's breadth, what we know now as the Kean Commission almost went down in history as the "Kissinger Commission." Soon after assenting to an independent investigation, George W. Bush kicked it off in Nov. 2002 by appointing Henry Kissinger to chair the panel.

    Two weeks later, Kissinger declined the appointment. The families and a few of the legislators designing the commission had asked him to rule out possible conflicts of interest involving his consulting firm, Kissinger Associates. Kissinger refused to name his clients, even confidentially. In a letter to Bush, he opined that service to country would ruin his business.

    During the two weeks of Kissinger's appointment, the Internet and alternative press buzzed at the thought of a 9/11 investigation headed by Richard Nixon's former secretary of state, a known practitioner of the strategic lie. Kissinger remains an elder adviser to many of the key people in the administration and U.S. defense establishment, especially the neoconservative group at the Pentagon under Donald Rumsfeld. He is under investigation in several countries for alleged involvement in Nixon-era crimes against humanity in Chile, Indochina and elsewhere. During a Paris hotel stay in 2001, he received a surprise visit for questioning by a French magistrate, and had to quietly slip out of the country.

    The failed Kissinger appointment was a global public relations disaster, but perhaps the administration felt it needed a cover-up artist of his caliber. Soon after his departure, the job of heading the 9/11 Commission went to Kean, a less controversial figure who was more willing to reveal his business connections. One of these is worthy of a brief detour.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 09:17 AM
    Response to Reply #39
    44. The other 9/11: Henry K., Salvador Allende and ITT
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 09:25 AM by DrDebug
    Early in 1970, Salvador Allende Gossens was chosen as the Popular Unity's presidential candidate. The Clarin disclosed on July 14th that CIA agents had expressly been sent to Chile because of the impending elections. On September 4, 1970 Allende won the elections. (1)

    The foreign press noted the immediate impact of giving the Western world its first democratically chosen Marxist president: "This election must have been a shock to foreign investors in Chile, mainly for the mining companies owned by the Americans... Allende is ready to install a revolutionary government to end the dominion of native and foreign capital." (1)

    The failed election gambit was known as "track one". On Sept. 13, 1970, Richard Nixon authorized "track two" intervention - which permitted milder involvement - in Chile, paving the way for the CIA to intervene in the economic and political affairs of Chile in whatever way they deemed necessary. (7)

    By November 4, 1971 the state had come to control 90% of what had previously been private banking. More than 70 strategic or monopolistic enterprises had been expropriated, nationalized, or subjected to state intervention. Under the agrarian reform, 2.4 million hectares had been taken over in order to settle landless farmers and make the land more productive. The indigenous people of Chile had benefited. The government financed a plan providing free milk to children. The industrial workers had increased output by 14 percent in the course of that first year. In September of 1970, the Chilean unemployment rate had stood by 8.4 percent; by September of 1971, it had dropped to 4.8 percent. (2)

    Ren Schneider
    Kissinger tried to prevent Allende for being inaugurated by ordering the assassination of General Ren Schneider, who was the Commander in Chief of the Chilean Army. The most significant obstacle to eliminating Allende was General Schneider, for the obvious reason that he controlled the military forces to a more significant degree than the smaller and more reactionary branch of right-wing military plotters. Therefore, General Schneider had to be removed. (3)

    Kissinger went to great lengths to distance himself from the assassination. October 16, 1970, according to CIA Operating Guidance Cable on Coup Plotting, a secret cable, Thomas Karamessines, conveys Kissinger's orders to CIA station chief in Santiago, Henry Hecksher: "It is firm and continuing policy that Allende be overthrown by a coup." The "operating guidance" makes it clear that these operations are to be conducted so as to hide the "American hand," and that the CIA is to ignore any orders to the contrary from Ambassador Korry who has not been informed of Track II operations. (4)

    Former CIA director John McCone acting for International Telephone & Telegraph (ITT) offered Henry Kissinger and CIA director Richard Helms $1 million to overthrow Salvador Allende which the CIA allegedly refused but paid $350,000 to his political opponents with CIA assistance. This included implementing ITT dirty tricks campaign in Chile. (8)

    Because of International Telephone & Telegraph (ITT)'s economic position in Chile, the CIA used the company to filter money to Allende opposition campaigns, including large sums of money for the right-wing opposition newspaper, El Mercurio. (8)

    Sections of the Chilean navy seized the port city of Valparaso at around six in the morning on September 11, 1973. Hearing of the troop movements, Salvador Allende called his Orlando Letelier, and asked him to investigate. After the minister confirmed the reports, Allende went to La Moneda, the Presidential palace, while Letelier proceded to the Ministry of Defense and became the first member of Allende's cabinet to be placed under arrest. (5)

    The military coup was supported by the CIA and led by General Augusto Pinochet. With the military in revolt, Allende retreated with his supporters to the presidential palace in Santiago, which was surrounded by tanks and infantry and bombed by air force jets. Allende survived the aerial attack but then allegedly shot himself (9) to death as troops stormed the burning palace. General Augusto Pinochet ruled Chile with an iron fist for the next 17 years. (6)

    1. Peter Kornbluh, The Chile Coup - The U.S. Hand, October 25, 1998 ( )
    5. Peter Kornbluh, Chile: Declassified ( )
    9. One of those things which doesn't make sense.

    Video at:

    El pueblo debe defenderse, pero no sacrificarse. El pueblo no debe dejarse arrasar ni acribillar, pero tampoco puede humillarse.

    The people ought to defend themselves, but not sacrifice themselves. The people ought not let themselves be subdued or persecuted, but neither should they humble themselves.

    - Salvador Allende, Santiago de Chile, 11 September 1973, 9:10 A.M.'s_Last_Speech_(English_translation)
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 10:06 PM
    Response to Reply #44
    78. I've read about Pinochet
    and the mass slaughter of peasants, courtesy of the USA. The irony is the criminal Kissinger was going to head up the 911 Commission, not that it turned out much better. I didn't know that happened to Allende on September 11 and I didn't know about the US involvement. I read his daughter's books, how can she stand to live here?
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 03:10 AM
    Response to Reply #78
    83. Peter Kornbluh documented it all in Chile Declassified
    And the Allende story is an extremely complete and detailed documentation about what happened and it was mainly Henry Kissinger behind the scenes and most of Congress didn't know anything about it.

    It was very deceiptful. The Rene Schneider affair was partially blamed on the ambassador who didn't know anything about it.

    The Pinochet File
    A Declassified Dossier on Atrocity and Accountability
    by Peter Kornbluh

    White House Audio Tape, President Richard M. Nixon and White House press secretary Ron Zeigler, March 23, 1972

    In this White House tape, President Nixon is recorded on March 23, 1972, speaking by phone to his White House press secretary, Ron Zeigler about damage control efforts on the first major covert operations scandal of the 1970s-the ITT papers on Chile. Zeigler reports on a State Department press conference held earlier in the afternoon.

    He tells the president that the key issue was an ITT memo that stated that in the fall of 1970, U.S. Ambassador Edward Korry had received a "green light" from the White House to "do everything short of a Dominican Republic-type action" to stop Allende.

    Nixon demands to know how that leaked out, and then emphatically states that Korry "was instructed" to do that. The President then scapegoats the Ambassador for failing to carry out those instructions. Numerous declassified records make it clear that Nixon and Kissinger explicitly ordered the CIA not to inform Ambassador Korry of their efforts to instigate a military coup to keep Allende from assuming office.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 08:10 AM
    Response to Original message
    42. Raytheon Company
    Raytheon Company is the fifth largest defence manufacturer in the world (1). The company has four business areas: Missile Defense (4); Intelligence, Surveillance and Reconnaissance; Precision Engagement; and Homeland Security. It is most famous for missiles - as Raytheon says, its "range of weapon systems needs little introduction. The company is a global leader in the development and deployment of advanced technology missile systems and air combat and strike systems" (2). Products include the AIM-9 Sidewinder air-air missile, the AIM-120 AMRAAM air-air missile and the Tomahawk Block IIIC Cruise Missile. (3)

    John Mark Deutch is on their board of directors (7, 8)

    Raytheon Company had an office on the 91st floor of WTC2, above the impact area, yet suffered no casualties. It did have four passengers in the airplanes which alledgely struck the buildings. Raytheon was also listed as one of the 9/11 inside traders.

    Parenthetically, Raytheon had also been hit with millions of dollars in fines for padding costs of equipment it sold to the US military. Raytheon also has a hush-hush subsidiary, E-Systems, whose clients include the CIA and NSA, the latter about to make a hostile takeover of the other. (5)

    The company's seven businesses include:
  • Integrated Defense Systems
  • Intelligence & Information Systems
  • Missile Systems
  • Network Centric Systems
  • Space & Airborne Systems
  • Raytheon Technical Services Company
  • Homeland Security (6)

    4. May the Pentagon can use that
    7. That DCI dude that screwed up so Poppy had to take over
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 12:39 PM
    Response to Reply #42
    49. Raytheon
    Something else I wanted to look at. Plane passengers also worked there - coincidence. I'm going hiking on Whidbey island, but I want to get back to this later.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 07:26 AM
    Response to Reply #49
    97. I think it was Flight 77
    That had 7 or 8 people listed on the flight who worked for Raytheon.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 08:16 PM
    Response to Reply #97
    107. Here they are
    Edited on Tue Jul-04-06 08:18 PM by mirandapriestly
    One of the Raytheon guys, I remember reading where his wife said that he had been very upset about something the night before he left. Also, there is a link to Killtown which lists the "unusual" passengers on board 77. One of them is a navy physicist and I was reading that his family did not even know he was on that flight, also that he had been very secretive about his job (which is not unusual, just the nature of his job, but it raises questions) I remember thinking this physicist did not even have to have been on the plane , he could have been killed in the Pentagon and they just said he was on the plane (since his body would be found in the same place)

    "2001-09-11 Peter Gay Raytheon VP of Electronic Systems on special assignment at the El Segundo, CA division office where the Global Hawk UAV remote control system is made. Raytheon did the retrofit of the A-3 that hit the Pentagon, where Bush claimed Flight 77 hit it. Disappeared on American airlines Flight 11, the one that supposedly hit the North World Trade Tower I.

    2001-09-11 Kenneth Waldie Raytheon Senior Quality Control for Electronic Systems. Raytheon did the retrofit of the A-3 that hit the Pentagon, where Bush claimed Flight 77 hit it. Disappeared on American airlines Flight 11, the one that supposedly hit the North World Trade Tower I.

    2001-09-11 David Kovalcin Raytheon Senior Mechanical Engineer for Electronic Systems. Raytheon did the retrofit of the A-3 that hit the Pentagon, where Bush claimed Flight 77 hit it. Disappeared on American airlines Flight 11, the one that supposedly hit the North World Trade Tower I.

    2001-09-11 Herbert Homer Raytheon Corporate Executive working with the Department of Defense. Raytheon did the retrofit of the A-3 that hit the Pentagon, where Bush claimed Flight 77 hit it. Disappeared on United airlines Flight 175, the one that supposedly hit the South World Trade Tower II.

    .. Why would they be in Boston and those planes coming from that direction and from north of Manhattan Island "

    unusual passenger combination:

    I have to make a peach pie, be back in a few...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 08:46 PM
    Response to Reply #107
    108. Three times E-Systems as in that LTV Corporation below as well...
    Edited on Tue Jul-04-06 08:55 PM by DrDebug
    Enjoy your peach pie (LOL Just typed peace pie ;)

    Very good link:

  • Total passengers: 64
  • Passengers involved in govt/defense related work: 21
  • Senior staff/directors/managers: 18
  • Military backgrounds: 10
  • Navy background: 7
  • Executives/chief officers/presidents: 5
  • Men: 30
  • Women: 24
  • Kids: 5
  • Non-hijacker passengers: 59
  • Alleged Hijackers*: 5

    *Allegedly armed with only knifes and box cutters.

    Is it a just coincidence the most of the passengers on Flight 77 with military backgrounds were Navy and that the crash at the Pentagon happened in the Navy's command center which took the heaviest casualties?

    Why didn't the passengers of Flight 77 rise up against the alleged hijackers like we are told the passengers on Flight 93 did since they both knew the hijackers were going to kill them?

    Is it really believable that all but one of the 64 passengers on Flight 77 were recovered at the Pentagon when almost nothing of a plane was?

  • Edit: That's the advantage of writing things down. E-Systems was of course CIA/NSA (see post above ^)
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:56 AM
    Response to Reply #107
    133. Another suspicious one for flight 77

    Mari-Rae Sopper, they say she is a gymnastics teacher, but really she was a navy lieutenant, I saw she was a "JAG" on one site- why mislead? It looks like she was leaving that life and going on to a "new life". Now what does that sound like to you? This is what it said on the site devoted to her, a quote from her, apparently: "New Job New City New State New Life." Buried in arlington cemetery
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 04:25 PM
    Response to Reply #49
    124. Raytheon, Wellstone crash, electronic warfare
    All of the 9-11 victims on board 93 worked for the elctronic warfare or the electronics division, except one who worked with DoD

    2001-09-11 Stanley Hall Raytheon Director of Electronic warfare program management.
    2001-09-11 Peter Gay Raytheon VP of Electronic System
    2001-09-11 Kenneth Waldie Raytheon Senior Quality Control for Electronic Systems
    2001-09-11 David Kovalcin Raytheon Senior Mechanical Engineer for Electronic Systems
    2001-09-11 Herbert Homer Raytheon Corporate Executive working with the Department of Defense.

    Wellstone died aboard a Beechcraft King Air A-10. The death was not investigated and similarly to 9-11 the NTSB deferred to the FBI. The FBI also was there unusually soon, I've read, but I haven't looked into that in detail.
    There is a book by Jim fetzer which outlines the suspicious nature of Wellstone's death. We all know the political ramifications. Here are some of the points:

    ? NTSBs Carol Carmody handled the Wellstone case. A former CIA official,
    she is a damage-control expert who handled the NTSBs investigation of the
    suspicious aircraft crash of Missouri Governor Mel Carnahan during his race
    against Senator John Ashcroft two years earlier.

    ? NTSB is legally mandated to take jurisdiction over a crash scene, yet
    they let the FBI take control. Yet in its official report, the NTSB failed
    to even mention any role by the FBI. (sound familiar?)

    ? There was never any distress call from the pilots. There was a cessation
    of communication commensurate with loss of control.

    ? Some witnesses heard the engines cutting out, a phenomenon not consistent
    with a stall.

    ? Others reported odd cell-phone and garage-door phenomena that were taking
    place about the same time the plane lost communications and control.

    ? The NTSB's own simulations, which replicated the weather, the flight, and
    the plane under similar conditions, were unable to bring it down<-even when
    they were conducted at abnormally slow speeds!

    ? One of the members who actually signed the report, Richard Healing,
    admitted that the NTSB really had no idea what had caused the plane to

    Since becoming active in this issue, local residents have contacted Dr.
    Fetzer and related strange electronic interference in the area at the time
    of the crash. One experienced an odd cell-phone phenomenon with a form of
    static he had never heard before. Its auditory pattern appears to be similar
    to that of "electro-magnetic pulse" (EMP) weapons recently developed by the
    Pentagon to take out computerized systems and wreak harm on human targets.
    (listen to wtc vid at bottom)
    Reports of garage doors that mysteriously opened in the immediate vicinity
    are surfacing. And radar images from the time of the plane crashes of
    Senator Carnahan and of Senator Wellstone are suggestive of EMP imprints.
    These weapons could have disable its radio communications and caused at
    least a partial loss of control. But they can do even more damage to human
    beings by rendering them unconscious, incapable of muscle control, or
    bringing about their death.

    Another man on his way to the funeral,
    driving within a couple blocks of the airport at the time of the crash
    experienced otherworldly cell-phone interference. He reported hearing a
    sound "between a roar and loud humming voice...oscillating...screeching and
    humming noise."
    Most responsible for narrowing the authors' search for a cause was the blue
    smoke typical of electrical fires that streamed out of the King Air's
    sheared fuselage for hours after the crash.,+2005
    Known as Vigilant Eagle, the airfield-based directed electromagnetic
    energy system protects the flying public against the threat of surface-to-air
    missiles including MANPADS (Manportable Air Defense System).
    More on Wellstone plane crash:'electromagnetic%20pulse%20raytheon'
    unusual noises in this wtc 911 video:
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 05:07 PM
    Response to Reply #124
    125. I think that Aviation Charter a.k.a. Executive Aviation needs ...
    Edited on Wed Jul-05-06 05:23 PM by DrDebug

    ... a closer look as well, because one thing we have learned from al-Cokeda and the CIA Extraordinary renditions is that the drug planes were used for multiple purposes and they didn't seem to use a single airliners but had dozens of airlines who were used whenever they needed them.

    So is Aviation Charter a.k.a. Executive Aviation a dual function airline as well, like the Huffman Aviation. For example Southeast Airlines was in close proximity of Skyways as well and Southeast appears to have been a normal airline.

    The reason why I am asking that question is the story by Jim Fetzer because it also contained Zacharias Moussaoui who knew the co-pilot.

    The NTSB Failed Wellstone
    Ignored Evidence and Suppressed Investigations
    By Jim Fetzer and John Costella
    Special to From The Wilderness

    Senator Wellstone, who was a nervous flyer, insisted that either one other pilot or Conry be the Captain for his flights (1).Conry had flown him at least a dozen times (2), the most recently three days before the fatal flight.(2) The day after, just two days before the crash, he had passed his regular FAA flight check, flawlessly. (3)

    The co-pilot, Michael Guess, had trained to be a ground instructor for Northwest Airlines. The NTSB focuses on the fact that he essentially flunked out of this course, being unable to master quickly enough the advanced computer systems necessary to teach pilots how to fly the A320 Airbus. 98 ... Flying a King Air twin turbo-prop plane is far removed from the complexities of an Airbus. The witness reports indicate that he was a competent young co-pilot, building his experience and flight hours.(4)


    Guesss mother stated that he was in the Air National Guard in Duluth, and received a letter after Northwest did not allow him to attend drill duties. At the time of the NTSBs investigations, she had a lawyer investigating the incident in order to clear his name. (5) (...) Guess returned to the front-desk job that he had been previously performing at Northwest. By this time, however, the position had been transferred to Pan Am. (6)

    There Guess met Zacharias Moussaoui, an accused 9/11 terrorist co-conspirator. Guess reportedly inadvertently left a disk for a 747 jumbo jet simulator at a workstation, which was later found copied onto Moussaouis laptop computer. (7) At Aviation Charter, Guess had told colleagues that he was at least a role player in the detection of Moussaouithat he and a receptionist thought that what Moussaoui was requesting was unusual, and that he had raised the issue with others. (7) Sure to the trend, the NTSB did not mention Guesss connection to Moussaoui at all, and even went as far as suppressing the name of Pan Am from its Final Report, referring to it as another company located at the same training facility. (8)


    1. Public Docket: Attachments 1-27 to the Operational Factors Group Chairmans Factual Report, p. 123.
    2. Final Report, p. 10.
    3. ibid p. 11
    4. Again, the complete set of witness interview summaries should be considered; Public Docket: Attachment 1 to the Human Performance Specialists Factual Report,
    5. Public Docket: Attachment 1 to the Human Performance Specialists Factual Report, p. 44-45
    6. Public Docket: Attachment 1 to the Human Performance Specialists Factual Report, p. 35.
    7. Christopher Bollyn, Wellstone and 911: The Uncanny Connections, The American Free Press, Dec. 2, 2003;
    8. Final Report, p. 14.

    Excerpted from:

    If al-Qaeda is al-Cokeda then is it possible that Zacharias Moussaoui was a drug dealer as well working al-Cokeda. That increases the likelyhood that Michael Guess was more than a co-pilot.

    See also:
  • George W. Bush and James Bath
  • Alabama National Guards and Bay of Pigs
    Wings of Denial: The Alabama Air National Guard's Covert Role at the Bay of Pigs. by Warren Trest and Donald Dodd
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 05:39 PM
    Response to Reply #124
    126. Raytheon - Phantom Flight & SEC Trouble
    These don't seem related to one another , but I do notice that the accounting practices ended in 2001. Also, Raytheon & Hughes merged and Hughes was the owner or the building that housed the Airman Flight School in Oklahoma where Moussaoui and Atta visited.
    "The Phantom Flight from Florida"

    ..."Because the federal government says the flight never took place, the paper headlined it the "Phantom Flight from Florida." It carried a Saudi Arabian prince, the son of that nation's defense minister, as well as the son of a Saudi army commander, and it flew from Tampa to Lexington, Kentucky, where Saudi princes had been purchasing racehorses in Bluegrass Country.

    From there, they flew a private 747 out of the country. But if no one in the government would acknowledge what had happened, the two armed bodyguards hired to get their clients out of the state were only too happy to recall a trip they remembered vividly.

    The Tribs reporter said the story revealed "a glimpse of international intrigue in the aftermath of terrorist attacks on America."

    It also offers a glimpse of the privilege accorded these foreign Saudi nationals that was denied American citizens.

    "Everyones got deals with the Saudis," protested a Special Forces Commander at McDill AFB, where the Afghan war was run, when asked about the trip. "Why point a finger at this one incident?"

    Because, we told him, we suspected that the initial pilot training of Bin Ladens Air Force at the tiny Venice Florida airport was a CIA operation, one they would be loath to admit.
    Since the plane took off from a private hanger at Raytheon Airport Services in Tampa, we went there first... Raytheon is a major defense-intelligence industry player which spent the past decade expanding, purchasing notorious E-Systems and culminating with Raytheons merger with Hughes Electronics defense operations (Hughes Aircraft). "
    Former Raytheon Co. chairman and chief executive officer Daniel P. Burnham has agreed to settle charges by the Securities and Exchange that a unit of the company improperly accounted for losses in 2000 and 2001, according to Bloomberg
    The SEC inquiry as it relates to Burnham, states the First Data proxy, concerns "alleged improper disclosure and accounting in 2000 and 2001 for the deteriorating market for a line of aircraft manufactured by a Raytheon subsidiary."
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    MinM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-30-08 09:07 AM
    Response to Reply #124
    141. Alternet | Was Paul Wellstone Murdered?
    AlterNet: Was Paul Wellstone Murdered?
    Paul Wellstone was the only progressive in the U.S. Senate. Mother Jones magazine once described him as, "The first 1960s radical elected to the U.S. senate." He was also the last. Since defeating incumbent Republican Rudy Boschowitz 12 years ago in a grassroots upset, Wellstone emerged as the strongest, most persistent, most articulate and most vocal Senate opponent of the Bush administration.

    In a senate that is one heartbeat away from Republican control, Wellstone was more than just another Democrat. He was often the lone voice standing firm against the status-quo policies of both the Democrats and the Republicans. As such, he earned the special ire of the Bush administration and the Republican Party, who made Wellstone's defeat that party's number one priority this year.

    Various White House figures made numerous recent campaign stops in Minnesota to stump for the ailing campaign of Wellstone's Republican opponent, Norm Coleman. Despite being outspent and outgunned, however, polls show that Wellstone's popularity surged after he voted to oppose the Senate resolution authorizing George Bush to wage war in Iraq. He was pulling ahead of Coleman and moving toward a victory that would both be an embarrassment to the Bush administration and to Democratic Quislings such as Hillary Clinton who voted to support "the president."

    Then he died.

    Wellstone now joins the ranks of other American politicians who died in small plane crashes. Another recent victim was Missouri's former Democratic governor, Mel Carnahan, who lost his life in 2000, three weeks before Election Day, during his Senatorial race against John Ashcroft. Carnahan went on to become the first dead man to win a Senatorial race, humiliating and defeating the unpopular Ashcroft posthumously. Ashcroft, despite his unpopularity, went on to be appointed Attorney General by George W. Bush. Investigators determined that Carnahan's plane went down due to "poor visibility."

    Carnahan was the second Missouri politician to die in a small plane crash. The first was Democratic Representative Jerry Litton, whose plane crashed the night he won the Democratic nomination for senate in 1976. His Republican opponent ultimately captured the seat from his successor in November.

    While an article in the New York Times on Saturday pointed out the danger politicians face due to their heavy air travel schedules, the death of a senator or member of Congress is still relatively rare, with only one other sitting U.S. Senator, liberal Republican John Heinz, dying in a plane crash since World War II. Heinz, who entered office as an outspoken opponent of the Vietnam War, later emerged as a strong proponent of health care, social services, public transportation and the environment. He also urged reconciliation with Cuba. He died when the landing gear on his small plane failed to function, and a helicopter dispatched to survey the problem crashed into his plane.

    One former senator, John Tower, also died in a small plane crash. Tower was best known as the chair of the Tower Commission, which investigated the Reagan/Bush era Iran/Contra scandal.

    Another member of a prominent government commission who died in a small plane crash was former Democratic representative and House Majority Leader Hale Boggs. Boggs was best known as one of the seven members of the Warren Commission, which investigated the assassination of President John F. Kennedy. The commission found that Lee Harvey Oswald was acting alone when he killed the president. Boggs, it turns out, had "strong doubts" that Oswald acted alone, but went along with the commission findings. Later, in 1971 and 1972, he went public with his doubts. He was presumed dead after the small plane carrying him and Democratic Representative Nicholas Begich disappeared in 1972...

    Syriana's Stephen Gaghan (December 9, 2005) reports in this video that his research taught him not to trust 'Small Planes'.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 03:26 AM
    Response to Reply #42
    115. E-Systems & Radio Detonator
    (Dr. Steven Jones said that the thermite charge could have been detonated by a radio transmitter)
    In 1977, during the height of the ''dirty war'' in Argentina, E-Systems won a contract to supply ''Wheelbarrow'' systems -- a radio transmitter that detonates explosives by remote control -- to the Argentine police. In August 1990, E-Systems pleaded guilty to criminal charges of falsifying results on tactical field radios manufactured at its Florida factories. The company paid out almost $3 million in fines to settle the charges.
    In the early 1970s, E-Systems won the contract to install communication gear on Air Force One, the U.S. president's plane. This led to similar contracts for the heads of state of Iran, Israel, Nigeria, Malaysia, Romania and Saudi Arabia. E-Systems has since built the ''Doomsday Plane,'' an airborne command post for the Pentagon and the White House in the event of a nuclear attack.(more at link...)
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 03:49 AM
    Response to Reply #115
    116. Remote Controlled Detonation
    Edited on Wed Jul-05-06 03:53 AM by DrDebug
    So with e-Systems it would have been possible to - just a random example - sit in the OEM and remotely detonate the plane into WTC1. You probably have a good view on the buildings from there as well and then do the same for WTC2. Blow up WTC2 and WTC1 after all the information people like Rudy have left the scene and then quietly sneak out of WTC7 and then get rid off the evidence...

    Edit to add a random clipping from your link:

    One of Raytheon's more secretive subsidiaries is E-Systems, whose major clients have historically been the CIA and other spy agencies like the National Security Agency and the National Reconnaissance Office. An unnamed Congressional aide told the Washington Post once that the company was ''virtually indistinguishable'' from the agencies it serves. ''Congress will ask for a briefing from E- Systems and the (CIA) program manager shows up,'' the aide is quoted as saying. ''Sometimes he gives the briefing. They're interchangeable.''
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 11:27 AM
    Response to Original message
    45. (Salomon) Smith Barney and Sanford Weill
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 12:06 PM by DrDebug
    The Smith Barney story dates back to 19th century Philadelphia, where a young broker, Charles Barney, founded his firm in 1873 and a young investment banker, Edward B. Smith, started his in 1892. These pioneers of the American securities industry helped make Wall Street the world's financial capital. (2)

    In 1997 Smith Barney Holdings Inc., the brokerage arm of Travelers Group, is combined with Salomon Inc. to form Salomon Smith Barney Holdings Inc. by Sanford I. Weill who started out his career by working for Bear Stearns. (1) On October 8, 1998 the company becomes part of Citigroup Inc. (2)

    Seven World Trade Center originally served as the corporate headquarters of Salomon Brothers. (3). Other unrelated companies like the CIA, Secret Service and the Office of Emergency Management filled in the vacant extra floors.

    Salomon Smith Barney sometimes did some things with Kissinger McLarty Associates (4) and Donald H. Rumsfeld is chairman of the Salomon Smith Barney International Advisory Board (5)

    Citigroup, the mother company of Salomon Smith Barney, has been named as one of the pre-9/11 inside traders. So far, the only one person named was the result of a courtroom outburst of assistant U.S. attorney Kenneth Breen, who recently accused Amr Ibrahim Elgindy, an Egyptian-born stockbroker on trial in San Diego, with knowing in advance about 9-11 and capitalizing on the insider information by attempting to unload $300,000 worth of shares on Sept. 10, 2001. (6)

    In court Breen charged that on the afternoon of Sept. 10, Elgindy contacted his broker at Salomon Smith Barney and asked him to sell the stock, confiding in the broker that the Dow Jones industrial average, which at the time stood at about 9,600, would soon dive to below 3,000. (7)

    The destruction of 7 World Trade Center was officially oil tanks including two 6,000-gallon storage tanks owned by Salomon Smith Barney, and conduits beneath the building may have contained asbestos and feeder lines wrapped in a material containing toxins. (8)

    Biased research

    A major scandal was the accusation that Citigroup and other investment banks had struck secret deals with companies that said that the bank's stock research division would rate that company a "Buy" if it would do investment banking with that division. Implicated by that scandal was analyst Jack Grubman. This scandal led to some wondering if the financial services conglomerate concept would lead to conflicts of interest such as this. Citigroup eventually paid the largest fine in the "global settlement" with the state, resulting from conflicts of interest between research and investment banking at Salomon Smith Barney. (9)

    Citigroup decides to make Jack Grubman the fall guy (10) and renamed the company to Smith Barney. (11)

    Example: Global Crossing
    Global Crossing was brought public in 1998 by Smith Barney. The company, which aimed to lay global fiber-optic telecom cables, received frequent advising from Grubman. He advised Global Crossing on its purchase of Frontier Communications, its attempted takeover of US West, and its choice of Robert Annunziata as CEO. Grubman continued to publish ratings on Global Crossing stock, even though he was personally involved in the company. He has faced intense criticism and even lawsuits because he gave the company buy ratings, apparently out of a conflict of interest, through nearly the entire length of the its collapse. These buy ratings werent dropped until October of 2001. Shares were valued at one dollar by this time. Global Crossing declared bankruptcy in January of 2002. (12)

    Frontline also speaks with two former Salomon Smith Barney brokers, who describe in detail how their firm steered choice initial public offerings (IPOs) to telecom CEOs like WorldComs Ebbers far more frequently that was reported to Congress. By offering large blocks of IPO stock at the typically low, opening-day price even after the actual price had doubled, tripled, or quadrupled in trading these brokers say Salomon was essentially giving millions of dollars in free money to CEOs in exchange for their investment banking business. (13)

    And they did similar work for Enron, Level 3 Communication, Inc., WorldCom, XO Communications Group and many more. Luckily most of the evidence got destroyed when Seven World Trade Center was pulled by Larry Silverstein.

    More details at:

    Sanford Weill
    Sandy Weill (born March 16, 1933) is a banker, financier, formerly CEO and chairman of Citigroup. He served in those positions until October 1, 2003 and April 18, 2006 respectively. He is one of the richest men in the world.

    Sandford started working for Bear Stearns. In 1982 he sold his company to American Express and served as CEO of Fireman's Fund Insurance in 1984. He tried to become CEO of Bank of America. In 1992 he bought a 27 percent share Travelers Insurance and reacquired his old Shearson brokerage in 1993 and by the end of the year he managed to take over the entire Travelers Corp. Sandford then merged it with Citicorp and in 2001 he became Class A Director of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, however he had to resign in 2002 because of some scandals. (14)

    He also runs around in a tight circle with all the names of the OP. Isn't that funny WTC 7 was build by the guy who knew, owned or worked with most of the inside traders.

    13. The Wall Street Fix, PBS Frontline, May 8, 2003,
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 06:38 PM
    Response to Original message
    52. American Express
    Edited on Sun Jul-02-06 06:49 PM by DrDebug
    American Express is a diversified global financial services company, headquartered in New York City. The company is best known for its credit card, charge card and traveler's cheque businesses. American Express was founded in 1850 by Henry Wells, William Fargo, and John Butterfield as an express business. (1)

    The current CEO is Kenneth Chenault, who took over in April 2001. The company was led by Harvey Golub from 1993 to 2001 (1) who is a member of the American Enterprise Institute. (2) Henry Kissinger is advisor to the Board of Directors. (4)

    In 1984 they bought Lehman Brothers, Kuhn, Loeb Inc. who was then headed by Peter Peterson. Lehman Brothers regained its independence in 1994. (5)

    American Express had offices in both WTC3 and WTC7, however it seems that there were also people working in WTC1. They lost 11 employees. (7) American Express was listed as one of the pre-9/11 inside traders. (3)

    AIG, Citigroup, WTO
    During the Reagan and Poppy Bush administration, American Express, Gerald Ford, Citicorp and American International Group used to directly influence ministerial meetings until the Uruguay Round of negotiations started in 1986 (6) which ultimately spawned the World Trade Organization.

    2. Leading architects of the Bush administration's public policy
    6. Ahlberg, American Express, p. 456 ( )
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-02-06 08:26 PM
    Response to Original message
    53. Who connects to who thus far
    Ace ->
    American International Group, Evan Greenberg, Silverstein

    al-Cokeda ->
    American Internation Group, Fireman's Fund, Genesis Intermedia

    American Airlines / Axa SA ->
    AMR Corporation, Boeing

    American Express Corp ->
    American International Group, Blackstone Group, Citigroup, Henry Kissinger, Lehman Brothers

    American International Group ->
    al-Cokeda, Ace, Adnan Khashoggi, American Express Bank International, Axa SA, Bear Stearns, Blackstone Group, Bush family, CIA, Citigroup, Enron, Genesis Intermedia, Greenberg-Traurig, Henry Kissinger, Kroll, Marsh & McLennan, Maurice Greenberg, Silverstream, UNOCAL, XL Insurance, Zolfo-Cooper LLC

    Bank of America Corp ->
    CIA, Enron, Keefe, Bruyette & Woods, Inc., Sanford Weill

    Bear Stearns ->
    Alan Greenberg, American International Group, Bush family, Cheney family, Citigroup, Clear Channel, Enron, Harken, Texas Rangers, Maurice Greenberg, Sanford I. Weill, Tri-Lateral Investment Group

    Blackstone Group ->
    American Express Corp, American International Group, Henry Kissinger, Lehman Brothers Holdings, Silverstein

    Boeing ->
    American Airlines, AMR Corporation, Northwest Airlines, Southwest Airlines, United Airlines, US Airlines

    Bush family ->
    American International Group, Bear Stearns, Enron, Greenberg-Traurig, Henry Kissinger

    Cheney family ->
    Bear Stearns

    Citigroup / Salomon Smith Barney ->
    American Express Corp, American International Group, Bank of New York, Bear Stearns, CIA, Donald Rumsfeld, Enron, Fuji Bank, Global Crossing, Henry Kissinger, Kroll, Lehman Brothers / Kuhn, Loeb & Co, Sanford Weill, Silverstein, WorldCom

    Deutsche Bank ->
    Carlyle Group, CIA, Josef Ackermann, SilverStream, Trading Technologies

    Donald Rumsfeld ->
    Citigroup (Salmon)

    Enron ->
    American International Group, Bank of America Corp, Bush family, Citicorp, Henry Kissinger, J.P. Morgan Chase

    Fireman's Fund ->
    al-Cokeda, Allianz AG, American Express, CIA, Sanford Weill

    Genesis Intermedia ->
    Adnan Khashoggi, al-Cokeda, American International Group, Fireman's Fund

    Global Crossing ->
    Blackstone Group, Citigroup, Richard Perle

    Greenberg-Traurig ->
    American International Group, Antonin Scalia, Bush family, Diebold Election Systems, Election Fraud

    Henry Kissinger ->
    American Express, Blackstone Group, Bush family, Citigroup, Enron, Marsh, Paul Bremer

    Kroll ->
    American International Group, Alpha Firm, Armor Holdings, CIA, Convar, Defence Systems Limited, Enron, Marsh, Michael Cherkasky, Morgan Stanley, Zolfo-Cooper LLC

    Lehman Brothers Holdings ->
    American Express Corp, Blackstone group, Citigroup, Goldman, Sachs, M.M. Warburg

    Marsh & McLennan ->
    American International Group, Citigroup, Control Risks Group, Guy Carpenter, Jeffrey Greenberg, Henry Kissinger, Kemper Insurance Companies, Kroll, Michael Cherkasky, Morgan Stanley, Paul Bremer, Silverstream, Versar

    Morgan Stanley ->
    Kroll, Marsh, Silverstream

    Silverstein ->
    Ace, Blackstone Group, Citigroup, XL Insurance

    Silverstream ->
    American International Group, Citigroup, Deutsche Bank, Marsh & McLennan, Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley

    United Airlines ->

    WorldCom ->

    XL Insurance ->
    American International Group, Silverstein
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 02:03 PM
    Response to Reply #53
    68. al-Cokeda money stream

    American International Group -> Saudi + al-Cokeda
    Saudi -> al-Cokeda < >- Intelligence
    Fireman's Fund Insurance Co. -> Saudi + al-Cokeda

    There are three main parts to the flight schools (1):

  • US part: American International Group (Laundry I)
  • European part: Fireman's Fund Insurance Co. (Laundry II)
  • Saudi part: Genesis Intermedia and other fronts (Funding)

    American International Group is owned by Maurice Greenberg which is the third largest global insurance company. The AIG connection was used during Mena and Iran-Contra (5, 6) AIG was linked to the OSS since its creation (7) and ties in the Bush family (4)

    Fireman's Fund is owned by Allianz AG which is the largest global insurance company with headquarters in Germany which might explain why there are some many Germans in Daniel Hopsicker's Venice investigation. It has a close CIA connection via its former CEO Myron Du Bain, John McCone and according the Opal Files (3) for the New Zealand drug trade. The Oryx connection also fits in with Fireman's Fund.

    Genesis Intermedia was part of the Adnan Khashoggi network (8, 9) Skyway International had lots of Saudi and Kuwaiti investors as well. They are provide the direct funding for the operations and could be related to the CIA-sponsored activities funded by the Saudi Royal Family which George H.W. Bush helped set up. (10)

    1. al-Cokeda story:
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 07:00 PM
    Response to Reply #68
    73. New Zealand ?
    That is where Hani Hanjour's former partner, Rayed Abdullah was recently arrested and deported. He had entered using an alias.,2933,199056,00.html
    "Immigration Minister David Cunliffe said Monday that Rayed Abdullah was expelled because of his ... activities in the United States (and) the general nature of his activities in New Zealand."

    But he said there was no evidence Rayed Abdullah was involved in terrorist activities in New Zealand."

    (so what "activities" are they talking about?"
    (I used Fox because they actually had the most information )
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 07:02 AM
    Response to Original message
    62. ITT Hartford
    ITT, originally International Telephone and Telegraph, was a large conglomerate that owned a variety of businesses during the 1960s under Harold Geneen. In the 1970s ITT was forced to sell off the majority of its holdings and became a shell of its 1960s glory. (1)

    In 1995, ITT Corporation split into 3 separate public companies: (1)
  • ITT Corp - In 1997, ITT Corp completed a merger with Starwood Hotels & Resorts Worldwide, selling off its non-hotel and resorts business.
  • ITT Hartford (insurance) - Today ITT Hartford is still a major insurance company although it has dropped the ITT from its name altogether. The company is now know as The Hartford Financial Services Group, Inc.
  • ITT Industries - Today ITT Industries still operates under this name and is a major manufacturing and defense contractor businesses. Effective July 1, 2006, ITT Industries will change its name to ITT Corporation as a result of its shareholders vote on May 9, 2006.

    ITT Hartford had offices in WTC7 during 9/11

    Ramani Ayer and George W. Bush
    The CEO of (ITT) Hartford is Ramani Ayer.

    After the terrorist's attacks on September 11, 2001, Ayer expanded his leadership role beyond his responsibilities at The Hartford by joining a team of insurance chief executives invited by President George W. Bush to discuss the insurance industry and its stability after the terrorism and associated insurance claims. Although they reported to Bush that the industry could bear the financial burden of the terrorist attacks, the executives determined that legislation should be developed to protect the insurance industry if another attack were to occur. Ayer served as a strong advocate for the development of new national insurance legislation and policy development.

    In part as the result of Ayer's work, the Terrorism Risk Insurance Act (2) of 2002, which provided a federal backstop for terrorism insurance, was signed into legislation on November 26, 2002. Ayer continued his larger leadership role in the business community as a director of the American Insurance Alliance, the chairman of the Insurance Information Institute, a director of the Metro Hartford Regional Economic Alliance, a chairman of the American Institute of Property and Liability Underwriters, and a trustee of the Business Roundtable.

    Lyndon Johnson and Richard Nixon
    International Telephone and Telegraph was an old hand at giving money on both sides. In 1960 it had made illegal contributions to Bobby Baker (3), who worked with Democratic Senators, including Lyndon Johnson. A senior vice-president of ITT was quoted by one of his assistants as saying the board of directors "have it set up to 'butter' both sides so we'll be in good position whoever wins." And in 1970, an ITT director, John McCone, who also had been head of the CIA, told Henry Kissinger, Secretary of State, and Richard Helms, CIA director, that ITT was willing to give $1 million to help the U.S. government in its plans to overthrow the Allende government (4) in Chile. (5)

    In 1971 ITT planned to take over the $1 1/2 billion Hartford Fire Insurance Company -- the largest merger in corporate history. The antitrust division of the Justice Department moved to prosecute ITT for violating the antitrust laws. However, the prosecution did not take place and ITT was allowed to merge with Hartford. It was all settled out of court, in a secret arrangement in which ITT agreed to donate $400,000 to the Republican party. It seemed that Richard Kleindienst, deputy Attorney General, had six meetings with an ITT director named Felix Rohatyn, and then brought in the head of the antitrust division, Richard McLaren, who was persuaded by Rohatyn that to stop the merger would cause a "hardship" for ITT stockholders. McLaren agreed. He was later appointed a federal judge. (5)

    Hartford and AIG

    October 15, 2004
    Insurance Scheme Rigged Bids
    By Gregory Bull, AP, USA Today

    ALBANY, N.Y. - New York Attorney General Eliot Spitzer on Thursday sued No. 1 insurance brokerage Marsh & McLennan and arrested two American International Group executives in his first prosecution of the insurance industry.

    Spitzer alleged that Marsh & McLennan took lucrative payoffs for steering unsuspecting clients to certain insurers. Spitzer also said American International (AIG), Hartford Financial Services Group, Ace, and Munich Re participated in steering and bid rigging.

    Where is the ethical compass of this industry? Spitzer said in a news conference, calling it thoroughly corrupt.

    The victims were mostly large corporations who were deceived into buying property and casualty coverage that may have cost more, but also included small and midsize businesses, municipal governments, school districts and individuals, Spitzer said....

    In some cases, Spitzer said, companies provided false and inflated quotes to help another in the scheme win a bid, with the idea that a subsequent bid would be steered to them.

    See also: (The Nazi history of ITT)

    2. Creation of a government reinsurance in case of terrorism, because they were victims in 9/11
    3. Joachim Joesten called this "the hidden key in JFK" in The Dark Side of Lyndon Baines Johnson (1968)
    4. See discussion Henry K., Salvador Allende and ITT.
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-06-06 11:06 PM
    Response to Reply #62
    129. Starwood Hotels
    was one of the three hotels: Hilton, Marriot, & Starwood, that had a huge increase in put options for 9-11.
    Putnam is the 3rd largest institutional investor in Starwood Hotels (and putnam is a subsidiary of Putnam).
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-07-06 03:07 AM
    Response to Reply #129
    130. Good one.
    I've seen Starwood somewhere else as well, but I can't remember.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-07-06 09:44 PM
    Response to Reply #129
    131. Correction: Putnam is subsidiary of Marsh.nt
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 08:16 AM
    Response to Original message
    63. Office of Emergency Management (Command Central for Terrorist Attacks)
    Edited on Mon Jul-03-06 08:26 AM by DrDebug
    The New York City Office of Emergency Management (OEM) was originally formed in 1996 as part of the Mayor's Office under Rudy Giuliani. By a vote of city residents in 2001 it became an independent agency, headed by a Commissioner who reports to the Mayor. (1)

    Richard Sheirer was appointed as Giulianis commissioner of the citys Office of Emergency Management. In 1999 Jerome Hauer became Head of the Office of Emergency Management.

    Jerome Hauer and was the chief architect of the bunker in WTC 7. Richard Sheirer forcefully opposed the construction of the "the bunker" on an upper floor of 7 World Trade Center. (3) Nevertheless in June 1999, Mayor Rudolph Giuliani built a $13 million emergency crisis centre on the 23rd floor of 7 World Trade Center, a building just north of the towers that itself collapsed late Tuesday afternoon. (4)

    Giuliani intended the centre to serve as a command central during city emergencies including blackouts, storms and terrorist attacks. Guiliani spent part of the New Year's Eve 2000 celebration in the emergency centre. (4)

    The 9/11 Command Center
    Even though the "bunker" was supposed to be the headquarters during an emergency, it wasn't needed during 9/11.

    As Giuliani said during the testimony to the 9-11 Commission ( WNYC radio has a copy at: because the 9/11 Omission report forgot to include this testimony )

    The reason Pier 92 was selected as a command center was because on the next day, on September 12, Pier 92 was going to have a drill, it had hundreds of people here, from FEMA, from the Federal Government, from the State, from the State Emergency Management Office, and they were getting ready for a drill for biochemical attack. So that was gonna be the place they were going to have the drill. The equipment was already there, so we were able to establish a command center there, within three days, that was two and a half to three times bigger than the command center that we had lost at 7 World Trade Center. And it was from there that the rest of the search and rescue effort was completed. (5)

    Funny because they put in a lot of efforts to deny the story that the FEMA was already present on 9/11 and even wrote stories for worldnetdaily to put an end to the rumors. Luckily hardly anybody noticed that Giulani's testimony was removed from the official report. We should note that the actual wording of the debunking accounts does not deny that FEMA was in New York on September 10, it merely denies that the Urban Search and Rescue Task Force was not in New York on September 10. (5) and the FEMA is slightly larger than one Task Force.

    Back to the morning of 9/11. Sheirer got to City Hall at 8 a.m. for a meeting about the Jackie Robinson-Pee Wee Reese memorial planned for Coney Island. "I was in heaven, sitting between Ralph Branca and Joe Black," he remembers. "We were about to select the statue, and then we heard the pop." At first he thought a transformer had exploded in an underground substation. Then he got a flash report from Watch Command in OEM headquarters. (6)

    Down at the scene, he joined Fire Commissioner Tom Von Essen and his chiefs Pete Ganci and Bill Feehan -- old friends from Sheirer's 26 years with the New York Fire Department. They were establishing a command post at the base of the burning tower. (6)

    The Red Cross and the OEM under Jerome Hauer worked very closely together. (3) Even though Jerome Hauer wasn't directly in charge of OEM anymore.

    On the morning of 9/11/01 Rudolph Giuliani told ABC News's Peter Jennings about the temporary headquarters that he and staff had set up at 75 Barkley Street: "We were operating out of there when we were told that the World Trade Center building was gonna collapse." How this Mayor would know about an impending collapse that even firefighters inside the Twin Towers did not anticipate is yet another question unaddressed by the National Ommission on Terrorist Attacks. (7)

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 09:36 AM
    Response to Original message
    65. Mass. Electric Construction 84th floor WTC2. Unlisted office
    Edited on Mon Jul-03-06 09:37 AM by DrDebug
    Mass. Electric Construction Co. (MEC), a subsidiary of Kiewit Corporation, is one of the nations largest electrical contractors. Founded in 1928, MEC is a leader in the construction of large- scale, complex electrical systems throughout North and South America. (1). The headquarters of MEC are in Boston. Kiewit is based in Omaha.

    They specialize in wiring and also do internet projects like the fiber optics internet backbone in the Fidelity World Trade Center in Boston, an fiber optics network for Raytheon and Global Crossing. (2) (3)

    Peter Schneidkraut was CEO of Kiewit Corporation until December 2001 and then started his own company and performed various tasks like the Restauration Project of the New Jersey to the World Trade Center Station in Manhattan, New York. (4)

    Mass. Electric Construction Co. had an office on the 84th floor of WTC2 (5), however nothing is known about this company and 9/11, however they are participants in the Arizonas September 11th Memorial. (6)

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 03:37 AM
    Response to Reply #65
    84. Some of the 9-11 victims who were electrical contractors
    Thomas Ashton, 21, 95th floor of the North Tower
    with Robert Caufield, 49, a journeyman wireman. Denino Electric.
    North Tower Local 3 journeymen Harvey Hermer, 59, Lester Marino, 58, Jeffrey Shaw, 42, and Glenn Travers, Sr., 53. : Forest Electric on the 105th floor.
    same floor in the same tower was a telecommunications crew from Kleinknecht Electric. They were Salvatore Fiumefreddo, 45, Joseph Romagnolo, 37, and Kenneth White, 50. All were in the telephone division of Local 3.

    105th floor South Tower, P.E. Stone Electric :Local 3 members James Cartier, 26, a second-year apprentice, and journeymen Ralph Licciardi, 30, and Charles Lucania, 35.

    South Tower on the 90th floor, was journeyman wireman Jose "Joe" Martinez, 50, Forest Electric. Journeymen wiremen Joseph DiPilato, 57, and Steven Strauss, 51, were last seen stuck in an elevator on the 30th floor of the South Tower. They were working for Petrocelli Electric.(Petrocelli Electric is being investigated for bid rigging)

    Michael Lowe, 48, Liberty Electric Supply, was last seen in the basement of the complex.

    Meanwhile, the four members of Local 1212 were at their posts in the World Trade Center when the planes struck. They were Gerard "Rod" Coppola of WNET-TV, Steven Jacobson of WPIX-TV, and Robert Pattison and Isaias Rivera, both of CBS.

    Nine electricians from E-J Electric Installation Co., Long Island City, N.Y., escaped from the World Trade Center before the 110-story Twin Towers collapsed. E-J Electric, which had an office in Tower 2, built and maintained the World Trade Center's entire security system
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 03:55 AM
    Response to Reply #84
    87. Thanks + First Commercial Bank

    Our Local usually had more than 200 workers at the Trade Center because of constant renovations

    I just means that there were plenty of people who could have helped in setting up the Controlled Demolition and most of them wouldn't even have known, because they just to connects wires all over the building.

    First Commercial Bank is another mystery. I couldn't find much.

    First Commercial Bank opened in 1985 and is a Birmingham, Alabama bank. It was founded by Richard E. Anthony and John T. Oliver, Jr. (1). The bank is part of the Synovus Financial Corp who own 40 banks.

    They also had an office on the 78th floor of WTC2 where 27 people worked. One did not survive.

    After 9/11 the New York branch was not reopened and the services taken over by the Birmingham main office (2).

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 07:43 PM
    Response to Reply #87
    104. Thanks, I was looking for that - 200 people
    That is enough alright. Why electrical? I have not seen any other type of contractor. I'm looking for stories on what people were doing there, specifically. One of the electrical contacting companies (Petrocelli) at least is under criminal investigation which makes it more likely or possible that they could be involved with something not kosher.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 11:50 AM
    Response to Original message
    67. Rudy Rudy Rudy
    Edited on Mon Jul-03-06 12:16 PM by DrDebug

    Rudy and Rummie in what used to be WTC
    Rudolph William Louis Giuliani III KBE (2) or Rudy G. (born May 28, 1944 in Brooklyn, New York) served as the Mayor of New York City from January 1, 1994 through December 31, 2001. He is currently Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of Giuliani Partners LLC, which he founded in January 2002, and a name partner in the Houston-based law firm Bracewell & Giuliani LLP. (1)

    In 1993 Rudy was elected mayor and by April 1999, Giuliani's approval rating had dropped to 40 percent. A year later, his failing marriage had become a daily tabloid soap opera. (11)

    He tried to increase his popularity based on the September 11 myth and used it to extend his term as Mayor for another three months and if they didn't like that, he'd run for another term. George W. Bush wanted Rudy to run the Department of Homeland Security, however Rudy appointed Bernard Kerik. (3)

    Rudy also featured in the London's 7/7 where he said the London terror strikes were an "eerie reminder" of 9/11 (10). A lot of people thought that his presence in London was also an "eerie reminder."

    Giuliani has been plagued by scandals such as his partner Bernard Kerik being convicted of improper actions while in office and being alledgely linked to organized crime. (1)

    Diebold Election Systems used Greenberg-Traurig to hire Robert Harding (5), former deputy mayor for Rudy Giuliani, to promote their electronic voting systems (4) during the 2004 Elections.

    And there are many persistent rumors that Rudy wants to run for President in 2008 as well. (1)

    May 11, 2001

    New York Citys Office of Emergency Management (OEM), which is located in World Trade Center Building 7, organizes a bio-terrorism drill where militant extremists attack the city with bubonic plague and Manhattan is quarantined. Various high-level officials take part, including Mayor Rudolph Giuliani, OEM Director Richard Sheirer, Fire Commissioner Thomas Von Essen, and Police Commissioner Bernard Kerik. Agencies and organizations that participate include New York City Fire Department, New York City Police Department, the FBI, and the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). (7, 8)

    Rudy uses Pier 92 as the Command Center instead of the OEM since it was already set up by FEMA and others. (12)

    9:37 - 9:58 am
    Rudy Giuliani is told by his chief of staff that the White House knew of seven planes that are unaccounted for. (9, 8)

    Rudolph Giuliani told ABC News's Peter Jennings about the temporary headquarters that he and staff had set up at 75 Barkley Street: "We were operating out of there when we were told that the World Trade Center building was gonna collapse." (6) He had heard about it between 9:25 a.m. and 9:45 a.m. (8)

    On 9:58 a.m. about one minute before the WTC 2 falls, he is able to reach the White House by phone learns the Pentagon has been hit and he asks about fighter cover over New York City. Henick replies, The jets were dispatched 12 minutes ago and they should be there very shortly, and they should be able to defend you against further attack. (9,8)

    On 11:02 Rudy Guiliani urges citizens to stay calm and in their homes, except for those living south of Canal St., who are politely urged to run like hell. (15)

    National Law Enforcement and Security Institute
    National Law Enforcement and Security Institute held a conference called "Homeland Security: America's Leadership Challenge" in Chicago on 6 Sept 2002. The star speaker is Rudolph Giuliani. One of the other speakers is CIA man John Fulton. Here is the crucial sentence from the promotional literature for the conference:

    On the morning of September 11th 2001, Mr. Fulton and his team at the CIA were running a pre-planned simulation to explore the emergency response issues that would be created if a plane were to strike a building.
    (AP later removed that story of course)

    Yet both Rudy Giulani and Jerome Hauer denied during 9/11 Omission Report that they were preparing for a scenario like September 11. (14) Giuliani's responsibility for giving the FDNY inoperable Motorola radios was overlooked as well. (16) The relatives of World Trade Center victims were outraged during the 9/11 Omission hearings of Rudy Guliani (13)

    See also:
    Giuliani Time
    Stop Guiliani

    Cooperative research material is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike ( )
    2. Even though it originally violates the Constitution, the Foreign Gifts and Decorations Act of 1966 was passed, so Rudy has to use KBE instead of Sir and the "Swearing upon of His Imperial Majesty" is now deemed irrelevant.
    3. "Bernie, thank God George Bush is our president"
    9. 9/11 Commission, 5/19/2004

    There was a strange inconsistency about Rudy finding out that the WTC where being hit, but I can't find it.
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 04:37 PM
    Response to Original message
    69. AMR Corporation, David L. Boren and George Tenet
    Edited on Mon Jul-03-06 04:40 PM by DrDebug
    The AMR Corporation is a holding company (1) that provides scheduled passenger and air freight services to more than 169 destinations in North America, the Caribbean, Latin America, Europe and the Pacific through its American Airlines (3) subsidiary. (4)

    AMR Corporation was named one of the 9/11 inside traders (2). The director is former Senator David L. Boren.

    David L. Boren
    Former U.S. Senator David Boren, now the president of the University of Oklahoma, is called the mentor of CIA director George J. Tenet. Boren is also interesting because during 2001 Zacarias Moussaoui spent six months in Norman, home of OU, and was taking flight lessons there before he moved to Minneapolis, where he was arrested and later charged with terrorism. He was also receiving wire transfers from the Hamburg Al Qaeda cell while in Norman. Additionally, in August 2001 Boren arranged for CIA officer David Edger to have a visiting professor appointment at OU. Edger had earlier been in charge of CIA surveillance over the Hamburg Al Qaeda cell, which included lead 9/11 hijacker Mohammed Atta.

    When the Minneapolis FBI was asking headquarters for permission to examine Moussoui's computer in August 2001, Tenet's CIA assisted them in their obstruction of a search which may have yielded information to unravel the 9/11 plot before the attack took place. Readers are invited to see these articles where I explore the odd events involving these four men: (6)

  • <- Recommended reading

    CIA support for Bin Laden: Who's Responsible?
    Michael Phillip Wright of Norman, Oklahoma
    September 2001

    The current crisis calls for Americans to investigate the records of all Congress members who approved of any legislation enabling U.S. support for the Afghan rebels during the 1980s. Those who supported this hideous adventure deserve severe judgment.

    As an Oklahoman, I am particularly interested in the record of former Senator David Boren, whose close tie to the CIA is well known. He was appointed to the Intelligence Committee in 1985, and later became its .

    Boren also has close ties to the extreme right. Political Research Associates (7), a group whose purpose is to expose the threat to democracy presented by right-wing groups, includes Boren as a member of one of the organizations which they have targeted for concern.

    One of the more prominent ASC (American Security Council (8) ) members was Major General Milnor Roberts, chairman of the Committee for a Free Afghanistan (CFA) (9). During the 1980s proxy war the CFA promoted U.S. support for the Islamic militants whose successors are now being accused of the September 11 attack.

    And much more...

    See also:

    Content from sourcewatch is available under GNU Free Documentation License 1.2.

    3. Flight 11, Flight 77 and Axa SA
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    Ferry Fey Donating Member (289 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 09:27 PM
    Response to Reply #69
    75. David Boren, Moussaoui and Nick Berg.
    Anyone looking further into David L. Boren and the Norman, Oklahoma connection between Zacarias Moussaoui and Nick Berg should be aware of a very information-rich discussion on what used to be the old AlterNet forum. It later was taken over by Utne, and now is at the Utne website. You may need to register to read.

    The thread is in the section NeverGiveUp.Currents.1099 and is titled "Killing of American Berg ....Who were the Terrorists???." There are 58 pages of discussion, over 1400 postings, and it is the one of the best examples of distributed research I've yet seen on the net, especially given the many unanswered questions regarding the beheading of Nicholas Berg.

    Go in through the main page "The New Caf", log in and go to the "New Cafe Partners", click "Never Give Up" for the forums, and then in Currents look for the "Killing of American Berg ....Who were the Terrorists???" (currently on page 3 of the menu).

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    BuddyYoung Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 09:48 PM
    Response to Reply #75
    76. Does the thread discuss the following important points:

    * Berg was already dead whenever he was decapitated

    * Alleged terrorists in the video don't appear to be "authentic" - due to wearing gold ring, physique, the way they stand and act is consistent with U.S. military training - not M.E. terrorists, chair Berg sits on is white chair like those used at Abu Ghraib, blood doesn't squirt out on everyone close by as would be expected if Berg were ALIVE whenever he was decapitated.

    * Berg event was a U.S. false flag (though not one aimed at placing blame on a country, just "terrorists") response to the newly revealed news (and photos) showing U.S. troops torturing Iraquis at Abu Ghraib. Goal was to deflect attention away from U.S. torture and make alleged Iraqi terrorists seem more brutal in comparison to what the U.S. was doing.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    Ferry Fey Donating Member (289 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 11:20 PM
    Response to Reply #76
    79. It goes way beyond those points
    It goes way beyond those points, which did get a lot of discussion on many of the forums and blogs. There's a lot of material dug up on that thread that never appeared anywhere else, as far as I know.

    Would be an excellent resource for anyone writing a book on the Berg issue.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 05:38 AM
    Response to Reply #69
    92. Airman Flight School in Oklahoma
    Edited on Tue Jul-04-06 05:43 AM by mirandapriestly
    Atta was also there for awhile.
    They have gone out of business. They say it's because flight is down after 9-11 but I don't think the other flight schools have closed. The holder of the lease of the building is Baker/Hughes of Houston and there is a law suit between them and Airman. The students who paid but weren't given lessons are also suing Airman. One of the names of the management of the Flight school is Mike Batton who is also the name of a drug enforcement officer in Oklahoma. Coincidence? Probably. The lawsuit mentions a CHILD ABUSE MULTIDISCIPLINARY FEE, wtf? I don't know what that is about.

    This mentions the Mike Batton who is a drug enforcement agent, no idea if it is the same guy. But just for the heck of it.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-06-06 06:28 AM
    Response to Reply #92
    128. And the CIA stonewalled the investigation into the Oklahoma flight school
    Edited on Thu Jul-06-06 06:38 AM by DrDebug

    by leveymg
    Don't let the CIA off the hook. They're the ones who had the UBL files

    To avoid stepping on the Agency's domestic surveillance operation, the FBI brass handcuffed and blindfolded their field agents whenever they came in contact with what DoD called "the Brooklyn cell". The Pentagon was also prevailed upon to abandon its own operations that threatened to conflict with the CIA's work. That's why Able Danger was shut down.

    Here's what we know from open sources:

    A Congressional report later describes (Bush's 08/06/01 PDB) as based on the memo discussed in July by Clarke and other high-level national security decision-makers. The Senate Intelligence Committee summarized that memo, as follows:

    "Members of al-Qaeda, including some US citizens, had resided in or traveled to the US for years and that the group apparently maintained a support structure here. The report cited uncorroborated information obtained in 1998 that Osama bin Laden wanted to hijack airplanes to gain the release of US-held extremists; FBI judgments about patterns of activity consistent with preparations for hijackings or other types of attacks and the number of bin Laden-related investigations underway; as well as information acquired in May 2001 that indicated a group of bin Laden supporters was planning attacks in the US with explosives." .

    Meanwhile, that August, FBI investigators in New York and Minneapolis were trying desperately to gather sufficient evidence to obtain FISA warrants to track down four al-Qaeda members known to be at large in the country and information for a warrant to open the computer files of a fifth suspect, Zacarias Moussaoui, who had been arrested at a Norman Oklahoma flight school. FBI requests that summer to the CIA for information contained in the Agencys files were repeatedly stonewalled.

    On August 23 2001, the CIA finally informed the Bureau that two intending terrorists Nawaf al-Hazmi and Khalid al-Mihdhar -- had entered the US in January 2000 information it had in its files for some 17 months. As they tried to get evidence for warrants, FBI agents in New York and Minneapolis were particularly in need of what the CIA knew about these two al-Qaeda members. In refusing to turn over information the previous month, a CIA officer told FBI investigators attached to the FBIs New York National Security office he would not turn over operational information. In a now famous e-mail message, one of the New York Bureau investigators remarked about the seeming meltdown in US counterterrorism, Someone is going to die. Colleen Rowley, a lawyer in the Minneapolis FBI office frustrated after the CIA refused to provide materials supporting warrants to open Moussaouis laptop -- and by the obstruction of FBI headquarters later conjectured that her own investigation was being sabotaged by moles.

    And the whole Moussaoui story is the same scenario. Even though they wanted him to serve as their patsy there was very little incentive to provide any information about Moussaoui. It's almost like he was one of them how maybe done something else and was therefore labelled as an al-Cokeda terrorist to help their "War on Terra" efforts.

    by Octafish
    Know your BFEE: The Stench of Moussaoui Permeates the Octopus
    Nothing to see here

    The joke goes: Doctors bury their mistakes.

    The same can be said for the Bush Crime Syndicate. Except, the Bushies use the Intelligence Community to cover up their mistakes and law-breaking.

    In this particular example, Bush and his henchmen are blaming self-confessed 20th hijacker Zacarias Moussaoui for failing to inform FBI investigators of the terror plot. Perhaps Bush and Co. hope to pin the blame for what happened on one man and silence him permanently.

    Should the Bushies succeed in blaming Moussaoui, they will be letting off the hook the many more who are criminally negligent. That would be unfortunate for America.

    The official record revealed last week in Federal Court shows blame for failing to pursue the leads, connect the dots, build the puzzle and generally do the competent leadership thing doesnt fall solely on the terrorist pawn Moussaoui.

    Failing to prevent 9-11 falls squarely on many shoulders in the administration of George W Bush. These names are on the record: Michael Rolince, David Frasca, and Michael Maltbie.

    My source? Special Agent Harry Samit. Heres what else Samit and some more of the best and the brightest in the government of the United States have to say:

    FBI Agent Slams Bosses at Moussaoui Trial

    ALEXANDRIA, Va., Mar. 21, 2006

    (CBS, AP) The FBI agent who arrested Zacarias Moussaoui in August 2001 testified Monday he spent almost four weeks trying to warn U.S. officials about the radical Islamic student pilot but "criminal negligence" by superiors in Washington thwarted a chance to stop the 9/ 11 attacks.

    FBI agent Harry Samit of Minneapolis originally testified as a government witness, on March 9, but his daylong cross examination by defense attorney Edward MacMahon was the strongest moment so far for the court-appointed lawyers defending Moussaoui. The 37-year-old Frenchman of Moroccan descent is the only person charged in this country in connection with al-Qaida's Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.

    MacMahon displayed a communication addressed to Samit and FBI headquarters agent Mike Maltbie from a bureau agent in Paris relaying word from French intelligence that Moussaoui was "very dangerous," had been indoctrinated in radical Islamic Fundamentalism at London's Finnsbury Park mosque, was "completely devoted" to a variety of radical fundamentalism that Osama bin Laden espoused, and had been to Afghanistan.


    But Samit told MacMahon he couldn't persuade FBI headquarters or the Justice Department to take his fears seriously. No one from Washington called Samit to say this intelligence altered the picture the agent had been painting since Aug. 18 in a running battle with Maltbie and Maltbie's boss, David Frasca, chief of the (R)adical (F)undamentalist (U)nit (RFU) at headquarters.

    They fought over Samit's desire for a warrant to search Moussaoui's computer and belongings. Maltbie and Frasca said Samit had not established a link between Moussaoui and terrorists.


    And much more (about 3Mb):

    The biggest irony is that they are stonewalling and protecting their own patsies...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 05:40 PM
    Response to Original message
    70. Cigna Group
    Edited on Mon Jul-03-06 05:43 PM by DrDebug
    Cigna Group is a Philadelphia-based insurance company, the oldest stock insurance company in the United States. (1)

    Cigna can trace its roots back to 1792, and the founding of the Insurance Company of North America (INA), the country's first marine insurer. Its first life insurance policy was issued two years later. (1)

    Carol Cox has been a director of Cigna Corporation since 1995 (2) In 1998, Cigna sold its individual life insurance business to Abraham Lincoln, and in 1999 it sold its property and casualty insurance business to the Evan Greenberg's Ace (3), for $3.5B cash. Shortly after CEO William H. Taylor appointed Edward Hanwey as his successor. (4)In 2000, it sold its reinsurance business to Swiss Re and in 2004, it sold its pension business to Prudential Financial. (1)

    Cigna was named of the pre-9/11 inside traders.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 06:21 PM
    Response to Original message
    71. CNA Financial
    CNA Financial Corporation is a subsidiary of Loews Corporation. (1) CNA Financial is the umbrella organization for a wide range of insurance providers, including Continental Casualty and Continental Assurance and First Insurance Company of Hawaii, Ltd. (2) The company was created from a merger in 1967.

    CNA Financial was named one of the pre-9/11 inside traders.

    The CEO, is Stephen W. Lilienthal (2) since July 23, 2001 (3). Immediately after 9/11, Steve Lilienthal directed the corporation's extension of reservist employee benefits from 30 days to six months and the company signed Statement of Support at the National Guard (7)

    Steve Lilienthal is a member of the Free Congress Foundation, lead by Paul M. Weyrich and funded by Scaife Foundations (6) among others, (4) where he is Director of the Center for Privacy and Technology Policy (5) and writes many conservative columns on the internet complaining about godlessness, gays and the liberal media.

    Loews Corporation
    Loews Corporation is a holding company whose subsidiaries are engaged in the following lines of business: (1)

  • property and casualty insurance (CNA Financial Corporation, a 90%-owned subsidiary)
  • the production and sale of cigarettes (Lorillard, Inc., owned by Carolina Group, a 67%-owned subsidiary)
  • the operation of hotels (Loews Hotels, a wholly owned subsidiary)
  • the operation of offshore oil and gas drilling rigs (Diamond Offshore Drilling, Inc., a 54%-owned subsidiary)
  • the operation of an interstate natural gas transmission pipeline system (Texas Gas Transmission, LLC, a wholly owned subsidiary) and
  • the distribution and sale of watches and clocks (Bulova Corporation, a 97%- owned subsidiary).

    6. You know from the Pentagon video
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 06:47 PM
    Response to Original message
    72. Carnival Corporation (Also featured in Hurricane Katrina)
    The British-American corporation, Carnival Corporation & plc is the world's largest cruise operator, comprising 12 cruise brands, including Carnival Cruise Lines, Princess Cruises, Holland America Line, Windstar Cruises and Seabourn Cruise Line in North America; P&O Cruises, Cunard Line, Ocean Village Holidays and Swan Hellenic in the United Kingdom; AIDA and A'ROSA in Germany; Costa Cruises in Southern Europe and P&O Cruises Australia in Australia. It operates 80 ships, totalling more than 139,000 berths with a further 15 ships to be delivered between May 2006 and October 2009. (1)

    Carnival Corporation was one of the pre-9/11 inside traders.

    During Hurricane Katrina, FEMA awarded Carnival Corporation $236 million for 3 of its cruise ships to the Military Sealift Commandor providing about 7,100 berths. (2)

    Ambassador Richard Capen Jr is a member of the boards of Carnival Corporation. (3) Richard was appointed US Ambassador to Spain between 1989 and 1991 by George H.W. Bush and publisher of The Miami Herald between 1983 to 1989. (4)


    They should rename it to Carnivore Corporation
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-03-06 07:47 PM
    Response to Original message
    74. L-3 Communications Holdings
    Edited on Mon Jul-03-06 07:48 PM by DrDebug
    L-3 Communications Holdings, Inc. is a leading merchant supplier of Intelligence, Surveillance and Reconnaissance (ISR) products, secure communications systems and products, avionics and ocean products, training products, microwave components and telemetry, instrumentation, space and wireless products. The company claims a workforce of more than 25,000 employees and over $4.0 billion in sales in 2002. Among its customers, L-3 Communications Holdings includes the Department of Defense, selected US government intelligence agencies, aerospace prime contractors and commercial telecommunications and wireless customers. (1)

    In conjunction with Lehman Brothers and Lockheed Martin, Lanza and LaPenta formed L-3 Communications to be a supplier of choice for prime contractors. In establishing the company, several advanced electronics businesses were purchased that were part of the Lockheed Martin, Loral Corporation merger that occurred in 1996. Also purchased from Lockheed Martin was a division located in Camden, NJ that had been part of General Electric. In 2000 they purchased Training Devices and Training Services of the Raytheon Company. On June 3, 2005, they bought Titan Corporation (2) (3) for $1.97 billion. (1)

    L-3 Communications was one of the pre-9/11 inside traders.

    Frank C. Lanza is the CEO of L-3 Communications.
    General Jay M. Garner from the previous Iraq war (4) is their president SY Technology

    Oh yeah, Salomon Smith Barney (5) helped raised their stock price with one their price manipulation schemes.

    2. WSJ June 3, 2005
    3. See: Skyways and the 5.5 tons of cocaine
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    MinM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-30-08 09:45 AM
    Response to Reply #74
    142. Did L-3 Communications kill Antioch College?
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    MinM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-30-08 12:31 PM
    Response to Reply #142
    143. The L-3 Communications Titan Group
    Apparently L-3 is killing more than a college:

    CorpWatch: Outsourcing Intelligence in Iraq -- A CorpWatch Report on L-3/Titan
    CorpWatch Managing Editor Pratap Chatterjee has just returned from Iraq where he was embedded with the US military and investigating the outsourcing of both military logistics and intelligence gathering. A new Corpwatch report offers a scathing assessment of intelligence contractors L-3 and Titan. We also speak to Marwan Mawiri, who worked in Iraq as a translator with Titan in 2003 and 2004...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    wildbilln864 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-30-08 05:32 PM
    Response to Reply #143
    144. Thanks MinM...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 04:38 AM
    Response to Original message
    88. Lockheed Martin
    Lockheed Martin is the largest arms manufacturer in the world (1), with an order book worth +/- 70bn and a dominance in the fighter aircraft sector. $23.3bn in military sales, including fighter and transport aircraft, missiles and space systems, comprise 88% of company turnover. (2)

    Lockheed Martin is headquartered in Bethesda, Maryland, and employs about 125,000 people worldwide. The company is principally engaged in the research, design, development, manufacture and integration of advanced technology systems, products and services (3)

    Nearly 80% of Lockheed Martin's customer base is with the U.S. Department of Defense and the U.S. federal government agencies. In fact, Lockheed Martin is the largest provider of IT services, systems integration, and training to the U.S. Government. The remaining portion of Lockheed Martin's business is comprised of international government and some commercial sales of products, services and platforms." (3)

    Lockheed Martin was named one of the 9/11 inside traders.

    The benefits of the war in Afghanistan and Iraq are immense and they are listed at #8 of the Top 10 of Worst War Profiteers. (4)
    The Vice President Bruce Jackson is a member of the Project for a New American Century (5) and the connections with Defense and other departments are such that they have almost become an integral part.

    Lockheed and the Future of Warfare
    Published: November 28, 2004

    Lockheed Martin doesn't run the United States. But it does help run a breathtakingly big part of it.

    But in the post-9/11 world, Lockheed has become more than just the biggest corporate cog in what Dwight D. Eisenhower called the military-industrial complex. It is increasingly putting its stamp on the nation's military policies, too.

    To critics, however, Lockheed's deep ties with the Pentagon raise some questions. "It's impossible to tell where the government ends and Lockheed begins," said Danielle Brian of the Project on Government Oversight, a nonprofit group in Washington that monitors government contracts. "The fox isn't guarding the henhouse. He lives there."

    The melding of military and intelligence programs, information-technology and domestic security spending began in earnest after the Sept. 11 attacks. Lockheed was perfectly positioned to take advantage of the shift. When the United States government decided a decade ago to let corporate America handle federal information technology, Lockheed leapt at the opportunity. Its information-technology sales have quadrupled since 1995, and, for all those years, Lockheed has been the No. 1 supplier to the federal government, which now outsources 83 percent of its I.T. work.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 05:27 AM
    Response to Original message
    90. LTV Corporation. One of its last actions was pre-9/11 inside trading
    LTV Corporation (Ling-Temco-Vought) was a large US conglomerate which began as an electric company, moved into the defense and aerospace business, and became the nation's third-largest steel manufacturer. (1)

    In 1947 entrepreneur James Ling founded his own Dallas electrical contracting business, Ling Electric Company, where he lived in the rear of the shop. After incorporating and taking his company public in 1955, Ling found innovative ways to market his stock, including selling door-to-door and from a booth at the State Fair of Texas. (2)

    In 1964 Ling started a holding company and established three public companies, LTV Aerospace, LTV Ling Altec, and LTV Electrosystems (later E-Systems, and now part of Raytheon), mirroring the original companies that formed LTV. This action raised capital, allowing Ling to raise more loans and buy more companies. (2)

    Eventually the company was named LTV Steel and filed for bankruptcy on December 29, 2000. The assets were acquired and merged with Weirton Steel to form the International Steel Group. (2)

    LTV Corporation ceased to exists on July 17, 2002 (3), it was a pre-9/11 inside trader during 2001.


    Probably one of the last actions of this company.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 07:32 PM
    Response to Reply #90
    103. Good grief Debug
    This looks awfully suspicious.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 06:14 AM
    Response to Original message
    93. Royal Caribbean Cruises
    Royal Caribbean International is a Norwegian- American cruise ship company based in Miami, Florida. It is a brand of Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd., with 20 ships in service and one more under construction. All the ships have names ending in "of the Seas." Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd. also operates Celebrity Cruises (1)

    Royal Caribbean is one of the pre-9/11 inside traders.

    Corporate Criminals of the 90s: #21 Royal Caribbean

    In the late 1990s, Royal Caribbean was twice fined for violating U.S. environmental cruising regulations. They pleaded guilty on June 8, 1998, to charges of dumping fuel oil on the high seas, using falsified records to cover it up, and even destroying a bypass pipe on the Sovereign of the Seas to further cover it up. It additionally pleaded guilty on July 26, 1999, to 21 felony charges in connection to dumping fuel oil in U.S. territorial waters and the accompanying coverups. Royal Caribbean was forced to pay a total of US$27 million (25 million, 211 million NOK) in fines. (2)

    Other weird stories
    George Allen Smith

    Cruise line lobbyists related to Jack Abramoff Scandal

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 06:29 AM
    Response to Original message
    94. Royal & Sun Alliance (with AIG)
    Royal & Sun Alliance is a British general insurance company, with its operating head quarter at London, UK. (1)

    The company was formed following the merger of Sun Alliance and Royal in 1996, and the acquisition of AMEV in 1997. Sun Alliance was itself a product of the merger of Sun and Alliance insurance companies. It is the oldest general insurer still operating under its original name at the time of its foundation, with The Sun opened for insurance business in 1710. (1)

    Royal & Sun Alliance was one of the pre-9/11 traders.

    AIG and Royal & Sun Alliance have a joint venture called AIG SunAmerica, one of the largest U.S. retirement services businesses. (2)

    2004: AIG purchases Royal & Sun Japan

    November 11, 2004

    AIG Subsidiaries Purchase Royal & SunAlliance Insurance Portfolio in Japan

    Press Release, American International Group, Inc.

    NEW YORK & TOKYO - (Business Wire) - American International Group, Inc (AIG) has announced that its subsidiaries American Home Assurance Company and AIU Insurance Company will purchase the insurance portfolio of the Royal & SunAlliance (RSA) branch operations in Japan. The purchase price of the book of business is GBP92 million, and AIG expects ongoing annual gross premiums to approximate 11 billion Yen....

    The transaction is subject to regulatory approvals and other customary conditions.

    American International Group, Inc. is the worlds leading international insurance and financial services organization, with operations in more than 130 countries and jurisdictions....

    AIG also has one of the largest U.S. retirement services businesses through AIG SunAmerica and AIG VALIC, and is a leader in asset management for the individual and institutional markets, with specialized investment management capabilities in equities, fixed income, alternative investments and real estate...

    Much more at:
    A Marriage On The Rocks

  • Sources:
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 06:55 AM
    Response to Original message
    95. Vornado Realty Trust (WTC - Port Authority deal)
    Vornado Realty Trust (Vornado) is an integrated real estate investment trust (REIT). The Company conducts its business through Vornado Realty L.P., a limited partnership. It operates in five business segments: Office Properties, Retail Properties, Merchandise Mart Properties, Temperature Controlled Logistics and Toys "R" Us, Inc. (Toys). (1)

    Originally Vornado Realty Trust tried to get the lease on the World Trade Center for $3.25 billion and outbid Larry Silverstein's $3.22 billion. (2), however Vornado and Port Authority could not agree on the terms and Larry Silverstein managed to secure the lease after all. The CEO Steven Roth refused to comment on the reasons why they withdrew. (3)

    On July 21, 2005, a joint venture owned equally by the Company, Bain Capital and Kohlberg Kravis Roberts & Co. acquired interest in Toys. Through Office Properties segment, it owns 111 office properties in the New York City metropolitan area, Washington D.C. and Northern Virginia area. (1)

  • Chairman of the board: Steven Roth
  • CEO: Michael D. Fascitelli

    Vornado Realty Trust is one of the 9/11 inside traders.

    2. Some sources say 50 million difference
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 07:09 AM
    Response to Original message
    96. W. R. Grace and Company (Asbestos)
    W. R. Grace and Company is a conglomerate founded in 1854 by William Russell Grace (1832-1904). Their self-description is "a premier global specialty chemicals and materials company." (1)

    Some subsidiaries and their products include: (1)
  • Grace Davison
  • Grace Performance Chemicals
  • Grace Construction Products

    W.R. Grace and Company is one of the 9/11 inside traders.


    W. R. Grace and Company has been involved in a number of controversial environmental incidents including the Libby, Montana asbestos contamination, the Woburn, Massachusetts water contamination lawsuit (basis of the film A Civil Action) and the Acton, Massachusetts Superfund site.

    To date, W. R. Grace and Company has faced more than 250,000 asbestos-related lawsuits.

    Coincidentally the World Trade Center had known minor problems like asbestos which would have cost about $1 billion (2) as well which was known since 1989. (3)

    2. Amounts vary of course depending on the source

    This is the last of the inside traders for which I have found some relations and clues to why they could have been involved. There are several more, however too little is known about those companies and I don't want to bore you with just a short description.
  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 07:52 PM
    Response to Reply #96
    105. I was looking into the asbestos thing
    on a thread here awhile ago. There was also a man who gave a lecture at the NY Public Library claiming that the WTC had galvanic corrosion on the exterior due to the conmbination of aluminum and steel. He is the only credible source for this I could find and he was a NY resident who was remembering reading about it. I came across Grace at that time. This galvanic corrosion was going to cost a lot of money to repair. I also found evidence of corrosion underneath in the subway area, which was documented, but no real proof of the galvanic corrosion on the wtc.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 02:13 AM
    Response to Reply #96
    113. Sordid Past
    Edited on Wed Jul-05-06 02:17 AM by mirandapriestly
    So W R Grace was involved in Operation Paperclip, a program to bring Nazi Scientists to the U.S.! They hired Otto Ambros as a consultant, a former concentration camp supervisor who had endorsed the brutality of enslaved workers in order to improve production. It is weird, there are bits and pieces of this on the web but most links that I hit have removed the information.

    W.R. Grace indicted over asbestos claims
    Seven executives have also been charged with conspiring to release asbestos; Firm denies wrongdoing.
    February 7, 2005: 6:33 PM EST

    WASHINGTON (CNN) - W.R. Grace & Co. and seven of the corporation's executives were indicted Monday for engaging in a long-running conspiracy to "knowingly release" hazardous asbestos fibers that placed the entire town of Libby, Montana, "in imminent danger of death or serious bodily injury," the Justice Department announced.

    The indictment says for many years company officials knew, and tried to hide, the dangers to the community of 8,000 residents from its hazardous mining operation. Prosecutors say 1,200 residents of Libby have suffered lung diseases and related pleural abnormalities from exposure to tremolite asbestos. The document says more than 20 town residents suffered "an extremely rare and fatal form of cancer in humans known as mesothelioma."

    Asbestos Exposure News
    "Asbestos cover-up"

    July 16, 2004
    According to an Environmental Protection Agency memo, after the World
    Trade Center collapse, city and federal officials concealed data
    showing lower Manhattan air had more than double the level of asbestos
    considered safe for humans. Despite this, the public was told it was
    safe to return downtown. City tests were so overloaded September 13
    with asbestos in the air that the lab could not conclude asbestos
    levels. The city never released the asbestos information to the public,
    and information on it's Website had 17 instances of understated or
    blank data.,,5008-4090727,00.html

    Execs Charged Over Asbestos Cover-Up
    08/02/2005 04:50 PM - Reuters - James Vicini

    WR Grace & Co and seven current or former executives were charged on
    Monday with conspiring to endanger residents in Libby, Montana, and
    concealing the health risks from asbestos-contaminated vermiculite, the
    US Justice Department said.

    According to the indictment returned by a federal grand jury in
    Montana, Grace spread the asbestos throughout the community to such
    locations as commercial buildings and schools, including an outdoor ice
    skating rink, school running tracks and baseball fields.

    The 10-count indictment charges the defendants with conspiracy,
    clean-air violations, wire fraud and obstruction of justice involving
    asbestos-related diseases linked to its former vermiculite mining and
    processing operations.

    Mining company guilty of asbestos cover-up in Libby

    Tristan Scott
    Montana Kaimin

    Top employees of W.R. Grace & Co. knew its Montana mine was releasing
    dangerous cancer-causing asbestos into the air and even conspired to
    hide the known hazards from workers and area residents, according to a
    federal grand jury indictment released Monday.

    Grace and its employees are charged with releasing tremolite asbestos
    - a carcinogen found in vermiculite ore - into the air and
    hindering federal investigations, including a 1999 inspection conducted
    by the Environmental Protection Agency, which former manager Alan
    Stringer tried to inhibit by giving false and misleading information he
    knew was inaccurate.

    Grace filed for bankruptcy in 2001 after the company was bombarded with
    asbestos-related lawsuits.

    9/11 Memo Reveals Asbestos 'Cover-Up'
    By Sam Smith, July 16, 2004

    An Environmental Protection Agency memo claims city and federal
    officials concealed data that showed lower Manhattan air was clouded
    with asbestos after the World Trade Center collapse.

    And officials sat on the alarming information even as they told the
    public it was safe to return downtown, the internal memo says. Testing
    by the city Department of Environmental Protection showed the air
    downtown had more than double the level of asbestos considered safe for
    humans, claimed federal EPA environmental scientist Cate Jenkins, who
    supplied the memo to The Post.

    The data, which Jenkins says she culled from state records, appear
    damning. On the day after the attack, the memo claims, city test
    results from the corner of Centre and Chambers streets and from the
    corner of Spruce and Gold streets showed asbestos concentration at
    about twice the level considered safe by the EPA.
    The city did not release this information to the public, Jenkins says.

    The next day, Sept. 13, city tests were "overloaded" with asbestos in
    the air =AD so much that the lab could not conclude precise amounts =AD
    along Church Street.
    Again, the information was withheld, the memo claims.

    When the city published the test results for the weeks following 9/11
    on its Web site in February 2002, there were 17 instances where the
    data was either understated or left blank, Jenkins asserts in her

    There 's more, including a sexual harassment suit , but you get the picture...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 06:43 AM
    Response to Reply #96
    134.  W.R. Grace
    Edited on Tue Jul-18-06 06:48 AM by seemslikeadream

    The Paul Wellstone crash was.....

    The NTSB report of the crash that killed the WR Grace employees

    Asbestos keeps cropping up....
    Ahhhhh asbestos....I am keenly interested in asbestos....

    1999 Halliburton CEO - Cheney aquires Dresser (Harbison-Walker)

    Dresser is a longtime Bush family company.

    These companies were steeped in the Asbestos quagmire. At the edge of ruin. 200,000 asbestos claims that could reach 2-3 million a piece.

    In June of 2002 Halliburton had lost a large claim and sent the stock tumbling to a dangerous low.

    I believe Cheney took on Dresser as a favor to GHWBush and the Bush family. His task was to prevent Asbestos claims from destroying Dresser and Harbison-Walker. Using his defence contacts he was able to secure BILLIONS of U.S. dollars in a war in Iraq to bolster HAL stock and give time for Buddies like Orin Hatch to push a bad asbestos liability bill through congress. Which required a GOP controlled senate. Wellstone dies in a crash. As a asbestos victim advocate he would NEVER of stood and allowed the Asbestos bill introduced by Hatch to live as long as it did. They spent millions on ads trying to convince limiting asbestos liability was good for victims.

    The bill now stalled or dead has disappeared from the public as the war in Iraq and the election dominates the media.

    The asbestos libility and estimated 750,000 claims is the single most expensive liability claim tracked to a single cause in U.S. history. Tort reform and Judicial appointments all now appear to guided by the outcome of this bill. Interestingly enough the public is now being hit with another campaign to allow Bush judicial appointments to go ahead.

    For Bush to not gain the Presidency in November will certainly mean that any asbestos friendly legislation will be difficult if not impossible to pass. Funds pooling into Halliburton as a result of Cheney's open ended no-bid contracts will surely end and put Halliburton at risk for complete dissolution as law suits send the company spiraling into financial oblivion.

    With the above threads it really looks like there has been a huge effort on the part of many big corporate type GOPers to make sure asbestos does not cause major economic strife for a large portion of U.S. industry. Much of which is the backbone of the U.S. military industrial complex.

    It sickens me the length people will go to protect money and allow people to suffer generation after generation.

    environmental liabilities -- $1 BILLION
    Grace told the Securities and Exchange Commission in 1998 that its liability for environmental cleanups was more than S230 million. But some EPA officials estimate the company's environmental liabilities to be "substantially greater," adding that it could be closer to $1 billion.

    Plane Crashes, WR Grace, Deadly Asbestos, WTC Collapse & Wellstone
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 07:53 AM
    Response to Reply #134
    135. NTSB report of the crash that killed the WR Grace employees
    From your links:

    The National Transportation Safety Board determines the probable cause(s) of this accident as follows:
    the airplane's loss of pitch control during take-off. The loss of pitch control resulted from the incorrect rigging of the elevator system compounded by the airplane's aft center of gravity, which was substaintially aft of the certified aft limit.

    (4) the Raytheon Aerospace quality assurance inspector's failure to detect the incorrect rigging of the elevator control system;

    From all the discussions upto now it is clear that Raytheon is a front organization.

    Let's add this little image as well:

    Washington Times, August 15, 2000

    More blood lust from the Wehrmacht/Criminal Intelligence Agency!
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 08:44 AM
    Response to Original message
    98. Hotel and Restaurant Employees International
    The Hotel Employees and Restaurant Employees International Union (HERE), was a United States labor union representing workers of the hospitality industry, formed in 1891. In 2004, HERE merged with the Union of Needletrades, Industrial, and Textile Employees (UNITE) to form UNITE HERE. HERE notably organized the staff of Yale University in 1984. Major employers contracted in this union include several large casinos (Harrah's, Caesars, and Wynn Resorts); hotels (Hilton, Hyatt and Starwood), and Walt Disney World. HERE and later UNITE HERE were affiliated with the AFL-CIO until September 2005, when the General Executive Board of UNITE HERE voted in to leave the AFL-CIO and join with the Change to Win Coalition. (1)

    Hotel Employees and Restaurant Employees International had offices on both WTC1 and WTC7 employing 277 people. The office on the 107th floor of WTC1 suffered 77 casualties.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 01:09 PM
    Response to Original message
    100. Baseline Financial (WTC2 impact area)
    Edited on Tue Jul-04-06 01:16 PM by DrDebug
    It's surprisingly difficult to get a complete overview of all the companies in WTC. Like mentioned about First Commercial Bank was small office of bank and not much was known about it. However on a number of tenant lists Baseline Financial is listed on the 77th and 78th floor and appears much more relevant than First Commercial Bank.

    Baseline Financial is part of the Thomson Corporation. The Thomson Corporation is one of the world's leading information companies, focused on providing integrated information solutions to business and professional customers.

    The company operates through four groups:
    Thomson Legal and Regulatory;
    Thomson Learning;
    Thomson Financial;
    and Thomson Scientific and Healthcare.

    Thomson started out with newspapers in the United Kingdom, including The Sunday Times and The Scotsman, and it owned Scottish Television and later purchased the The Times of London. The media assets were sold to Rupert Murdoch's News Corporation.

    Baseline Financial had offices on the 77th and 78th floor of WTC2 and employed 175 people and suffered three casualties during 9/11.

    Chairman: David K.R. Thomson

    Edit: Murdoch needs special emphasis...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 03:28 PM
    Response to Original message
    101. WTC 5: Credit Suisse First Boston
    A lot of companies in WTC1, WTC2 and WTC7 have been described. Time for a "forgotten" building WTC5. It is a pretty complex building, because it is a lot more than just 9 floors and I haven't seen a description of it yet, so this the first attempt.

    WTC5 was a 9-story low-rise office building in the southeast corner of the site, in Lower Manhattan, New York City. It was damaged beyond repair as a result of the 9/11 attacks and was later demolished. (1)

    Floor plan
    (# employees, # victims). Courier is inside trader.

    Both Lower Manhattan Council and Credit Suisse have one victim during 9/11. Also Credit Suisse (2) has 850 employees on just three floors which is probably a bit crowded, because that's almost 300 per floor.

    Credit Suisse First Boston
    Credit Suisse First Boston is a bulge bracket New York City based investment banking and financial services firm. It is a division of the Credit Suisse group and has started operating under the Credit Suisse name since 16 January 2006. (3)

  • CEO: K. Abraar Ahmed
  • Chairman: Walter B. Kielholz

    Credit Suisse occupied the 7th-9th floors in WTC5 with 850 employees. On the morning of 9/11, the managing director Steven Glick was in a meeting on the 106th floor in WTC1 at Cantor Fitzgerald. (4)

  • Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 07:24 PM
    Response to Original message
    102. Kroll. Changes at the top around 9/11: VP: Michael D. Shmerling

    Excerpted from the Stockholder report:


    Thomas E. Constance has been a partner in the law firm of Kramer Levin Naftalis & Frankel LLP since 1994. From 1973 to 1994, Mr. Constance was with the law firm of Shea & Gould. Mr. Constance is a director of Uniroyal Technology Corp. and Siga Technologies Inc. He has been a director of Kroll since December 2000. Age 66.

    Michael D. Shmerling has been Executive Vice President of Kroll since September 20, 2001 and was Chief Operating Officer of Kroll from May 15, 2001 through December 2002. He has held the position of President of the Background Screening Group since June 1999. Mr. Shmerling was one of the founders of Background America, Inc., a company providing background investigations services to governments, corporations and other professional clients, and from September 1995 to June 1999 served as President of Background America, which was acquired by Kroll in June 1999. In 1990, he co-founded Correction Management Affiliates, Inc., a private correctional facility management company.

    In 1989, he co-founded Transcor America, Inc., a nationwide prison transportation company. He served as Chairman of the Board of Transcor America, Inc. until he resigned to dedicate his time to Correction Partners, Inc., a private prison management company majority-owned by Correction Management Affiliates, Inc. In 1994 and 1995, all of the above correctional management companies were sold to Corrections Corporation of America. Mr. Shmerling is a Certified Public Accountant (inactive), and a member of the American Institute of Certificate Public Accountants. He practiced as an accountant for more than 15 years. From 1977 to 1980, he was a member of the professional staff of certified public accountants at Ernst & Young.

    Mr. Shmerling is also a director of Capital Bank & Trust Co., Inc. He has been a director of Kroll since August 2001. Age 47.


    J. Arthur Urciuoli has been Chairman of Archer Group, a provider of private investment and consulting services, since 1999. Mr. Urciuoli served with Merrill Lynch & Company, Inc. from 1969 to 1999. He was Chairman of Merrill Lynchs International Private Client Group and was responsible for strategic development and acquisitions from 1997 to 1999. He was Director of the Marketing Group of Merrill Lynch Private Client Group from 1993 to 1997. He also served as Chairman of the Mutual Fund Forum/ Forum for Investor Advice from 1997 to 1998 and as Chairman of the Sales and Marketing Committee of the Securities Industry Association from 1986 to 1989. Mr. Urciuoli is an advisory director of deVisscher, Olson and Allan LLC. He has been a director of Kroll since August 2001. Age 65.

    So who was VP before Michael D. Shmerling...
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-04-06 08:02 PM
    Response to Reply #102
    106. Michael A. Petrullo (33) vice president between Aug and Nov 2001
    Edited on Tue Jul-04-06 08:05 PM by DrDebug
    It is not the VP I was looking for, however this rookie is going up fast...

    Let's start with an old timer from Spain with interesting connections who is a member of their boards:

    Oscar Fanjul
    Audit Committee
    Compensation Committee
    Director since 2001

    Mr. Fanjul, age 56, is vice chairman and chief executive officer of Omega Capital, a private investment firm in Spain. Mr. Fanjul is honorary chairman of Repsol YPF (1), where he was chairman and chief executive officer from its inception in 1986 until 1996. He was chairman of Hidroelctrica del Cantbrico from 1999 to 2001 and chairman of NH Hoteles from 1997 until 1999. Mr. Fanjul is a director of Acerinox, the Lafarge Group, the London Stock Exchange, Unilever, Marsh S.A. and a member of MMC?s International Advisory Board. He is a trustee of the International Accounting Standards Committee Foundation and the Amigos del Museo del Prado.

    Repsol is the largest Spanish oil company. A former CEO of one of the ten largest oil companies in the world. Talk about a minor player: London Stock Exchange, Unilever, Marsh, and a quick search brings up Carlyle Group, Trilateral Commission, Goldman Sachs etc. etc.

    Back to Michael and his career:

    Michael A. Petrullo, age 37, is senior vice president and chief administrative officer of MMC. After MMC's acquisition of Kroll in July 2004, Mr. Petrullo became chief financial officer for the risk consulting businesses of Marsh and Kroll until assuming his current position with MMC in January 2005. Mr. Petrullo was chief operating officer and executive vice president of Kroll Inc. from December 2002 to July 2004. Prior thereto, he was deputy chief operating officer of Kroll from June through December of 2002, the acting chief financial officer of Kroll from November 2001 to June 2002, and vice president and controller of Kroll from August 2001 to November 2001. He was vice president-finance of Kroll's Investigations and Intelligence Group from February 1999 until August 2001. He joined Kroll Associates in 1995, serving as assistant controller through February 1998.

    And his 9/11 job means that his salary goes from $155,000 + $20,000 bonus to an amazing $187,083 + #110,000 bonus. Michael Cherkasky who never got a bonus and suddenly gets $415,000 as well. I wonder why... (1) and that for a guy who admits at 33 he knew that he was still a little too wet behind the ears (2)

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 05:51 AM
    Response to Original message
    118. IQ Financial Systems (Why are all the tenant lists incomplete?) 83 fl WTC2
    Edited on Wed Jul-05-06 05:55 AM by DrDebug
    IQ Financial Systems is a leading provider of capital markets and commercial lending software products and services to over 100 financial institutions worldwide. IQ Financial has offices in New York, London, Tokyo, Singapore and Hong Kong. Their major client was Fuji bank (1)

    Misys plc, the global software products and solutions company, announced in 2004 it has acquired substantially all of the assets and liabilities of IQ Financial Systems a majority held subsidiary of Deutsche Bank for $40m in cash. (2)

    IQ Financial Systems had an office on the 83th floor of WTC2 with 110 employees and was located in the middle of the impact area during the 9/11. Three employees did not survice.


    Funny. You would think that Deutsche Bank (biggest European bank) and Fuji Bank (one of the biggest Japanese banks) are competitors in the global banking game and were both trying to get a slice of the US market, but instead they are helping each other...

    I guess that their extensive mutual CIA relations make all the difference.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-07-06 09:49 PM
    Response to Reply #118
    132. Two good tenant lists
    One is Dunn & Bradstreet, the other is French and has the "date d'installation", which I think is the date they signed the lease?'American%20Lota%20International'

    I haven't disappeared I am in the middle of looking up all the more obscure companies.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 10:23 AM
    Response to Original message
    120. Fiduciary Trust (Thomas Kean and Ann Tatlock but lost 76)
    Fiduciary Trust Company International is a member of Franklin Templeton Investments and a global asset management firm established in 1931 to serve private clients and institutions. One of the worlds oldest global investment firms, Fiduciary Trust Company International manages assets for institutions, individuals, and families through offices in New York, Miami, Los Angeles, Washington, Wilmington, London, Geneva, Hong Kong, Melbourne, Tokyo, and Grand Cayman. Along with global investment expertise, Fiduciary Trust provides client-tailored portfolio management and independent in-house research and analysis. (1) Fiduciary Trust also does Risk management.

    Fiduciary Trust had offices at the top of WTC2 and lost 76 of their 645 employees.

    Thomas Kean
    Thomas Kean, the Chairman of the 9-11 Commission was at the time of his appointment director of Amerada Hess Corporation and Aramark Corporation, and had previously served as director of UnitedHealth Group, Bell Atlantic Corp (now Verizon) and CIT Group, as well as being a former chairman and board member of Fiduciary Trust Company International and Pepsi Bottling Group. (2)

    CEO of Fiduciary and Warren Buffet
    So where was Warren Buffett (4) the morning of 9/11 and what was he doing?

    Mr. Buffett was reportedly at his home in Omaha, Nebraska watching TV when he heard about the terrorist attacks. He was getting ready to host his "last annual golf charity event" which just happened to be at the U.S. Strategic Command headquarters located at Offutt Air Force Base in Omaha. Offutt AFB is, coincidentally, where President G. W. Bush flew to on Air Force One later in the day for "safety". This early golf charity event hosted by Mr. Buffett was to include celebrities, professional athletes, and a small group of business leaders in which one of these business leaders became a very lucky person.

    This very lucky person was Ann Tatlock, the CEO of Fiduciary Trust Co. International. Now what made Mrs. Tatlock such a lucky person for being invited to this charity event that morning? Mrs. Tatlock not only works in the World Trade Center, but her offices were right where Flight 175 alledgely crashed into the WTC 2. (3)

    4. Where did I see the name Warren Buffett before. Was that American Express?
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-05-06 11:58 AM
    Response to Original message
    122. Since the OP is severely outdated now. Will continue at part III
    Edited on Wed Jul-05-06 12:45 PM by DrDebug
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    wildbilln864 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-09-06 12:47 AM
    Response to Original message
    136. boosting..
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    Anarcho-Socialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-09-06 04:37 AM
    Response to Original message
    137. Yay, more TRUTH
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    wildbilln864 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-14-07 12:06 PM
    Response to Original message
    138. Must
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    wildbilln864 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-15-07 12:55 AM
    Response to Original message
    139. kick! n/t
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    reinhardt Donating Member (122 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-17-07 09:57 PM
    Response to Original message
    140. That was then.. this is now.
    10/17/2007; The 2007 Pilgrimage To Rome Is Happening Right Now; This Is How You Debase A Market

    24/05/1999 Al Gore backs aid to faith-based groups in speech to Salvation Army facility in Atlanta.

    The following is the political definition of aid to faith-based groups.

    07/1999 Tyco wires $15 million to one of Kozlowskis personal accounts and $10 million to a personal account of Mr. Schwartz.

    22/07/1999 (WSJ316) Texas Gov. George W. Bush tells an Indianapolis audience that aid to faith-based groups will rally Americas armies of compassion to solve social ills (this is a biblical metaphor).

    Here comes a little more of Gore & Bushs aid to faith-based groups.

    08/1999 $38.5 million bonus paid in the form of loan forgiveness to Schwartz ($12.5 million) and Kozlowski ($25 million) and $1 million to another person. Note: Phillip Hampton (dead-man defense) chairman of Tyco compensation committee.

    The accounts of Kozlowski, Belnick, and Schwartz are all being filled prior to the pilgrimage to Rome.

    22/09/1999 Belnick files to sell 75,000 shares, worth an estimated $7.5 million, that he acquired through an exercise of options and from an employee benefit plan.

    30/09/1999 (WSJ300) Belnick receives the first of several huge Tyco payments: $3.4 million from the sale of restricted company shares.

    The same day!

    30/09/1999 Members of the organization of Catholic businessmen begin their 1999 Pilgrimage to Rome with a Mass in the Church of Santo Spirito celebrated by Archbishop John Foley. The Pilgrimage lasts until October 07, 1999.

    10/1999 Barbara Ley Toffler ends work at Arthur Anderson four years to the day after she started.

    10/1999 (WSJ101) Frank Savage Joins Enrons board. He will be a member of the boards finance committee. He is also on the board of Lockheed Martin Corp. WSJ reports this is the day after Enron suspends ethics code for the second time. This move enables CFO Andrew Fastow to head two controversial partnerships that kept significant debt off of the books. Savage subsequently votes to create other off-balance sheet vehicles and suspends the ethics code a third time. (note: the IRS conspired to allow Enron to avoid taxes since Project Tanya in 1996) Note: Harvards Toffler ended work with Arthur Anderson this month!

    10/1999 (WSJ338) Enron launches Enron Online and racks up more than $180 billion in transactions in the first year. Note: The IRS only bills them for $64 million.

    06/10/1999 Belnick emails Father McCloskey to say: Im sending you my check for $2M for my pledge to the new Sanctuary/Alter in the Catholic Information Center in Washington. My note: Some of that faith-based funding stuff is starting to enter the scene. Belnick is actually laundering money between the church and Tyco.

    Note: The radical Islamic Muslim extremists begin to wonder why a Jewish attorney is laundering money from Tyco to Catholic institutions?

    06/10/1999; Wednesday October 06 1999; 05:02 pm Eastern Time; Yahoo Message Board: TYC (Tyco); Post #4545; The lawyer is shedding some stock Probably buying a boat wonder what he knows?

    Washington October 06 (Reuters) - Mark Belnick, chief corporate counsel and executive vice-president at Tyco International Ltd. (NYSE:TYC - news), filed to sell about $7.5 million in stock, a Securities and Exchange Commission filing said. Belnick filed September 22 to sell 75,000 shares, worth an estimated $7.5 million, that he acquired through an exercise of options and from an employee benefit plan, the filing said.

    06/10/1999 Tyco shares are up 1-1/8 to $106-1/8 on the NYSE.

    See the next day!

    07/10/1999 Date of the end of recent Legatus Pilgrimage. Note: The Catholic Information Center in Washington looted Tyco, not Belnick. Belnick was simply the courier.

    Note: See next day!!!!!

    08/10/1999 David Tice (Dallas-based market analyst) sends out report regarding Tycos accounting practices. Note: In reality, the report should have mentioned money-laundering but it didnt. Note: This is the day following the end of the Legatus pilgrimage. The check is in the mail as of two days ago. The Catholic Information Center gets its money. The Legatus tough choices are chosen. The beans can be spilled.

    13/10/1999 Tyco calls rumors unfounded and malicious. This is a Wednesday (six days after the Legatus Pilgrimage).

    29/10/1999 Tyco issues response to New York Times article. Note: The NYT is (intentionally) debasing Tyco share value.

    31/10/1999 EgyptAir crashes a half-hour after the plane takes off from New Yorks John F. Kennedy Airport.

    11/1999 (WSJ300) Tyco accounting practices begin attracting skeptical press reports. The SEC commission launches a probe.

    The SEC is faking it.

    02/11/1999 (WSJ300) Father McCloskey emails Belnick: I pray you are weathering well the Tyco tempest.

    05/11/1999 (WSJ300) Belnick emails Father McCloskey blaming the government inquiry on rumormongers. He adds that Tycos woes were nothing compared to the problems of Mother Theresas earthly charges or the glory of her boss. (note: yet another biblical analogy to white-collar crime)

    Jason, this is how you debase your companys share value.

    05/11/1999 (WSJ27) WSJ reports the Senate overwhelmingly approved, by a vote of 90-8 a landmark financial services overhaul of restrictions in the Glass-Steagall law.

    16/11/1999 George H. W. Bush and his wife sell 100,000 shares of Global Crossing for $4.45 million.

    12/1999 (WSJ563) Omar Sheikh is freed from an Indian Jail - where he was serving time for kidnapping American (and British) citizens in Delhi - in exchange for the release of 150 Indians whose flight had been hijacked to Kandahar by Islamic terrorists. (According to an eyewitness, Mr. Bernard-Henri Levy reports, Sheikh was received in Kandahar by an ISI operative.)

    09/12/1999 Tyco announces the SEC is conducting an informal inquiry related to charges and reserves taken in connection with the companys acquisitions.

    22/12/1999 Lawfirm Stull, Stull and Brody announce class action against Tyco. Kaplan, Kilsheimer and Fox also file a class action against Tyco in the district of New Hampshire. Other law-firms include Bernstein, Liebhard and Lifshitz. Schoengold and Sporn. Note: They are debasing Tyco stock value and they are rounding up who knows what to make certain that knowledge of what really happened stays.. at the tip of the iceberg.

    10/03/2000 Nasdaq closes at 5048.62 after hitting an intraday high of 5132.52.

    Mark Belnick and Warren Rudman had re-structured and governed the NASD between 1994 and 1995.

    24/02/2000 (WSJ300) Belnick laments in an email to Father McCloskey that he lacks spousal consent.

    28/02/2000 (WSJ300) Day Belnick had planned to convert to Catholicism.

    The Legatus Pilgrimage of 2007 is occurring this week and it ends on the 22nd of October 2007.

    The 23rd of October 2007 is when a Dallas-based market analyst sends out a report regarding accounting practices.

    For the record todays date is October 17th 2007.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    MinM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 03:25 PM
    Response to Original message
    145. Probe of USS Cole Bombing Unravels | What if...
    Probe of USS Cole Bombing Unravels

    What if...

    This is the scenario that might have played out in Yemen and the one that still bothers O'Neill's former allies and supporters. For them, it is conceivable that, in the end, John O'Neill would have been able to learn about that critical January 2000 meeting in Malaysia, and to start connecting the dots that ultimately led to Sept. 11, 2001.
    Posted May 4, 2008 08:57 AM PST

    Note that the WAPO article neglects to mention Amb. Bodine refused to grant country clearance to the FBI after the initial trip to investigate the Cole bombing. Bodine went on to work for the CPA in Baghdad.

    The last investigation of FBI agent John O'Neil? The Cole bombing. O'Neil was later killed in the WTC on 9-11, the first day of his new job there as Chief of Security...

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    MinM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-04-10 09:28 AM
    Response to Reply #145
    149. Yemen 2K 9/11 Yemen 2K9/10
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    MinM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-04-10 10:27 AM
    Response to Reply #149
    150.  Embassies shut after 'Yemen lost track of arms trucks'

    This comes on the heels of this editorial...

    Why shouldn't we waterboard Abdulmutallab? The ticking time bomb scenario is here

    the circle is closing.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    procopia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-04-10 12:21 PM
    Response to Reply #150
    151. Thanks for kicking
    I wasn't aware of DrDebug's journal.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    rschop Donating Member (493 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-08-10 02:32 PM
    Response to Reply #145
    152. K&R
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    aldo Donating Member (297 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-19-08 01:37 PM
    Response to Original message
    146. Why do you think he's dead?
    An inside job needs an inside man. John O'Neill's nickname at the FBI was Satan, I doubt if there was no reason for that. Plastic surgery & a million dollars can do wonders.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 12:01 AM
    Response to Reply #146
    147. 57 posts and a disabled profile...
    Does it matter or make any difference to the above threads.

    The story of John O'Neill is a very strange one. First he was forced out of the FBI. Jerome Hauer arranged a new job for him with Kroll at the World Trade Center. He was already on record that he knew that the towers were coming down, so he must have known something.

    On 9/11 John O'Neill was in his office when the WTC1 got "hit" / "blown up from the inside" Not soon after he was in the lobby of WTC1. Then John O'Neill went outside. Nobody has seen him or knows where he was going to. Several weeks (just search for the date) he was identified by none other than Jerome Hauer as deceased from having WTC2 tumble on top of him.

    Indeed the later point is the most curious part of the story, because if John O'Neill got buried under a 110 story building, there wouldn't be much to identify him by ... and ... the identification was made by Jerome Hauer (mastermind of OEM, Kroll, and much more in the links above)

    So even if John O'Neill is alive and was part of the conspiracy, it would have been his death which leads to Jerome Hauer, and Kroll which leads to Marsh which leads to the OP which still stands, just like it did TWO YEARS ago.

    And if John O'Neill is dead, it could have been from having being hit by a building, however there are no eyewitnesses that he was there even though he was a well-known figure. Another alternative is foul play.

    P.S. Nice touch calling John O'Neill Satan. Using an insult to undermine a story is pretty childish..
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-11-09 09:26 PM
    Response to Original message
    148. The empires operatives exposed: The Krongards, 9/11, and Blackwater/Iraq
    Thanks for remembering John O'Neill, DrDebug.

    Something this thread needs:

    The empires operatives exposed: The Krongards, 9/11, and Blackwater/Iraq
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-21-10 01:05 AM
    Response to Reply #148
    153. Timely Kick.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-21-10 01:19 AM
    Response to Original message
    154. Deleted message
    Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
    Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-26-10 12:25 PM
    Response to Reply #154
    155. Deleted message
    Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
    IScreamSundays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 08:26 PM
    Response to Original message
    156. I always loved this thread. nt
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-06-10 01:01 AM
    Response to Original message
    157. Kick
    Edited on Mon Dec-06-10 01:22 AM by deconstruct911
    The OCT keep asking why like this thread never existed.

    A simple example. We estimate that Berkshire Hathaway and General Re combined will write around $12 billion in nonlife reinsurance premiums in 2001 and $2 billion in life/health insurance. We also estimate Berkshires probably largest loss from this event <9/11> at around $1.5 billion or roughly 11 percent of premiums. Looked at very simply therefore, a price increase of 11 percent on unchanged volume would recoup Berkshires entire loss from the World Trade Center.

    We expect Berkshires volume to increase significantly -- probably more than 25 percent. We expect rates to rise considerably more than 11 percent. Without trying to be overly precise, therefore, its clear that the largest reinsurers should fare better as the flight to quality steers customers back to reinsurers who can, without question, pay claims.$12+billion+in+nonlife+reinsurance+premiums&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

    "According to the Consumer Federation of America, insurers reported a 66.4 percent increase in profits in the first six months of 2002 thus suggesting the consequences of 9/11 were not as dire for them as they were for thousands of others."
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    mrarundale Donating Member (281 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-10 10:37 PM
    Response to Original message
    158. Election Fraud King Choicepoint also got WTC DNA contract
    Edited on Thu Dec-09-10 10:38 PM by mrarundale
    right after 911. (post #29) Also DBT, a subsidiary of CP, CEO Hank Asher, was involved in Bahamian drug smuggling. Now, I am really going to trust that DNA database (it is now Bode Technologies) and is still being used by the NYME. The NYME 's office was busted redirecting victims's funds into shell companies:

    NY AND NJ funeral homes were caught selling body parts:

    Look at the Marsh "victim's" names and read how bizarre their "memorials" are.

    The DrDeBug threads are way better than wikifuckingleaks., but you're not going to hear it 24/7 on Faux or National Petroleum (disguised as "charitable foundations") Radio.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-31-10 10:11 PM
    Response to Original message
    160. Great to have all of this info on the record here ...
    Edited on Fri Dec-31-10 10:21 PM by defendandprotect
    Thank you --
    Will take some time to even review --
    and guess I have to start with finding Part I, first --

    but would also comment that the more I think about this financial coup
    the more it seems to me connected to all of the rest of right wing's
    shock and awe -- from JFK and through to 9/11 -- and the bail outs.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 04:58 PM
    Response to Reply #160
    161. part I
    Edited on Sat Jan-01-11 04:59 PM by deconstruct911
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-02-11 02:09 AM
    Response to Reply #161
    163. Thank you -- just checked in to try to catch up ...!!
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-01-11 06:40 PM
    Response to Original message
    162. Might as well add Kroll was hired to supervise the relocation of the gold

    "Asked about what appeared to be an attempted break-in two weeks ago, Ms. Agnew said that she was unaware of it. Later, she called to reiterate that the metals were safe: ''It would be factually incorrect to say there had been any attempt to steal the contents of our vault.''

    However, a government official involved in the recovery efforts said that there had clearly been an attempt within the last two weeks to enter the vault area. ''It looked like they used a blowtorch, a crowbar,'' said the official, who spoke on the condition that neither his name nor his position be identified. ''The Port Authority police began periodic patrols, and then a closed-circuit television system was put in.''

    The bank also engaged Kroll Inc., a security business based in New York, to supervise the relocation of the gold and silver, a process that began this week, The Daily News reported yesterday.

    Michael Cherkasky, the president of Kroll, declined to comment on his company's involvement.

    Anyone trying to make off with the gold would not be able to run very fast: each ingot weighs 70 pounds."
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-01-11 08:37 PM
    Response to Original message
    164. Ontrack.....
    Edited on Tue Feb-01-11 09:06 PM by deconstruct911
    "The Deal: Kroll Inc. has agreed to buy Ontrack Data International for $12.50 per Ontrack share, or about $140 million, in stock. The transaction is anticipated to close late in the second quarter or early in the third quarter of 2002."


    "Ontrack had Kroll as one of their investors, a subsidiary of risk consulting company Kroll O'Gara (former Kroll Associates, Inc),"


    ONTRACK(R) is a registered trademark of Kroll Ontrack Inc.
    (c) 1995-2009 Kroll Ontrack Inc.


    "Sean Barry - Sean is a senior data recovery engineer with Kroll Ontrack, the largest, most experienced and technologically advanced provider of data recovery products and services in the world. He also serves as a training coordinator for the data recovery department. In April 2006, Sean was a guest speaker at Ontrack's Data Recovery Symposium. Sean has been with Kroll Ontrack since 1997. Hes been instrumental in supporting and developing numerous technologies for the company and focuses on providing the highest quality data recovery solutions for computer data disasters."


    "Thalhuber was also founder and owner of Jenex Consulting, a company specializing in
    business development, planning and strategy. Thalhuber held an executive management role
    with Kroll Ontrack, a technology firm providing legal professionals with electronic discovery
    litigation support software and services. She led the initiative to develop a key business
    division that resulted in multi-year double-digit growth in both revenue and net income and
    included staff selection to help manage the growth opportunity. Thalhuber received the Kroll
    Ontrack Leadership Award in 1999."

    Monday, June 3, 1996
    "With its secure facilities and safeguarding capabilities, Ontrack addresses the handling and processing requirements of sensitive information, and currently holds numerous prime contracts with government agencies for data recovery and media declassification services. A representative list of Ontracks government customers includes the FBI, DEA, USDA, GSA, Department of Energy, State Department, Postal Service, FAA, and numerous military agencies. In June, 1995, Ontrack was recognized for its commitment to the security requirements of the federal government when it was awarded the Department of Defense James S. Cogswell Outstanding Industrial Security Achievement Award."

    So if Ontrack has always been bigger than Convar, why didn't we hear about Ontrack getting contracts for the hard-drives? The FBI and Military already held contracts with Ontrack and apparently Kroll was involved with Ontrack before 9/11???
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-02-11 01:41 AM
    Response to Reply #164
    165. Ontrack: 1993 world trade center bombing:
    Edited on Wed Feb-02-11 01:49 AM by deconstruct911
    MINNEAPOLIS, March 9 /PRNewswire


    World Trade Center computer users who discover that their computer hard disk drives have sustained fire-related or other physical damage may be able to recover usable data from even severely impaired drives. Data may be restored from computers that have soot, moisture and halon damage, or that appear melted and beyond repair, according to Stuart Hanley, engineering manager for Ontrack Data Recovery, Inc.
    Hanley offered the following advice to computer users who discover that their drive or data may have been damaged by the bombing:
    -- Do not attempt to operate a visibly damaged hard drive. As Hanley explained, "In this state, the drive and data are both extremely vulnerable and the drive should not be run without the supervision of an engineer attuned to symptoms of distress." In the case of smoke exposure, the same principle holds true for systems without visible damage. "Data platters exposed to soot and moisture particles may be irreversibly damaged if not recovered in an air and static controlled clean room."
    -- Do not use diskettes or tapes that have been exposed to heat, moisture or soot. Again Hanley cautioned, "To ensure a successful data restoration, any diskettes or tapes that are suspect need to be properly cleaned. Even minute particles on data tracks can gouge the media and destroy data."
    -- Do not attempt to recover data with commonly available utility software programs. "Under these circumstances, even minor manipulations may collapse any hope for a successful data recovery," reported Hanley.
    -- Do not shake or remove the cover on the hard drive assembly. "This may void the drive manufacturer's warranty and aggravate the already fragile condition of the data platters. The drive casing should only be opened in the controlled environment of a clean room," said Hanley.
    In the event of a disaster, the loss of valuable data is more critical than ever. Often, many or all of the computers contained within a business are damaged -- along with the backups -- multiplying losses and compromising normal business operations dramatically. In a study measuring the ability of businesses to perform basic functions following a computer disaster, the University of Minnesota found the following: a 30 percent decline in productivity among business without data access for two days, and a 90 percent drop after a 10-day period.
    "For businesses that are stalled until accounting records, customer information, or engineering data can be restored, the costs of a recovery operation are almost always less than the cost of downtime, and of rekeying lost data," reported Hanley. Ontrack can return usable data to customers quickly -- immediately when on location -- avoiding a costly and lengthy downtime period.
    Ontrack's 24-hour support includes the ability to dispatch data recovery engineers to any location for immediate on-site data restoration. The firm has an extensive success record, having recovered data from hard disk drives, floppy diskettes, and tape backups that have become inoperable due to mechanical or circuit failures, software problems, and damage suffered through fire and other disaster conditions. Costs for the company's data recovery services normally depend on the complexity of the recovery problem, however, discounted and expedited service is planned for bombing victims. In addition to Ontrack's 24-hour support and on-site service, they have established a hotline number (800-872-2599) for World Trade Center customers.
    The company can restore data from computers with DOS, NetWare, Windows, Macintosh, OS/2, Unix/Xenix, Sun, DEC, Wang, Banyan Vines, and other operating platforms, as well as from tape backups and removable media systems. Ontrack Data Recovery is also authorized by major hard drive manufactures to open and service drives under warranty. Ontrack Data Recovery offers the most advanced technology for retrieving data from any PC, network, or alternative storage device, including tape backups. Services support virtually every operating environment, and include weekend, priority and on-site capabilities. Its parent company, Ontrack Computer Systems, specializes in hard disk utility software, including installation and data recovery tools for the NetWare, DOS, Macintosh and Unix environments. Corporate headquarters for both companies are located at 6321 Bury Drive, Eden Prairie, Minn., 55346. In addition, Ontrack has a regional service center at 2400 Main Street, Irvine, Calif., 92714. Ontrack's European headquarters are located at Surrey House, 34 Eden Street, Kingston upon Thames, Surrey KT1 1ER, United Kingdom.
    -0- 3/9/93
    /CONTACT: Danie Watson or Wendy Wobbrock, both of Ontrack Data Recovery, 800-752-1333 or 612-937-1107/
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-02-11 02:53 AM
    Response to Reply #164
    166. September 12 "Computer recovery companies go to work"
    Edited on Wed Feb-02-11 02:57 AM by deconstruct911
    Businesses affected by the terrorist attack on the World Trade Center have been turning to disaster-recovery companies in an effort to get their operations back online.

    OnTrack Data International, a company that recovers data from damaged hard disks or tapes, is changing its pricing rules for those affected by Tuesday's attacks, said Greg Olson, senior director of data recovery.
    "It's not going to cost the customer anything to have us take a look at the system," and the company will charge less than the market rate of $1,000 to $1,500 per hard disk for data recovery, he said. "We are certainly here to help as much as we possibly can."

    OnTrack recovers data from about 25,000 hard disks each year and currently is working on thousands of storage systems recovered from Texas floods earlier this year. Most of the company's work is from hardware or software failure or human error, but about 3 percent comes from natural disasters.
    Several computer companies, including IBM, Sun Microsystems and Hewlett-Packard, also offer disaster-recovery services.
    Sun Microsystems, which has many customers in the financial district of New York, primarily offers planning services rather than disaster-recovery services, said Kevin Coyne, director for enterprise services. But the server seller is talking to customers, preparing lists of equipment that needs to be replaced and is contacting partners who handle disaster recovery work, he said.
    "The main thing now is assessing what the needs are and making sure we can provide equipment," Coyne said.

    While invaluable following a man-made or natural disaster, recovery services can be very expensive, especially when customers require that computer systems be available without delay after an incident. "Costs can go up dramatically as you move toward higher-availability requirements," Coyne said. But often the price tag can be worth it.
    "A lot of times, customers are finding that losses of $100,000 or $1 million per hour quickly justify the cost of a replicated site," he said.

    Read more:
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-03-11 04:06 AM
    Response to Reply #164
    167.  Chief Executive Officer of Kroll, Ontrack, Marsh
    "In late 2001, Kroll Ontrack was faced with a strategic
    opportunity and a challenge. The opportunity lay in the
    potential market for an electronic document discovery solution
    for the legal industry. The challenge? Creating an effective
    market strategy for a business still in its infancy.

    The term paperless office was just coming into vogue, notes
    Andrea Johnson, Kroll Ontracks vice president of marketing
    and communications. Lawyers were finding that many
    documents relevant to a legal proceeding were not available in
    paper form. Rather, they were found in the electronic records
    distributed throughout a corporations internal databases. Competitors who were able to meet the paper
    discovery needs of lawyers were ill equipped to manage the discovery of these electronic records."

    Strategyn helped us the most by taking a lot of guesswork out of the process. If you know the
    outcomes that you are trying to solve, your innovation is focused. You dont spend time and money
    innovating against any outcome that the customer doesnt care about or is already completely
    satisfied with.
    Ben Allen CEO, Krol

    "Krolls market strategy has paid off. Ontrack has grown from $11 million in
    electronic discovery revenues in 2001 to over $200 million in 2008. The company
    is the industry leader in both market share and revenues"

    "Mr. Ben F. Allen served as the President of Kroll Ontrack Legal Technologies Limited, legal technologies and data recovery subsidiary of Kroll, Inc. since 2001. Mr. Allen served as Chief Executive Officer of Kroll, Inc. since march 2008 and served as its President. He served as Chief Operating Officer of Kroll, Inc. since July 25, 2007. He served as the Chief Operating Officer at Kroll Inc. He served as the Chief Operating Officer of Kroll Ontrack, Inc. since July 2007 and President from 2002 to July 2007. He served as the Chief Executive Officer and President of Kroll Inc. of Altegrity, Inc. and Marsh & McLennan Companies, Inc. since March 2008.",%20Inc.

    Shortly after B. Allen joined Ontrack and during/shortly after Ontrack's WTC hard-drive recovery, Ontrack was purchased by Kroll. He then became an executive at Kroll and Marsh. It would be very interesting if Ontrack's recovery at any point pertained to "sensitive" financial information, but nothing seems to be Known/mentioned about their recovery. Since they were lowering the recovery costs and had very high security standards, I would assume they were hired for a few recoveries......

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-04-11 01:17 AM
    Response to Reply #167
    168. Altegrity/Kroll
    June 7, 2010

    "Marsh & McLennan Cos Inc (MMC.N) agreed to sell investigations unit Kroll to a firm led by former Marsh CEO Michael Cherkasky for $1.13 billion, less than the amount the insurance broker paid for it six years ago.

    MMC said on Monday it plans to sell Kroll -- a corporate sleuth and intelligence expert that has expanded into risk management and other areas -- to Altegrity, a Virginia-based security solutions firm backed by private equity firm Providence Equity Partners, in an all-cash deal.

    The Kroll acquisition is expected to close by late September."

    "Cherkasky, chief executive of Altegrity, will be reunited with Kroll, which he led from 2001 to 2004. Cherkasky was ousted as MMC CEO in late 2007 after producing disappointing results.

    Cherkasky told Reuters he had been trying to pair Kroll with Altegrity or its predecessor firms for years."

    Cherkasky joined Altegrity in 2008. In 2009 he hired former Los Angeles Police Chief William Bratton to lead Altegrity's security consulting unit.


    After Altegrity acquires Kroll, the companies will have a combined 11,000 employees.

    MMC bought Kroll in 2004 for $1.9 billion, but agreed six years later to sell it for nearly $800 million less after the investigations unit sold off some of its units.

    "The components of the company at the time Marsh bought it was quite a bit different," Kroll CEO Ben Allen said.

    Allen became chief executive officer and Cherkasky chief executive of Altegrity in 08. They don't keep their assets far from grip, just continue to move companies around....

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-06-11 02:53 PM
    Response to Reply #167
    169. A possible fit for Ontrack 9/11
    "Ontrack DataTrail(TM) electronic discovery solutions helps companies, law firms and federal agencies quickly and cost-effectively recover electronic information for use in legal matters."

    9 11 Aftermath Building 6 & 7, Federal Offices, Government Agencies 10 3 2001 ABC
    (mentions the use of hard-drive data recovery)

    Originally wrote:
    Shortly after B. Allen joined Ontrack and during/shortly after Ontrack's WTC hard-drive recovery, Ontrack was purchased by Kroll.

    B. Allen became president and chief executive officer of Ontrack 2 months before 9/11, but was with Ontrack for a few years prior.

    BEN F. ALLEN has served as President and Chief Executive Officer since
    June 2001 and previously served as Chief Operating Officer from February 2001 to
    June 2001. From March 1999 to February 2001, he served as the General Manager of
    Ontrack's European operations in the United Kingdom and France. From February
    1998 through February 1999, he served as Ontrack's Internet Marketing Manager.
    From 1987 to 1998, he served in various management roles at Ceridian
    Corporation, a Minneapolis-based information services company, most recently as
    Vice President of Sales and Marketing for Washington Consulting Services and
    Technologies, a former Ceridian subsidiary. In 1997, he served briefly as
    Regional Manager at Hyperion Software.
    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    deconstruct911 Donating Member (809 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-21-11 01:03 AM
    Response to Original message
    170. Here are the more recent interviews with Grove about the Marsh project
    Edited on Mon Feb-21-11 01:07 AM by deconstruct911

    Ellen Clarke, global chief information officer of insurance brokerage Marsh Inc., on Sept. 10, 2001, flew to a meeting set for the following day at her company's offices in London, England. "Otherwise, I would be dead," she says, referring to

    Ellen Clarke, former CIO of Marsh

    In a last-minute decision, the fact that her original plans called for working that day from the 97th floor of 1 World Trade Center where the first hijacked plane slammed into Marsh's offices on floors 94 through 100. At the time, the $5.2 billion subsidiary of Marsh and McLennan also occupied floors 47 through 54 in 2 World Trade Center, the south tower.

    Out of 425 members of Clarke's I.T. staff, 130 died. A total of 294 Marsh employees perished in the twin towers; another one died in one of the planes that crashed into the towers.

    Clarke, who left Marsh in 2003, is the co-founder of Talent Mosaic, a New York City consultancy that provides interim chief information officers, chief financial officers and chief operating officers for businesses. Another new venture is My Computer Worker, which aims to provide technical support to small businesses.

    Q: Where were you on Sept. 11?

    A: While the plane was hitting 1 World Trade Center, I was on the phone discussing my global budget for 2002. I had the managers on the phone from 1 World Trade Center and 2 World Trade Center and all the countries around the world where I had technology directors and CIOs.

    Michael Darviche


    Michael Darviche is a managing director for Marsh, Inc.s, global portal, His role is setting Marsh's E-business global strategy as well as running the technology and services team that implements it.
    Previously Darviche was Gm and founder of Bigfoot Interactive (an Axicom affiliate) and also a senior vice president of database strategies at Foote Cone Belding. His earlier career was with American Express Corporate Card, Small Buisness Services, where he managed database marketing. He has an M.B.A. from Harvard Business School and a B.A. from Tufts University.


    "You look desperately for a silver lining in all of this," says managing director of applications development Michael Darviche, who, along with many of his staff, wasn't in the office on the morning of Sept. 11 because they worked late the night before. "We've learned how to do things and think about things in new ways." The organization now thinks more about issues such as tighter integration and standard architectures across global business units, and building new efficiencies into the technology infrastructure that will be useful in disaster-recovery situations while saving money in the long term.

    More about Ontrack:

    IT Infrastructure Rebuilding
    Will Top $15 Billion

    Computer Economics estimates that $1.7 billion alone will be spent in short term work, with the rest of the money doing to data and telecommunications equipment.

    Carlsbad, CA-based Computer Economics estimates the cost of building the information technology infrastructure damaged last week in New York and Washington will be close to $15.8 billion.

    The estimate includes about $1.7 billion spent to keep disrupted operations going in the short-term in work that will involve as many as 25,000 IT workers.

    Beyond that, the company estimates $8 billion will be spent replacing the necessary telecommunications and data communications support, including servers, computers, workstations, terminals, printers, and other equipment.

    As much as $6 billion may be required to rebuild the telecommunications infrastructure supporting these operations.

    Greg Olson, senior director of product line management at Eden Prairie, Minn.-based data recovery firm OnTrack Data International, warns that one of the most valuable resourcesthe datamay be irreplacable.

    "Most of the Fortune 500 companies will have off-site storage, alternative facilities," Olson explained. "But small and medium companies will probably not be as well covered. And for those firms it comes down to how much it costs to recreate data if it isn't possible to recover it.


    ChoicePoint software secuirty post 9/11

    Monday, March 22, 2004
    ChoicePoint executive tops in info security
    He stresses awareness, empowerment
    Atlanta Business Chronicle - by Justin Rubner Staff Writer

    Securities companies at the World Trade Center lost $3.2 billion in hardware and software on Sept. 11, 2001. Such hardware and software can be replaced, but the information contained within the technology is priceless.

    The potential for such a catastrophic loss of data is what prompted ChoicePoint Inc. to name Rich Baich the company's first chief information security officer last year. On March 18, he was scheduled to be honored as Georgia's Information Security Executive of the Year at a ceremony at The Fox Theatre.

    Baich's position was created mainly due to the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11 and the subsequent government regulations requiring companies to disclose breaches that may harm customer data.


    Speaking of ChoicePoint, Ontrack also did hard-drive recoveries from computers used by Katherine Harris during the election recount.

    Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
    DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Mon Nov 23rd 2020, 10:09 PM
    Response to Original message
    Advertisements [?]

    Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » September 11 Donate to DU

    Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002
    Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators

    Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

    Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

    About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

    Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

    © 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC